Shigura MaXTR (Marta XTR Frankenbrake)- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Shigura MaXTR (Marta XTR Frankenbrake)

    So I had a set of pre-2008 Magura Martas. Very nice modulation, absolutely quiet, good power and light weight. Unfortunately, the levers kept leaking fluid and sucking air. A common problem with older Martas. I suppose this makes the brakes even lighter over time, but I still wasn't happy.
    Shimanos XTR M975 brake levers on the other hand are better sealed, and have a bigger reservoir, but the calipers are not all that great it seems.

    Both, however, run on mineral oil fluid. So, someone on another forum came up with a great idea: why not combine the two?

    A set of M975 levers was ordered. The hoses and fittings are compatible. I just removed the Magura levers and used new press-fittings from the Magura Service Kit to attach the hoses to the XTR levers, no extra parts required.
    Bled the brakes with Magura fluid, and - done:


    (also note the Alligator rotor, OBE brake pads, and Hope PM adaptor. This setup is probably not covered by any warranty.)

    The brake feels very, very similiar to a stock Marta. If anything, the XTR levers seem to build up a bit more pressure when you pull harder, so the brake is slightly more powerful now, without giving up the excellent modulation of the Marta. Other than that it is hard to notice any difference - except that I don't have to bleed them anymore after turning the bike upside down for a minute.

    Weight:



    Disclaimer:
    Combining brake parts from different manufacturers is something that everyone did back in the days of rim brakes, but nowadays with disc brakes, it is considered one of the seven deadly sins. This post is not meant to be instructional, in the same way that a bank robbery on the evening news is not meant to encourage people to rob banks. In fact, messing with hydraulic disc brakes is probably worse than robbing a bank. If you do this, your brakes might fail, and you will die.
    Last edited by lelebebbel; 11-08-2010 at 06:14 AM.
    wanted: Cannondale Lefty w/ V-brake studs

  2. #2
    MEGALOMANIAC
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    WTF are you smoking, snorting or shooting up??? LOL!!!
    life is... "All About Bikes"...

  3. #3
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    The XTR levers sure are sexy. I wonder if they would work on Saint 4-pot calipers?
    "It looks flexy"

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by gticlay
    The XTR levers sure are sexy. I wonder if they would work on Saint 4-pot calipers?
    Shimano is cross compatible across their line. So yes it will work on the Saint 810s.


    With that said, I can see how this will work as Mag and Shimano are both mineral oil. Also the Mag caliper looks more many compared to the girlie XTR.

    Please report back on long term use.

  5. #5
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    Will do, although I am not expecting any problems. The person who invented this has apparently been using this setup since 2008 without any issues.

    Quote Originally Posted by ambassadorhawg
    WTF are you smoking, snorting or shooting up??? LOL!!!
    If I was on drugs, I'd be combining the old Marta levers with XTR calipers. That would make a noisy brake that fades and leaks! Actually, I might do that yet, and sell the design to Hayes...

    Anyone need a set of Marta levers btw?
    wanted: Cannondale Lefty w/ V-brake studs

  6. #6
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    Lol great thread. The info combined with the humor made it a winner
    Ride

  7. #7
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    I wish it was the other way around, lol, I have a set of the exact same Marta levers which are duds (same thing, sucking air and leaking), but the calipers are hooked up to their newer levers (which have been less problematic). Wish I could do something with them...

    Very cool to see the two systems working well together.

  8. #8
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    ^Nothing is stopping you from using Mag levers with Shimano calipers other than buy the parts.

    I wonder if this will also work with Hope stuff.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by the-one1
    I wonder if this will also work with Hope stuff.
    You can't combine Hope with Shimano or Magura, because Hope brakes run on DOT 4 or DOT 5.1 brake fluid, which is glycol-based. This means that they use EPDM (ethylene propi-somethingsomething) seals, which will NOT tolerate the mineral oil fluid used in Shimano and Magura brakes. Getting EPDM seals in contact with mineral oil can permanently damage them. Mineral oil brakes use NBK seals, which - as far as I know - doesn't play with glycol brake fluid.

    You might, however, be able to combine Hope and Avid or Hayes brakes, if you can find a model that uses a similiar hydraulic leverage ratio.
    wanted: Cannondale Lefty w/ V-brake studs

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by lelebebbel
    You can't combine Hope with Shimano or Magura, because Hope brakes run on DOT 4 or DOT 5.1 brake fluid..................
    WTH was I thinking? When I was typing that, I though of mineral oil for Hope.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by the-one1
    Shimano is cross compatible across their line. So yes it will work on the Saint 810s.


    With that said, I can see how this will work as Mag and Shimano are both mineral oil. Also the Mag caliper looks more many compared to the girlie XTR.

    Please report back on long term use.
    Were cross compatible. I'm sure these older ones are but I already know the new XTR won't work with the M810 calipers.
    "It looks flexy"

  12. #12
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    its a numbers game.

    Quote Originally Posted by gticlay
    Were cross compatible. I'm sure these older ones are but I already know the new XTR won't work with the M810 calipers.
    m975 lever will work with m810 caliper but because they lack servo wave you will sacrifice power. The XTR m988 trail levers have servo wave but don't know if anyone has matched these to m810 calipers yet.

    Years ago there was a post by Hammerhead (i think) he fitted a m960 dual control lever/shifter to Magura Marta calipers., i guess it worked perfectly.

  13. #13
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    Okay, so I've got a leaky Julie HP lever. Can I throw in any cheapo Shimano lever to replace it and be done with all the worries?

    The "funny" thing about Julie HP is that it was awesome during the summer but failed on the first ride in 14F winter temperature after an hour and a half of riding. Lever sucks in air like a cheap ho and all you need to do is use the brake ten times in said temperature, after that complete loss of power and you've got a brake to bleed. Silly thing really since Magura forums have people with the exact same brake and the exact same problem and no info on manufacturers part as to why this is happening in the first place. I bet they only test their stuff in warm climates. A brake like this is a dangerous toy if you don't know it's going to fail given a certain low enough operating temperature.

    That's enough babbling... how about a solution to a problem aka a Shimano lever?!?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by rinseflow
    Okay, so I've got a leaky Julie HP lever. Can I throw in any cheapo Shimano lever to replace it and be done with all the worries?

    The "funny" thing about Julie HP is that it was awesome during the summer but failed on the first ride in 14F winter temperature after an hour and a half of riding. Lever sucks in air like a cheap ho and all you need to do is use the brake ten times in said temperature, after that complete loss of power and you've got a brake to bleed. Silly thing really since Magura forums have people with the exact same brake and the exact same problem and no info on manufacturers part as to why this is happening in the first place. I bet they only test their stuff in warm climates. A brake like this is a dangerous toy if you don't know it's going to fail given a certain low enough operating temperature.

    That's enough babbling... how about a solution to a problem aka a Shimano lever?!?

    Which is a little strange since Magura is in Germany and it's not all that warm there in the winter.
    "It looks flexy"

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by gticlay
    Which is a little strange since Magura is in Germany and it's not all that warm there in the winter.
    But not as cold as here up north either. I'm betting on a larger thermal contraction on some metal part than the plastic surroundings. One prime suspect would be the bleed hole plug, I'll put some plastic tape over it and see if that cures the lever... we'll see.

  16. #16
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    Been using

    Dual control XT shifter/levers with Louise FR calipers for two years without a problem. Gave up a tad in the lever feel department, but always felt the maggie levers were a bit mushy. Jim

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ratt
    m975 lever will work with m810 caliper but because they lack servo wave you will sacrifice power. The XTR m988 trail levers have servo wave but don't know if anyone has matched these to m810 calipers yet.
    .
    What do you think about to use servo wave XT-775 levers with Marta's caliper?

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jadis3
    What do you think about to use servo wave XT-775 levers with Marta's caliper?
    ? don't know. Shimano claims a 20% increase in power that can blow out seals in older designs (ie m755 or x60 and below calipers). But we've all been using old calipers and servo wave levers with no problems for years now.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by gticlay
    Which is a little strange since Magura is in Germany and it's not all that warm there in the winter.
    Yeah, it`s weird that they do have problems with the cold,
    german sites have quite a few complaints about that too.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ratt
    ? don't know. Shimano claims a 20% increase in power that can blow out seals in older designs (ie m755 or x60 and below calipers). But we've all been using old calipers and servo wave levers with no problems for years now.
    I'm running 775 levers with 965 calipers with no problems. It's been a couple years now. Big improvement over 965 levers with 965 calipers. They still lack a bit of bite though.

  21. #21
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    so you are using the stock magura lines, correct?

    what bleed procedure did you use? the magura system where you pump fluid from the bottom up. or the shimano way, pump fluid down, close nipple at caliper and pump out bubbles at the caliper.

    nice set up....i have a set of xtr levers in my garage, i'll be doing this soon.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1speed1der
    so you are using the stock magura lines, correct?

    what bleed procedure did you use? the magura system where you pump fluid from the bottom up. or the shimano way, pump fluid down, close nipple at caliper and pump out bubbles at the caliper.

    nice set up....i have a set of xtr levers in my garage, i'll be doing this soon.
    I bleed my Shimanos the Magura way, from the caliper up. So one would think either way is fine.

  23. #23
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    And here we go. From where does Maggie bleed/suck? From under the tape I placed over the reservoir plug. It's gotten so bad after a couple more arctic weather rides that not only does the lever suck in air, it's now actually bleeding hydraulic fluid from beneath the pluggy thing that's not plugging much of anything anymore. I haven't even touched the damn thing and it gets worse. Kinda lousy. If I'm counting correctly, I might be already over twenty rides on this brake or maybe it should rather be called a break.. yeah, as in gimme a break, Maggie!

  24. #24
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    hi! I have a dead a magura mts lever cylinder dead.. did someone make the frank with magura mt caliper with new shimano lever design??

  25. #25
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    Good job!

    my creation, my frankenbrake

    shimano m596 ispec a levers with servo + magura mt6 caliper

    such more power added.. i like so much!

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