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  1. #1
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    Help Me Make This A Race Bike!

    I want to get a few DH races in this year - depending on the course I'll either be using my 6" bike (currently an RFX, but might be changing that, soon) - or my 8" bike - a 2004 Foes Fly.

    I love the Fly: it rides great, but is a fat pig and could use some fine tuning to make it a little lighter.

    Lighter wheels/tires - bars and possibly some kind of chain guide all seem like good places to start.

    Other than that - and recognizing that money doesn't grow on trees - what would you guys suggest?
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  2. #2
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    new rear shock dhx air or 5.0

  3. #3
    wait...what?
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    dhx air, and a blackspire stinger for the guide..

  4. #4
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    tubeless
    2008 Transition Dirtbag w/Totem

  5. #5
    EastBaySteez
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    Boxxer or 40RC2
    Lighter single ring guide (such as gamut )
    regular seat post
    Gamut
    Team Evil
    Formerly: motormonkeyr6

  6. #6
    BrassBalled DropbarNinja
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    keep the Curnutt...

    Go ghetto tubeless
    Gamut P30 with a 36T front.
    Hope Pro II laced to Syncros DP28
    2.35 Highroller in the back with a 2.5 Minion 3C in front.
    Road Cassette
    Lighter saddle
    Boxxer
    Twenty6 stem
    Deity Dirty30
    XC seatpost

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrpercussive
    keep the Curnutt...

    Go ghetto tubeless
    Gamut P30 with a 36T front.
    Hope Pro II laced to Syncros DP28
    2.35 Highroller in the back with a 2.5 Minion 3C in front.
    Road Cassette
    Lighter saddle
    Boxxer
    Twenty6 stem
    Deity Dirty30
    XC seatpost
    You guys are spending my money faster than I can make it!

    Replacing the Curnutt with something else would probably save a lot of weight. I forgot that these bikes had that option (Foes usually come with Curnutt's, and most models don't offer any other shocks as options).

    I might call Foes and see if they have any of the OEM Fox shocks lying around - it wasn't a standard shock, so I don't think I could find one otherwise...

    I've already replaced the seatpost with a Thomson and have some lighter seats lying around that I could put on it.

    My hubs are solid (chris king) - but I will probably find some lighter rims/spokes/nipples/tires and reduce the rotating mass.

    Carbon DH bars? The Truvativ bars on their currently weight something like 350 grams!
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  8. #8
    Natl. Champ DH Poser/Hack
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    36-ish single ring and a gamut or a used srs would work. those show up cheap from time to time.
    road cassette fer sure.
    yer wheels look fine. updatein the tires will help but ya may not save any weight.
    a shock swap will save some weight and in a excellent spot on the bike but id stay away from the dhxa and go coil.
    yer fork is a brick. obviously somethin new will be a huge investment. boxxers are nice and the '09's are gonna be cheap soon.
    carbon dh bars are risky. the easton havoc is wide, lite and half the money.
    No, I'm NOT back!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles
    You guys are spending my money faster than I can make it!

    Replacing the Curnutt with something else would probably save a lot of weight. I forgot that these bikes had that option (Foes usually come with Curnutt's, and most models don't offer any other shocks as options).

    I might call Foes and see if they have any of the OEM Fox shocks lying around - it wasn't a standard shock, so I don't think I could find one otherwise...

    I've already replaced the seatpost with a Thomson and have some lighter seats lying around that I could put on it.

    My hubs are solid (chris king) - but I will probably find some lighter rims/spokes/nipples/tires and reduce the rotating mass.

    Carbon DH bars? The Truvativ bars on their currently weight something like 350 grams!
    No Carbon bars for DH, dangerous. Try some sunline V-one, they weight 260g for the 19mm rise ones.

  10. #10
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    wash your bike!
    I'm GNARcissistic

  11. #11
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    dont get rid of that rear shock, that is the most badass shock on downhill bikes.,
    Quote Originally Posted by _dw
    To be blunt;

    6) The Earth would begin to collapse into a black hole and it would make people sad.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by EDizzleVR6
    dont get rid of that rear shock, that is the most badass shock on downhill bikes.,
    Why? Because it weighs 2lbs more than anything else, or because it performs like crap compared to a fox DHX coil?

    I had that shock, it was a POS. For that "big" of a shock, you'd think the damping would be good and that the shock would react well in all situations, nope. Harsh as heck, rebound-clunk, etc. Got it rebuilt even, same problems. CV/T (spv) will never work as well as a good shimmed-damper setup, no matter how much money Brent Foes paid into it to be able to use it.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem
    Why? Because it weighs 2lbs more than anything else, or because it performs like crap compared to a fox DHX coil?

    I had that shock, it was a POS. For that "big" of a shock, you'd think the damping would be good and that the shock would react well in all situations, nope. Harsh as heck, rebound-clunk, etc. Got it rebuilt even, same problems. CV/T (spv) will never work as well as a good shimmed-damper setup, no matter how much money Brent Foes paid into it to be able to use it.
    You're going to LOVE my new FXR! Curnutt Air sweetness!
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  14. #14
    N* Bomber Crew
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    People are recommending a DHX Air in replacement of a Curnutt?

    Dude...use you're friggin dome.
    Northstar 2008 Riding Crew

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raptordude
    People are recommending a DHX Air in replacement of a Curnutt?

    Dude...use you're friggin dome.
    Don't know who you're responding to - but everyone knows the eye to eye on this bike is too long for off the shelf shocks. Foes did offer the bike with a Vanilla coil, though, customized with special fittings and adjustable rod end. If I can find one of those and get a Ti spring for it - it could easily save a pound or two.
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  16. #16
    Natl. Champ DH Poser/Hack
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    look up. 2 reccomendations for the dhxa, 1 of the worst performin shocks ever to come from fox. its a blessing it wont fit on yer frame. trust us. a vanilla rc would be sweet and its pushable. id use it on the dhr in a heartbeat if it would fit.
    No, I'm NOT back!

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by cactuscorn
    look up. 2 reccomendations for the dhxa, 1 of the worst performin shocks ever to come from fox. its a blessing it wont fit on yer frame. trust us. a vanilla rc would be sweet and its pushable. id use it on the dhr in a heartbeat if it would fit.
    Yep. Pushed Vanilla. And it's got the e2e adjust - which might help lower the bb a bit.
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  18. #18
    Natl. Champ DH Poser/Hack
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    b/bkt doesnt look as tall as the h/a looks old school steep. couldnt hurt a damn bit. good luck with the search.
    No, I'm NOT back!

  19. #19
    StraightOuttaCompton
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    a new fork(boxxer, 40, totem) would lighten it up pretty significantly.
    HARDTAIL PRIDE- 09 Kona Five-0

  20. #20
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    just race the bike and beat the guys with the new components

    or just focus on the suspension (new fork and dial it in)
    ↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A Select Start

  21. #21
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    A new fork and/or shock if you can swing it. look used, many awesome deals to be had. I bet we'll see alot of deals on boxxer's as people dish out their coin for new 2010's. cheaper upgrades, i'd say e.13 lg1 or mrp g2 chainguide. Lighter tire's are an easy way to drop rotating mass, or go ghetto tubeless like some have suggested.
    22Pride

  22. #22
    Elitest thrill junkie
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    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles
    You're going to LOVE my new FXR! Curnutt Air sweetness!
    Maybe, but;

    A, the bike doesn't have a curnutt air.

    B, it took this long for Foes to actually make a decent performing curnutt shock (assuming the curnutt air performs well)?

    Brent foes has the technical know-how to make good bikes, but he always failed on the shocks, probably due to the investment he made with the technology.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem
    Maybe, but;

    A, the bike doesn't have a curnutt air.

    B, it took this long for Foes to actually make a decent performing curnutt shock (assuming the curnutt air performs well)?

    Brent foes has the technical know-how to make good bikes, but he always failed on the shocks, probably due to the investment he made with the technology.
    Just looking to replace the RFX which has a stupid high BB. The Curnutt Air feels good - but I am going to do a long term demo just to make sure.

    I'm sure you'll be stoked to see another of your fave shocks out there!
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles
    Don't know who you're responding to - but everyone knows the eye to eye on this bike is too long for off the shelf shocks. Foes did offer the bike with a Vanilla coil, though, customized with special fittings and adjustable rod end. If I can find one of those and get a Ti spring for it - it could easily save a pound or two.
    Glad someone said this.
    Meh.

  25. #25
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    So you beat me at one DH race and now your building the ultimate DH race bike? But seriously, you would be a good DH racer. You should hit up the Northstar series this year with me. That's really the only real DH racing in NorCal. The CCCX series, while well run and fun for the most part you have to pay to push your bike to the top and the courses are not something I would want to ride. I mean, you saw how easily we were able to time everyone down the hill on Saturday. Why pay someone $40 to do that? At least at North* you get to ride the lifts all day.

    Back on topic. I'd just suggest switching out the tires to Maxxis High Rollers or Minions, getting rid of the front derailleur/shifter and setup single ring 36/38T with an LG1 chainguide. I don't think this will really lighten the bike much but will just be a better setup. Your fork is fine and the shock is supposed to be tuned to that bike so I'd rock it. You could build a race wheel set. Rebuild your King hubs with Mavic EN321 (EX823 if you don't want to fuss with ghetto tubeless) with straight 2.0 spokes and allow nips and go tubeless tires. If your racing at North*, other than the Livewire race, you really don't need a super light bike anyway. Although I'd advise against it, if you want carbon bars go with Easton. Mine have some serious battle wounds and they've held up. I have alum EA 70's on my DH bike though.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeng
    So you beat me at one DH race and now your building the ultimate DH race bike? But seriously, you would be a good DH racer. You should hit up the Northstar series this year with me. That's really the only real DH racing in NorCal. The CCCX series, while well run and fun for the most part you have to pay to push your bike to the top and the courses are not something I would want to ride. I mean, you saw how easily we were able to time everyone down the hill on Saturday. Why pay someone $40 to do that? At least at North* you get to ride the lifts all day.

    Back on topic. I'd just suggest switching out the tires to Maxxis High Rollers or Minions, getting rid of the front derailleur/shifter and setup single ring 36/38T with an LG1 chainguide. I don't think this will really lighten the bike much but will just be a better setup. Your fork is fine and the shock is supposed to be tuned to that bike so I'd rock it. You could build a race wheel set. Rebuild your King hubs with Mavic EN321 (EX823 if you don't want to fuss with ghetto tubeless) with straight 2.0 spokes and allow nips and go tubeless tires. If your racing at North*, other than the Livewire race, you really don't need a super light bike anyway. Although I'd advise against it, if you want carbon bars go with Easton. Mine have some serious battle wounds and they've held up. I have alum EA 70's on my DH bike though.
    That was just luck on my part that you dropped your chain!

    I've been wanting to lighten up the Fly for a while now - racing just helps me sell the missus on the idea of more $$ wasted on bikes!
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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles
    That was just luck on my part that you dropped your chain!

    I've been wanting to lighten up the Fly for a while now - racing just helps me sell the missus on the idea of more $$ wasted on bikes!
    Well if you really want a light DH rig replace this Foes with a Session 88 frame... Man I really want one of those.

  28. #28
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    I race an '05 Foes Fly and it's great. The Curnutt is not nearly as bad as people say. Mine actually works quite well despite being sprung and valved for someone 200lbs. I just got it rebuilt/revalved and sprung lighter for the '09 season and I'm very excited. Keep the Curnutt and save the extra couple hundred bucks to pay for race fee's and gas money to travel to other races.

    For your bike I would recommend swapping the rims out for a set of WTB Laserdisc FR rims and DT Competition spokes to bring a bit of the weight down.
    A Gamut 36t chainguide with Gamut 36t Guide Ring.
    Sunline V1 bars if you're unhappy with the current bars and to gain the benefits of a wider bar.
    It looks like you've got a King headset in there and I must say I love the King products I have(hubs, headsets, bottom brackets) because they work so well and last forever. However, throwing a Crank Bros Direct set in there would lower the stack height and would provide a little more room to adjust the fork to slack out the head angle just a tad without raising the front end too much.

    -Kevin

  29. #29
    moaaar shimz
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    Quote Originally Posted by [email protected]
    new rear shock dhx air or 5.0
    Retarded comment

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacubaya
    Retarded comment
    Be Nice! Not everyone is an expert on all things Foes!

    That said - I talked to Foes and they ain't got squat for the Fox Vanilla's with custom fittings for my frame. If anyone has a line on one, let me know!
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  31. #31
    moaaar shimz
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    Sorry, I guess I was wrong
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  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacubaya
    Sorry, I guess I was wrong
    hammock. Wollow. Blech.
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  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by tacubaya
    Sorry, I guess I was wrong

    fox does make air ATV shocks... i'm sure those come in the right E2E... lol.
    Proud to represent Mojo Wheels.

  34. #34
    Natl. Champ DH Poser/Hack
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    would avalanche build ya a shock? some say theyre the best in the biz. not cheap by a long shot but if yer not all about the curnutt, it might be worth a call or email to craig. weight may be a push or close to it as theyre not known to be light either.

    is that dhxa a photoshop joke?
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  35. #35
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    cheaper to sell the bike and start over
    the trick is ENJOYING YOUR LIFE EACH DAY, don't waste them away wishing for better days

  36. #36
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    If you're bent on replacing the shock then you're options for having one built are Avalanche or Romic. I dealt with Romic last year to get some shock eyelet bushings so I would assume they are still around. Foes does offer the FXR with a DHX 5.0 Air with a long eye to eye. However, it's really just a stock DHX with a cap and heim bolted to it.

    What is the eye-to-eye and stroke of the '04?

    I think you should stick the Curnutt. Maybe spend a few bucks and have Foes revalve it to your body weight and riding style. I think that most people that ride the Curnutts don't like them because they are off the shelf setups and not setup for them. I don't think that a new shock is money well spent.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmxconvert
    I think that most people that ride the Curnutts don't like them because they are off the shelf setups and not setup for them. I don't think that a new shock is money well spent.
    The technology doesn't allow for that. The "platform" will always cause there to be more damping than is required for perfect bump absportion, and the position-sensitive damping makes it very harsh in the real rough stuff. Great for drops, but there's so much more to riding than a few drops. I sent it back more than once. The curnutt is a huge dissapointment because you think with a shock that big, it's just going to be butter everywhere. Unfortunately it was like my overly-progressive stratos helix (progressive wound spring on a hybrid air and coil shock, plus progressive linkage), just that it was even harsher. I had the displeasure of using a 5th element on my iron horse for a while too.

    The CV/T technology can't hold a candle to valid suspension technology that's been used for years.

    Not only that, but what's the benefit of that huge 4lb shock anyway? Why does it have to be so huge and big with no advantage over other shocks? That's one of the issues with a "race" bike, because it would save some serious weight to replace it, heck even with another coil shock.

    Why do you think the Progressive 5th element coil shocks (SPV is same as CV/T) came and went so fast?

    I think foes are great bikes, but they've been held back with the coil curnutts for a long time.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  38. #38
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    Jayem Loves Him Some Curnutt!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem
    The technology doesn't allow for that. The "platform" will always cause there to be more damping than is required for perfect bump absportion, and the position-sensitive damping makes it very harsh in the real rough stuff. Great for drops, but there's so much more to riding than a few drops. I sent it back more than once. The curnutt is a huge dissapointment because you think with a shock that big, it's just going to be butter everywhere. Unfortunately it was like my overly-progressive stratos helix (progressive wound spring on a hybrid air and coil shock, plus progressive linkage), just that it was even harsher. I had the displeasure of using a 5th element on my iron horse for a while too.

    The CV/T technology can't hold a candle to valid suspension technology that's been used for years.

    Not only that, but what's the benefit of that huge 4lb shock anyway? Why does it have to be so huge and big with no advantage over other shocks? That's one of the issues with a "race" bike, because it would save some serious weight to replace it, heck even with another coil shock.

    Why do you think the Progressive 5th element coil shocks (SPV is same as CV/T) came and went so fast?

    I think foes are great bikes, but they've been held back with the coil curnutts for a long time.
    You ever going to drop it, Jayem? At last count you had over 75 posts dedicated to bashing Curnutt.

    Let it go already!

    (edit)

    http://www.google.com/search?q=jayem...hl=en&filter=0

    DAMN, Jayem - are you really up to 139 posts bashing Curnutt shocks? That damn near a vendetta! I think it's time you just let it all out.

    Go for it, Jayem. We're here for you!
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  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles
    DAMN, Jayem - are you really up to 139 posts bashing Curnutt shocks? That
    They are that bad.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles
    You ever going to drop it, Jayem? At last count you had over 75 posts dedicated to bashing Curnutt.

    Let it go already!

    (edit)

    http://www.google.com/search?q=jayem...hl=en&filter=0

    DAMN, Jayem - are you really up to 139 posts bashing Curnutt shocks? That damn near a vendetta! I think it's time you just let it all out.

    Go for it, Jayem. We're here for you!
    I don't think this counts as Curnutt bashing:

    FindLostFriendsOnline.com: Male > Wyoming > Jay Em > C
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  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem
    The technology doesn't allow for that. The "platform" will always cause there to be more damping than is required for perfect bump absportion, and the position-sensitive damping makes it very harsh in the real rough stuff. Great for drops, but there's so much more to riding than a few drops. I sent it back more than once. The curnutt is a huge dissapointment because you think with a shock that big, it's just going to be butter everywhere. Unfortunately it was like my overly-progressive stratos helix (progressive wound spring on a hybrid air and coil shock, plus progressive linkage), just that it was even harsher. I had the displeasure of using a 5th element on my iron horse for a while too.

    The CV/T technology can't hold a candle to valid suspension technology that's been used for years.

    Not only that, but what's the benefit of that huge 4lb shock anyway? Why does it have to be so huge and big with no advantage over other shocks? That's one of the issues with a "race" bike, because it would save some serious weight to replace it, heck even with another coil shock.

    Why do you think the Progressive 5th element coil shocks (SPV is same as CV/T) came and went so fast?

    I think foes are great bikes, but they've been held back with the coil curnutts for a long time.
    I have a Curnutt. I like it. Mine does not do the things you say it does. It has in the past, but after being setup and tuned it is a far nicer. My point is that Foes CAN revlave the internals based on riding styles and weights. It has a significant difference in feeling.

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