24 Hours of Time Trialing

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  • 06-26-2006
    Ricksom
    24 Hours of Time Trialing
    Has the 24 Hour race format ever changed in the last 10 years. There was a time when laps were about 25km, and there were many technical and physical obstacles to survive without hurting yourself or burning out. It was 24 Hours of Adventure and Survival, and every lap was a test. Now it is 24 Hours of Time Trialing......, speed, speed, speed. This past course was the shortest and fastest ever at 16km. Many single-track sections allowed you to maintain a speed of 15-20km/hr, making many lap times around 1 hour. Leaning the bike into corners at speed was a new common skill. As the weekend progressed, shortcut trail sections were forming which I found very surprising (although quite useless with their sharp angles). It was a fun course for sure, but with very short laps and no real sense of accomplishment of "making it", there was much more spare time during the 24 hours with nothing to do. For the first time I got bored. I got the "been there, done that" kind of feeling. It was still a fun and social weekend, but it was like a party that was going on too long.

    It is clear that this race is now geared to die hard racers and solo challengers, or recreational riders with many party friends and too much spare time on their hands. For those of us that are skillful and experienced endurance riders, one notch slower than O-Cup racers because of limited spare time, we feel lost and out of place. This will probably be my last 24 Hour race.

    But Chico Racing is smart and they know this. The 8 hour relay format is growing, especially for people like me. A fast paced day of riding with team buddies, followed by a dinner and party afterwards (and maybe a hot tub) sounds much better these days. And you have Sunday to rest and take care of those "other" responsibilities.

    But heh, times are always changing, and you have to change with the times.
    I will sure miss those quiet night laps of days gone by...
  • 06-26-2006
    nogearshere
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ricksom
    Has the 24 Hour race format ever changed in the last 10 years. There was a time when laps were about 25km, and there were many technical and physical obstacles to survive without hurting yourself or burning out. It was 24 Hours of Adventure and Survival, and every lap was a test. Now it is 24 Hours of Time Trialing......It is clear that this race is now geared to die hard racers and solo challengers, or recreational riders with many party friends and too much spare time on their hands. For those of us that are skillful and experienced endurance riders, one notch slower than O-Cup racers because of limited spare time, we feel lost and out of place. This will probably be my last 24 Hour race.

    this is an interesting take. i say that b/c the die hard racers seem upset that the course was designed around the 'middle' pack riders...with thousands of riders i guess you can't satisfy everyone.

    i never minded the olde 20-25k courses either but the change has no effect on my down tyme - they just meant less laps with longer saddle tymes...actual ride tyme in 24hr races is still a product of # of laps x lap tyme. come to think of it i would spend much of those longer courses yawning during the boring 'filler' flats...glad there werent many this course.

    it is a shame you won't be coming back, but i think the course shouldn't be the deciding factor for an event of this length.

    and remember, both schools of thought towards 24hr races existed in southern ontario (together) once. only one survived, so maybe evolution is part of the sport.
  • 06-26-2006
    osokolo
    interesting...
    you probably defined some things better than i did over on the other thread...

    but that "been there , done that" without a feeling you "made it" through reflects my feelings as well...

    well said, the only difference is - i just have to go back and do it again....

    you should consider it too... in a weird way, you owe it to ourselves...


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ricksom
    Has the 24 Hour race format ever changed in the last 10 years. There was a time when laps were about 25km, and there were many technical and physical obstacles to survive without hurting yourself or burning out. It was 24 Hours of Adventure and Survival, and every lap was a test. Now it is 24 Hours of Time Trialing......, speed, speed, speed. This past course was the shortest and fastest ever at 16km. Many single-track sections allowed you to maintain a speed of 15-20km/hr, making many lap times around 1 hour. Leaning the bike into corners at speed was a new common skill. As the weekend progressed, shortcut trail sections were forming which I found very surprising (although quite useless with their sharp angles). It was a fun course for sure, but with very short laps and no real sense of accomplishment of "making it", there was much more spare time during the 24 hours with nothing to do. For the first time I got bored. I got the "been there, done that" kind of feeling. It was still a fun and social weekend, but it was like a party that was going on too long.

    It is clear that this race is now geared to die hard racers and solo challengers, or recreational riders with many party friends and too much spare time on their hands. For those of us that are skillful and experienced endurance riders, one notch slower than O-Cup racers because of limited spare time, we feel lost and out of place. This will probably be my last 24 Hour race.

    But Chico Racing is smart and they know this. The 8 hour relay format is growing, especially for people like me. A fast paced day of riding with team buddies, followed by a dinner and party afterwards (and maybe a hot tub) sounds much better these days. And you have Sunday to rest and take care of those "other" responsibilities.

    But heh, times are always changing, and you have to change with the times.
    I will sure miss those quiet night laps of days gone by...

  • 06-26-2006
    dskunk
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ricksom
    I got the "been there, done that" kind of feeling. It was still a fun and social weekend, ...

    Just a thought...since you did find it fun still, maybe just try doing it on a different sized team or with a different bunch of people. Or even doing a 24 hour race at a different venue, like the WOW race up at Mansfield ( I'm pretty sure they have quiet night laps ).
    Mind you, I have to agree that the 8hr stuff is really good. It's a good social event and doesn't take up nearly as much time.
    I was reading somewhere about a twelve hour race that was run from dusk 'til dawn, all night laps. That would be quite an interesting event to put on here. Not sure if it would be popular though eh?
    Cheers, Dave
  • 06-26-2006
    superlightracer
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ricksom
    Has the 24 Hour race format ever changed in the last 10 years. There was a time when laps were about 25km, and there were many technical and physical obstacles to survive without hurting yourself or burning out. It was 24 Hours of Adventure and Survival, and every lap was a test. Now it is 24 Hours of Time Trialing......, speed, speed, speed. This past course was the shortest and fastest ever at 16km. Many single-track sections allowed you to maintain a speed of 15-20km/hr, making many lap times around 1 hour. Leaning the bike into corners at speed was a new common skill. As the weekend progressed, shortcut trail sections were forming which I found very surprising (although quite useless with their sharp angles). It was a fun course for sure, but with very short laps and no real sense of accomplishment of "making it", there was much more spare time during the 24 hours with nothing to do. For the first time I got bored. I got the "been there, done that" kind of feeling. It was still a fun and social weekend, but it was like a party that was going on too long.

    It is clear that this race is now geared to die hard racers and solo challengers, or recreational riders with many party friends and too much spare time on their hands. For those of us that are skillful and experienced endurance riders, one notch slower than O-Cup racers because of limited spare time, we feel lost and out of place. This will probably be my last 24 Hour race.

    But Chico Racing is smart and they know this. The 8 hour relay format is growing, especially for people like me. A fast paced day of riding with team buddies, followed by a dinner and party afterwards (and maybe a hot tub) sounds much better these days. And you have Sunday to rest and take care of those "other" responsibilities.

    But heh, times are always changing, and you have to change with the times.
    I will sure miss those quiet night laps of days gone by...


    I totally agree. While Im definitely not a super competitive o-cup racer I do feel that these 24hr events are a bit 'easier' (for lack of a better word) than they originally were. While I am totally supportive of increasing citizen level involvement, I'd love to see a bit more 'hardcore endurance' events. Given that I am stronger over 24hrs than 2hrs I could see my self getting involved in something like a 150k mtb race.

    Races like the Transrockies and Transalps really tickle my fancy..Obviously in Ontario a 'transescarpment' would be the epitome of lame, but events like the pine river ramble, or even longer ones that take maybe 12hrs and dont require doing laps like a rat in a wheel would be amazing. Faster riders would get past newbies early and then its a true 'push yourself to your limits' type race.

    but this is ontario.. where are we gonna get 150km of singletrack.

    Dreamer....nothing but a dreamer, can you put your hands on your head Oh NO!
  • 06-26-2006
    Dmytro
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by superlightracer
    but this is ontario.. where are we gonna get 150km of singletrack.

    I wonder how much we can squeeze out of the Durham trails (3 Rocks+Glen Major+Durham+Walker Woods) (I realize that some of these names overlap...) with careful planning.
  • 06-26-2006
    SuperNewb
    Will 100km suffice?
    http://torontocyclist.com/bbc/pauls/index.html :thumbsup:
    I havent tried it but my friend did and he said it was ok for being sandy as the Ganny can get.
  • 06-26-2006
    chicoracing
    but....
    The Hot August Nights will use an entirely different course that should challenge riders in a different way with the course going across the bridge. Everything that was directed towards me, and my bro and staff on the weekend was this was the "best 24 hour course ever".

    Mountain biking isn't a cut and dry science, but if you are one level under an Ontario Cup racer you should still find our 24 course plenty challenging (if you think it is way too easy, try Elliot Lake Ocup). Sure some will find one year's course more enjoyable than another, but I get the feeling that this year's course was the best yet for most of the riders.

    It is IMPOSSIBLE to please everyone 100% on every event which is why you should appreciate different aspects of different courses.

    This year's course actually had more singletrack and many fast riders found out it was more technical than previous years (but how do you measure that). The fastest riders at the event all told me the course was very enjoyable and challenging at speed. The fastest lap times were actually slower than some other years.

    BTW - Ricksom it sounds like you are just tired of 24 hour racing, but 25 km laps :nono: were never part of the 24 hour experience in Ontario and I can't think of anywhere where that is a standard or even used (plus if they were hardcore 25 km laps you'd be doing 2 plus hour laps!!!!!). Many companies in the US have tried giving 24 hour racers a super-gnarly experience and all of them are looking a diminishing numbers/failing/dead.

    8 Hours is kind of cool, but it will never be as popular as 24 hours for the same reason 1/2 marathons aren't as popular as full marathons. Participating in a 8 hour is fun, but it isn't that cool......

    Hope you guys/ladies had a good weekend, thanks for your support.

    Adam from Chico, just back from Albion and yes I read what you post.
  • 06-26-2006
    Smytty
    Hey Adam!
    I thought it was great. The course was much better (faster and more singletrack fun) than August nights last year, but the huge rain the day before might have had something to do with that last year. Everyone on my team this year thought it was a fantastic course - from guys who have done just about every 24hr race in Ontario for the last coupla years to a guy who did his first this weekend. I guess you just can't please everybody. One of the guys on the team had done a couple of 24hrs of Adrenalin races in Canmore, and this was his first Chico experience. He said it was unbelievably better than Adrenalin - better organized, better course, better everything.

    A few of the guys who I don't particularly want to see at the next one are some of the "not quite O-cup" racers who cut me off just after one of the bridges, or were riding my ass down a couple of the steeps saying "Rider up - get off the brakes!" as I was struggling to keep from careening off the edge and into the trees. There weren't many, but there were a few. I wasn't going that slow, or not letting guys pass - I was hitting laps around 1:05 - not a superstar by any means, but I also wasn't walking up hills either.

    Ricksom, if it's starting to bore you, try stepping it up a notch - try solo, or a tag team, or whatever. How about singlespeed? How about doing like the guy from the campsite across the road who did his laps on a trials bike with no seat? I'm sure you can find a way to challenge yourself to get back to the sense of "making it". I know I was just glad to get in a few laps on some great singletrack and have a few beers with my buddies.

    Well done, again, Chico!!:thumbsup:
  • 06-26-2006
    AndrewTO
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ricksom
    Has the 24 Hour race format ever changed in the last 10 years. There was a time when laps were about 25km, and there were many technical and physical obstacles to survive without hurting yourself or burning out. ......

    But heh, times are always changing, and you have to change with the times.
    I will sure miss those quiet night laps of days gone by...

    I can't say I share your point of view as this was my first 24H event. I can offer the same suggestion as I just did with osokolo - how about trying it solo? Perhaps with a smaller team? If not for the course difficulty, then at least the mindset needed. Just a thought. I hope you change your mind.


    Bah, Smytty just posttd the same thing. Oh well - great minds think alike, right? :thumbsup:
  • 06-26-2006
    osokolo
    i realize...
    that "...It is IMPOSSIBLE to please everyone 100% on every event which is why you should appreciate different aspects of different courses....", and this statement best describes the issue at hand...

    we didnt talk about all the good things about Chico organized events, including this Summer Solstice - honestly - since you guys "took over" Ontario 24 hours racing scene, both events are way better organized and more enjoyable... there is no comparison... it is also fascinating that Summer Solstice is the biggest 24 hour race in NA... you dont achieve this by not doing the right thing... Having results of the race posted within couple of days from the race just adds to it's excellent mark already...

    although I, personally, was looking for more hard core stuff to be incorporated in the course, i fully understand why it was not, and if we have to maintain Summer Solstice as the biggest in NA - so be it... hopefully Hot August Nights course will be designed in the manner that offers something to everyone... i guess it is important to design the course so that we dont feel like "rats on the wheel" like someone said... although i hated woo-wo trail backwards, i loved it because it was different... i would even agree with those that complimented this course - it was one of the fastest and best flowing (except for woo-wo backwards) courses ever, and i loved that high speed aspect of it...

    i thought it had the right measure of singletrack and double track... most of us loved both descents that were taken out from the course - but we do understand why you had to do it - at least with the long one... i was puzzled to see the second one, just after crossing the road taken out as well... can you share with us why???

    i think that it'd be worthwhile to try 12 hours event at one point... or at least insert another 8 hours event sometime in July...

    at any rate, we are happy that Chico is continuing to support and listen to MTB community in Ontario... you guys are doing fantastic job and i am sure that Chico events will continue to be the best and the biggest in the NA...

    thank you...


    Quote:

    Originally Posted by chicoracing
    The Hot August Nights will use an entirely different course that should challenge riders in a different way with the course going across the bridge. Everything that was directed towards me, and my bro and staff on the weekend was this was the "best 24 hour course ever".

    Mountain biking isn't a cut and dry science, but if you are one level under an Ontario Cup racer you should still find our 24 course plenty challenging (if you think it is way too easy, try Elliot Lake Ocup). Sure some will find one year's course more enjoyable than another, but I get the feeling that this year's course was the best yet for most of the riders.

    It is IMPOSSIBLE to please everyone 100% on every event which is why you should appreciate different aspects of different courses.

    This year's course actually had more singletrack and many fast riders found out it was more technical than previous years (but how do you measure that). The fastest riders at the event all told me the course was very enjoyable and challenging at speed. The fastest lap times were actually slower than some other years.

    BTW - Ricksom it sounds like you are just tired of 24 hour racing, but 25 km laps :nono: were never part of the 24 hour experience in Ontario and I can't think of anywhere where that is a standard or even used (plus if they were hardcore 25 km laps you'd be doing 2 plus hour laps!!!!!). Many companies in the US have tried giving 24 hour racers a super-gnarly experience and all of them are looking a diminishing numbers/failing/dead.

    8 Hours is kind of cool, but it will never be as popular as 24 hours for the same reason 1/2 marathons aren't as popular as full marathons. Participating in a 8 hour is fun, but it isn't that cool......

    Hope you guys/ladies had a good weekend, thanks for your support.

    Adam from Chico, just back from Albion and yes I read what you post.

  • 06-27-2006
    SSteve F
    Or even......
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SuperNewb
    Will 100km suffice?
    http://torontocyclist.com/bbc/pauls/index.html :thumbsup:
    I havent tried it but my friend did and he said it was ok for being sandy as the Ganny can get.


    .......this one?

    http://ltr.northbaycycling.ca/
  • 06-27-2006
    rkj__
    Ya, for anybody looking for more of a challenge, i think a rigid bike is a great way to make any course just a little bit tougher.

    Myself, i really enjoyed the event, and thought that the course was perfect for the 24h racing format.

    Good job chico. thanks for giving us the opportunity to participate.
  • 06-27-2006
    nogearshere
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by osokolo
    although i hated woo-wo trail backwards, i loved it because it was different... i would even agree with those that complimented this course - it was one of the fastest and best flowing (except for woo-wo backwards) courses ever, and i loved that high speed aspect of it...

    ARG! i am sure the lack of flow and brick wall that uw oow presented was intentional...the climb to it was nothing compared to the hostility i felt toward some of the ackasward turns...needless to say stupid riding was in full effect.

    if you are serious about a challenge for august allow me to present one. i have two teams slated for the event...i will save you a spot and loan you a bike for the entire event. NO you may NOT use your new pumpkin bike. if you leave sunday feeling unchallenged you may have the sweaty shirt off my back AND NOT pay your share of the entry.

    ...now arek may be around on occassion so you two will have to play nice...otherwise rj will have to be there to talk sense.
  • 06-27-2006
    osokolo
    no gears??
    thank you sir... but that is totally nuts..

    the only thing that beats singlespeed is singlespeed solo...

    :eek: :eek: :eek:

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by nogearshere
    ARG! i am sure the lack of flow and brick wall that uw oow presented was intentional...the climb to it was nothing compared to the hostility i felt toward some of the ackasward turns...needless to say stupid riding was in full effect.

    if you are serious about a challenge for august allow me to present one. i have two teams slated for the event...i will save you a spot and loan you a bike for the entire event. NO you may NOT use your new pumpkin bike. if you leave sunday feeling unchallenged you may have the sweaty shirt off my back AND NOT pay your share of the entry.

    ...now arek may be around on occassion so you two will have to play nice...otherwise rj will have to be there to talk sense.

  • 06-27-2006
    mtbmeister
    I am confused...
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ricksom
    Has the 24 Hour race format ever changed in the last 10 years. There was a time when laps were about 25km, and there were many technical and physical obstacles to survive without hurting yourself or burning out. It was 24 Hours of Adventure and Survival, and every lap was a test. Now it is 24 Hours of Time Trialing......, speed, speed, speed. This past course was the shortest and fastest ever at 16km. Many single-track sections allowed you to maintain a speed of 15-20km/hr, making many lap times around 1 hour. Leaning the bike into corners at speed was a new common skill. As the weekend progressed, shortcut trail sections were forming which I found very surprising (although quite useless with their sharp angles). It was a fun course for sure, but with very short laps and no real sense of accomplishment of "making it", there was much more spare time during the 24 hours with nothing to do. For the first time I got bored. I got the "been there, done that" kind of feeling. It was still a fun and social weekend, but it was like a party that was going on too long.

    It is clear that this race is now geared to die hard racers and solo challengers, or recreational riders with many party friends and too much spare time on their hands. For those of us that are skillful and experienced endurance riders, one notch slower than O-Cup racers because of limited spare time, we feel lost and out of place. This will probably be my last 24 Hour race.

    But Chico Racing is smart and they know this. The 8 hour relay format is growing, especially for people like me. A fast paced day of riding with team buddies, followed by a dinner and party afterwards (and maybe a hot tub) sounds much better these days. And you have Sunday to rest and take care of those "other" responsibilities.

    But heh, times are always changing, and you have to change with the times.
    I will sure miss those quiet night laps of days gone by...

    Being that I have only seen a couple of comments like yours pertaining to the challenge of this course be it length or technical demands, I can't figure out how it can be boring??? Maybe you aren't pushing yourself hard enough. I didn't find the course technically demanding for me, but I love to go fast, especially in singletrack. Hammering that stuff at your personal limit just seems to keep the hunger to achieve more present during all of my rides.

    As others have suggested, if you weren't challenged by your participation in the race this weekend, perhaps you should have a look at the many options to change that. Singlespeed, Tag team, or solo. If none of those work, you may want to consider focusing on O-Cup races, Trans Rockies, or other...I can't imagine that a change in category or one of these facets of racing wouldn't challenge you again...

    Neil
  • 06-27-2006
    osokolo
    i think you are...
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mtbmeister
    Being that I have only seen a couple of comments like yours pertaining to the challenge of this course be it length or technical demands, I can't figure out how it can be boring??? Maybe you aren't pushing yourself hard enough. I didn't find the course technically demanding for me, but I love to go fast, especially in singletrack. Hammering that stuff at your personal limit just seems to keep the hunger to achieve more present during all of my rides.

    As others have suggested, if you weren't challenged by your participation in the race this weekend, perhaps you should have a look at the many options to change that. Singlespeed, Tag team, or solo. If none of those work, you may want to consider focusing on O-Cup races, Trans Rockies, or other...I can't imagine that a change in category or one of these facets of racing wouldn't challenge you again...

    Neil

    misunderstanding ricksom...

    it is not about "challenge" per se... yes, you can always challenge yourself to go faster, even on the 300m circle course, on some parking lot, but that is not his point...

    the way i understand his observation is that recent 24 hour events have become very similar - a 16-18km loop with familiar configuration and hammer... there is no that "tough adventure" spice and exclusivity feeling that only the toughest can make it... there are no surprises on the course nor need to walk a section for 95% of the field...

    mind you - this weekends layout was perfect for me and my ability to hammer (205 pounds, half of it in legs :D :D ) hence my time was only 8 mins slower than the best time on the hill - usually it is 10+ mins diference... From that angle, i've got nothing to be unhappy about... And maybe it is just a matter of accepting this structure of 24 hour event and expecting just that... in that case no one would have unrealistic expectations of the event...

    there are few events in ontario where you can go an challenge yourself - for a change and come back to Albion Hills to a known and expected format of the competition... nothing wrong with that...

    it just may be that what ricksom wants this event to be, will never be again - for the benefit of growing the sport of mountain biking...

    so i kinda understand both ricksom and chico... if chico sees it's survival in this format of the competition - i am all for it because if chico is not successful - we all lose...
  • 06-27-2006
    airman
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by chicoracing
    The Hot August Nights will use an entirely different course that should challenge riders in a different way with the course going across the bridge. Everything that was directed towards me, and my bro and staff on the weekend was this was the "best 24 hour course ever".

    Mountain biking isn't a cut and dry science, clip...

    My team has been doing endurance events since 1998 with the adrenalin series and have experienced different venues, weather conditions and personal challenges. After 9 - 24 hour races we are still loving it and will be back for more. The Chico events are fantastic, and I'm not going to say any one was better than another because I think these events are what you make of them. I have met lots of wonderful people through these events and learned much about people's limitations, and how to overcome them. There aren't many personal experiences that stack up to what you go through at a 24 hour event. I'm grateful that a promoter with the savy of Chico Racing continues with this kind of event.

    Lets share things about the positive side of this kind of riding, pride in accomplishment, encouragement of others and sacrificing personal goals for the benefit of others... I feel great about the event, as does the rest of my team, and I hope all of you find what you want and continue to support 24 hour racing...

    Cheers
    :cool:
  • 06-27-2006
    superlightracer
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by osokolo
    misunderstanding ricksom...

    it is not about "challenge" per se... yes, you can always challenge yourself to go faster, even on the 300m circle course, on some parking lot, but that is not his point...

    the way i understand his observation is that recent 24 hour events have become very similar - a 16-18km loop with familiar configuration and hammer... there is no that "tough adventure" spice and exclusivity feeling that only the toughest can make it... there are no surprises on the course nor need to walk a section for 95% of the field...

    Precisely.

    Im sure as time goes by we'll see more demand for things like 150k races

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by nogearshere
    if you are serious about a challenge for august allow me to present one. i have two teams slated for the event...i will save you a spot and loan you a bike for the entire event. NO you may NOT use your new pumpkin bike. if you leave sunday feeling unchallenged you may have the sweaty shirt off my back AND NOT pay your share of the entry.

    Are you a wuss? You should join my team if you want a challenge. We're doing square wheels and no chain. :thumbsup: But on another note, some guys from my shop are doing a total bmx team... that oughtta be good.

    And yea, I didnt attend the 24 hr race, but good job chicoracing, you keep the mtb wheels turning in Ontario. All you have to do now is incorporate live DJ's at your events to keep the tuneskis rolling. lol
  • 06-27-2006
    serious
    nogearshere: if you are serious about a challenge for august allow me to present one. i have two teams slated for the event...i will save you a spot and loan you a bike for the entire event.

    Too bad I am out of town for Aug 19-20. I would seriously consider such an offer. And the good news is that I have a torture contraption (errr, I mean rigid SS bike) of my own. :D

    Osokolo, you would kick ass on an SS. First you are a big/heavy guy, which is an advantage in SS and with 54-55 minute laps at the Solstice, you are obviously no slouch. If I can manage SSing, you definitely can. Even geared, I doubt I could come in under 1 hour on that course (I did do a training run of 1:05 on Saturday on the rigid SS).
  • 06-27-2006
    osokolo
    you guys are killing me....
    i dont like the pain that much to subject myself to even more pain... it hurts enough on the geared bike that i dont want to even think how it would hurt on SS, let alone RIGID SS... c'mon... torture belongs to the dark ages... do you also sleep on the nail board?

    i might try SS just for fun, but for 24 hour racing i'd rather be bored on my geared squishy than feeling like a dead fish on a SS... just a thought that a granny gear could end my suffering for the moment, is worth the difference... not that i had to use granny this past weekend, but...

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by serious
    nogearshere: if you are serious about a challenge for august allow me to present one. i have two teams slated for the event...i will save you a spot and loan you a bike for the entire event.

    Too bad I am out of town for Aug 19-20. I would seriously consider such an offer. And the good news is that I have a torture contraption (errr, I mean rigid SS bike) of my own. :D

    Osokolo, you would kick ass on an SS. First you are a big/heavy guy, which is an advantage in SS and with 54-55 minute laps at the Solstice, you are obviously no slouch. If I can manage SSing, you definitely can. Even geared, I doubt I could come in under 1 hour on that course (I did do a training run of 1:05 on Saturday on the rigid SS).

  • 06-27-2006
    nogearshere
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by osokolo
    granny gear could end my suffering for the moment, is worth the difference

    sure i edited the post but who here cares? oso uses a granny gear...oso uses a granny gear...

    as for the rigid bit let me introduce the gov'ner...in best arrnowld voice: "no wunder you have half your weight in your leggs...your girly mann bawdy comes from squishy suspension"

    dont look at me, i didnt say it...
  • 06-27-2006
    osokolo
    yeah, i have to admit...
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by nogearshere
    sure i edited the post but who here cares? oso uses a granny gear...oso uses a granny gear...

    as for the rigid bit let me introduce the gov'ner...in best arrnowld voice: "no wunder you have half your weight in your leggs...your girly mann bawdy comes from squishy suspension"

    dont look at me, i didnt say it...

    20 years in the tough sport that i spent took a good toll on my body... i was pumping too much iron and squating few thousand times to many and now it hurts even when i dont ride... yes, i guess that is my excuse... weak? ok, it is weak... :skep: :skep:

    i rode my first lap on my hardtail and realized that if i had to ride 4 more laps on it - i'd be out of commiission for couple of days... yeah, i am old too... :eek: :eek:

    but i still refuse to play golf and i can kick Arek's arse any time...
  • 06-27-2006
    nogearshere
    1 Attachment(s)
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by osokolo
    now it hurts even when i dont ride... yes, i guess that is my excuse... weak? ok, it is weak... :skep: :skep:

    but i still refuse to play golf and i can kick Arek's arse any time...

    sorry, sometymes i forget to be pc...you have every right to ride what you want...


    the last line keeps the hate alive, i'm telling - RJ??? ohhhhh RJJJJ???? he's doing it again.

    in all truth - squats near did my knees in too, single speed have saved them hallelujah!
  • 06-27-2006
    osokolo
    so what SS do you ride?
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by nogearshere
    sorry, sometymes i forget to be pc...you have every right to ride what you want...


    the last line keeps the hate alive, i'm telling - RJ??? ohhhhh RJJJJ???? he's doing it again.

    in all truth - squats near did my knees in too, single speed have saved them hallelujah!

    is it home made or something else? i am curious...
  • 06-27-2006
    nogearshere
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by osokolo
    is it home made or something else? i am curious...

    thats not fair, you trying to have me bumped for spam 'er somthin...

    guess you could say it's home made. maybe even a bit custom...we can fix your hardtail right quick to start...CONVERT SINNER!
  • 06-27-2006
    SuperNewb
    Just make them stick it in one gear and ride like that the whole ride :D
  • 06-27-2006
    AndrewTO
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by SuperNewb
    Just make them stick it in one gear and ride like that the whole ride :D

    Yeah, NOW you think of it! I had my cable cutters and Phillips screwdriver with me the whole weekend. :p


    You know, as much as I hate contributing to the giant re-route this thread has taken (sorry Ricksom, i'm about to contribute to it!), I have to say something ..... Peter, of all people will love and hate this at the same time ..... SS ain't so hard. No, really, think about it - you use your body weight more, that's the "hard part", the way I see it.

    Wanna do something tough AND nuts? Try a recumbent! :eekster: :skep: :eekster: :skep:

    I further fortify my statement by including that I no longer think solo riders are nuts ..... only half nuts! They're beaten by the recumbent crowd. Pwned, even!
  • 06-27-2006
    Ricksom
    Adam

    No slam on your great event. Perhaps I was thinking out too loud. It is obvious that many people find your 24 hour events a great experience, and perhaps I have the 7 year (or 8, I can't remember) itch to do something different. Like I always say, you (Adam and Sean) are the meister of cross country mountain biking in Ontario, and I hate to think of where we would be without you.

    And yes, I was hoping you wouldn't read this, but who am I fooling........
    I will still volunteer to help you out whereever I can, and that you can count on.

    I have already moved on to adventure racing, and 8 hour mountain bike race format, and it keeps me excited for now. Taking a whole weekend off for a 24 hour event no longer suits my family life with older kids (or the wife for that matter).

    Sorry for the negative thought, but I know several others who have gotten the 7 year itch.
  • 06-27-2006
    Ricksom
    You're scaring me....
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by osokolo
    misunderstanding ricksom...

    it is not about "challenge" per se... yes, you can always challenge yourself to go faster, even on the 300m circle course, on some parking lot, but that is not his point...

    the way i understand his observation is that recent 24 hour events have become very similar - a 16-18km loop with familiar configuration and hammer... there is no that "tough adventure" spice and exclusivity feeling that only the toughest can make it... there are no surprises on the course nor need to walk a section for 95% of the field...

    mind you - this weekends layout was perfect for me and my ability to hammer (205 pounds, half of it in legs :D :D ) hence my time was only 8 mins slower than the best time on the hill - usually it is 10+ mins diference... From that angle, i've got nothing to be unhappy about... And maybe it is just a matter of accepting this structure of 24 hour event and expecting just that... in that case no one would have unrealistic expectations of the event...

    there are few events in ontario where you can go an challenge yourself - for a change and come back to Albion Hills to a known and expected format of the competition... nothing wrong with that...

    it just may be that what ricksom wants this event to be, will never be again - for the benefit of growing the sport of mountain biking...

    so i kinda understand both ricksom and chico... if chico sees it's survival in this format of the competition - i am all for it because if chico is not successful - we all lose...



    You are kind of thinking like me, and I wasn't sure if I had anything in common with you. But yes, the newness is gone, and the challenge and surprises are gone (perhaps because I am much fitter than earlier years). I also posted my best lap times ever, and was comparible to others who used to be faster than me. But, I have moved on to other things like adventure racing.

    But crap..... we need Chico Racing and we know it to keep mountain biking worthwhile in Ontario. Where the hell does he find the time to read all this stuff on MTBR.COM????
  • 06-27-2006
    skihillguy
    ok some of you guys are begining to sound like whiny children. If you want to do the race then do it... don't cry about if it's not tough enough.
    If you want tough...then come on out and do some of our races. Test of metal.....67 km of road doubletrack singletrack ..rocks, everything. winning time 2hr 44 min. Now add some people on SS...even one guy on a cyclocross. And for all you whiners out there there was even a guy who rode it all with just one leg.

    Gearjammer goes in late july or aug. Then there is always the Cheakamus Challenge from Squamish to Whistler. If Ontario riding isn't "tough enough" for you then come on out to mecca
  • 06-27-2006
    osokolo
    pfft...
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by skihillguy
    ok some of you guys are begining to sound like whiny children. If you want to do the race then do it... don't cry about if it's not tough enough.
    If you want tough...then come on out and do some of our races. Test of metal.....67 km of road doubletrack singletrack ..rocks, everything. winning time 2hr 44 min. Now add some people on SS...even one guy on a cyclocross. And for all you whiners out there there was even a guy who rode it all with just one leg.

    Gearjammer goes in late july or aug. Then there is always the Cheakamus Challenge from Squamish to Whistler. If Ontario riding isn't "tough enough" for you then come on out to mecca


    too much rain for my taste...

    pass...
  • 06-27-2006
    skihillguy
    wussss

    FYI ...we've got gorgeous weather 38 deg yesterday and and mid 30's today and no rain in the forecast
    And right now according to the thestra.ca you've got thunderstorms forecast.....
    Afraid of riding the best and sweetest singletrack Oso.........??????
  • 06-27-2006
    nogearshere
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by superlightracer
    Are you a wuss? You should join my team if you want a challenge. We're doing square wheels and no chain. :thumbsup: But on another note, some guys from my shop are doing a total bmx team... that oughtta be good.

    please open a window, i mean who farts on the internet?
  • 06-27-2006
    SuperNewb
    Its actually nice and cool outside atm. Plus the weather in Toronto seems to turn out better then the weatherman usually predicts. Like it rained in the morning and that was it.
  • 06-27-2006
    osokolo
    raced 2004 Whistler 24 hours...
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by skihillguy
    wussss

    FYI ...we've got gorgeous weather 38 deg yesterday and and mid 30's today and no rain in the forecast
    And right now according to the thestra.ca you've got thunderstorms forecast.....
    Afraid of riding the best and sweetest singletrack Oso.........??????

    on labour day weekend in september... that was the toughest 24 hour race i have ever had... at the end of my 2am lap, around 3am, once i got back to the tent area, it was probably just above freezing, mixture of rain and snow was coming down and wind was threatening to blow of the camp site...

    the next morning, since one of my teammates pussied out of his lap, i went for him and right after the start (there was a long and fast downhill) i survived spectacular crash at probably over 70km/h... not only that i survived without any broken bones (landed on that service road with baby head rocks) but i collected myself off of my bloody arse (literally - as i landed right on it) picked up my bike and finished the lap...

    those are very fond memories... i was just kidding when i said i'd pass... i'd love to come and ride it again... you guys live in heaven and i envy you to death...
  • 06-28-2006
    serious
    skihillguy: Test of metal.....67 km of road doubletrack singletrack ..rocks, everything. winning time 2hr 44 min.

    This translates to an average speed 24.5km/hr. Compare this with the winner in the Canada Cup race (45km) who had an verage speed of 21.7km/hr. Shorter distance but obviously far more technical and difficult. So I think there is plenty of challenge in the East, but a 24 hour race may not be the best place to find such challenge.
  • 06-28-2006
    osokolo
    test of metal...
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by serious
    skihillguy: Test of metal.....67 km of road doubletrack singletrack ..rocks, everything. winning time 2hr 44 min.

    This translates to an average speed 24.5km/hr. Compare this with the winner in the Canada Cup race (45km) who had an verage speed of 21.7km/hr. Shorter distance but obviously far more technical and difficult. So I think there is plenty of challenge in the East, but a 24 hour race may not be the best place to find such challenge.


    is not technical at all... it is lot of climbing - anyone can do it - it is just a question of final time... didn't want to slam it, but there are events out west that you REALLY can brag about, test of metal is just not one of them... it is just another "just hammer" type of event... agree?
  • 06-28-2006
    skihillguy
    if you don't think it's that difficult then you ought to come ride it..... and let's see what ya got. Technical....yes! Fast..yes!..greulling...most definitely!!
    Just ask anyone who does the test of metal.
    Don't slam an event you know nothing about.
  • 06-28-2006
    Bill Payer
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by skihillguy
    if you don't think it's that difficult then you ought to come ride it..... and let's see what ya got. Technical....yes! Fast..yes!..greulling...most definitely!!
    Just ask anyone who does the test of metal.
    Don't slam an event you know nothing about.

    there is a 100KM event in North Bay in July coming up that might be worth looking into if they need a change.

    http://ltr.northbaycycling.ca/index....tpage&Itemid=1
  • 06-28-2006
    nogearshere
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by skihillguy
    if you don't think it's that difficult then you ought to come ride it..... and let's see what ya got. Technical....yes! Fast..yes!..greulling...most definitely!!
    Just ask anyone who does the test of metal.
    Don't slam an event you know nothing about.

    bloody hell i'm trapped in the western canada forum...c'mon focus...albion hills.
  • 06-28-2006
    osokolo
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by skihillguy
    Don't slam an event you know nothing about.

    sorry if it sounded like that...

    my transrockies partner rode it few times... i got all the info from him...

    did you try any of the events over here in the east???
  • 06-28-2006
    skihillguy
    First let me say we don't have grizzlies here...just black beers.
    Now that 100km race looks kinda cool to do. How many racers are they expecting?
    do they have a profile of the course.....could be tempted to come and try a race like that
  • 06-28-2006
    serious
    I did not mean to slam the Test of Metal either. I am just pointing out that there is plenty of challenge everywhere. Average speeds and the number of people who DNF are a good indication of the level of difficulty. And speaking of DNFs, only 15 people (out of almost 800) had DNF at the Test of Metal. At the last Canada Cup over 80 people (out of 570) had DNF.

    This does NOT mean that Test of Metal is easy. It only means that there are plenty of challenges in the East. Don't worry, I still worship the West, especialy for skiing. :D
  • 06-28-2006
    skihillguy
    First let me say we don't have grizzlies here...just black beers.
    Now that 100km race looks kinda cool to do. How many racers are they expecting?
    do they have a profile of the course.....could be tempted to come and try a race like that