Results 1 to 17 of 17

Thread: Share the Road

  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    540

    Share the Road

    Okay. So this has come up in enough recent threads, that I decided to make a new one. My family and I have decided to do the best we can to educate cyclists and motorists alike on the rules of the road, and how to share public rights-of-way. It has become a serious problem for us here in Flagstaff.

    We do not own a car, and do not drive. We have two kids, one old enough to ride his own bike, and the 1.5 yo we pull in a baby trailer. There are problems with drivers apparently not understanding that we have a right to be on the road every week.

    In addition to this, we see many many cyclists who do not follow the rules of the road either. This confuses me. I was *shocked* when I stopped at a stop sign to let pedestrians cross in my neighborhood and they looked surprised and said 'thanks!'... wtf!?! I get a 'thank you' for stopping at a stop sign? Like they expected me to just blow through it and run them down? Something is wrong. And I send my son to the corner store to get some milk, and he is harassed by some guy telling him to 'get on the sidewalk'... again, something is wrong.

    So we printed up a bunch of flyers with excerpts from the ADOT Multimodal Planning Division website. And created an email account (bikesafe01@gmail.com). We have been distributing flyers all over town to cyclists and motorists alike, to educate and increase awareness that cyclists on the road must follow the same rules of the road as motorists, and that we have the same rights and responsibilities. These flyers have been put on public bulletin boards, every bike at a bike rack, under windsheild wipers, and even hand delivered to people seen doing dangerous/illegal things on the road.

    If anyone is interested in carrying this effort further afield than Flagstaff, let me know if you want some of the flyers. I understand ADOT has a 'Share the Road' booklet as well, which would be great to distribute in similar fashion.

  2. #2
    Master Gardener
    Reputation: Velokid1's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,347
    We're working on it here in Prescott. It's slow-going, as it is in most towns.

    It's interesting how many cyclists I know, who believe themselves to be educated about how to safely and responsibly ride on the road, do things that they wouldn't do in a car. This morning I saw a good friend riding to work downtown and as the row of cars ahead of him came to a stop at a red light, he rode right up along their right side and then stopped at the intersection.

    I'm sure he thinks that's acceptable and doesn't even consider that passing on the right is always illegal on roadways.

  3. #3
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    30,444
    Quote Originally Posted by Velokid1

    I'm sure he thinks that's acceptable and doesn't even consider that passing on the right is always illegal on roadways.
    Passing on the right is not illegal in AZ if you can do so safely and keep from crossing the lines on the side of the road. I learned this in defensive driving
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  4. #4
    Master Gardener
    Reputation: Velokid1's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,347
    On wide roads, it's true you could pass on the right. But there are virtually no roads in Prescott wide enough to do so. Passing safely, according to state law, requires that there is a minimum of 3' between vehicles. Lanes that wide (12-14') are rare in our little cowboy town.

  5. #5
    Master Gardener
    Reputation: Velokid1's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,347
    I've been trying to keep an eye on this one: http://www.azleg.gov/FormatDocument....ls/hb2479p.htm

    Argument for No-Stop Law for bicycles: http://azbikelaw.org/blog/why-i-supp...at-stop-signs/

    Blog discussing it: http://azbikelaw.org/blog/bicycle-st...nges-proposed/

  6. #6
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    24
    "I understand ADOT has a 'Share the Road' booklet as well, which would be great to distribute in similar fashion."

    yes they do and are more than happy to send any amount you wish to anyone who requests them. i distribute them in Prescott to cyclists, pedestrians and motorists. i also find peoples' ignorance quite appalling with all users.

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    540
    Quote Originally Posted by Velokid1
    I've been trying to keep an eye on this one: http://www.azleg.gov/FormatDocument....ls/hb2479p.htm

    Argument for No-Stop Law for bicycles: http://azbikelaw.org/blog/why-i-supp...at-stop-signs/

    Blog discussing it: http://azbikelaw.org/blog/bicycle-st...nges-proposed/
    Quote Originally Posted by IdahoLaw
    C. The driver of a vehicle approaching a yield sign AND ANY PERSON RIDING A BICYCLE APPROACHING A YIELD SIGN OR A STOP SIGN shall slow down in obedience to the sign to a speed reasonable for the existing conditions and shall yield the right‑of‑way to any vehicle in the intersection or approaching on another highway so closely as to constitute an immediate hazard during the time the driver OR BICYCLE RIDER is moving across or within the intersection. If after driving OR RIDING past a yield sign OR STOP SIGN without stopping the driver OR BICYCLE RIDER is involved in a collision with a vehicle in the intersection, the collision is prima facie evidence of the driverís OR BICYCLE RIDERíS failure to yield the right‑of‑way.
    That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. The sign says 'STOP'. It does not say 'slow down and stop if necessary to avoid a crash'. Granted, that would be a big sign, but we already have a sign that does that job: 'YIELD'. There is a reason why the two are different. This is a perfect example of reckless/careless behavior being so well tolerated that it eventually becomes legal.

    The argument that most cars already roll through stop signs and when making right turns on red is invalid. Most cars don't signal when changing lanes either. So I guess we should change the laws and car manufacturers can save a bunch of money by not equipping cars with turn signals? How about speed limit signs? We could just do away with those altogether. Lots of people routinely drive 5-15 mph faster than the posted speed limit anyway. I've caught myself speeding on my bicycle before, and I would expect to get a speeding ticket if I did that often enough. But you'll see plenty of people doing 35mph through the school zone near my house, in front a cop... no ticket. Why spend the money to put up the signage if it is routinely ignored and the violations are so well tolerated?

    Further down the slippery slope: I guess if I shoot my rifle in a public space with lots of people, but I don't actually end up shooting anyone, then there is no "prima facie evidence" of me endangering the lives of my fellow citzens. It would also, naturally, be incumbent upon them to recognize something "constituting an immediate hazard" and yield the right of way to my bullets.

    Sorry, it seems like society would like to make the roads into a free-for-all and not be bothered with things like having to stop. This only has the net effect of making it more dangerous for everyone.

  8. #8
    Master Gardener
    Reputation: Velokid1's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,347
    Wow.

  9. #9
    Not a Barry supporter.
    Reputation: Crash_FLMB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,869
    Can't help the stupid...

    I follow the rules of the road but if no ones around, I will slow down but not stop at a stop sign. Say what you will but that's how I roll. If there's lots of traffic, I will stop, completely.

    More nanny state stuff? Maybe get gov't involved. They aren't doing much these days except complaining about the people they supposedly represent.

    And get a car hippie....
    Why would I need more than one gear?
    @A_SingleSpeeder
    EPA = crooks!

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    540
    Quote Originally Posted by Crash_FLMB
    Can't help the stupid...
    ehhh... what?

    Quote Originally Posted by Crash_FLMB
    Maybe get gov't involved. They aren't doing much these days except complaining about the people they supposedly represent.
    Agree completely. Government is supposed to fulfill a necessary role within society... anymore, they're a bunch of squabbling dingbats who don't seem to know what 'needs' to be done at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crash_FLMB
    And get a car hippie....
    Umm.. no. I don't drive, and don't need to. This town is 8 miles from one end to the other. I've ridden across it, in traffic, to do errands in 20 minutes. Care explaining why not being willing to pay for the ridiculous expense of owning a car in order to engender the laziness required to drive 10 blocks to the store makes me a 'hippie'?

    Of course, if you figure that my location is Flagstaff, a town noted for being rather left of center, and are interpreting the fact that I don't drive as being a political statement, and have somehow jumped to the conclusion that I am some hemp wearing anti-establishment bum... then you couldn't be more wrong.

    You can be sure, the next time I almost get hit by a tie-dye VW bus with 'peace' spray-painted on the side, the driver's gonna get an earful.

  11. #11
    Not a Barry supporter.
    Reputation: Crash_FLMB's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,869
    Quote Originally Posted by sunset1123
    Of course, if you figure that my location is Flagstaff, a town noted for being rather left of center, and are interpreting the fact that I don't drive as being a political statement, and have somehow jumped to the conclusion that I am some hemp wearing anti-establishment bum... then you couldn't be more wrong.

    You can be sure, the next time I almost get hit by a tie-dye VW bus with 'peace' spray-painted on the side, the driver's gonna get an earful.
    I stand corrected. I apologize for lumping you in with the rest of Flagstaff.

    I always feel dirty when I go up there. I've seen way too many chicks with armpit hair. UGH!
    Why would I need more than one gear?
    @A_SingleSpeeder
    EPA = crooks!

  12. #12
    suvlako
    Reputation: suvlako's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    510
    Is it any wonder why Motorists are rude and unwilling to yield to cyclists? Here in Tucson we have cyclists who ride 4 abreast on two lane Mt. Lemmon highway and then flip you off when you honk at them. Not sure if you have been up Mt. Lemmon highway but it is dangerous enough without having to dodge roadies. I'd love to sing cumbaya with them but so long as they put other cyclist, motorcyclists and motorists in danger....

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    540
    Indeed. Even though I am a cyclist, I do not condone the irresponsible behavior of other cyclists any more or less than that of drivers. Riding 4 abreast on a narrow road is not just illegal, but discourteous as well. I haven't been up Mt. Lemmon, but realize that if the shoulder is too narrow or in bad condition, it would be perfectly legal for cyclists to take the lane, two abreast... _legally_ any traffic behind them would have to wait. It would be common courtesy for these riders, as 'slower traffic' to pull to the side safely and let faster traffic by at reasonable intervals.

    It is absolutely true, no matter what clever rationalizations people come up with, that cyclists will not be respected on the road until (as a whole) we shape up and start playing by the rules. Lobbying to have the rules changed to be tolerant of irresposible behavior that already pisses off drivers is not going to make anyone's life any easier. But drivers need to take a chill pill sometimes also, and realize that getting somewhere 2 minutes faster isn't worth nearly running someone off the road.

  14. #14
    mtbr member
    Reputation: az1jeff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    604
    Quote Originally Posted by sunset1123
    You can be sure, the next time I almost get hit by a tie-dye VW bus with 'peace' spray-painted on the side, the driver's gonna get an earful.
    ^

    Hey sunset or other Flagstaffer's, any advice for reliable parking that's close to downtown and/or the university? Intent is to ride from there.

    jeff

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    540
    I'd say downtown near the Library/Wheeler Park. NAU will be back in session soon, so I don't know about the lot across the ravine from Denny's... that's a good one when campus is deserted.

    Also, the TH at the Buffalo Park gate has a small parking lot, and easy access to trails, but arrive early.

    Other than that, if you will be riding into Fort Valley or Dry Lake Hills, you could try the Bashas parking lot off of Hwy 180.

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation: az1jeff's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    604
    Thanks. Appreciate that.

  17. #17
    Kathleen in AZ
    Reputation: DurtGurl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Posts
    5,179
    Quote Originally Posted by suvlako
    Is it any wonder why Motorists are rude and unwilling to yield to cyclists? Here in Tucson we have cyclists who ride 4 abreast on two lane Mt. Lemmon highway and then flip you off when you honk at them. Not sure if you have been up Mt. Lemmon highway but it is dangerous enough without having to dodge roadies. I'd love to sing cumbaya with them but so long as they put other cyclist, motorcyclists and motorists in danger....
    During Spring Fling this year (when I hitched a ride on the road to get my 4Runner from the drop off point up by Greenie when Gary broke his collarbone), I was amazed and impresssed that there was a city street cleaner vehicle moving slowly up the Mt. Lemon road cleaning the bike lane.

Members who have read this thread: 0

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

THE SITE

ABOUT MTBR

VISIT US AT

© Copyright 2019 VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.