Whatever happened to Mike Vandeman?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
    nocturnal oblivion
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    Whatever happened to Mike Vandeman?

    Just random curiosity but any word from the MV front? Been a while, have he and his compadres been quiet or taken on another focus in life?
    Yes, the Candyman, I mention his name.
    "...like sex with the trail." - Boe

  2. #2
    J-Flo
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    Mistake.

  3. #3
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    Perhaps he joined ISIS?
    He has attempted to decapitate people.
    He wants to see the world burn.
    He has a rambling manifesto.

  4. #4
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    He met his "Harry Potter".

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by stumblemumble View Post
    Just random curiosity but any word from the MV front? Been a while, have he and his compadres been quiet or taken on another focus in life?
    Yes, the Candyman, I mention his name.
    He is still around, talking about mountain biking as usual:

    https://disqus.com/by/mikevandeman/

  6. #6
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    He has started making noises again. Tried to stir up trouble with NorCal, with mtb sponsors, along with his assorted pathetic diatribes. I have had folks contact me asking for opinions. Here is my response:


    This is a very sad man who is slowly losing his grip and foundering in desperation.

    The key to V is a lack of relevance. His wider audience has long ago abandoned him for the fool that he is. Those who hold on are as those few who sustain the viscous negativity of Fox News adherents and Obama-is-not-a-citizen ideologues.

    He is best ignored as irrelevant.
    I don't rattle.

  7. #7
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    I wonder how many birds his roaming murderous cat killed before being run over.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkeley Mike View Post

    Those who hold on are as those few who sustain the viscous negativity of Fox News adherents and Obama-is-not-a-citizen ideologues.
    Just curious. Why this?

    Talking like that reminds me of the narrow mindedness of Vandeman himself.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by squareback View Post
    Just curious. Why this?

    Talking like that reminds me of the narrow mindedness of Vandeman himself.
    Fox news = Propaganda bullhorn ?
    Suicide by single speed. Work in progress.

  10. #10
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    Nothing like a new mtbr thread with his name in the title to get him going. My guess is that he is someone who googles his name often and eats this stuff up.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by squareback View Post
    Just curious. Why this?

    Talking like that reminds me of the narrow mindedness of Vandeman himself.
    Precisely. Either side, that's a really lame comment.

  12. #12
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    Um ah !

    Any chance that ... oh never mind! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VaMczG0Hguc
    Suicide by single speed. Work in progress.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by ancient rascal View Post
    Fox news = Propaganda bullhorn ?
    Exactly as bad as MSNBC.
    I don't rattle.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by FullBladdy View Post
    Nothing like a new mtbr thread with his name in the title to get him going. My guess is that he is someone who googles his name often and eats this stuff up.
    He lurks here. He reads the BTC Buzz.He has nothing better to do with his life.

    The very best thing to do is ignore him but people persist in engaging their time and energy.

    I just don't get it.
    I don't rattle.

  15. #15
    Obi
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkeley Mike View Post
    I just don't get it.
    People love dirty laundry and a lost cause. Voldemort brings both.

  16. #16
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    I see people engaging with him these days for sport. :-)

    He deserves a special place in the Marin MTB Hall of Fame. Could you imagine how much that would bother him?! (And I'm not talking about putting some sort of plaque on a toilet bowl).

  17. #17
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    It is important to find a good foil. Unfortunately he hardly dignifies us with his enmity because he is so unworthy.
    I don't rattle.

  18. #18
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    Isn't there something worth liking about him? Even Porkstacker has a few things some folks enjoy about him eh?
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  19. #19
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    He has been known to pull scotch broom.
    I don't rattle.

  20. #20
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    "A Life Wasted - the Mike Vandeman Story. Tonight on Lifetime, Television for Women."

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Beer View Post
    I see people engaging with him these days for sport. :-)

    He deserves a special place in the Marin MTB Hall of Fame. Could you imagine how much that would bother him?! (And I'm not talking about putting some sort of plaque on a toilet bowl).
    Oh man, that would be so awesome.

    I actually think the guy had some validity before he became completely obsessed.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by FullBladdy View Post
    Nothing like a new mtbr thread with his name in the title to get him going. My guess is that he is someone who googles his name often and eats this stuff up.
    I considered that. I don't think his name being mentioned on MTBR NorCal really holds much sway though. If he did feel that way he should reconsider that a Phd should put him beyond such an inconsequential thread online. I could post about my latest bowel movement after a ride on here and people would respond, I would think MV is above internalizing his name being mentioned here.
    "...like sex with the trail." - Boe

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Beer View Post
    I see people engaging with him these days for sport. :-)

    He deserves a special place in the Marin MTB Hall of Fame. Could you imagine how much that would bother him?! (And I'm not talking about putting some sort of plaque on a toilet bowl).
    Lead him on thinking he is getting you riled up... then walk away.

    In all seriousness report him for spamming that website whenever he posts it. It's no different then the sunglasses spam or "add me" spam on Facebook.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkeley Mike View Post
    He lurks here....
    He somehow harvested my email address for his spam list. About half a dozen messages a day. He seems to delight in sending out stories about mtb'ers getting hurt.

  25. #25
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    Trolololol Voldemort


  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by stumblemumble View Post
    I considered that. I don't think his name being mentioned on MTBR NorCal really holds much sway though. If he did feel that way he should reconsider that a Phd should put him beyond such an inconsequential thread online. I could post about my latest bowel movement after a ride on here and people would respond, I would think MV is above internalizing his name being mentioned here.
    Rather than let Mike Vandeman muzzle us, based on some fear that he might read this thread - I propose the we do the opposite. Mention his name all over the place, so his google searches are completely overloaded.

    Post his name in the comments section on completely unrelated websites - all over the place. It will provide cover for us to discuss stuff here.
    Stupid, but sometimes witty. Occasionally brilliant. Slow and fat though.

    Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkeley Mike View Post
    He has started making noises again. Tried to stir up trouble with NorCal, with mtb sponsors, along with his assorted pathetic diatribes. I have had folks contact me asking for opinions. Here is my response:


    This is a very sad man who is slowly losing his grip and foundering in desperation.

    The key to V is a lack of relevance. His wider audience has long ago abandoned him for the fool that he is. Those who hold on are as those few who sustain the viscous negativity of Fox News adherents and Obama-is-not-a-citizen ideologues.

    He is best ignored as irrelevant.
    Quote Originally Posted by squareback View Post
    Just curious. Why this?

    Talking like that reminds me of the narrow mindedness of Vandeman himself.
    Yeah, we all know Obama was born in Kenya and that Hawaiian birth certificate was a fake created on MS Word. The new thing is that Hillary is really a man.
    Lead by my Lefty............... right down the trail, no brakes.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkeley Mike View Post
    Exactly as bad as MSNBC.
    But that was not the example you used. While that is an understandable City of Berkeley leftist opinion, it has nothing to do with mountain biking. All sorts of people ride.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by andytiedye View Post
    He somehow harvested my email address for his spam list. About half a dozen messages a day. He seems to delight in sending out stories about mtb'ers getting hurt.
    On several public comments lists messages had been sent out with all users in open CC. That is how I got on it.

  30. #30
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    In my case I believe he got on the Google Group for MORCA and raided the member list. (others reported like-wise at about the same time)

    I simply added his email to my spam list so every month or so I can go back through my junk mail and see what's trending on his planet.
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  31. #31
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    I feel sorry for him.

    What could have been a great mind has slid into the depths of mental illness. I do hope he finally grows out of his denial stage and seeks professional help.
    Do not take anything I post seriously. I don't.

  32. #32
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    Don't think about a hippopotamus.
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  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by dave54 View Post
    I feel sorry for him.

    What could have been a great mind has slid into the depths of mental illness. I do hope he finally grows out of his denial stage and seeks professional help.
    I sort of do too but his pathology could just as well be that of a mistimed Hitler or Stalin; after all he has a degree in psychology and could be very calculating in what he is doing---for his "cause".

    On the plus side because of him I've learned the meaning of words like "epicaricacy" and "schadenfreude".
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  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by pliebenberg View Post
    I sort of do too but his pathology could just as well be that of a mistimed Hitler or Stalin; after all he has a degree in psychology and could be very calculating in what he is doing---for his "cause".

    On the plus side because of him I've learned the meaning of words like "epicaricacy" and "schadenfreude".
    Through out history both individuals and groups have fallen into the trap of thinking their own opinions are so right, so superior - that anyone who disagrees is subhuman.

    Once the opposition is no longer worthy of consideration, any and all actions needed to defeat them are on the table.

    If you ever find yourself in a position where your opposition isn't worthy of basic human kindness, it may be time to check yourself.
    Stupid, but sometimes witty. Occasionally brilliant. Slow and fat though.

    Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

  35. #35
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    HI MIKE! You must be loving all this attention. See you on the trail.

  36. #36
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    This single idiot will have no power against the rapidly rising sport of Mountain Biking....ever.

    The wheels have touched the dirt. He is seemingly DOOMED....wait for it. Or, simply ignore it.
    "This is a male-dominated forum... there will be lots of Testosterone sword-shaming here" ~ Kenfucius

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zachariah View Post
    This single idiot..
    Unfortunately, there are a LOT of idiots.

  38. #38
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    I heard that Mike V bought an electric bike

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohmygato View Post
    He is still around, talking about mountain biking as usual:

    https://disqus.com/by/mikevandeman/
    good god, look at that...

  40. #40
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    His facebook rantings are same as his disqus... down to the same phrases. He does need to reword his arguments occasionally.

  41. #41
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    When you spend a lifetime trying to validate your claims, it is hard to give up and admit you were wrong... so you just keep doing what you know:

    https://groups.google.com/forum/#!fo....mountain-bike

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    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles View Post
    Through out history both individuals and groups have fallen into the trap of thinking their own opinions are so right, so superior - that anyone who disagrees is subhuman.

    Once the opposition is no longer worthy of consideration, any and all actions needed to defeat them are on the table.

    If you ever find yourself in a position where your opposition isn't worthy of basic human kindness, it may be time to check yourself.
    Very good post. It is very true, of him and of many others... Reading his Disqus page (just skimming headlines basically) makes it clear that he has gone that far. All mountain bikers are evil, sent here by Satan to destroy God's creation. Or something like that.

    It really makes you wonder... Even if he were totally correct in his assumptions, wouldn't you expect him to at least accept that some mountain bikers ride out or ignorance and not malicious intent? If he accepted that viewpoint he could even try to dissuade mountain bikers from riding, rather than seemingly trying to bring on an off-road cyclist genocide like he seems to be attempting.

    Are signatures searchable? Maybe we should all put his name in our signatures so every post pops up in his searches? This thread just rekindled my desire to mess with that guy... Not so much because of his hate for us, but more just because he's clearly unstable and takes himself way too seriously.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDwayyo View Post
    Very good post. It is very true, of him and of many others... Reading his Disqus page (just skimming headlines basically) makes it clear that he has gone that far. All mountain bikers are evil, sent here by Satan to destroy God's creation. Or something like that.

    It really makes you wonder... Even if he were totally correct in his assumptions, wouldn't you expect him to at least accept that some mountain bikers ride out or ignorance and not malicious intent? If he accepted that viewpoint he could even try to dissuade mountain bikers from riding, rather than seemingly trying to bring on an off-road cyclist genocide like he seems to be attempting.

    Are signatures searchable? Maybe we should all put his name in our signatures so every post pops up in his searches? This thread just rekindled my desire to mess with that guy... Not so much because of his hate for us, but more just because he's clearly unstable and takes himself way too seriously.
    Yes, signatures are searchable.
    Stupid, but sometimes witty. Occasionally brilliant. Slow and fat though.

    Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Beer View Post
    When you spend a lifetime trying to validate your claims, it is hard to give up and admit you were wrong... so you just keep doing what you know:

    https://groups.google.com/forum/#!fo....mountain-bike
    LOL. He's still trolling alt.mountain-bike? I remember his spewed garbage from 15 years ago.

    If there hadn't been actual physical encounters with him by various members of the mtb community, I would almost think that he wasn't a real person - just a cleverly written internet trolling program.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles View Post
    Yes, signatures are searchable.
    I like yours... But I'm not linking his page. You know that the more links to his page that exist on the interwebs the further up on the page he is when people use a search engine. Don't help him out.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDwayyo View Post
    I like yours... But I'm not linking his page. You know that the more links to his page that exist on the interwebs the further up on the page he is when people use a search engine. Don't help him out.
    Got it. I removed the link. And now he's got 5,370 posts on mtbr to read up on!
    Stupid, but sometimes witty. Occasionally brilliant. Slow and fat though.

    Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

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    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Beer View Post
    When you spend a lifetime trying to validate your claims, it is hard to give up and admit you were wrong... so you just keep doing what you know:

    https://groups.google.com/forum/#!fo....mountain-bike
    Wow, this is so sad. I am starting to feel really bad for the guy now.

  48. #48
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    The frail old guy defense is one of his strongest fallback positions. Don't buy into it.
    I don't rattle.

  49. #49
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    Even kayaking and rafting, which give humans access to the entirety of a water body, prevent the wildlife that live there from making full use of their habitat, and should not be allowed

    Now I don't feel so 'singled out". He's gone off on kayakers as well!
    If only I could just float over the ground and never touch a thing. Sigh...

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    But that was not the example you used. While that is an understandable City of Berkeley leftist opinion, it has nothing to do with mountain biking. All sorts of people ride.
    You seem biased in your categorizing of the sustaining of negativity by Fox News as a leftist opinion. Negativity is negativity and it should never be condoned. The argument that Obama is not a citizen is ludicrous and should be condemned by all fair thinkers, Republicans and Democrats alike. The comeback that MSNBC engages in negatism and should also be reviled is no justification for the specific Fox News stories that sustain negatism.

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheDwayyo View Post
    Even if he were totally correct in his assumptions, wouldn't you expect him to at least accept that some mountain bikers ride out or ignorance and not malicious intent? If he accepted that viewpoint he could even try to dissuade mountain bikers from riding, rather than seemingly trying to bring on an off-road cyclist genocide like he seems to be attempting.
    In MV's world, ALL mountain bikers (and all police now apparently, after having been on trial) are liars, just by virtue of having ridden a mountain bike (kids, grandma, etc.) and therefore anything that any one of us says is a lie. He will always think he is correct, as everything we say to counter his argument is not true. Pretty airtight "logic" happening in his worldview. Don't even try. Unless you like being turned into Brer Rabbit vs. the Tar Baby.
    Half the planet is deep into bloody tribal mayhem. We’re just riding bikes (and drinking beer) here.
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  52. #52
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    He deserves a special place in the Marin MTB Hall of Fame. Could you imagine how much that would bother him?! (And I'm not talking about putting some sort of plaque on a toilet bowl).[/QUOTE]

    ^^^THIS is a brilliant suggestion!

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Beer View Post
    When you spend a lifetime trying to validate your claims, it is hard to give up and admit you were wrong... so you just keep doing what you know:

    https://groups.google.com/forum/#!fo....mountain-bike
    If only we could somehow funnel our spam over there. Then our problem will become his problem.

  54. #54
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    Mike Vandeman Siting!

    He used to be just a legend to me -- until I actually saw him! I innocuously stumbled into him at a conference at UC Berkeley about science and the National Parks. He was presenting his "work" at the poster session. I read his abstract (but did not put his name to the legend) and thought it would be an interesting thing to check out. Whoo! I was in for a surprise!

    When I finally figured out who he was I said, "Oh! You're famous!" and he smiled and said, "Yes". He was pretty low-key. I didn't really engage in any discussion but I did ask him if I could take a photo of his poster presentation, as I had never seen anything like it, and he let me. It had magazine pictures that looked like they were from the 80s. It was the nuttiest "science" poster I have ever seen. It was a little sad -- they had him stuck down in the basement of the building we were in.

    Then I saw him at several talks during the conference. I just had to take a few photos -- a little weird, I know. But I was in awe! He is so weird!


    Whatever happened to Mike Vandeman?-mv_3.jpgWhatever happened to Mike Vandeman?-mv_4.jpgWhatever happened to Mike Vandeman?-mv_1.jpgWhatever happened to Mike Vandeman?-mv_2.jpg

  55. #55
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    He looks like he wants to stab someone in the last pic

    also I wonder if he got permission to use the images

  56. #56
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    This is like poking roadkill with stick. Ewwwww.
    I don't rattle.

  57. #57
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    Naw, roadkill's more fun. It's like feeding a rabid hamster sunflower seeds, sooner or later you're gonna get bit and regret even letting yourself be near it.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Klarity View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	mv_1.jpg 
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ID:	995288
    I wonder if he is carrying his saw in that backpack?
    "You're messing with my zen thing, man!"

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bokchoicowboy View Post
    I wonder if he is carrying his saw in that backpack?
    I wish I had the skills, but I can see a hilarious photoshop opportunity here.
    Half the planet is deep into bloody tribal mayhem. We’re just riding bikes (and drinking beer) here.
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  60. #60
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    My sources told me this is his girlfriend.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  61. #61
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    Those Middle Earthers sure have an odd way of wearing day packs...



    And it appears that his hand is permanently stuck in the would-you-like-to-lick-my-popsicle-little-boy position.

    #vandermanboylove
    Last edited by dirtvert; 06-14-2015 at 04:58 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by shredchic View Post
    I wish I had the skills, but I can see a hilarious photoshop opportunity here.
    Im not that good but took a "Stab at it"

    removed it because it was so bad
    Last edited by AndrewJL; 06-14-2015 at 08:11 PM.

  63. #63
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    I believe it is at Mt. Rushmore where hikers have permanently damaged & scarred the trails.
    And no, not joking. The metal tips on walk/hike sticks can really mess things up.

  64. #64
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    What fascinates me about Mike, is his rather textbook example of Narcissistic Personality Disorder. And the rather intelligent side contrasts sharply with the irrational rantings that come out with his mountain biking obsession. We, with "normally" wired brains have a difficult time trying to understand his behavior. It is, of course, pointless to attempt to persuade Mike's opinions with any kind of rational reasoning, although many, including myself, have been lured into trying. I had an email exchange with Mike a few years ago, concerning an article he posted on the net. I had no idea who he was at the time, so I just questioned some of his comments-big mistake, for Mike can never, but never be wrong! We went back and forth a couple times and I realized something was strange with this guy. So I Googled him and found out about his reputation. I responded back to him in a manner that would make him seem like an idiot if he agreed with me, but contradict his own words if he disagreed. I never heard from him again. I like to think I cornered him into a situation where he had to retreat, but I may be narcissistic to think that! Anyway, I kind of feel sorry for him, like one might feel sorry for Jeffrey Dahmer. All the best to you, Mike. They say NPD just gets worse with age, so you have a lot to look forward to!

  65. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by bpressnall View Post
    What fascinates me about Mike, is his rather textbook example of Narcissistic Personality Disorder. And the rather intelligent side contrasts sharply with the irrational rantings that come out with his mountain biking obsession. We, with "normally" wired brains have a difficult time trying to understand his behavior. It is, of course, pointless to attempt to persuade Mike's opinions with any kind of rational reasoning, although many, including myself, have been lured into trying. I had an email exchange with Mike a few years ago, concerning an article he posted on the net. I had no idea who he was at the time, so I just questioned some of his comments-big mistake, for Mike can never, but never be wrong! We went back and forth a couple times and I realized something was strange with this guy. So I Googled him and found out about his reputation. I responded back to him in a manner that would make him seem like an idiot if he agreed with me, but contradict his own words if he disagreed. I never heard from him again. I like to think I cornered him into a situation where he had to retreat, but I may be narcissistic to think that! Anyway, I kind of feel sorry for him, like one might feel sorry for Jeffrey Dahmer. All the best to you, Mike. They say NPD just gets worse with age, so you have a lot to look forward to!
    He should be a politician. He'd fit in with a those there that think they can "fix the social problems" with some law.

    Well, maybe in Florida or something where he won't bother us.
    Lead by my Lefty............... right down the trail, no brakes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ziscwg View Post
    He should be a politician. He'd fit in with a those there that think they can "fix the social problems" with some law.

    Well, maybe in Florida or something where he won't bother us.
    Nah Mike is more of a despot than a politician instead of counters of LIAR, AD HOMINEM, AND LIBEL (in rotation) it would be HARD LABOR and EXECUTE.

    He is all about freedom of speech for himself and only those who agree

    If you try to explain a scientific principle to him it's libel

    If you disagree with him it's Ad Hominem

    If you ask him for proof on his statements its lying

    This is all of course because he is the self proclaimed expert on everything because you know, he holds a PhD in Psycology and everyone knows when you get a PhD you become an "expert" in everything.

  67. #67
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    Your libel is duly noted.

  68. #68
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    Have seen him canvassing around Rockridge and Berkeley - Save Knowland Park maybe? I forget what it was. Have been tempted to just yell into the air without eye contact, "HA HA!!!! Pruning Saw!!!!" and then continue on my way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Entrenador View Post
    Have seen him canvassing around Rockridge and Berkeley - Save Knowland Park maybe? I forget what it was. Have been tempted to just yell into the air without eye contact, "HA HA!!!! Pruning Saw!!!!" and then continue on my way.
    It would be a good idea to post a warning at trail heads given his violent past.

  70. #70
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    Corrected

    Whatever happened to Mike Vandeman?-mv_3.jpg

  71. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkeley Mike View Post
    Exactly as bad as MSNBC.
    Then why not just state all cable news networks. Why single Fox, Mike? Are you one of those crazy Berkeley libs? Hmmmmm, you just might be mtn bikes V

    Sometimes you make great contributions and other times you rail people for making the same comments you just made.

  72. #72
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    He very recently showed up at a SC meeting designed to gather energy to resist opening EBMUD lands to mountain bikers. He made disparaging remarks about a local Oakland Composite NorCal team which did not help him with the group.
    I don't rattle.

  73. #73
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    The two greatest obsessions of the MTBR NorCal section: Mike Vandeman and mountain lions. Of the two, I'd rather meet mike but I carry bear spray that would work on both an attacking lion and an attacking Mike. Well, maybe it'd work with the lion.

  74. #74
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    Does anyone else get his anti mtb emails like I do?
    Please don't mistake my enthusiasm for mountain biking as an indication of my skill level.

  75. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by zicked View Post
    Does anyone else get his anti mtb emails like I do?
    Yes. He stole some mailing lists that where CCed in the open, I think from MidPen in particular. I want to write to some authorities where he lives to get a restraining order or something, not sure how to formulate that.

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    I want to write to some authorities where he lives to get a restraining order or something, not sure how to formulate that.
    Quite a simple process really:

    I am not 100% sure, but I believe you can file a restraining order in the jurisdiction (county) where you live if that is the primary location the unwanted contact (email) is taking place (being received). It is a gray-area where crimes like this (unwanted/unsolicited contact/harassment) occur when the medium is email. Question of jurisdiction.

    First step is to collect whatever objective evidence you have, which would be both copies of emails he has sent you as well as at least one email response by you to him asking him to cease and desist. If you have not asked the suspect to stop emailing you, I do not believe you have any grounds to make a complaint against him. This is very important. Even at this point if you have not yet asked him to cease, do it now and record that sent email in your evidence.

    Take this evidence to your local law enforcement agency (PD if in a city municipality, county sheriff if you are in an unincorporated area) and file a police report.

    The law enforcement agency will most likely resist filing a report ("we are too busy", "we don't take reports on non-violence or non-property loss crimes", "handle this in civil court", "not our juristiction", etc.), but you can insist they at least take a report as a "General info" or "Information only" report...unwanted email contact may be filed as a criminal report, I do not recall the specific penal codes, but at the very least get an "Info Only" type of report filed.

    Have them include copies of your evidence (emails) with the report. If they try to play the "not our jurisdiction" card insist they take the report and then send a copy to the jurisdiction where the suspect lives...this covers all bases and is something that is done all the time by law enforcement.

    When doing this if you get blown off by whatever officer is assigned to talk to you insist on speaking to a supervisor/sergeant/lieutenant and make them write the report...this is your right as a citizen to have it documented.

    Don't let them just make what is called a "log note" or "dispatch record", these are just entries in the officer's dispatch record...a notation stored in the computer and something really hard to use to pursue anything in court. Have them give you a report number and actually write a report. Find out how long it will take to have the report filed in the records department and get the info on what it takes to obtain a copy of the report for yourself. There will probably be a few days wait and a cost for reproduction.

    Once a report has been generated get a copy and take that to the local county courthouse. The personnel at the courthouse will be able to give you information on filing a restraining order. You will use the police report as the legal basis (reason/need) for the restraining order. There will be costs involved in filing this as well as time needed to be spent.

    If you do obtain a restraining order it will need to be served on the suspect/defendant/respondent. You can do this yourself...bad idea...or you can get a process server to deliver it. Some orders are legal to send via US mail, some county sheriff departments also provide a service for serving orders.

    Technically the order is enforceable without service, but most law enforcement and judges will not pursue charges if it is not provable the suspect has been served. They will consider it a waste of time to try and pursue an unserved order...so make sure you get it served.

    Once served all you need to do is wait and see if he continues emailing/contacting you. If he does, copy whatever is sent and take it and a copy of your restraining order to the local law enforcement and file a violation of restraining order report with them. They can then pursue criminal charges against the suspect.


    There you go Axe...like I said, quite simple really....
    "You're messing with my zen thing, man!"

  77. #77
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knucklehead View Post
    LOL. He's still trolling alt.mountain-bike? I remember his spewed garbage from 15 years ago.

    If there hadn't been actual physical encounters with him by various members of the mtb community, I would almost think that he wasn't a real person - just a cleverly written internet trolling program.
    20+ years. I remember him on rec.backcountry in 1995, maybe earlier. He had no credibility then and was regarded pretty much the same then as he is now, and that was a backpacking group, not a mountain biking group.

  78. #78
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    Just received one of the many emails from him that I get daily. He got my email from a State Parks list that was not BCC'd. Sent him back a reply to cease and desist. Hope that works!

  79. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtnbiker4life View Post
    Then why not just state all cable news networks. Why single Fox, Mike?
    Good point. In fairness I should say that I have become suspicious of most news outlets.

    BTW I am an old-school Blue Collar Berkeley flatlander from near the tracks.
    I don't rattle.

  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkeley Mike View Post
    The frail old guy defense is one of his strongest fallback positions. Don't buy into it.
    That right there is a nudge in the right direction. There is only one solution for a bully. Some stuff doesn't change. This ***** took up hating MTBrs. I bet his wife is a Dom, and a particularly nasty one at that. That or he actually believes his own horse shit. A degree in whatever not associated with the topic at hand is never mentioned by educated people. That's like leading every conversation with the fact that you know modern FS MTBs and can advise anyone and everyone on the proper choice when the discussion is current French wines. He is one giant 'duh'. Someone please deliver the message.
    "It's not that bicycling is so important, it is that everything else is equally unimportant."-Bruce Ohlson.

  81. #81
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkeley Mike View Post
    Good point. In fairness I should say that I have become suspicious of most news outlets.

    BTW I am an old-school Blue Collar Berkeley flatlander from near the tracks.
    I don't trust any damn one of them.

    When I hear a headline, I think - ok is this news worthy? If it is, I do my own research. The the actual studies and polls myself. The media distorts stuff so frequently and so badly, you have to wonder if the whole US media is run by a bunch of pre-pubescent, ESL miscreants.
    Stupid, but sometimes witty. Occasionally brilliant. Slow and fat though.

    Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bokchoicowboy View Post
    Quite a simple process really:

    There you go Axe...like I said, quite simple really....
    My concern with this is once you send him a cease and desist he now knows that he is actually harassing you. Isn't there a way to get his email provider to crack down on him?

  83. #83
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    In fairness, he has respected my request in the past to delete my address from his missives.
    I don't rattle.

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    On a positive note seeing his spam has prompted me to start mountain biking on a regular basis again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skinnyfatty View Post
    Reality check:

    If what you have posted is true, you're a really sad individual. Just as deviant as Sir Mike.
    well that and it's summer and I am only commuting twice a week

    It's not because of spite, it's because it was a aha of hmm I remember how much fun that is.

  86. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by skinnyfatty View Post
    Reality check:

    If what you have posted is true, you're a really sad individual. Just as deviant as Sir Mike.
    That's kinda harsh

  87. #87
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    Quote Originally Posted by AndrewJL View Post
    My concern with this is once you send him a cease and desist he now knows that he is actually harassing you. Isn't there a way to get his email provider to crack down on him?
    Once he knows he is harassing you then the decision is on him to continue (makes it a premeditated crime) or cease contact with you. If he takes the first course then you have the legal option of contacting law enforcement, if he takes the second course then problem solved.

    As far as contacting his email/internet service provider, if you can figure out who they are they usually have some sort of process to file a complaint. Many wont really do anything unless facing criminal charges or civil lawsuit themselves. You might be able to get him put on a spam or IP blacklist.

    One thing everyone may want to remember is that since he already has a criminal conviction each and every continued criminal act goes against him harder than if he had a spotless record. More so if his conviction is a felony. If he is on probation or parole and he commits any crime he is up for a jump back into jail/prison via probation/parole violation and possibly fresh charges.

    In my opinion it is in the best interest of the MTB community to be diligent and report each and every criminal act this guy commits. It will all add up to additional jail time for him and get him off-line. You can't quash his freedom of speech but you can stop his contacting you and get him busted for continuing if that contact is unwanted and reported.

    You can fight back, you can make life difficult for him.
    "You're messing with my zen thing, man!"

  88. #88
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    I think you'd get some skepticism from a judge that a civil restraining order is warranted here without any threat or other attempt to contact outside of these spam emails. It might be subject to civil fine under CAN SPAM, but that's a stretch at these volumes.

    Secondly, the whole process takes a lot of time on the part of the complainant. Multiple visits to court, multiple discussions with a peace officer, etc. I don't know about you guys but I don't have that kind of time.

  89. #89
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    I am not sure he is interested in harassing folks like us. Co-opting a list to quickly swell his broadcast is a no-brainer. Tweeking the details with unsubscribes takes a bit more time. Diddling with us just to be a jerk, I think, is not his goal.
    I don't rattle.

  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bokchoicowboy View Post
    If you have not asked the suspect to stop emailing you, I do not believe you have any grounds to make a complaint against him. This is very important. Even at this point if you have not yet asked him to cease, do it now and record that sent email in your evidence.
    I have asked twice. He replied that he would not. I did not engage in further conversation.

    But his macabre stories are annoying.

  91. #91
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    That's creepy. I have no problem with disagreement or simple opposition but this is the sort of cluelessness that alienates him from people who otherwise might support his sort of cause at least at some level. The people who do stand next to him are just the same types. You don't want to be around them as they are socially bizarre and righteous in their belief that they are fighting the good fight.

    Ewww!
    I don't rattle.

  92. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    I have asked twice. He replied that he would not. I did not engage in further conversation.
    Then it's Game On for either reporting him, or returning the favor and spamming him EPIC MOUNTAIN BIKE VIDEOS FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD. He then gets so spun out he spends hours tearing each video segment apart to write a new plan of attack.

    Heck, imagine if every one of us, instead of spending 5-10 minutes catching up on topic replies sent him an equally frustrating email retort?

    Tie his free time down w maintaining his illustrious self image?

  93. #93
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    Side note,

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeVandeman-Youtube
    Mike Vandeman posted 3 years ago

    And use your real name, COWARD (I know, then you would be sued for libel)! No one respects a coward.
    *Says the wimp who uses hand tools to hurt people with and rolls over like he broke a nail or a hip when someone attempts to answer physical force with equal self defense.

    Tell us again Wittle Mikey, who's the coward? Projecting much since you know nobody respects you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles View Post
    you have to wonder if the whole US media is run by a bunch of pre-pubescent, ESL miscreants.
    close , there was a wikileak out a month or two ago that revealed main stream media news was basically being written by government, it was a little suspicious to me that all the tv networks ran the same news stories every day,creepy

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    The bowling shoes fit

    Quote Originally Posted by natrat View Post
    close , there was a wikileak out a month or two ago that revealed main stream media news was basically being written by government, it was a little suspicious to me that all the tv networks ran the same news stories every day,creepy
    Corporate media and talking heads? Bombs away ... Crying Wolf? :: Jim Sinclair's Mineset
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  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    I have asked twice. He replied that he would not. I did not engage in further conversation.

    But his macabre stories are annoying.
    He replied to my request and said he would take me of his list and told me I was free to put my head back in the sand. It's been a couple of days now and so far so good.

  97. #97
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    A vapid parting shot but he did cooperate.
    I don't rattle.

  98. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by FKFW View Post
    He replied to my request and said he would take me of his list and told me I was free to put my head back in the sand. It's been a couple of days now and so far so good.

    Look at it this way then, we can all agree he is the absolute expert when is comes to putting one's head in the sand.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Whatever happened to Mike Vandeman?-mikevandemanthethreatisreal.jpg  

    Whatever happened to Mike Vandeman?-screen-shot-2015-06-27-10.05.51-pm.jpg  

    Last edited by Obi; 06-28-2015 at 11:45 AM.

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    Hate the bring this up, but were all of Vandeman's convictions dismissed a couple of years ago? That is what he is asserting.

  100. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by cohenfive View Post
    Hate the bring this up, but were all of Vandeman's convictions dismissed a couple of years ago? That is what he is asserting.
    AFAIK for such first time offenders conviction is purged from record after a little while. It does not not mean it did not happen. He can keep asserting anything, we know who he is. A convicted criminal.

  101. #101
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    He is currently in the comments section of the article on EBMUD Access and bikes. He is making his usual mess and trumpeting this "dismissal." I am commenting with data and studies and don't want to dilute my message by confronting his distortions.

    EBMUD eyes easing ban on mountain bike access to its watershed trails - ContraCostaTimes.com
    I don't rattle.

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    He likes to call people "liars" when they refer to him as a "convicted felon." I think his rationale is that he was convicted of misdemeanors and was not convicted on the felony charge (it was either a hung jury or not guilty, I don't recall). He served 8 days in jail and 22 days on a work program after his conviction and sentencing. So, yes, he is a convicted criminal but not a convicted felon. Just like him to be arguing about the difference.

    If memory serves, he was under a long-term injunction to stay off the trails in the area where he committed this crime. Perhaps that was what expired or was "dismissed," but the Alameda criminal records portal is down at the moment so I can't check. It doesn't matter though, Berkeley Mike is correct.

  103. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    AFAIK for such first time offenders conviction is purged from record after a little while. It does not not mean it did not happen. He can keep asserting anything, we know who he is. A convicted criminal.
    Exactly. He still attacked mountain bikers with a hand saw.

  104. #104
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    Ya know I did sense a disturbance in the force. Didn't read the comments though. Might make for some interesting reading.


    EDIT! ROFL/YOLO!
    Gary Fisher to Mike Vandeman • 10 hours ago

    you have a puffy face. You are not A REAL PERSON who is seen at public events. You are anti AMERICAN! I dare you! PUFFY!

  105. #105
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    He's such a tool.
    I will suffer no butt-hurt fools!

  106. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axe View Post
    AFAIK for such first time offenders conviction is purged from record after a little while. It does not not mean it did not happen. He can keep asserting anything, we know who he is. A convicted criminal.
    Convictions are never purged without going through a process petitioning the court for it. Not for first time offenders, not for anyone. Even with juveniles it is not automatic (urban legend). The only thing juveniles can do is have their record sealed, so if they have some sort of background check all the investigator can find out is they have a sealed record (in some cases the sealing also eliminates the investigator even being told there is a sealed record).

    The conviction is not actually purged. It is expunged. Due to what in my opinion is a very f*cked-up law in California you can get all types of criminal convictions expunged...including DUI, including the stuff Vandeman was convicted of.

    What is expungement? This means that when petitioned, and the petitioner has been found to have completed probation, paid all fines/restitution, and has no other current charges of crime, the court may reopen the case and change the finding of guilt (conviction) to a dismissal.

    It does not remove it from the criminal record (record will state "dismissed after conviction") but the petitioner can state he/she has not been convicted of the crime. If there is a repeat of the offense the court will reverse the expungement.

    Sometimes there are deals made by prosecutors that make such things part of the conviction (automated expungement), but if there is no benefit to the prosecution or court it wouldn't even come up as an offer.

    In the case of M.V., I can see him pursuing expungement. This is probably why he states he has not been convicted. As far as I am concerned he has been convicted...I look at the expungement process as a political and administrative tool, not something that exists for the interest of justice. It protects the criminal, not society.
    "You're messing with my zen thing, man!"

  107. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bokchoicowboy View Post

    The conviction is not actually purged. It is expunged. Due to what in my opinion is a very f*cked-up law in California you can get all types of criminal convictions expunged...including DUI, including the stuff Vandeman was convicted of.
    I had no idea those are two different things. Thank you for the explanation.

    Purged or expunged, he is a convicted criminal and a regular idiot. Too bad we still talk about it. Power of the modern media amplification.

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    BM, I blame you for providing that link to his current doings. I just wasted time reading all this stuff. There are about three people who seem to be on our side replying I want to wish the best of luck to. It's pointless to argue with him. Funny, but pointless. He's in any topic having to do anything with a bicycle and it being dirt related.

    I wonder how he feels about Bike-Packing? That's bicycles and dirt at certain times.

    Excerpt of the best so far IMHO. DR's apparently using the South park logic of "present it to me"?


    Mike Vandeman > Kevin Moore • 3 hours ago

    You are a total idiot. No merry-go-round ever made a child happy, if their IQ was above 10.



    Mike Vandeman > DoseaReality • 3 hours ago

    The Olympics are indeed frivolous and environmentally destructive. Just think of all the CO2 from thousands of people flying halfway around the world to run a few yards in a race. That is the very definition of frivolous. We should boycott the Olympics - permanently.
    Last edited by Obi; 08-22-2015 at 07:34 PM.

  109. #109
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    Pardon me here if this idea lacks merit.

    Can we nominate a spot for MJV in the MBHOF? I know people might not want it, but here's the thing, dealing with his logic has actually IMHO pushed us into a better spot. We're used to his ilk and therefore we have grown from having had to deal with him. I'm thinking a Madam Tussaud statue that way we can all pose with it.

    Well, that and I'd love to see it happen. It will prove most interesting, most interesting indeed.

  110. #110
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    This guy is not worth a millisecond of our time.

    *just wasted my allotment for the next decade
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  111. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obi View Post
    P

    Can we nominate a spot for MJV in the MBHOF? I know people might not want it, but here's the thing, dealing with his logic has actually IMHO pushed us into a better spot. We're used to his ilk and therefore we have grown from having had to deal with him. I'm thinking a Madam Tussaud statue that way we can all pose with it.

    Well, that and I'd love to see it happen. It will prove most interesting, most interesting indeed.
    Darwin Award might be more appropriate; just wait for it...


    V is a curious foil. He is seen as an embarrassment and an unfortunate representation for folks who oppose us. He is not taken seriously by thoughtful people, the people we need to engage to make solid progress.
    I don't rattle.

  112. #112
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    True, or should I say touché. A blunt, rusty, and warped foil at that.

    Can someone please clarify why Gary Fisher and DR keep calling him "Puffy"? Is it supposed to reference the BlowFish from Saving Nemo?

    As in the "No I'm right, ooops, there I go..." bit?



    If that's it, I can see the similarities.

  113. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obi View Post
    I'm thinking a Madam Tussaud statue that way we can all pose with it.
    This is what it would look like:
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    For some reason his mug shot reminds me of Mugatu from Zoolander.

    "I invented the piano key necktie!!"

  115. #115
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    Good Lord! I just read what is on his Discus page and he's a kook! So much time and effort directed at one cause, one windmill to tilt at.

  116. #116
    > /dev/null 2&>1
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    Empty can rattles the most.

  117. #117
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    The Order for Dismissal. Bok explained it perfectly. Enjoy presenting it where needed.

    https://www.facebook.com/preservingt...type=1&theater

  118. #118
    I'm really diggin it!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Beer View Post
    The Order for Dismissal. Bok explained it perfectly. Enjoy presenting it where needed.

    https://www.facebook.com/preservingt...type=1&theater
    So now he is posting this? To prove his innocence???


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  119. #119
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    PCTodd finagled it out of him and posted it. Me thinks MJV won't be happy with his protege...

  120. #120
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    You gotta love California law. So he is (a) a convicted criminal, even though (b) the charges were dismissed after the conviction.

  121. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Beer View Post
    PCTodd finagled it out of him and posted it. Me thinks MJV won't be happy with his protege...
    Name:  ohtodd.jpg
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  122. #122
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    Well like maybe its sorta like past a certain age you can like get your permanent record sealed. The hard part is by spouting off like a total jerk-off for so long you can't get people to forget.

    I'm not sure jerk-off is the right noun. I was thinking whack-job or whack-a-doodle. It is too easy to use profanity, any clown can do that.

    I know.....

    FC, how about socks to the best profanity-less noun?

    Bon mots, anyone?
    I don't rattle.

  123. #123
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    pool noodle

  124. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Beer View Post
    The Order for Dismissal. Bok explained it perfectly. Enjoy presenting it where needed.

    https://www.facebook.com/preservingt...type=1&theater
    You won't let this thread die huh??
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  125. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkeley Mike View Post
    Well like maybe its sorta like past a certain age you can like get your permanent record sealed. The hard part is by spouting off like a total jerk-off for so long you can't get people to forget.

    I'm not sure jerk-off is the right noun. I was thinking whack-job or whack-a-doodle. It is too easy to use profanity, any clown can do that.

    I know.....

    FC, how about socks to the best profanity-less noun?

    Bon mots, anyone?
    I'm a Sarah Silverman fan, so perhaps Douche nozzle is appropriate for MJV.

    BTW, I like the idea of a place for him in the MTB HOF, in Fairfax. Have him come to the unveiling of a plaque acknowledging him for galvanizing a community of cyclists.
    Last edited by chuckha62; 12-09-2015 at 08:37 AM.
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  126. #126
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    Got a message today, apparently Voldemort got himself outed from Disqus and is now trying to troll CycleBanter.


    CycleBanter.com - View Profile: Mike Vandeman[_4_]

    Feel free to jump in and play nicely w him? So far he's garnered nothing other than a cursive viewing.

  127. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by stumblemumble View Post
    Just random curiosity but any word from the MV front? Been a while, have he and his compadres been quiet or taken on another focus in life?
    Yes, the Candyman, I mention his name.
    On a newspaper where he was spreading his anti-bike BS I suggested he buy a short length of rope and a rickety stool and my comment was removed by the paper because it was insensitive. After reading his same old copy and paste rants I hope he finally takes my advice.

  128. #128
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    MJV is going strong over on Outside Magazine's article about the MTB in Wilderness Areas by Vernon Felton. I would say he has about 25% of the ~1100 comments there. Most of it of course calling bikers liars and using the word DUH.

    Are Mountain Bikers About to Get Their Day in the Wilderness? | Outside Online

    His beliefs about how wilderness should be experienced only on foot and in the MJV way leads me to believe he should be transported into some wilderness, naked and without food or tools, and experience it fully in the proper manner.

  129. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRSpalding View Post
    MJV is going strong over on Outside Magazine's article about the MTB in Wilderness Areas by Vernon Felton. I would say he has about 25% of the ~1100 comments there. Most of it of course calling bikers liars and using the word DUH.

    Are Mountain Bikers About to Get Their Day in the Wilderness? | Outside Online

    His beliefs about how wilderness should be experienced only on foot and in the MJV way leads me to believe he should be transported into some wilderness, naked and without food or tools, and experience it fully in the proper manner.
    Reading these peoples comments depresses me. I always avoid comments on anything bike related, the haters are so toxic.
    East Bay Parks AKA East Bay Cattle Ranches

  130. #130
    Paper or plastic?
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    There ate only 3 haters though and all 3 are not too bright.

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  131. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by zorg View Post
    There ate only 3 haters though and all 3 are not too bright.
    They have a zealot's strength though. Energizer Zealots.

    I just went back to the article and noticed "870 comments" which is substantially fewer than the 1137 it had yesterday evening. It appears that all of the MJV comments were deleted and perhaps the other two spammers as well.

    I guess my estimate of 25% MJV was a bit off, but not too far.

  132. #132
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    He also hates kids.


    From: Mike Vandeman
    Date: Tuesday, November 3, 2015 at 8:19 AM
    To: ""
    Subject: (Hopefully Not) Coming to a School Near You: Mountain Bike Racing

    (Hopefully Not) Coming to a School Near You: Mountain Bike Racing
    Mike Vandeman, Ph.D.

    Mountain bikers and the mountain bike industry
    know that the future of their sport depends on
    recruiting young people into it. Consequently,
    they are actively promoting the creation of
    mountain bike racing teams in the nation's high
    schools. They will ask to use school facilities,
    the school's name, and the school's teachers as
    coaches. They will claim, using questionable
    logic, that mountain biking is fun, healthful,
    socially responsible, and environmentally
    beneficial. But don't be fooled! If you do your
    own investigation, as I have, you will find that exactly the opposite is true.

    Of all the many high school sports, mountain bike
    racing is the only one that is actually illegal!
    For example, in the San Francisco Bay Area, the
    league managers had to go 50 to 100 miles away to
    find a legal place to race. Every park in the Bay
    Area has a speed limit (generally 15 MPH), and
    won't allow mountain bike racing. No land manager
    within 50 miles is willing to subject the lands
    that s/he is responsible for to such abuse. That
    is a good indication that mountain biking -
    especially mountain bike racing �is not environmentally benign.

    A favorite myth of mountain bikers is that
    mountain biking is no more harmful to wildlife,
    people, and the environment than hiking, and that
    science supports that view. Of course, it's not
    true. To settle the matter once and for all, I
    read all of the research they cited, and wrote a
    review of the research on mountain biking
    impacts. I found that of the seven studies they
    cited, all were written by mountain bikers, and
    in every case, the authors misinterpreted their
    own data, in order to come to the conclusion that
    they favored. They also studiously avoided
    mentioning another scientific study (Wisdom et
    al) which did not favor mountain biking, and came
    to the opposite conclusions. In short, mountain
    biking, partly because mountain bikers travel
    several times as far as hikers, causes several
    times as much erosion, damage to plants, and harm
    to animals (e.g. driving them away from the
    resources that they need) as hikers.

    Introducing children to mountain biking is
    criminal. Mountain biking, besides being
    expensive and very environmentally destructive,
    is extremely dangerous. Recently a 12-year-old
    girl died during her very first mountain biking
    lesson! Another became quadriplegic at 13!
    Serious accidents and even deaths are
    commonplace. In September, 2000, a mountain bike
    race was held in a regional park in the San
    Francisco Bay area. One rider ended up brain
    damaged. Since then, mountain bike racing has
    never been allowed. Truth be told, mountain
    bikers want to introduce kids to mountain biking
    because they want more people to help them lobby
    to open our natural areas to mountain biking and
    children are too naive to understand and object
    to this activity. For I have collected almost 600
    reports of serious accidents and deaths caused by mountain biking.

    Isn't one of the purposes of school creating good
    citizens? Although the mountain bike teams claim
    not to support illegal mountain biking or illegal
    trail-building, their members (and, in some
    cases, even the coaches!) have often been caught
    doing just that. Their excuse is that there
    aren't enough legal trails close by�

    Mountain biking accelerates erosion, creates
    V-shaped ruts, kills small animals and plants on
    and next to the trail, drives wildlife and other
    trail users out of the area, and, worst of all,
    teaches kids that the rough treatment of nature
    is okay (it's not!). What's good about that?

    If your students want to mountain bike, I suggest
    that you let them do it on their own time. Don't
    lend this environmentally destructive activity legitimacy by sponsoring it.


    --

    I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is
    off-limits to humans ("pure habitat").
    Want to help? (I spent the previous 8 years
    fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

    Wildlife must be given top priority, because they
    can't protect themselves from us.

    Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of
    your body that you are fond of!

    Wildlife Need Habitat Off-Limits To Humans! Mike Vandeman's Second Home Page

  133. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRSpalding View Post
    They have a zealot's strength though. Energizer Zealots.

    I just went back to the article and noticed "870 comments" which is substantially fewer than the 1137 it had yesterday evening. It appears that all of the MJV comments were deleted and perhaps the other two spammers as well.

    I guess my estimate of 25% MJV was a bit off, but not too far.
    I believe that the other two spammers were also MJV.

  134. #134
    I'm really diggin it!
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    Quote Originally Posted by norton55 View Post
    He also hates kids.


    From: Mike Vandeman
    Date: Tuesday, November 3, 2015 at 8:19 AM
    To: ""
    Subject: (Hopefully Not) Coming to a School Near You: Mountain Bike Racing

    (Hopefully Not) Coming to a School Near You: Mountain Bike Racing
    Mike Vandeman, Ph.D.

    Mountain bikers and the mountain bike industry
    know that the future of their sport depends on
    recruiting young people into it. Consequently,
    they are actively promoting the creation of
    mountain bike racing teams in the nation's high
    schools. They will ask to use school facilities,
    the school's name, and the school's teachers as
    coaches. They will claim, using questionable
    logic, that mountain biking is fun, healthful,
    socially responsible, and environmentally
    beneficial. But don't be fooled! If you do your
    own investigation, as I have, you will find that exactly the opposite is true.

    Of all the many high school sports, mountain bike
    racing is the only one that is actually illegal!
    For example, in the San Francisco Bay Area, the
    league managers had to go 50 to 100 miles away to
    find a legal place to race. Every park in the Bay
    Area has a speed limit (generally 15 MPH), and
    won't allow mountain bike racing. No land manager
    within 50 miles is willing to subject the lands
    that s/he is responsible for to such abuse. That
    is a good indication that mountain biking -
    especially mountain bike racing �is not environmentally benign.

    A favorite myth of mountain bikers is that
    mountain biking is no more harmful to wildlife,
    people, and the environment than hiking, and that
    science supports that view. Of course, it's not
    true. To settle the matter once and for all, I
    read all of the research they cited, and wrote a
    review of the research on mountain biking
    impacts. I found that of the seven studies they
    cited, all were written by mountain bikers, and
    in every case, the authors misinterpreted their
    own data, in order to come to the conclusion that
    they favored. They also studiously avoided
    mentioning another scientific study (Wisdom et
    al) which did not favor mountain biking, and came
    to the opposite conclusions. In short, mountain
    biking, partly because mountain bikers travel
    several times as far as hikers, causes several
    times as much erosion, damage to plants, and harm
    to animals (e.g. driving them away from the
    resources that they need) as hikers.

    Introducing children to mountain biking is
    criminal. Mountain biking, besides being
    expensive and very environmentally destructive,
    is extremely dangerous. Recently a 12-year-old
    girl died during her very first mountain biking
    lesson! Another became quadriplegic at 13!
    Serious accidents and even deaths are
    commonplace. In September, 2000, a mountain bike
    race was held in a regional park in the San
    Francisco Bay area. One rider ended up brain
    damaged. Since then, mountain bike racing has
    never been allowed. Truth be told, mountain
    bikers want to introduce kids to mountain biking
    because they want more people to help them lobby
    to open our natural areas to mountain biking and
    children are too naive to understand and object
    to this activity. For I have collected almost 600
    reports of serious accidents and deaths caused by mountain biking.

    Isn't one of the purposes of school creating good
    citizens? Although the mountain bike teams claim
    not to support illegal mountain biking or illegal
    trail-building, their members (and, in some
    cases, even the coaches!) have often been caught
    doing just that. Their excuse is that there
    aren't enough legal trails close by�

    Mountain biking accelerates erosion, creates
    V-shaped ruts, kills small animals and plants on
    and next to the trail, drives wildlife and other
    trail users out of the area, and, worst of all,
    teaches kids that the rough treatment of nature
    is okay (it's not!). What's good about that?

    If your students want to mountain bike, I suggest
    that you let them do it on their own time. Don't
    lend this environmentally destructive activity legitimacy by sponsoring it.


    --

    I am working on creating wildlife habitat that is
    off-limits to humans ("pure habitat").
    Want to help? (I spent the previous 8 years
    fighting auto dependence and road construction.)

    Wildlife must be given top priority, because they
    can't protect themselves from us.

    Please don't put a cell phone next to any part of
    your body that you are fond of!

    Wildlife Need Habitat Off-Limits To Humans! Mike Vandeman's Second Home Page
    Considering that he has been stalking one of the NICA teams practices, this is quite scary. I'm predicting a Vandeman incident in 3, 2, 1....

  135. #135
    Log off and go ride!
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    I thought by now someone would have offed him ( or he offed himself), ending his pathetic drain on the earth's resources.

  136. #136
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    Quote Originally Posted by DRSpalding View Post
    They have a zealot's strength though. Energizer Zealots.

    I just went back to the article and noticed "870 comments" which is substantially fewer than the 1137 it had yesterday evening. It appears that all of the MJV comments were deleted and perhaps the other two spammers as well.

    I guess my estimate of 25% MJV was a bit off, but not too far.
    From what I heard/was-told a certain someone decided she had enough of his harassment and went after both MJV and one of the main websites that allowed him to post his gibberish. Not sure what exactly was done, but at the least understand it was based on the tone of his posts and replies, that it was considered willful and intentional harassment/trolling, and the paperwork served went to both him and that site. Pretty much she got his baloney on lockdown on numerous sites that tied into each other through a site used to view and post commentary and also got him another injunction/charge of sorts that he's likely going to have to deal with really soon. As a result that site's tasked now with not necessarily removing his posts (as they serve as evidence) but "hiding" or "blocking" them and keeping them available when the Court(s) will need them. He hung himself. Even when serving time he was still actively posting his baloney.



    Again, that's what I heard/was-told, so AFAIK it's all hearsay but apparently the results speak for themselves since he's being pushed/cornered.

    As to the post above about him essentially stalking minors/coaches/etc either in-person or online if true I hope they nail his a$$ to the wall. If he ever does something again like he does in confrontations, especially to a minor in real life, and I'm witness to it, things will not go his way. He willfully and intentionally confronted me years ago, it's too late to file charges, but he's also pulled crap by spamming and interacting with me online and I'll easily put that to a stop if he tries it again. He's tried to get my Wife fired/written-up at her job, and also attempted to pull stunts on me like calling in and making a false complaint when I was working in Berkeley/Lafayette as well as another town. Luckily in both situations co-workers were able to prove they were loaded or false situation(s) and the Wife and I went along with our lives. (*Yes, he's that vile and even get's friends to do this currently with shop employees.)

    MJV can go off-himself as far as I'm concerned. There's no love or hate lost on that idiot in my eyes.

    *Part of why we don't miss working in the industry at a shop level.
    Last edited by Obi; 12-10-2015 at 06:42 PM.

  137. #137
    Hella Olde
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    I ride for Mike. May his injured mind one day heal.

  138. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by DH40 View Post
    I ride for Mike. May his injured mind one day heal.
    In death he will find peace.
    East Bay Parks AKA East Bay Cattle Ranches

  139. #139
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    Some folks call it a sling blade, I call it a Kaiser blade - Mike Vandeman

  140. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by matuchi View Post
    Some folks call it a sling blade, I call it a Kaiser blade - Mike Vandeman
    Mmmmm hmmmmm.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  141. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by Davey Simon View Post
    Mmmmm hmmmmm.
    I like them French fried potaters.

  142. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by matuchi View Post
    I like them French fried potaters.
    "mmmmh hmmmm. I don't understand all of it, but I understand a good deal of it" - Mike Vandeman
    Stupid, but sometimes witty. Occasionally brilliant. Slow and fat though.

    Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

  143. #143
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    "They turned me loose from the nervous hospital. 'Said I was well. I got hired on by a Mr. Bill Cox fixing lawnmowers and whatnot. That grass out there in the yard has grown up quite a bit. I reckon I might cut it for you." - Mike the Nutcake...........

  144. #144
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    Here, the gentleman spews forth propaganda from his hate hole on an article about a young woman who died on the trail from still unreleased causes (presumably cardiac related)

    Rocklin woman dies on mountain bike trail ride near Auburn | Auburn Journal
    Velofix.com for mobile bike repair in Sac

  145. #145
    Obi
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    Quote Originally Posted by ryanxj View Post
    Here, the gentleman spews forth propaganda from his hate hole on an article about a young woman who died on the trail from still unreleased causes (presumably cardiac related)

    Rocklin woman dies on mountain bike trail ride near Auburn | Auburn Journal
    Huh, must've missed that because from what we can see "Comments" are turned off. Did he make a comment? If so it's nice to see Ms. D's work is still in place and his baloney got shut down yet again.

    Got screenshots of said "propaganda" to share?

  146. #146
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    Whatever happened to Mike Vandeman?-2016-01-03_1630.png


    Anybody have a photo of this guy? It would be nice to recognize the threat before it makes itself obvious.

  147. #147
    J-Flo
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    The first entry on google images is him.

  148. #148
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    Thanks. I'll keep my eyes open. Fortunately (for me at least) it sounds like he would not assault the planet by road tripping out of the bay area. Although it would be kind of fun if Mike and Granite Bay Kathy hooked up.

  149. #149
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    Name:  mv.jpg
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    I knew he'd look something like this. smh

  150. #150
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    Whatever happened to Mike Vandeman?

    Quote Originally Posted by Metamorphic View Post
    Thanks. I'll keep my eyes open. Fortunately (for me at least) it sounds like he would not assault the planet by road tripping out of the bay area. Although it would be kind of fun if Mike and Granite Bay Kathy hooked up.
    Match made in heaven. They could even go polyamorous and add in Jaede M. for a ménage atois of hate.
    Its all Shits and Giggles until somebody Giggles and Shits

  151. #151
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    ^ Terri Sweet might get jealous and kill them all.

  152. #152
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    ......
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Whatever happened to Mike Vandeman?-ter-copy-2-.jpg  


  153. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by squareback View Post
    ......
    For giggles, I decided to Google Terri. Too bad about her husband, but from what I've read about her, he didn't die in his sleep from a heart issue. He WANTED to die to get away from her. The woman is a piece of work.

    Maybe she'll hook up with Mike V. and they'll create some new breed of super-MTB-hater offspring.

    BTW, .031 is like one beer. Now, if it were .31, THEN there could be an issue.
    "And crawling on the planet's face, some insects called, The Human Race..."

  154. #154
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    Terri is a cold and bitter women that spews her hatered like it's a fact. It's narrow-minded people like her that divide all the user groups on the trails. Hopefully she will someday come down off her high horse and see we really can get along if we all try.

  155. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by matuchi View Post
    terri is a cold and bitter women that spews her hatered like it's a fact. It's narrow-minded people like her that divide all the user groups on the trails. Hopefully she will someday fall down head first off her high horse and we can all move on.
    ftfy?

  156. #156
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    Such an idiot...

    I'd like to point out that Vandeman is blogging the apparent discovery of the remains of mountain biker Michael Rust

    MV is such an idiot he doesn't even bother to read that Rust was obviously a victim of a homicide that had nothing to do with mountain bikes.

    Or maybe MV is just a spambot...
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  157. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by pliebenberg View Post
    I'd like to point out that Vandeman is blogging the apparent discovery of the remains of mountain biker Michael Rust

    MV is such an idiot he doesn't even bother to read that Rust was obviously a victim of a homicide that had nothing to do with mountain bikes.

    Or maybe MV is just a spambot...
    He is probably blogging about it because he was kicked off of the Disqus platform completely. He can't comment on the article because the comments are Disqus based. So no Mikey.

  158. #158
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    Congrats Davey, way bigger deal than all this.
    I'm sick of all the Irish stereotypes, as soon as I finish this beer I"m punching someone

  159. #159
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    Did he get banned from U.S. websites completely? He's getting his comeuppance across the pond.

    Teenage mountain biker collides with a tree in Ledbury (From Hereford Times)

  160. #160
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    Quote Originally Posted by AKD View Post
    Did he get banned from U.S. websites completely? He's getting his comeuppance across the pond.

    Teenage mountain biker collides with a tree in Ledbury (From Hereford Times)
    What a tool! He's over there giving us Americans a bad name - I hope they don't think we're all Bonkers like him!

  161. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by matuchi View Post
    What a tool! He's over there giving us Americans a bad name - I hope they don't think we're all Bonkers like him!
    Holy crap! Certified LOONY.

    Thanks for the laughs.
    "합니다 행사에서 디비 판매 합니다 관련해" Lesleybien

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  162. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by mjvande
    The Brits are notoriously ignorant about wildlife and conservation. They filled Australia and New Zealand with exotic species like cats. You confirmed that ignorance. Don't they teach biology in British schools? Or were you just not paying attention?
    Quote Originally Posted by Moreteavicar
    Too right we did.
    Can't dispute that one.
    We also filled America with exotic species like genetically retarded nutters. such as yourself.


    WINNING!

  163. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obi View Post
    WINNING!
    Right? Is Vandemon (sick) Charlie Sheen???
    "합니다 행사에서 디비 판매 합니다 관련해" Lesleybien

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  164. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obi View Post
    WINNING!
    Totally. Spat my drink on the keyboard whilst reading that one.

  165. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by finch platte View Post
    right? Is vandemon (sick) charlie sheen???
    huh?

  166. #166
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    His letter in the comments section is just a copy and paste of every other comment he has ever made going back 10+ years. He cannot come up with any new arguments.

  167. #167
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    Funny comments. I think those Brits are better at internet sparring than we are.

  168. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obi View Post
    WINNING!
    Heh, thanks for sharing that.


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  169. #169
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    Van demon is on the IMBA board of directors

  170. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vaughn View Post
    Van demon is on the IMBA board of directors
    NFW!

    no f'in way?

  171. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohmygato View Post
    Funny comments. I think those Brits are better at internet sparring than we are.
    Waiting form someone to call him a twat versus a twit.

    Quote Originally Posted by dave54 View Post
    His letter in the comments section is just a copy and paste of every other comment he has ever made going back 10+ years. He cannot come up with any new arguments.
    Part of what came into play when he was pulled off Disqus. The accusation was that it was no longer considered even a valid contributor as the cut and paste mirrors spambot behavior. This would incline one to believe his claims that he will be around longer than any of us. He's so incompetent he had to get someone to build him a spambot to continue his tirades so he can attend to more stupid ventures?

  172. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obi View Post
    huh?
    What don't you get? Intentional misspelling of his name so he can't search for his name? The 'sick' misspelling of 'sic', because he is unwell?

    Or the drug-addled Sheen reference, brought on by the 'WINNING' comment?

    Does that help?
    Last edited by Finch Platte; 02-20-2016 at 06:26 PM.
    "합니다 행사에서 디비 판매 합니다 관련해" Lesleybien

    Hogan Lake blog. A section of Hogan Lake trails here.

  173. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finch Platte View Post
    ..Does that help?
    Most certainly does. I've been busy, that whole tie-in flew right over my head.

    LMFAO right now.

  174. #174
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    I just want him to hurry up and die so I can ride my bike across his grave.

    Sounds like the makings of a good group ride!

  175. #175
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    Quote Originally Posted by dave54 View Post

    Sounds like the makings of a good group ride!
    Count me in. Warning: I'll be several beers in, and will need to relieve myself, if you know what I mean and I'm sure you do.
    "합니다 행사에서 디비 판매 합니다 관련해" Lesleybien

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  176. #176
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finch Platte View Post
    Count me in. Warning: I'll be several beers in, and will need to relieve myself, if you know what I mean and I'm sure you do.
    I do not want to stand in line when I need to go.

  177. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finch Platte View Post
    What don't you get? Intentional misspelling of his name so he can't search for his name? The 'sick' misspelling of 'sic', because he is unwell?

    Or the drug-addled Sheen reference, brought on by the 'WINNING' comment?

    Does that help?
    Bruh,

    Don't be a sissy. Spread his name everywhere - that way his online searches return too many results.

    The idea that not writing his name will some how thwart him is both ill conceived and self censoring. Don't let the shitlord win.
    Last edited by iheartbicycles; 02-22-2016 at 09:16 AM.
    Stupid, but sometimes witty. Occasionally brilliant. Slow and fat though.

    Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

  178. #178
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    But it we say his name, he (or at least the boatloads of spam he generates) might appear. 😯

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  179. #179
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    Quote Originally Posted by andytiedye View Post
    But it we say his name, he (or at least the boatloads of spam he generates) might appear. 😯

    Sent from my SM-P900 using Tapatalk
    look at my signature. that's 6,000 posts vandeman will have to read through before he finds anything worth trolling.

    If more people did that, he'd be so overloaded with references that he'd never be able to find anything meaningful to troll.
    Stupid, but sometimes witty. Occasionally brilliant. Slow and fat though.

    Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

  180. #180
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    Quote Originally Posted by iheartbicycles View Post
    look at my signature. that's 6,000 posts vandeman will have to read through before he finds anything worth trolling.
    5900, Chat don't count. So we're clear here, your sigline shows up in search since his name's in it?

    edit: Holy Crap! NICE!!! LMGTFY Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

    *Just added another 3800 to his search platform, it means he's gonna have to do delete mode to remove you and others now. Hahaha!!

  181. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obi View Post
    5900, Chat don't count. So we're clear here, your sigline shows up in search since his name's in it?

    edit: Holy Crap! NICE!!! LMGTFY Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

    *Just added another 3800 to his search platform, it means he's gonna have to do delete mode to remove you and others now. Hahaha!!
    Naive piled on naive right here.

    Vandeman simply searches on mountain biking in news feeds to pick his trolling targets. MTBR signatures have no effect on those results.

    If you truly want to see the result of the ineffectual "signature gambit" you need to search only his name, not the 'Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong' dealio.

    Let me google that for you

  182. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by GhostOfForumsPast View Post

    (Weak sock-puppet reply.)
    Whatever Pete. I can respect the fact I<3 is making fun of him and trolling him down.

    Ladies and Gentlemen, Pete Fagerlin.
    Quote Originally Posted by GhostOfForumsPast

    2 Hours Ago
    Thread: Tips on fixing youtube blurriness
    by GhostOfForumsPast

    ..presets, Cineform

    21 Hours Ago
    Thread: Video Cameras
    by GhostOfForumsPast

    ..truly, "looking awkward', I don't give a crap about how my cameras...

    1 Day Ago
    Thread: Tips on fixing youtube blurriness
    by GhostOfForumsPast

    ..glaring errors, HB4s

    1 Day Ago
    Thread: Gimbal with GoPro Protective Case?
    by GhostOfForumsPast

    ..gimbals, affairs

    4 Days Ago
    Thread: Remember Zonic Man?
    by GhostOfForumsPast

    RIP, Dick.


    1 Week Ago
    Thread: Remember Zonic Man?
    by GhostOfForumsPast

    ..grandiosely naive assumption
    Last edited by Obi; 02-23-2016 at 01:39 AM.

  183. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obi View Post
    5900, Chat don't count. So we're clear here, your sigline shows up in search since his name's in it?

    edit: Holy Crap! NICE!!! LMGTFY Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

    *Just added another 3800 to his search platform, it means he's gonna have to do delete mode to remove you and others now. Hahaha!!
    That's what I'm saying. Instead of modifying your behavior and speaking in code - overload his dumb ass.
    Stupid, but sometimes witty. Occasionally brilliant. Slow and fat though.

    Mike Vandeman Sucks Dong

  184. #184
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    I've attempted to summarize and preserve our collective two-decades long experience with Mike Vandeman on my blog. Apologies for the self-promotion, but I thought it might be germane to the topic of this thread.

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  185. #185
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    I was surprised to come across a recent posting of his last week, on an article about some new trails that my Sorba group will be building. SOS.
    This post is a natural product. Variances in spelling & grammar should be appreciated as part of its character & beauty.

  186. #186
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    He's like Prince Humperdink. The king's evil son.

    Humperdink, Humperdink, Humperdink...

    Vendeman, Vandeman, Vandeman!
    "And crawling on the planet's face, some insects called, The Human Race..."

  187. #187
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    Please - let's not tempt fate. I'd be happy to never hear from Vandermoron ever again.

  188. #188
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    He has been pushed to the back burner recently by Kim Jong Un.

    They seem to have a lot in common, though.
    Do not take anything I post seriously. I don't.

  189. #189
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    It's really sad, I mean the guy has and apparently still is putting so much time and effort into his crusade. I'm in Georgia and he found an announcement of my own mt bike group receiving permission to build trails at a new location sooner than I did. It was just an article in a small "newspaper" website. He must spend an incredible amount of time searching the internet for any new trails anywhere that are approved to be built. I'm glad all of his efforts are for nought but his incredible obsession is weird and sad.
    Last edited by chazpat; 05-16-2017 at 02:56 PM.
    This post is a natural product. Variances in spelling & grammar should be appreciated as part of its character & beauty.

  190. #190
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    I wonder if he still likes to put on women's clothing and hang around in bars?

  191. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by TahoeBC View Post
    I wonder if he still likes to put on women's clothing and hang around in bars?
    great reference



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  192. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by TahoeBC View Post
    I wonder if he still likes to put on women's clothing and hang around in bars?
    No, 'cause then he'd be "ok".

    He's not ok.
    This post is a natural product. Variances in spelling & grammar should be appreciated as part of its character & beauty.

  193. #193
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    *Bear in mind Captain Nimby also has minions who blindly follow lame-ass leader and are partially responsible for the cut and paste commentary. One could easily setup a spambot to serve the same function. If you see a post with his name just flame away and report the post or complain enough until the post(s) are deleted or someone gives up. At the end of the day he's only as powerful as you make him. All I can say in brief is after a recent personal interaction where he was told flat-out to remove himself from my and another person's immediate presence I've come to realize that he's not just mentally feeble but physically. Jackass is aging out quickly. Match his lunacy with metered intelligence and a calm presentation and he's forced out of the picture in short order.
    Last edited by Obi; 04-16-2017 at 09:58 PM.

  194. #194
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    This is all a reminder to be a responsible trail user. If you guys keep resurecting this thread, I will stump speech about Mt Biker bad behavior. Some of us go too fast on multi use trails in the Bay Area. We piss off and scare hikers, and I get reprimanded at least once a month for "taking a wrong turn". So try not to be a STRAVA hero unless you send a buddy down the trail 1st, to look for hikers. There is always someone faster than you. Weekends at some local parks I see a few Mt bikers going way too fast for hikers to deal with. Vandeman is a lost soul, but we can accomodate other trail users that only hate us a little. Now go ride fast BEHIND your buddy.

  195. #195
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    ^ Well said, hoolie!

    As far as prolific anti-MTB trolls go, Vandeman has been replaced by McMahon.

    157K hits for McMahon:
    https://www.google.com/search?source...69i57.9344j0j8

    8.3K hits for Vandeman:
    https://www.google.com/search?rlz=1C...k1.WSZvKGkyagg

  196. #196
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    Mike is currently trolling an online news story about a UK based xc charity mountain bike ride that raises money for the air ambulance. Hundred enjoy The Beast mountain bike challenge in Hamsterley Forest (From The Northern Echo)

    Mike isn't winning.

  197. #197
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    [QUOTE=Empty_Beer;13128249]^ Well said, hoolie!

    As far as prolific anti

    As anyone investigated whether McMahon is not in fact a pseudonym for MV?
    The agenda sure seems similar and the troll approach consistent.

  198. #198
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    [QUOTE=chasejj;13170624]
    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Beer View Post
    ^ Well said, hoolie!

    As far as prolific anti

    As anyone investigated whether McMahon is not in fact a pseudonym for MV?
    The agenda sure seems similar and the troll approach consistent.
    The writing styles seem different. However, they could be in communication with each other, coordinating their childish tantrums.
    Do not take anything I post seriously. I don't.

  199. #199
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    [QUOTE=chasejj;13170624]
    Quote Originally Posted by Empty_Beer View Post
    ^ Well said, hoolie!

    As far as prolific anti

    As anyone investigated whether McMahon is not in fact a pseudonym for MV?
    The agenda sure seems similar and the troll approach consistent.
    McMahon is not MV. They have communicated but Todd isn't quite as extreme as Mike. Mike shared his legal papers on his "incident" with Todd, which Todd shared with the World Wide Web. Mike is definitely a wacko, but believe it or not, he's far more intelligent than our buddy from Wisconsin ;-)

  200. #200
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    That's not saying much...

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