Results 1 to 53 of 53
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25

    Need some advice

    I am in the market for a 29er full suspension and had my mind set on a trek superfly 100 elite. My question is when buying a trek are you paying a lot for the name? I am not asking this just to have a bunch of you bash trek I am just looking for some guidance to help me make the right purchase. I was at a local bike shop yesterday and the guy was talking about the GT bikes and told me they were pretty sick. I have 3k to spend would love to spend less but that is my cap and I am also new to the sport so I don't need top of the line stuff. Thanks

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation: jrogs's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    229
    Here are some reviews.
    Trek Superfly 100 29er Full Suspension Reviews

    Have you ridden it? That is the biggest thing. Ride a few and see what you like best. The trek is a fine bike. It has super decent parts. I don't think that is a bad bike at all. I think trek bikes look super cool the last couple years. I personally would get the trek over a GT but it is all personal preference. But for 3g's you have a lot of options so make sure you get a bike that fits your needs.

  3. #3
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    Quote Originally Posted by jrogs View Post
    Here are some reviews.
    Trek Superfly 100 29er Full Suspension Reviews

    Have you ridden it? That is the biggest thing. Ride a few and see what you like best. The trek is a fine bike. It has super decent parts. I don't think that is a bad bike at all. I think trek bikes look super cool the last couple years. I personally would get the trek over a GT but it is all personal preference. But for 3g's you have a lot of options so make sure you get a bike that fits your needs.
    Thanks for the help I will check out the link

  4. #4
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    21
    What the guy above me said. Ride the bike to see how it feels, that's probably the most important aspect other than budget.

    But 3k should buy a pretty sweet bike.
    One other thing would be to see what components are on the bike to find out if any may have problems and how much trouble/expensive they are to fix.
    But I don't really have anything of value to add on the Trek, so I'll shut up.

  5. #5
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    I don't know a ton about the components but from what I have been told the 2013 superfly 100 AL elite comes with some nice stuff

  6. #6
    sock puppet
    Reputation: osokolo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,098
    in general terms, you can ask the same question about few other brands, not just Trek... i would not lose my sleep over this concern.

    more importantly - what kind of riding are you planning on doing with this bike? what kind of terrain?

    are you open to other brands/models?

    did you test ride Superfly? did you test ride any other 29er. is this your first 29er?

    help us help you.

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    61

    The 2013 Supertly is an all new design with geometry

    Very different from 2012. Don't know about your area but I know they aren't in my area yet to demo. The pics look awesome. Can't wait to try one myself!

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    in general terms, you can ask the same question about few other brands, not just Trek... i would not lose my sleep over this concern.

    more importantly - what kind of riding are you planning on doing with this bike? what kind of terrain?

    are you open to other brands/models?

    did you test ride Superfly? did you test ride any other 29er. is this your first 29er?

    help us help you.
    Would be doing a lot do single track and yes I test rode a superfly the 2012 model not the 2013. I am open to other brands as I am new to this sport and yes would be my 1st 29er I use to ride a little back in 2006 and rode a KHS alite 1000

  9. #9
    sock puppet
    Reputation: osokolo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,098

    okay, that is a good start...

    so you KNOW you want to go with a 29er - since you rode one and you like it... check

    superfly should definitely be on your short list. i rode both the hardtail and squishy in two consecutive seasons... liked the squishy a lot - though this is also a personal thing...

    another bike that should be on your list, just because it seems to be a very good value for the money is Giant Anthem... if you can try it - and then compare to Superfly - that would be perfect. If not - I still would not rule it out...

    Santa Cruz has a very good offering in Superlight, Blur and Tallboy - progressively more expensive - Superlight might fit your budget though...

    Specialized Camber and FSR are very nice - if you can snatch a demo or slightly used one - to fit it in your budget....

    there are many other candidates as well - but this would be on my list. i am sure there will be more suggestions...

    if you can test ride as many of the bikes on your short list - that would be the perfect case scenario....


    Quote Originally Posted by justbike View Post
    Would be doing a lot do single track and yes I test rode a superfly the 2012 model not the 2013. I am open to other brands as I am new to this sport and yes would be my 1st 29er I use to ride a little back in 2006 and rode a KHS alite 1000

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    12,460
    If you are riding locally in MI and starting out I think you can also consider HTs. A Scott Scale 29 Expert is a top carbon race bike with engineered seat stay compliance and light weight. The 2013 model is renamed 930. Both under your price.

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    379
    Buy a Carbon Nomad.

  12. #12
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    At 3k budget you can have your pick. I'd say test ride them all if/when you can, I'd start with the big 4 then if possible move on to the next attractive ones.

    Different brands have their attractive feature, you just have to find one that fit your need. Geometry and fit is probably the most important issue to look for.

    Most bikes at that price would be strong climbers and plush descenders as well as active suspension during braking, so there's no worry about those issues. The difference you'd see would be geometry, material, proprietary components, blings, price/value, etc.

    I like Trek, the Superfly and rumblefish are pretty good ABP really takes late braking to the next level. Their DCRV shock bring plushness to ride without sacrificing pedaling firmness. On the front end, tapered headtube, and G2 geometry(in some models) really brings snappy and precise handling.
    There are some drawbacks, the modified SinglePivot while great for climbing and descending can be touchy when the chain line is not correct, and at sag the bb height is too low for my liking.

    If you choose to go with more modern(for the lack of better word) suspension designs like the dual mini links, Pivot DW-link, Giant Maestro or Niner CVA, You'd be treated with a firm acceleration that does not effect BB height, spot on geometry that would allow you to move your body mass around the bike.

    I have a HT Niner and owned a Rip9 while I love them I don't see them as a replacement for my 26ers, they are not as much fun just added flavors.

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    It is going to be hard to ride a bunch of different bikes as we don't really have any real good bike shops in the area. Like I said I did get a chance to ride a superfly but it was a 2012 and not a 2013 but they look pretty much the same. The reason behind wanting a 29er is just from what I have read and also because it just makes sence to me the advantages of having a 29er

  14. #14
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    Quote Originally Posted by justbike View Post
    It is going to be hard to ride a bunch of different bikes as we don't really have any real good bike shops in the area. Like I said I did get a chance to ride a superfly but it was a 2012 and not a 2013 but they look pretty much the same. The reason behind wanting a 29er is just from what I have read and also because it just makes sence to me the advantages of having a 29er
    I know it not easy to test ride them all but at least if you can try a few.

    Have you consider the disadvantage of 29er?


    Sent from my iPhone 4s using Tapatalk

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation: jpatt28's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    69
    IMO the superfly elite for the price lacks good components. I really see it in the rear deraileur. I know full suspension is nice to have but there are some good carbon hardtails out there that are in your price range. Specialized has the carve comp pro or you could snatch the stumpjumper evo 29er that are still under budget. Also if you like giant you could look at giant xtc composite 29er. Same components as the superfly but full carbon.

  16. #16
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    Quote Originally Posted by jpatt28 View Post
    IMO the superfly elite for the price lacks good components. I really see it in the rear deraileur. I know full suspension is nice to have but there are some good carbon hardtails out there that are in your price range. Specialized has the carve comp pro or you could snatch the stumpjumper evo 29er that are still under budget. Also if you like giant you could look at giant xtc composite 29er. Same components as the superfly but full carbon.
    If I'm going to spend 3k on a hardtail it would not be carbon that's for sure. I'd go with steel. There are so many good custom companies Seven, Soulcraft, Wolfhound(if you are in the mood), etc.

  17. #17
    sock puppet
    Reputation: osokolo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,098

    why would you take steel over carbon...

    just curious...

    Quote Originally Posted by mimi1885 View Post
    If I'm going to spend 3k on a hardtail it would not be carbon that's for sure. I'd go with steel. There are so many good custom companies Seven, Soulcraft, Wolfhound(if you are in the mood), etc.

  18. #18
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Trail_Blazer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    2,162
    Trek is usually over priced for the components they include, but the bike is usually a good bike.
    Find one used or on sale and buy it.

  19. #19
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    just curious...
    Better question would be custom over production. It's not the material it's how it's made and geometry. Steel because it's the cheapest option as cheapest ti frame would start closer to 3k already

    Company like Seven Cycles can make you a nice sweet ride just the way you want it. You can have lively feel, comfortable, responsive, etc. 4.2lbs Steel frame is cheaper than ti or ti carbon but nonetheless still can still out perform a 3lbs production carbon frame any day. Predetermine handling production bike is all good if you fall in the predetermine sample, if not more compromise.

    If the bike made for you, you'd climb better, and faster than a pound lighter bike, not to mention you'd be faster and have better handling every where else. It's not a cheap option but a Seven with cheap component can out perform production with good components. With that kind of budget in my hand that's the only direction I'd go. You have to do a lot of home work but it's worth it.

    I own 3 Seven cycles, the first time I took my road bike out on the closed canyon group ride after a painful climb and short rest the seasoned riders start taking off on the descend, I was somewhere mid pack I didn't really feel like I was going fast or pushing limit but I start picking up riders one by one, I thought they were waiting for someone so I just kept going it was a blast, ended up waiting a bit at the bottom. I didn't have the lightest wheel or expensive components it was a hand me down 105 groupo so I can put the bike up the night before. I know it was not the same feeling I had when I was on a Spech earlier ride.

    You are an Olympian so I'm certain you can relate the importance of custom fit over hightech gadget aspect of the equipment.

  20. #20
    sock puppet
    Reputation: osokolo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,098
    i have only one friend that went with Seven - custom built road bike - combination of carbon and titanium. he liked it a lot, but had some minor problems that Seven addressed promptly...

    he eventually went with mass production bike...

    if i was Kulhavy or Absalon - i am sure i would be able to feel the difference that custom equipment inherently brings to the table... however, being an above average weekend warrior as well as not that young any more - i find that i can get as much as my body can perform out of any of the mass production bikes that i own right now... one thing is common for all of them - carbon.

    for 3 years i was riding a titanium cx geometry bike - as my winter / cyclocross bike and then switched to full carbon cyclocross bike and raced it ever since...

    while titanium was more comfortable, it was also more flexy - for my physique (195# without gear)...

    some of my singlespeed friends rave about their steel full rigid bikes, over aluminum... but all of them prefer carbon over steel...

    at my age and fitness, though i still manage to finish close to the top in my age category - i do appreciate less weight that i have to haul up the grade...

    i find that i can fine tune either of my race bikes (both s-works HT and FS) and it is my ability that is the limiting factor...

    also - you should give yourself more credit for picking up riders one by one... it is, and it will always be - all about the engine...

    but at the end of the day - whatever puts that stupid grin on our faces - is what counts... whether it is carbon or steel or titanium - doesnt really matter...

  21. #21
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    Quote Originally Posted by mimi1885 View Post
    I know it not easy to test ride them all but at least if you can try a few.

    Have you consider the disadvantage of 29er?


    Sent from my iPhone 4s using Tapatalk
    What would some disadvantages be with a 29er? I have only heard good things about the 29er but just like anything i am sure there are some disadvantages to having a bigger wheel
    Last edited by justbike; 09-17-2012 at 07:39 AM.

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    Quote Originally Posted by having fun View Post
    Very different from 2012. Don't know about your area but I know they aren't in my area yet to demo. The pics look awesome. Can't wait to try one myself!
    My local bike shop said dec for the 2013 superfly and yes i agree the 2013 elite looks pretty cool

  23. #23
    I hate that name.
    Reputation: blunderbuss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,643
    Quote Originally Posted by jpatt28 View Post
    IMO the superfly elite for the price lacks good components. I really see it in the rear deraileur. I know full suspension is nice to have but there are some good carbon hardtails out there that are in your price range. Specialized has the carve comp pro or you could snatch the stumpjumper evo 29er that are still under budget. Also if you like giant you could look at giant xtc composite 29er. Same components as the superfly but full carbon.
    Just curious, but what are you comparing the component spec to, to say that the Trek lacks good components?
    Worked at Trek/Fisher dealer 2008-2013. Only a little biased.

  24. #24
    Cow Clicker
    Reputation: wmac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    2,031
    If you've got some time, answer the questions in the link below and we may be able to help you better: http://forums.mtbr.com/beginners-cor...de-811009.html

    If you've 3k to spend and plan to do a lot of riding, you can easily drop another $1k-$2k on "stuff" like apparel, tools, accessories and racks for maintenance and transportation. Just keep that in mind as you shop.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  25. #25
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    Quote Originally Posted by wmac View Post
    If you've got some time, answer the questions in the link below and we may be able to help you better: http://forums.mtbr.com/beginners-cor...de-811009.html

    If you've 3k to spend and plan to do a lot of riding, you can easily drop another $1k-$2k on "stuff" like apparel, tools, accessories and racks for maintenance and transportation. Just keep that in mind as you shop.
    I have a home made rack that goes in the bed of my truck and i already have a helmet and a camel pack so i have a few things already. I don't see me doing a whole lot of riding outside of the local park we have hear in Michigan which is 5 min from my home. I do understand the money does not stop when you buy the bike and if i drop a few grand on a bike i am going to want to keep it in tip top shape! i think the local bike shop gets about 80 bucks for a bike tune up. Thanks for the link i will check it out later

  26. #26
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    In case you did not know hear are a few specs for the 2013

    Front suspension-Fox Evolution Series 32 Float w/CTD (climb-trail-descend) damper, rebound, E2 tapered steerer, 15QR thru axle, custom G2 Geometry w/51mm offset, 100mm travel

    Rear suspension-Fox Evolution Series Float w/CTD (climb-trail-descend) damper, rebound, tuned by Trek in California, 7.25x1.75

    Shifters-Shimano SLX, 10 speed

    Front derailleur-Shimano SLX

    Rear derailleur-Shimano Deore XT Shadow

    Crank-Shimano M552, 42/32/24

    Looks like they cheap out on the rear derailleur! Kinda sucks because that's a part i would think i would use alot

  27. #27
    I hate that name.
    Reputation: blunderbuss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,643
    Huh? XT is cheap? The rest of the drivetrain is SLX, and the rear derailleur is one step better at XT. This is pretty common in the bike world. Some manufacturers even like to put on a rear derailleur that is way above the rest of components, since that is first thing that people look at, but the reality is that the derailleur only does what the shifter tells it to, and a nice derailleur is pointless if the shifter, chain, and cassette are crap.
    Worked at Trek/Fisher dealer 2008-2013. Only a little biased.

  28. #28
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    Quote Originally Posted by justbike View Post
    What would some disadvantages be with a 29er? I have only heard good things about the 29er but just like anything i am sure there are some disadvantages to having a bigger wheel
    That would get you a reverse eureka moment once you bought it.

    Beside the usual suspect
    -29er is heavier.
    -Big wheel weaker wheel.
    -Harder to climb.
    -Harder to accelerate.
    -Harder to turn.
    -Harder to lift the front wheel.
    -On full suspension it's more difficult to design especially on long travel.

    My personal experience on the down side of 29er: Mainly it makes you more lazy. You don't lean so much in the turn, wide sweeping turn is sweet but tighter you need to react sooner or you'd blow it. Since it roll over things so well and the wheel base+chainstay is longer than smaller wheel it makes manual and wheelie more difficult, definitely more effort: some say it's easier to maintain the manual once you get it up but I couldn't tell.

    It's slower to accelerate, while people rave about cruising at higher speed on the climb it's just not true, it takes more effort to climb on the 29er than 26er. Feeling like you are in the bike instead of on the bike is not necessary a good thing.

    Am I a 29er hater, absolutely not, since I own many bikes including 650b and 29er they all give me different challenge on the trail. It's just that there are so many Kool-Aid drinkers that think 29er is the answer to all. Do your own research and test ride look at both side of the argument and spend

  29. #29
    sock puppet
    Reputation: osokolo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,098

    hmmm... some of these disadvantages are out of date...

    Quote Originally Posted by mimi1885 View Post
    That would get you a reverse eureka moment once you bought it.

    Beside the usual suspect
    -29er is heavier.
    hence carbon... my racing 29er tips the scale at 22 pounds. trail 29er is heavier at 24 pounds

    -Big wheel weaker wheel.
    American Classic 29er tubeless (just to mention an average price and great value wheel set) weighs in at 1600 grams and did not require truing in 2 years under my 200 pounds... and this is not the stiffest 29er wheelset...

    -Harder to climb.
    i actually find it quite the opposite - it is easier to climb on the 29er. more traction with bigger wheels. what's not to like about it and what is to slow it down compared to 26"?

    -Harder to accelerate.
    this is out of date big time. wheels are lighter, tires are lighter... my racing wheels are 1400 grams. racing tires are sub 500 grams tubeless. trail wheels are 1600 grams - tires are sub 600 grams. keep in mind that with 29er you can actually go through the corner FASTER so if done properly - there is less acceleration to be made on the exit...

    -Harder to turn.
    out of date - look at chainstay and wheelbase lengths - though these are not the only factors that affect this. although in general 29ers are not as nimble as 26" - i am yet to encounter a trail where 29er could not do anything that 26" can...

    -Harder to lift the front wheel.
    true - this does require a bit more effort...

    -On full suspension it's more difficult to design especially on long travel.
    true, but here we are talking 4" travel bikes even 5" are fine. though some DH 29ers are starting to come down the production line... it will happen.. harder - yes, but completely doable...

    My personal experience on the down side of 29er: Mainly it makes you more lazy. You don't lean so much in the turn, wide sweeping turn is sweet but tighter you need to react sooner or you'd blow it. Since it roll over things so well and the wheel base+chainstay is longer than smaller wheel it makes manual and wheelie more difficult, definitely more effort: some say it's easier to maintain the manual once you get it up but I couldn't tell.

    It's slower to accelerate, while people rave about cruising at higher speed on the climb it's just not true, it takes more effort to climb on the 29er than 26er. Feeling like you are in the bike instead of on the bike is not necessary a good thing.

    Am I a 29er hater, absolutely not, since I own many bikes including 650b and 29er they all give me different challenge on the trail. It's just that there are so many Kool-Aid drinkers that think 29er is the answer to all. Do your own research and test ride look at both side of the argument and spend
    am i a kool-aid 29er drinker - not at all - just my personal experience. i completely agree with your last paragraph above. to each his/her own - 29er is not a holly grail, nor it is any other wheel size. each one of us has the luxury of choosing between different options - which is good for buyers...

    as a new buyer - take into account all comments from different people but decide based on YOUR OWN experience. that is why quite a few of us suggested that you TEST RIDE as many bikes as you can.

    one person's dream bike is another person's nightmare. who cares about the wheelsize - pick what will make you grinning every second of every ride you go on...

    mimi - hope you are ok with friendly discussion...

  30. #30
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    hence carbon... my racing 29er tips the scale at 22 pounds. trail 29er is heavier at 24 pounds

    It's physically impossible for 29er to be lighter than 26er when you compare apple to apple. The smaller one would always be lighter.

    American Classic 29er tubeless (just to mention an average price and great value wheel set) weighs in at 1600 grams and did not require truing in 2 years under my 200 pounds... and this is not the stiffest 29er wheelset...

    If you compare the same wheel the 26er would be lighter, in your case AC 26 tubeless is 8g heavier I have no idea why but not because it's smaller

    i actually find it quite the opposite - it is easier to climb on the 29er. more traction with bigger wheels. what's not to like about it and what is to slow it down compared to 26"?

    May be if you are talking about fireroad climb, I don't have the same experience with singletrack climb and or especially technical climb (however some technical climb is best done with 29er). For the lack of better word I'd call it lag, 29er does not have the snappiness needed in some situation, I have best result giving myself a few extra second to wind up the momentum.

    this is out of date big time. wheels are lighter, tires are lighter... my racing wheels are 1400 grams. racing tires are sub 500 grams tubeless. trail wheels are 1600 grams - tires are sub 600 grams. keep in mind that with 29er you can actually go through the corner FASTER so if done properly - there is less acceleration to be made on the exit...

    No, physic is not out of date. Bare in mind I don't use race tires. I prefer meaty trail tires. My case I'm comparing the Tioga Phycho Genius 2.1, 2.3 to the 2.2 29er. As for cornering I know it's personal preference; 29er do not require a lot of lean go rip you thru corner(that's why it's so appealing to the beginners) if you ride more aggressively you have to put much more effort to fight the big wheel rolling force as the bike love to stand up, and it's not as easy to drift as the 26er. If your Kung Fu is good no doubt you'd be faster on either wheel size.

    Here's the small excerpt taking straight from the bible.
    "Bigger wheels are harder to accelerate. All that extra weight is on the outside of the rotating body, where it has the greatest effect on rotational inertia. if you consider the extra 10% of mass and the fact that the mass is about 10% farther from the center of the hub, you can see that the result is an increased rotational inertia of almost 40%. That makes 29-inch wheels much less responsive in the sprint but much more stable on the rough terrain." Lee McCormack.


    out of date - look at chainstay and wheelbase lengths - though these are not the only factors that affect this. although in general 29ers are not as nimble as 26" - i am yet to encounter a trail where 29er could not do anything that 26" can...

    True, not all 29er share the same geometry but short stay is happy stay. After an all day practicing manuals, and wheelie on my 29er, I hopped on my STP DJ bike sure enough with half the effort I looped out and flat on my back.

    true, but here we are talking 4" travel bikes even 5" are fine. though some DH 29ers are starting to come down the production line... it will happen.. harder - yes, but completely doable...

    That's why I sold my Rip9 and also why I've not replaced it yet. Rip9 is a 4.5 FS at Interbike Niner announced the 6.5" WFO I was excited and couldn't wait to get one, I had a good offer for my Rip9 so I let it go. A few months later I found out WFO is only going to be 5.5" so I keep waiting and got the Sir9 instead. One of the design that show some promise would be the Dave Weagle Split Piot (yes, the one that Trek copied) it looks like it can handle some travel, rumor has it that Seven has been working on the Prototype, we'll see.

    am i a kool-aid 29er drinker - not at all - just my personal experience. i completely agree with your last paragraph above. to each his/her own - 29er is not a holly grail, nor it is any other wheel size. each one of us has the luxury of choosing between different options - which is good for buyers...

    as a new buyer - take into account all comments from different people but decide based on YOUR OWN experience. that is why quite a few of us suggested that you TEST RIDE as many bikes as you can.

    one person's dream bike is another person's nightmare. who cares about the wheelsize - pick what will make you grinning every second of every ride you go on...

    mimi - hope you are ok with friendly discussion...
    Hell yeah, this is a good discussion. Many of the thing you said is the milestone that 29er have accomplished, but if you compare the same light weight in smaller size then it would only make equivalent 26er lighter. All except for the tires, the same race tire 29" will grip more than 26" model.

    If you look at my bikes then I must be drinking Kool-Aid by the gallon

  31. #31
    sock puppet
    Reputation: osokolo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,098

    yes, good discussion

    maybe we are looking at the 29er from different perspectives... for me 4" of travel is absolute maximum that i need/want on my bike... the bikes i have are great climbers, very efficient and snappy (S-Works Epic, S-Works Stumpjumper and Tallboy carbon). That may be where i am coming from when i say they climb as well and better than any of the (top end) 26" climbers (Scott Spark, Scott Scale, Titus Racer-X etc) as well as acceleration. Both of my S-Works have carbon wheels too - rotational mass is not higher than the 26"... etc...

    i'll leave it to others to jump in with their observations... i've spoken too much... good exchange... thanks...

    Quote Originally Posted by mimi1885 View Post
    Hell yeah, this is a good discussion. Many of the thing you said is the milestone that 29er have accomplished, but if you compare the same light weight in smaller size then it would only make equivalent 26er lighter. All except for the tires, the same race tire 29" will grip more than 26" model.

    If you look at my bikes then I must be drinking Kool-Aid by the gallon

  32. #32
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Trail_Blazer's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Posts
    2,162
    Some 29rs have shorter wheel bases than some 26ers.

  33. #33
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    1,545
    you are new, I would not pay $3k on a bike. If you really do want something that nice, i would pay the $75ish bucks to rent a demo bike for a day from a couple different makes, and try the 26er vs 29er thing, if you're going the LBS route.. I think 29ers are way over rated, especially for people under 5'10-511. There is a reason there are so many 26ers in top ten of olympics women category, quite a few in men's too.

    yes, you are paying a lot for the trek name and their sponsorship and marketing departments.

    you are paying even more to purchase a bike in a LBS.

    When you compare lbs brands to online brands, it's clear where the value is. When you do budget an online bike, budget in $$ to have it built and adjusted. You will still come out wayyyyy on top. Look at the price level and compare the components. Since the majority of the bikes cost has nothing to do with the frame, it's easy to compare the included components in the tiers of parts.

    ie derailleurs + shifters: shimano xtr > xt > lx > deore > tourney

    I would compare my bike to ones like these brands.
    SRAM XO, 3x10 Speed 29er Full Suspension Mountain Bikes - MTB - 2012 Motobecane Fantom 29er | Shimano DynaSys full suspension mountain bikes | Save up to 60% off list prices on new bicycles is something

    Sette Derro 1.0 XT Dual Suspension 4inch Mountain Bike at Price Point

    I would spent the $$ saved on a wheelset upgrade. that had an xt wheelset deal for $500 recently, or you could go with the chinese carbon set for around $400 that many have had good experiences. Check the deals subforum and the the rims thread here
    http://forums.mtbr.com/29er-componen...ms-673410.html

    If you choose to purchase from a bike company that spends less on marketing/sponsorship, you will end up with lighter bike with higher quality parts for less $.You will spend plenty of $$ at your LBS on maintenance and repairs. Don't forget a helmet.

  34. #34
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    Quote Originally Posted by mimi1885 View Post
    That would get you a reverse eureka moment once you bought it.

    Beside the usual suspect
    -29er is heavier.
    -Big wheel weaker wheel.
    -Harder to climb.
    -Harder to accelerate.
    -Harder to turn.
    -Harder to lift the front wheel.
    -On full suspension it's more difficult to design especially on long travel.

    My personal experience on the down side of 29er: Mainly it makes you more lazy. You don't lean so much in the turn, wide sweeping turn is sweet but tighter you need to react sooner or you'd blow it. Since it roll over things so well and the wheel base+chainstay is longer than smaller wheel it makes manual and wheelie more difficult, definitely more effort: some say it's easier to maintain the manual once you get it up but I couldn't tell.

    It's slower to accelerate, while people rave about cruising at higher speed on the climb it's just not true, it takes more effort to climb on the 29er than 26er. Feeling like you are in the bike instead of on the bike is not necessary a good thing.

    Am I a 29er hater, absolutely not, since I own many bikes including 650b and 29er they all give me different challenge on the trail. It's just that there are so many Kool-Aid drinkers that think 29er is the answer to all. Do your own research and test ride look at both side of the argument and spend
    Are there any positive things to a 29er? I would think there is a reason the bike company's are building the 29er's but then again what the hell do I know. I do like to go fast but sounds like the 29er is going to give me problems in that department and would like to get up hills but it falls short there to. They did have some nice fuel ex bikes at my LBS on sale for 2k maybe that's the way I should go.
    Last edited by justbike; 09-18-2012 at 12:22 PM.

  35. #35
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    17
    I recently purchased a new FS MTB. I shopped my LBS(s) that carry Trek, Giant, Cannondale, and Scott. While shopping, I am sure that you can get bikes cheaper online, but I like to support the store that carries so much gear and equipment, plus does free tune ups on my bike. It is worth it to me to have local support for the bike and the trails that I ride. At the $3K price range, this may or may not be important to the OP

    I did find that similar styles of bike with similar equipment did have a end price difference. I found Trek to be the most expensive bike of the 4, and Scott to be the least expensive of the 4. I have little long term experience to say that one bike is better or is justified in being priced higher or lower.

    Having a bike that fits you and you feel comfortable on is the key.

  36. #36
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    Quote Originally Posted by justbike View Post
    Are there any positive things to a 29er?
    Yes, plenty. You said that you read many good things about 29er I thought you knew already.

  37. #37
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    Quote Originally Posted by bob13bob View Post
    you are new, I would not pay $3k on a bike. If you really do want something that nice, i would pay the $75ish bucks to rent a demo bike for a day from a couple different makes, and try the 26er vs 29er thing, if you're going the LBS route.. I think 29ers are way over rated, especially for people under 5'10-511. There is a reason there are so many 26ers in top ten of olympics women category, quite a few in men's too.

    That I agree, however one of the reason 29er is popular among racers is the fact that XC course are quite tame, sure there are some technical sections but they are short and very easy to roll even with 26er. Promoter would set up the course (when applicable) to put the strategy and bike option to racers. For a while the short travel FS was a good choice, but when 29er enter the scene it was an easy choice. Newbies like them because they are more stable on the descend, less maneuverable but less scary.

    yes, you are paying a lot for the trek name and their sponsorship and marketing departments.

    You are paying more for Big Brands because it cost more to get the bike to you. R&D is a big ticket. Big brands Trek, Giant, Specialized, Cannondale each has their own proprietary components, patents, as well as marketing and sales. These things cost money unlike the knock offs online big box stores. Heart of any full suspension bicycles is the frame, components can be upgrade so the argument getting better bike with the knockoff online big box store is just untrue. If you are talking about hardtail I'd buy that argument.

    you are paying even more to purchase a bike in a LBS.

    Not true, it's a good idea for a new rider to buy from LBS, I'll concede that not all LBS are the equal so shop around for the right one. LBS offers service that comes with the purchase, be it lifetime tune up, discount on accessories, local trail info, etc. New riders needs some time to build up tools inventory and bike maintenance know how, these things take time your LBS is a good back up. If you find a good LBS it's a great idea to make the purchase with them and start a good relationship there. When you buy online even brand name you don't have this option. Many components company make you go thru LBS as they don't deal with customer directly.

    If you are an experience riders who can wrench your own bikes and have proper tools to do it, your next purchase can be just a frame online and you can put everything together yourself, you don't need to buy from LBS, but usually by the time you get to that point you'd probably have one or a few LBS on your friend list already.


    When you compare lbs brands to online brands, it's clear where the value is. When you do budget an online bike, budget in $$ to have it built and adjusted. You will still come out wayyyyy on top. Look at the price level and compare the components. Since the majority of the bikes cost has nothing to do with the frame, it's easy to compare the included components in the tiers of parts.

    It's a myth. You are just buying on mix bag of over priced OEM components as the frame has no value. Many have tried to buy the bike from Big Box and swap parts to nice frame but ended up spending dollars trying to save a few pennies. The Big Box would hyped the retail price and shamelessly compare to other brands that equipped with some eye-catching components: ie XX, XO, XTR trying to fool you that you are getting the groupo but when it fact you are getting mix bag of parts put together. XX, XO drivetrain but FSA crankset, Vuelta wheelset (oh yeah, that's the winner), they are counting on the fact that if you are new you don't know, and if you are experienced you don't care. Buy them if you think it's a good value for your money, but not because they are as good or better than brand name bikes.

    ie derailleurs + shifters: shimano xtr > xt > lx > deore > tourney

    I would compare my bike to ones like these brands.
    SRAM XO, 3x10 Speed 29er Full Suspension Mountain Bikes - MTB - 2012 Motobecane Fantom 29er | Shimano DynaSys full suspension mountain bikes | Save up to 60% off list prices on new bicycles is something

    Sette Derro 1.0 XT Dual Suspension 4inch Mountain Bike at Price Point

    I would spent the $$ saved on a wheelset upgrade. that had an xt wheelset deal for $500 recently, or you could go with the chinese carbon set for around $400 that many have had good experiences. Check the deals subforum and the the rims thread here

    All the power to you if you choose to buy a carbon frame and/or parts from a knock off Chinese companies whose warranty is non-existence.

    If you choose to purchase from a bike company that spends less on marketing/sponsorship, you will end up with lighter bike with higher quality parts for less $.You will spend plenty of $$ at your LBS on maintenance and repairs. Don't forget a helmet.

    Do it right, spend it once. Do your homework and test ride when you can. If the deal sounds too good to be true it usually is. Ask yourself if BD claim that their $2200 POS compares to the $6000 Trek/Gary Fisher, or they are comparing bike that equipped with the similar component group.
    I though I was the one drinking Kool-aid by the gallon

    Like I mentioned earlier if I have 3k to spend, say on a 29er hardtail. I'd spend 2k on a custom frame and valued used fork then spend the next $700 on the rest of the build kit still be a b!tchen ride, instead of spending $2900 on components and $100 over priced frame.

    Or just get a $700 used Cannondale Rush or Prophet with lefty fork and call it a day.

  38. #38
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    Quote Originally Posted by mimi1885 View Post
    Yes, plenty. You said that you read many good things about 29er I thought you knew already.
    I thought I knew until your remarks about the 29er. Everything positive I have read you said is a negative. This is why I came hear to get info about the bike and I appreciate your input. In the end it will be up to me to decide I am just trying to Collect as much input I can before making my purchase

  39. #39
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    48
    Quote Originally Posted by blunderbuss View Post
    Just curious, but what are you comparing the component spec to, to say that the Trek lacks good components?
    I'm curious as well... I'd say the Elite comes pretty well equipped, at least in my research. The one brand I really noticed that seemed to "cheap out" on components despite it's high price is Specialized.

    Quote Originally Posted by blunderbuss View Post
    Huh? XT is cheap? The rest of the drivetrain is SLX, and the rear derailleur is one step better at XT. This is pretty common in the bike world. Some manufacturers even like to put on a rear derailleur that is way above the rest of components, since that is first thing that people look at, but the reality is that the derailleur only does what the shifter tells it to, and a nice derailleur is pointless if the shifter, chain, and cassette are crap.
    ^This...
    14' Specialized Crave

    13' Trek Superfly100 AL Elite - Sold
    06' Specialized Hardrock Sport Disc - Sold

  40. #40
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    Quote Originally Posted by justbike View Post
    I thought I knew until your remarks about the 29er. Everything positive I have read you said is a negative. This is why I came hear to get info about the bike and I appreciate your input. In the end it will be up to me to decide I am just trying to Collect as much input I can before making my purchase
    There you go, you are now on the right track. Exactly where you started

    If you want a 29er give them a try I you don't have enough list of pros and cons take some of the pointers from these thread check it against your experience if the pros outweight the cons then it may be for you.

    I have one I know it's for me.

  41. #41
    sock puppet
    Reputation: osokolo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,098

    bikes are very personal toys...

    one persons dream bike may be anothers person nightmare..

    my opinion is mostly opposite to mimi's, which does not make me right or wrong, nor it makes mimi wrong or right...

    it means that i found my 3 perfect 29ers, each catering towards more specific type of riding...

    it also means that mimi rode few 29ers that were not a good fit...

    get out there and ride them. as many as you can. determine if a 29er is your piece of cake first.

    your initial choice is an awesome bike. if you like how it rides - that may be it... the love at first sight is a beautiful thing...

    enjoy your shopping...

    Quote Originally Posted by justbike View Post
    I thought I knew until your remarks about the 29er. Everything positive I have read you said is a negative. This is why I came hear to get info about the bike and I appreciate your input. In the end it will be up to me to decide I am just trying to Collect as much input I can before making my purchase

  42. #42
    sock puppet
    Reputation: osokolo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,098

    hope the user RTM doesn't mind that i post his

    signature here:

    "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of a low price is forgotten." - Benjamin Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by bob13bob View Post
    you are new, I would not pay $3k on a bike. If you really do want something that nice, i would pay the $75ish bucks to rent a demo bike for a day from a couple different makes, and try the 26er vs 29er thing, if you're going the LBS route.. I think 29ers are way over rated, especially for people under 5'10-511. There is a reason there are so many 26ers in top ten of olympics women category, quite a few in men's too.

    yes, you are paying a lot for the trek name and their sponsorship and marketing departments.

    you are paying even more to purchase a bike in a LBS.

    When you compare lbs brands to online brands, it's clear where the value is. When you do budget an online bike, budget in $$ to have it built and adjusted. You will still come out wayyyyy on top. Look at the price level and compare the components. Since the majority of the bikes cost has nothing to do with the frame, it's easy to compare the included components in the tiers of parts.

    ie derailleurs + shifters: shimano xtr > xt > lx > deore > tourney

    I would compare my bike to ones like these brands.
    SRAM XO, 3x10 Speed 29er Full Suspension Mountain Bikes - MTB - 2012 Motobecane Fantom 29er | Shimano DynaSys full suspension mountain bikes | Save up to 60% off list prices on new bicycles is something

    Sette Derro 1.0 XT Dual Suspension 4inch Mountain Bike at Price Point

    I would spent the $$ saved on a wheelset upgrade. that had an xt wheelset deal for $500 recently, or you could go with the chinese carbon set for around $400 that many have had good experiences. Check the deals subforum and the the rims thread here
    http://forums.mtbr.com/29er-componen...ms-673410.html

    If you choose to purchase from a bike company that spends less on marketing/sponsorship, you will end up with lighter bike with higher quality parts for less $.You will spend plenty of $$ at your LBS on maintenance and repairs. Don't forget a helmet.

  43. #43
    Flow like water
    Reputation: DavyRay's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    711
    I know less than these other guys, so beware. I do have a couple of comments.

    1. If you are going to buy a major brand, you will probably buy that bike from a bike shop, not an online retailer. Most major brands do not allow bikes to be shipped direct to customers. That is a contract thing. So, if you get a Trek, or a Giant, or a Kona, you will probably get it in person, at a bike shop. Few exceptions exist (and someone will be right along to tell us about them).

    2. You have little recent experience, so it is unlikely that you will buy the best bike for you the first try. Do you have a guitar? Just the one? Same deal. Perhaps you should not spend your budget until you do some riding.

    3. Online bikes? Not at your price point. I have read lots of analysis of component cost vs total price. The online bikes for $500-$600 can be argued to be as good as entry-level bikes from the LBS. Above that level, do the math, and include the frame and wheelset. If you are not able to judge the quality and value of a wheelset, welcome to the newbie club. I can't do that yet, so think it is voodoo. Some can. If you don't know who the sucker is in a poker game, guess who it is.

    4. A $3K investment is worth some travel and some effort to get right. Otherwise, it is just a roll of the dice.

    Good luck with your new bike, whatever it is. Full disclosure, I ride a used 26 incher hardtail now. I hope to have a rigid 29+ frameset this December. I have ridden a full rigid Krampus and a full squish Beargrease. The FS was very nice. I actually think I was faster on the trail with the FS bike.

  44. #44
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    Quote Originally Posted by osokolo View Post
    one persons dream bike may be anothers person nightmare..

    my opinion is mostly opposite to mimi's, which does not make me right or wrong, nor it makes mimi wrong or right...

    it means that i found my 3 perfect 29ers, each catering towards more specific type of riding...

    it also means that mimi rode few 29ers that were not a good fit...

    get out there and ride them. as many as you can. determine if a 29er is your piece of cake first.

    your initial choice is an awesome bike. if you like how it rides - that may be it... the love at first sight is a beautiful thing...

    enjoy your shopping...

    I like them just fine, like I said I own(ed) 2 already and have been on many Jeff Jones Space frame, Pivot 429, Tracer 29, Tallboy, Giants and others. Still have my Niner HT. I really love to add the Space frame to my stable just have to put more $$ in to my piggy bank everyday

    The reason for the post was a response to
    Quote Originally Posted by justbike View Post
    What would some disadvantages be with a 29er? I have only heard good things about the 29er l
    It's quite common for people to only hear good things about 29er, not necessary a miracle cured all pills. It has it's place. I grab a ride on it when I can.

  45. #45
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    1,545
    signature here:

    "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of a low price is forgotten." - Benjamin Franklin
    I agree. I think many in the are slow to realize the depressing fact that America has the lowest quality manufacturing / $ spent = poor value e.g, If i spent x amount on an object, I get more quality/$ spent. Countries that used to only have the bottom tier market (Japan used to be the cheap brands), now have made huge investments to be the best in manufacturing: China, Korea, Japan, is where they are making the most advanced and top quality products. smartphones like the iphone, cars, cameras, bike parts, etc. These countries have significant manufacturing and engineering powerhouses, that america can't compete with. If you look in any hobbby enthusiast forums, where information is spread by peer reviewed forums (NOT corporate sponsorship and marketing campaigns, America's manufacturing is always not competitive., best radios are made in japan/China Yaesu, best value radios are chinese brands . Best TVs: Korea and Japan. Best value headphones ($20-150 range): Chinese. Best knives:japan. Best cameras, Japan.

    yes, you are paying a lot for the trek name and their sponsorship and marketing departments.

    You are paying more for Big Brands because it cost more to get the bike to you. R&D is a big ticket. Big brands Trek, Giant, Specialized, Cannondale each has their own proprietary components, patents, as well as marketing and sales. These things cost money unlike the knock offs online big box stores. Heart of any full suspension bicycles is the frame, components can be upgrade so the argument getting better bike with the knockoff online big box store is just untrue. If you are talking about hardtail I'd buy that argument.
    I do not agree. Most of your bike's cost is not the frame, but the components. Online brands are not "knockoff", they have the same exact oem parts that LBS brands have. When you buy a LBS bike, your are paying for all more middlemen, overhead of store, and $$ retail floorspace.

    Take a look at the value of these nonbranded frames and wheels shipped directly from china. People have had very good luck with these.
    3800 post long thread carbon frame
    http://forums.mtbr.com/29er-bikes/ch...640919-39.html
    2400 post long thread on carbon rims
    http://forums.mtbr.com/29er-componen...673410-25.html

    I believe proprietary branded technology eg., specialized "brain shocks". Cannondale lefties, etc. are mostly a marketing ploy.
    Looking at the lefty shock for example,
    1. Rockshox and Fox sells more forks. This leads me to believe that rockshox and fox's RnD is higher than cannondales.
    2. i only saw one lefty in the top ~20 olympic bikers.

    I saw lots of fox, rockshox sid, and swiss front fork shocks. All these brands and models can be had on online bikes for cheaper.

  46. #46
    I hate that name.
    Reputation: blunderbuss's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,643
    Quote Originally Posted by bob13bob View Post
    I do not agree. Most of your bike's cost is not the frame, but the components. Online brands are not "knockoff", they have the same exact oem parts that LBS brands have. When you buy a LBS bike, your are paying for all more middlemen, overhead of store, and $$ retail floorspace.
    Most of YOUR bike's cost is not the frame, since you seem to prefer internet brands, such as Bikes Direct, that have very little to no research and development invested in the frames that they order from the Chinese manufacturer catalog. To quote myself from a recent post in an unrelated thread, "a nice bike is more than just the sum of its components." I actually do get to test ride some of these bikes when people bring them to us to assemble, and I'm here to tell you, its funny how bikes with the same exact components can ride so differently. Contrary to what they want you to think, frames matter. Is there money being made by the LBS that sells you the bike? Of course- they've got bills to pay. But believe me, no one in a bike shop is getting rich.
    Worked at Trek/Fisher dealer 2008-2013. Only a little biased.

  47. #47
    Cow Clicker
    Reputation: wmac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    2,031
    Hey Justbike - did you have time to check out the http://forums.mtbr.com/beginners-cor...de-811009.html ?

    If you answer those questions, we may be better able to help you choose the right bike for you instead of telling you all about why WE choose certain bikes. For example, how did you come to the conclusion that you wanted a FS 29er? It's impossible to give advice without knowing more about your situation, your goals, your abilities, etc.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  48. #48
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    Quote Originally Posted by bob13bob View Post
    I agree. I think many in the are slow to realize the depressing fact that America has the lowest quality manufacturing / $ spent = poor value e.g, If i spent x amount on an object, I get more quality/$ spent. Countries that used to only have the bottom tier market (Japan used to be the cheap brands), now have made huge investments to be the best in manufacturing: China, Korea, Japan, is where they are making the most advanced and top quality products. smartphones like the iphone, cars, cameras, bike parts, etc. These countries have significant manufacturing and engineering powerhouses, that america can't compete with. If you look in any hobbby enthusiast forums, where information is spread by peer reviewed forums (NOT corporate sponsorship and marketing campaigns, America's manufacturing is always not competitive., best radios are made in japan/China Yaesu, best value radios are chinese brands . Best TVs: Korea and Japan. Best value headphones ($20-150 range): Chinese. Best knives:japan. Best cameras, Japan.
    First of all enthusiasts of any thing don't buy knockoffs, unless it's a tweaking projects.

    If that were true and iPhone is made in China, we should be able to get an iPhone Clone for $50. Unfortunately, we kept getting $70 piece of Crap that runs on Android FroYo. American companies set up shop there because the labor is cheaper, and for limited time Tax-Free. "Best knives:Japan" Yes, I'm a chef and I'm using knives from Japan, I don't know how it's relate for lower price, because they are not, they are even more expensive than German knives, same goes with Japanese TVs.

    Quote Originally Posted by bob13bob View Post
    I do not agree. Most of your bike's cost is not the frame, but the components. Online brands are not "knockoff", they have the same exact oem parts that LBS brands have. When you buy a LBS bike, your are paying for all more middlemen, overhead of store, and $$ retail floorspace.

    I believe proprietary branded technology eg., specialized "brain shocks". Cannondale lefties, etc. are mostly a marketing ploy.
    Looking at the lefty shock for example,
    1. Rockshox and Fox sells more forks. This leads me to believe that rockshox and fox's RnD is higher than cannondales.
    2. i only saw one lefty in the top ~20 olympic bikers.

    I saw lots of fox, rockshox sid, and swiss front fork shocks. All these brands and models can be had on online bikes for cheaper.

    First of all, I think you misunderstand the "Heart of any full suspension bike is the frame" part. It's the importance not the cost, but usually it's the most expensive single "component" of a bike.

    Lefty/Cannondale suspension were made by big brands Manitou, Magura, Fox and others. Spech Brain shock also made by Fox at one point.

    Unfortunately, knockoffs do not have the same OEM parts as online BD only carry a hand full of component brands I'd love to see they put the Fox DCRV shock and Rp24 on their bike but unfortunately the only thing they can buy a box full is RS.

    LBS is very important, it keeps the local economy going as well as providing newbies vital info about sports and local trail and events to keep the sport thriving.

    Putting a AMG parts on a Kia is not going to make it perform like an SLR anytime soon, if one choose to believe that would be a fool. If you believe mike when he said his frames made by the same manufacture as "Big Brands" so they are the exactly same quality as the Big Brand you need another reality check. Sure they may be made there but not the same quality, it's like saying Kindle is made by Foxconn it has the same quality as iPhone

  49. #49
    Cow Clicker
    Reputation: wmac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    2,031
    Mimi: here are a bunch of carbon knock off bikes with full component groups - no mix/match. The 26 inch bikes have Fox forks: at Price Point

    They also have a five year warranty. Quality is fantastic and durability is proven via Tour Divide finishes. If you buy one, you still have a decent group to swap onto a different frame. There is a place for LBS and a place for online and a place for custom. Depends on what the desires are and how own calculates value.

    I'm still waiting for Justbike to answer some questions before I give my two cents.
    No, YOU don't understand. You're making an ass of yourself for all of eternity.

  50. #50
    T.W.O.
    Reputation: mimi1885's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    8,172
    wmac, I actually like the business model of PP, it's not only local to me but the don't practice "Matress sales, and suit for you" marketing. Yes, they do blow up their MSRP a bit but buying a bike from them you do get about the same quality of every components as big brands spec. They let the products speak for themselves. They also have frame only option as well. It's a straight forward business model. Their price while cheaper than big brands with similar spec but not too good to be true. You look at PP part spec and BD part spec you can see no funky off brand stuff.

    I'm not anti online stores I just hate sleezy store that try to fool especially new riders who do not know the sport yet, misleading them to believe that they are wastiing money buying the same quality bike as the big brand costing thousands more.

    Another good option at a killer deal is Titus Titus Frames their carbon full suspension is only $640 shock not included that's additional $223. That's a great deal, plus Titus was a boutique brand that sells $3-4000 frame in the pass. I have a friend who own a $10,000 Titus exogrid (titanium and carbon fusion). Personally, I own 2 Titus, Motolite and Racer X, I can tell you they know what they are doing. Their XC FS bike can descend with more stability than many of the current trail bikes on the market today, that's saying a lot.

  51. #51
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    Thank you all for your input it has been a big help. The only reason I am looking at a 29er is because that's what the sales man recommended at my LBS and plus it is kinda what I was leaning toward per the trek website. What I am being told is it will climb faster,have more grip,roll over logs and stuff very easy,it is a very fast bike and it is the future of MTBR. I hit the trails today on my KHS alite 1000 which was I think about a 500 dollar bike and I had a blast!! One of you ask why a FS and my answer really is how comfortable they are to ride. I really messed up my back in a car wreck in 2010 and most of my back issues are lower and tailbone area and riding the HT really hurts. I could always get a new seat that may help and also I won't lie I think they are really cool lol I can appreciate the engineering that goes into these bikes it is unbelievable how far bikes have come.

  52. #52
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    I did look in the phone book and I guess there are quite a few LBS in my area and the carry specialized, giant, GT, cannon dale and trek so it looks like I will be able to put my hands on a few different bikes! I am very excited about this. How are some of these other brands I have listed?

  53. #53
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    25
    Hear is the exact bike I have. For the most part this has been a very good bike for what I do but it is a little cheap and you definite can tell.

    2005 KHS Bikes : : Alite 1000

Members who have read this thread: 0

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

THE SITE

ABOUT MTBR

VISIT US AT

© Copyright 2019 VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.