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  1. #1
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    Spesh enduro too much for local trails in Phoenix?

    So I have figured out that the Enduro seems popular for bigger-hit trails like National up on somo, but im curious if anyone has ridden that much bike extensively on other trail systems in town like PMP, Hawes, FINS, etc.

    Current sales from Specialized got me all worked up and intent on upgrading (likely adding a 2nd bike though vs replacing) my 2017 camber comp 29. I'm getting the idea that a stumpy is so similar to the camber that it'd possibly not be worth it to have that and the camber, but now I wonder if a camber/enduro pairing might make for a nice little stable to pick from.

    There's also a solid chance I'd finally just sell the camber if I fell in love with and used the new ride the majority of the time, so usability on the local stuff is kinda important. That said, I'm not averse to putting in a little extra work on climbs if it's still somewhat reasonable, and the promise of bombing through rocky sections downhill gives me a chub =)

  2. #2
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    I have friend that does some XC races on his enduro. He not fast, but he does it. Personally I have zero need for an Enduro. My 130/125 Santa Cruz 5010 with a dropper is enough ride everything I want including national. However I find that bike "too big" for alot of places. Certainly rideable every where, but I enjoy a lighter snappier bike in alot of places and I like to climb.
    Joe
    '18 Specialized Epic 29", Vassago Verhauen SS 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  3. #3
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    I have at 2018 Stumpjumper that replaced a Breezer Supercell, similar to a Camber. Since I can't afford two full suspension bikes the Stumpjumper is the perfect compromise for me. I'm a bigger guys so the added suspension is nice on the big hits. If I had a Camber and was going to get a second bike, then I could see getting an Enduro.

    A friend of mine rode his Enduro on everything in the valley and he was fast on the ups and downs. He now has a Yeti 4.5 and feels it is better suited to the trails he normally rides, but again, that is his only bike.

  4. #4
    No Clue Crew
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    Iíve owned several E29s, an older Camber and currently riding a Ď17 Stumpy.

    I didnít like the Camber. The Stumpy pedals just as well and destroys it downhill. The E29 is a great bike. Iíve ridden it on all the systems you listed. Great at SoMo and PMP. Not my first choice for Hawes, but still not bad.

    What is the current sale?
    Just like a raindrop, I was born to fall.

  5. #5
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    I've only ever ridden two bikes on trails (not counting old school Huffy ones when I was a kid). An REI Novara Bonanza 26in HT, and my current 17 camber comp 29. So I don't have much experience to base any of my theories on. I'm in that 'dont know what i dont know' phase I think, but always trying to learn more, and try something different/new.

    That in mind, I LOVE the camber, but again, given my riding history, I think anyone would love that thing compared to the rei bike.

    As for the current sales, im still in the cheapskate ballpark on pricing these days, but Enduro Comps are going for $2719:

    https://globalbikes.info/product/spe...e-306107-1.htm

    I wouldn't say that I've totally ruled the Stumpy out either, but mainly worry that it'll be too much like the camber ive been riding to feel like it was worth the spend. Stumpy comp carbons going for $2974:

    https://globalbikes.info/product/spe...e-307396-1.htm

    and not yet really decided on wheel size either. i jumped from 26 to 29 without issue, and love the wheels, but part of me continues to wanna try something different. plus, the 27.5s end up with more squish in the case of the stumpy. 150 both ends vs 135/150 rear/front on the 29. In the case of the enduro, 170 for the 27.5's and 160 for the 29ers.

  6. #6
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    What do you want to do with the bike? The Camber is a middle of the road do it all bike. I will not be light an snappy as XC bike like an Epic, but also not be as fast as and Enduro or stumpy on the techy stuff.

    If your goal is ride all the "Big stuff" at So Mo (National, Geronimo, Holbert, Old Man etc) Then an Enduro is good. If you want to set some PR's on desert classic get an Epic.
    Joe
    '18 Specialized Epic 29", Vassago Verhauen SS 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoePAz View Post
    What do you want to do with the bike? The Camber is a middle of the road do it all bike. I will not be light an snappy as XC bike like an Epic, but also not be as fast as and Enduro or stumpy on the techy stuff.

    If your goal is ride all the "Big stuff" at So Mo (National, Geronimo, Holbert, Old Man etc) Then an Enduro is good. If you want to set some PR's on desert classic get an Epic.
    Makes me think I should get my brain out of new-bike-fever mode, and stick to the camber. My riding is kinda in the middle. I have zero plans of going ultra fast, xc racer, weight weenie, etc. I do enjoy flying thru downhills on the smooth stuff out at browns ranch, but thats probably about as xc as i get on that end of the spectrum. Climbing is still a lotta fun to me though, especially techy ones. The rocky climb out in pmp at the top of what strava seems to refer to as the 'big red climb".... coming at that point from both the red rock side and the trail from the east (8a i think?) Are a lotta fun and i find them really gratifying when i clear them.

    I rode part of national once (from waterfall down) and in that segment found some drops that i dont imagine id ever even attempt. So definitely not full bonsai on that end of the spectrum either. But i do lean more towards rocky and technical stuff as i like the challenge, especially if i can do it fast.

    I also wanna get my ass to sedona eventually and just explore the hell outta that trail system, as well as more time on the smoother but also very fun to me stuff up in flag like around schultz creek.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thoreau View Post
    Makes me think I should get my brain out of new-bike-fever mode, and stick to the camber. My riding is kinda in the middle. I have zero plans of going ultra fast, xc racer, weight weenie, etc. I do enjoy flying thru downhills on the smooth stuff out at browns ranch, but thats probably about as xc as i get on that end of the spectrum. Climbing is still a lotta fun to me though, especially techy ones. The rocky climb out in pmp at the top of what strava seems to refer to as the 'big red climb".... coming at that point from both the red rock side and the trail from the east (8a i think?) Are a lotta fun and i find them really gratifying when i clear them.

    I rode part of national once (from waterfall down) and in that segment found some drops that i dont imagine id ever even attempt. So definitely not full bonsai on that end of the spectrum either. But i do lean more towards rocky and technical stuff as i like the challenge, especially if i can do it fast.

    I also wanna get my ass to sedona eventually and just explore the hell outta that trail system, as well as more time on the smoother but also very fun to me stuff up in flag like around schultz creek.
    I tend to agree. The camber is a very capable bike. If you've got some money to spend and still have the stock fork, you might think about getting a Pike. You could even go to 130 mm.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slyham View Post
    I tend to agree. The camber is a very capable bike. If you've got some money to spend and still have the stock fork, you might think about getting a Pike. You could even go to 130 mm.
    As I'm sure you (and others) have noticed from my posts in my short time here, I tend to over analyze a lotta stuff, and have a bad habit of wanting new shiny things too. Not a great combination, but it can be fun at times, lol.

    FWIW, I just found out that my S-Works card actually did get enough of a limit boost to spring for the Stumpjumper Expert model at current sale prices. I know that I'm gonna continue to want 'more bike' and drive myself nuts as a result, which now makes me wanna go the stumpy route (despite the upcoming new model releases, whatever those might entail) just because I can get into it for $500 off normal price, get carbon frame and wheels, eagle groupset, fox 34 performance, monarch rt shock, etc. Quite the platform for my long-term riding i think?

    And of course sell off the camber. And abandon the entire Enduro thing that was probably retarded from the get go =)

    I tend to be gung ho on smaller upgrades as time goes on (drivetrain bits, tires, brakes, even the dropper post) but when it comes to big stuff like forks and wheelsets, i always shy away from purchasing because of lack of experience and the big dollar signs tied to them. At least with a new bike entirely (too many dollar signs, but i digress) it's a known system/combination that has proven itself with other riders who've gone before me.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thoreau View Post
    ..I rode part of national once (from waterfall down) and in that segment found some drops that i dont imagine id ever even attempt. So definitely not full bonsai on that end of the spectrum either. ..
    I did fine on that section of national on my 5010 (130/125, 68 deg HA) with a dropper post. So if that is more than you want to ride I bet the camber will be fine.
    Joe
    '18 Specialized Epic 29", Vassago Verhauen SS 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoePAz View Post
    I did fine on that section of national on my 5010 (130/125, 68 deg HA) with a dropper post. So if that is more than you want to ride I bet the camber will be fine.
    You know what you're doing though =)

    Admittedly, I have a long way to go as far as building confidence goes. I also ride solo a lot, so I tend to not push myself as much as I could, but I've been working on changing both the solo bit and the pushing/learning side.

    Kinda hoping that more bike will nudge me. If for no other reason than to justify the cost, but I do wanna at least try to improve.

  12. #12
    Meatbomb
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    If you can wait until the new models come out the prices start dropping even more (if they have the inventory). I got a great deal on my Stumpy because it was last years model and an XL frame size....

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thoreau View Post
    You know what you're doing though =)

    Admittedly, I have a long way to go as far as building confidence goes. I also ride solo a lot, so I tend to not push myself as much as I could, but I've been working on changing both the solo bit and the pushing/learning side.

    Kinda hoping that more bike will nudge me. If for no other reason than to justify the cost, but I do wanna at least try to improve.
    Dropper post is great confidence builder. Makes my 5010 from a "trail bike" to an "enduro machine". At least it feels that way.
    Joe
    '18 Specialized Epic 29", Vassago Verhauen SS 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoePAz View Post
    Dropper post is great confidence builder. Makes my 5010 from a "trail bike" to an "enduro machine". At least it feels that way.
    That was one of the more recent additions to my camber. It took a little while get used to actually using it, but I've started finally instinctively reaching for that little lever as I approach any kind of downhill bits, and sometimes even for short techy climbs.

    Also found that its nice for fast curvy downhills to be able to get my flab, er, mass down lower, but that one is taking a little more time to make instinctive.

    I hemmed and hawed at the idea of a dropper from day 1, and while it's not 'must-have' for me YET, I'm dead certain it will become something I can't live without as I find more times to use it.

  15. #15
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    I know your itching to buy a new bike, but I didn't replace my 120/120 mm trail bike until I broke the rear triangle at the bottom of a drop.

    Keep gaining confidence and when you feel like the camber is limiting you, that's when you upgrade.

  16. #16
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    Just from what I read above I would say no you don't need an enduro or comparable. Just throw a lil money at your current bike and continue to have fun.
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoePAz View Post
    I did fine on that section of national on my 5010 (130/125, 68 deg HA) with a dropper post. So if that is more than you want to ride I bet the camber will be fine.
    Agree 100%....well 98% because the 1st thing I'd do if I was Thoreau is get off the Specialized affliction. The 5010 is a very capable bike. I've ridden mine on National, all over Sedona including Hangover and every trail in St George/Hurricane numerous times.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by clockwork View Post
    Just from what I read above I would say no you don't need an enduro or comparable. Just throw a lil money at your current bike and continue to have fun.
    This ^^^. An Enduro alone won't give you the confidence to ride the more challenging sections on National, only faster. Learn the lines and build the confidence on your Camber and go from there. Small upgrades go a long way to keeping it interesting and fueling the stoke!

  19. #19
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    I have owned 3 different enduro 29ers and a 2017 is my current ride. Of course it is too much bike for most of the riding around the valley but that doesn't make riding it any less fun! I only have one bike so while it may be overkill for Browns Ranch I enjoy having it when I go to Sedona or South Mountain.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by nick041881 View Post
    ... Of course it is too much bike for most of the riding around the valley but that doesn't make riding it any less fun! ...
    That is highly debateable. I have friend with and Enduro and he knows it does not climb well. It big and heavy and on some trails it sucks the life out of him. However it loves it in other spots on the trail and gladly takes the trade off. So to say it does not make riding less fun is not true for everyone. Personally would not want to ride my 5010 at Browns. That will be no fun. But I love my singlespeed there.
    Joe
    '18 Specialized Epic 29", Vassago Verhauen SS 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

  21. #21
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    Not here to argue, but the enduro is not that bad of a climber for a 165mm travel bike. I will not say that it climbs as well as a hardtail or an epic or another more dedicated xc bike but climbing on it does not take the fun out of my riding! All of the reviews seem to think that it climbs pretty well for what it is. I agree that the climbing ability is a trade off for the descending capability but it really isn't that bad!

    https://www.bikemag.com/gear/mountai...nduro-comp-29/

    https://www.pinkbike.com/news/specia...view-2017.html

    https://www.pinkbike.com/news/2017-s...irst-look.html

    https://www.mtb-mag.com/en/tested-sp...trek-slash-29/

  22. #22
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    I love these "which bike" threads...but I think this is pretty easy.
    1. pick the minimum specs you require for what you ride most often...
    2. feel free to go "up" at least 1 1/2 in range (capability) to get the bike that makes you the most happy to ride...b/c you will ride it more
    3. ride it like you stole it...upgrade it...til you break it.
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by nick041881 View Post
    ..but the enduro is not that bad of a climber for a 165mm travel bike..
    The issue is dragging a 32lbs 165mm bike up a 1000 foot ST climb is never "fun". The fun part of that is going down, but if your down is not techy then you don't get that fun back on the way down. Climbing Mormon/National to Buena Vista sucks on any 165mm bike, but going back down is where it shines. However when you are climbing browns Mtn and going back down the other side the climb will suck and you will never use bike that much on the way down. Better to use HT or short travel XC bike so climb does not suck as bad and descent is still fun. Same for everything at Sonoran North and South. The descents are not rough enough to counter the weight of a big big on the climbs. Now Climbing windgate sucks, but the Enduro would rock going down Bell pass.

    It is all about choices and making the right one for you needs/desires. This one reason I have 3 Mtn bikes. I pick the one I want to use for the trail I am riding and experience I want for the day.
    Joe
    '18 Specialized Epic 29", Vassago Verhauen SS 29", '13 Santa Cruz Solo 27.5", XC, AM, blah blah blah.. I just ride.

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