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  1. #1
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    trail help

    with all this rain that we have been getting I was needed some help with trail work I've been doing. On sandy section I've been carring out bags of concrete and mixing it in with the sand so when it drys the trails are nice and firm. The thing is I'm getting tired of carry all these bags out there myself (50lb a bag) and wanted to see if I could get any help

  2. #2
    sixsixtysix
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    Quote Originally Posted by way-no
    with all this rain that we have been getting I was needed some help with trail work I've been doing. On sandy section I've been carring out bags of concrete and mixing it in with the sand so when it drys the trails are nice and firm. The thing is I'm getting tired of carry all these bags out there myself (50lb a bag) and wanted to see if I could get any help

    You are bored aren't you?

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by way-no
    with all this rain that we have been getting I was needed some help with trail work I've been doing. On sandy section I've been carring out bags of concrete and mixing it in with the sand so when it drys the trails are nice and firm. The thing is I'm getting tired of carry all these bags out there myself (50lb a bag) and wanted to see if I could get any help
    Get some pictures of the area you are working on so we know whether it is a worthy project. How many bags are left to be carried and what is the distance to be carried?

    How far do you have to dig down to get to a solid base? Aren't trail improvement fun? How many users use this trail on a daily basis?

    Doc

  4. #4
    pedaller
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    Are you sure that 90% of trail users will be able to clear the sections you are "improving"? That seems to be the acceptable benchmark for trailwork here.

    Also, I suggest you load those bags onto an ATV and drive them out to the site. It's worth it, even if it means widening the existing trail a little bit.

    It would also be nice if you could mix in some good sized rocks in with the concrete to establish some nice rock gardens and help with the erosion...

    You are on the right track though - Keep up the good work!
    "Nobody ever told me not to try" - Curious George Soundtrack by Jack Johnson

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by way-no
    with all this rain that we have been getting I was needed some help with trail work I've been doing. On sandy section I've been carring out bags of concrete and mixing it in with the sand so when it drys the trails are nice and firm.
    Are you joking?

  6. #6
    Saucy Size
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    Be sure to reinforce the structure with rebar first. Don't let anyone see you hauling the torch out into the desert -- people get twitchy when they see you hauling fuel through the brush.

    p.

  7. #7
    sixsixtysix
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    Its a trap.

    But while you're at it wayno, can you just pave all of National? The rocks just make it too hard to ride.

  8. #8
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    no, i carried about five bags today, dam my back hurts. some hikers were given me some grief about it when i was out there mixing it in some loose sand on national.
    I've being doing this to dc for some time now and it seems to help out in the washes now it's some much faster.
    I do carry out all my trash out

  9. #9
    Just another half mile...
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    Now we know who's been sanitizing the trails on SoMo. If you want to ride paved trails go ride the Scottsdale green belt. Please stop paving the dirt! There is nothing wrong with a little sand on the trail. It's called mountain biking for a reason.

    Quote Originally Posted by way-no
    no, i carried about five bags today, dam my back hurts. some hikers were given me some grief about it when i was out there mixing it in some loose sand on national.
    I've being doing this to dc for some time now and it seems to help out in the washes now it's some much faster.
    I do carry out all my trash out

  10. #10
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    I saw big crew of people doing some trail work on the trail that goes up the ridge, southwest of the Pima Canyon Parking lot. For some reason I've never been on it. Is it worth my while?
    Attached Images Attached Images

  11. #11
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    way-no,
    I got bricks if you want them. I can just drop them in the areas that look like they need it.

  12. #12
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    thanks tony,lets use those to for water drains. Me and sixty got back from home depot with another 26 bags.
    we need more help moving these up the hill!

  13. #13
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    Can we get a heli drop?
    On a real note, I'll be at the mtn tomorrow around 12:30 if anyone is up for a pedal. The mtn is nice and spongy.

  14. #14
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    tony we should have backpacks and just put holes in the bags and start at the end of the fire road so the ride up will have better traction.

    you know that leaves 24 more.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by tmarkos
    Can we get a heli drop?
    On a real note, I'll be at the mtn tomorrow around 12:30 if anyone is up for a pedal. The mtn is nice and spongy.

    I'd be down for some pedal action, where ya starting at?


    .
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  16. #16
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    kort can you carry a bag too?

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by way-no
    kort can you carry a bag too?

    F that!! I can carry two bags.

    .
    Eating meat is murder, yummy yummy murder!!

  18. #18
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    they are about 50lbs a piece are you sure you want two on your back?

  19. #19
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    Bobby just told me he'd go down to Home Depot and pick up a truckload of workers and then we can rent some bikes and send them on up! Odelay

  20. #20
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    So I am sure I understand, you are looking for help in basically paving the trails around SoMo because you feel the sand slows you down to much... is that right?

    Perhaps you should look into a different discipline of cycling:

    Just keep pedaling...

    visit the sticki chronicles

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kortface
    I'd be down for some pedal action, where ya starting at?


    .

    48th street.

  22. #22
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    Where are the pictures?

    way no:

    Why don't you take some pictures of your work product, so those of us who enjoy trail maintenance projects can pick up some techniques on how to surface harden sand. How many feet of sand hardening do you get for a 50 lb. bag?

    My dad use to drive a truck and he delivered 100 lb. bags of donut flour to bakeries. He sometimes would carry two bags (one on each shoulder) to speed up the delivery process. Try carrying two bags maybe it would be easier, just think what a great workout you getting.


    Doc
    Last edited by traildoc; 02-09-2009 at 11:44 PM.

  23. #23
    more beers, lees gears.
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    i really wish you would stop. sand in the desert and on the mountain is expected.

    I highly doubt the city, park rangers, environmentalists, and too many other people want you doing this either.

    by paving the trail through the sand, you are essentially damming up a wash.
    A burrito is a sleeping bag for ground beef.

  24. #24
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  25. #25
    more beers, lees gears.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RidingRiot

    i really hope so.

    At first i was thinking this has to be a joke, but then again, we all know people will modify the trail with rocks to make sections easier, by removing, or adding rocks.

    and then there are the infamous hikers that try and slow bikers down on national by moving small boulders.

    So I wasnt sure what to think.
    A burrito is a sleeping bag for ground beef.

  26. #26
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    This thread is awesome

  27. #27
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    Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of
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  28. #28
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    Thanks for the Pictures

    way-no:

    Seems like a worthy project. Give me a PM the next rain storm, I am good for around 100 bags.

    Doc

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by RidingRiot
    Somebody obviously hacked into this website. I was always told "gullible" was not in the dictionary.
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  30. #30
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    Great job way-no. I'll join the work if we can also clean up CoronaDL. Every ride I take one big rock out of the trail and roll it off the side.

    I haven't noticed a difference yet, but with perseverance.....

  31. #31
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    I'm not worried about the hikers moving my rocks, I use nail glue to hold them together. Thats stuff is so strong and very easy to carry in a back pack.

    Carried out two more bags today,just thinking how many more bags this section of dc I will need?

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elvota
    So I am sure I understand, you are looking for help in basically paving the trails around SoMo because you feel the sand slows you down to much... is that right?

    Perhaps you should look into a different discipline of cycling:


    Thats a sweet ride,I would ride that no problem in that color if you buy my it

    I do like road bikes,but not for somo it beat up my last one real bad.

  33. #33
    sixsixtysix
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  34. #34
    I am Doctor Remulak
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    Quote Originally Posted by way-no
    I'm not worried about the hikers moving my rocks, I use nail glue to hold them together. Thats stuff is so strong and very easy to carry in a back pack.
    Perhaps the best trail maintenance tip I've ever read.

  35. #35
    Chunky Monkey
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    No-Way

    No-Way,

    Can I do in north Phoenix what you are doing in the south? Just think of it, I have a friend with a asphalt company. We could start at Cave Creek Park on to Spur Cross than down to the McDowell s. Hell if we could marshal up some help we could cover Phoenix and move on to Tucson or Flagpole. Ohhh the rush of it all

    Thx,
    John

  36. #36
    Meatbomb
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    Maybe we can use a helicopter to stage some bags like they did in the McDowells

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by way-no
    Thats a sweet ride,I would ride that no problem in that color if you buy my it

    I do like road bikes,but not for somo it beat up my last one real bad.
    Awh crud... I already placed a hefty down payment on some matching pink neon cement mixers for you and TrailDoc



    I kinda figured you guys would already have some pink road bikes. My mistake.
    Just keep pedaling...

    visit the sticki chronicles

  38. #38
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    New Ridge Trail

    The trail being built up the ridge above the Marcos de Niza rock is being built at the request of the park by VOAz. The existing fall line trail that goes straight up the crest of the ridge is being replaced by a more sustainable contouring trail. The trail is really intended as a hiking trail with sections of stairs due to the steep rocky nature of the ridge. Would be a lot of hike-a-bike for short sections of riding.

  39. #39
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    Sedona Trail Hardening Projest

    We have a couple of sandy areas in Sedona on Az Cypress and the Girdner trail and conditions were perfect to use the way-no surface hardening technique to keep these trails firm all the time. The problem sections of trails are over a mile from the road so we needed a crew of laborers to carry out the bags of cement.

    With some quick thinking we were able to get Congress to pass a mini stimulus bill to fund the project. We were given two million in funds for labor, tools and materials. Having the funds we went and rented a flat bed truck and drove to the Home Depot in Cottonwood to pick up the cement, tools and laborers.

    Unfortunately we couldn’t find any legal laborers who wanted to carry 50 lb. bags of cement even if we supplied a wheelbarrow to but the cement in. There were over 20 illegals that were more than happy to help with the project they even offered to carry two bags at a time, but the terms of the funding didn't allow for using foreign labor so we scrubbed the project until we could find legals to help out.

    At this point the cost of the flat bed rental has been $250 plus the administration fees of $10,000 and we are not sure if there will ever be enough legals to fill the labor needs of the project.

  40. #40
    I have new balls
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc
    We have a couple of sandy areas in Sedona on Az Cypress and the Girdner trail and conditions were perfect to use the way-no surface hardening technique to keep these trails firm all the time. The problem sections of trails are over a mile from the road so we needed a crew of laborers to carry out the bags of cement.

    With some quick thinking we were able to get Congress to pass a mini stimulus bill to fund the project. We were given two million in funds for labor, tools and materials. Having the funds we went and rented a flat bed truck and drove to the Home Depot in Cottonwood to pick up the cement, tools and laborers.

    Unfortunately we couldn’t find any legal laborers who wanted to carry 50 lb. bags of cement even if we supplied a wheelbarrow to but the cement in. There were over 20 illegals that were more than happy to help with the project they even offered to carry two bags at a time, but the terms of the funding didn't allow for using foreign labor so we scrubbed the project until we could find legals to help out.

    At this point the cost of the flat bed rental has been $250 plus the administration fees of $10,000 and we are not sure if there will ever be enough legals to fill the labor needs of the project.

    this is why I'm here asking for help.

    I'm not wanting to pave the trails just firm up the sandy parts.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by way-no
    this is why I'm here asking for help.

    I'm not wanting to pave the trails just firm up the sandy parts.
    I understand your frustration, thanks again for the pictures.Keep up the good work, I am sure it will put many s on future riders faces.

    When you finish that project we may need a project manager to complete our project. We are currently paying the same amount that people will be making on those future green jobs that President Obama is talking about, plus stock in the company.

  42. #42
    newbie mountain biker
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    I didn't realize this was fake until we got to the nail glue comment

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by papago warrior
    I didn't realize this was fake until we got to the nail glue comment

    Fake,,lets some one move 500lb of rock glued together

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