Is 6500 miles to much for standard oil?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Is 6500 miles to much for standard oil?

    Taking my 2010 Corolla on a extended biking trip next may/june and will start out with a fresh oil change. The car uses 5w20 non synth and I would like to know if I should use something like mobil 1 extended mileage syn (good for 15k I think) or just go with the normal oil and change it when I get back. Thanks
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  2. #2
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    Should be fine. Vw's interval for non turbo cars was 10k miles. I say if you are doing long freeway drives and not stop and go driving, and not too much dusty area driving, 6.5k miles is fine.

    My mom used to go 10k miles between changes in her 83 tercel out of neglect. That car went 250k miles before it blew a radiator hose, my sister kept on driving it and warped the head. Before that, the engine was tip top.

    The 3k mile oil change was an old standard before oil got much better. Jiffy Lube still promotes 3k changes... Well, we all know why.

  3. #3
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    Use your standard, and take an extra quart or two with you in the car, just in case. I drove from Michigan to Florida and back on one oil change, and my low oil light came on. I was down a bit, and threw a quart in there, and was good to go. Made it all the way back to northern Ohio before this happened.

  4. #4
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    What does your owners manual recommend for distance between oil changes?
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  5. #5
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    The general reccomendations for standard dino oils is 3000-4000 miles. This is alway considering all types and habits of driving. I would spend the extra couple of bucks and get some semi synthetic/synthetic blend in a good brand like valvoline or mobil if you know you are going to go outside the normal maintence schedule. You will most likely be fine but when an engine is cruising at 3k rpms for hours it builds up alot of heat. Synthetic is really unneeded unless you are going to be doing alot of high rpm driving, in dusty conditions, "extreme" driving. I run castrol semi synthetic in my wifes xterra and we go 4500-5000 between oil changes. I run castrol full fyn in my camaro but it sees upwards of 6000rpms alot, and I go 5000 without issue.


    I would suggest a can of BG Products MOA or a bottle of Lucas top end lubricant before your trip. Theres no reason not to spend $8 to protect your engine.
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  6. #6
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    Why couldn't you just hit a Jiffy Lube or some other quick lube place once you get to the 3-4K mile range?
    I normally change my own oil and do all my own servicing but for your case I would just find a quick lube joint. You can argue that a quick lube joint is over priced and a bunch of monkeys working there but if you're on a 6500 mile trip, I'm sure you would pass one somewhere near the middle of your trip.
    That's what I would do if I was in your case. Just run the recommended oil and go from there.

  7. #7
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    Why add time and hastle to the trip when no more than $10 can circumvent the issue? Ive personally run mobil 1 full synthetic (the current 800 zinc count vs the old formula with the 1600 zinc count) in my work vehicle (2005 honda element) for a hair over 10,000 miles. The oil was evaluated by mobil and they said it had about 45% life left. I would not hesitate for a second to run a full syn or even a semi syn name brand oil to 6000-7000 miles.
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  8. #8
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    You will be fine. I would NEVER use BG or any other additive to your oil, its not needed. Also you can run full synthetic during normal operation, its doesnt need to be severe conditions to see the benefits. Also cruising at 3 k for hours doesnt build any more heat into the engine than anything else would! Remember, the manufacturer only SUGGESTS, doesnt REQUIRE you to change the oil at those intervals. The suggestions are made for the average idiot driving around the street. Change your oil, drive your car, and dont worry about it. When you get back, change it again if you so desire. Nothing bad will come if you exceed the manufacturers recommendation by a few thousand miles. Heck I use Amsoil in my Highlander, and only change the oil once a year or 25k miles. Been doing this on my vehicles since 1990, and have never had a single engine failure or issue!

  9. #9
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    Amsoil is engineered different, has things like different zinc and copper contents. Chances are your Amsoil has a 1400+ zinc count (which actually on some of the newer vehicles with tighter emissions tolerances isnt reccomended because it prematurely wears out the catilytic converters). Most base oils have between 650 and 900. Im not saying youre right and im wrong im just giving my personal opinions which are based off my personal experiences and the fact that ive been a technican for Ford for over 8 years.


    Just out of curiousity, whats your discouragement against additives?
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  10. #10
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    I should have mentioned that about a third of that will be out west, somewhat loaded, with bikes and up to 9,000 ft. So, I was thinking the 4 cylinder might give the oil a workout then compared to the rest of the trip.

    I think it should be good. I will check the oil level during the trip and change it after.
    Thanks for the responses
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  11. #11
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    Additives arent needed! if you use quality lubricants, then you dont need additives. Being a motorcycle technician since 1997, Ive never seen anything good come from using additives.

  12. #12
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    Well, I was hoping for a bit more in depth explanation, but Ill leave you to your opinions and me to mine.
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  13. #13
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    Well whats your rationale behind it?

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    The condition of the internals of engines and transmissions that ive torn down that have used additives on a regular basis vs the ones that havent. Ive torn down 99-03 mazda protege transmissions that have only had the reccomended fluid changes and no additives using the oem reccomended fluid, vs the transmission in my 03 and my friends 01 that both used GM synchromesh synthetic fluid plus friction modifier (which now you can only buy synchromesh with the friction modifier). Signs of wear were shown on the non treated oem fluid transmissions (such as clash marks on the gear teeth) vs the practically new condition of the treated transmissions. I could go on and on with stuff like that I was just interested if you had personally seen anything in a case against the additives. Whether its needed or not isnt an issue, I was mostly wondering if you had a reason not to use it.
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  15. #15
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    So the higher quality lubricants protected better than OEM, which is exactly my point that you dont need to add additional additives to quality lubricants. I know that all lubricants have additives, my point is you dont need extra additives when using quality lubricants.

  16. #16
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    It shouldn't be a problem.

    If it was my car, I'd check the dipstick at 3-4k and decide then. If the oil looks good let 'er roll. If the oil is very dirty find a jiffy lube.
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  17. #17
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    Getting your oil changed takes 20 minutes. When you get to 3000 miles, stop and get it changed while you get lunch or something. The rest of this is just over thinking the problem.

    J.

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    6500 miles is no big deal. Like one of the previous posts said, bring a quart or 2 with you. Not sure of the oil consumption for your Toyota.
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSlow35th View Post
    Why add time and hastle to the trip when no more than $10 can circumvent the issue? Ive personally run mobil 1 full synthetic (the current 800 zinc count vs the old formula with the 1600 zinc count) in my work vehicle (2005 honda element) for a hair over 10,000 miles. The oil was evaluated by mobil and they said it had about 45% life left. I would not hesitate for a second to run a full syn or even a semi syn name brand oil to 6000-7000 miles.
    +1. I run mobil 1 full synthetic on both my MDX and My civic, I change the oil usually at about 5000 miles but usually it has plenty of life, I just change it to baby my babys if you know what I mean

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    Getting your oil changed takes 20 minutes. When you get to 3000 miles, stop and get it changed while you get lunch or something. The rest of this is just over thinking the problem.

    J.
    Unless the toolbag of a "mechanic" decides to strip out your oil pan/forgets to put oil back in it/doesnt tighten the filter correctly and it falls off on the highway........
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bad Idea View Post
    It shouldn't be a problem.

    If it was my car, I'd check the dipstick at 3-4k and decide then. If the oil looks good let 'er roll. If the oil is very dirty find a jiffy lube.
    "Dirty" look of oil doesn't have much to do with it lubricating properties. The only way to know FOR SURE is to have your oil tested when you change it. I use Blackstone Labs:

    Blackstone Labs

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    This is an EXCELLENT way to pre-diagnose upcoming engine problems.
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSlow35th View Post
    Unless the toolbag of a "mechanic" decides to strip out your oil pan/forgets to put oil back in it/doesnt tighten the filter correctly and it falls off on the highway........
    LOL.

    Then, you always need to worry about AQ Terrorists who masquerade as oil change guys. You can just never be too careful.

    If you are that worried about oil changes and your car, don't venture far from home or your mommy.

    J.

  23. #23
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    No thats why I do my own oil changes. Ive worked in various dealerships and shops over the years and ive seen the majority of the goobers they hire to change oil. The lesson in the auto industry? Minimum wage does NOT buy you quality employees.


    But way to jump out on a limb and compare common mishaps in the industry to some far fetched fair tale. You had good form, but the landing was a little rough.
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  24. #24
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    For heaven's sake, how hard is to to check that someone did an oil change properly? Answer: It's not.

    And if one can't take the <gasp> risk to get one's oil changed on a trip, then you shouldn't go far from home and your mommy. I mean, give me a break. You act like changing oil is brain surgery.

    J.

  25. #25
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    I asked the original question "Go synthetic or let her eat". The consensus was that the oil would be fine. That is what I'm going to do. Otherwise, I would run synthetic as an alternative. Your suggestion of changing the oil by goober at the jiffy during lunch made me laugh. That would be the absolutely last thing I would do while on vacation. Has nothing to do with being away from mom, just more like it makes no sense to me. But hey, thanks for the suggestion!

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    For heaven's sake, how hard is to to check that someone did an oil change properly? Answer: It's not.

    And if one can't take the <gasp> risk to get one's oil changed on a trip, then you shouldn't go far from home and your mommy. I mean, give me a break. You act like changing oil is brain surgery.

    J.
    Its not brain surgery, but youd be suprised how badly Ive seen people screw up a car just attempting to do an oil change, and how often for that matter. It has absolutely nothing to do with "being away from mommy" or my insecurities with mankind (other than the fact that i've lost most of my faith in humanity and people with half a brain now make up the minority). It has to do with the fact that IF (keyword here folks, IF) they screw up my car I dont want to be stuck in BFE halfway to my destination for 2 days while they wait on the dealer to get them an oil pan after they screw it up. Because then my $30 oil change that I did halfway through my trip has turned into a $300 oil change, oh and then $100 a night for a hotel, 2 days of my vacation that are now wasted, and general heartburn. Oh and I did that $30 oil change halfway through my trip to save the $10 extra I would have spent on a quality oil that would last the duration of my trip. If youd like to keep insulting me go right ahead. Ive been in this business for almost a decade and ive seen this same scenario play out much more than once.
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  27. #27
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    you could always stop at autozone change you oil in the back of the parking lot, and turn the old oil in before you leave. Under normal non-dusty, non towing situations 6500 shouldn't be a problem though

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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSlow35th View Post
    No thats why I do my own oil changes. Ive worked in various dealerships and shops over the years and ive seen the majority of the goobers they hire to change oil. The lesson in the auto industry? Minimum wage does NOT buy you quality employees.
    Boy isn't that the truth. I thought I wanted to be a mechanic when I first got out of high school. Growing up building race cars with my father it was pretty easy for me to go to work at a shop where a family friend worked. I was an ASE Steering, Suspension, Alignment, and Brake before I changed careers because working on other people's busted ass vehicles and dealing with idiot customers all day got really old.

    Makes me think of the window lickers that used to change oil in our shop.....and all the times I got to fix the stripped drain plugs, or a cracked aluminum oil pan from over tightening, or time we got to replace an engine because they double gasketed the filter and leaked all the oil out causing it to let go.

    Only my hands touch my vehicles when it comes to service/maint. work. But if I were away from home I would be okay with hitting a quick lube joint for an oil change.

  29. #29
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    Id be ok with it, if I had to. But if I could avoid the situation I will.
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  30. #30
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    If you're worried about it

    ...you can get regular mineral auto oil changed and a new oil filter installed anywhere for around $20-25. If you're worried about the oil techs. quality of work (being far from home and all) just ask to watch them and screw the oil drain plug and filter back on yourself. I wouldn't be worried about it myself though because you'll be doing a lot of highway driving and having the oil get dirty and sludge up will be less likely to occur than in regular stop and go short trip driving with a lot of heat/cool cycles.

  31. #31
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    should be ever 3000 to 4000 miles unless u have full synthetic

  32. #32
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    Not really true

    Quote Originally Posted by MC357 View Post
    should be ever 3000 to 4000 miles unless u have full synthetic

    That standard was coined way back when engine oil wasn't nearly as good as it is today... Like 50 years ago.

    Plus, it depends on how you drive. If you drive a lot of stop and go, and city traffic, you're effectively putting on big engine hours on the car without putting miles on the odometer. Freeway driving is the opposite, where you pile on odometer miles with few engine hours.

    In the OP's case, he's driving big freeway miles.

    Jiffy lube still wants you to believe that 3k number, tho.

    No Reason to Change the Oil Every 3,000 Miles - NYTimes.com
    Last edited by pimpbot; 12-30-2011 at 04:35 PM.

  33. #33
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    Yea, 3-5 k on oil these days is what the big oil manufacturers want you to believe. As another poster stated, the color of the oil has nothing to do with its lubrication properties. On a mechanically sound engine, you could run regular oil 10k with no problems. Again I would only do this using brand name oil (castrol, quaker state, penzoil, etc) I wouldnt do it on no name brand oil.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSlow35th View Post
    Its not brain surgery, but youd be suprised how badly Ive seen people screw up a car just attempting to do an oil change, and how often for that matter. It has absolutely nothing to do with "being away from mommy" or my insecurities with mankind (other than the fact that i've lost most of my faith in humanity and people with half a brain now make up the minority). It has to do with the fact that IF (keyword here folks, IF) they screw up my car I dont want to be stuck in BFE halfway to my destination for 2 days while they wait on the dealer to get them an oil pan after they screw it up. Because then my $30 oil change that I did halfway through my trip has turned into a $300 oil change, oh and then $100 a night for a hotel, 2 days of my vacation that are now wasted, and general heartburn. Oh and I did that $30 oil change halfway through my trip to save the $10 extra I would have spent on a quality oil that would last the duration of my trip. If youd like to keep insulting me go right ahead. Ive been in this business for almost a decade and ive seen this same scenario play out much more than once.
    LOL - I rest my case. Don't travel. You don't have the temperament for it.

    J.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nov0798 View Post
    Yea, 3-5 k on oil these days is what the big oil manufacturers want you to believe. As another poster stated, the color of the oil has nothing to do with its lubrication properties. On a mechanically sound engine, you could run regular oil 10k with no problems. Again I would only do this using brand name oil (castrol, quaker state, penzoil, etc) I wouldnt do it on no name brand oil.
    You're right.

    I just do it as cheap insurance - then I don't have to think about it (and it's habitual). I've got two cars now with 160K+ on them and I like to get over 200K before I replace them so I'm pretty careful on oil changes, lubes etc...

    J.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pitanan View Post
    I asked the original question "Go synthetic or let her eat". The consensus was that the oil would be fine. That is what I'm going to do. Otherwise, I would run synthetic as an alternative. Your suggestion of changing the oil by goober at the jiffy during lunch made me laugh. That would be the absolutely last thing I would do while on vacation. Has nothing to do with being away from mom, just more like it makes no sense to me. But hey, thanks for the suggestion!
    Change it where you want to. You'd be surprised at how easy it is to find someone who knows how to change oil! (note: we need a sarcasm font).

    If you're not worried about it then don't change it. If you are, then change it. Basically this is all pretty simple and not to be over thought too much.

    J.

  37. #37
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    I fail to see where Ive shown any kind of temper.
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    Not "temper," but temperament as in "nature" or "disposition".

    J.

  39. #39
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    Years ago I was buying a new Subaru, and there was a semi-loony guy in there who was being told he needed to have his engine replaced - he had NEVER changed the oil - just kept adding it - for 8 years and well over 100K miles... And this was in 1982 - car engines and lubricants are much better now. I check my oil about once a month or so for coloration, and when it starts to look darker, I get it changed. On my CR-V that gets short commute in light traffic/residential that works out to about 6K miles on average. Start with a fresh fill, carry a quart and check it every couple of thousand miles. If it starts to look noticeably dark, or low, add some and then get it replaced. If not, make the trip and have a good time and get it changed again when you get back.
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  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post

    If you're not worried about it then don't change it. If you are, then change it.

    J.
    good stuff

  41. #41
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    The way I look at it, it doesn't hurt to change your
    oil a lot. Not changing it enough? Some worry more
    about keeping fresh oil on their bike chains than in
    the engine of their car.

    Best, John

  42. #42
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    Well,

    Quote Originally Posted by John Kuhl View Post
    The way I look at it, it doesn't hurt to change your
    oil a lot. Not changing it enough? Some worry more
    about keeping fresh oil on their bike chains than in
    the engine of their car.

    Best, John
    Apart from enviro impact. Dirty oil is serious toxic waste. Getting your oil changed all the time just creates more of it. It has to go somewhere when you're done with it. It's often used for industrial fuel.
    Last edited by pimpbot; 12-31-2011 at 04:20 PM.

  43. #43
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    It depends on the car. Normally aspirated Subarus, for example, go 7,500 on normal oil as long as the driving is predominantly highway. Change it to stop and go driving and that is halved to every 3,750 miles.

    The scenario you describe, I would just change it before leaving and again upon returning. I wouldn't trust a random garage to change my oil when I'm travelling.

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by pimpbot View Post
    Apart from enviro impact. Dirty oil is serious toxic waste. Getting your oil changed all the time just creates more of it. It has to go somewhere when you're done with it. It's often used for industrial fuel.
    Most oil change centers in many states have to take used motor oil. Much of this recycled oil is reprocessed and used as fuel for boilers or in ships (fuel) according to the American Petroleum Institute. Apparently it can also be reprocessed and used for further lubrication. So just don't dump it out but take it to a service station or a oil change place for recycling. Then it's no big deal.

    FAQs - Used Motor Oil Collection and Recycling - American Petroleum Institute

    J.

  45. #45
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    well, yeah...

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    Most oil change centers in many states have to take used motor oil. Much of this recycled oil is reprocessed and used as fuel for boilers or in ships (fuel) according to the American Petroleum Institute. Apparently it can also be reprocessed and used for further lubrication. So just don't dump it out but take it to a service station or a oil change place for recycling. Then it's no big deal.

    FAQs - Used Motor Oil Collection and Recycling - American Petroleum Institute

    J.
    ... nobody said dumping it in the ground is a good idea (although I've heard Dr. Watenberg say it just goes back where it came from, which is total BS, like so much of what he says on his radio show).

    But, remember everything comes from somewhere and has to go somewhere. The key is that we as individuals make those decisions, even whether to do the job in the first place or not, right down to driving the car the miles that requires the job to be done.

  46. #46
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    Now that we have beat the topic of oil changes into the ground should we take on tire rotation?

  47. #47
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    that reminds me....

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    Now that we have beat the topic of oil changes into the ground should we take on tire rotation?
    Wife's car needs tires rotated on the Audi Avant Quattro. Gotta keep them even or the center Torsen diff gets overworked. I usually do that at every 5k mile oil change, which I just did last week.

    I better bring it to work this week and do that.

    Thanks!!

  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    Now that we have beat the topic of oil changes into the ground should we take on tire rotation?

    If the automotive industry cant agree on a standard for the "correct" way to do a tire rotation then I dont think we (as a forum) have ANY hope in reaching an agreeable end.


    IMHO, rotate your tires every 7-10k miles (more if you are an aggresive driver). Try to keep the best tires on the front (I prefer to have traction on the steering end of the car). Tire rotation wouldnt be near as big of a deal if people would bother to check their tire pressure every once in awhile.
    2010 Giant Yukon FX
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    Another transfusion yesterday. Being able to change your own oil should be a life skill that everyone has, even if they usually have someone else change their oil.


    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSlow35th
    IMHO, rotate your tires every 7-10k miles (more if you are an aggresive driver)."
    Rotating tires isn't an option for everyone.

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    It is for the majority, and yes I understand what you are getting at. My camaro and my dad's corvette both run staggered fitment and directional tires, so rotating is not an option except for side to side with dismount, and thats hardly cost effective. And rotating side to side is pretty much pointless.
    2010 Giant Yukon FX
    Pure XCR Wheelset/Geax Saguaro Tires/Tubeless
    Bike Weight Lost: 2.48lbs (1124g)

  51. #51
    ballbuster
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    Oh, I dunno....

    Quote Originally Posted by SuperSlow35th View Post
    It is for the majority, and yes I understand what you are getting at. My camaro and my dad's corvette both run staggered fitment and directional tires, so rotating is not an option except for side to side with dismount, and thats hardly cost effective. And rotating side to side is pretty much pointless.
    THe tires wear forward and backward differently. On a RWD car, especially the fronts, since the fronts are only braking. Same with FWD rear tires. When the tire wears, you'll notice the knobs develop a bit of a ramp to them, especially on the outside edges.

  52. #52
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    Ive had two fwd's and two high torque rwd's, along with a handful of rwd trucks/suv's. Only odd wearing Ive ever encountered is my 91 camaro would wear the outside tread block on the front tires due to shove it through corners to fast and it trying to understeer.
    2010 Giant Yukon FX
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    Bike Weight Lost: 2.48lbs (1124g)

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    Quote Originally Posted by pitanan View Post
    Taking my 2010 Corolla on a extended biking trip next may/june and will start out with a fresh oil change. The car uses 5w20 non synth and I would like to know if I should use something like mobil 1 extended mileage syn (good for 15k I think) or just go with the normal oil and change it when I get back. Thanks
    Prior to the Toyota 1MZ/5S oil sludge fiasco, the recommended oil change interval was 7500 miles.

    If you're going to do the M1 Extended mileage... you should use their extended performance filters also, AND you should read their warranty:

    Mobil 1 Warranty

    YOu don't want to give them any excuses for voiding a warranty

    Quote Originally Posted by pimpbot View Post
    Should be fine. Vw's interval for non turbo cars was 10k miles. I say if you are doing long freeway drives and not stop and go driving, and not too much dusty area driving, 6.5k miles is fine.
    VW's require synthetic (Group III or higher) oils that meet VW502.00 (with the exception of TDI's)

    There are no conventional oils that meet VW502.00.

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnJ80 View Post
    Now that we have beat the topic of oil changes into the ground should we take on tire rotation?
    Geez, you guys. I was just kidding!

    J.

  55. #55
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    Huh....

    Quote Originally Posted by tednugent View Post
    Prior to the Toyota 1MZ/5S oil sludge fiasco, the recommended oil change interval was 7500 miles.

    If you're going to do the M1 Extended mileage... you should use their extended performance filters also, AND you should read their warranty:

    Mobil 1 Warranty

    YOu don't want to give them any excuses for voiding a warranty



    VW's require synthetic (Group III or higher) oils that meet VW502.00 (with the exception of TDI's)

    There are no conventional oils that meet VW502.00.
    ... interesting. I didn't know the non turbo cars also required synthetic. I had a 96 GTi 2.slo. I just saw the tech bulletin on the subject, and it said 97 and on... not that there is any difference in the 2.slo engine from 96 to 97....

    I thought the issue was more due to the turbo cooking the oil out, turning it to sludge and plugging up the oil pump intake and turbo oil feed hose, not actual friction breakdown.

    I did 5k mile conventional oil tune changes on that car, and when I sold it at 250k miles or so, the engine was still tip top. It didn't even burn much oil oddly enough. I would have to put half a quart in it over that 5k miles, but that is it.

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