5th spring on a DHX 5.0, anyone else doin' this ?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    5th spring on a DHX 5.0, anyone else doin' this ?

    I find the DHX to be a lil' too squishy for my taste, even w/th' ProPedal cranked up. I noticed the 5th & DHX springs were the same diameter coils, however, the 5th springs are a lil'bit over a 1/4" longer, so I decide to try it out. I hoped the longer spring would sort of help me get the feel I'm lookin' for, it did help. I tried a few different springs I had, settling on the 450lb spring made by Manitou, (5th replacement spring). Guess I just need to learn to ride it. It's taking a lil gettin' used to such a long travel rearend w/a seemingly bottomless shock. Sorry for crappy phone pics.

    Anyone else tried this?
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  2. #2
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    Yup, should work fine. Specifically I was using a Progressive 400# 3" stroke spring on a 9.5"x3" DHX and had no issues with it. Makes people think you have a Ti coil too for added bling.
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  3. #3
    TNC
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    You'll put your eye out!

    Quote Originally Posted by man w/ one hand
    I find the DHX to be a lil' too squishy for my taste, even w/th' ProPedal cranked up. I noticed the 5th & DHX springs were the same diameter coils, however, the 5th springs are a lil'bit over a 1/4" longer, so I decide to try it out. I hoped the longer spring would sort of help me get the feel I'm lookin' for, it did help. I tried a few different springs I had, settling on the 450lb spring made by Manitou, (5th replacement spring). Guess I just need to learn to ride it. It's taking a lil gettin' used to such a long travel rearend w/a seemingly bottomless shock. Sorry for crappy phone pics.

    Anyone else tried this?
    Well, maybe not...but you might scratch up the piggyback on your DHX. I ran a Progressive spring on one of my DHX coils some time back, and in one ride it started a pretty good grind on the piggyback body. The 5th E coil is a tiny bit bigger ID or OD, or both, and under full compression, the spring will move enough to make contact with the piggyback. It's been suggested to come up with a bigger spring collar to keep the 5th E spring better centered on the DHX body. I'm sure it could be done, but I haven't seen any pics posted or what parts were used. Here's a pic of the grinding on my DHX after just one ride. Just something to be aware of.

    Also some have suggested on just removing the blue boost chamber adjusting collar and that might yield enough clearance, but I'd rather see a better centered spring retainer.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by DHidiot
    Yup, should work fine. Specifically I was using a Progressive 400# 3" stroke spring on a 9.5"x3" DHX and had no issues with it. Makes people think you have a Ti coil too for added bling.
    I settled on th' 450 Manitou spring in th' 1st pic. It felt better & I like a blacked out ride anyways.
    "Why are you willing to take so much & leave others in need...just because you can?"

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by TNC
    Well, maybe not...but you might scratch up the piggyback on your DHX. I ran a Progressive spring on one of my DHX coils some time back, and in one ride it started a pretty good grind on the piggyback body. The 5th E coil is a tiny bit bigger ID or OD, or both, and under full compression, the spring will move enough to make contact with the piggyback. It's been suggested to come up with a bigger spring collar to keep the 5th E spring better centered on the DHX body. I'm sure it could be done, but I haven't seen any pics posted or what parts were used. Here's a pic of the grinding on my DHX after just one ride. Just something to be aware of.

    Thanks TNC, I'll czech that out this evening. As far as the spring collar goes, it might be possible to use the btm end collar, (the one w/o threads), from a 5th on th' DHX, not sure about th' threaded collar. I'll look at them too. I compared them last night & they seemed the same to the "untrained eye".

    Thanks again fer th' heads-up.
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  6. #6
    TNC
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    Yeah, everything looks fine when you put it on, but mine didn't show a problem until it was actually being compressed on the bike. If you have access to a set of vernier calipers you can see the slightly different size. It's not much, but in some cases, it's just enough. I don't think the longer aspect of the spring is an issue as long as it fits between the retainers.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by TNC
    Yeah, everything looks fine when you put it on, but mine didn't show a problem until it was actually being compressed on the bike. If you have access to a set of vernier calipers you can see the slightly different size. It's not much, but in some cases, it's just enough. I don't think the longer aspect of the spring is an issue as long as it fits between the retainers.

    I did compare the btm collar of each shock w/each other. They seemed to have the same diameter raised area to center the shock & recessed area for the collar to rest on. One thing that I had hoped "might" be a side effect of the longer spring, is the possiblity of it minimizing the stroke somewhat. Minimal stroke restriction shouldn't be too detrimental to the shock, if any, & will shorten wheel travel. Since I bought this bike I've said, I wish I could get a VP Free frame w/6-7 in of travel. I like the burleyness of the VP Free & its about a grand cheaper than the Nomad. I'm sure the Nomad is very capable of handling more than I could put it through, but its out of my price range & I'm not a fan of the "hump".
    A shock 8.75 in length, (VP Free spec), w/a 2.5 or 2.25 stroke would be the ideal situation for me. That way th' geometry doesn't change & I get th' travel I "need". One can only dream.
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  8. #8
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    I run a Manitou ti spring on my DHX with no probs or grinding. I think the rubbing of the piggyback becomes more exaggerated with the heavier spring weights due to the larger coils. I run a 350# and its got clean clearance all the way to bottom-out.
    People wait for me on the way up. I wait for them on the way down.

  9. #9
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    As far as I know regardless of spring length the rated number determines the spring rate. I have run a 5th 450lb. @ 4.8" and Fox [email protected] 5.25" on my DHX and didn't notice any difference. Sounds like you might want to call push about your DHX - they told me they firm up the Propedal and use a custom bottom bumper in their custom tune.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by keen
    As far as I know regardless of spring length the rated number determines the spring rate. I have run a 5th 450lb. @ 4.8" and Fox [email protected] 5.25" on my DHX and didn't notice any difference. Sounds like you might want to call push about your DHX - they told me they firm up the Propedal and use a custom bottom bumper in their custom tune.
    I jus' might go that route after my other shock gets here....
    "Why are you willing to take so much & leave others in need...just because you can?"

  11. #11
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    I dealt with Tim Flooks here in the UK to replace the spring on my DHX 3.0. They don't offer a Fox replacement on the DHX models, but offer Manitou or 5th Element instead.

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  12. #12
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    manitou, 5th and the roco are all metric. fox uses standard. although they're close, fox is not exactly the same size.
    something like a spring might work, but this would explain the rubbage TNC is experiencing.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by man w/ one hand
    One thing that I had hoped "might" be a side effect of the longer spring, is the possiblity of it minimizing the stroke somewhat.
    Only too short of a spring is gonna do that and it won't be pretty.

  14. #14
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    A couple things for yall to think about:

    1) The rate on the spring is the rate regardless of the length. If it's a 400 lbs/in spring, that means it takes 400# to compress it 1", 800# to compress it 2", 1200# to compress it 3#, etc.

    2) The length figure is basically suppossed to be the recommended shock travel. Springs have a travel spec as well. So a spring rated 2.75 probably has a spring travle of about 3" to 3.25" - that way you have room for preload. The point being, that if you need 300# 2.75 spring, but can only find a 300# 3.00- you'll be fine if it will fit between the spring retainers. Don't go short though. If you put a 2.75 on when you need a 3.00, chances are it will coil bind and start destroying the spring retainers and or the shock body. Not good!

    3) The spring ID is the key figure on getting different springs to go on different shocks. Usually spring makers use the same coil diameter on all the springs but use a different number of coils to get the diffferent rates. They do this so they can buy spring wire in bulk and save money. So even though the springs have a different rate- they should have the same ID and OD. I haven't measured every shock spring obviously, so this may or may not be the case but logically it should be that way.

    4) As far as the springs rubbing the body- when you fit a spring that has and ID that is too big, you will see this problem. The spring will cock under compression and bulge out to the side. Think of a sleenky(sp?) when you bend it. You can get different spring retainers made that will center the spring and stop this- but that will probably cost you more money than a new (correct)spring.

    I hope this helps- I have lots of technical experience with MX suspension- fire away if you have any questions.

  15. #15
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    Chuckie....

    By coil bind do you mean that the springs coils compress to the maximum point while there is still room for the shock to compress? So, is there a maximum number of turns on the shocks spring which one should not exceed when setting the sag in the suspension?

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baysh
    By coil bind do you mean that the springs coils compress to the maximum point while there is still room for the shock to compress? So, is there a maximum number of turns on the shocks spring which one should not exceed when setting the sag in the suspension?
    That's exactly what he means. Fox says you shouldn't have more than .25" of preload on a spring. Not sure about other manufacturers.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hardtails Are Better
    That's exactly what he means. Fox says you shouldn't have more than .25" of preload on a spring. Not sure about other manufacturers.
    My problem is this, I only have one arm...er wait that's another story, seriously, I like burlier built bikes, they tend to be long travel, when I get a spring that gives the "proper sag", it feels as if the bike just wallows in its travel in certain aspects of riding, i.e. g-outs in a curve at the btm of hill. So, I end up having to go up 100 or so lbs in spring rate to get the feel I want. The travel of te VP Free is really taking me to task on this issue. Frustrating at times, at least until I get it dialed in, then it'll be buddah.
    "Why are you willing to take so much & leave others in need...just because you can?"

  18. #18
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    I thought about that too.

    I'm selling my 5th coil right now, and just picked up a DHX. I decided to go for the factory DHX 350# spring though instead.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by TNC
    The 5th E coil is a tiny bit bigger ID or OD, or both,
    I've got one of each sitting in front of me and it appears (using my caliper) that the 5th coil is about 1mm bigger in both ID and OD.

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