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  1. #1
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    Hydraulics...convert me

    So I'm thinking about moving to hydraulic discs, but have yet to be swayed in one direction or another. I've run BB7's for years and not had too many poor experiences. I was hoping some one could fill me in on the advantages of going hydraulic as it seems most bike stores and people are moving in that direction. Weight differences? Maintenance? How often to bleed? etc...

    I should add, I'm doing this on a budget - so pretty much looking to spend whatever I make on selling the BB7's and levers (maybe a hundred bucks or so). I've heard the standard Shimano Deore hyrdos are nice, but I have no idea and nothing to compare it to

    Thanks

  2. #2
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    BB7s are awesome for cable discs.
    I've run them myself and like them.
    They aren't light, but the weight isn't bad.
    You get a bunch of lever choices with them.
    Easily the best cable disc system on the market in my opionion.

    Big difference that you'll notice with hydros is that it takes much less force/strength etc to apply constant pressure to the brake system and maintain effecive braking on long descents.

    With hydros, you are pushing fluid. You don't need to squeeze hard on the levers to maintain a constant pressure on the braking surface. The advantages becomes hugely apparent on long descents that require a lot of braking. No more "claw" and having to ask for helpt to uncurl your fingers from the grips and brake levers at the bottom.

    With the cable/mechanical brakes, most of the power applied is dependent on how hard you squeeze the levers and keep the pressure on. You get a bit of a boost from the cam system on the BB7s and can get an additional boost depending on the levers and how they are set up, but it is not the same as the gains you'll see from hydros.

    Ever driven an older car that doesn't have "power assisted" brakes? Notice how easy it is to get great braking from a modern car?

    Cable and hydraulic brakes sort of follow those same lines.

    BB7 maintence is so minimal if they are set up correctly. That's also a plus.

    That being said, properly set up hydros can go for several season without needing tweaking. Years even depending on how they were initially set up.

    You'll often be happy with the bleed that comes from the factory on hydraulics. Sometimes though, hydros benefit from an initial bleed.rebleed to set them up perfectly.

    Bleeding is easy and if you go the hydro route, I would encourage you to learn to bleed them early on. You can really dial in the feel of hydros once you know and understand what you want from a brake bleed. Best to learn to do it yourself.

    It's the improperly set up hydros that are the source of recurring problems and the bad rap that hydros get from some users-air in the lines-stuck pistons-howling-mushy levers, etc.

    Go to a bike shop and squeeze the hydraulic brakes on the bikes on display. You should find a mix of manufacturers. Go for a few test ridesin the parking lot on a demo or rental bike that has had some miles on the brake so you can feel what "broken in" hydros feel like. You won't get an idea of how hydros feel by riding new bikes when the pads aren't bedded etc.

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    Wow, thanks for the thorough explanation, I appreeciate it. I get that "claw" a lot where I ride w/ all the steep decents and I'm always wishing I didn't have to pull so hard/adjust my discs every other ride.

    As far as cheap options - I was looking at a set of Juicy 5's for around 80 bucks (for the pair), but the reviews don't seem spectacular. Any thoughts?

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    When upgrading don't go cheap....

    Shimano makes some great brakes....look around for deals and closeouts.

    http://www.jensonusa.com/store/closeouts.aspx

  5. #5
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    Norman gave a great list of reasons to go hydro. One thing I did not see mentioned, tho I may have missed it, is that hydro's don't need to be adjusted very often at all. They are designed to reset a certain distance from the rotor taking into account pad wear. With mechanical brakes you need to adjust for wear on a fairly regular basis.
    Nobody cares...........

  6. #6
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    I think Juicy 5s are an excellent brake.

    $80 for the pair is a great deal especially if they are new or very near it and the pads are fresh.

    There are a few things you'll need to check, otherwise that $80 is just going to be the admission fee to your hydraulic experience.

    Are the brakes new?

    Do the existing hose lengths fit/match the bike they are going on? If not, you're going to either need to cut or replace hydraulic hose and then rebleed.

    You should be able to match them up to your existing rotors/adapters that you run with your BB7s, so that should save some cash and hassle.

    I had a pair of 5's that I pulled out of retirement. All it took was just a little clean up on sticky pistons and a pad replacement and they were good to go. A rebleed was not needed even after sitting for years.

    Their "break in" ride was a 5k+ descent by my girlfriend on a light XC bike( Blur XC). That was the first big descent for her on that bike without BB7s. She raved about the Juicys.

    Juicy 5s are easy to set up. I really like Avid's caliper positioning sytem. Pad replacement is pretty easy too.

    Many people do not realize that Juicy 5s do have a reach/throw adjustment on the lever that basically does the same thing as the incorrectly named "pad contact adjust" dial on the pricier Avids.

    On the Juicy 5s, you just need to get the small allen keys out and you can dial that adjustment in easily. The adjustment is on the backside of the lever near the reservoir body. You can really dial in the feel of Juicy 5s if you want to.

    I think many people don't like the feel of some hydros because they were unaware of the ability to adjust the throw/reach on the levers and they just ride on the original set up which may not match their hand and lever feel preferences.

    Bleeding Avids is really easy. Especially so if you use their official kit. Their syringe/clamp system make a quality brake bleed possible for just about anyone the first time out. Plenty of instruction available from avid online via video and written instruction.

    You don't need the official Avid bleed kit, but you will need fittings that match up with the Avid caliper and reservoir-these fitting are found in most aftermarket universal bleed kits.

    If it's you're first time bleeding hydros and you end up with Avids, just get the Avid kit and have at it. It's the easiest system to use for their brakes when you are learning. You'll end up with the ability to do better and higher quality brake bleeds than many bike shops provide in short order. You should be able to buy the Avid kit and fluid for the price of a front and rear bleed at a bike shop. Learning about hydros yourself takes most of the mystery and misconceptions out of them.

  7. #7
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    Thanks again for candid response. I think I'm just going to spend a little more and get Elixer 5's, as they seem to fit the bill a little more for my riding preference. I like a VERY quick brake with little-to-no "slush" in the lever pulling action (if that makes any sense!). Plus, as stupid as this is, I'd like to stick with Avid because of my years of positive experience with the company before. They come pre-bled, which may not mean a thing, but I guess it'll be a good learning experience.

    Also saw a pair of "Hygia Usagi" (or something) that were white that looked pretty nice - though I've never heard the brand so I'm skeptical
    Last edited by JOwens14; 06-10-2010 at 10:50 AM.

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    I'm not quite sold.
    I've got BB7s on a hardtail and they work great but going back to them after going hydro you do notice more grip strength required and some hand fatigue as a result.

    My full squish has Hayes Stroker Carbons.
    They do require less hand force.
    Bleeding and aligning them isn't as easy as maintaining the BB7s.
    The tolerances are tight and the self adjustment is twichy / iffy.
    I was ready to send them back to Hayes when I managed to get them dialed in after several attempts. If it wasn't for the lost time I'd probably still send them in since they were showing signs of a lazy or sticky piston.

  9. #9
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    I don't like the lack of modulation on BB7's. Too much "ON" or "OFF" action for me. My trails are rock, loose rock, hardpack with loose rocks, and pieces of rocks rolling around on rocks. Did I mention there are rocks?

    It takes nothing to lock a wheel on these loose surfaces. I was constantly skidding with the BB7's.

    I have had good luck here with the cheapie Hayes 9 brakes. About $100 a set, and very good modulation. Not the best for pure power, but I don't need that here. The Avid Juicy brakes (Ive had 3's and 7's) also do not modulate as well as my Hayes do.

    If you ride trails with mondo traction, then you may feel that the Hayes 9 take too much pressure, but I like being able to finely control my braking.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norman Clydesdale
    IJuicy 5s are easy to set up. I really like Avid's caliper positioning sytem. Pad replacement is pretty easy too.

    Many people do not realize that Juicy 5s do have a reach/throw adjustment on the lever that basically does the same thing as the incorrectly named "pad contact adjust" dial on the pricier Avids.

    On the Juicy 5s, you just need to get the small allen keys out and you can dial that adjustment in easily. The adjustment is on the backside of the lever near the reservoir body. You can really dial in the feel of Juicy 5s if you want to.
    Avid pad replacement is much more difficult than either Formula or Shimano, both of which don't require taking the caliper off.

    Juicy 5s (as far as I know) do not allow you to adjust how close to the bars the lever is before the pads make contact. They do allow you to move the initial position of the lever closer to the bars, but this is not the same.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Penny
    Avid pad replacement is much more difficult than either Formula or Shimano, both of which don't require taking the caliper off.

    Juicy 5s (as far as I know) do not allow you to adjust how close to the bars the lever is before the pads make contact. They do allow you to move the initial position of the lever closer to the bars, but this is not the same.

    Avid pad replacement does not require taking the caliper off.

    The adjustment screw on the back of the Juicy 5 lever does the same thing as the Pad Contact Adjustment knobs that are featured on the front of some Avids. Pad Contact Adjust is just a an easier to use/access adjustment that doesn't require the traditional allen key. It's just a throw adjustment for the brake lever. Out=lever will activate and begin pushing fluid when further away from the handlebar. In=lever will activate and begin pushing fluid when closer to the bar. You'll get the same results from turning the allen adjuster on the backside of the Juicy 5s

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Normal Clydesdale
    Avid pad replacement does not require taking the caliper off.

    The adjustment screw on the back of the Juicy 5 lever does the same thing as the Pad Contact Adjustment knobs that are featured on the front of some Avids. Pad Contact Adjust is just a an easier to use/access adjustment that doesn't require the traditional allen key. It's just a throw adjustment for the brake lever. Out=lever will activate and begin pushing fluid when further away from the handlebar. In=lever will activate and begin pushing fluid when closer to the bar. You'll get the same results from turning the allen adjuster on the backside of the Juicy 5s
    Sorry your wrong Norman.

    The reach adjust is NOT the same as the Pad Contact Adjuster.
    Both Juicy 5's and Juicy 7's have the reach adjuster. They serve the purpose, only to move the lever in or out relative to the master piston. It does not move the master piston in the lever, does not more the fluid, does not change anything but the angle of the lever.

    The Pad contact adjuster physically moves FLUID in the lever which will change the physical fluid movement in the system, that is required to engage the brakes. Just like increasing / decreasing tension with your cable disc brakes. Although I agree the pad contact adjustment does not adjust the placement of the pistons in the caliper, which is why the name is a little incorrect... it still does change the lever motion required to brake.

    To OP:

    If you can pick up a pair of Juicy 7's you wont be dissapointed.

    If not, Juicy 5's are great, but Juicy 3's are also great and much cheaper.

    Depends on your budget!!

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norman Clydesdale
    Avid pad replacement does not require taking the caliper off.

    The adjustment screw on the back of the Juicy 5 lever does the same thing as the Pad Contact Adjustment knobs that are featured on the front of some Avids. Pad Contact Adjust is just a an easier to use/access adjustment that doesn't require the traditional allen key. It's just a throw adjustment for the brake lever. Out=lever will activate and begin pushing fluid when further away from the handlebar. In=lever will activate and begin pushing fluid when closer to the bar. You'll get the same results from turning the allen adjuster on the backside of the Juicy 5s
    nope. One adjusts how much the lever travels before it starts moving the pistons, the other adjusts how far the lever is from the bar.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue_neon
    Sorry your wrong Norman.
    Really....?

    On Jucy 3s, 5s, and Code 5s that little "reach adjust" screw is actually the pushrod which activates the piston when the brake lever is pulled.

    If you want your "pad contact" point to be away from the bars, turn it clockwise. You want it closer? Turn it counterclockwise.

    You will feel the indexed clicking of the pushrod as it turns on Juicy 5s and Code 5s.

    Go try it. You will notice that "pad contact" point changes.

    By adjusting the lever reach via the pushrod on 3s, 5s,and Code 5s, you are also adjusting where in the throw of the lever the "pad contact" point is.

    The official Pad Contact adjuster is different in how it acts on the pushrod.

    The official Pad Contact adjuster acts on a worm gear that has been incorporated into the coupling and coupling retainer (the coupling mates the pushrod to the piston). This Pad Contact dial eliminates the need turn the pushrod itself via an allen key like on the 3s, 5s and Code 5s. But like on those brakes, the "pad contact" point on brakes with the Pad Contact dial is dependent on where in the lever throw the pushrod activates the piston.

    By turning the Pad Contact adjuster dial, you are now turning the coupling. This adjusts where in the throw of the brake lever the pushrod begins to act on the piston. You are now just making the adjustment with a dial instead of going at it from the backside with an allen key.

    Want your "pad contact" point away from the bars? Turn the dial in the out direction. Want the "pad contact" point closer to the bars? Turn it towards the in direction. You get the same resulting "pad contact" adjustment as you do with the allen key adjustment on the pushrod itself.

    Now to Blue Neon's and Scotzg's points-What you point out is more applicable to the NEWER Taperbore Avids, but Juicy 3s, 5s, and Code 5s aren't Taperbore brakes. The Pad Contact adjustment and reach adjustment are not set up to be two independent systems on those brakes. The piston/bore/port set up is different on the Taperbores and you can better isolate the the reach adjustment from the "pad contact" point adjustment. The Pad Contact adjust on Taperbores engages an entirely different piston/bore system than the brakes I mentioned.

    Juicy 3s, 5s, and Code 5's have always had a "pad contact" adjustment. It was just combined with the reach adjust via the pushrod.
    You've always been able to adjust "pad contact" on those brakes, but you ended up adjusting the reach in the process or vice versa.

    The non Taperbore sytems that feature a Pad Contact dial on the front of the brake should not be confused with the Taperbore systems that feature a Pad Contact dial. They are two VERY different systems.

    I wasn't speaking to Taperbore systems when I was pointing out the adjustments on 3s, 5s, and Code 5s.

    On the non Taperbore brakes that feature a Pad Contact dial, you are unable to completely isolate the "pad contact" from the reach adjuster even though those brakes feature "independent" adjustements for each. It doesn't matter that the adjustments are independent, because they are both acting on a pushrod/coupling/piston/bore system that doesn't allow them to be as "independent" as the Taperbore brakes.

    Next time you are around a set of CODES, try the following:

    Set the reach adjustment of the levers via the reach adjuster.

    Now set the "pad contact" point via the Pad Contact dial.

    Go back and tweak the reach adjustment again so that the levers are closer to the bar. You will see how the "pad contact" point also changes. It now activates closer to the bar.

    Set the reach adjustment so the lever is now far away from the bar and you will see that the pad contact point has changed again.

    So, like on 3s, 5s, and Code 5s, the "pad contact" system on non Taperbore Avids that feature the Pad Contact dial is not isolated from the reach adjust system. Yes, it allows more independent adjustment of both reach and "pad contact", but both are still tied together.
    Last edited by 11053; 06-13-2010 at 06:27 PM.

  15. #15
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    Where is it you're finding Juciy 5's for $80 for the pair? Is that the full kit w/rotors, or just the caliper and lever?

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by JOwens14
    So I'm thinking about moving to hydraulic discs, but have yet to be swayed in one direction or another. I've run BB7's for years and not had too many poor experiences. I was hoping some one could fill me in on the advantages of going hydraulic as it seems most bike stores and people are moving in that direction. Weight differences? Maintenance? How often to bleed? etc...

    I should add, I'm doing this on a budget - so pretty much looking to spend whatever I make on selling the BB7's and levers (maybe a hundred bucks or so). I've heard the standard Shimano Deore hyrdos are nice, but I have no idea and nothing to compare it to

    Thanks
    I would not change to hydros on that tight budget. When you factor in your entire cost (brake system, bleed kit or similar, shipping and/or taxes etc) you have no room for any error.

    That being said, if you are happy with your BB7 why do you want to change in the first place? I have BB7 and hydors. For me weight and (really bad) hand fatigue would be the only reasons to change. BB7 require a bit more regular attention than hydros but the attention is a lot easier.

  17. #17
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    If you're finding Juicy 5s for $80, they are probably in need of some help - new pads, a bleed, rotors, etc. That's just too cheap for a full, properly functioning brakeset.

    As mentioned, I wouldn't upgrade to hydros on a tight budget. Low end hydros suck, and are not any better than BB7s - they're finicky, require more maintenance and aren't any lighter (hell, even higher end hydros don't give you that big a weight difference).

    Despite what anyone says, it is possible to set up BB7s to have gobs of power and modulation. And they really are bombproof. I have Juicy Ultimates on one bike and BB7s on another. The Juicys are great, tons of power and lots of adjustability. The BB7s require more effort to set up, but once they're set, they just plain work. I've ridden the same trails with both, and prefer the lever feel of the hydros, but haven't felt either set to be lacking power.

    Bleeding can be a *****, but all in all, it's not that difficult. Definitely do it yourself. Do it right the first time around and you should be set for a while.
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  18. #18
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    BB7 vs XTR

    I have both XTRs and BB7s. I use the BB7 calipers on my quite hideous road converted 29er El Mariachi.

    I wanted an easily switchable set up so I have two complete set of bars with shifters, levers and calipers that I can swap out. The BB7s are hooked up to a road bar and the XTRs reside on a carbon flat bar.

    The BB7s are complete BOAT ANCHORS.....

    They work very well I have to admit, but must be a full pound heavier than my XTRs.

    That is a pretty big downside, but they are very cheap to buy by comparison.

    Drew
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  19. #19
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    For weight comparison...

    My 2007 BB7s with 180F/160R alligator serrated rotors, Koolstop pads, Avid SD7 levers, and Jagwire cables w/full length housing weigh 974g. Probably paid $140 for the set, everything brand new.

    My Juicy Ultimates with 185F/160R G2 rotors, Jagwire HyFlow hoses and standard pads weighs 831g. Paid $240 off ebay, rear brake was lightly used, but all new rotors and pads, etc. CF levers, but they only offer about a 10g weight savings over alu ones. I'm not sold on them - still worried I'm gonna break them during a crash.

    Both weights include appropriate mounting hardware, which is roughly the same weight between the sets. So the weight savings is negligible, in my case.
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    BB7s worked great for mechanicals. Hayes hfx-9 were on/off brakes, not much modulation. My current Shimano LX hydros are great. Plenty of stopping power and great modulation. I won't be straying from Shimano hydros, plus you can mix and match levers/calipers if you wreck your bike on the trails.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norman Clydesdale
    Ever driven an older car that doesn't have "power assisted" brakes? Notice how easy it is to get great braking from a modern car?
    Irrelevant to bikes. Vacuum assist.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by JOwens14
    So I'm thinking about moving to hydraulic discs, but have yet to be swayed in one direction or another. I've run BB7's for years and not had too many poor experiences. I was hoping some one could fill me in on the advantages of going hydraulic as it seems most bike stores and people are moving in that direction. Weight differences? Maintenance? How often to bleed? etc...

    I should add, I'm doing this on a budget - so pretty much looking to spend whatever I make on selling the BB7's and levers (maybe a hundred bucks or so). I've heard the standard Shimano Deore hyrdos are nice, but I have no idea and nothing to compare it to

    Thanks
    it seems to me that properly set up BB7s and better than some of the more lame hydros but not as good as the high end hydros..it all comes down to what I can afford I am going to buy some shimano XTs as I find them to be good for most situations

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    Thanks everyone for the discussion. After reading all of this and doing my research, I decided to hold off on the upgrade until I can swing for a substantial brake upgrade. I through a new set of levers on there (Cane Creek Direct Curve) and it made a HUGE difference - so I think I'll just rest on these until something better is in my reach

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    Quote Originally Posted by chas_martel
    Norman gave a great list of reasons to go hydro. One thing I did not see mentioned, tho I may have missed it, is that hydro's don't need to be adjusted very often at all. They are designed to reset a certain distance from the rotor taking into account pad wear. With mechanical brakes you need to adjust for wear on a fairly regular basis.
    I rarely have to muck around with my BB7s, I have been using them for many seasons and find that those that have problems with them simply do not understand how they work or have problems with other issues such as poorly set up skewers.I occasionally reach down and turn in the pad rotor adjusters as the pads wear..not too much work there.So much operator error is blamed on a component

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lule
    Irrelevant to bikes. Vacuum assist.
    Just used to give the OP an idea of what he might notice from the benefits of pushing fluid over pulling cable. His question was a general "what will I notice for advantages of hydros over mechanicals question" and not a "how do hydros do the voodo that they do question." Not to be taken literally as precise brake system to system comparison and I doubt the OP took it as such.

    Sounds like it got the point across to the OP, as comparing what one FEELS when going from mechanicals to hydros on a bike is very akin to what one FEELS when going from an unassisted to a "power" braking system in a car.

    If anyone with a literal bend is struggling to navigate the attempted analogy, I apologize. I now see that "irrelevant to bikes" could also be due to the physiological crux of mtb brakes being activated by hand and car brakes being activated by a foot pedal.

    Please, please, please, DO NOT attempt to drive and stop a car featuring a power assisted braking system and then hop on your bike and attempt to use your feet to activate the brake levers in search of an accurate comparison.

    I hope I this warning gets out in time to save a life.

  26. #26
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    One other benefit to hydro's that nobody's mentioned is they're winterproof. Don't know if you do any riding in freezing temperatures, but if you do, you've probably already discovered the hard way that on occasion, cables freeze. Hydraulic lines do not. (At least not in any temperatures I've ridden in.) And, of course, mud can mess with a cable/housing system, but hydraulic lines are impervious.
    Quote Originally Posted by trogdor
    I think everyone who wears a helmit should carry around an old crank arm, then when you see someone without a helmit on, give them a good wack in the head. That'll teach them to flaut their helmit-less noggins out in public.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JOwens14
    Thanks everyone for the discussion. After reading all of this and doing my research, I decided to hold off on the upgrade until I can swing for a substantial brake upgrade. I through a new set of levers on there (Cane Creek Direct Curve) and it made a HUGE difference - so I think I'll just rest on these until something better is in my reach
    smart move......gday

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    Quote Originally Posted by JOwens14
    Thanks everyone for the discussion. After reading all of this and doing my research, I decided to hold off on the upgrade until I can swing for a substantial brake upgrade. I through a new set of levers on there (Cane Creek Direct Curve) and it made a HUGE difference - so I think I'll just rest on these until something better is in my reach
    Keep an eye on closeout/overstock offers on HIGH END brake systems from the online retailers.

    The high end brake systems often take HUGE price hits and get priced to MOVE each season.

    Sure, you're going to spend a bit of $$$, but I've seen things like Juicy Ultimates and Stroker Grams cheap. Way cheaper than many mid range systems, you just need to keep an eye out.

    They can be a great deal when you get titanium hardware, top shelf pads and rotors, and a decent weight savings.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by upNdown
    One other benefit to hydro's that nobody's mentioned is they're winterproof. Don't know if you do any riding in freezing temperatures, but if you do, you've probably already discovered the hard way that on occasion, cables freeze. Hydraulic lines do not. (At least not in any temperatures I've ridden in.) And, of course, mud can mess with a cable/housing system, but hydraulic lines are impervious.
    I never had a cable freeze, I use my bike year round here in Idaho with riding conditions factoring in windchill of min 10 degrees, just my personel experience riding in what many consider the lowest temp they want to be riding in.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by oscarperez
    I never had a cable freeze, I use my bike year round here in Idaho with riding conditions factoring in windchill of min 10 degrees, just my personel experience riding in what many consider the lowest temp they want to be riding in.
    Same here, never had a cable brake freeze. Shifter cables, yes. Brake cables, no. Espcially with full length housing.
    Axle Standards Explained

    Founder at North Atlantic Dirt, riding & writing about trails in the northeast.

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Norman Clydesdale
    Just used to give the OP an idea of what he might notice from the benefits of pushing fluid over pulling cable. His question was a general "what will I notice for advantages of hydros over mechanicals question" and not a "how do hydros do the voodo that they do question." Not to be taken literally as precise brake system to system comparison and I doubt the OP took it as such.

    Sounds like it got the point across to the OP, as comparing what one FEELS when going from mechanicals to hydros on a bike is very akin to what one FEELS when going from an unassisted to a "power" braking system in a car.

    If anyone with a literal bend is struggling to navigate the attempted analogy, I apologize. I now see that "irrelevant to bikes" could also be due to the physiological crux of mtb brakes being activated by hand and car brakes being activated by a foot pedal.

    Please, please, please, DO NOT attempt to drive and stop a car featuring a power assisted braking system and then hop on your bike and attempt to use your feet to activate the brake levers in search of an accurate comparison.

    I hope I this warning gets out in time to save a life.
    I felt it was unclear and 'wordy.' I didn't want to OP to think that there was some type extra multiplication of force from just using a fluid over a cable. Not everyone knows how automotive brake systems operate.

    I do apologize for my vicious, five word post. I'll attempt to turn down my vitriol.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lule

    I do apologize for my vicious, five word post. I'll attempt to turn down my vitriol.
    At least you acknowledge the brutality.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Berkley
    Same here, never had a cable brake freeze. Shifter cables, yes. Brake cables, no. Espcially with full length housing.
    I've never run full length housing. But now that you mention it, I'm not 100% sure I can remember my brake cables freezing. Shifter cables, like you say, definitely. But I'm pretty sure it's happened to me because I remember that was one of the reasons I made the switch to hydraulic discs to begin with.

    Iowa guy above, cables aren't going to freeze in 10 degrees - it's too cold. I remember it happening when it was below freezing, but not so cold that everything was frozen. Water or slush would accumlate places and freeze.
    Quote Originally Posted by trogdor
    I think everyone who wears a helmit should carry around an old crank arm, then when you see someone without a helmit on, give them a good wack in the head. That'll teach them to flaut their helmit-less noggins out in public.

  34. #34
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    I'm sure all the details were covered, but I did want to say, if you go to hydraulics, go with the best.

    Otherwise, your BB7's are superior to the cheap ones, particularly in the area of maintenance.

  35. #35
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    $100 used - Started with Avid MgTi. Worked great. Little Maintenance. The World stopped using them.
    $100 used - Went to Juicy 5s. Heavy. Noisy. Ok in general.
    $200 used - Went to XTR. Blew bubbles. Seeped oil. Worked only when hot.
    $100 used - Went to BB7s. Very heavy. Needed 2 finger pulling sometimes.
    $200 used - Went to Juicy Ultimates. The rear kept rubbing. Hard to bleed.
    $500 new - Went to Hope Race X2s. Perfect in every way.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by upNdown
    I've never run full length housing. But now that you mention it, I'm not 100% sure I can remember my brake cables freezing. Shifter cables, like you say, definitely. But I'm pretty sure it's happened to me because I remember that was one of the reasons I made the switch to hydraulic discs to begin with.

    Iowa guy above, cables aren't going to freeze in 10 degrees - it's too cold. I remember it happening when it was below freezing, but not so cold that everything was frozen. Water or slush would accumlate places and freeze.
    uh.....I am from IDAHO I have been running BB7s for many seasons on my hardtail which is used for commuting year round and trail riding, I put about 3k/year on that bike, my Heckler has BB7s too.Temp range about 10f to 105f, rain snow or whatever, never any problems.I do run premium full length cables because my bikes leave me no choice, I replace every season all cables and housings.I suppose any brake system is not exempt from failure?

  37. #37
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    Oscarperez, which cables are you using?

  38. #38
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    http://www.bikeparts.com/search_resu...p?ID=BPC135169 this housing with shimano prem cable lubed with silicon grease
    Last edited by oscarperez; 06-18-2010 at 08:16 PM.

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