Next gen Giant DH- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Next gen Giant DH

    hmmm, looks a lot like the Sunday...

    look here

  2. #2
    Innovate or die!
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    very sick! nice to know there will be some competition back in giants DH line. Here is a pic for your viewing pleasure. Looks a tad stiffer and lower CG than sunday.
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    170mm profile crankset, silver king headset barely used, new blackspire chainguide, old version hope mini brakes---- all for sale at i-wanna-get-rid-of-it prices. I'm gone all of july after the 10th, other than that PM me if interested.

  3. #3
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    that is so.... sexy...
    "Better safe than scarry"

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  4. #4
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    They need to ditch that shitty as CG

  5. #5
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    looks just like their Trance and Reign bikes....


  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeyOrange
    hmmm, looks a lot like the Sunday...

    look here
    exept when you really look, then it doesnt...
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  7. #7
    650 yay area
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    OMG L000KS lyke a KONA STINKY DID GIANT COPY DER BYKES?!!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by j6105
    Looks a tad stiffer and lower CG than sunday.
    Wow man, you've got skills! You can tell just by looking at a bike how stiff it is?
    <><

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Kadvang
    OMG L000KS lyke a KONA STINKY DID GIANT COPY DER BYKES?!!


    yeah... not seeing the resemblance of a kona stinky. other than the fact that it has a frame, two wheels, a crank, tires, brakes, bars, grips, etc... you get it.

  10. #10
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    yeah yeah

    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    exept when you really look, then it doesnt...
    yeah, ok. it looks a lot more like the reign and trance.... i guess i should have said it looks similar to the sunday.

    it'll be interesting to see/hear how it rides and the pricing; it appears to have the same rear end as the faith, so hopefully that cuts the cost down. if it was front derailleur compatible, i'd sooner get this than the faith due to the seattube length... but then again who knows, this isn't a production frame that is "like 4 pounds lighter than the sunday" lol, azzclown

  11. #11
    "El Whatever"
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    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    exept when you really look, then it doesnt...
    Right Zedro... It's upper rocker is shorter. The wheelpath should be kind of different. Maybe a tad less vertical than the Sunday?? Like the wheel coming towards the rider more while deep into travel??
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warp2003
    Right Zedro... It's upper rocker is shorter. The wheelpath should be kind of different. Maybe a tad less vertical than the Sunday?? Like the wheel coming towards the rider more while deep into travel??
    make sure to take a look at the lower link before making too many assumptions... then again, i'm making one too

  13. #13
    "El Whatever"
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeyOrange
    make sure to take a look at the lower link before making too many assumptions... then again, i'm making one too
    That's is why I used question marks and the word "maybe"...
    Check my Site

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by carolinarider
    yeah... not seeing the resemblance of a kona stinky. other than the fact that it has a frame, two wheels, a crank, tires, brakes, bars, grips, etc... you get it.
    i agwee
    Quote Originally Posted by Mouse
    what were is gnarcal

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warp2003
    That's is why I used question marks and the word "maybe"...
    damn, you caught me not really reading...

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warp2003
    Right Zedro... It's upper rocker is shorter. The wheelpath should be kind of different. Maybe a tad less vertical than the Sunday?? Like the wheel coming towards the rider more while deep into travel??
    There's alot more going on than that. Keep in mind that there are 4 pivots, the placement of each of those pivots is important to consider
    <><

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeyOrange
    hmmm, looks a lot like the Sunday...

    look here
    "low on fiz, slam it down fast"

    That's not exactly what I look for in a beer...

  18. #18
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    soo nice ......drool
    I HATE WORK, WORK IS BAD, WORK = NO BIKE, NO BIKE = NO GOOD

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by j6105
    very sick! nice to know there will be some competition back in giants DH line. Here is a pic for your viewing pleasure. Looks a tad stiffer and lower CG than sunday.
    You lack intelligence.
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  20. #20
    Just Ride
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    anyword on when they're coming out? '06?

  21. #21
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    zedro is that a single pivot?

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Banshee Rider
    zedro is that a single pivot?
    or maybe a modified virtual pivot point?

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Banshee Rider
    zedro is that a single pivot?
    no, it swings on links. much like the rest of the maestro line....


  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by sriracha
    or maybe a modified virtual pivot point?
    you've invented a new and meaningless term!

    its a 'virtual pivot' 4 bar, it has the same "basic" arrangement (and i use that very loosely) as a DW-Link, or Karpiel, Cortina, 2Step, Canfield etc....in other words uses a unified seatstay and chainstay swingarm connected with two links which rotate in the same direction. Giant has experimented with virtual pivots of this basic arrangement before (actually more of an VPP, before SC bought the patents), seen below with this ATX prototype they toyed with around 2000-2001.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  25. #25
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    hahaha wow you people have plenty o time on your hands. It definetly resembles a sunday in my eyes. The rear linkages are square and much larger than those of a sunday, along with the frame bearings and linkage plates-- hench the guess at stiffness. If you can't tell it was just a random azz , well you just analyze the heck out of it. Looks fun too me.
    170mm profile crankset, silver king headset barely used, new blackspire chainguide, old version hope mini brakes---- all for sale at i-wanna-get-rid-of-it prices. I'm gone all of july after the 10th, other than that PM me if interested.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by .WestCoastHucker.
    no, it swings on links. much like the rest of the maestro line....
    i would say its the maestro style dh bike that will replace the giant dh single pivot in 06. looks sweet. all maestro really is is vpp slightly tweaked to avoid lawsuit.
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  27. #27
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    that looks real nice. I wonder what the price will be.
    Sully

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by dream4est
    all maestro really is is vpp slightly tweaked to avoid lawsuit.
    you mean slightly tweaked as in the linkage doesnt even rotate in the same direction?
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  29. #29
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    that seems really nice, its good to see them step up there design...
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob
    everybody was dressed nice...I had shorts, Rogue T-shirt and sandles

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    you mean slightly tweaked as in the linkage doesnt even rotate in the same direction?
    alright here we go again . slightly tweaked because right before 05 production the axle path was too close to the sc vpp patent. now the axle path is different enough to calm the lawyers.
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  31. #31
    rollin
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    Quote Originally Posted by dream4est
    vpp slightly tweaked to avoid lawsuit.
    i bet giant was pissed when santa cruz bought the patent and started developement.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by sriracha
    i bet giant was pissed when santa cruz bought the patent and started developement.
    from what ive heard from the giant insiders they started the maestro line after sc got the patent. they did not try to emulate the vpp axle path but rather came up with a VERY close version that luckily someone found out (and i heard it was too late to really test and tweak the design enough to work out all the kinks. expect better maestro suspension on the 06 models) was so close to vpp that giant would have been forced to pay sc license fees and/or recall 05 models.
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  33. #33
    Uhhhhh...
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    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    you mean slightly tweaked as in the linkage doesnt even rotate in the same direction?
    Just let it go zedro, the sheep will pass by.

    Waiting for DW to chime in.........
    Fayetteville, AR and N.W.A RePrEsEnT

  34. #34
    gnar, brah
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    Quote Originally Posted by dream4est
    from what ive heard from the giant insiders they started the maestro line after sc got the patent. they did not try to emulate the vpp axle path but rather came up with a VERY close version that luckily someone found out (and i heard it was too late to really test and tweak the design enough to work out all the kinks. expect better maestro suspension on the 06 models) was so close to vpp that giant would have been forced to pay sc license fees and/or recall 05 models.
    In VPP the links both rotate in the same direction as the shock compresses, in Maestro they rotate in opposite directions. They have a similar effect in suspension behavior, but are about as similar as FSR and Lawill.
    Trestle Bike Park

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrewpalooza
    In VPP the links both rotate in the same direction as the shock compresses, in Maestro they rotate in opposite directions. They have a similar effect in suspension behavior, but are about as similar as FSR and Lawill.
    you got it backwards, for VPPs the top link rotates opposite to the bottom one (or opposite to any linkage design out there). In this design both links rotate foward (or clockwise looking towards the driveside), where VPP has the top link rotating counter-clockwise.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    you mean slightly tweaked as in the linkage doesnt even rotate in the same direction?
    yeah, the links both rotate in the same direction. jake actually has been riding a faith for about 6 months now and i've seen and ridden it a bazillion times....


  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by .WestCoastHucker.
    yeah, the links both rotate in the same direction. jake actually has been riding a faith for about 6 months now and i've seen and ridden it a bazillion times....
    i meant compared to the VPPs, which have to counter rotating links, ie; the Giants links dont even rotate in the same direction as the VPPs
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    i meant compared to the VPPs, which have to counter rotating links, ie; the Giants links dont even rotate in the same direction as the VPPs
    i should have known you knew what you were talking about....


  39. #39
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    zedro has it right about the linkages. the prototype mimicked the vpp, but the production model was changed at the last second to avoid legalities. i know this because i was supposed to test ride that prototype but then my connect told me it was not shipped (aug 04) due to legal issues. i then got to ride the faith in september and am waiting for the 06 model if i can hold out. my question is for wch. hows your friends holding up? i had a problem with the upper link after casing twice at the gunbarrel jumps. but that frame may have been pre-production.
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  40. #40
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    jake was also running a preproduction model and we were tearing it up on that bike. both at the jumps and the trails, the bike held up like a champ. he just recently got a production one because he wanted a different color.....

    the thing that throws people off is the fact that the links rotate counter-clockwise as opposed to the rest of the other non vpp bikes that rotate clockwise. they just see a counter -clockwise link and assume vpp, not realizing both links rotate that way....

    (edit: i just realized the links will be swinging the other way if you are looking at the other side of the bike. the above reference was made looking at the drive side..)
    Last edited by .WestCoastHucker.; 05-16-2005 at 08:26 PM.


  41. #41
    gnar, brah
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    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    you got it backwards, for VPPs the top link rotates opposite to the bottom one (or opposite to any linkage design out there). In this design both links rotate foward (or clockwise looking towards the driveside), where VPP has the top link rotating counter-clockwise.
    Yeah, I couldn't remember which was which, just the concept. Thanks for setting it straight...
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  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by .WestCoastHucker.
    jake was also running a preproduction model and we were tearing it up on that bike. both at the jumps and the trails, the bike held up like a champ. he just recently got a production one because he wanted a different color.....

    the thing that throws people off is the fact that the links rotate counter-clockwise as opposed to the rest of the other non vpp bikes that rotate clockwise. they just see a counter -clockwise link and assume vpp, not realizing both links rotate that way....
    alright formerboulderhucker thats sounds like jakes faith was tough (if you rode it and it did not disintegrate ill take that as an endorsement). in retrospect i was getting all crazy during my test ride and 50/50ed a big dub on a botched one foot xup and nearly broke my ankle. the top link looked like it bent inwards and the wheel would not line up anymore. so hucker should i get one now and not wait for 06 (keep in mind i have the same problem you do in regards to destroying bikes)? the cost price is a steal.
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  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    you got it backwards, for VPPs the top link rotates opposite to the bottom one (or opposite to any linkage design out there). In this design both links rotate foward (or clockwise looking towards the driveside), where VPP has the top link rotating counter-clockwise.
    The part I put in bold face is not true. Currently the Titus Motolite Horst link rotates that way. So did the Jamis Dakar Horst link. And there are faux bars that do too--the Dakar non-Horst link for example.

    Also you were wrong on the anti-squat thing the last time we tangled on this board. You need to go back to your old Suspension 101 professor on that. Any amount of anti-squat will alter the suspension performance under power compared to coasting, as will any amount of anti-lift when braking.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve from JH
    The part I put in bold face is not true. Currently the Titus Motolite Horst link rotates that way. So did the Jamis Dakar Horst link. And there are faux bars that do too--the Dakar non-Horst link for example.

    Also you were wrong on the anti-squat thing the last time we tangled on this board. You need to go back to your old Suspension 101 professor on that. Any amount of anti-squat will alter the suspension performance under power compared to coasting, as will any amount of anti-lift when braking.
    Pulling a thread back thats 3 weeks old just to start sh1t. I would expect nothing less.
    Fayetteville, AR and N.W.A RePrEsEnT

  45. #45
    The Ancient One
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSherpa
    Pulling a thread back thats 3 weeks old just to start sh1t. I would expect nothing less.
    Actually this thread was linked inside another current one about the Giant DH bike. It was like I was responding to the current thread.

    But I'm even worse than you think. I only registered on Bikemonkey so that I could hassle DW when he said stuff I thought was wrong. Hey, wrong is wrong, no matter who is doing the talking.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeyOrange
    hmmm, looks a lot like the Sunday...

    look here
    nawww. Looks more like a Huffy.

  47. #47
    I wanna talk to Samson!
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    I saw J. Rando on it this weekend at fontana. Pinner fo sho.

    He was also riding fox now.
    JackNugz

    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    no, but they are shinier....it's like the fututre, where everything is really really shiny.....but still really just the same ol'crap

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