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  1. #1
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    Norcal Coronavirus poll

    Anonymous poll as of March 18, 2020. We'll close the poll after a couple days since the issue and perception is so dynamic.
    Last edited by fc; 03-20-2020 at 06:04 PM.
    IPA will save America

  2. #2
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    The public is overreacting because the government is fear-mongering.

    The elected officials are touting the worst-case scenario as the expected outcome.
    Do not take anything I post seriously. I don't.

  3. #3
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    My answer: The virus should be taken seriously, but the media is overreacting and creating the problem.

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    It's an issue for sure, but also a lot of political CYA, heard mentality and media hype.

  5. #5
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    My wife is a surgeon. I have a second row seat to the daily briefings, the local progression, the data coming in from other areas (Italy, Seattle, etc), the reallocation of resources. This shit is as real as it gets.

    Is there tons of fear because of media cycles, where there might otherwise be composed and measured responses? Sure. Does that make it a hoax or overreacting? No.

    Hell, it's finally got national attention, maybe maybe far enough in advance to make a dent in the impact. Of course that means later the doubters maybe maybe get to be smug about their assertions that this was all ridiculous. If I have to suffer from smug ignorance so fewer people die, fine by me. But if anyone's smugness puts my wife's life in danger because of flouting the guidelines, helping to push the transmission curve up and flooding the hospitals, they can go f^¢k themselves.

    Look, I'm still gonna go ride, even with my kids, maintaining 10 feet and all that. But generally ignoring this or downplaying it because of a lack of trust modern media outlets is going to kill people, full stop.

  6. #6
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    I work for a major healthcare organization.

    The organization is doing all it can to prepare for the onslaught of patients that will be coming in. It will be an all-hands-on-deck effort, with office workers (like me) being asked to help with critical health care operations. With the global supply chain disruptions, as well as the expected resource issues (as employees/health care providers get sick) the job is going be even harder.

    With the lack of testing in the US, nobody really knows the extent of the issue. But call center data suggests a much larger scope than is being currently reported.

    If we're lucky, in few months people will say that we overreacted.
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  7. #7
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    Learning how people react to such infectious disease is good for policy-making to better handle another pandemic, such as another Spanish Flu. Can be so much better prepared.

    Fear-mongering is a common way to disrupt complacency and get more onboard with change. People are questioning if this fear is even valid. This reminds me of how people said everyone overreacted to y2k, as if the world was going to end, but to their perspective, nothing happened. They might have said it was fear-mongering. They probably were ignorant of all the work done to reach that outcome.

    In this case, it exposes a lot of flaws in the private medical system, among others. There just isn't enough medical resource to support so many people seeking med attention, so they're saying to not come in unless things are very severe and life-threatening. Political world taking advantage of all this. The whole "business as usual" attitude was also criticized. Some got a good look at work-at-home. It's been a stress test for all sorts of systems...

    Not sure if people know that a lot of infectious/contagious disease can be spread even if the infected shows no symptoms, and recognize how dangerous that is. Heck, I'm not sure if people know how interdependent everyone, individually, is on other humans in society, and if they should care if others survive.

    Noticing more taboo things being brought up, including automation replacing humans. Odd seeing people defending the sale/marketing of fake remedies and other predatory business practicing (inc. price gouging) as fair and guilt-free. Concepts like military-style triage, where those with the highest survivability rate are prioritized, are brought up. The economics of this, regarding how to minimize cost, is pretty fascinating, regarding how much a half-assed or delayed approach can cost way more than a more all-out effort from the beginning. Doesn't help that people are going "conspiracy!", or "it's fine, the panic/fear is affecting me/us more than the pandemic", rather than "lets kick this pandemic's ass" (e.g. choosing the last option in this poll).
    "The challenge is not in developing new ideas, but in escaping old ideas."

  8. #8
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    i vote we full court press to stop this thing. at the end if we over-reacted, so be it. i am good with that.

    my wife is a public health nurse. it's all hands on deck right now and they transferred everyone to the CDC dept. the calls and follow ups, seem to be going up in numbers. she isnt allowed to tell me anything..but i can read her body language and she tells me she was on the phone 8 hours straight.

    as a community..a worldwide community. LETS DO THIS!! the tiny island of Taiwan acted fast, acted hard, with resolve. they are so far ahead of this thing..and we had a 2 month head's up!! they had 2 weeks.
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  9. #9
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    #5

    I've been following this thing since December and when you read the perspectives of those in Italy, Spain and France it is really hard to not see the writing on the wall. I closed my shop Monday night, then worked hard all day Tuesday dealing with the fallout of that decision while seeing so many other shops still open. I'm feeling pressured by the community to re-open and probably will. And yet, I wholeheartedly clicked #5. We haven't even seen the tip of the iceberg yet.

    The truth is, we'll probably only be open for a few days until the National Guard steps in and makes the hard decisions for us all. I fear for all of us and our families, our friends and our colleagues. I fear the consequences of zero cash flow and how that will affect my 21 employees and our suppliers.

    The fear I have is not from watching newsertainment, crazed media or any doomsayer social posts. My fear is based on the lack of preparedness and knowledge of what is going down. I hope we are moving fast enough to avoid the worst case scenarios and folks will have the luxury of saying, told ya so.

    Head for the hills, and do not take many chances...
    “Everything will be okay in the end. If it's not okay, it's not the end.”
    -John Lennon

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    This is likely the biggest threat to the country since WW2. We better hope the president and congress do everything they can to keep us going. The bailout is the biggest in history, this is no joke.

  11. #11
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    Who are the 3 "hoax" voters? Please explain.
    I'm the problem....

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    This is very real. Nobody designs ERs for this level of occupancy, duration and specific modalities (breathing machines for eg). Lack of testing capacity makes it nigh impossible to better advise isolation or inform ones social/professional circle of contact. Shelter in place and lockdowns are unfortunately the only way to go.

  13. #13
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    Thank you for that, Lars.

    I hope you--and all of us--can ride this one out.

    "Live gently and don't take chances" will have to suffice for a while.
    "I will absolutely apologize hopefully sometime in the distant future if I'm ever wrong." ~ Donnie Bonespurs

  14. #14
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    My greatgrandfather died in Philly during the 1918 spanish flu epidemic. I always through it was a tough flu and that is why he died but look up the history of it. The number one thing done wrong in the US was for elected officials lied about the severity of it, the preparedness of the US, and its spread rates.

    The virus spread to Philadelphia on September 19, 1918, through the Philadelphia Navy Yard, UPenn states. In a matter of days, 600 sailors had the virus.
    Yet Philadelphia didn't cancel its Liberty Loan Parade, scheduled for just a little more than a week later. Meant to be a patriotic wartime effort, the parade went on as scheduled on September 28, bringing 200,000 Philadelphians together.

    By October 1, there were 635 new cases in Philadelphia, according to UPenn.

    Philadelphia was one of the hardest-hit US cities. More than 12,000 people died in six weeks, with about 47,000 reported cases, according to UPenn. By the six-month mark, about 16,000 had died and there were more than half a million cases.

    My grandfather probably wished this had been different.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Callender View Post
    Thank you for that, Lars.

    I hope you--and all of us--can ride this one out.

    "Live gently and don't take chances" will have to suffice for a while.
    Hmmm, we could temporarily change our motto to;

    "Ride slow,,, fake chances,,,"

    Or how 'bout
    "Ride like a coward,,, keep your distance,,,,"

    Awe shit, those are lame...
    “Everything will be okay in the end. If it's not okay, it's not the end.”
    -John Lennon

  16. #16
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    ^ Yeah, just not quite the same.

    I'll be talking to you about a Levo SL in the near future.
    "I will absolutely apologize hopefully sometime in the distant future if I'm ever wrong." ~ Donnie Bonespurs

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtbrdan View Post
    Who are the 3 "hoax" voters? Please explain.
    Honest suggestion for @FC - ban the people who say its a hoax.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtbrdan View Post
    Who are the 3 "hoax" voters? Please explain.
    Read a few threads and you'll probably figure out who the 3 are.
    There are a few outspoken.
    I don't want to have to read their dumba.... comments again.

    I think the few that are closed minded, and expressed it here on the forum, should be 14 days banned. Only because it servers only one purpose which is to create arguments.

  19. #19
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    Now way. I'm not in support of banning people just because they have a different opinion, regardless of how uninformed it is. I'm surprised people would even bring this up.

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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by NRP View Post
    Now way. I'm not in support of banning people just because they have a different opinion, regardless of how uninformed it is. I'm surprised people would even bring this up.

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    It's an abuse of freedom of speech to spread misinformation about something so serious, sowing discord, and doing damage to society. They are ignorant to the damage they are causing, so they don't feel guilt. Without any feedback to suggest this is bad, they will think they're innocent.

    The action can be justified based on a sense of urgency and timing, raising general behavior standards. I would not object if crisis management took priority over maintaining the purity of such seemingly sacred constitutional human rights.
    "The challenge is not in developing new ideas, but in escaping old ideas."

  21. #21
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    The defense against that is facts and reasoned discourse/rebuttal. Not censorship.

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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by NRP View Post
    Now way. I'm not in support of banning people just because they have a different opinion, regardless of how uninformed it is. I'm surprised people would even bring this up.

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    The ignant shall be shutdown, and sterilized...

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by NRP View Post
    The defense against that is facts and reasoned discourse/rebuttal. Not censorship.

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    How naive. Facts and reason don't work against those types. They will only cover their eyes and ears and preach louder, to drown contradiction out, possibly even reinforcing their stance if anything can be interpreted to support their belief. Surely you've seen this pattern, where an "argument" between people just has each person stating their belief and each defending theirs, and it usually ends in a fallacy where you "agree to disagree", nothing changing except one side loses face for stooping to the level of the lower one and them making fun of you for such.

    The backfire effect and confirmation bias is strong in them.
    "The challenge is not in developing new ideas, but in escaping old ideas."

  24. #24
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    This is real.

    It's not a Hoax.

    Don't look at the data from China. It's not creditable.

    Do look at what is happening in Europe for how it can go here.

    Running out of respirators and hospital beds, nationally, is real, very real.

  25. #25
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    Norcal Coronavirus poll-screen-shot-2020-03-18-9.35.49-pm.jpg

  26. #26
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    I voted 3. I believe that the unprecedented aggressive action that we're taking now will do the job. I bet this thing will be waning by May. I hope I don't eat these words. No matter what happens, this will be a massive learning experience for everyone around the world.

  27. #27
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    Yeah, why is this even a poll? This virus is not a thing to lightly have opinions about, like a reality show, it's a thing to be educated about and respond appropriately. Setting up a poll where a bogus answer like "it's a hoax" is given the same weight as it being a critical issue isn't a responsible use of a platform like this. It sets up false dichotomies and empowers naysayers and conspiracy theorists. Same reason I never read the comments on news stories: A journalist spends days meticulously researching a story, the results of that careful work are published, and then some jackass gets to vomit his knee jerk reaction on the same page? Sets up a dangerous false equivalency. Just like this poll.

  28. #28
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    Great exchange so far. I am encouraged by Norcal mountain bikers.

    Two weeks ago, I discovered that about half my good friends did not believe this pandemic was real. They kept saying the 'common cold' or the flu killed more people last year.

    Given that I've researched this virus since January because of trips to South Africa and Spain, I was disheartened. I knew there existed many doubters but my close friends???

    It is a process of learning, understanding and changing one's viewpoint on a subject they know very little about. Change has occurred but it's not complete, even in my circle.

    People, skeptics in particular will only listen to folks they can relate too. The Joe Rogan video did that for a lot of my crew. It's not the deepest knowledge but it is relatable to most. 11 million views and it's finally turned a lot of folks around.

    IPA will save America

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott M View Post
    Yeah, why is this even a poll? This virus is not a thing to lightly have opinions about, like a reality show, it's a thing to be educated about and respond appropriately. Setting up a poll where a bogus answer like "it's a hoax" is given the same weight as it being a critical issue isn't a responsible use of a platform like this. It sets up false dichotomies and empowers naysayers and conspiracy theorists. Same reason I never read the comments on news stories: A journalist spends days meticulously researching a story, the results of that careful work are published, and then some jackass gets to vomit his knee jerk reaction on the same page? Sets up a dangerous false equivalency. Just like this poll.
    I appreciate this poll because all viewpoints are represented. If someone wants to answer that 'it's a hoax', so be it. It should have absolutely no effect on an intelligent human being's opinion and you shouldn't take offense with it. It is merely a data point, and that is all. Just because someone like Vermin Supreme appears on a presidential ballot, doesn't mean you have to vote for him.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott M View Post
    Yeah, why is this even a poll? This virus is not a thing to lightly have opinions about, like a reality show, it's a thing to be educated about and respond appropriately. Setting up a poll where a bogus answer like "it's a hoax" is given the same weight as it being a critical issue isn't a responsible use of a platform like this. It sets up false dichotomies and empowers naysayers and conspiracy theorists. Same reason I never read the comments on news stories: A journalist spends days meticulously researching a story, the results of that careful work are published, and then some jackass gets to vomit his knee jerk reaction on the same page? Sets up a dangerous false equivalency. Just like this poll.
    It gauges what people believe and who they're listening to. And it documents where we are in the process of taking action. One month ago, most Americans did not believe this was a real concern, let alone two months.

    In two weeks, we will be in a very, very different place.
    IPA will save America

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Great exchange so far. I am encouraged by Norcal mountain bikers.

    Two weeks ago, I discovered that about half my good friends did not believe this pandemic was real. They kept saying the 'common cold' or the flu killed more people last year.
    ]
    At this moment that is still a true statement. I don't feel most feel the virus is fake, but whether a response this extreme is warranted. After 4 months less than %0.005 of China's population have been infected. The death totals are still small when compared to many causes of death we deal with on a regular basis.

    I'm not saying the response isn't warranted, but I'm also not going to belittle opinions that might differ from mine, because the reality is people don't know.

    Is it worth the possible deaths, family hardships, economic hardships for many years to come that will be a result of a response this extreme? That is what some question,. I think it's important to have discourse and people willing to challenge the validity of policy makes.

    600,000 Americans will die this year of cancer. The total monetary cost of the response to covid to the country is going to dwarf 1000x+ the money spent to help cure cancer and help cancer patients. Will covid eclipse 600,000 deaths in America this year?? If not, some might question why some life's are worth extreme measures to save but not others?? Will it eclipse total deaths from common flu? There are reasons to be skeptical.....

  32. #32
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    I work for a healthcare manufacturer and I took some of the threat lightly for awhile. The levity of the situation started for me about 2 weeks ago as I engaged with my healthcare orgs about this. I am in full blown 14hr days trying to solve supply issues, delivery logistics, distributor issues, doing things Ive never seen in this industry to help ramp up for the onslaught of patients coming. This is for real.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by SikeMo View Post
    I appreciate this poll because all viewpoints are represented. If someone wants to answer that 'it's a hoax', so be it. It should have absolutely no effect on an intelligent human being's opinion and you shouldn't take offense with it. It is merely a data point, and that is all. Just because someone like Vermin Supreme is running for president, doesn't mean you have to vote for him.
    I appreciate that SikeMo. So now, I will share my bombshell.

    I participate in an RC Car Channel and we ran this exact same poll this morning. We now have almost 600 votes and the demographic is mostly middle America, older men that play with expensive toy cars. Some international folks too.

    Do not cry but here is the results data from today.



    The greatest weapon of the Coronavirus it's very contagious while one is NOT showing any symptoms. Its second greatest weapon is the denial of the public, perhaps because one does not turn into a zombie and it requires a little bit of insight to understand where it's going. We need to fight both.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Norcal Coronavirus poll-screen-shot-2020-03-18-9.49.26-pm.png  

    IPA will save America

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by NRP View Post
    The defense against that is facts and reasoned discourse/rebuttal. Not censorship.

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    I agree. There shouldn't be any banning of people that have a difference of opinion or voted #1. I voted #3.

  35. #35
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    To me, the scariest part of the coronavirus is that it attacks the lungs. The people who are most critically affect need assistance breathing. Definitely not the flu.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by dave54 View Post
    The public is overreacting because the government is fear-mongering.

    The elected officials are touting the worst-case scenario as the expected outcome.
    I disagree. What I hear from our elected officials (excluding the WH) is that if we all do our part to stay safe, we can perhaps avoid the "worst-case scenario" ie: what happened in Italy.

    I don't know really. It's a mutated virus so no one really knows wtf is going to happen next. I do know that for many years I have ridden with a group of 5 on Wed nights that I call "The Inner Circle" and in today's text, I had to politely decline tonights ride. I rode by myself and instead of awesome conversation and good trails with old friends, I got that lonesome, I'm gonna get eaten by a big cat vibe and then some fun, muddy DH action. Win some lose some. The weirdness is palpable though.....

  37. #37
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    Norcal Coronavirus poll

    Quote Originally Posted by ScottParsley View Post
    I disagree. What I hear from our elected officials (excluding the WH) is that if we all do our part to stay safe, we can perhaps avoid the "worst-case scenario" ie: what happened in Italy.

    I don't know really. It's a mutated virus so no one really knows wtf is going to happen next. I do know that for many years I have ridden with a group of 5 on Wed nights that I call "The Inner Circle" and in today's text, I had to politely decline tonights ride. I rode by myself and instead of awesome conversation and good trails with old friends, I got that lonesome, I'm gonna get eaten by a big cat vibe and then some fun, muddy DH action. Win some lose some. The weirdness is palpable though.....
    Agreed. Appreciate your share. This will affect us and it will harm most of our circles. Not just sickness but economicically and menatalky too. Maybe we develop a greater appreciation for everything.
    IPA will save America

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by aliikane View Post
    To me, the scariest part of the coronavirus is that it attacks the lungs. The people who are most critically affect need assistance breathing. Definitely not the flu.
    Yes, we have no immunity and there is no medicine. The only measure is to turn the dying upside down with a ventilator cranked up.

    And then the key is how everyone infected is a carrier 5 days before they start showing symptoms
    IPA will save America

  39. #39
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    We had someone test positive late last week and it shut down everything. Ive been on mandatory telework/leave the first three days of the work week. Today it was mandatory that we come back to the office to gather materials, sign and get approval of alternative work schedule paper work. It is what it is....

  40. #40
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    I am still public-facing and taking this shit seriously. In the end of this wave (when there is actually some data based on an legit sample size) I still believe that the death rate will be low - well under 2%, but that 75% of people will have had it. That is a significant number of fatalities. I could be totally wrong. This is the best thing that has happened for the environment in 100 years. Earth can finally breathe a littler easier - for now. The real existential threat is the bad case of H0m0 Sapiens spreading all over this planet........but eventually that will pass.
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  41. #41
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    I believe this is about as serious as it gets. No time for the blame game right now, that should come later..My sister in law probably has it, she's been tested and has classic symptoms but not a bad case as most are not. She has no idea where she got it. There are two crises right now..one medical, the other economic. Both deserve a 100% effort over the next few months. The question is whether we have taken these draconian responses in time to keep it from getting as bad as it could be. I sure hope so, and would love it if the second guessers are out in force in a couple months saying we didn't need to take all these steps. Right now the economic damage is in most ways worse, but that can probably be mostly fixed if the medical situation does not get out of control. I'm going for a mtn bike ride this afternoon even though it will be muddy. I just need to feel the wind on my face, even if it also means getting some cow poop splattered on me!

  42. #42
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    I spent most of the day Tuesday drafting and editing and redrafting and re-editing my company's response and instructions for our crew.

    While we're in a profession that has been deemed "Essential Services", we're telling our guys to stop looking for the excuse to work. We're asking them instead to look at the job they're on and if it's essential for the institution they're at to maintain services if/when this thing blows up. If it is, we're staying on the job. If it's not, we're asking our guys to stay home and be safe. If an individual feels that the threat to them and their family is too great, we're advising them to stay home.

    We're offering them the reduced hour unemployment option and we'll maintain their healthcare benefit (including their part) for as long as they're out.

    Our office has a fairly small staff and we can maintain some distance from one another while we're in. We've stepped up our hygiene in the office and are working from home as much as we can.
    "And crawling on the planet's face, some insects called, The Human Race..."

  43. #43
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    Smaller proactive initial steps would have significantly reduced what will happen later.

  44. #44
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    This poll shows how stupid humanity is. Faced with facts there are those that refuse knowledge. These will be the people spreading the virus, killing others.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Agreed. Appreciate your share. This will affect us and it will harm most of our circles. Not just sickness but economicically and menatalky too. Maybe we develop a greater appreciation for everything.
    bad thing is this is just the beginning. I was laid off yesterday. Its going to get much worse before it gets better. I am ticked off they let me go, but at the same time, it may have saved me for now as I deal with the public.

    Hopefully the malaria medicine pans out and we get a handle on this. Good thing is with our endurance, we may be able to fight this better then the general public if we get it.

  46. #46
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    Funny to hear people want someone banned for 'abuse of freedom of speech'. Twatter, FB, mtbr, every platform that has comments - is a virus of it's own with people abusing fos 24/7. Guess you cross a line if it has to do with an outbreak. Must have missed this in Freedom of Speech 101 in college. Amazing. People can have scathing political opinions or even scarier, an opinion on whether or not ebikes are good or bad. Nobody gets banned for it, no matter how vitriol.

    It is real, it isn't a hoax. It's making people bat shit crazy. Global economic impact overnight. I agree with SikeMo - i'm optimistic that the craziness will settle down in a few weeks. I'm not very optimistic about job security for so many people, even if there is a bad recession that recovers quick.

    But such is life - the sun will rise and fall.

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    My occupation is transportation of perishable commodities. Fresh Produce, namely. I've been in this industry for most of my life. Prior to transportation, I worked directly on the production side, harvest, post harvest and food safety. Cold chain distribution and supply is my specialty, essentially. During my tenure, my business has worked through every outbreak to face our fresh food supply since 1999. You name it, e-coli, mad cow, H1N1, listeria.. Not to mention 9/11 where the fresh produce industry and the families of distributors, such as retailers and wholesalers adopted the Bio-Terrorism packing slips and tractability standards to gain back the public trust. Each of these separate measures contributed to food safety protocol making it law that US growers adhere to any needs necessary to protect the food supply. Those measures that were adopted from experience are in full effect today and they are working in favor of the people, right... now...

    The one instance of food borne illness that sticks out in my mind, is tainted Spinach in 2009. The world gave two shits about spinach, but they all cared about the media portrayal and the negative press, which instantly spilled over to every other green vegetable there was. The fresh market collapsed and small companies with shallow pockets were wiped out over fear from the general public. The existing growers and shippers took measures beyond just discing the tainted leaf back into the ground and damage control. They took action, and closed facilities, built new, state of the art facilities that ran on new technology and could be better disinfected investing into the future in preparation. Before the Feds could even react, US growers were designing and implementing solutions to protect our food supply.
    They created test and hold procedures that incubated samples, and each shipper that packed any fresh cut, leafy greens into a sealed bag could be assured their product was safe. Shelf life went from 21 days to 14 in order to ensure freshness. Shippers also mandated demand for trailer washouts and demanded certificates of said washout at time of shipping and the chemical used. Every point of contact was recorded, and every head of (lettuce) moved was now traceable in order to keep our food supply safe.

    Having experienced this firsthand myself, I say to you, welcome to the fight against the invisible enemy. If you are concerned about the food supply, you should be, that's good human nature. If you are not, good for you, too, because we farmers, growers, packers and shippers are doing our job to make you feel safe, and keep it that way.

    I don't represent any particular entity, nor am I pushing you to eat vegetables, but I thought some may take comfort knowing there are some people working right now, that kick ass at fighting these kind of things. The smartest people.. The best people.. As we enter into this strange time, I am reminded of the several, and I mean several instances where the food supply could have been compromised. Like our farmers and ranchers, this situation, requires the highest level of caution there can possibly be.

    In the immortal words of Zack De La Rocha "Don't turn away, get in front of it"...

    TWM-

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    Excellent post, rep-worthy for all. I've apparently repped you in the past, but alls' I can say is "Well said!"
    Just call me Ray

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    Here's an interesting live infographic:

    https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/a...23467b48e9ecf6

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    How this is viewed surely depends to some degree on each persons situation. At 72 with a history of adult onset asthma and on crutches for the last two months makes me feel pretty helpless and threatened. If I were 30 and healthy, I'd be finding someway to ride even if only in the farm fields nearby. I hope I will be riding here, at least slowly, in the next few weeks.

    Stay healthy, stay busy
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  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by BraaapTastic View Post
    Here's an interesting live infographic:

    https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/a...23467b48e9ecf6
    Hey DH40, where is that one you posted with all the stuff a while back?

  52. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Outhouse View Post
    bad thing is this is just the beginning. I was laid off yesterday. Its going to get much worse before it gets better. I am ticked off they let me go, but at the same time, it may have saved me for now as I deal with the public.

    Hopefully the malaria medicine pans out and we get a handle on this. Good thing is with our endurance, we may be able to fight this better then the general public if we get it.
    Hang in there, dude - that's gotta be so rough having your income stream affected in the midst of this situation.

  53. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by twowheelmotion View Post
    Hey DH40, where is that one you posted with all the stuff a while back?
    Um....maybe this one? My friend sent it to be to scare me:

    https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

    They are better known for all their other crazy data-ometers:

    https://www.worldometers.info/

    They are also listed as a drive-by sketchy browser extension site so mind where you click!

  54. #54
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    We'll never know how many people really 'Recovered' because we will never be tested so resist drawing conclusions from the Infected/Recovered ratio that causes so much BS info to spread. JMO.

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    The main thing that people need to realize about COVID-19 is that there is zero immunity against it. Just because you got it and recovered doesn't mean that you are not going to get it again.

    My uncle is the chief of staff at a major regional hospital in another country and he's told me that just because you got covid doesn't mean you can't get it again. Plus, it will be more dangerous the second time if you get it while you are still recovering because your immune system will be weakened.

    In the end this is a flu. Flu viruses mutate very easily and the more people that get it the more likely it is to mutate. The longer we go without containing this thing the easier it gets for it to wipe out a massive amount of the human population because of mutation.

  56. #56
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    US is now a hot spot for coronavirus. It passed S. Korea in just a few days. The case count for the US was only a couple thousand a few days ago, now it is over 11K. Not good.

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    Dr. Wife just got in from a shift. Her surgery duties cover 3 South Bay / Santa Clara County hospitals. One of 'em with a substantial (~20 bed) ICU is now full of 'rona patients.
    Damn.

    Granted that's a single data point, but if the ICUs are already reaching official capacity we are in for a long slog. This thing is nowhere near peaked. Stay at home, kids.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by davee5 View Post
    Dr. Wife just got in from a shift. Her surgery duties cover 3 South Bay / Santa Clara County hospitals. One of 'em with a substantial (~20 bed) ICU is now full of 'rona patients.
    Damn.

    Granted that's a single data point, but if the ICUs are already reaching official capacity we are in for a long slog. This thing is nowhere near peaked. Stay at home, kids.
    I happen to know that hotels in San Mat Co have already been housing hospital overflow from SF and other areas. More to come for sure.

  59. #59
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    If there's anyone in the Stockton area looking for work, I know of 2 places that are hiring. Warehouse/forklift action.
    “The further a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”

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  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radium View Post
    Excellent post, rep-worthy for all. I've apparently repped you in the past, but alls' I can say is "Well said!"
    Did it for ya.
    “The further a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”

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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeWHayduke View Post
    Honest suggestion for @FC - ban the people who say its a hoax.
    Quote Originally Posted by Varaxis View Post
    It's an abuse of freedom of speech to spread misinformation about something so serious, sowing discord, and doing damage to society. They are ignorant to the damage they are causing, so they don't feel guilt. Without any feedback to suggest this is bad, they will think they're innocent.

    The action can be justified based on a sense of urgency and timing, raising general behavior standards. I would not object if crisis management took priority over maintaining the purity of such seemingly sacred constitutional human rights.

    People tripping over themselves to ask for censorship and surrendering of their own rights, looks like this hoax was successful after all. This is California of course though, you were probably doing that before this virus anyway.


    Also not a big surprise, both the media and our elected officials are handling this is the most convoluted and unnecessarily vague way possible. Take Taiwan as an example, they have a daily briefing, go over new cases, explain the case details without violating the privacy of those people, it's not difficult to do. Now let's look at the Marin IJ - Article from 2 days ago, cases up to 15. Yesterday, radio silence. Today, 2 people kicked off a golf course is the top news, then a few mins ago count goes to 25. How many people were tested yesterday? Today? "Community spread" means nothing, were these roommates of people off the cruise ship? Complete random chance? Uber driver? Why not pseudononymize the data and share it? Is this hard to do? Of course not. https://focustaiwan.tw/society/202003065001

  62. #62
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    Newsom has lost the plot. Misdemeanors for non essential activities.

    'Californians are not allowed to leave home except for essential purposes. They are allowed to purchase groceries, prescriptions and health care, as well as commute to jobs deemed essential.'

    'The governor's order comes with misdemeanor penalties for anyone who violates the restrictions, though he said he believes social pressure will keep people home rather than law enforcement.'

    Not sure if this is just shelter in place for the state or if it's a step up.

    https://www.politico.com/states/cali...ckdown-1268248

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    Quote Originally Posted by SikeMo View Post
    Newsom has lost the plot. Misdemeanors for non essential activities.

    'Californians are not allowed to leave home except for essential purposes. They are allowed to purchase groceries, prescriptions and health care, as well as commute to jobs deemed essential.'

    'The governor's order comes with misdemeanor penalties for anyone who violates the restrictions, though he said he believes social pressure will keep people home rather than law enforcement.'

    Not sure if this is just shelter in place for the state or if it's a step up.

    https://www.politico.com/states/cali...ckdown-1268248
    This is what's needed. Do you want CA to become another Italy? If people don't want to listen the easy then they're going to listen the hard way.

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  64. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by SikeMo View Post
    Newsom has lost the plot. Misdemeanors for non essential activities.

    'Californians are not allowed to leave home except for essential purposes. They are allowed to purchase groceries, prescriptions and health care, as well as commute to jobs deemed essential.'

    'The governor's order comes with misdemeanor penalties for anyone who violates the restrictions, though he said he believes social pressure will keep people home rather than law enforcement.'

    Not sure if this is just shelter in place for the state or if it's a step up.

    https://www.politico.com/states/cali...ckdown-1268248
    That's been the rule in Bay Area for the past week.

    They don't highlight that part of the order, but if you real the whole thing that's what the Emergency Power means. It's not just "please", it's "must". And a misdemeanor not to.

    I guess they could have had it be a civil infraction or something, but presumably they want the ability to arrest truly severe cases? I am not a lawyer/criminal justice expert.

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    Unfortunately the Politico article is a bit misleading and doesn't report the whole picture. However I do believe it's a bit ridiculous to charge misdemeanors in this situation. I'm not even sure how enforceable it would be. Good luck.

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    I read an article from another news outlet and was left feeling like this is a reasonable decision. I dont think the cops are going to go overboard with writing tickets, but it's a tool that they have to enforce social distancing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sa12 View Post
    I read an article from another news outlet and was left feeling like this is a reasonable decision. I dont think the cops are going to go overboard with writing tickets, but it's a tool that they have to enforce social distancing.
    I think the most likely enforcement is to break up and large groups they see engaging in close quarters. For example, the basketball courts were in full use this afternoon when I drove by a popular park.

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    If you listen to it at least twice it will get stuck in your head.
    https://www.instagram.com/tv/B94Kbkj...d=q97xqntgwz84

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    Anyone know where I can read the executive order in full?

    The link on ca.gov is broken, as well the executive order page (which seems like some divine irony).

  70. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by shapethings View Post
    Anyone know where I can read the executive order in full?.
    https://covid19.ca.gov/img/Executive-Order-N-33-20.pdf

    It's actually quite succinct, it's likely your county was more explicit in details, qualifications, and explanations. As read this is simply "stay home, unless you're part of the war effort."

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    Weird, that link didn't work a minute ago. Just read it on wikipedia.

    Yes, the bay area one was much more detailed.

    So it is basically the same, from SF Chronicle, you can still exercise, just maintain social distancing.

    Someone needs to tell runners to get off the sidewalks. They're exhaling more during the activity and I've had many run right by me the last two days. Thanks jerks.

    SF Chronicle:

    "The order is similar to the shelter-in-place rules that Bay Area residents have been living under since Monday, allowing people to visit the grocery store, seek medical care, walk outside and exercise if they maintain social distance from others. It will force countless businesses in the state deemed nonessential to close their doors temporarily."

    https://www.sfchronicle.com/politics...s-15144649.php

  72. #72
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    I was supposed to go home to the Bay Area this weekend but it doesn't look like that's going to happen for a while. I prefer to listen to scientists and doctors when it comes to things I don't totally comprehend instead of forming my own opinion based on editorials.

    For those that believe this is a hoax or overblown, continue believing that until someone you're close to gets the virus and can't find treatment.

  73. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipnidaho View Post
    I was supposed to go home to the Bay Area this weekend but it doesn't look like that's going to happen for a while. I prefer to listen to scientists and doctors when it comes to things I don't totally comprehend instead of forming my own opinion based on editorials.

    For those that believe this is a hoax or overblown, continue believing that until someone you're close to gets the virus and can't find treatment.
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  74. #74
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    This whole thing is a fascinating social study.
    "And crawling on the planet's face, some insects called, The Human Race..."

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    Quote Originally Posted by mbmtb View Post
    That's been the rule in Bay Area for the past week.

    They don't highlight that part of the order, but if you real the whole thing that's what the Emergency Power means. It's not just "please", it's "must". And a misdemeanor not to.

    I guess they could have had it be a civil infraction or something, but presumably they want the ability to arrest truly severe cases? I am not a lawyer/criminal justice expert.
    There has been an increase in crime on the streets*, but they are not after regular people. The Gavinator just duplicated what previously SF did. No big deal.

    *My amateur crime analysis comes from the Citizen app - uptick in robberies, assaults, car-jackings, burglaries, etc. Quite a few of the shuttered businesses (esp bars) have boarded up entries.

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    At least he acknowledges that there is no real data to work with yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckha62 View Post
    This whole thing is a fascinating social study.
    Totally

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    #2 voter here. Media is sensationalizing the news as usual. I'm not going to go super critical on the government actions. I see it as reasonable to try to slow the spread so hospitals are not over whelmed. I think we should be encouraging people to continue to go to work and get outside and exercise (exercise and and sunlight are good for you).

    The scariest thing of all of this is the potential over reaction, economic/societal collapse, loss of liberty and people talking about banning others because they don't like their opinion.

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    Thanks FC!

    As we have no TV, the computer is our source of information. Culling through what is factual and what is not has been daunting.

    We watch The Joe Rogan's Podcast of March 10th (90 min) with Dr. Michael Osterholm (Regents Professor, McKnight Presidential Endowed Chair in Public Health, Director of the Center for Infectious Disease Research and Policy, Distinguished Teaching Professor in the Division of Environmental Health Sciences, School of Public Health) and I feel its viewing important for many. There are no punches pulled. Nothing pretty. This is the science necessary to inform us and to forearm us all.

    I have watch it twice and still could not glean all the pertinent information from his guest. Here is the transcript in its entirety made available 5 days ago. For those who want to read a reputable source (Too bad the WH didn't contact him):

    https://www.rev.com/blog/transcripts...ks-coronavirus

    WE have suspended all our group rides until further notice.

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    I voted #2, but none of the options are exactly in line with my take on the situation. For example, I believe the public is overreacting by hoarding TP and food staples. The economy could be doing better if people didn't freak out.

    However, I also see the public not taking social distancing seriously. The homeless people living on the sidewalk are doing everything they can do spread every disease they can find. Sorry, that is who I see more than anybody because of my neighborhood.

    When I go out riding, most runners and hikers don't even try to stay 6 feet away. Some riders are trying.

    I had to take my cat with an infected tooth to the vet yesterday. You would think nothing out of the ordinary was happening. No hand sanitizer out. Zero effort at social distancing. The vet stood two feet away as she explained the results of the procedure. At least I smelled disinfectant when I went into the room.

  82. #82
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    10% Hoaxers? LOL Even your Fox news should be telling you otherwise (now, anyway).

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    Quote Originally Posted by DH40 View Post
    10% Hoaxers? LOL Even your Fox news should be telling you otherwise (now, anyway).
    I'm truly amazed here! Those 10%er most likely never took a science class.

    Be safe!

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    Quote Originally Posted by 5k bike 50cent legs View Post
    The difference between our Department of Defense and the Department of Health and Human Services is: At least, the former builds the battleship before war even breaks out!

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    Quote Originally Posted by DH40 View Post
    10% Hoaxers? LOL Even your Fox news should be telling you otherwise (now, anyway).
    It's too bad more of the hoaxers don't come out of the woodwork to explain why they think it's a hoax. Could get interesting.
    “The further a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”

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    I think the virus is a huge issue and all resources should be devoted to defeating it. Just a little over a week ago there were just a few isolated cases in California and it seemed possible to live life normally and avoid them, but our state has jumped to extreme measures and more than half the population is still expected to get infected within 8 weeks (see Newsom's speech), so you know it's time to take things very seriously. I think the stat that said 70% of American's were expected to get it was a real wakeup call for me.

    I also think too that while people are saying the death rate isn't that much, seeing videos of hospitals in Italy with people in all sorts of weird equipment (clear helmets that isolate them) and no visitors allowed really makes me realize that even if I don't die, I certainly don't want to get put in the hospital by this virus because it's going to suck if so.

    As an FYI, apparently over 19% of people who get the coronavirus will require hospitalization, so your chance of experiencing the suck is quite high (source: https://www.vox.com/science-and-heal...mparison-chart ). Not only that, but for many being hospitalized will both cost a lot of money for and also result in a lot of lost wages, which is worse than when you could just self quarantined at home and saved money.

    Also, while these death rates are somewhat low for the virus, once hospitals runs short on equipment (some already are?), death rates for the people who are hospitalized could soar because people can't take care of them.

    Currently, since other states aren't self isolating, I am concerned that once the Bay Area lockdown ends on April 7th, infected people from other states will travel here and start infecting people again, ruining the benefits we had of our shelter-in-place. That's why I kind of think we as a nation almost aren't doing enough. If the country goes all-in an experiences the hardship now for a few weeks, then we stop the virus in its place like China and begin the path to recovery that much quicker. For now though, it looks like we will shelter-in-place but still have the virus lingering because of other states, which will make people more cautious to travel, do fun things, and hurt the economic recovery.

  88. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Finch Platte View Post
    It's too bad more of the hoaxers don't come out of the woodwork to explain why they think it's a hoax. Could get interesting.
    Caw! The poll lets them exhibit their Flat-Earth tendencies without fear of being moved to Banning, Riverside County.

  89. #89
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    One of the great sites is this: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

    It gives total infected and death numbers. And then you can click on each country to dig deeper.

    To me, the greatest data point is Italy and Spain. There about a dozen plus countries tracking their death rates with the same exponential (hockey stick) curve. It's not a big deal while it simmers. Then the death rates hit big numbers and double every 3 days.

    Norcal Coronavirus poll-screen-shot-2020-03-20-11.50.40-am.png

    Yesterday, Italy had 627 deaths. They have a very good medical system with some of the most hospital beds per capita and doctors/nurses.

    USA is tracking that line, along with many other countries. Spain is entering the hockeystick curve too of deaths per day.
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    World wide with all lock down and shelter in place the death ratio is little over 4%. just imagine if there are no lock down or shelter in place.

    Coronavirus Cases:
    270,069
    view by country
    Deaths:
    11,271
    Recovered:
    90,603

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    Quote Originally Posted by 08_Yukon hard tail View Post
    World wide with all lock down and shelter in place the death ratio is little over 4%. just imagine if there are no lock down or shelter in place.

    Coronavirus Cases:
    270,069
    view by country
    Deaths:
    11,271
    Recovered:
    90,603
    Without a lockdown, even if the death rate drastically decreased, the number of deaths would drastically go up. Something along the lines of WW2.

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    Historical Event✓
    Media/propaganda✓
    Fear/hysteria ✓
    Increased government powers✓
    Reduction of civil liberties✓
    Increased dependency on govt✓
    Mass transfers of wealth✓

    Lots of check boxes necessary for the rise of some of darkest periods of human history..... Hope the world has learned from the past.

  94. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by 08_Yukon hard tail View Post
    World wide with all lock down and shelter in place the death ratio is little over 4%. just imagine if there are no lock down or shelter in place.

    Coronavirus Cases:
    270,069
    view by country
    Deaths:
    11,271
    Recovered:
    90,603
    RE: "Recovered" They only know about the ones they know about. Incomplete useless data at best. Complete hysterical BS at worst. I am not a Hoaxer. Didn't mean to sound harsh, tho....

  95. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5k bike 50cent legs View Post
    Saw that, too. Not sure the US Army is up to the task here.....

  96. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    It gives total infected and death numbers. And then you can click on each country to dig deeper.
    Ooooooooo, bad choice of words!
    “The further a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”

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    To hear a rational conversation about Covid-19 and responses too it watch the youtube video below. He also sites the articles or people below.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xaycvo79v6w

    Mainstrain Dr. urges caution in response to Covid-19. Compares it to the flu.
    https://www.facebook.com/DrPaulOffit...80515489366995

    Britan takes natural herd immunity approach (makes sense to me):
    https://www.newscientist.com/article...her-countries/

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    ^^^ Seriously? Del BigTree? That is some whacko conspiracy anti-vaxxer Alex Jones garbage. C'mon dude.

  99. #99
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    So the 'poll' does not require you be logged into MTBR to 'vote' so the results are about as reliable as the 'Death Rate' of Covid-19. I just voted Hoax from an Incognito window twice....sorry but there is a flat-earther out there having some fun.....uh....right?

  100. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by shapethings View Post
    ^^^ Seriously? Del BigTree? That is some whacko conspiracy anti-vaxxer Alex Jones garbage. C'mon dude.
    Thanks for that. Wikipedia sez: Del Matthew Bigtree is an American television and film producer who became a prominent anti-vaccination activist. He is the CEO of the anti-vaccination group Informed Consent Action Network and the producer of the movie Vaxxed based on the discredited views of Andrew Wakefield concerning vaccines and autism. Despite having no medical training, his appeal as a public speaker and a recent influx of funding make him one of the most prominent voices in the anti-vaccination movement.

    Ah, a voice of reason, I'm sure. *dripping sarcasm*
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  101. #101
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    Yeah, I'm just happy that there's only one joker that's shown up with conspiracy-level nonsense looking to have a "rational" discussion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DH40 View Post
    10% Hoaxers? LOL Even your Fox news should be telling you otherwise (now, anyway).
    I've never trusted those RC folks. This just confirms my suspicions.

    And Del Bigtree?! Holy fock. Our species needs a reboot.
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  103. #103
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    Poll deleted for now. Registration was not required and one disturbed user/IP address voted 'hoax' 136 times.

    Will repost. Maybe.
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  104. #104
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    ^^^Please post the user name

  105. #105
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    Those of you bad mouthing Del Bigtree have provided no evidence to warrant your remarks. Have you even watched one of his shows or do you blindly follow wikipedia?

  106. #106
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    Norcal Coronavirus poll

    Quote Originally Posted by westeast View Post
    Those of you bad mouthing Del Bigtree have provided no evidence to warrant your remarks. Have you even watched one of his shows or do you blindly follow wikipedia?
    Have you ever seen a smallpox survivor in person? I have. A rare bird, because... vaccines.

    That’s all I need to know that he’s an idiot.


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  107. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Have you ever seen a smallpox survivor in person? I have. A rare bird, because... vaccines.

    That’s all I need to know that he’s an idiot.


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    An article you may enjoy about the current pandemic from one of the doctors who helped eradicate smallpox.

    https://www.wired.com/story/coronavi...pidemiologist/

  108. #108
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    The US just past Iran in infected cases. Nearly 20K. It was a couple of thousand around a week ago.

  109. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5k bike 50cent legs View Post
    An article you may enjoy about the current pandemic from one of the doctors who helped eradicate smallpox.

    https://www.wired.com/story/coronavi...pidemiologist/
    The more I hear from Dr Brilliant the more I like his views. Thanks for posting the article.

  110. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    How is it out there in Boise? Where is your better half?
    I'm actually in Atlanta right now, working from home. It's not bad here... Yet. We are still able to get to thee trails and ride. However, they are closing more and more state parks so our riding choices are narrowing down a bit.

  111. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5k bike 50cent legs View Post
    An article you may enjoy about the current pandemic from one of the doctors who helped eradicate smallpox.

    https://www.wired.com/story/coronavi...pidemiologist/
    Good read.

    On an unrelated note, I have to wonder if the anti-vaccine movement will die off a bit once COVID-19 is brought to heel.

    It’s interesting how a virus with a relatively low mortality rate has caused such a massive shift in our culture. I’d hope there are some positive lessons from this, long term. We’ll see.


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    I'm old enough to remember the polio epidemics, both Dr. Brilliant and Mr. Bigtree make salient points depending on one's philosophy. (I'm not going to worship either of them)

    In regards to those scoffing Bigtree; I put his advice on about the same level as our current president. (Some scary shit right there)

    And bringing up (medical) politics; the rivalry between the Sabin and Salk polio vaccines is worth studying. I fully expect a similar conflict to arise with COVID-19.

    Being retired, "shelter in place" is sort of my life style anyway so I'm not feeling too much of a disruption. My kids have reason to be worried; at some point there may not be the jobs to work at home from.

    I've always wondered if I'd be around to see the reset button get pushed for the human race; I was expecting another World War but this may be it instead.

    Have a great day!
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  113. #113
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    Italy daily death rate as of yesterday. This hockey stick curve is key to watch because many, many countries are tracking this same rate but 10 days behind. This includes the U.S.

    This is where most countries headed unless they locked down many weeks ago.

    627 dead in one day... with an advanced medical system.

    Mortality rate for folks over 80 years old is about 8+ percent

    Norcal Coronavirus poll-screen-shot-2020-03-21-8.16.11-am.png

    https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus
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  114. #114
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    I just posed this in another forum...

    I wonder about the rates of smokers versus non-smokers. Seemingly the hardest hit countries have a high percentage of smokers.

    When this thing has run its course, there's going to be analytical data coming out the ass.
    "And crawling on the planet's face, some insects called, The Human Race..."

  115. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by chuckha62 View Post
    I just posed this in another forum...

    I wonder about the rates of smokers versus non-smokers. Seemingly the hardest hit countries have a high percentage of smokers.

    When this thing has run its course, there's going to be analytical data coming out the ass.
    For northern Italy, there's a strong correlation between elder coronavirus deaths and air pollution (industry)

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    This is from 16 years ago, more recent maps show a slight improvement in air quality---I chose this one because it shows the air the "elderly" were breathing when they were still of working age.
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  116. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Italy daily death rate as of yesterday. This hockey stick curve is key to watch because many, many countries are tracking this same rate but 10 days behind. This includes the U.S.

    This is where most countries headed unless they locked down many weeks ago.

    627 dead in one day... with an advanced medical system.

    Mortality rate for folks over 80 years old is about 8+ percent

    Click image for larger version. 

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    https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus
    And almost 800 today. That is so sad and sobering.

    Without demographics and severity of infections to compare to Italy, it’s hard to say which way the US would go. We should know more 2 weeks from now, let’s hope it’s different.

    I was talking to my wife that it looks to me that we are going to be sheltering in place into May at this rate.

  117. #117
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    Why not completely isolate people over 60 and people
    with severe respiratory problems from the general population. Provide all the services they need free of charge over the next 3-4 months. Let the rest of society go about it's business.

    Might be as effective as these stay at home orders that seem like very few are really listening to and not allowing people to work completely tanking the economy for possibly years to come.

    If the death rate is no different than the flu for people outside that group listed above,. Wouldn't it be easier and more doable to just isolate that small part of the population most at risk, then to halfass isolate the entire population?

    Who knows, I guess.

  118. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by slimnshady View Post
    And almost 800 today. That is so sad and sobering.

    Without demographics and severity of infections to compare to Italy, it’s hard to say which way the US would go. We should know more 2 weeks from now, let’s hope it’s different.

    I was talking to my wife that it looks to me that we are going to be sheltering in place into May at this rate.
    Holy moly man!!!!!

    Spain... 285. Tracking the Italy line very closely.

    Norcal Coronavirus poll-screen-shot-2020-03-21-3.31.26-pm.png


    And USA... we're on the same line. In the 50s right now... exactly where these other countries were a week+ ago.

    Norcal Coronavirus poll-screen-shot-2020-03-21-3.32.27-pm.png
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  119. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by prozach0215 View Post
    Why not completely isolate people over 60 and people
    with severe respiratory problems from the general population. Provide all the services they need free of charge over the next 3-4 months. Let the rest of society go about it's business.

    Might be as effective as these stay at home orders that seem like very few are really listening to and not allowing people to work completely tanking the economy for possibly years to come.

    If the death rate is no different than the flu for people outside that group listed above,. Wouldn't it be easier and more doable to just isolate that small part of the population most at risk, then to halfass isolate the entire population?

    Who knows, I guess.
    With some refinement, this is probably one of the better ideas I've heard yet.

  120. #120
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    ^^^ I read a stat that 40% of hospitalizations are between the ages of 20-54. The death rate is lower in that group, with supportive care. If hospitals become overwhelmed the death rate between older and younger may narrow. As a country the two things we need to do for the next month are isolate and build more ventilators.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Holy moly man!!!!!

    Spain... 285. Tracking the Italy line very closely.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    And USA... we're on the same line. In the 50s right now... exactly where these other countries were a week+ ago.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    that is just staggering.

  122. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5k bike 50cent legs View Post
    ^^^ I read a stat that 40% of hospitalizations are between the ages of 20-54. The death rate is lower in that group, with supportive care. If hospitals become overwhelmed the death rate between older and younger may narrow. As a country the two things we need to do for the next month are isolate and build more ventilators.
    Yup, pneumonia is no joke even for the young and healthy.

    @prozach0215- the answer for why not is time required to get logistics in place and family units where it’s hard to enforce the split.

  123. #123
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    Here are a couple of of links I found interesting and educational:

    The first are simulations showing how 'flattening the curve' works with social distancing (and why quarantining doesn't work as well). Scroll through all the way to the end to see the simulations compared.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph...ona-simulator/

    This one is a video of 'Emily Landon, the chief infectious disease epidemiologist at University of Chicago Medicine' explaining why we are asked to sacrifice by sheltering in place. A great quote from her: “The healthy and optimistic among us will doom the vulnerable”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHUuWq6y8F0

  124. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by slimnshady View Post
    Yup, pneumonia is no joke even for the young and healthy.

    @prozach0215- the answer for why not is time required to get logistics in place and family units where it’s hard to enforce the split.
    The Spanish flu of 1918 had a "W" shaped curve of deaths based on age; the very young, the very old and then a spike of "healthy" young adults in between. (Possibly the most mobile and the most likely to become infected?)
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    Quote Originally Posted by lixxfe View Post
    Here are a couple of of links I found interesting and educational:

    The first are simulations showing how 'flattening the curve' works with social distancing (and why quarantining doesn't work as well). Scroll through all the way to the end to see the simulations compared.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/graph...ona-simulator/

    This one is a video of 'Emily Landon, the chief infectious disease epidemiologist at University of Chicago Medicine' explaining why we are asked to sacrifice by sheltering in place. A great quote from her: “The healthy and optimistic among us will doom the vulnerable”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHUuWq6y8F0
    Great visuals on the Wapo article, thanks. One would argue that quarantining will work if it’s enforced, much like how it went down in Hubei. Doubt if any nation outside of China can pull it off though.

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    Found this interesting collection. Accuracy is questionable but sources are called out. NY is stunning: ~22% Positive cases out and a huge test base. Either they have a major outbreak cluster around NYC/Westchester county or the 4x testing compared to CA or WA nets more cases. Inclined to think it’s the former.


    https://covidtracking.com/data/

  127. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Italy daily death rate as of yesterday. This hockey stick curve is key to watch because many, many countries are tracking this same rate but 10 days behind. This includes the U.S.

    This is where most countries headed unless they locked down many weeks ago.

    627 dead in one day... with an advanced medical system.

    Mortality rate for folks over 80 years old is about 8+ percent

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Screen Shot 2020-03-21 at 8.16.11 AM.png 
Views:	36 
Size:	54.4 KB 
ID:	1318507

    https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus
    Serious question, how many people are dying from cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc in that same area per day? The severity can be better understood if we have something to reference it to.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Moe Ped View Post
    The Spanish flu of 1918 had a "W" shaped curve of deaths based on age; the very young, the very old and then a spike of "healthy" young adults in between. (Possibly the most mobile and the most likely to become infected?)
    I Would buy that hypothesis.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RBoardman View Post
    Serious question, how many people are dying from cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc in that same area per day? The severity can be better understood if we have something to reference it to.
    I think I know what you're implying, but does that really matter if ICU's are full and we run out of ventilators?
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  130. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by RBoardman View Post
    Serious question, how many people are dying from cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc in that same area per day? The severity can be better understood if we have something to reference it to.
    The annual death rate in Italy is around 10.6 per 1000. There are 60.5MM Italians. That works out to 641,300 deaths per year or about 1757 per day. Yesterday there were 793 deaths from Covid in Italy, and growing exponentially.

    In the Lombardy region where this is currently playing out there were about 100k deaths last year, or about 272 per day.

    What people fail to realize is the deaths that are happening with Covid are happening in the ICU. Most of the daily deaths from other causes, which are not going away btw, don't eat up nearly as many resources.

    Feel free to check my math, I'm happy to be wrong.

  131. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by RBoardman View Post
    Serious question, how many people are dying from cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc in that same area per day? The severity can be better understood if we have something to reference it to.
    We all die some day and yes I would expect the diseases you outlined to be a large percentage of deaths/day. The problem at hand is that COVID-19 is accelerating those deaths and they are occurring in a very very small timeframe and this will overwhelm systems, healthcare and otherwise. Where some of those folks might have had years to live say via medication or just managing along, now they are at significant risk due to a COVID-19 infection.

    Flip side: how many 75+ Y/O do you know who have a clean bill of health? I worry for my parents and are reasonably healthy.

  132. #132
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    The good thing about pandemics is they don't last very long, the bad thing is the damage they can do in a very short period of time can be pretty devastating. If you can stay healthy for the next 3-4 months you'll be in good shape, relatively. You DO NOT want to be in the hospital during the hottest period of this. I would suspect this will take quite a bit longer to play out, but the hospitals will be in better shape after the first big wave, I hope.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RBoardman View Post
    Serious question, how many people are dying from cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc in that same area per day? The severity can be better understood if we have something to reference it to.
    A major concern with this virus is the rate of spread. The things you listed are not contagious. Please understand the difference.

  134. #134
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    Bill Gates from 5 years ago:

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    Quote Originally Posted by slimnshady View Post
    I Would buy that hypothesis.
    Another approach to the information:
    Please watch for a factual but humorous approach to what our government hasn't said:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hks6Nq7g6P4

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    Social media is an incredibly powerful tool, but has become the Covid19 version of misinformation. It's incredible the ridiculous conspiracy theories and other nonsensical ideas people have been lured into believing by cult of personality idiots. I think this is because people can't think critically or analyze data in meaningful ways, they think emotionally and not rationally in times of stress. I've realized students and society at large falls into a bimodal distribution of incredibly well educated and incredibly uneducated. This is an issue we need to address as a world, the current pandemic is proving that a chain is only as strong as its weakest link, everyone must be onboard to solve this issue.

  137. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5k bike 50cent legs View Post
    Social media is an incredibly powerful tool, but has become the Covid19 version of misinformation. It's incredible the ridiculous conspiracy theories and other nonsensical ideas people have been lured into believing by cult of personality idiots. I think this is because people can't think critically or analyze data in meaningful ways, they think emotionally and not rationally in times of stress. I've realized students and society at large falls into a bimodal distribution of incredibly well educated and incredibly uneducated. This is an issue we need to address as a world, the current pandemic is proving that a chain is only as strong as its weakest link, everyone must be onboard to solve this issue.
    yeah, but you/we live in a bubble, where the area under the "educated" portion of the distribution is larger than in many places. having grown up in tx, the amount of stupidity* i see in folks from my high school is mind boggling.

    *stupidity defined as the inability to grasp basic math concepts, such as exponential increase vs. linear, what the difference in percentage rate means (i.e. .1% vs 2 or 3%), and so on. notice that i didn't even include basic critical thinking, reasoning skills nor general cognitive ability.

    edited for syntax
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    Quote Originally Posted by RooHarris View Post
    Another approach to the information:
    Please watch for a factual but humorous approach to what our government hasn't said:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hks6Nq7g6P4
    That's brilliant- thanks for sharing!

  139. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by lixxfe View Post
    That's brilliant- thanks for sharing!
    Oh. My. God. I'm spreading, err- SHARING that with all my friends & relatives. Lol
    “The further a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”

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    Ditto ^ love it

  141. #141
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    Yeah that video was hilarious

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    Quote Originally Posted by dth656 View Post
    yeah, but you/we live in a bubble, where the area under the "educated" portion of the distribution is larger than in many places. having grown up in tx, the amount of stupidity* i see in folks from my high school is mind boggling.
    I concur. I have family in Kentucky where they're lining up to buy guns--because that's an essential item right now...
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    Quote Originally Posted by Callender View Post
    I concur. I have family in Kentucky where they're lining up to buy guns--because that's an essential item right now...
    I saw a line outside a gun shop Saturday in Lodi, CA, so it's happening everywhere.
    “The further a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”

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    Makes sense. They just want to protect themselves and their TP stash from the hordes of dirty-butted looters.
    Just call me Ray

  145. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radium View Post
    Makes sense. They just want to protect themselves and their TP stash from the hordes of dirty-butted looters.
    My new band name.

    Dirty-Butted Looters.
    Last edited by Finch Platte; 03-23-2020 at 01:31 PM. Reason: Truck you, Fump.
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    It's hilarious what the state deems essential and non-essential.

    State OHV park like Carnegie is able to stay on open, while a private track like club Moto is forced to close?

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    Businesses embracing change:


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    I work in Healthcare Planning / Architecture. We've been fielding many calls and brainstorming sessions about how to quickly convert existing underutilized medical spaces to ICU/ recovery spaces.
    The average ICU department only has 2 (negative pressured) isolation rooms. From what Ive heard, and some simple math, all isolation rooms in the state of California will be spoken for by the end of this week. If not sooner.

  149. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by BraaapTastic View Post
    Businesses embracing change:

    Keep Portland weird.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BraaapTastic View Post
    Businesses embracing change:

    In exchange they only want a tip?

  151. #151
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    Norcal Coronavirus poll-desktop236.jpg

    Spain is tracking the Italy line very closely. All these other countries too including the US.
    IPA will save America

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    Quote Originally Posted by RBoardman View Post
    My answer: The virus should be taken seriously, but the media is overreacting and creating the problem.
    Bingo. Ignore the news, and buy as much stock as you can afford right now at 35% off!

  153. #153
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    Looks like I missed the poll, but I take it very seriously. I don't get the idiots who go out and get together during the pandemic.

    Everything I read about this is scary, even if most folks under 60 will do just fine. Unfortunately, too many states are ignoring the obvious warning signs, and a nasty Italian style pandemic is probably too late to avoid in many places. I sure hope I am wrong.

    A buddy of mine in France got it and so far has just dealt with it by staying home and avoiding his wife and kids. So far, he looks like one of the lucky ones.

    Frankly, 2008 seems like a cake walk compared to this. It's hard to figure out where the bottom is.



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    Quote Originally Posted by vedson View Post
    I work in Healthcare Planning / Architecture. We've been fielding many calls and brainstorming sessions about how to quickly convert existing underutilized medical spaces to ICU/ recovery spaces.
    The average ICU department only has 2 (negative pressured) isolation rooms. From what Ive heard, and some simple math, all isolation rooms in the state of California will be spoken for by the end of this week. If not sooner.
    Yeesh.. BTW, always wondered what the negative pressure rooms were for. Makes sense now, thinking about air flow.

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    Its alarming to see more and more discussion in media about trading off public health for mitigating economic impact.. Right now seems like the worst time to have these discussions pop up. The data is incomplete and we are far from getting a full picture of what the impact of the outbreak will be on the US. Going on a hope and prayer that our outbreak would follow the trend of South Korea vs Italy is lunacy, not strategy.

  156. #156
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    Quote Originally Posted by slimnshady View Post
    Its alarming to see more and more discussion in media about trading off public health for mitigating economic impact.. Right now seems like the worst time to have these discussions pop up. The data is incomplete and we are far from getting a full picture of what the impact of the outbreak will be on the US. Going on a hope and prayer that our outbreak would follow the trend of South Korea vs Italy is lunacy, not strategy.
    Well our president has staked his election strategy on the economy and this pandemic is wrecking it.

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  157. #157
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    The trade off between economic impact and public health may not be an either/or scenario. We may have a situation where public health and the economy are both greatly diminished simultaneously. With SIP ordinances people are not working based on a decision to slow the virus, if SIP ordinance are prematurely lifted and a large portion of the population becomes sick rapidly leading to hospitals being overwhelmed, then people will not work out of necessity and the situation will be out of our control.

  158. #158
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    28% of those tested in the Tri-state area are positive. Buckle up

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    Quote Originally Posted by 5k bike 50cent legs View Post
    The trade off between economic impact and public health may not be an either/or scenario. We may have a situation where public health and the economy are both greatly diminished simultaneously. With SIP ordinances people are not working based on a decision to slow the virus, if SIP ordinance are prematurely lifted and a large portion of the population becomes sick rapidly leading to hospitals being overwhelmed, then people will not work out of necessity and the situation will be out of our control.
    Agreed. There is definitely a time to have a conversation about how and when the SIP ordinances and social distancing get lifted, and that time is likely after we have handle the outbreak and the case load starts leveling off.

    Quote Originally Posted by zorg View Post
    Well our president has staked his election strategy on the economy and this pandemic is wrecking it.

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    The way to have kept that on track would have been to, you know show some leadership and a steady hand. Instead its been the usual clown show. There was 15 seconds during a press conference last week where he sounded remotely presidential and then he started going extempore or said something about the Chinese virus. I had to mute till Dr Brix or Dr Fauci started talking.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WHALENARD View Post
    28% of those tested in the Tri-state area are positive. Buckle up

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    Scary. Got a ton of friends and fam out in NY, MA. I had to talk my "at-risk" demographic in laws from taking a trip from Upstate NY to cape cod because they were bored

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    Quote Originally Posted by WHALENARD View Post
    28% of those tested in the Tri-state area are positive. Buckle up

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    I mean no offense by this, but this statistic doesn't mean much unless we also know how many people were tested and from what demographics (ie were the tests administered to people already showing symptoms of the virus?).

    Please post links to references.

  162. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by zorg View Post
    Well our president has staked his election strategy on the economy and this pandemic is wrecking it.

    Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

    But, but , but . . . . . . The POTUS wants the "Workers" to work dammit!!!
    "There's two kinds of people in this world - Walkers and Talkers." Which one are you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ohmygato View Post
    I mean no offense by this, but this statistic doesn't mean much unless we also know how many people were tested and from what demographics (ie were the tests administered to people already showing symptoms of the virus?).

    Please post links to references.
    https://covidtracking.com/data/ while incomplete, is the best reference I have found. Cant find demographics anywhere nor can I find geographical info. Gvien paucity of tests one has to assume they were administered to people showing symptoms and not a random sampling of the population.

    NY sample size is significant however.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Forest Rider View Post
    In exchange they only want a tip?
    Social distancing...only the tip.

  165. #165
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    I think we're likely to start seeing firewalls between states and maybe intrastate between cities.

  166. #166
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    Trade overall is gonna take a huge hit from this, even after it's over.

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  167. #167
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    The US has passed China and Italy for infected cases. Not good.

    Norcal Coronavirus poll-c19-counts.jpg

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    Quote Originally Posted by aliikane View Post
    The US has passed China and Italy for infected cases. Not good.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    17,000 cases just today???? We'll see well over a thousand deaths a day by next week, just in the US.
    IPA will save America

  169. #169
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    Da whole store got da flu, so I had to wear this ridiculous thing just for you. Are you mocking me.

  170. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by palerider View Post
    Da whole store got da flu, so I had to wear this ridiculous thing just for you. Are you mocking me.
    What’s a yute?
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  171. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by RBoardman View Post
    Serious question, how many people are dying from cancer, heart disease, diabetes, etc in that same area per day? The severity can be better understood if we have something to reference it to.
    Yes! Car crashes and gunshots too right? Common cold? The flu? Quite a few uniformed folks are claiming Covid19 is not a big deal because of the other causes of death exist and are greater.

    There are many, many reasons why it is a big deal. Perhaps the simplest way I can state it is this is an unknown, uncontrolled people killer with a hockey stick death rate curve.

    60 days ago, 0 people died from it. Today 2871 people died so far. In about a month, about 10,000 people will die in one day (maybe 20,000). And we really do understand where the end is.
    IPA will save America

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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    Yes! Car crashes and gunshots too right? Common cold? The flu? Quite a few uniformed folks are claiming Covid19 is not a big deal because of the other causes of death exist and are greater.

    There are many, many reasons why it is a big deal. Perhaps the simplest way I can state it is this is an unknown, uncontrolled people killer with a hockey stick death rate curve.

    60 days ago, 0 people died from it. Today 2871 people died so far. In about a month, about 10,000 people will die in one day (maybe 20,000). And we really do understand where the end is.
    You talk in absolutes about things that haven't happened yet. Every country that was projecting in a horrible direction never got close to 10,000 deaths a day. And most those early countries have already tapered way below the apocalypse people like you keep flaming. 🤷*♀️

  173. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    17,000 cases just today???? We'll see well over a thousand deaths a day by next week, just in the US.
    I don't doubt that. I doubt it will be daily occurrence, but there will be days. If Italy can post up 300's, 400's, then 700's in less than a week -we'll get there.

    Not sure abut the flu comment. He must be in the wrong thread talking about a flu. Can't quite understand his nonsense though so maybe 'flu' means something else.

  174. #174
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    Big day today. The key countries are hitting that hockey stick death graph on the same beat.

    3273 died. RIP.

    Norcal Coronavirus poll-desktop237.jpg
    IPA will save America

  175. #175
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    The Army Corps of Engineers is doing some truly great work converting buildings into hospitals. Read the various articles here.

    https://www.usace.army.mil/

  176. #176
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    ^^^I thought you were retiring...due to your busy schedule?

  177. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dark Meat View Post
    ^^^I thought you were retiring...due to your busy schedule?
    It's Friday night, I'm taking a break! It's been hectic as of late, but I like being busy.

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  179. #179
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    Today, the US takes top spot in this very unfortunate but real stat.Norcal Coronavirus poll-screen-shot-2020-03-31-10.06.36-pm.png

    912 deaths today as we've turned the corner into the hockeystick curve.

    4542 deaths for the world
    IPA will save America

  180. #180
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    It's gonna get rough.

  181. #181
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    Some modeling data for the next few months. This data assumes the mitigation practices remain in place until end of May. This is the data that was cited in the White House Press briefing recently by Dr. Birx.

    https://covid19.healthdata.org/projections

  182. #182
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    Quote Originally Posted by joshtee View Post
    It's gonna get rough.
    I think in a week, it's gonna get its stride in the US and many of us will start to have some connection to a fatality.
    IPA will save America

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    On the plus side, the Bay Area seems to be flattening the curve. I'd agree in a week, we'll all know of a fatality or two. No one one is sick until everyone is sick.

  184. #184
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    Agreed FC and SS. It's a matter of when, not if. Stay safe all!
    "And crawling on the planet's face, some insects called, The Human Race..."

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  186. #186
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    CHECK-IN | How is your health? Physical and mental? You taking care of self and family and getting the routine down? Getting better or worse?

    Income, shelter, food, beer, toilet paper situation ok?

    Need hobbies? Rc cars? Bikes? Music, movie, baking suggestions?

    As this transitions from a 3-week event to a 3-month, have you started thinking about that? Gonna be ok?

    Has your opinion on the severity of the situation in the last month changed or the same?
    IPA will save America

  187. #187
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    Coronavirus in the United States: There are more than 325,000 cases in the United States, according to a Johns Hopkins University tally. More than 9,200 people have died nationwide. Globally, the number of cases has surpassed 1.2 million with more than 68,000 deaths, Hopkins reports.

    https://www.kcra.com/article/coronav...ation/32017647

    The Navy captain removed from command of the USS Theodore Roosevelt last week after warning that action was needed to save the lives of his crew from a coronavirus outbreak has tested positive for the virus.

    https://www.kcra.com/article/new-yor...virus_COMBINED

    'Please go home': El Dorado County issues Tahoe Basin no-travel order

    https://www.kcra.com/article/please-...virus_COMBINED

    CALIFORNIA: 13,946 confirmed cases; 324 deaths related to the coronavirus.
    Last edited by Finch Platte; 04-05-2020 at 04:17 PM. Reason: "This isn't about winning a news cycle on Fox, please. The American people right now need someone to explain what is going to be done to get us out of this. It's a moment that requires leadership
    “The further a society drifts from truth, the more it will hate those who speak it.”

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  188. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by fc View Post
    CHECK-IN | How is your health? Physical and mental? You taking care of self and family and getting the routine down? Getting better or worse?

    Income, shelter, food, beer, toilet paper situation ok?

    Need hobbies? Rc cars? Bikes? Music, movie, baking suggestions?

    As this transitions from a 3-week event to a 3-month, have you started thinking about that? Gonna be ok?

    Has your opinion on the severity of the situation in the last month changed or the same?
    I still believe the response to the virus will be far more damaging to the country as a whole than the virus itself. But only time will tell. It is also sad the way the media is still using this event for political agendas.

    I think In the end we will rethink the whole globalization thing and it a simply being a win win for everyone. It's obvious that country's need to be able to produce certain items without being dependent on any other country if they are to adequately protect their people. Some things just should not be out sourced and some countries just should not be trusted.

  189. #189
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    Quote Originally Posted by prozach0215 View Post
    I still believe the response to the virus will be far more damaging to the country as a whole than the virus itself. But only time will tell. It is also sad the way the media is still using this event for political agendas.

    I think In the end we will rethink the whole globalization thing and it a simply being a win win for everyone. It's obvious that country's need to be able to produce certain items without being dependent on any other country if they are to adequately protect their people. Some things just should not be out sourced and some countries just should not be trusted.
    Huh?

    Globalism isn’t the problem here. One of the main problems is that we failed to sustain a contract to maintain medical equipment procured during the previous administration.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/01/u...ntilators.html


    Then, we also failed to ban exports to other countries, because its far more important to make a buck and keep shareholders happy during a time of crisis than to be prepared ourselves:

    https://theintercept.com/2020/04/01/...pplies-export/


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  190. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Huh?

    Globalism isn’t the problem here. One of the main problems is that we failed to sustain a contract to maintain medical equipment procured during the previous administration.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/01/u...ntilators.html


    Then, we also failed to ban exports to other countries, because its far more important to make a buck and keep shareholders happy during a time of crisis than to be prepared ourselves:

    https://theintercept.com/2020/04/01/...pplies-export/


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    https://apnews.com/090600c299a8cf07f5b44d92534856bc

  191. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by 5k bike 50cent legs View Post
    A link below that story includes information about lower fuel economy (more air pollution) standards coming online soon.

    Great. Just what we need when we have a *respiratory* illness predicted to kill upwards of 100,000 Americans.


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  192. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by prozach0215 View Post
    I still believe the response to the virus will be far more damaging to the country as a whole than the virus itself. But only time will tell. It is also sad the way the media is still using this event for political agendas.
    Boy, that is a broad brush you're using.

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  193. #193
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    Meanwhile at my house...

    We're staying in and around our house almost exclusively. I've been away from the house 3 times in the past month to do curbside pickup at our local grocery store. Therefore between the two of us we've had face to face distanced and fully masked up contact with three other people.

    Fitness is way up for my family, Zwifting 5 days/week and building back the base fitness for racing after a couple years of running. My kettlebell technique is improving and I seemed to have worked out the nagging elbow tendonitis. The wifey's period came yesterday so we're forgoing the boning for a bit and I got a few more KB swings in to compensate.

    There's an opportunistic skunk we've never seen before who wanders around the yard looking for a new home under our driveway and digging grubs. The deer haven't been around lately, either because they're having babies or they all got mauled by the mountain lions who are out roaming the neighborhood now that there are fewer stupid humans to interrupt them.

    We're both practicing our instruments about an hour a day each, perfecting our bread recipes, and I have about another hour of work to finish up my adirondack footstools. If work fires me I could use a couple years off anyway.

    I don't know what you guys are yapping about. The world is beautiful.

  194. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by ohmygato View Post
    Meanwhile at my house...

    We're staying in and around our house almost exclusively. I've been away from the house 3 times in the past month to do curbside pickup at our local grocery store. Therefore between the two of us we've had face to face distanced and fully masked up contact with three other people.

    Fitness is way up for my family, Zwifting 5 days/week and building back the base fitness for racing after a couple years of running. My kettlebell technique is improving and I seemed to have worked out the nagging elbow tendonitis. The wifey's period came yesterday so we're forgoing the boning for a bit and I got a few more KB swings in to compensate.

    There's an opportunistic skunk we've never seen before who wanders around the yard looking for a new home under our driveway and digging grubs. The deer haven't been around lately, either because they're having babies or they all got mauled by the mountain lions who are out roaming the neighborhood now that there are fewer stupid humans to interrupt them.

    We're both practicing our instruments about an hour a day each, perfecting our bread recipes, and I have about another hour of work to finish up my adirondack footstools. If work fires me I could use a couple years off anyway.

    I don't know what you guys are yapping about. The world is beautiful.
    TMI award for the first week in April.
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  195. #195
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    I feel that the 'Earth' - whatever that means - will 'learn' - whatever that means - that the more humans are kept from polluting due to viral pandemics, the better life is for the 'Earth' and the more viral pandemics we will see. She finally found a medicine that slows the human outbreak. Unfortunately, it hasn't slowed down Bolsonaro.....

    Caw Caw

  196. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by moe ped View Post
    tmi award for the first week in april.

    lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    A link below that story includes information about lower fuel economy (more air pollution) standards coming online soon.

    Great. Just what we need when we have a *respiratory* illness predicted to kill upwards of 100,000 Americans.
    I've been following this a bit, and I don't think it's worth immediate concern. The 2021 cleanliness standards will be used for the next few years (instead of increasingly stringent regulations being phased in). Here's another article on the topic. https://www.thedrive.com/tech/32848/...ide-of-history

    I hope that the next administration reverts us "back" to the cleaner Obama era standards, but at least we won't be returned to the 70s.

    The silver lining is that today we're getting a glimpse of what our world looks like without industry polluting the rivers and skies, and hopefully people will understand that with clean energy we may eventually be able to see this natural beauty even as industry is in full swing. I'm hopeful.

    And, lastly, the Trump move eliminates a mandate for electrified cars, but I am sure plenty of people will still be buying hybrids and electric cars (and in increased numbers) because they're still absolutely the future.

  198. #198
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    Sign up for The Economist and read this article, you get five articles for free.

    The data suggests that under the age of 50 the likelihood of being an asymptomatic carrier increases exponentially the younger a person is, and over the age of 50 the lethality of the virus increases exponentially with age.

    This has pretty serious implications for schools, day care centers, etc.

    https://www.economist.com/science-an...n-be-available

  199. #199
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    IPA will save America

  200. #200
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    I was lamenting missing my annual trip to Mammoth last year and was fiddling around with the latitude of the place and noticed that it is pretty much due east of somewhere in the Sharpe Park golf course in Pacifica, or the San Bruno Jail if that;s a more well-known landmark to some f you shifty types on here. Strange how most people think it's in SoCal and it's usually only discussed in the SoCal forum.

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