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  1. #1
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    Demo 9 Pro owners or 888RR owners (long)

    Ok, I'll try not to make this too confusing . . .

    An 04 Demo 9 Pro comes with an 888RR, not an 888R, what is the difference between an RR and an R, well the R has compression cartridge in the left leg and the RR has a dummy cartridge and a spring, but according to the manual, the right side is the same.

    So, I want to upgrade my RR to an R, I call Marzoochi and get all the part numbers for everything that is needed (Marzoochi doesn't sell to the consumer, only dealers and bike shops) and I take the list to several of my local bike shops and ask them to call Marz to check prices and availbility . . .

    I'm still waiting after two weeks for one shop to call me back, another shop, I called after one week to remind them to make the call has yet to call me back and the third shop I gave the list to called back and said "marz said it would be better to sell the fork and buy a new 05 RC," (the same as an 04 R) and that the price would be $550

    This is outragous, I know that the cartridge is around $100 bucks and the small parts, knobs, springs, etc. shouldn't cost more than about $150 so it looks my local bike shop is trying to go for the 200% markup deal with me, or they don't want to get the parts and just hand them over to me so they are making the price so HIGH that I will just go away and they won't have to talk to me? (that's my rant)

    Here are my questions:
    1) for bike owners - Has anybody upgraded the forks on their Demo 9 Pro's or Kona's (I think that is the only bikes that the RR came on?)??

    2) for bike shop guys - I have all the part numbers and will do all the install work myself, all I need is for your shop to order the parts, confirm that it is all the parts needed for this upgrade, and ship the parts to me - Can/Will a shop order all the parts and charge me, say $50 markup on the whole kit, plus shipping rather than markup on each part?

    So for 1 phone call and a few minutes of your time to talk to marz sales person, and to put a shipping label on a package You get $50, does that seem like a fair price for what I'm asking?

    Any shops out there want to get rave reviews for helping me with this?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJBiker
    Ok, I'll try not to make this too confusing . . .

    An 04 Demo 9 Pro comes with an 888RR, not an 888R, what is the difference between an RR and an R, well the R has compression cartridge in the left leg and the RR has a dummy cartridge and a spring, but according to the manual, the right side is the same.

    So, I want to upgrade my RR to an R, I call Marzoochi and get all the part numbers for everything that is needed (Marzoochi doesn't sell to the consumer, only dealers and bike shops) and I take the list to several of my local bike shops and ask them to call Marz to check prices and availbility . . .

    I'm still waiting after two weeks for one shop to call me back, another shop, I called after one week to remind them to make the call has yet to call me back and the third shop I gave the list to called back and said "marz said it would be better to sell the fork and buy a new 05 RC," (the same as an 04 R) and that the price would be $550

    This is outragous, I know that the cartridge is around $100 bucks and the small parts, knobs, springs, etc. shouldn't cost more than about $150 so it looks my local bike shop is trying to go for the 200% markup deal with me, or they don't want to get the parts and just hand them over to me so they are making the price so HIGH that I will just go away and they won't have to talk to me? (that's my rant)

    Here are my questions:
    1) for bike owners - Has anybody upgraded the forks on their Demo 9 Pro's or Kona's (I think that is the only bikes that the RR came on?)??

    2) for bike shop guys - I have all the part numbers and will do all the install work myself, all I need is for your shop to order the parts, confirm that it is all the parts needed for this upgrade, and ship the parts to me - Can/Will a shop order all the parts and charge me, say $50 markup on the whole kit, plus shipping rather than markup on each part?

    So for 1 phone call and a few minutes of your time to talk to marz sales person, and to put a shipping label on a package You get $50, does that seem like a fair price for what I'm asking?

    Any shops out there want to get rave reviews for helping me with this?
    I would try marzocchi one more time. You have the part numbers you need, so just call them up, ask to talk to sales and tell them which parts you want. They have always shipped fork parts to me no problem. I don't see why they wouldn't ship a "replacement" cartridge.

    Shops usually do charge around twice their cost (this applies to shoe stores, car parts, bikes, etc.) so that is not abnormal. They will get some discount over what you will pay to marzocchi, so it will not be quite twice your cost.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJBiker
    Ok, I'll try not to make this too confusing . . .

    An 04 Demo 9 Pro comes with an 888RR, not an 888R, what is the difference between an RR and an R, well the R has compression cartridge in the left leg and the RR has a dummy cartridge and a spring, but according to the manual, the right side is the same.

    So, I want to upgrade my RR to an R, I call Marzoochi and get all the part numbers for everything that is needed (Marzoochi doesn't sell to the consumer, only dealers and bike shops) and I take the list to several of my local bike shops and ask them to call Marz to check prices and availbility . . .

    I'm still waiting after two weeks for one shop to call me back, another shop, I called after one week to remind them to make the call has yet to call me back and the third shop I gave the list to called back and said "marz said it would be better to sell the fork and buy a new 05 RC," (the same as an 04 R) and that the price would be $550

    This is outragous, I know that the cartridge is around $100 bucks and the small parts, knobs, springs, etc. shouldn't cost more than about $150 so it looks my local bike shop is trying to go for the 200% markup deal with me, or they don't want to get the parts and just hand them over to me so they are making the price so HIGH that I will just go away and they won't have to talk to me? (that's my rant)

    Here are my questions:
    1) for bike owners - Has anybody upgraded the forks on their Demo 9 Pro's or Kona's (I think that is the only bikes that the RR came on?)??

    2) for bike shop guys - I have all the part numbers and will do all the install work myself, all I need is for your shop to order the parts, confirm that it is all the parts needed for this upgrade, and ship the parts to me - Can/Will a shop order all the parts and charge me, say $50 markup on the whole kit, plus shipping rather than markup on each part?

    So for 1 phone call and a few minutes of your time to talk to marz sales person, and to put a shipping label on a package You get $50, does that seem like a fair price for what I'm asking?

    Any shops out there want to get rave reviews for helping me with this?
    PM Brianpeterson (rep for Marz) he should be able to hook you up
    the trick is ENJOYING YOUR LIFE EACH DAY, don't waste them away wishing for better days

  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by DJBiker
    2) for bike shop guys - I have all the part numbers and will do all the install work myself, all I need is for your shop to order the parts, confirm that it is all the parts needed for this upgrade, and ship the parts to me - Can/Will a shop order all the parts and charge me, say $50 markup on the whole kit, plus shipping rather than markup on each part?
    Doug,

    Try giving Ryan (the owner) at Kore Bike Industries in Scottsdale (NWC of Scottsdale & Curry) a call. He is very fair with pricing, and goes way out of his way for customers. 480-966-5673. I know he deals directly with Marz a lot.

    ER

  5. #5
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    ER: Cool info, I just got off the phone with Ryan and he said he would give it a shot (call marz and see what he can do pricing wise) so I'll take the list to them and see how that works out.

    Shiver: I'm still trying to find the PM for Brian P when I talked to the techs at Marz, they said to call Brian in sales, and I'm assuming it's the same guy. I'll give him a try as well, he might be able to help.

    Thanks for the info guys.

    (kinda wondering why Go Ride hasn't chimed in?)

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJBiker
    ER: Cool info, I just got off the phone with Ryan and he said he would give it a shot (call marz and see what he can do pricing wise) so I'll take the list to them and see how that works out.

    Shiver: I'm still trying to find the PM for Brian P when I talked to the techs at Marz, they said to call Brian in sales, and I'm assuming it's the same guy. I'll give him a try as well, he might be able to help.

    Thanks for the info guys.

    (kinda wondering why Go Ride hasn't chimed in?)
    Were you dealing with Nate at Excellent bikes?

    Heres the deal... To do the mods you want to do isn't cheap. You basically have to replace everything inside of that left leg.... The cartridge alone will run about $140, at that does not include all of the other little parts you need to finish the job... And if this is the same fork I spoke to Nate about, you asked for extra stuff like springs, shims for the stem, the tools... It all adds up real quick...

    Brian

  7. #7
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    Brian,

    Yes, as a matter of fact, I was talking with Nathan at Excellent bikes, and he did call you (I am assuming this is why this issue is fresh in your mind).

    The thing is: he said, you said "it would be cheaper to sell the fork and buy and new 05 888 RC" (I don't know if you said that, or he came up with it on his own, but lets say I sell the fork and go out and purchase an new 05 888 RC - the retail cost is $1500 so that idea isn't really giving me a warm fuzzy satisified customer feeling, if you know what I mean)

    And yea, I get that Excellent bikes in trying to run a business . . . but lets look at it from the bike shop owner standpoint ;

    I come in and ask for all this stuff, etc., etc.

    You as a bike shop owner, think . . . well let me see, if I get the parts, and tools and everything for this guy and I charge my normal markup (which is roughly about 100% over cost) I'll make a fair amount, anywhere between $180 to $250 profit just to make a phone call and order some stuff. Not a bad deal when you think about it (but the customer - that's me - thinks Gee! what a rip off, why should I do that, and skips the deal, or grudgingly gets the stuff, never returns to the shop and post on the internet and tells all his biking friends what a money grubbing shop it is!

    dat don't seem to good to me, what do you think? OR

    You as a bike shop owner think, hum If I get all this stuff for the guy and take a small overall profit, like say $50 to $100 over cost, it's likely that the customer - that's me again - will think my shop is the next best thing to sliced bread and will tell everyone he meets to shop there and will likely drive across town to spend his money at my shop, and post what a great shop I have and what great customer support they give, etc. etc.

    the fork did come on a $3 + grand bike, of a brand that shop sells, hum the guy could have purchased that bike there and be looking to purchase another bike in the future . . .

    Which shop do you want to shop at, and which shop do you think will get my business?

    If this turns out good, and somebody steps up the friendly customer service level, I might begin to think all my local bike shops are NOT just out to make a quick buck and NOT get a loyal customer, and I might think twice about the Italian products I purchase in the future . . .

    I not making threats, just telling you that as a consumer I take those things into consideration when making my purchasing decisions . . .(is it easy to get parts, are they reasonably priced, is their custormer service good, etc.)

    (I know the "rough" cost of all the items on the list, and with a "REASONABLE" markup the stuff don't cost 1/3 the cost of a fork) feel free to correct me if I wrong on this, but I don't think the stuff should cost more than about 3 bills, that seems reasonable . . .
    Last edited by RedDwarf; 03-18-2005 at 09:19 PM. Reason: clarity

  8. #8
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    may i ask why you consider an adjuster knob so important, if you got your fork rebuilt specificly to suit your weight and preferences then you would never need the stupid knob, and it would save you alot of money...

    i never upgraded my cartridge on my 888RR because i didnt consider paying $350AUD for an adjuster knob worth it...

    anyways good luck, if you decide to continue persuing this...

  9. #9
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    if you got your fork rebuilt specificly to suit your weight and preferences then you would never need the stupid knob, and it would save you alot of money...

    True, if you ride the same trail day in- day out, but if you're like some of us who typically visit different trails w/different landscape then it may be a worth investment.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by hozzerr1
    if you got your fork rebuilt specificly to suit your weight and preferences then you would never need the stupid knob, and it would save you alot of money...

    True, if you ride the same trail day in- day out, but if you're like some of us who typically visit different trails w/different landscape then it may be a worth investment.
    you don't even ride...you are a gimp...better heal fast July and whistler are right around the corner
    the trick is ENJOYING YOUR LIFE EACH DAY, don't waste them away wishing for better days

  11. #11
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    and you wonder why people always put you down?

    sure BJ you can ask why I consider the adjuster knob to be so important, and my answer would be (I'll try to keep this simple so you can understand this downunder boy)

    "BJ it's not the adjuster knob, but what the knob adjusts!"

    I'll explain further: if you take your fork apart, you will find that the only thing in the left leg is a spring, some oil and a big SPACER

    The RR has NO compression adjustment, none, nada, zip, zilch, bubbkis, or in ausie speak, "none mate" . . . so in technical terms, you have no way to control the rate at which the fork COMPRESSES when it hits a bump . . .

    you CAN control how the fork returns to it's "normal riding position" or how fast or slow it RE-BOUNDS from bumbs it hits (thats the rebound side)

    other than the rebound and preload, what you have is a very expensive tubes with springs in them, or what is commonly refered to as a POGO STICK

    And thus ends our lesson for the day . . .

    remember, study hard . . .

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by hozzerr1
    (by BJ)if you got your fork rebuilt specificly to suit your weight and preferences then you would never need the stupid knob, and it would save you alot of money...

    True, if you ride the same trail day in- day out, but if you're like some of us who typically visit different trails w/different landscape then it may be a worth investment.
    i never touch my suspension knobs, just set and forget. i know my bikes like the back of my hand and 100% of the time know how they will react to any given situation. i own my ride....

    knobs are for excuses....


  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by DJBiker
    ....so in technical terms, you have no way to control the rate at which the fork COMPRESSES when it hits a bump ....
    BJ is right, there in no need for that anyway....


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    Quote Originally Posted by DJBiker
    2) for bike shop guys - I have all the part numbers and will do all the install work myself, all I need is for your shop to order the parts, confirm that it is all the parts needed for this upgrade, and ship the parts to me - Can/Will a shop order all the parts and charge me, say $50 markup on the whole kit, plus shipping rather than markup on each part?

    So for 1 phone call and a few minutes of your time to talk to marz sales person, and to put a shipping label on a package You get $50, does that seem like a fair price for what I'm asking?
    if you are trying to do this via some random shop, why should they go around their standard markup scheme to cover their costs just because you feel the upgrade is too expensive? boo-hoo....

    but i would think if its the same shop you bought the bike from they could cut you some slack and just tack on the processing %

  15. #15
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    Let me see if I got this right: what you are saying is that controling the rate at which your fork compress when you hit a bump is not important???

    you hit your head real hard in that last crash didn't you?
    Last edited by RedDwarf; 03-19-2005 at 11:12 AM. Reason: opps missed letters

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    Quote Originally Posted by .WestCoastHucker.
    knobs are for excuses....
    lol, should of put on a sarcasm warning label...

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    slowing down a compression rate makes for a choppy ride. period


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    Quote Originally Posted by .WestCoastHucker.
    slowing down a compression rate makes for a choppy ride. period
    thats like saying springs make my fork harsh.

    you need the proper compression damping rates to avoid overshooting the bump and to keep the bike from wallowing. Zero- compression damping would create an unstable unbalanced fork.

    Now weither you want loads of low speed compression damping to avoid bobbing is another matter, but doing so while sacrificing bump sensitivity is just poor setup or poor design, but doesnt meaning damping is useless

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by .WestCoastHucker.
    slowing down a compression rate makes for a choppy ride. period
    I agree 100%. Upping compression damping is good for drops, but bad for trail riding.

    Anyone who says minimal compression isn't the shiznit on bumps has never tried it! My fork has compression adjust. Guess what? I'm always leaving it in full open because it makes for the plushest, most responsive, bump absorbing ride you could ever imagine.

    BTW, Zedro, springs are WAAAAYYYY different than compression damping. Since when do springs change their rate in response to fork speed?

    On the other hand though, it sure is nice being able to adjust compression for drops.

    I say get the 888 upgrade, you won't regret it!

    BTW, do they put compression adjust on any of the Super T's? I met a guy on the trail who was messing around with his and mentioned smething about adjusting his compression. Was the guy just an idiot and thought the rebound was compression?

    Edit: Hey BJ, even though everyone dogs on you, please keep posting! I'm sure no one is getting tired of seeing those hot Aussie babes! mmmmmmmmmm, upside down titties, mmmmmmmmmmm!
    Last edited by MicroHuck; 03-19-2005 at 01:11 PM.

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by MicroHuck
    BTW, Zedro, springs are WAAAAYYYY different than compression damping. Since when do springs change their rate in response to fork speed?
    i was being sarcastic

    but proper compression damping is important. Its there and serving a purpose weither you realize it or not.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by .WestCoastHucker.
    i never touch my knobs, i know the back of my hand 100% . know how will react to any given situation. i own my ride....

    knobs are for excuses....
    He-he, you said you know the back of your hand 100% (hint)
    Last edited by hozzerr1; 03-19-2005 at 12:41 PM. Reason: this is funny

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