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  1. #1
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    New question here. Reign or Trance?

    Hi,

    Not been on here for a good few years (in fact last time was the last day of the realtime chat room...those were the days!!!). Anyway, I'm looking for opinions and advice.

    I've finally decided that I want a full bounce bike, I'm currently riding a Specialized M5 hardtail with F80X forks...really nice ride (BB is a bit low but otherwise great) and it's been very good...but lately I've done a few big days out in the hills of Scotland and thought that full bounce might have been a bit more of a help - some climbs and many of the descents I'm sure would have been done smoother/faster with the aid of some bounce at both ends of the bike.

    Having a read at some reviews I think I'm sold on Giant's new Maestro full bounce bikes but I'm not sure on what travel I want. I'm not fussed about weight but I don't want a heavy bike - the current bike is 23.5lbs without much weight saving being done - I'd be most happy if the full bouncer came in at around 27lbs or less but it's not a deciding factor really. I can't decide on the Reign 1 or Trance 1 - both have the same finishing kit so it really just comes down to the way the bikes ride and the travel. I'm looking for a bike that can be ridden all day up and down the hills, handle some technical stuff, the steering has been immediate and I don't want the bike to feel as though it's a barge wallowing around.

    From the reviews I've read I know that both bikes do not feel barge like and certainly don't wallow but I'm not sure about the travel - I reckon the Trance will be lighter but has just over 4 inches and the Reign has 6 inches...my thoughts aren't really clear - is 4 inches enough for today's technology and riding (bearing in mind I'm an all-day XCer and don't go for air or jumps) or should I go for 6inches as that's the way bikes are moving.

    Also, when do Giant bring out their 2006 range and are these bikes going to change for next year?

    Your thoughts, please...

    Cheers.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by DickBarton
    Hi,

    Not been on here for a good few years (in fact last time was the last day of the realtime chat room...those were the days!!!). Anyway, I'm looking for opinions and advice.

    I've finally decided that I want a full bounce bike, I'm currently riding a Specialized M5 hardtail with F80X forks...really nice ride (BB is a bit low but otherwise great) and it's been very good...but lately I've done a few big days out in the hills of Scotland and thought that full bounce might have been a bit more of a help - some climbs and many of the descents I'm sure would have been done smoother/faster with the aid of some bounce at both ends of the bike.

    Having a read at some reviews I think I'm sold on Giant's new Maestro full bounce bikes but I'm not sure on what travel I want. I'm not fussed about weight but I don't want a heavy bike - the current bike is 23.5lbs without much weight saving being done - I'd be most happy if the full bouncer came in at around 27lbs or less but it's not a deciding factor really. I can't decide on the Reign 1 or Trance 1 - both have the same finishing kit so it really just comes down to the way the bikes ride and the travel. I'm looking for a bike that can be ridden all day up and down the hills, handle some technical stuff, the steering has been immediate and I don't want the bike to feel as though it's a barge wallowing around.

    From the reviews I've read I know that both bikes do not feel barge like and certainly don't wallow but I'm not sure about the travel - I reckon the Trance will be lighter but has just over 4 inches and the Reign has 6 inches...my thoughts aren't really clear - is 4 inches enough for today's technology and riding (bearing in mind I'm an all-day XCer and don't go for air or jumps) or should I go for 6inches as that's the way bikes are moving.

    Also, when do Giant bring out their 2006 range and are these bikes going to change for next year?

    Your thoughts, please...

    Cheers.
    I would go the Reign personally because I like the downhilling portion of XC riding, so the extra travel is beneficial. I only climb up so I can go down. You're right about the weight, so it depends on how much that really matters to you. The Reign is almost 10 pounds heavier than your current M5. I ride a Giant VT with 5.75" in the rear and have not noticed any tradeoff on climbing over my 4" Cannondale. Good luck.

  3. #3
    Phil from San Diego
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    I bought my 04 giant back in Feburary of this year... and think the 05's came out around late March or early April... So I'd assume the 06 giants will be out next year around the same time.


    Phil.

  4. #4
    Time is not a road.
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    Always the perplexing question...

    I think if you're getting along on your trails, the ones you'll ride most frequently, with the HT, then 4" is all you'll ever need. But if you plan on moving or think that frequent trips to the mtns are in your future, I'd get the Reign.

    One mag reviewed this bike by saying that XC racers will think it's bulky but that trail riders will just "get it right away". Which are you?

  5. #5
    Time is not a road.
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    Always the perplexing question...

    I think if you're getting along on your trails, the ones you'll ride most frequently, with the HT, then 4" is all you'll ever need. But if you plan on moving or think that frequent trips to the mtns are in your future, I'd get the Reign.

    One mag reviewed this bike by saying that XC racers will think it's bulky but that trail riders will just "get it right away". Which are you?

  6. #6
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    Well, I'm certainly no racer...I'm built like one but that's it...I resemble the image but no, I prefer all day out in the hills (or mountains...whatever is there)...but I don't ride extreme terrain like jumps, drops and stuff...I like both wheels on the ground but I'm not scared to do steep ups or downs...the technical stuff scares the beejeesus out of me and I reckon the full bounce will help me there...but with technology how it is now, is there going to be a major difference between the way the 4" and the 6" bieks ride? With all this pro-pedal stuff and valves and whatnot, the bikes have minimal bob, so you are left with suspension travel when you need it...as each bike is the same price, it comes down to asking myself if the extra 2" is worth the extra weight (one shop told me that the Reign 1 weighs in at around 29lbs - which seems a bit light for it in my view...but the Trance would come it at around 26-27lbs if that's the case - and the only real difference is the fork and the rear triangle as it only allows 4" travel) - I need to ride each to decide but even that's presenting problems as I'd like to ride them back-to-back over the same stuff...

    Decisions, decisions...

  7. #7
    Totally Rad
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    If it's going to be your only bike, get the Trance. It won't be too heavy, and it will have a good bit of travel for most trail terrain. If you're going to keep your hardtail, you could get the Reign for more agressive terrain, and ride the hardtail when it's a smoother trail.

  8. #8
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    Trance............

    I think the 4" travel trance will be better for you.
    You are coming from a lightweight hardtail and don't do rough descents, The reign will be to much.

    When you switch to full suspension there is a learning period as you discover how to take advantage of the fully suspended bike's handling characteristics. The way you ride will change a bit: will sit and peddle where you used to stand, will be able to take turns at higher speeds, will have better traction on technical climbs, be more aggresive on technical sections, etc etc.

    The 4" of travel will feel just amazing.

    Once you make the handling transition, which may take you from 3 to 6 months, the newness of the fully suspended experience will keep you entertained for at least two years.

    Eventually, you may be tempted to push yours and your bike's capabilities even further and then you may find yourself wanting more travel. However if you continue to do the same trails you are doing now, the 4" will satisfy you for a couple of years.

    Pedro

  9. #9
    EDR
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    I demo'd a stock Reign 2...it weighed in at 34lbs, I find it very hard to believe a stock Reign 1 (isnt' that the lower end model with the Splice fork???) is 29lbs but i'm not a Giant expert. All I can tell you is that it felt like a tank to me, I hated it. The reason I am chiming in here is because you say you now ride a 24lb bike and are lookinig for f/s bike, not too heavy, around 27lbs would be ok....I really don't think thats what you will find with the Reign.

    I am used to a 27-28lb xc 4'' travel f/s bike and when I rode that Reign 2 I headed back to the truck after 20 minutes of riding. It just wasn't the bike for me. Personally I think it's overkill if you don't like technical downhill and always want to keep the wheels on the ground.

    Just my opinion but i would say don' t buy without riding one. You might be surprised at how heavy "it feels" compared to what you are used to riding.

  10. #10
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    Hmmm, useful info there, thanks. I'm not aggressive, but I enjoy technical trails...if I can't ride a bit I just get off and walk - which doesn't bother me until I see someone else riding it then it annoys me!

    I'm going to test ride both bikes and decide...I think I'm hovering between the 2 as I mentioned the technology nowadays means that the 4" and the 6" travel ride in a similar fashion i.e. they both do not wallow...I'm certain that once I'm into this new fangled full bounce thing, I'll be riding harder and more aggressively so I guess I'm needing to decide how much more aggressively I'll be to determine how much bounce I need. Almost all my riding mates who are on full boun3ce are now riding 5"+ which makes me also think that 4" will soon be a thing of the past (unless you are a racer)...

    The Reign 1 and Trance 1 are teh top end bikes...I'd be very surprised if the Reign 1 was below 30lbs...but he's the guy that works in the bike shop and has weighed them...

    Cheers for the advice and info so far...

  11. #11
    Wood chips are stupid
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    Easy

    Buy a Turner.

  12. #12
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    Why? What's a Turner going to offer me that the Giant doesn't? If it's the name and exclusivity then thanks but no thanks...not interested in a name...I want performance - I'm very much function over form whereas a large number of people area form over function...

    Also, the Turner ain't going to be as cheap as the Giant...but I'd be interested to hear your justification of the Turner please...

  13. #13
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    Reign

    I have a lightweight hardtail with a SID and a second bike with a Pike (also a hardtail but not at all like the first). Its nice to have bikes meant for very different types of riding instead of two that are similiar.

    6" of travel and 2.5" tires have opened up a whole new world of riding. Use the long travel for all that it is worth and you will not have time to worry about wallowing.

  14. #14
    Wood chips are stupid
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    why a Turner...

    Quote Originally Posted by DickBarton
    Why? What's a Turner going to offer me that the Giant doesn't? If it's the name and exclusivity then thanks but no thanks...not interested in a name...I want performance - I'm very much function over form whereas a large number of people area form over function...

    Also, the Turner ain't going to be as cheap as the Giant...but I'd be interested to hear your justification of the Turner please...

    DickBarton,
    Performance,performance,performance. Four bar rules if you want an active rear end durning braking(decending) and over all ride.The frames are also very balanced. Both ends will stay stuck to the ground when cornering,climbing,decending and tossing it around in the tight stuff. Another cool thing is Turner uses bushings instead of cart. bearings in their pivot points. Much more durable and easy to lube because they have "zerks" to inject your favorate grease with! I lube mine about once or twice a year.Frame construction is always very good. Tight,even beads in the welds and straight every time. BB shell is cleaned and the head tube is flush,always.Cool stickers. Price is a deal breaker for a lot of folks.$1600-1900 bucks is a lot for a frame. But if you can hold out for a little longer and shop around...go for it. The Turner name has been growing the past couple of years or so. But Turner has been building bikes since around 93' or 94' I think. Back then they were regarded as the best you can buy.The bikes still are a benchmark all others try to meet. Ask around,talk to the riders you meet on the trail. If they are on a Turner,ask them what they think and what they rode before the bought the Turner. I think if you do some poking around you will find out what Turner is all about. The flashy ad campain you see on MTBR.COM is only very recent. And I can bet Giant spends a lot more on ads than Dave does.One last thing,with a decent build,you can get a 5 Spot down to 26.5 pounds,a Flux even lighter. If you go with Giant, get the Trance. I hope this has helped. Good luck and Happy trails!

    aldeluxe
    Last edited by akdeluxe; 08-04-2005 at 10:20 AM.

  15. #15
    Time is not a road.
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    I agree with Pedro. 4" of travel, coming from none, will keep you entertained for a long time. By then, when you're ready, 7" travel, 26lb bikes will be the order of the day!

  16. #16
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    recent mtbike rag spec'd the Reign 1 at 33 pounds ... that with Manitou's Nixon Platinum shock (which is pretty heavy - and getting horrible reviews). I'd say you need to nail down the actual weight difference - is it really only 1 or 2 pounds (which, to some would be HUGE) or is it more like 5 pounds (which is significant no matter who you're talking to)? Weight aside - I concur with the thinking that going from an HT to FS, 4" should would be enough to make your current semi-sketchy descents seem like a walk in the park. Either way, Giant makes a nice bike with a very nice component spec for a decent price. (isn't the reign 1 about $3,300.00?)

  17. #17
    EDR
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    Don't listen to all the hype...."active rear susp" is not always a positive trait. It's not bad either, just depends on what you are talking about. Bottom line is too much tech talk will ruin your buying experience. Just ride! Ride a Turner or a Giant or whatever!

  18. #18
    No, that's not phonetic
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    Quote Originally Posted by DickBarton
    Why? What's a Turner going to offer me that the Giant doesn't?
    Apparently not much, based on the Trance and Reign owner who recently posted about how he feels uninspired by his 5-Spot...

    Anyway, sorry to wander into the weeds here, but I was looking the maestros over at IBike and was wondering how much you are limiting your future shock options based on the rather odd and seemingly tight shock mounting on these frames:



    Also, it looks to be a 7.5x2.0. Is that correct? A leverage of 3:1? Hopefully the dust settles a bit at the Giant booth this year and I will have a chance to try one...
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  19. #19
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    A friend of mine has a trance 1.

    I think it weighs ~25.5 lbs. It comes with a very good selection of parts (fox fork, rp3 shock, beautiful wheels, hayes brakes....). He uses it for racing and trail-riding. I certainly wouldn't feel inferior showing up to a trailhead with on of these. It's a very nice bike, and comes at a reasonable price given the total package. I think that's the way to go for you. I know it's tempting to get the biggest, baddest bike out there, but the reign seems like it's going to be overkill for you. If you follow the forums much, you'll notice a small under-current of riders who go out and get a long-travel bike, ride it for a year, and realize they would be better-suited with something more moderate. Either that, or they slap light-weight components onto their long-travel bike and start wars over in the turner forum.

  20. #20
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    I went from a 5" Speczld enduro to a 4" Trance 2 The bike is so stiff and tracks so well that it is superior ride all round. THe Reign will be well over 30lbs - DEFINITELY. You will probably ride faster on the Trance than your mates 5" bikes.

  21. #21
    bi-winning
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    I am surprised to see reccomendations for the Reign. I think that the Trance is designed to be that all day enduro style mtb. Coming from the M4 i think the reign would feel like an absolute beast. 6 inches of travel is so much, and people have noted it can feel like even more than that. It is capable of some real gnarly stuff. Not the bike i would choose. I think the Trance's lighter weight and higher efficiency would be the logical choice to smooth out your rides.
    When under pressure, your level of performance will sink to your level of preparation.

  22. #22
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    I'm still yet to test ride the 2 bikes but I'm thinking the Trance is the one to go for now...thanks for all the opinions...always helps before a purchase!

  23. #23
    EDR
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    Quote Originally Posted by DickBarton
    I'm still yet to test ride the 2 bikes but I'm thinking the Trance is the one to go for now...thanks for all the opinions...always helps before a purchase!
    President Bush rides a Trance!

    Seriously, that Reign is a dog imho. Trance will be much faster feeling and quicker to react to your input. More like what you are used to but better. IMO Trance is the better bike for you. The Reign is just too much travel and too much weight to lug around. The Trance will be a BLAST!

  24. #24
    Portland, OR
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    Go with the Reign, i've been riding a Reign 2 for a while and I love it. it is a bit of a tank for XC but it'll definatly pay off in the end when you see tricky decents that look like fun

  25. #25
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    I Love My Reign!!! :)

    I went from a ~20lb hardtail to the Reign and I've never looked back...it definitely is a good 10lbs heavier, but when your actually riding it its not nearly as noticeable as I had imagined it would be, just when ur loading it onto the rack Anyway, I test rode the Trance also and it is a great bike, and is probably all (or more) than you'll need, but for me the Reign was only slightly heavier, and still rode extremely efficiently and has that extra 2" just in case, and just in case has started to come up every ride now The Reign is awesome and I am definitely hitting harder steeper, and gnarlier stuff than ever before. The trance will make your current trails seem like butter, the reign will have you looking for new steeper and more difficult trails! Either way you can't lose the meastro suspension is amazing! Good luck!

  26. #26
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    Go with the Trance

    Just picked up a Trance 3. I'm usually riding 4-6 hours a day for 2 or 3 days in a row over the weekends in Quebec, NY, Ontario and Vermont. I had a Rocky Mountain Hammer hardtail that I loved, but I too wanted something to make the ascents and descents a little smoother. I bought a Marin with 6" and found that it was just too much for the type of riding it seems we both do. I don't think one needs more than 4" for mostly XC type riding even with fairly large drops and sketchy descents. I find the Trance to be perfect for the all day riding I do. Climbs really well, is stiff enough not to sap all my energy and provides a nice smooth ride. I'm sure with the better components on the Trance 1 or 2, you'd love it even more.

  27. #27
    Johny Sokko!
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    Cool-blue Rhythm

    Like these guys have said!

    The R E I G N is a bike of evolution! If I could put it in a quote "On your left" this is what you will be saying to the person on a standard XC bike with a smile on your face. Remember... unless you are training for a trophy, riding is about having a good time and that is usually on the way down a hill. The sucker floats like a Cadillac up and down.

    As a matter of fact! I use the stock stem and handle bar for normal riding and switch out a Diabolous 70mm Stem and 2" Riser Bar for the steep fun rides. That's what the R E I G N offers you.

    Stoner (R E I G N R I D E R)

  28. #28
    Meh.
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    Sounds like you're looking for the Trance since you don't plan on hitting any drops or anything remotlely gnarly. The Trance is strictly a XC bike. The Reign is more of an "all mountain" bike. The Trance is a bit lighter. The Reign is a bit tougher.

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