Pivot mach 5 or Epiphany?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1

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    Pivot mach 5 or Epiphany?

    Hey all--- i just visited "thePath" bike shop in tustin... great shop and guys were super helpful. I rode an Epiphany, with the intent of making a choice between that and the Chumba xcl, but saw the Pivot mach 5 ( not built up yet) .

    I'm doing the typical So. Cal CC riding with the occasional trip out to sedona/moab for a little bit longer trips/and aggresive riding, but I'm by no means a get air guy... 3 ft with transitions etc.

    The epihpany I rode was super light, lighter than i would, or could afford to build, with a RS revelation fork... felt very nice, but only rode int he parking lot.

    The Pivot will be available to ride in my size in a few weeks...

    anyone care to chime in on these bikes, and how either would stack up next to the Chumba XCL?
    There is a crazy good deal on the Epiphany (07 frame) so that's the only reason i'm really looking at it...

    The Pivot will come in in the same price range, and I'm VERY innterested in it due to the DW Link .

    The owner of the shop seemed to lean towards the Pivot, but said I couldn't go wrong with either (especially at the price the Epi is going for)

    suggestions and thoughts?

  2. #2
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    Go for the Pivot. It will be more durable and stiff and not slower. The Epi markup over dealer cost is very high, so it is easy to discount it heavily if needed.

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    It's so hard to express to people how damn awesome the Pivot rides without them actually riding one on a trail. I still wholeheartedly believe that it rides better than any other bike on the market.

  4. #4
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    Decisions, decisions.

    Quote Originally Posted by cajonezzz
    Hey all--- i just visited "thePath" bike shop in tustin... great shop and guys were super helpful. I rode an Epiphany, with the intent of making a choice between that and the Chumba xcl, but saw the Pivot mach 5 ( not built up yet) .

    I'm doing the typical So. Cal CC riding with the occasional trip out to sedona/moab for a little bit longer trips/and aggresive riding, but I'm by no means a get air guy... 3 ft with transitions etc.

    The epihpany I rode was super light, lighter than i would, or could afford to build, with a RS revelation fork... felt very nice, but only rode int he parking lot.

    The Pivot will be available to ride in my size in a few weeks...

    anyone care to chime in on these bikes, and how either would stack up next to the Chumba XCL?
    There is a crazy good deal on the Epiphany (07 frame) so that's the only reason i'm really looking at it...

    The Pivot will come in in the same price range, and I'm VERY innterested in it due to the DW Link .

    The owner of the shop seemed to lean towards the Pivot, but said I couldn't go wrong with either (especially at the price the Epi is going for)

    suggestions and thoughts?
    I'm picking up my Pivot today and I own the Epiphany and the Chumba. I'm riding the Pivot all weekend so I will have a better idea on that one by the end of the week. As for the other two, The Ellsworth is a phenomenal climber and it goes downhill great also. My epi weighs 25lbs with full XTR. As for the Chumba it downhills better than the Ellsworth because it is beefier made bike. I got it down under 28 lbs with full XTR also. Ascending on the Chumba is by no means sluggish but it doesn't match up against the Ellsworth in this category.

    If you are a stronger climber and a weaker downhiller I would go with the Chumba because it a very stable bike at speed and rails corners with the best of them. Now if you are like me and are better at going down then going up go with the Ellsworth. The Ellsworth is an effortless climber and it can hold it's own going down. Both bikes are four bar suspension so it's more a matter of geometry and weight between these two.

    I purchased the Pivot because I was told It goes up and down better then any other bike on the market. I guess Chris Cocalis tweaked the geometry a bit also to make the bike even better. I will know by this weekend. These are just my opinions so take them for what they are worth,. I hope this helps you.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by C & D's Dad
    I'm picking up my Pivot today and I own the Epiphany and the Chumba. I'm riding the Pivot all weekend so I will have a better idea on that one by the end of the week. As for the other two, The Ellsworth is a phenomenal climber and it goes downhill great also. My epi weighs 25lbs with full XTR. As for the Chumba it downhills better than the Ellsworth because it is beefier made bike. I got it down under 28 lbs with full XTR also. Ascending on the Chumba is by no means sluggish but it doesn't match up against the Ellsworth in this category.

    If you are a stronger climber and a weaker downhiller I would go with the Chumba because it a very stable bike at speed and rails corners with the best of them. Now if you are like me and are better at going down then going up go with the Ellsworth. The Ellsworth is an effortless climber and it can hold it's own going down. Both bikes are four bar suspension so it's more a matter of geometry and weight between these two.

    I purchased the Pivot because I was told It goes up and down better then any other bike on the market. I guess Chris Cocalis tweaked the geometry a bit also to make the bike even better. I will know by this weekend. These are just my opinions so take them for what they are worth,. I hope this helps you.
    This helps alot!

    please do post your ride impressions after you get some time in on your Pivot.

    Is it the mach 5?


    very curious to hear what your impressions are.

    cz

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    Pivot vs Ellsworth vs Chumba.

    It is in fact the Mach 5. As soon as I take it out I will post what I think.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by C & D's Dad
    It is in fact the Mach 5. As soon as I take it out I will post what I think.

    I'm curious to see what you think of the Pivot, especially coming from an Epi owner. I'm also curious why you have three 5" travel bikes. I'm all for multiple arrows in the quiver - but usually the arrows are different. For example, I have a ti hardtail, a 4" ti FS, a 5" FS, a 6" FS, a 8" FS, a 29er SS, and a 29er FS. But, each bike fills a unique purpose. Why do you have the three 5" trail bikes - let alone three awesome rides like the Epi, the Chumba, and a new Pivot?
    Kokopelli Racing

    "Curb drops to flat, or curb drops to transition? There's a BIG difference there." Qfactor03

  8. #8

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    anxiously awaiting your ride report and impressions!

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    waiting anxiously!

  10. #10
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    Mach 5

    I spent about 60 hard miles on a Pivot over the weekend and was impressed. As a 140-145lb guy, I've never had a virtual pivot bike feel so good, especially with an RP3. The Ellsworth has craftsmanship, RS rear shock and first world manufacture in its corner, but the graphics don't do it for me (sorry, but for $2k+...). Overall, I still prefer my Maverick Durance, which can out-climb and out-descend the Mach 5, but the gap is narrowing...

    marc
    www.bikefix.net

    Here's our draft review, which will be proofread and up in a few days:

    I was in a friend's bike shop the other day when a gentleman, who owned a hardtail, was shopping for a full suspension bike. Like me (and that shop's owners), he claimed to enjoy longer cross country rides in the mountains. Around here that means plenty of climbing and no shortage of techy bits or rock gardens. After the gentleman described his riding habits, the owner suggested a couple of 5in travel bikes in his price range (including a Rocky Mountain ETS-X, which Charlie reviewed a while back). Hearing that, the shopper recoiled, saying that he really didn't need that much travel and was really thinking about a 4in bike. That would have been most of us a couple of years ago. However, as suspension designs have evolved, many bikes in the ~5in travel range (front & rear) have become extremely efficient, versatile and light weight- perfect for long mellow rides, trips to Moab and the occasional XC race.

    Pivot's Mach 5 is just such a bike. There is a broad spectrum of bikes available with between 4.5 and 5.5in of travel front and rear. Despite it's 5.5in of travel, the Mach 5 sits squarely at the XC end of the spectrum. Looking long and lean sitting still, the Pivot's ~6lb/$1900 frame uses a proprietary version the DW-Link suspension design that is also used by Iron Horse and Ibis. As a former Ibis Mojo owner, I was curious to see if the Pivot was simply an aluminum Ibis or something better. Similar to Santa Cruz's VPP, the DW-Link uses a pair of stout links to create an axle path and shock leverage ratio that can be tailored to provide a number of different ride characteristics (such as squatting, not squatting, minimal chain growth, linear spring rates, progressive spring rates, reduced pedal-induced bobbing and combinations thereof). As a moderately agressive 145lb XC rider who likes technical climbing as well as descending, I came into this test having never ridden a virtual pivot bike that I liked. Blur? no. Ibis Mojo? Not really. Intense 5.5 EVP? Awful. Crazy, eh? Here's why: most virtual pivot bikes are set up to minimize bob. Everyone pretty much admits that bob (or rider-induced suspension movement) is a Bad Thing. Everyone, in this case, extends to include suspension manufacturers. Fox's Pro Pedal, Rock Shox's Motion Control and Manitou's SPV are all damping schemes that work to eliminate bob. In fact, it's gotten hard to spec a decent quality rear shock that doesn't have some sort of platform damper or aggressive low-speed compression damping. The result, especially for those on the lighter end of the spectrum, is bikes that are somewhat dead feeling- especially over smaller bumps. My Mojo was a great example. It was light and pedaled well and a remarkable bike in a number of ways. However, the rear suspension's reluctance to move over smaller stuff, a slightly flexy rear end and the short (for a Large) top tube left me wanting- which shouldn't happen in the $2,000 (frame) price range. "But wait!" you're saying, "I love my Mojo/Blur/Spyder!" Good- you should love your bike. When it comes time to upgrade, though, there are an increasing number of bikes on the market that not only pedal well, but work on both large and small bumps.

    Our demo Mach 5 came in the mid-range ($4200 complete) XT build kit. Something that I love to see is a build kit with no funny business. No Deore hubs, no cheap cranks, no house brand bars. Shimano's 2008 XT kit is fantastic, with smooth shifting, a cool low-profile Shadow dérailleur and powerful (but controllable) hydraulic discs. Speccing straight XT isn't cheap, but it ensures that nothing on the bike is particularly heavy or will wear out prematurely. A Ritchy Pro bar, stem and seatpost aren't fancy, but are both light and strong while being reasonably priced. This bike's parts were clearly chosen by someone who actually rides. The only disappointments are the WTB saddle and grips- after 60 miles in one weekend, my bottom was bruised and my palms tender. You've probably got your favorites already, and at this price, your dealer should be more than willing to help you get things tailored to your liking. This was my first experience with Shimano's new (and fairly normal-looking) M-775 XT wheelset. They're 1700g, stiff, tubeless and servicable- what's not to like? The hubs feel like they have far quicker engagement than older Shimano hubs and sound like Industry 9's wheels- at 1/3 volume. Cool. The rear hub did sound a bit like the bearings were dry, though, but I didn't pull it apart to see (it's easy enough to add grease to them and again, your dealer should help you out there).

    Further proving that Arizona-based Pivot guys actually ride (in the Southwest, no less), the tires were the fantastic Kenda Nevegal/Small Block 8 combination. They won't be everyone's choice, but the Small Block 8 in a 2.35in width is both grippy and fast and the combination was great in both hard and loose conditions. I'll have to pause this love-fest for a minute, though, to say that tubes suck. They're a liability on a bike like this. I went through nearly $30 worth of pre-slimed tubes in two rides. That's more flats than I've had in the past year, and I was running my usual 30psi front/35psi rear (remember that I weigh 145lb). My pack, gloves and shorts are all stained with sealant and I missed an appointment as a result. I know that there are people who hate tubeless tires without even having had to try them, but they'll be kicking themselves when they finally do. Tubes suck. It's got tubeless rims, guys- come on.

    The bikefix crew got together for a nice mini-epic the other day so that we could swap gear, take some photos and go for a ride. I brought both the Pivot and my personal bike (a Maverick Durance) so that we could swap back and forth during the ride. Over a few days, I put in between 75 and 80 off-road miles between the two bikes. While it's not not enough time to really speak to the Pivot's durability, we got a very good feel for how the bike rides.

    In short, the Mach 5 is far and away the best virtual pivot type bike I've ever ridden. Designers Dave Weigle (DW-Link) and Chris Cocalis (formerly of Titus) have done a good job at making a bike that feels snappy out of corners or while climbing without giving up plushness or small bump sensitivity. An initially rearward axle path does a very good job on not only small bumps but the kind of steppy, ledgy stuff that's common both in New Mexico and New England. I was surprised, to be honest, until I had a closer look at the rear shock. While the long-ish stroke (low leverage ratio) was no doubt part of it, Pivot are the first company that I've seen to spec the version Fox's RP23 shock with the lowest compression damping available. There's a little 3-bar graph on the shock (sort of like the old Cingular logo) that states the amount of factory-set compression damping. It makes a huge difference. Set the sag to about 30% and turn the Pro-Pedal lever to Off and you're done. While there is some occasional pedal kickback, the suspension seems very efficient under torque. It snaps out of corners like few other bikes I've ridden and never feels like it's bogging down while siting. When pedaling out of the saddle, it does get a bit mushy, but no worse than its competition. While I never felt it bottom out harshly, the o-ring on the shock shaft told me that I was using all of the travel. Launching into rock gardens at speed was a blast (explaining the flats?)- the suspension handled successive hits in a very controlled fashion. More than anything else, the rear suspension reminds me of my 2003 Giant VT-1, which was a moderate travel single pivot with a linkage-driven Manitou SPV shock, but snappier.

    As well as the bike climbed, though, I had a hard time keeping the front wheel down while climbing. Despite the 110mm stem (an odd choice for a medium-sized frame) and reducing the TALAS fork to its 120 or 100mm setting, the front end of the bike had a bit of wanderlust on the climbs, which is hard to explain. An indication of how well the rear suspension was working was the how bad it made the TALAS feel. I've never been a big Fox fan, but the better a bike's rear suspension works, the worse they tend to feel. The TALAS, in particular, seems to suffer from excessive high-speed damping and/or stiction- when set up soft enough to feel decent, it blows through all 5.5in of travel at an alarming rate. Dan (formerly of Manitou) has been playing with 5wt oil in some Fox forks and they do feel better, but an $800 fork should probably work better straight out of the box. Luckily, Fox have a fantastic resale value, and your dealer may be able to swap it for a better fit for a few bucks- maybe a new Minute or Revelation. I liked how the bike felt with the fork set at 120mm (with a 70 degree head tube), and extending it to 140 was nice for longer or rougher descents. While the Mach 5 really comes into its own at speed and on sweepy motorcycle trails, it did feel a bit odd in slower situations. Turns at lower speeds required conscious steering rather than leaning or carving. This made more trials-y moves a bit difficult, but with more time on the bike I think that it'd be fine.

    While two bottle cage mounts are appreciated (one set on either side of the downtube), the one inside the main triangle is really wedged in there. Forget about running a large bottle, and it can be a bit of a struggle to get a small bottle out of the cage with the shock in the way. Some sort of alternative side-entry cage might be in order if you'd like to keep your bottle out of the path of logs and/or manure. All in all, the Mach 5 is an impressive enduro bike. It pedals well and has the ability to compensate for some spectacularly poor line choices. It rewards the rider for carrying speed, which is a blast. $1900 for a Taiwanese made boutique frame isn't unheard of, but it could be a hard sell against the arguably sexier Ibis, which comes with an XT kit, Easton carbon bar and seatpost (but cheaper Easton non-tubeless wheels) for the same money. If you're in the market for an all-around bike or frame, though, the Mach 5 is certainly worth a demo. I'm not going to rush out and sell my current bike, but if I were in the market, it would certainly be on my short list.

  11. #11
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    Shock Pressure

    Just curious, what percentage of your weight did you have to run in shock pressure to get proper sag?


    Quote Originally Posted by Marc Bikefix
    I spent about 60 hard miles on a Pivot over the weekend and was impressed. As a 140-145lb guy, I've never had a virtual pivot bike feel so good, especially with an RP3. The Ellsworth has craftsmanship, RS rear shock and first world manufacture in its corner, but the graphics don't do it for me (sorry, but for $2k+...). Overall, I still prefer my Maverick Durance, which can out-climb and out-descend the Mach 5, but the gap is narrowing...

    marc
    www.bikefix.net

    Here's our draft review, which will be proofread and up in a few days:

    I was in a friend's bike shop the other day when a gentleman, who owned a hardtail, was shopping for a full suspension bike. Like me (and that shop's owners), he claimed to enjoy longer cross country rides in the mountains. Around here that means plenty of climbing and no shortage of techy bits or rock gardens. After the gentleman described his riding habits, the owner suggested a couple of 5in travel bikes in his price range (including a Rocky Mountain ETS-X, which Charlie reviewed a while back). Hearing that, the shopper recoiled, saying that he really didn't need that much travel and was really thinking about a 4in bike. That would have been most of us a couple of years ago. However, as suspension designs have evolved, many bikes in the ~5in travel range (front & rear) have become extremely efficient, versatile and light weight- perfect for long mellow rides, trips to Moab and the occasional XC race.

    Pivot's Mach 5 is just such a bike. There is a broad spectrum of bikes available with between 4.5 and 5.5in of travel front and rear. Despite it's 5.5in of travel, the Mach 5 sits squarely at the XC end of the spectrum. Looking long and lean sitting still, the Pivot's ~6lb/$1900 frame uses a proprietary version the DW-Link suspension design that is also used by Iron Horse and Ibis. As a former Ibis Mojo owner, I was curious to see if the Pivot was simply an aluminum Ibis or something better. Similar to Santa Cruz's VPP, the DW-Link uses a pair of stout links to create an axle path and shock leverage ratio that can be tailored to provide a number of different ride characteristics (such as squatting, not squatting, minimal chain growth, linear spring rates, progressive spring rates, reduced pedal-induced bobbing and combinations thereof). As a moderately agressive 145lb XC rider who likes technical climbing as well as descending, I came into this test having never ridden a virtual pivot bike that I liked. Blur? no. Ibis Mojo? Not really. Intense 5.5 EVP? Awful. Crazy, eh? Here's why: most virtual pivot bikes are set up to minimize bob. Everyone pretty much admits that bob (or rider-induced suspension movement) is a Bad Thing. Everyone, in this case, extends to include suspension manufacturers. Fox's Pro Pedal, Rock Shox's Motion Control and Manitou's SPV are all damping schemes that work to eliminate bob. In fact, it's gotten hard to spec a decent quality rear shock that doesn't have some sort of platform damper or aggressive low-speed compression damping. The result, especially for those on the lighter end of the spectrum, is bikes that are somewhat dead feeling- especially over smaller bumps. My Mojo was a great example. It was light and pedaled well and a remarkable bike in a number of ways. However, the rear suspension's reluctance to move over smaller stuff, a slightly flexy rear end and the short (for a Large) top tube left me wanting- which shouldn't happen in the $2,000 (frame) price range. "But wait!" you're saying, "I love my Mojo/Blur/Spyder!" Good- you should love your bike. When it comes time to upgrade, though, there are an increasing number of bikes on the market that not only pedal well, but work on both large and small bumps.

    Our demo Mach 5 came in the mid-range ($4200 complete) XT build kit. Something that I love to see is a build kit with no funny business. No Deore hubs, no cheap cranks, no house brand bars. Shimano's 2008 XT kit is fantastic, with smooth shifting, a cool low-profile Shadow dérailleur and powerful (but controllable) hydraulic discs. Speccing straight XT isn't cheap, but it ensures that nothing on the bike is particularly heavy or will wear out prematurely. A Ritchy Pro bar, stem and seatpost aren't fancy, but are both light and strong while being reasonably priced. This bike's parts were clearly chosen by someone who actually rides. The only disappointments are the WTB saddle and grips- after 60 miles in one weekend, my bottom was bruised and my palms tender. You've probably got your favorites already, and at this price, your dealer should be more than willing to help you get things tailored to your liking. This was my first experience with Shimano's new (and fairly normal-looking) M-775 XT wheelset. They're 1700g, stiff, tubeless and servicable- what's not to like? The hubs feel like they have far quicker engagement than older Shimano hubs and sound like Industry 9's wheels- at 1/3 volume. Cool. The rear hub did sound a bit like the bearings were dry, though, but I didn't pull it apart to see (it's easy enough to add grease to them and again, your dealer should help you out there).

    Further proving that Arizona-based Pivot guys actually ride (in the Southwest, no less), the tires were the fantastic Kenda Nevegal/Small Block 8 combination. They won't be everyone's choice, but the Small Block 8 in a 2.35in width is both grippy and fast and the combination was great in both hard and loose conditions. I'll have to pause this love-fest for a minute, though, to say that tubes suck. They're a liability on a bike like this. I went through nearly $30 worth of pre-slimed tubes in two rides. That's more flats than I've had in the past year, and I was running my usual 30psi front/35psi rear (remember that I weigh 145lb). My pack, gloves and shorts are all stained with sealant and I missed an appointment as a result. I know that there are people who hate tubeless tires without even having had to try them, but they'll be kicking themselves when they finally do. Tubes suck. It's got tubeless rims, guys- come on.

    The bikefix crew got together for a nice mini-epic the other day so that we could swap gear, take some photos and go for a ride. I brought both the Pivot and my personal bike (a Maverick Durance) so that we could swap back and forth during the ride. Over a few days, I put in between 75 and 80 off-road miles between the two bikes. While it's not not enough time to really speak to the Pivot's durability, we got a very good feel for how the bike rides.

    In short, the Mach 5 is far and away the best virtual pivot type bike I've ever ridden. Designers Dave Weigle (DW-Link) and Chris Cocalis (formerly of Titus) have done a good job at making a bike that feels snappy out of corners or while climbing without giving up plushness or small bump sensitivity. An initially rearward axle path does a very good job on not only small bumps but the kind of steppy, ledgy stuff that's common both in New Mexico and New England. I was surprised, to be honest, until I had a closer look at the rear shock. While the long-ish stroke (low leverage ratio) was no doubt part of it, Pivot are the first company that I've seen to spec the version Fox's RP23 shock with the lowest compression damping available. There's a little 3-bar graph on the shock (sort of like the old Cingular logo) that states the amount of factory-set compression damping. It makes a huge difference. Set the sag to about 30% and turn the Pro-Pedal lever to Off and you're done. While there is some occasional pedal kickback, the suspension seems very efficient under torque. It snaps out of corners like few other bikes I've ridden and never feels like it's bogging down while siting. When pedaling out of the saddle, it does get a bit mushy, but no worse than its competition. While I never felt it bottom out harshly, the o-ring on the shock shaft told me that I was using all of the travel. Launching into rock gardens at speed was a blast (explaining the flats?)- the suspension handled successive hits in a very controlled fashion. More than anything else, the rear suspension reminds me of my 2003 Giant VT-1, which was a moderate travel single pivot with a linkage-driven Manitou SPV shock, but snappier.

    As well as the bike climbed, though, I had a hard time keeping the front wheel down while climbing. Despite the 110mm stem (an odd choice for a medium-sized frame) and reducing the TALAS fork to its 120 or 100mm setting, the front end of the bike had a bit of wanderlust on the climbs, which is hard to explain. An indication of how well the rear suspension was working was the how bad it made the TALAS feel. I've never been a big Fox fan, but the better a bike's rear suspension works, the worse they tend to feel. The TALAS, in particular, seems to suffer from excessive high-speed damping and/or stiction- when set up soft enough to feel decent, it blows through all 5.5in of travel at an alarming rate. Dan (formerly of Manitou) has been playing with 5wt oil in some Fox forks and they do feel better, but an $800 fork should probably work better straight out of the box. Luckily, Fox have a fantastic resale value, and your dealer may be able to swap it for a better fit for a few bucks- maybe a new Minute or Revelation. I liked how the bike felt with the fork set at 120mm (with a 70 degree head tube), and extending it to 140 was nice for longer or rougher descents. While the Mach 5 really comes into its own at speed and on sweepy motorcycle trails, it did feel a bit odd in slower situations. Turns at lower speeds required conscious steering rather than leaning or carving. This made more trials-y moves a bit difficult, but with more time on the bike I think that it'd be fine.

    While two bottle cage mounts are appreciated (one set on either side of the downtube), the one inside the main triangle is really wedged in there. Forget about running a large bottle, and it can be a bit of a struggle to get a small bottle out of the cage with the shock in the way. Some sort of alternative side-entry cage might be in order if you'd like to keep your bottle out of the path of logs and/or manure. All in all, the Mach 5 is an impressive enduro bike. It pedals well and has the ability to compensate for some spectacularly poor line choices. It rewards the rider for carrying speed, which is a blast. $1900 for a Taiwanese made boutique frame isn't unheard of, but it could be a hard sell against the arguably sexier Ibis, which comes with an XT kit, Easton carbon bar and seatpost (but cheaper Easton non-tubeless wheels) for the same money. If you're in the market for an all-around bike or frame, though, the Mach 5 is certainly worth a demo. I'm not going to rush out and sell my current bike, but if I were in the market, it would certainly be on my short list.

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    Maiden voyage on the Mach 5

    Well I rode my new mach 5 today. And I will have to say that as of right now I can tell the bike has a lot of excellent features and qualities. But for starters I hate the Ritchey bar on my bike it sucks for all mountain riding. I think it would be a good bar on the mach 4 not the 5. As for the ride, the Mach 5 climbs better then my Epiphany that is certain. But as for going down hill I really can't say at this time because of the bars. The bend is so low it hurt my back and I couldn't push the bike as hard as I wanted. The bike is certainly fast and the shifting is spot on with the new front der set up. Tonight I'm going to swap out the bars for a bar with more rise. I really want to push this bike to it's limits. to see how it compares to some of the other bikes I have owned and ridden. I will take it out again tomorrow and hopefully run it ragged.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qfactor03
    Just curious, what percentage of your weight did you have to run in shock pressure to get proper sag?
    I started at about 65% (100psi) and let a bit off from there with my thumbnail... Just use the o-ring on the shock body- it helps to have a buddy there too.

    mb

  14. #14
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    Thanks for the reply. Marc. I was just trying to get an idea of whether this is a good design for us clydes out there. I have had full suspension bikes in the past that required running extremely high pressure to get correct sag and the Pivot looks like a serious contender. I was looking at the Racer X 29, but the XL is only available in Ti ($$$$). In all reality though, at $2200, the new Pivot Mach 429 isn't too far from that figure.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qfactor03
    Thanks for the reply. Marc. I was just trying to get an idea of whether this is a good design for us clydes out there. I have had full suspension bikes in the past that required running extremely high pressure to get correct sag and the Pivot looks like a serious contender. I was looking at the Racer X 29, but the XL is only available in Ti ($$$$). In all reality though, at $2200, the new Pivot Mach 429 isn't too far from that figure.
    I'd imagine that the Pivot is a fair bit stiffer than the Racer X, and if you're a big buy, you might want to go for something stiffer. In the UK, and Orange would be a great choice, but there's no US distribution. The Pivot is very meaty around the lower pivot (as is the Tomac Snyper) and may well be a good choice. Just don't piss that stiffness away with some flexy wheels. Shimano make an all-mountain version of the XTs, and there are countless options available if you go handbuilt (you'll appreciate the rigidity).

    I'd be surprised if you need to run a higher pressure than the Fox is capable of in this application, though. You can always go with a coil, too, and Romic will do custom springs for a number of applications (last I checked) for a reasonable price, which I've had done for bigger guys.

    marc

  16. #16
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    Wheels...

    I would be switching a set of Industry 9 Enduros over to the Pivot from my current hard tail. This wheel set has almost been too stiff on the ht with absolutely zero flex. I am mostly an aggressive XC rider and had a Racer X back in 2000. If the Pivot is even stiffer, I think it will work out just fine.

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    Mark BIkefix, you said you noticed some occasional
    pedal kickback. I've noticed this myself on the Mkiii and other virtual pivot
    type bikes I've ridden like the giant reign, I think some of that is inevitable with these kind of suspension designs.
    What did you have the sag set at ? 65 % of body weight would
    mean 35 %, am I reading that right ?

    Anyway, I've been curious about the Pivot version of the dw - link, as it seems
    optimized for the local terrain here and was designed by Chris C

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