Results 1 to 24 of 24
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    8

    Hope Anyone have experience buying land in NorCal

    Longtime (lurker) first time. My buddy wants to buy land together to pool our money to buy more land to be able to ride. He says he would create a trust and put me in his trust. But if the friendship dissolves I worry I won't have rights if I need to pull out. I assume its better to have both our names on the deed. Are there lawyers who specialize in this? Thanks a head of time.

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Posts
    83
    Ive contemplated similar situations often... a little too often. Wouldnt it make sense that a few friends have a plot of land, each can build a small house (far away from eachother incase of future fall out), with trails running throughout?
    The major issue is, as youve addressed, if someone wants out, they want to be cashed out right away. And if you cant cash them out , they will want to force sale of such land.
    Ive realized, sadly, that between the litigious country we live in and humans just being difficult in general, this dream of mine probably wont happen.

  3. #3
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    8
    Thanks yes just thinking about the future not that i want the friendship to dissolve. But what if I want to cash out later. I figure people here might have experience or know what type of lawyer would know the ins and outs of this kind of situation.

  4. #4
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Posts
    170
    You're going to each need your own lawyer. Probate/Estate attorneys and some real estate attorneys do that kind of stuff. If you find the right attorneys, it should be relatively simple to draw up the papers for somebody who practices in that area.

    Do it right in the beginning and save yourself a lot of headache later if things go south, or much later when one of you dies and your heir(s) have to deal with it.

  5. #5
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Posts
    33
    In my experience, joint ownership of undeveloped land has been great.... Just usually not for the folks that jointly own the land. Typically it works out better for the investor that gets to buy the land on the cheap when the joint owners are forced to sell in a hurry....

  6. #6
    Hella Olde
    Reputation: DH40's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,672
    What about some kind of LLC / Partnership?

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    8
    That's what I was thinking. In case things go south. That's a great idea to each get our own lawyer. Hadn't thought of that. Like a prenup. Thanks much.

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    8
    Maybe LLC is the way to go instead of a trust.

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    1,237
    Hi all - I'm a CPA, not an attorney, so bear all this with a grain of "git-r-dun" salt.

    If you want to buy land with a friend, first thing you need to do is recognize that going into business with a friend is the A#1 most certain way of turning a friendship into the opposite.

    Still with me?

    Then you need a partnership agreement (you can't use a trust (remember I'm not a lawyer) because you can't give money to a trust (over 15K(?)) without gift tax consequence and there may also be issues with who's the trustee etc). Yes, my parentheses are cheezed up. Sue me.

    Your partnership agreement needs to be written out with the mindset that you and your bro are at each others' throats going for blood. Or, more frankly, that your surviving spouses are suing each other to get bought out. Plan for the absolute ugliest dissolution of this enterprise and you'll be maybe 51% of the way toward getting things set.

    I cannot overstate how much you need to be prepared for the downside. One of you will want out before the other, guaranteed. How is FMV determined? How many appraisals? Who gets right of first refusal? How do you hold title?

    I may be jaded (am jaded) because I live across the street from Annadel, but jeeze, I can think of many things better to do with money, time, effort, and friendship (beer is the answer to most of those) than buying property with a homie so you have a place to ride.
    2016 SC 5010
    2017 Norco Torrent
    2014 Giant Trance (the boy's)
    2014 Kona Process 134a (the other boy's)

  10. #10
    Hella Olde
    Reputation: DH40's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,672
    Quote Originally Posted by mtbikerfan View Post
    Maybe LLC is the way to go instead of a trust.
    BTW, I know next to nothing, so do-due diligence!

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    256
    It might be harder to find but what about buying two adjacent parcels? You own one and your buddy owns one. Or buy something and subdivide it. Either way you then build trails across the property line (assuming thatís your intent). Maybe you could also have some sort of deed restriction and/or easement that guarantees access in perpetuity to the other property.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    8
    LLC makes more sense. More like a FLP but we're not family. Thanks all. Sage advice. Plan like a wedding and prenup for the worst day if things go south since money is involved. But an estate attorney is a good tip like a divorce attorney if things go south. It's a good argument against this fantasy.

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    8
    I think Travis Pastrana and his buddies added land together to create more trails to ride. Sure he's a millionaire. But wonder how they did that on paper.

  14. #14
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    751
    I do open space/timberland transactions for a non profit. Agreed with the aforementioned. Due diligence is a must including potentially a phase 1 hazardous materials report for said land (donít want to inherit the previous landowners hazardous waste/liability and it can be quite surprising where there are buried hydrocarbon storage tanks) and a title report to make sure you are buying what you think you are. Often with vacant land things such as mineral and water rights can be severed from title; I e Someone might be able to drive up and gravel mine on your property.( thatís slightly an exxageration for effect). Lots of other stuff to consider. Legal counsel probably a good idea.

    My wife and her good friend opened a coffee biz together. Their friendship survived its demise but it was rough for a while. Agree with the aforementioned partnership stuff too!

    Not trying to discourage you though!

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    8
    Quote Originally Posted by DH40 View Post
    BTW, I know next to nothing, so do-due diligence!

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Posts
    180
    Best advice is to buy adjacent parcels or subdivide with easements. Otherwise if someone wants out, you both need to sell unless you can afford to buy the other out.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    8
    Sage advice. Prevents the King Solomon splitting the baby scenario when things go south or if someone wants out first as @kyle242gt pointed out is inevitable.

  18. #18
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Truckee29's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    440
    TIC works well in CA

  19. #19
    orthonormal
    Reputation: andy f's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    4,301
    Erik Estrada. California Pines.
    The glass is twice as large as it needs to be

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Posts
    1,316
    i cant even work out the math at how buying land for bike riding makes sense.

    granted i am not a business major..okay i tried and got kicked out. i blame girls.

    for the money, you could buy the best bike boxes, get airplane tickets and ride some of the most epic landscapes on the planet. like bunny-hopping off some Thailand jungle temple staircase. then go home, clean up and ride Spain. or pedal down some elephant trail in Burma.

    i'm a big time hunter. buying land for hunting is a reach.
    Santa Cruz 5010 C
    Surly Crosscheck.

  21. #21
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    1,215
    Live to Ride, Ride to Live

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    128
    Get. A. Lawyer.

    Yes there are lawyers that specialize in real estate.

    Based on the questions/posts, I am curious as to how you've amassed enough money to spend it buying land for mountain biking...lottery? Inheritance?

  23. #23
    mtbr member
    Reputation: flipnidaho's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    7,164
    Quote Originally Posted by Boomchakabowwow View Post
    i cant even work out the math at how buying land for bike riding makes sense.

    granted i am not a business major..okay i tried and got kicked out. i blame girls.

    for the money, you could buy the best bike boxes, get airplane tickets and ride some of the most epic landscapes on the planet. like bunny-hopping off some Thailand jungle temple staircase. then go home, clean up and ride Spain. or pedal down some elephant trail in Burma.

    i'm a big time hunter. buying land for hunting is a reach.
    This!



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  24. #24
    middle ring single track
    Reputation: Moe Ped's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    4,332
    Quote Originally Posted by mtbikerfan View Post
    Longtime (lurker) first time. My buddy wants to buy land together to pool our money to buy more land to be able to ride. He says he would create a trust and put me in his trust. But if the friendship dissolves I worry I won't have rights if I need to pull out. I assume its better to have both our names on the deed. Are there lawyers who specialize in this? Thanks a head of time.
    I wouldn't trust a "buddy" who wants to put you in "his" trust. If things went south though (a second party breaks their neck on "your" land), it might be good not having your name on the recorded title.

    Having said all that me and buddy (and our wives) held 3 NorCal properties (bare land to build spec homes on) in simple partnership and we were able get in and get out with no problem. This was quite a long time ago and the margins weren't enough to warrant the hassle and cost of incorporation.

    The other thing is to set up a partnership where a requirement is that each party maintain a bond sufficient to buy the other party out. This would have to have an adjustment clause to keep the bonds sufficient as the lands appreciates.

    In the end it will be a test of just how good your friendship was.
    Content here does not officially represent the CA DPR.

    Windows 10, destroying humanity one upgrade at a time.

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 30
    Last Post: 12-28-2018, 02:19 PM
  2. Photo assignment: Trail and land destruction in NorCal.
    By fc in forum California - Norcal
    Replies: 70
    Last Post: 07-22-2017, 07:17 AM
  3. Replies: 10
    Last Post: 05-25-2007, 11:31 AM
  4. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 02-08-2005, 10:50 AM

Members who have read this thread: 247

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

THE SITE

ABOUT MTBR

VISIT US AT

© Copyright 2019 VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.