Do I want a Sunday or a 7 Point?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Do I want a Sunday or a 7 Point?

    I had a chance to demo a Sunday at the Dry Hill Shuttle day last weekend and it's got me itching to get on a DW linkage bike.

    I'm riding in the Pacific NW and will be doing like 50% of my rides on the Shore and 50% at Whistler.

    Do you think I can get away with the racey HA and Lower BB of the Sunday for the shore or would I be happier on a 7 Point?
    SHAM-WOW

  2. #2
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    DW says...

    PS - You might want to ask in the Iron Horse forum as well. There are a couple of guys that have owned both bikes.
    Last edited by Winston; 03-29-2007 at 10:44 PM.
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  3. #3
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    7point for sure. Sundays are total race bikes, they really want to stick to the ground. The 7point is more playful.

  4. #4
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    I am struggling with EXACT problem myself. I do own a DW-Link bike! Believe the hype.

    If you are strickly looking for a DH/Park bike- I believe the Sunday is the way to go. The reason I am leaning towards the 7point (for now) is it versatility. It is beyond tough. Descends well. Climbs much lighter than its weight would have you believe. It also allows for the use of a front derailer. Here in So Cal, we have to pedal UP in order to ride the trail down.

  5. #5
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    I bought a Sunday as my first Freeride/DH bike. The DW link impressed me too. However, the low bb on the Sunday bugs me so now I think I should have bought a 7Point and put an 888 on it to reduce the HA. There is info on the Iron Horse forum.
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  6. #6
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    The Sunday can go uphill, but it's not fun. I picked up a telescoping seatpost in case I get in a situation where I'm climbing on mine again - that combined with the adjustable travel on the 888sl should make it a bit easier.
    But if you're planning on pedalling up on a regular basis, the 7 Point is the way to go. It climbs great. It can descend anything that the Sunday can, it's just not quite as comfortable going fast on wide open dh trails. But for tight and technical, it does have the advantage.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbabuser
    ...
    But if you're planning on pedalling up on a regular basis, the 7 Point is the way to go. It climbs great. It can descend anything that the Sunday can, it's just not quite as comfortable going fast on wide open dh trails. But for tight and technical, it does have the advantage.
    Sorry to hijack, but you think the 7Point has an advantage for tight and technical. Does that include steep, tight and technical? I would think the low bb, slack head angle of the Sunday would be an advantage?
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by artnshel
    Sorry to hijack, but you think the 7Point has an advantage for tight and technical. Does that include steep, tight and technical? I would think the low bb, slack head angle of the Sunday would be an advantage?
    I'd say the headangle on the 7 point makes it easier to maneuver on slow tech trails. When we were in Tride for the msc race a couple years ago, we had the good fortune to hit sasquatch. My 7 point felt like it was made for that trail. Tight, twisty with drops around every corner - fk yeah! And the taller bb/ shorter wheelbase means you're not smacking pedals or the bashguard nearly as often.
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by dbabuser
    I'd say the headangle on the 7 point makes it easier to maneuver on slow tech trails. When we were in Tride for the msc race a couple years ago, we had the good fortune to hit sasquatch. My 7 point felt like it was made for that trail. Tight, twisty with drops around every corner - fk yeah! And the taller bb/ shorter wheelbase means you're not smacking pedals or the bashguard nearly as often.
    Thanks for the detail
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  11. #11
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    I had a 7 Point and it's a versatile beast. I think that with a 180mm fork like a Travis or Totem and a Roco rear shock it's enough DH bike for most people. However set it up with a DHX and you have a bike that pedals well and is a DH weapon too.

    Bascially get a 7 Point. You won't feel like it's holiding you back on the DH. Go to the IH forum and check out how people have set theirs up. A slightly longer fork and a Roco rear shock is a popular upgrade.

    Jon.

  12. #12
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    Be like me, get both They are both such incredible bikes.

    Lets get up and ride some shore again some time, I've been on a Cypress kick lately. I just got back from riding chuckanut, that trail is just so much fun to fly down on the sunday . I'll let you try out my 7point sometime when i get a fork on it.

    Teague; owner of far too many bikes for a college student.

  13. #13
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    I know this is OT

    Teague do you go to UBC by any chance?

    I'm a junior in highschool lookin at colleges and a prime concern is where to keep all my bikes! Have an Enduro, p3, and probably a Demo 8 soon.
    it's actually not a PRIME concern, because all dorms at any school are going to be pretty much the same

    How do you keep all your bikes w/ u?

    P.S. i'm a canadian citizen so UBC is lookin like a nice option

  14. #14
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    I actually live in Bellingham, just south of the border, and go to Western Washington University. I live in a house with a pretty big garage, so I dont have too many problems with space, other than navigating between my roommates streetbikes. I know some people that go to UBC and like it, good school.

    I have:
    IH Sunday
    IH 7point
    IH porter
    Giant Reign
    Old specialized rockhopper hardtail
    Snowbike

    rediculous, but i use them all I think that its nice to have lots of bikes, means that i can always have the right bike for any given ride, or backups for bikes with broken parts.

    Teague

  15. #15
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    If it helps at all I have a 7point and am loving it! I second the low BB. If you are doing shore I think that the 7point would be a better choice.
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  16. #16
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    The 7 Point is a very versitle bike, would be great on the shore. Sunday's BB is too low.
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  17. #17
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    Get the 7point

    The Sunday is alot more of a race bike although it would probabley do ok on the Shore. I live in BC and lots of trails in BC require some climbing before you can go downhill so that is where the 7point will be better.
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  18. #18
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    The above comments about the shore are true, with the exception of Cypress, which is the best of the three, and best ridden on a sunday.... so awesome.

    Teague

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by coldawg
    Teague do you go to UBC by any chance?

    I'm a junior in highschool lookin at colleges and a prime concern is where to keep all my bikes! Have an Enduro, p3, and probably a Demo 8 soon.
    it's actually not a PRIME concern, because all dorms at any school are going to be pretty much the same

    How do you keep all your bikes w/ u?

    P.S. i'm a canadian citizen so UBC is lookin like a nice option
    it takes a bit of ingenuity but it can definitely be accomplished. don't even worry about space.

    2 bikes in the dorm is a fair bit better than 3, but you can definitely work it out.

  20. #20
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    Thanks for all the opinions. As I said earlier, I have also been struggling with the same question. Even with everything pointing me toward the 7point, I still can't give up on the Sunday yet. Kinda' frustrating!

    Last question- nice deals on the 2006 7points. Is there any reason to consider the 2007model?

  21. #21
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    The '07 frames are lighter. Do a search on the IH forum for #'s. I think I heard around a pound difference?
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  22. #22
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    Thanks Man!

  23. #23
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    I want a Sunday

  24. #24
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    I just picked up an 06 7point5.....I'm telling you, it is a hell of a deal for the price

  25. #25
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    Uhh

    Quote Originally Posted by dbabuser
    The '07 frames are lighter. Do a search on the IH forum for #'s. I think I heard around a pound difference?

    So, where exactly is the Iron Horse forum you guys are talking about? I own a IH Warrior and want to upgrade to something more Freerideable since I believe my limited travel is hindering my fun! (Also because I've had to replace a lot of stuff of stuff)

    EDIT: Never mind, I found 'em! (Gotta love google)
    Last edited by splatman; 03-31-2007 at 02:40 PM.

  26. #26
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    Hey BX- how does the head angle feel when riding? Perfect? Too steep?

  27. #27
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    I really think its in the right place. I know there was some concern about it being a little too steep, but I think it depends more on your fork choice

  28. #28
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    Hey DR,
    I used to own a 05 7point3 and I just ordered a 07 7point frame.
    Some people think the 7point is too steep. I beg to disagree. My 7point3 had the Manipoo Stance flow on it. It has 150mm travel and a A2C of 135mm.
    A Marz All Mountain 1 has 160mm and A2C of 151mm.
    A Marz 66 has 180mm travel and an A2C of 165mm.

    Other than the manitou being a low grade fork, I never felt like the bike was too steep. I think I am getting the All Mountain 1. It will make the bike a little slacker and will keep it light. The runner up is the 66sl but it has had some defect issues.

    I guess it depends on your riding stance. Some prefer to sit on their back tire on steep stuff. I prefer to stay centered and work it.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by wormvine
    Hey DR,
    I used to own a 05 7point3 and I just ordered a 07 7point frame.
    Some people think the 7point is too steep. I beg to disagree. My 7point3 had the Manipoo Stance flow on it. It has 150mm travel and a A2C of 135mm.
    A Marz All Mountain 1 has 160mm and A2C of 151mm.
    A Marz 66 has 180mm travel and an A2C of 165mm.

    Other than the manitou being a low grade fork, I never felt like the bike was too steep. I think I am getting the All Mountain 1. It will make the bike a little slacker and will keep it light. The runner up is the 66sl but it has had some defect issues.

    I guess it depends on your riding stance. Some prefer to sit on their back tire on steep stuff. I prefer to stay centered and work it.
    Axle to crown height of 135mm? 151mm? 165mm? I beg to differ. That's not even big enough to clear a 26'' wheel. I think you've got your numbers way wrong.

    A2C height is measure from the center of the axle(you know, the thing that goes through the hub?) to the very top of the crown(bottom crown on a dual crown fork).

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teague
    Be like me, get both They are both such incredible bikes.

    Lets get up and ride some shore again some time, I've been on a Cypress kick lately. I just got back from riding chuckanut, that trail is just so much fun to fly down on the sunday . I'll let you try out my 7point sometime when i get a fork on it.

    Teague; owner of far too many bikes for a college student.
    Hey we should definitly hit up a shore ride soon. I'd definitly like to take a spin on your 7 point fpr sure some time. What are you looking at for a fork on it? I assume you put your Boxxer World cup on the Sunday?
    SHAM-WOW

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by snaky69
    Axle to crown height of 135mm? 151mm? 165mm? I beg to differ. That's not even big enough to clear a 26'' wheel. I think you've got your numbers way wrong.

    A2C height is measure from the center of the axle(you know, the thing that goes through the hub?) to the very top of the crown(bottom crown on a dual crown fork).
    I'm sure he meant 535, 551, and 565.

    And IMHO, 7 point is the way to go.

  32. #32
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    I think it (sadly) boils down to this:

    7Point = More practical
    Sunday = Cooler

    I had to make a similar choice when deciding between an Orange Patriot or 224 (and I think a lot of people have to make the same decision). I went for the Patriot and generally I'm happy but there are always moments when you wish you'd gone for the [email protected]$$ bike... just one of those things.
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  33. #33
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    I think you are totally right. I bet half the people out there on 8" dual-crown bikes would be better riders and have more fun on a 7" single crown bike. The Sunday and 7point are both sick. Be honest with yourself about what kind of riding you do and you will make the right decision. Pick the bike that is best for 75% of your riding, not the 25% that you WISH you did all the time.

    BTW: I had the same questions, I bought the 7point7. Freakin LOVE it. It lacks the dead-sexy lines of the Sunday, but the ugly-duckling nature of the frame will grow on you.

    JMH

    Quote Originally Posted by Ace1
    I think it (sadly) boils down to this:
    7Point = More practical
    Sunday = Cooler
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  34. #34
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    The problem I am having is the geometry of the Sunday "feels" more natural when pedaling around. The 7point has a "feel" that reminds me of my MKIII. Not the same- can't explain it.

    Another reason I don't mind waiting, I am well aware set-up plays a huge role in how a bike feels. Here in So Cal, you see 7points all the time. Just waiting for the day when I sit on a 7point that is set-up "my Style." That style includes a single crown fork! Slacker headangle?

    Bottomline, I know the 7point is a better fit. I also know some bikes feel RIGHT without changing a thing. Other bikes may not feel right even if you change everything.

    Thanks for your help fellas. Don't worry, it will GET DONE!

  35. #35
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    Axle to crown height of 135mm? 151mm? 165mm? I beg to differ. That's not even big enough to clear a 26'' wheel. I think you've got your numbers way wrong.
    Sorry Brain fart.
    532mm for the Stance flow. 551mm for the Marz AM 1, 565mm for the 66 series.
    Last edited by wormvine; 04-01-2007 at 06:03 PM.

  36. #36
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    i love my 7point. i have it setup with a travis 180 single and a swinger 6way. i rode it at PA last week and it shredded everything. i totally agree with JMH - be honest with yourself about what kinda riding you'll be doing, allow that to help you make a decision. also, if you're on the fence about the bike's capabilities check out elemental - ryder kasprick and jordie lunn are both riding 7points. bottom line - unless you're riding mostly DH, the 7point is a better choice.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by JMH
    I .... but the ugly-duckling nature of the frame will grow on you.

    JMH
    I don't think that is an ugly bike at all.
    2 wheels

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teague
    Be like me, get both They are both such incredible bikes.

    Lets get up and ride some shore again some time, I've been on a Cypress kick lately. I just got back from riding chuckanut, that trail is just so much fun to fly down on the sunday . I'll let you try out my 7point sometime when i get a fork on it.

    Teague; owner of far too many bikes for a college student.
    hey teaugue, how is that chuckanut trail? i haven't had a chance to ride it yet. is it pretty close to bow hill road? technical DH/freeride or what?

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goliath_2
    hey teaugue, how is that chuckanut trail? i haven't had a chance to ride it yet. is it pretty close to bow hill road? technical DH/freeride or what?
    Chuckanut is in larabee state park, its just super fast, flowy singletrack with the odd little jump and drop, and fast techy sections. Through a super sweet lush forest too. Unfortunately the trail only goes about halfway down the mountain, then you take an old road down. But its certainly fun, and shuttleable.

    I just road the trails out off north fork for the first time. Holy hell what fun trails. Also shuttleable .

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teague
    Chuckanut is in larabee state park, its just super fast, flowy singletrack with the odd little jump and drop, and fast techy sections. Through a super sweet lush forest too. Unfortunately the trail only goes about halfway down the mountain, then you take an old road down. But its certainly fun, and shuttleable.

    I just road the trails out off north fork for the first time. Holy hell what fun trails. Also shuttleable .

    how long is the trail itself (chuck)? i heard northfork is nice

  41. #41
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    10 minutes give or take, i've never timed it.

  42. #42
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    Anything you buy developed by this genious is fine by me



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  43. #43
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    7 point is the way to go....SO versatile...

    Good deals at rscycle.com right now, too...I got my new 7 point 5 there, then swapped out the rear shock and fork (DHX 5.0 and Totem 1.5)...LOVE IT!!!!


  44. #44
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    man... all this great input on going for a 7 point and why am I still leaning toward a Sunday?
    SHAM-WOW

  45. #45
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    How much 7point frame weight? i feel it is so heavy

  46. #46
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    Before you buy a Sunday or 7pt., you should check out a V-Tach by Knolly. I got mine with the Mack Daddy build kit. This bike is trully the best bike for the kind of riding you say you will be doing.

  47. #47
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    on the Iron Horse site, they say the Sunday Expert is for aggressive Freeride, whilst the Elite , WC is for DH/ race

  48. #48
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    I've seen that on the site. Funny though... the frame is exactly the same and honestly the spec does'nt really make that much of a difference either.

    I got a Sunday World Cup by the way just as an update.
    SHAM-WOW

  49. #49
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    bah, i think i should of gotten the 7 point 5 instead of the kumicho.....i think it was worth the money difference and the small frame would of fit me great. however, i dont even have the kumicho yet, its coming tomorrow :P

  50. #50
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    As a current 7Point rider my vote is going to be for..... the Sunday. Shock of shocks! Here's why, and you can see this in the IH section of MTBR's forums if you go looking for my posts....


    I ride DH almost exclusively on my 7Point which I've setup as slack, low, and "DH racey" as possible with a 888 and Roco. I never pedal the bike uphill unless I'm intentionally trying to punish myself on a XC ride for eating Burger King the day before.

    I actually race DH on mine, and it works, but it could be better (see below). I do at least 6 races a year here in the mid-atlantic/northeast USA and I can justify having a "race bike". I ride lift-access places a lot. And I watch my friends ride local shore-style stuff on V10s and if they can do it on that bike I can do it on a Sunday.

    I think the frame isn't slack enough. Even with the 888 the bike hasn't felt slack enough for me. Call me crazy, whatever, but it's a feel thing. Also, to get it as slack as it is now I've had to go with a LONG fork. I'd rather the front be a couple inches lower with the same (or slacker) head angle.

    Feels pretty high, rides pretty upright. I don't know why but the bike now feels rather tall even running 40% sag in the rear.

    You can still slap a 8" singlecrown on the Sunday and go all x-up crazy if you really wanted to. Put a 12-34 cassette and a 36 or 34t chainring on there and it should be as pedallable as any single-ring FR setup.

    Better drop-outs. It matters when you go through 4 hangers a season easily, without crashing on the rear derailleur.

    I think the cockpit, for amount of pedalling uphill I do (ie. none) is just too long in the cockpit. I'm on a large 7Point and will be going with a medium Sunday despite being 6'4". Should make things nice and compact.

    Sunday Expert is just a nicer color. Yeah honestly, it matters to me!
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  51. #51
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    7point

    After 4 months of owning my 7point here are my opinions.

    I outright love this bike. As people have said before the HT angle is steep and is crappy handling. BS. I have my Super T super steep and its not one bit twitchy.

    All the 7point frames are the same weight. (I think so)

    Its a sick bike the DW linkage is the way to go. Eats up the small bump and is great with the bigger hits.

    I rode a bullit, Nomad, bunch of XC HT's, and many other IH bikes. By far I like the 7points geo's the most.

    If you want to push yourself you can do almost any climb. Mind over matter. Is it going to burn? yes of course your pedaling a 39 lb bike up a hill.

    I love my 7point. The only other bike I would chose to ride is a 6point. But in all reality I'd rather take the extra 2inches.
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  52. #52
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    7"-6"=2"?

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ojai Bicyclist
    7"-6"=2"?

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  54. #54
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    You do realize the 7Point only has 7" of travel right, despite having a 8.75" rear shock length??? Please, tell me you realize this. Tell me this is all just a joke gone bad!


    Oh btw I should add that the 7Point's handling is fantastic. I wouldn't call it twitchy by any stretch but it just doesn't feel as raily in the turns as I'd like if it were slacker/lower. Honestly the only bike I would replace the 7Point with is a Sunday, period. Ok maybe a medium 7Point on the 07 bike since the frames are lighter in 07. ;-)
    EXTREEM MEDIUM MOUNTAINSTYLE SLOPCROSS STEEDS:
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  55. #55
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    [QUOTE=Hot Butter Topping]You do realize the 7Point only has 7" of travel right, despite having a 8.75" rear shock length???

    [QUOTE]


    .... what do you think.


    OF COURSE. Im not that dumb why do you think they call it a 7point...
    Gamut
    Team Evil
    Formerly: motormonkeyr6

  56. #56
    crumb
    Reputation: saviorself's Avatar
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    there are sundays on the new IH lineup listed under aggressive freeride

  57. #57
    mtbr member
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    oops.
    Last edited by po0ptruck; 06-06-2007 at 09:27 PM.
    god built south dakota saying "i dont want anybody to ride MTB here, im going to make it suck ass." so it sucks ass Luke 4:2

  58. #58
    odo
    odo is offline
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    !!!Get a Sunday!!!

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