2005 Yeti 303 DH- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    2005 Yeti 303 DH

    Quote "Triangulated swingarm mounte to 2 'Cars' that runs on 2 Linear Tracks-one running vertical from the BB up towards the seat post,and a second one running horizontal from roughly the seat tube to the down tube.While the bike compresses the swingarm rides up the 1 st rail,and at the same time rides foreward on the second rail therefore tuning the wheelpath along the way.
    This gives the bike a slightly rearward path up to 6" then curves foreward through the rest of the stroke. It goes rearward 4mm then at the end comes foreward from vertical 13mm.
    Gets even crazier-the upper rail has a gentle curve in it that the Car follows fine tuning the curve.Where it is mounted to the downtube at the front it bolts on and can be adjusted up and down to tune the end of the curve.Other rails with different curves will also be available to set the bike up for individual preferences.
    Rails are used instead of swinging links so that very exacting axle path(s) can be achieved,or altered. It also makes the bike feel super solid.
    this causes unbelieveable pedaling berformance without noticable feedback,and without getting overly long at the end of the travel.
    These parts known as Cars have bearings surrounding the tracks on all sides allowing them to move on the tracks but not able to twist or bind.
    Great news-no wierd geomertry-65 dr egree head angle w/a fox fork set at 7.5 inches,14"bb average length top tube on the medium.
    It cornered very neutral felt lively,easy to change lines etc.
    The bike has a mild overall rising rate that is designed around modern shocks(read DHX).Pretty plush with very good bottoming control,propedal,volume,and pressure set at lowest settings.
    suggested retail $2799 available in March.Fox booth at Interbike should have a bunch to ride that are being built now.
    It also has a crazy monocoque top tube that splits into 2 spars at the seat tube area.
    150x15 hub no floater necessary replaceable hanger, 1 1/8 ht." (ridemonkey.com)

    Looks pretty sweet, if it works.
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  2. #2
    is faster than you
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    New question here. yeti huh?

    weird, i cant figure it out i would need a real pic to figure out what is going on in there

  3. #3
    Artist formly Poop
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    cool stuff
    Pirates are the S

  4. #4
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    One more pic. go-ride.com is selling these for $2,900. Ouch. Thats more expensive then the M3.
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  5. #5
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    **** son! i'd always toyed with the idea of sliding bits instead of pivots. I mean, look at the fork, it slides, why not the rear end? I'd always wanted to make a system that had a TRUE vertical axle path, but I like this idea better, since you can negate most pedaling forces by toying with the axle path and the effects of chain tension. Sweetness...

  6. #6
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    Its weird how they explain how the bike compresses through its travel. 6" inches of vertical travel? What does that mean... that the rest of the travel is just non-vertical forward arc?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by SevenInches
    One more pic. go-ride.com is selling these for $2,900. Ouch. Thats more expensive then the M3.
    But cheaper than the 05 Demo 9.
    Tony
    is making a comeback.

    Turns out that five years of not mountain biking, really makes one strive to get back to it.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by SevenInches
    Its weird how they explain how the bike compresses through its travel. 6" inches of vertical travel? What does that mean... that the rest of the travel is just non-vertical forward arc?
    I think it means that 6" os how much the rear triangle moves on the rails, that's not how much actual travel it gets since you have to take in effect the amount that it pivots upwards by moving forwards on the horizontal rails.
    Tony
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    Turns out that five years of not mountain biking, really makes one strive to get back to it.

  9. #9
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    The demo nine is so over priced. $2700 for a mass produced tiawanese frame? For that price i'd go buy a handmade Lenz Pro-Decender.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by SevenInches
    Its weird how they explain how the bike compresses through its travel. 6" inches of vertical travel? What does that mean... that the rest of the travel is just non-vertical forward arc?
    go here, i modeled the suspension. Its mostly a large radius arc, as if it was a single pivot with the mainpivot around the fork. Of course there more to it but thats the general axle path
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by SevenInches
    The demo nine is so over priced. $2700 for a mass produced tiawanese frame? For that price i'd go buy a handmade Lenz Pro-Decender.

    very intresting design, looks like it would work in theory. id like to ride 1, and cycle it with out a spring! but mmm i think its a nice way to have a VPP with no pivot a true VPS virtual pivot slide lol. haha rip off of old school norcos (the name) i wonder it it would wear the rails over a long time? and if they get dirty will it grind them up? looks like a racer boy only thing, with a racer boy only price tag.; intresting. and yeah, alot of frames that claim they have 8" of travel, that is measured as an arc, they cheat alot. idk if they did or not. looks damn cool

  12. #12
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    I wonder how many manufacters measure travel by total arc? I know my pro decender has 8 inches of verticle travel even though total arc is maybe 9 inches. All Lenz bikes are measured by actual verticle travel.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by SevenInches
    I wonder how many manufacters measure travel by total arc? I know my pro decender has 8 inches of verticle travel even though total arc is maybe 9 inches. All Lenz bikes are measured by actual verticle travel.
    people say that but i think its BS, no one has ever offered sensible proof, its like an urban legend.

    It is much easier to design from vertical travel anyways.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  14. #14
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    Not to mention that during the 'arc' of the wheelpath its still gaining vertical height, so really you're still getting vertical travel out of it, its just that the dropouts arent necessarily moving only straight up. Measuring it by the outside of the arc would be retarded....
    Tony
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    Turns out that five years of not mountain biking, really makes one strive to get back to it.

  15. #15
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    It's interesting...

    But it still has two main pivots and a lot of rolling elements. I'm not sure it conforms to the KISS principle.
    "Without the ability to make moral distinctions based on motive, consequences, the ethical constructs of various parties, everything is equal, and you end up with people like Woody Allen: a tiny speck of compacted narcissism, revolving around the dead sun in an empty universe." - James Lileks

  16. #16
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    Maintenance Disaster

    Hello maintenance disaster. Also, not so sure on the bottom bracket rigidity.
    While billions are being spent to determine whether there is or was life on Mars, we are left to ponder the age old question: "How much wood could a Wood Chuck chuck, if a Wood Chuck could chuck wood?"

  17. #17
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    Heres a visual of how the suspension works, thanks to zedros calculations
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    <><

  18. #18
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    People really do need to read the link to the thread on RM that zedro posted.....
    Tony
    is making a comeback.

    Turns out that five years of not mountain biking, really makes one strive to get back to it.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by WheelieMan
    Heres a visual of how the suspension works, thanks to zedros calculations
    cooll, was going to do that but then the lazyness kicked in
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  20. #20
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    Nice animation

    I think you beat Zedro to the prize of "Top Geek".
    "Without the ability to make moral distinctions based on motive, consequences, the ethical constructs of various parties, everything is equal, and you end up with people like Woody Allen: a tiny speck of compacted narcissism, revolving around the dead sun in an empty universe." - James Lileks

  21. #21
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    Very cool Spencer!!!
    Tony
    is making a comeback.

    Turns out that five years of not mountain biking, really makes one strive to get back to it.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tarpon
    I think you beat Zedro to the prize of "Top Geek".
    no way dude! check this stuff out.....

    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    no, the IC only describes the point of which the entire swingarm 'link' rotates about at that very moment (or instant). However since it only applies at a single infinitly small point in the travel, it only describes a point vector of the axle path (ie the tangeant of the actual axle path at that point), whereas for the CC we will take two of those of those 'instant' points (or tangeants) and extrapolate a curve from them, where the CC represents the center of that curve.

    Since the IC will only describe a tangeant vector, the actual CC can lay anywhere in the axis drawn from the axle to the IC, and in this case, the CCs lay ahead of the ICs, whereas usually the opposite is true in the more common linkages (except for Lawills, where the ICs are behind the rear wheel). Blah blah blah...


  23. #23
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    i didnt get it at first, that moving picture in an eye opener tho, pretty neat design i think.

  24. #24
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    I like the whole 1980's quote about how inconsievable it was to have shocks on the front of a bike, and not have them explode or something. I feel the same way about this. Give it a chance, there are many ways seals and all that good stuff can keep it tidy. He||, you dont leave your rear shock caked on with mud do you? I for one welcome our new leaders.
    People call me a dick, but I just think im clever.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zedro
    what he meant was 'greaser' types, most likely performing choreographed musical outakes which somehow degrade dirt jumps...

  25. #25
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    sweet

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  26. #26
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    It's a pretty minimal difference anyway...

    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    people say that but i think its BS, no one has ever offered sensible proof, its like an urban legend.

    It is much easier to design from vertical travel anyways.
    ... and the larger the radius of the arc, the more the arc approximates a straight line.

    If you're suspension travel is something like 6.8" and you want to call your bike the "big 7" then it's probably not too bad in terms of misleading marketing. However, it certainly won't make a 8" bike a 9" travel bike.

    This is probably not quite true for bikes with complicated axle paths like the VPP series, but for single pivots and most four bars, the vertical and arc travel are pretty similar.
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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gramatica
    I like the whole 1980's quote about how inconsievable it was to have shocks on the front of a bike, and not have them explode or something. I feel the same way about this. Give it a chance, there are many ways seals and all that good stuff can keep it tidy. He||, you dont leave your rear shock caked on with mud do you? I for one welcome our new leaders.
    Yeah, its amazing how many people are whining about "its not gonna work, waaaa". Give it a chance! When you think about it, none of the parts are that much more exposed to prone to damage than in a "regular" full suspension bike. C'mon people, this is how new stuff starts!
    www.suckcreek.com

  28. #28
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    hopefully this bike really works. I don't think Yeti would let it out to production if they had not put it through the works in pre-pro. This could be big.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Racerx336
    hopefully this bike really works. I don't think Yeti would let it out to production if they had not put it through the works in pre-pro. This could be big.
    although with the older Lawill bike there were a few years of maturation involved, i would expect the same here. I just hope they dont rush it and end up with a dud.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  30. #30
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    that thing would be amazing to ride...

    hopefully DH-9s prices do right down once they come out...

    what i think is funny is in austraila i could get a DEMO9 last year for 3000-3500 now itll cost me 4000 for either a DEMO9 or DEMO8...how can they simply justify increasing the price by 500-1000 bucks...
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  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by BJ-
    ...how can they simply justify increasing the price by 500-1000 bucks...
    currency adjustments are like that (among other things), especially if the bottom dropped out the previous years. Its not like their sitting around their lair with evil grins thinking "oh lets ream the Aussies"...there may actually be buisness factors behind the pricing
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    although with the older Lawill bike there were a few years of maturation involved, i would expect the same here. I just hope they dont rush it and end up with a dud.

    It certainly follows the Lawill design theory at least (rearward travel). Which is the same thing that Paul Turner is doing with the Maverick. It's funny though, with the scissor link housing the BB on the Maverick bikes, I think the design is limited. In other words, giving it more travel would make the BB move alot more. Just like URT...

    No one else seems to be doing this, unless I am missing something. FSR designs and single pivots still pull the wheel forward.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by ezweave
    It certainly follows the Lawill design theory at least (rearward travel).
    thats what i said over on RM, its kinda funny that this system is more 'Lawill' than the actual Lawill was. The design threory (or rather marketing line) was completly untrue, the Lawill had quite a sharp arc for an axel path, with a theoretical main pivot (CC) above and behind the BB....there was no real linear rearward path, it was basically circular (although a bit flatter if you looked at small sections). Their description was very misleading to what actually was going on.

    Basically the new system has the same basic characteristic, but with a much shallower curve.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  34. #34
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    With Schwinn essentially folding, Yeti was the last place for the Lawill design, I guess it lives on.

    It *seems* like the rest of the bike industry ignores rearward travel entirely. The popularity of FSR, single pivots (and 4-bar single pivots), and VPP designs have overshadowed this. I mean horst link suspension hasn't really changed in over 10 years.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by ezweave
    With Schwinn essentially folding, Yeti was the last place for the Lawill design, I guess it lives on.

    It *seems* like the rest of the bike industry ignores rearward travel entirely.
    not true, high foward pivots like the C'Dales, Oranges, Bullits, Stabs, Diesels etc have more rearward movement than that new Yeti, and VPPs have it as well. Canfield uses it, as well as Balfas (who has the most) and other small builders.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    not true, high foward pivots like the C'Dales, Oranges, Bullits, Stabs, Diesels etc have more rearward movement than that new Yeti, and VPPs have it as well. Canfield uses it, as well as Balfas (who has the most) and other small builders.
    Ahh! I stand corrected... but with those bikes you have chain tension issues. Well, not the jackshaft bikes (Balfa). What ever happend to BCD? Did they give up on carbon fiber DH bikes?

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ezweave
    Ahh! I stand corrected... but with those bikes you have chain tension issues. Well, not the jackshaft bikes (Balfa). What ever happend to BCD? Did they give up on carbon fiber DH bikes?
    BCD was on hiatus for awhile, but he's back with a new model or two.

    also the new Yeti will have similar chain tension issues (or characteristics to sound neutral ) due to the foward CC
    Quote Originally Posted by Gunslingger
    no doubt you must have majored in english or something rad!!!

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by zedro
    currency adjustments are like that (among other things), especially if the bottom dropped out the previous years. Its not like their sitting around their lair with evil grins thinking "oh lets ream the Aussies"...there may actually be buisness factors behind the pricing
    i realise economy may have something to do with it...but i cant see how it could be responsible for such a dramatic change...i dont see how that is "justififed" at all 200-400 bucks i could maby understand etc...but not 500-1000 and especially not for a frame that hasnt gone through any major/dramatic changes since its first year of production...the DEMO8s maby but they were supposed to be cheaper...and ended up not being at all...your pay the same price for either DEMO8 or DEMO9 over here...

    and since the prices have gone up...you can get a complete built DEMO8-DEMO9 (not the pro models) for cheaper than the cost of buying the frame and a fork such as a 888...thatll cost you 6000 in aus and the DEMO8 and DEMO9 base models areboth equal to or under that...so why the hell would you bother just buying the frame and a new fork when you could get a complete bike for cheaper...thats retarded...

    if ppl just bought the complete bikes then wouldnt they loose money...i think my informatoin is either seriously wrong or maby the SPECIALIZED guys have made a bit of a mistake coz thats really is quite "wierd" they would price there frames so hight and there complete builds so low...
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob
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