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  1. #1
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    A request for advice

    If I might, I'd like to draw on the wisdom of the community here for an upcoming workshop I'm giving. The bike collective at my school has asked me to come give a workshop on winter riding/commuting, with the emphasis on the latter.

    While I'm a long time, year-round commuter (with a pretty well-dialed routine), I realize that I don't have all the "answers" and represent only one perspective on the winter commuting experience. So, I thought that with the diverse collection of experience, varied types of commutes, and variety of climates represented on this board, I might get some more interesting insights to share with the would-be winter commuters who join me at the workshop.

    So, here's the question: If you could share one piece of advice about what revolutionized your winter commuting experience, what would it be?

    I plan to talk a bit about how clothing choices, lighting/reflective devices, and riding techniques all contribute to having a safe and (more) comfortable commuting experience. So, feel free to speak to any of those areas.

    Thanks for your input. Here's hoping I can convince a few more folks that winter biking is not just for mental patients and self-hating masochists.

  2. #2
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    The one thing that revolutionized my winter commuting experience was discovering windproof clothing. For me, a high quality softshell jacket and rainpants over an insulating layer on the legs has allowed me to keep the bulk down and the warmth up. Also, a thin balaclava on the face vs. a thicker one lets you keep breathing and benefit from the warmth of your breath.

    I think too much clothing that isn't affective is the biggest mistakepeople make Adding another layer that doesn't block the wind doesn't do much. My coldest winter temps are usually in the single digit negatives (F), and I normally wear just a jersey top and my softshell, and a pair of insulating tights and rain pants.

    Feet and hands are a whole different topic ...
    You have no excuse for driving to work
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by CommuterBoy View Post
    The one thing that revolutionized my winter commuting experience was discovering windproof clothing. For me, a high quality softshell jacket and rainpants over an insulating layer on the legs has allowed me to keep the bulk down and the warmth up. Also, a thin balaclava on the face vs. a thicker one lets you keep breathing and benefit from the warmth of your breath.

    I think too much clothing that isn't affective is the biggest mistakepeople make Adding another layer that doesn't block the wind doesn't do much. My coldest winter temps are usually in the single digit negatives (F), and I normally wear just a jersey top and my softshell, and a pair of insulating tights and rain pants.

    Feet and hands are a whole different topic ...
    This ^

    Learning to layer properly is a huge thing that I am still working on. I think once you get that down, the whole thing is just that much better.

  4. #4
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    If I had to say just one thing, it would be:
    Want warm extremities, you have to make sure everything between your core and them is warm first. Toes are going to be colder if your legs aren't properly covered, even if your core is cooking and same goes for hands and arms. If you're feeling too hot but still have cold extremities start with venting the core a bit before venting arms/legs.

    If I got a second thing to say it would be:
    Cover your neck in addition to your head, lots of surface area there and lots of blood going through it, easy way to add warmth.
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  5. #5
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    Re-think routes.

    Snow banks and black ice not to mention a higher chance of riding in the dark put you at a bit greater risk for accidents. Also people aren't expecting you to be out.
    So switching to a side street can greatly alleviate stress and risk.

    Also even if you stick to the same route, It will take a little longer so plan accordingly. Even if weather is not bad it just will.

  6. #6
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    I'm not sure what it's like there, but here in VT the studded tires make the difference between a confident commute and hitting the ground in a hurry.

    My sister works in PA with folks trying to get GEDs or jobs, many recent immigrants with no car limited $, etc., and she asked me for advice for them on winter biking also. I told her you can do it without fancy bike stuff,inexpensive windproof warmup pants for basketball over longjohns will work too. But you do need lights to be seen & safe.

  7. #7
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    Studded tires given the poor snow removal here meant I did not have to wait until the roads were cleared. The Bar Mitts way of aid in keeping hands warm was a revelation. Investing in good warm boots that you can use off the bike was an excellent addition to my kit.

    Wool under layers if you aren't allergic like me, avoid 100% cotton, ski silk or man made fiber under layers work well for me. One is heavy silk with a turtle neck: great layering for the neck, just unroll the amount you want.

    Remember the bladder before getting fully dressed!

    BrianMc

  8. #8
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    Thanks for the insights. Keep 'em coming! A couple are definitely things that didn't leap to my mind due to the easy route I have.

    We only sporadically have to deal with snow (SLC, UT), and even on big dump days, the roads in the city are more churned up slushsy hell than real ice or snow. So, studs/chains are mostly unnecessary - flotation becomes more important than traction, oddly enough. Only the hardcore nut jobs (like me!) ride on those days, so I'm not thinking I'll talk too much about that stuff - unless people are really enthusiastic.

  9. #9
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    Fenders.
    "Don't buy upgrades; ride up grades." -Eddy Merckx

  10. #10
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    I agree with the fenders statement. One other thing. If you THINK it's too much in the way of clothing then it's probably not enough. You can ALWAYS remove something. But you can't add on if you don't already have it with you. Basically, initially "overdress"...you can remove whatever you feel you don't need.

  11. #11
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    Snowmobile gloves big enough to work with liners. Fur on the back of gloves for wiping your nose is optional.
    Remember, nobody knows. So let's find out...

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndrwSwitch View Post
    Fenders.
    critical.
    You have no excuse for driving to work
    (unless you don't have studded tires)
    (no excuse for that either)

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by theGliberal View Post
    Snowmobile gloves big enough to work with liners. Fur on the back of gloves for wiping your nose is optional.
    Oh, yeah. That reminds me of a point I almost forgot, but will bring up: Buying cycling specific gear can be expensive (and sub-optimal, functionally) - the gear for other outdoor activities is often cheaper and better for truly harsh rides. Thanks!

  14. #14
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    A few riding tips I'd make for general winter and wet weather riding (not necessarily snow as its often just cold and wet here):

    - A good piece of advice I saw on a motorcycle forum is to always ride well within your limits on the road. Ride at 60% or less (on a push bike you would still pedal hard of course ) and never take risks. That leaves you a big safety margin so if things begin to go wrong you have a way out. If you're pushing hard on corners, aggressively filtering up the inside of traffic etc then that increases the likelihood of a crash, especially in wet weather. The aim is to get to where you're going in one piece after all.

    - Remember that overall grip levels decrease drastically in wet weather. When it's cold your tyres don't grip as well either. Cross railway and tram tracks at right angles. Avoid any metal grates, manhole covers or painted road markings if possible. If you do have to ride over them keep the bike straight and don't turn at the same time. Manhole covers and road markings are lethally slippery when wet. Any ice or morning dew will remain on them long after the main road surface appears to have dried also. Be careful of newly laid road surfaces too. In the wet the oils trapped in newly laid tarmac rise to the surface making it treacherous. If it looks slippery then it probably is.

    -If you do have to do some cornering in bad weather on slippery surfaces then there are a few different techniques to consider. If you go round a corner counter steering by leaning the bike over and keeping your body upright then this means you're relying on the edge grip of your tyres. It's the best technique for carrying speed through long high speed corners but if the bike is leant over and the wheels begin to slip you've got a fight to keep it upright. The tyres are already on the edge and it's hard to recover if they begin to slide.

    An alternative cornering technique is to keep the bike upright, lean your upper body into the corner and steer round the corner (as shown in the bottom right diagram below). This achieves two things: It increases pedal ground clearance but also increases stability. If the bike begins to slip you're riding on the centre of the tyre with minimal lean angle and a centred weight distribution, making it easier to control the slide and reducing the chance of a crash. If you're going round a slippery roundabout or riding on a surface of wet leaves and mud over tarmac for example then you would do this in preference to leaning the bike over. It's often worth transferring some weight onto the front end at the same time to keep the front wheel planted when cornering.

    Some other general winter tips would be:

    - Take two inner tubes and have at least one steel tyre lever with you. Plastic tyre levers have a nasty habit of becoming brittle and snapping when it's cold.

    There's a similar thread here with some winter suggestions to look at also:

    BikeRadar.com • View topic - Remote Rural Winter Commuting

    If you're riding in remote areas make sure that people know where you have gone (the same as when mountain biking). A device like the garmin GTU-10 might be worth looking at.

    DC Rainmaker: Experimenting with using the Garmin GTU 10 tracker during Ironman Boise 70.3

    Pictured below: Different cornering techniques
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails A request for advice-steering.jpg  


  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by ubernerd View Post
    Thanks for the insights. Keep 'em coming! A couple are definitely things that didn't leap to my mind due to the easy route I have.

    We only sporadically have to deal with snow (SLC, UT), and even on big dump days, the roads in the city are more churned up slushsy hell than real ice or snow. So, studs/chains are mostly unnecessary - flotation becomes more important than traction, oddly enough. Only the hardcore nut jobs (like me!) ride on those days, so I'm not thinking I'll talk too much about that stuff - unless people are really enthusiastic.
    Ahhh, then you will have to acknowledge the inversion. I'm up in Logan where it's worse and can make some days unridable.

    The inversion can cause smog akin to or worse than the worst days in LA. It doesn't affect me too bad, but can be unpleasant to huff and puff in. Tell riders with issues like asthma to consider taking the bus that day (But not drive-it'll just make it worse!)

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmmorath View Post
    Ahhh, then you will have to acknowledge the inversion. I'm up in Logan where it's worse and can make some days unridable.

    The inversion can cause smog akin to or worse than the worst days in LA. It doesn't affect me too bad, but can be unpleasant to huff and puff in. Tell riders with issues like asthma to consider taking the bus that day (But not drive-it'll just make it worse!)
    Howdy, neighbor!

    I hadn't thought about talking about that, but you are spot on that I should warn folks of the extra hazard we face to our long-term health. I'm still struggling with how to deal with that wintertime "issue". I have no reasonable bus routes to get me to work, so on the worst air quality day, I have to get in my car? What kind of screwed up situation is that???

    I may try the model of riding to work (since it's all downhill) on red air quality days, and then bus most of the way home, and walk the rest. Not sure I can do that though, as it doubles my commute time home.

    BTW, drop me a line if you're ever in my neighborhood and want to go for a ride (road or mountain). I'd love to meet a fellow rider/commuter.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by WR304 View Post
    A few riding tips I'd make for general winter and wet weather riding (not necessarily snow as its often just cold and wet here):

    - A good piece of advice I saw on a motorcycle forum is to always ride well within your limits on the road. Ride at 60% or less (on a push bike you would still pedal hard of course ) and never take risks. That leaves you a big safety margin so if things begin to go wrong you have a way out. If you're pushing hard on corners, aggressively filtering up the inside of traffic etc then that increases the likelihood of a crash, especially in wet weather. The aim is to get to where you're going in one piece after all.

    - Remember that overall grip levels decrease drastically in wet weather. When it's cold your tyres don't grip as well either. Cross railway and tram tracks at right angles. Avoid any metal grates, manhole covers or painted road markings if possible. If you do have to ride over them keep the bike straight and don't turn at the same time. Manhole covers and road markings are lethally slippery when wet. Any ice or morning dew will remain on them long after the main road surface appears to have dried also. Be careful of newly laid road surfaces too. In the wet the oils trapped in newly laid tarmac rise to the surface making it treacherous. If it looks slippery then it probably is.

    -If you do have to do some cornering in bad weather on slippery surfaces then there are a few different techniques to consider. If you go round a corner counter steering by leaning the bike over and keeping your body upright then this means you're relying on the edge grip of your tyres. It's the best technique for carrying speed through long high speed corners but if the bike is leant over and the wheels begin to slip you've got a fight to keep it upright. The tyres are already on the edge and it's hard to recover if they begin to slide.

    An alternative cornering technique is to keep the bike upright, lean your upper body into the corner and steer round the corner (as shown in the bottom right diagram below). This achieves two things: It increases pedal ground clearance but also increases stability. If the bike begins to slip you're riding on the centre of the tyre with minimal lean angle and a centred weight distribution, making it easier to control the slide and reducing the chance of a crash. If you're going round a slippery roundabout or riding on a surface of wet leaves and mud over tarmac for example then you would do this in preference to leaning the bike over. It's often worth transferring some weight onto the front end at the same time to keep the front wheel planted when cornering.

    Some other general winter tips would be:

    - Take two inner tubes and have at least one steel tyre lever with you. Plastic tyre levers have a nasty habit of becoming brittle and snapping when it's cold.

    Pictured below: Different cornering techniques
    Wow. That's a treasure trove of knowledge. I knew there was a reason I wanted to get feedback from this group. All kinds of things I "knew" at some level, articulated nicely and clearly. You folks rock!

  18. #18
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    Another technique that's useful for winter riding is dealing with crosswinds. Strong crosswinds and sudden gusts of wind can often be a problem as they affect the handling of the bike. A strong sideways gust can blow you across the road into traffic, or even knock you off.

    When riding in strong crosswinds you lean your body into the wind, as though it's a support helping you to stay upright. If the wind is blowing from the left then you would drop your left hand elbow and shoulder and lean your entire upper body left (whilst tucking down low to reduce the side profile presented). If the wind is blowing from the right then you would drop your right hand elbow and shoulder and lean your entire upper body right.

    In very strong winds you would lean your body plus also lean the bike over into the wind as well. In extremely strong winds you lean your body into the wind, lean the bike into the wind and also steer into the wind. If the wind is blowing from the right and strong enough to blow you left across the road then you would steer right to resist the change of direction.

    A large part of riding in crosswinds is anticipating where the gusts will be. Exposed areas like hilltops and along the sea front are often windy. If you're riding along a sheltered road, but its windy, then you need to be prepared for strong sideways gusts of wind whenever you pass an opening (farm gates, driveways etc).

    If you're expecting to be hit by a strong gust of wind get ready before you reach the opening. Keep two hands on the bars and have your upper body braced and leant over in the direction you're expecting the wind, so that you're not caught by surprise when the wind actually hits you. If it feels like quite an exaggerated position that's probably about right. Keep an eye out for things like flags and banners which will give you a good indication of how strong the cross wind is.

  19. #19
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    This is for bay area California winter commuting...

    - run lower pressure in your tires than you do in the summer/fall

    - bring a compete change of clothes with you (may seem like a no-brainer). I tried for years to keep my clothes dry, but either rain or sweat would make those first few hours in class or at the job pretty unpleasant. Especially socks!

    - travel with a thermos of warm tea or coffee. Nothing better than getting to your destination, putting on dry clothes, and swinging some nice hot beverage.

  20. #20
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    Wipe down moving components as often as possible, winter grit accumulates and will accelerate wear.

  21. #21
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    One more quick one.

    Store your bike outdoors if it won't fully dry before your next ride.

    Having liquid water on your bike when you head out into the sub-freezing temperatures can make things stop working.
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  22. #22
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    I store the bike inside....

    I ride without fenders...

    I use studs...

    I don't use poggies...

    I use winter cleated bike boots...

    I use ski googles...

    To many seminars etc, pass on one way of doing things there are many ways to achieve winter commuting.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by jeffscott View Post

    To many seminars etc, pass on one way of doing things there are many ways to achieve winter commuting.
    Not to be argumentative, but that would be the whole point of this thread. From the first post:"I realize that I don't have all the "answers" and represent only one perspective on the winter commuting experience. So, I thought that with the diverse collection of experience, varied types of commutes, and variety of climates represented on this board, I might get some more interesting insights to share with the would-be winter commuters who join me at the workshop."

    I'm trying to draw on and share a variety of experiences/ideas rather than just talking about what works for me.

    So, would you care to share a lesson you learned along the way that made your winter commuting/riding experience a whole lot better?

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by ubernerd View Post
    Not to be argumentative, but that would be the whole point of this thread. From the first post:"I realize that I don't have all the "answers" and represent only one perspective on the winter commuting experience. So, I thought that with the diverse collection of experience, varied types of commutes, and variety of climates represented on this board, I might get some more interesting insights to share with the would-be winter commuters who join me at the workshop."

    I'm trying to draw on and share a variety of experiences/ideas rather than just talking about what works for me.

    So, would you care to share a lesson you learned along the way that made your winter commuting/riding experience a whole lot better?
    See above already did.

  25. #25
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    There have been a lot of great suggestions. Layering is key, though I find the balance between safety (having sufficient insulation in case I have to fix a flat along the road, for instance) and comfort (not being too warm) while I am riding to be a conundrum. A couple of things that I have found:

    1. I quit buying a parking pass, which gives me extra incentive to ride every day, and it provides a reason to justify the clothing and safety equipment that I want (I'm still a cheapskate, though).

    2. I keep a log of what I wear for the weather conditions (temp, wind, and precip) during the winter months. That way I don't have to rediscover what works for me every year.

    3. I love studded tires on the ice! It makes me feel like a kid again, and is more fun than the 4WD pickup I used to own. They aren't cheap, which is where #1 above comes in, and they are no fun on dry pavement.

    4. I commute on a scrabbled-together, no-name single speed MTB (32x14). It feels like am getting more exercise, and it is much easier to keep clean and operating properly through the winter months.

    Sorry, that's more than a couple...

  26. #26
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    ^^ Similar to #1, I had a gas budget that I used to buy most of my gear when I started riding all the time and stopped spending on gas. Come to think of it, I haven't had a gas budget for the past few years now. Need to bring that one up with the wife.
    You have no excuse for driving to work
    (unless you don't have studded tires)
    (no excuse for that either)

  27. #27
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    Recently i have been putting miles on my single speed belt drive steed. Granted this is not a step a beginner commuter is going to make, but a bike with a few mods aimed at being a specific commuter will reap rewards.
    I LOVE having zero drive train maintenance and i clicked over 8500 miles on it last week.

    Good tires! Im partial to the Specialized Armadillo line for their resistance to flats.

    Good fenders as stated above. also don't be afraid to add your own extended mud flaps. There are a few DIY sites on the web, but the concept is simple enough.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by burmer_skark View Post
    I LOVE having zero drive train maintenance and i clicked over 8500 miles on it last week.
    Damn... I knew there were some hardcore riders on here, but you're an animal.

    If a belt drive will allow me to do that, I'm buying one tomorrow!

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by ubernerd View Post
    Damn... I knew there were some hardcore riders on here, but you're an animal.

    If a belt drive will allow me to do that, I'm buying one tomorrow!
    Yeah it piratically pedals itself. Let me tell you, 8500 miles in a week, i need all the help i can get.

  30. #30
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    2 most important things for winter comfort here in Balmy southern CA (especially with the rains we had this last year)

    1) When you arrive at work, newspaper in the shoes really help to dry them out fast. Always Dry before the ride home!

    2) shoe covers (even a plastic bag) = toasty warm toes
    Last edited by apatron; 11-11-2011 at 03:38 PM. Reason: Fat finger syndrome...I need to learn how to type

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by burmer_skark View Post
    Yeah it piratically pedals itself. Let me tell you, 8500 miles in a week, i need all the help i can get.
    8,500 miles a week on a pirate themed belt drive commuter bike? +rep

    Something that I find really useful for riding during the winter is to use a high intensity yellow or persimmon (orange) sunglass lens. The lens gives everything a nice yellow tint, making it appear sunnier, even on grim days like today when the sky was the colour of slate and it was blowing a gale. It makes going out in bad weather a much more bearable and enjoyable experience as you don't realise just how horrible it really is.

    Pictured below: A tinted persimmon (orange) sunglass lens makes it seem sunnier and more cheerful riding in the winter.
    Attached Images Attached Images

  32. #32
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    Don't use your front brake as your front tire can easily wash-out, sending you tumbling to the ground.

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    The [U]one[U] thing I discovered the hard way. Put platform pedals on. When that front wheel goes out on the ice, you will not have enough time to get unclipped. You will go down. The third time will hurt enough to keep you from riding the rest of winter. The next winter you will wise up and install the platform's. Flat ice is not the problem. It's the grooved stuff packed down by cars. this assumes the studded tires are already on.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziemas View Post
    Don't use your front brake as your front tire can easily wash-out, sending you tumbling to the ground.
    ??? in that case you shouldn't use your back brake either as it will skid easier once your weight transfers forward.
    If you need to slow down, look for a pedestrian to plow into. They are soft and will slow your forward momentum in a hurry.

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ziemas View Post
    Don't use your front brake as your front tire can easily wash-out, sending you tumbling to the ground.
    I don't think this is solid advice at all. Typically I use my front brake more than my rear. Of course you have to consider the road/trail conditions in front of you, but if I am on dry, paved roads, I don't really use my rear. On wet roads or if there is loose rock, I use them both and only brake lightly or only as hard as I have to in order to achieve my braking goal.

  36. #36
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    I've heard lots of people say to not use the front brake for riding in the Canadian winter like it's a truism. I don't agree either though, and tend to be front-centric all year (although I use platforms and don't have to worry about unclipping to dab).

    I think the kernel of truth in there is that you need to be careful when using both brakes. If you lock your rear wheel on ice you can recover. If you lock your front wheel on ice (and you're a hardcore, gnar shredding mountainbiker) you can recover. If you lock both wheels on ice your bike drops out from under you and you've got a half second to look like a chump before you meet the ground.

  37. #37
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    Normally, I'm not a fan of the rear brake. But on ice, I've found it to be more usable than the front. It still doesn't provide much stopping power, but it does provide some, and it's easier to keep the bike under control if it skids.

    On any other surface, I'm still front uber alles. (Maybe not wet metal.)
    "Don't buy upgrades; ride up grades." -Eddy Merckx

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by burmer_skark View Post
    ??? in that case you shouldn't use your back brake either as it will skid easier once your weight transfers forward.
    If you need to slow down, look for a pedestrian to plow into. They are soft and will slow your forward momentum in a hurry.
    You'll skid and fishtail on ice using your rear brake, but you won't have your bike washout from under you nearly as quickly as with the front brake.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dalton View Post
    I don't think this is solid advice at all. Typically I use my front brake more than my rear. Of course you have to consider the road/trail conditions in front of you, but if I am on dry, paved roads, I don't really use my rear. On wet roads or if there is loose rock, I use them both and only brake lightly or only as hard as I have to in order to achieve my braking goal.
    I'm speaking of commuting in icy conditions, not riding trails or dry roads. Winter commuting is a beast unto itself.
    Quote Originally Posted by newfangled View Post
    I've heard lots of people say to not use the front brake for riding in the Canadian winter like it's a truism. I don't agree either though, and tend to be front-centric all year (although I use platforms and don't have to worry about unclipping to dab).

    I think the kernel of truth in there is that you need to be careful when using both brakes. If you lock your rear wheel on ice you can recover. If you lock your front wheel on ice (and you're a hardcore, gnar shredding mountainbiker) you can recover. If you lock both wheels on ice your bike drops out from under you and you've got a half second to look like a chump before you meet the ground.
    What kind of conditions are you riding in where you use your front brake in the winter? Where I live the streets end up a mush of sleet, snow, and sand with a layer of ice underneath. Urgh.


  39. #39
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    ^ that's pretty similar to what I'll see. But we'll also get a weeks here or there where it never gets warmer than -25C, and all the ruts will freeze solid and then get finely polished so it's like riding on a moguls course. I treat it a lot like mountain biking, with brake modulation and weight shifts. Bike selection makes a huge impact too though, and I use studs and fairly wide tires.

  40. #40
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    Hey, another Utah commuter/rider here. Perhaps I have a different perspective embarking on my first full winter of commuting, as I've always put the bike away as freezing temps arrived in prior years.

    First piece of advice -- it isn't that bad! In 25* this morning, crystal clear skies, as the sun was coming up, I was very happy I was outside and enjoying myself. It is actually quite fun and refreshing to ride in the winter if you're prepared for it!

    Second piece -- it doesn't have to cost that much to equip yourself. Most of us here in Utah have snow/cold weather outdoor gear. My ski gloves, socks, base layers, fleece liner, etc. all work just as well on the bike. My gortex shell I wear for skiing will also work fine on my bike as an outer layer, although it hasn't gotten cold enough to need it yet. What I have purchased that is cycling specific (tights, neoprene shoe covers, yellow reflective cycling windbreaker) I've been able to find on clearance racks, online, etc, and has been less than the price of 2 tanks of fuel for my truck -- it will have paid for itself by the end of the month! The Patagonia outlet in Sugarhouse and Pearl Izumi outlet in Park City have some great deals on base layers and other cold weather items.

    Good luck!
    '19 Ibis Ripmo
    '13 Felt Z4

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by burmer_skark View Post
    Yeah it piratically pedals itself. Let me tell you, 8500 miles in a week, i need all the help i can get.
    Wait.. wait... wait... what? 8,500 miles in a week?

    1,214 miles a day?

    50.59 miles per hour, 24 hours a day, for 7 days straight...?

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthy123 View Post
    Wait.. wait... wait... what? 8,500 miles in a week?

    1,214 miles a day?

    50.59 miles per hour, 24 hours a day, for 7 days straight...?
    Yeah, i normally cruise at 60 when im gettin my spin on, but i have to stop for the occasional red light ya know.

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