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Thread: lapierre dh 720

  1. #1
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    New question here. lapierre dh 720

    http://www.lapierre-bikes.co.uk/lapi...-2011/geometry

    anyone have it?

    how does it feel?

    the pendbox is as great as it is said?

  2. #2
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    worst set of marketing ******** ever created for DH.

    you could no pay me to ride one.
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  3. #3
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    Well they sure do love their Links and bearings. I wonder if that BB violates GT's patent?

    Pretty bad ass looking though.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails lapierre dh 720-1485%5B1%5D.jpg  

    lapierre dh 720-lapierre.jpg  


  4. #4
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    so the BB moves FORWARD as the rear wheel goes up? Wouldn't that create massive pedal blowback and chain snappage?
    wanted: Cannondale Lefty w/ V-brake studs

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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    worst set of marketing ******** ever created for DH.

    you could no pay me to ride one.

    Well, as it stands I don't think anyone is paying you to ride any of their bikes. And since I'm sure you've probably never thrown a leg over one I'm not sure you have much of a leg to stand on. A bike frame doesn't come out of marketing, it comes out of engineering. marketing comes as the result of engineering and performance claims.
    The arsonist has oddly shaped feet!

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    Quote Originally Posted by lelebebbel View Post
    so the BB moves FORWARD as the rear wheel goes up? Wouldn't that create massive pedal blowback and chain snappage?
    The swingarm drives the link that rotates the BB slightly rearward and upward

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeyOrange View Post
    The swingarm drives the link that rotates the BB slightly rearward and upward
    Seriously, reading this and then looking at the frame made it so much clearer to me what was going on.
    "Solution to two of the world's problems: Feed the homeless to the hungry."

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    Is that a dent in the seat tube? WOW 7 piviots!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeyOrange View Post
    The swingarm drives the link that rotates the BB slightly rearward and upward
    No, look at this video:

    http://www.pinkbike.com/video/145630/

    The BB moves slightly back, but only up to the sag point. Then it moves down and forward, creating massive chain growth. Which is obviously intended. I just can't really see how that wouldn't create a heap of problems.
    wanted: Cannondale Lefty w/ V-brake studs

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by his dudeness View Post
    Well, as it stands I don't think anyone is paying you to ride any of their bikes. And since I'm sure you've probably never thrown a leg over one I'm not sure you have much of a leg to stand on. A bike frame doesn't come out of marketing, it comes out of engineering. marketing comes as the result of engineering and performance claims.
    as it stands, i turned down the opportunity to test one on the principle of **** design.

    the reason this design is so bad and actually born out of marketing is though pend-box system is THE worse way to achieve its pedalling characteristics. it is easier to use a idler system to get EXACTLY the same pedalling characteristics.

    using an idler would loose 5 bearings, frame would be stiffer, less maintenance AND lighter. but because other company's use idlers to create this characteristic lappierre created pend-box as a patented marketing tool instead of putting time and money into marketing a system ANY company can use. the 2011 dh720/920 is born from the need to be different not the need to be better!


    there is no two way about it, it was created for marketing. if you don't see it, then you are lost to the world of design intellect and will forever buy into marketing ********.
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    as it stands, i turned down the opportunity to test one on the principle of **** design.

    the reason this design is so bad and actually born out of marketing is though pend-box system is THE worse way to achieve its pedalling characteristics. it is easier to use a idler system to get EXACTLY the same pedalling characteristics.

    using an idler would loose 5 bearings, frame would be stiffer, less maintenance AND lighter. but because other company's use idlers to create this characteristic lappierre created pend-box as a patented marketing tool instead of putting time and money into marketing a system ANY company can use. the 2011 dh720/920 is born from the need to be different not the need to be better!


    there is no two way about it, it was created for marketing. if you don't see it, then you are lost to the world of design intellect and will forever buy into marketing ********.
    says the goof who rides an orange

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norcoshore1 View Post
    says the goof who rides an orange
    keep up......

    besides, don't change what's not broken.
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    keep up......

    besides, don't change what's not broken.
    You're exactly right. Don't change what's already mediocre. Don't ever worry about improving upon a product or doing something new as long as you can happily remain stagnant.
    The arsonist has oddly shaped feet!

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    looks like at least 14 seperate bearings in this frame not counting DU's? man.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by his dudeness View Post
    You're exactly right. Don't change what's already mediocre. Don't ever worry about improving upon a product or doing something new as long as you can happily remain stagnant.
    development of a good design is good, redesigning for sake of marketing is bad. that is my point. so enough of the sarcasm and removing my quote from its context.
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by his dudeness View Post
    You're exactly right. Don't change what's already mediocre. Don't ever worry about improving upon a product or doing something new as long as you can happily remain stagnant.
    Kona?

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    as it stands, i turned down the opportunity to test one on the principle of **** design.

    the reason this design is so bad and actually born out of marketing is though pend-box system is THE worse way to achieve its pedalling characteristics. it is easier to use a idler system to get EXACTLY the same pedalling characteristics.

    using an idler would loose 5 bearings, frame would be stiffer, less maintenance AND lighter. but because other company's use idlers to create this characteristic lappierre created pend-box as a patented marketing tool instead of putting time and money into marketing a system ANY company can use. the 2011 dh720/920 is born from the need to be different not the need to be better!


    there is no two way about it, it was created for marketing. if you don't see it, then you are lost to the world of design intellect and will forever buy into marketing ********.




    Don't try to reason out the design with two pictures and one video. It's silly to try and do that. Perhaps the bike doesn't work well, perhaps it does. Either way, your coming to a conclusion without having ridden it (and without ANY knowledge of the details of the design) is dumb and shows little respect for engineers.

    And if you'd like to declare a criteria for being lost to the world of design intellect, the first thing on your list should be "jumping to conclusions". Don't be an armchair engineer.
    Gnar Cal!

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by his dudeness View Post
    A bike frame doesn't come out of marketing, it comes out of engineering. marketing comes as the result of engineering and performance claims.
    If done right, marketing has major inputs on what to build (role of marketing is technically product, place, price and promotion, the 4 Ps). However, the bike industry is ass backwards and doesn't work like this.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by igotbanned View Post


    Don't try to reason out the design with two pictures and one video. It's silly to try and do that. Perhaps the bike doesn't work well, perhaps it does. Either way, your coming to a conclusion without having ridden it (and without ANY knowledge of the details of the design) is dumb and shows little respect for engineers.

    And if you'd like to declare a criteria for being lost to the world of design intellect, the first thing on your list should be "jumping to conclusions". Don't be an armchair engineer.
    explanation and reasoning with sometimes NEVER works, they are still deluded and lost like you!

    ONCE you understand how certain characteristics that are created though certain design implications then it is possible to understand how a bike will ride by looking at it. and before you fly of the handle that is not ********. its just tiny bit harder with vpp but with a single pivot and some practical knowledge and a logical technical understanding its piss easy to work out by looking at it.

    but if you protest the opposite you just prove your ignorance and and how far you have bought into marketing. and you are dead to understanding how rear suspension works.
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    ONCE you understand how certain characteristics that are created though certain design implications then it is possible to understand how a bike will ride by looking at it.
    so if you knew how your orange was going to ride beforehand, why did you buy it?

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norcoshore1 View Post
    so if you knew how your orange was going to ride beforehand, why did you buy it?
    1) i was coming off a patriot when i get the 222, i loved the feel of the patriot just wanted to change to a more race dedicated bike

    2)i bought it before i understood suspension any where near as well as i do now.

    3) i will be going back to a 224 evo when given the chance (budget issues)
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  22. #22
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    Last edited by his dudeness; 06-30-2011 at 03:27 PM.
    The arsonist has oddly shaped feet!

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    development of a good design is good, redesigning for sake of marketing is bad. that is my point. so enough of the sarcasm and removing my quote from its context.
    Enough of YOUR sarcasm and removing MY quote from it's context.

    And aren't you the kid saying Orange is the only company that makres a good bike, and that apparently any company that redesigns a bike is doing so purely for marketing?

    Yet you have a Turner. Didn't Turner do a redesign? Are they sellouts now?
    The arsonist has oddly shaped feet!

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by his dudeness View Post
    Enough of YOUR sarcasm and removing MY quote from it's context.

    And aren't you the kid saying Orange is the only company that makres a good bike, and that apparently any company that redesigns a bike is doing so purely for marketing?

    Yet you have a Turner. Didn't Turner do a redesign? Are they sellouts now?
    again, removed it from context. i never said orange were the only good bikes out there. far from it. and turner did not invent a whole new system to make good marketing but instead continued the development of an existing system that i known to work.

    enough of your twisting.
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  25. #25
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    This thread made my head hurt. Where did the good old MTBR days go?
    I just want to ride.

  26. #26
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    so what do you think of the bike?

    is it good or not?

    i haven't understood yet!

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by sundace View Post
    so what do you think of the bike?

    is it good or not?

    i haven't understood yet!
    good if you like lots of maintenance, lots of stupid useless bearings, weaker designs and more prone to flex.
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  28. #28
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    That bike is ugly to me, and seems overly complicated/inefficient.

    Any ride reports?

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    explanation and reasoning with sometimes NEVER works, they are still deluded and lost like you!

    ONCE you understand how certain characteristics that are created though certain design implications then it is possible to understand how a bike will ride by looking at it. and before you fly of the handle that is not ********. its just tiny bit harder with vpp but with a single pivot and some practical knowledge and a logical technical understanding its piss easy to work out by looking at it.

    but if you protest the opposite you just prove your ignorance and and how far you have bought into marketing. and you are dead to understanding how rear suspension works.

    Stop talking out your rear end. No one can only look at a complex design and understand the details of its working characteristics, let alone the specific forces acting on any member. I dare you to plot the rear-axle to BB-center distance as the bike moves through its travel (even ignoring chain tension), if you think it's easy to do. And it's very doable, I'll tell you that much, though rather difficult.


    -Third Year Mechanical Engineering Student, Cal Poly SLO
    Last edited by igotbanned; 06-26-2011 at 10:03 PM.
    Gnar Cal!

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by igotbanned View Post
    Stop talking out your rear end. No one can only look at a complex design and understand the details of its working characteristics, let alone the specific forces acting on any member. I dare you to plot the rear-axle to BB-center distance as the bike moves through its travel (even ignoring chain tension), if you think it's easy to do. And it's very doable, I'll tell you that much, though rather difficult.


    -Third Year Mechanical Engineering Student, Cal Poly SLO
    now take it back into context and stop reading it how you WANT it to be written but read it how it is.
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    now take it back into context and stop reading it how you WANT it to be written but read it how it is.
    :cough: troll :cough:
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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    now take it back into context and stop reading it how you WANT it to be written but read it how it is.

    I never took it out of context. I quoted you on what you said in its entirety. What is written is that a person can take a look at a picture of a (new) suspension design and come to conclusions about how well it works. That is not true. If you truly believe you can do that I don't know what to tell you, except that, no, you can't.
    How about, instead, you read what you wrote.

    And how about my dare?
    Gnar Cal!

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by igotbanned View Post
    I never took it out of context. I quoted you on what you said in its entirety. What is written is that a person can take a look at a picture of a (new) suspension design and come to conclusions about how well it works. That is not true. If you truly believe you can do that I don't know what to tell you, except that, no, you can't.
    How about, instead, you read what you wrote.

    And how about my dare?
    There is obviously no use reasoning with bxxer riding because apparently he is so pro that he has turned down testing a new progressive design to ride his clunky Turner, that has since then abandoned ship and gone to a non existent DW link.

    And to Bxxer rider if we didn't develope new suspension designs we would all still be riding Proflex, Outland and Amp research frames.
    "its not how slack your head angle is, its how you ride the bike"

  34. #34
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    My dearest Bxxr-Rider, must we go down this road again?

    <object width='500' height='281'><param name='allowFullScreen' value='true' /><param name='allowScriptAccess' value='always' /><param name='movie' value='http://www.pinkbike.com/v/158521/l/' /><embed src='http://www.pinkbike.com/v/158521/l/' type='application/x-shockwave-flash' width='500' height='281' allowFullScreen='true' allowScriptAccess='always'></embed></object><p><a href="http://www.pinkbike.com/video/158521/">leckhampton, self filmed</a> on <a href="http://www.pinkbike.com">pinkbike.com</a></p>

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by b4 stealth View Post
    :cough: troll :cough:

    If only it were so...

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by dowst View Post
    My dearest Bxxr-Rider, must we go down this road again?

    <object width='500' height='281'><param name='allowFullScreen' value='true' /><param name='allowScriptAccess' value='always' /><param name='movie' value='http://www.pinkbike.com/v/158521/l/' /><embed src='http://www.pinkbike.com/v/158521/l/' type='application/x-shockwave-flash' width='500' height='281' allowFullScreen='true' allowScriptAccess='always'></embed></object><p><a href="http://www.pinkbike.com/video/158521/">leckhampton, self filmed</a> on <a href="http://www.pinkbike.com">pinkbike.com</a></p>
    A little brake control would go a long way downhillers who skid into every corners give us a bad name.
    By the way that was a sick cyclocross track
    "its not how slack your head angle is, its how you ride the bike"

  37. #37
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    after such a productive discussion, i guess that the bike kicks ass!

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by giantsaam View Post
    There is obviously no use reasoning with bxxer riding because apparently he is so pro that he has turned down testing a new progressive design to ride his clunky Turner, that has since then abandoned ship and gone to a non existent DW link.

    And to Bxxer rider if we didn't develope new suspension designs we would all still be riding Proflex, Outland and Amp research frames.
    show me a design that is actually NEW not just re-badged other technology from the last 5 years in suspension.

    and igotbanned i never said that i could give out precise technical data just work out what the ride characteristics will be.

    and dowst don't do the personal attacks because it just makes a fool of your self. (besides i had a highroller on it the back of the vid so soon as i touched back brake it locked up every time no matter how hard you works to modulate the power)

    giantsaam just a loose natural line for bit of a mess-about. my riding has infact changed massively since then.


    on and fact i can be reasoned with just with a factual argument that doesn't have bus size loopholes in cobble to gather a decent enough comment then i give respect. i don't have any respect what so ever in the very slightest for any one who following marketing ******** that is everywhere in this sport.

    oh and btw, mtbr i now officially worse then pinkbike. just some on here when bored and cant ride.....
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  39. #39
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    Oh lord, you've said something true. You can't be reasoned with unless being told you are correct.

    As to finding a new design, found one: http://www.lapierre-bikes.co.uk/lapi...1/dh-team-2011

    So if you can't give precise technical data, lets hear how it will ride. Don't argue around my every point and ignore me. Obviously the picture in the link shows enough details for your judgement. Tell me how it rides overall.

    And maybe in addition to that, go ahead and point out any loophole you've found in my arguments so far.
    Gnar Cal!

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    i guess the discussion has gone totally downhill...

    my main concerns on the lapierre 720 are:

    1. 7 pairs of bolts are too many, aren't they?

    2. the pendbox may attract too much dirt

    3. the pendbox is too vulnerable in rocks...it may be damaged rather easily...(?)


    overall i like the design and is a very tempting bike.

    another option is the devinci wilson xp:

    http://www.devinci.com/bikes/browse_9#9_32_93

    comments please!

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    show me a design that is actually NEW not just re-badged other technology from the last 5 years in suspension.

    and igotbanned i never said that i could give out precise technical data just work out what the ride characteristics will be.

    and dowst don't do the personal attacks because it just makes a fool of your self. (besides i had a highroller on it the back of the vid so soon as i touched back brake it locked up every time no matter how hard you works to modulate the power)

    giantsaam just a loose natural line for bit of a mess-about. my riding has infact changed massively since then.


    on and fact i can be reasoned with just with a factual argument that doesn't have bus size loopholes in cobble to gather a decent enough comment then i give respect. i don't have any respect what so ever in the very slightest for any one who following marketing ******** that is everywhere in this sport.

    oh and btw, mtbr i now officially worse then pinkbike. just some on here when bored and cant ride.....
    You are by far the biggest troll I've ever seen here. You have not once given any factual information to back up what you say, and just keep ignoring people who ask you specific questions by acting like a patronizing jerk. You just keep plugging your ears and screaming out "LALALALA I'M RIGHT I'M RIGHT I'M RIGHT"
    "Solution to two of the world's problems: Feed the homeless to the hungry."

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyrix View Post
    You are by far the biggest troll I've ever seen here. You have not once given any factual information to back up what you say, and just keep ignoring people who ask you specific questions by acting like a patronizing jerk. You just keep plugging your ears and screaming out "LALALALA I'M RIGHT I'M RIGHT I'M RIGHT"
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by igotbanned View Post
    Oh lord, you've said something true. You can't be reasoned with unless being told you are correct.

    As to finding a new design, found one: http://www.lapierre-bikes.co.uk/lapi...1/dh-team-2011 its not new tech, its a new way of creating a pedalling characteristic from the 90's!!!!! its not ****ing new! just a stupid arse backwards way of doing things

    So if you can't give precise technical data, lets hear how it will ride. Don't argue around my every point and ignore me. Obviously the picture in the link shows enough details for your judgement. Tell me how it rides overall. uses a progressive link, hopefully i don't have to explain what that means.....

    pivot position will mean that over stutter bumps the wheel will track well, but also under hard cornering and g-outs the chainstay wont lengthen that much giving that accelerating feeling though corners.

    the pend-box system means it wont suffer from pedal-bob


    but once the bearings wear and possible ova-ling of the seats then it will flex all over the place!


    And maybe in addition to that, go ahead and point out any loophole you've found in my arguments so far.
    ...
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by sundace View Post
    i guess the discussion has gone totally downhill...

    my main concerns on the lapierre 720 are:

    1. 7 pairs of bolts are too many, aren't they? yes

    2. the pendbox may attract too much dirt yes

    3. the pendbox is too vulnerable in rocks...it may be damaged rather easily...(?) yes


    overall i like the design and is a very tempting bike.

    another option is the devinci wilson xp:

    http://www.devinci.com/bikes/browse_9#9_32_93

    comments please!
    much much much better option to go with the wilson.
    Quote Originally Posted by [Orge
    ]
    This problem could quite simply be solved if people would stop buying Konas.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    I figured you wouldn't have an actual intellectual answer to respond with.
    "Solution to two of the world's problems: Feed the homeless to the hungry."

  46. #46
    mtbr member
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    Quote Originally Posted by bxxer rider View Post
    now take it back into context and stop reading it how you WANT it to be written but read it how it is.

    It's just funny how everyone that has something to counter what you said was marketing hype is apprently dumb and taking things out of context yet you have no ability to prove this so-called marketing hype yourself or even prove that a specific design is good or bad just by looking at the pictures... Oddly enough when someone calls you out on that you once again play the "out of context" card.


    You're a funny kid, but just like no one's points are valid to you, yours aren't valid to the majority either.
    The arsonist has oddly shaped feet!

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