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  1. #1
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    Riding the NEW Little Horse Trail Improvement

    Yesterday I talked our friends from Canada to do a loop from their rental home on Chapel Rd. via the Little Horse trail in the uphill direction. We headed south trough the Neighborhood and hooked up on the Bell Rock Pathway trail that we took south to the bottom of the Little Horse trail.

    While heading up Little Horse to the new FS improvement section I felt the excitement of being able to try and make the new trail improvement recently built by several volunteers and two FS personnel. As we got close to the improvement there were two tourons walking their bikes on the lower uphill part of the climb.

    My friend Mark was following close behind me so the pressure was on to make the climb w/o dabbing. I don't know how I did it but I pulled out all my Sedona world class uphill skills and made the climb. I was totally amazed that I pulled off a miracle at my current skill level.

    My friend Mark also made the climb, but the rest of the people in our group had to walk it to make it to the top.

    After making the climb I was feeling Nod like and I was ready to climb anything Sedona had to offer. I felt so confident I told my wife to take some pictures of me riding the new section, unfortunately I never was able to pull off the climb after two more attempts.

    Hope to hear if anyone else makes the climb on the dumbed-down route. I am not sure who is going to ride down the other two options. They looked pretty sketch and I am wondering if anyone thinks differently and rides them.

    TD
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    Last edited by traildoc; 11-07-2011 at 03:12 PM.

  2. #2
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    Justin (btw thanks man) did that exactly how I like to see stuff done right around where I live..

    Glad to see you like it too TD! Thats a nice redo isnt it?

    Nice to have a few lines, and one well within reach of most.
    -Gem

  3. #3
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    TD - Is this the section that was 're-done'?
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    "The secret of joy is the mastery of pain." (Anaïs Nin)

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by titusbro View Post
    TD - Is this the section that was 're-done'?
    Barney making it look easy

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by titusbro View Post
    TD - Is this the section that was 're-done'?
    Yep
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    Last edited by traildoc; 11-07-2011 at 11:08 PM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockman View Post
    Barney making it look easy
    Yes she did, and by the look on my face (in the background) I was amazed.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by u2metoo View Post
    Yes she did, and by the look on my face (in the background) I was amazed.
    I'm 'amazed' when she is just standing still...
    "The secret of joy is the mastery of pain." (Anaïs Nin)

  8. #8
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    Oh man that was a fun little section going down....
    "Nobody ever told me not to try" - Curious George Soundtrack by Jack Johnson

  9. #9
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    Looks like some solid work there! Those are some BIG rocks. I really like the newish boulder causeway work on Broken Arrow as well. Proud work indeed.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Noelg View Post
    Oh man that was a fun little section going down....
    Let us know what you think of the NEW section to the right of the new ramp. I personally think it needs some tweaking, but what do I know?

    TD

  11. #11
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    TD, I saw a a full page picture with you and some friends in the latest issue of Decline magazine. It's towards the back and I'm pretty sure you are about to drop into Hangover.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by raisingarizona View Post
    Looks like some solid work there! Those are some BIG rocks. I really like the newish boulder causeway work on Broken Arrow as well. Proud work indeed.
    a picture


  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by justinwp View Post
    a picture

    It would be nice to get some FS approved trail markings on slickrock sections to help tourons figure out where the trail route is on those areas.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Riding the NEW Little Horse Trail Improvement-coyote-droppings.jpg  


  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    It would be nice to get some FS approved trail markings on slickrock sections to help tourons figure out where the trail route is on those areas.
    Careful for what you ask for. You may end up with more rock jails.

  15. #15
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    Seconds for the proud work on that ledge. MMMnnnn, big rocks= good line.
    There is a big difference between ripping and skidding.

  16. #16
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    Its just a bit too easy on the way down IMHO...but nice otherwise

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acrophobe View Post
    Its just a bit too easy on the way down IMHO...but nice otherwise
    Acrophobe:

    Since you were on the project to being with why don't you just go out and do a trail improvement on the steep rollin spot to the right of the dumbed down uphill ramp. You indicated you discussed the new build spot with Justin, so it seems like you should be able make that right hand side a nice option. Maybe you could get Heywoa to come out and help you with importing some of the material necessary to complete that project.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Riding the NEW Little Horse Trail Improvement-publication1.jpg  

    Last edited by traildoc; 11-10-2011 at 12:40 PM.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    Acrophobe:

    Since you were on the project to being with why don't you just go out and do a trail improvement on the steep rollin spot to the right of the dumbed down uphill ramp. You indicated you discussed the new build spot with Justin, so it seems like you should be able make that right hand side a nice option. Maybe you could get Heywoa to come out and help you with importing some of the material necessary to complete that project.
    Lucky me, another post from the doc directed at me:


    Ahhh TD my brothren, now now - now, I just got done telling you we werent doing this again? Can't you follow instructions? Miss me that much? Calling me out again? said we were gonna play nice. Now you need to be told again, already?

    FAIL .. sorry Doc, what we learned from last year was that it is best if you cease worrying about me and my involvement with trail work, and stay focused on your own free time utilization, CREC billable hours, retirement budget, and your online persona as Sedona's ambassador.

    I offered my time to the FS. Not you or your basket of 'great trail project ideas', perhaps you need me to clarify this, so there I have. Now dont ask me again whether I can ride this or that or if I did work here or there. I put my shovel where my mouth is. Now back off my ass, online, thank you.

    With regards to your concerns on my moving dirt in sedona on a solo unsanctioned trail project: Why should I do it Doc? Why should you even suggest I do it? No, that line is not my style, but I can offer the FS nothing but thanks and kudos for their efforts.

    I think the line is easier on the way down than I'd like, and yes, I would love to see some rocks stacked on the other side for a more eventful descent down this obstacle for those of us who prefer that. I didnt suggest you do it, kindly offer the same respect back Mr Ambassador. By no means was that an invitation for your sarcasm filled post. Act your age. I'm not starting with you, stop making a spectacle of yourself, its unbecoming. After all, I'm not the self appointed bozo. Hopefully I am coming across lucidly for you.

    So what is the idea in posting a picture of my koi pond dig? Yes I have tons of dirt, boulders and flagstone I just bought for a 17,000 gallon koi pond water garden. I see you have nothing better to do but look at my pond dig pics and online albums. Thats pretty tasteless of a guy who calls himself the ambassador; but its rewarding to know you have nothing else to do with your retirement days than look thru my google photo albums, and then post them on mtbr. Enjoy the pics; but its too bad your sitting there drooling at my hobbies. Go see if you can afford to develop some more of your own. Maybe someday you can build a koi pond of your own, or is biking the only outlet?

    You are how old, sir? Posting pics like that is the work of school children; but again, you fail.

    I will suggest you refrain from
    a)spending your days looking at pictures of me, and my girlfriend's home, hobbies and adventures
    b)posting pictures of my property, land, or from my albums on this forum

    But do what you think is best TD!

    Keep trying to get a rise outta me. I'm getting what I want done out on the trails I ride. Hopefully you will get the same satisfaction I enjoy.

    Did you have any other questions directed at me besides whether I can ride this section or that, or was I involved in trailwork x,y,or z? No? I look fwd to seeing you at the next FS work day or out on the trail. Enjoy the ride and keep rubber side down! cheers
    Last edited by Acrophobe; 11-10-2011 at 01:57 PM.

  19. #19
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    If coming downhill did the right side get changed at all? Did they use rocks, dirt, etc., from that side to complete this project? If no, great! If yes, well they just messed up a fun line.

    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    Acrophobe:

    Since you were on the project to being with why don't you just go out and do a trail improvement on the steep rollin spot to the right of the dumbed down uphill ramp. You indicated you discussed the new build spot with Justin, so it seems like you should be able make that right hand side a nice option. Maybe you could get Heywoa to come out and help you with importing some of the material necessary to complete that project.

  20. #20
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    they just messed up the dh line is right...

    but its HAB free in either direction, and thats what the Rx seems to be for in Sedona, versus leaving the natural character of the rocks on some section of trail..I too liked it better before

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    Yep
    Based off the side by side pics Id say the trail in the left pic looks significantly better than the one on the right. This is only based on viewing the pics.
    Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did." Mark Twain

  22. #22
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    I rode it today. The old "DH" line is still there. The old old 5' drop off to the far right is still there too if you want more tech. Solid work, nice job folks!

  23. #23
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    Could you ride up it? That was the intent after all....

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by motochick View Post
    Could you ride up it? That was the intent after all....
    I did. Its a little tricky but not super hard.

  25. #25
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    "I offered my time to the FS. Not you or your basket of 'great trail project ideas', perhaps you need me to clarify this, so there I have. Now dont ask me again whether I can ride this or that or if I did work here or there. I put my shovel where my mouth is. Now back off my ass, online, thank you."

    This is precisely what I've been asking for since my first interaction with TD. Good luck.

    Hey Doctrail- How 'bout you stop telling me what to do around here, asking about my ulterior motives and demanding I volunteer for the Doctrail trail improvements. Maybe you can even use the right screen name when you're quoting me- its right in your face. Can you do this please?
    The secret to mountain biking is pretty simple. The slower you go the more likely it is youll crash.
    - Julie Furtado

  26. #26
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    I will suggest you refrain from
    a)spending your days looking at pictures of me, and my girlfriend's home, hobbies and adventures
    b)posting pictures of my property, land, or from my albums on this forum

    Please post naked pics of said girlfriend at least and then we may start taking you seriously.

  27. #27
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    I wanna know more about the Koi pond. Sounds like a great hobby.

  28. #28
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    My friends, it feels like old times again, us all here on the same thread talking about Doctrail Projects and asking for pics of my girlfriend. Oh. Yay. woo. hoo.

    RasingAZ:Just ask doc for the link to my google pics, maybe he can post that here too, so you can all join in on my family photo albums? Doc adores viewing them during his abundant free time, perhaps youd like them too? Sadly, you'll have to come ride on the weekend to catch a glimpse of her in lycra, I wont be posting anything here for you to 'enjoy privately'. LOL

    I hope this year we can all get to know one another a little better. I want to clear up your misgivings towards me and and I am certain, for sure, that i had misjudged you -likely my error. I've promised the moderators I'd behave. Its a great way to foster blossoming friendships, yes? Lets all harvest this opportunity, why dont we?Great!

    Woahey,
    TD cant spell, and even if he could, he intentfully mucks up your username, like he mucks up mine. he can spell it *JUST* fine when spending his afternoon googling me. He's accomplished at bullying, but clearly from the ambassadors posts, he is not so edumacated as evidenced by his misusage of grammar and spelling. We call that 'country' to put it in a better light.

    ProdigalSon:
    Fishkeeping is alot of fun, and when you combine it with horitculture, you can build ecosystems that are self sustaining. Lots of fun, very nice way to chill after a ride, om shanti. Then you can bug out to sitting at the fire pit, after a dip in the hot tub, or the swimming pool. I got lots of hobbies, too many if you ask me.

    cheers!

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acrophobe View Post
    Lucky me, another post from the doc directed at me:


    Ahhh TD my brothren, now now - now, I just got done telling you we werent doing this again? Can't you follow instructions? Miss me that much? Calling me out again? said we were gonna play nice. Now you need to be told again, already?

    FAIL .. sorry Doc, what we learned from last year was that it is best if you cease worrying about me and my involvement with trail work, and stay focused on your own free time utilization, CREC billable hours, retirement budget, and your online persona as Sedona's ambassador.

    I offered my time to the FS. Not you or your basket of 'great trail project ideas', perhaps you need me to clarify this, so there I have. Now dont ask me again whether I can ride this or that or if I did work here or there. I put my shovel where my mouth is. Now back off my ass, online, thank you.

    With regards to your concerns on my moving dirt in sedona on a solo unsanctioned trail project: Why should I do it Doc? Why should you even suggest I do it? No, that line is not my style, but I can offer the FS nothing but thanks and kudos for their efforts.

    I think the line is easier on the way down than I'd like, and yes, I would love to see some rocks stacked on the other side for a more eventful descent down this obstacle for those of us who prefer that. I didnt suggest you do it, kindly offer the same respect back Mr Ambassador. By no means was that an invitation for your sarcasm filled post. Act your age. I'm not starting with you, stop making a spectacle of yourself, its unbecoming. After all, I'm not the self appointed bozo. Hopefully I am coming across lucidly for you.

    So what is the idea in posting a picture of my koi pond dig? Yes I have tons of dirt, boulders and flagstone I just bought for a 17,000 gallon koi pond water garden. I see you have nothing better to do but look at my pond dig pics and online albums. Thats pretty tasteless of a guy who calls himself the ambassador; but its rewarding to know you have nothing else to do with your retirement days than look thru my google photo albums, and then post them on mtbr. Enjoy the pics; but its too bad your sitting there drooling at my hobbies. Go see if you can afford to develop some more of your own. Maybe someday you can build a koi pond of your own, or is biking the only outlet?

    You are how old, sir? Posting pics like that is the work of school children; but again, you fail.

    I will suggest you refrain from
    a)spending your days looking at pictures of me, and my girlfriend's home, hobbies and adventures
    b)posting pictures of my property, land, or from my albums on this forum

    But do what you think is best TD!

    Keep trying to get a rise outta me. I'm getting what I want done out on the trails I ride. Hopefully you will get the same satisfaction I enjoy.

    Did you have any other questions directed at me besides whether I can ride this section or that, or was I involved in trailwork x,y,or z? No? I look fwd to seeing you at the next FS work day or out on the trail. Enjoy the ride and keep rubber side down! cheers
    Acrophobe:

    OK we finally got the wife/girl friend thing worked out.

    I just figured you would have the initiative to fix that right side roll in since as you said you just put in a 17,000 gallon Poi Pond with tons of dirt, boulders and flagstone. Obviously from the work done on your pond a small rock rollin fix would be pretty simple.

    It is just hard for me to understand why you and Woahey wouldn't get together and go out and fix that spot. You see a spot that needs work, you are both registered volunteers and you chose not to take the initiative to improve the rollin.

    Don't worry about it, I will do the fix myself since I don't think anyone is riding it the way it is.

    Even if I had the money to build a Poi Pond myself, I personally don't believe it is a good investment, but you obviously are doing well in the financial department so I say if having a Poi Pond makes you and your girl friend happy go for it.

    I took the initiative and went out and worked on Chuck Wagon today, doing so made me happy, anyway being a simple self-appointed ambassador I THINK I was happy with what I got accomplished to improve the user experience of others.

    So here is the olive branch, if you get a chance join us for the 11/11/11 ride, we are meeting tomorrow at the Huckaby parking lot at 9:45 AM, hopefully Woahey will also show-up. The boys from Vancouver, Kelona, Moab and Seattle will also be there to enjoy what should be an EXCITING ride, if you base jump bring your parachute.

    TD

  30. #30
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    doc,

    TD,
    I appreciate the olive branch. and I mean that most sincerely. I want nothing more but peace here, on mtbr, and of course on earth. You are not my adversary, on contrary we share more than many-a common gene: MTB.

    The girlfriend will hopefully formally become wifey next year, maybe we'll send you a 'save the date',if we are pals by then, k? Sorry if the details of my status with her have confused you. Not quite sure it should matter to you tho...anyhoot

    I wont be doing trailwork of that magnitude under FS radar. Its against the law. Simple.

    I see that you cant add up why I wouldnt get with WoaHey or someone else and 'just do it' Nike style. I commend you for all you have accomplished and am not back on mtbr to ruffle your feathers; tho I realize some of my perspectives and opinions may- that is NOT my intent. You like strawberry and I like chocolate.We both like wafer cones.

    If there is a approved 'work day' I would say I will try hard to make it out. I will try and come to chuck wagon work day too, tho I have little preference(read: motivation) on how dumb or smart the work ends up being-that is just not a trail I ride.Works days on The Slims, the Hogs, on Broken, templeton- if they are announced, you can count on me being there with pick and shovel.

    I think, however, that we will run into eachother on the trail soon enough again without making a date of it 11/11 @ huckaby.

    The same way I declined your invite to ride Damifino, I hope you can appreciate that being from NJ, I dont do well with exposure, Huckaby is NOT one of my favorite trails; nor is damifino, which seems to be one of yours. Kudos to you TD, I dont have the same tastes in exposure riding. That off camber stuff scares me when your on the cow pies-I hoof it! I draw the exposure line at highline, so as you can see my threshold is not high at all when it comes to exposure.. Gloat as you will with that info..

    PLEASE dont mis read me, in no way am I rejecting your olive branch, perhaps you would honor a rain check? I'm sure we'll find time to get together on the dirt someother time.

    cheers!

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acrophobe View Post
    doc,

    TD,
    I appreciate the olive branch. and I mean that most sincerely. I want nothing more but peace here, on mtbr, and of course on earth. You are not my adversary, on contrary we share more than many-a common gene: MTB.

    The girlfriend will hopefully formally become wifey next year, maybe we'll send you a 'save the date',if we are pals by then, k? Sorry if the details of my status with her have confused you. Not quite sure it should matter to you tho...anyhoot

    I wont be doing trailwork of that magnitude under FS radar. Its against the law. Simple.

    I see that you cant add up why I wouldnt get with WoaHey or someone else and 'just do it' Nike style. I commend you for all you have accomplished and am not back on mtbr to ruffle your feathers; tho I realize some of my perspectives and opinions may- that is NOT my intent. You like strawberry and I like chocolate.We both like wafer cones.

    If there is a approved 'work day' I would say I will try hard to make it out. I will try and come to chuck wagon work day too, tho I have little preference(read: motivation) on how dumb or smart the work ends up being-that is just not a trail I ride.Works days on The Slims, the Hogs, on Broken, templeton- if they are announced, you can count on me being there with pick and shovel.

    I think, however, that we will run into eachother on the trail soon enough again without making a date of it 11/11 @ huckaby.

    The same way I declined your invite to ride Damifino, I hope you can appreciate that being from NJ, I dont do well with exposure, Huckaby is NOT one of my favorite trails; nor is damifino, which seems to be one of yours. Kudos to you TD, I dont have the same tastes in exposure riding. That off camber stuff scares me when your on the cow pies-I hoof it! I draw the exposure line at highline, so as you can see my threshold is not high at all when it comes to exposure.. Gloat as you will with that info..

    PLEASE dont mis read me, in no way am I rejecting your olive branch, perhaps you would honor a rain check? I'm sure we'll find time to get together on the dirt someother time.

    cheers!
    Acrophobe:

    The rollin fix wouldn't be against the law. I would just call the FS and tell them I was going out to fix the rollin. They would give me permission and it would get done. As a simple man it seemed like a simple fix.

    Thanks for the potential wedding invite, but unlike many who love weddings, I would rather go for a ride. I haven't been to a wedding for over ten years and I doubt I will be going to any in the future.

    I do go to class reunions every five years, it is FUN to see how OLD everyone is, and if they have any hair left. I like to go in blue jeans, a tee shirt and a ball cap, so my old classmates can try and figure out if I have a house with a Poi Pond or I live in a cardboard box.

    What a great country we live in.

    TD

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    Acrophobe:

    The rollin fix wouldn't be against the law. I would just call the FS and tell them I was going out to fix the rollin. They would give me permission and it would get done. As a simple man it seemed like a simple fix.

    TD
    when you make time to do it, let me know if you can use an extra pair of hands. I"ll show.
    -cheers

    gem

  33. #33
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    ... and if we just ...

    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post

    I do go to class reunions every five years, it is FUN to see how OLD everyone is, and if they have any hair left. I like to go in blue jeans, a tee shirt and a ball cap, so my old classmates can try and figure out if I have a house with a Poi Pond or I live in a cardboard box.

    What a great country we live in.

    TD
    Hilarious. I'm glad to see you guys have buried the hatchet. Remember, friendship is like peeing on yourself: everyone can see it, but only you get the warm feeling that it brings.

  34. #34
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    what happened to the Firebird Traildoc?

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post

    It is just hard for me to understand why you and Woahey wouldn't get together and go out and fix that spot. You see a spot that needs work, you are both registered volunteers and you chose not to take the initiative to improve the rollin.

    I took the initiative and went out and worked on Chuck Wagon today, doing so made me happy, anyway being a simple self-appointed ambassador I THINK I was happy with what I got accomplished to improve the user experience of others.

    So here is the olive branch, if you get a chance join us for the 11/11/11 ride, we are meeting tomorrow at the Huckaby parking lot at 9:45 AM, hopefully Woahey will also show-up. The boys from Vancouver, Kelona, Moab and Seattle will also be there to enjoy what should be an EXCITING ride, if you base jump bring your parachute.

    TD
    I, unlike people who are bored and have to constantly tweak trails, would rather ride. You know I'm a minimalist when it comes to maintenance: trim enough for a bike to get through and let the features lie.

    As far as chuck-wagon goes, . That's obviously all you're looking for.

    I'll be getting my own 11/11/11 ride in. I was already invited to ride the new trail up there today, and heard that its really effing steep. I'm just getting used to my new dropper and still have scrapes that are healing on my elbow and shoulder from my last crash- I don't need to take a chance at ripping them up again. You'll have fun and maybe you'll even get into your big chainring somewhere on the ride.
    The secret to mountain biking is pretty simple. The slower you go the more likely it is youll crash.
    - Julie Furtado

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by canyondave View Post
    what happened to the Firebird Traildoc?
    I still have it. The 5.7 is just lighter so I don't lag behind so far. It isn't as stable on the real thechie stuff, but since I have dumbed down most every trail in Sedona I don't need a 6" travel bike a 5.7" will do great.

    TD

  37. #37
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    Sedona - Earl's Loop/Chuckwagon Ride - YouTube

    or Chuck Wagon to Gunslinger to Gunsmoke to Mescal - YouTube

    TD,

    Where does chukwagon technically BEGIN or endon the videos above?
    A time mark would be good, unless I am looking at the wrong thing
    where is the proposed trail work, and why?

    I've never ridden, and dont usually ride out there.

    Chuck wagon looks fun at 1:10 and 2:20 but the rest, well if you live here-it it looks a bit touroniffic; I'd be going out of my way to make that a ride; but I suppose I should ride it someday.

    Its interesting that you bring up size...

    up in west sedona/dry creek end of town the mix of trails is a different feel than what I enjoy riding on my 6.5 and 6" bike(MavML8 or Carbon Enduro both with fox36s)-Gunslinger to Gunsmoke to Mescal looks 'nice' but also appears more xc ' whoa look at the scenery' riding-nothing wrong with that, but not my cup of tea. Or coffee. I suppose if all I had was my smaller 5.x" bikes(Carbon Altitude with a duc32 or a ML75) with an air fork, I'd be feeling like the Doc too and wanting every trail dumb.

    TD, you cant be more than 200lbs, 6 feet? What fork do u have on the front end of your mach5.7?
    Seriously, why dont you strap on my Van36rc2 to your 5.7 and take it for a ride for a few days? I have it lowered to a shorter a2c, so it wont throw off your geometry, I have it at 153mm. I am certain you wont break it. You may even like it.

    I think youre under biked for your skill level; and the new breed of carbon 160mm bikes is something you may wanna try. Light plush and super climby with the given that the DH is bottomless. I bet you would love a steeper seat angle bike-I've been thrilled with the feel of the new enduro and the rocky's steep seat angle, as admittedly your strenght is DH, not the climbs. Perhaps you could use a less progressive mid stroke linkage than the DW to open your mind up to some more rugged and less dumbed down riding experiences. My offer is sincere. Come by the house. While I dont foresee us enjoying Damifino together, there may be other ways we can benefit one another, and Sedona's jewels of rock surface. I think You or anyone can really have a different ride based on the bike(s) they own. Would love to show you my quiver. We can even go play locally..
    Last edited by Acrophobe; 11-11-2011 at 10:05 AM.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acrophobe View Post
    Sedona - Earl's Loop/Chuckwagon Ride - YouTube

    or Chuck Wagon to Gunslinger to Gunsmoke to Mescal - YouTube

    TD,

    Where does chukwagon technically BEGIN or endon the videos above?
    A time mark would be good, unless I am looking at the wrong thing
    where is the proposed trail work, and why?

    I've never ridden, and dont usually ride out there.

    Chuck wagon looks fun at 1:10 and 2:20 but the rest, well if you live here-it it looks a bit touroniffic; I'd be going out of my way to make that a ride; but I suppose I should ride it someday.

    Its interesting that you bring up size...

    up in west sedona/dry creek end of town the mix of trails is a different feel than what I enjoy riding on my 6.5 and 6" bikes-Gunslinger to Gunsmoke to Mescal looks 'nice' but also appears more xc ' whoa look at the scenery' riding-nothing wrong with that, but not my cup of tea. Or coffee. I suppose if all I had was my smaller 5.x" bike with an air fork, I'd be feeling like the Doc too and wanting every trail dumb.

    TD, you cant be more than 200lbs, 6 feet? What fork do u have on the front end of your mach5.7?
    Seriously, why dont you strap on my Van36rc2 to your 5.7 and take it for a ride for a few days? I have it lowered to a shorter a2c, so it wont throw off your geometry, I have it at 153mm. I am certain you wont break it. You may even like it.

    I think youre under biked for your skill level; and the new breed of carbon 160mm bikes is something you may wanna try. Light plush and super climby with the given that the DH is bottomless. I bet you would love a steeper seat angle bike-I've been thrilled with the feel of the new enduro and the rocky's steep seat angle, as admittedly your strenght is DH, not the climbs. Perhaps you could use a less progressive mid stroke linkage than the DW to open your mind up to some more rugged and less dumbed down riding experiences. My offer is sincere. Come by the house. While I dont for see us enjoying damifino together, there may be other ways we can benefit one another, and Sedona's jewels of rock surface. I think You or anyone can really have a different ride based on the bike(s) they own.
    Awesome, the olive branch comes with bicycle lessons

    Acro, what gives? Damifino, HE and the Hogs are too tech but the Dry Creek area is too XC. What exactly do you ride in VOC?

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    Rock,

    I never said Highline or the hogs were too tech-rather I enjoy those. My weekly staples include all the VOC stuff. Pretty much everything south of munds, and east of oak creek. I like FLG in the summer. Still need to get down to PHX more to find out whats there.

    What I saidwas that Damifino, hangover these can offer more exposure than I am comfy with. Yes some of it is a combo of skill and exposure, and I am shameless when it comes to walking sections that have exposure. its no fun when I am freaking out white knuckled looking where I shouldnt be looking. its not the technical challenge of the surface, more so the penalty of dabbing exceeds 1.5 tumbles or 10 feet, whichever is greater. I love to ride it all tho. Where I like sanitized is on the DH, thats my newest bike, and my experiences are limited to 'safe' DH riding at parks like Diablo and Mt Snow. There are plenty of trees to slow your roll, signage and bail outs.

    Damifino's off camber spots, tho few, make it not worth it to me, the rest of the trail is fine one you get down- but the approach-no thank you. My GF on the other hand, rides the steeps and off cambers and doesnt have the fear of heights I have. She's less techy on the chunky, but more brave than me when it comes to exposure regardless of what bike I am on.
    I'm simply suggesting different equipment in the stable can change your ride.

    Plus, the Doc and I shook hands and made up at fat tire fest, there really is no branch to hand. I just resurfaced on the forums, after pledging to the mods I would self moderate my self. I would like that as a local, and a volunteer, I can have some fun on mtbr too. Plus its a great tool for traveling, new trails, new destinations etc. ok, enough with the popcorn.

    here are two pics from my pond
    cheers-
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Riding the NEW Little Horse Trail Improvement-koi.jpg  

    Riding the NEW Little Horse Trail Improvement-flower-lily.jpg  

    Last edited by Acrophobe; 11-11-2011 at 10:00 AM.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acrophobe View Post
    Rock,

    I never said Highline or the hogs were too tech-rather I enjoy those. My weekly staples include all the VOC stuff. Pretty much everything south of munds, and east of oak creek. I like FLG in the summer. Still need to get down to PHX more to find out whats there.

    What I saidwas that Damifino, hangover these can offer more exposure than I am comfy with. Yes some of it is a combo of skill and exposure, and I am shameless when it comes to walking sections that have exposure. its no fun when I am freaking out white knuckled looking where I shouldnt be looking. its not the technical challenge of the surface, more so the penalty of dabbing exceeds 1.5 tumbles or 10 feet, whichever is greater. I love to ride it all tho. Where I like sanitized is on the DH, thats my newest bike, and my experiences are limited to 'safe' DH riding at parks like Diablo and Mt Snow. There are plenty of trees to slow your roll, signage and bail outs.

    Damifino's off camber spots, tho few, make it not worth it to me, the rest of the trail is fine one you get down- but the approach-no thank you. My GF on the other hand, rides the steeps and off cambers and doesnt have the fear of heights I have. She's less techy on the chunky, but more brave than me when it comes to exposure regardless of what bike I am on.
    I'm simply suggesting different equipment in the stable can change your ride.

    Plus, the Doc and I shook hands and made up at fat tire fest, there really is no branch to hand. I just resurfaced on the forums, after pledging to the mods I would self moderate my self. I would like that as a local, and a volunteer, I can have some fun on mtbr too. Plus its a great tool for traveling, new trails, new destinations etc. ok, enough with the popcorn.

    here are two pics from my pond
    cheers-
    K, but don't judge trails based on a vid. I think you might be surprised by the challenge CW, Gunslinger, and Mescal have to offer. You're assessment is mostly correct, those trails are more xc oriented, but IMO that makes for a nice change of pace. However, there's still some chunk and and techy moves on all three that require some skillz. If you really want some chunk to challenge your 6" rig then hit Ledge-n-airy. That's about the chunkiest 4 miles of fun Sedona has to offer without the exposure.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockman View Post
    If you really want some chunk to challenge your 6" rig then hit Ledge-n-airy. That's about the chunkiest 4 miles of fun Sedona has to offer without the exposure.
    I've hit it...like it.
    .. MORE of that chunky sauce please!!!
    not a mileage kinda guy, and love trails that make me dab, think , and redo sections...

    thanks for the push- I need it- I will go check out the CW-Mescal bits eventually, for sure- you're right the vids make everything seem flat!

  42. #42
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    Acrophobe:

    I have a 150 mm Magura DUAL ARCH front fork on the 5.7. That is pretty close to the 153 mm you were going to lone me. The fork is very stiff for its weight and so far the travel seems bottomless.

    It loves the backside of Highline especially the sharp somewhat steep chunky technical 90 degree right hander before the very narrow somewhat steep off camber slickrock thingy.

    You say you like downhill. I think Tomahawk could be classified as a somewhat downhill trail with some technical mixed in. You might give that a go and let me now which bike you think would be the best choice for the ride the second time around. Some guys from Vancouver rode down it 11/11/11 with some pinner bikes with 2.1 tires and I wouldn't recommend starting with that type of bike the first time down.

    Some sections are pretty steep so I wouldn't suggest just ripping down it without checking some of the steeper sections before you commit. If you ride Skidmark sight unseen then maybe your skill set and confidence level are high enough to just let er rip.

    I would have liked the Firebird with 10 mm more travel but the climb up Schnebly Hill Rd. sucks, so I take a lighter bike uphill and just try and ride very conservatively downhill.

    Like Rockman says Chuck Wagon/Gunslinger/Mescal has some challenging spots that even someone with your skill level would probably enjoy. The FS is out there doing numerous improvements to one increase long term sustainablity and two to do re-routes, that are being done to avoid pottery dust and shards.

    On the official X-Mountain Bike Heaven NOD ride today we did Christmas Wash as one of the sections. You need to throw that section into the CW loop to get an idea what kind of technical flavor you can spice the ride up with.

    TD

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    Check out Sickboy Acrophobe, it's short but has at least 2 real dh like sections. There is another slick rock dh line above chicken point down the steep rock rolls, it is a hab to get to it but if you want some dh I think it should work.

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    td, my point in my post was that a van36rc2 is a COIL- I own a number of fine air sprungs, but steel is steel..worth its weight imho

    Thanks - I've got some cool new stuff to go check out!

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    Quote Originally Posted by raisingarizona View Post
    Check out Sickboy Acrophobe, it's short but has at least 2 real dh like sections. There is another slick rock dh line above chicken point down the steep rock rolls, it is a hab to get to it but if you want some dh I think it should work.
    I agree with ra there are a lot of downhill trails (such as Sickboy and Skid Mark) that the now lame system trails can help get those highly skilled riders to those challenging sections for a more enjoyable user experience. It just seems like those riders just need to give ra a jingle and wahla excitement to the max. What a country

    TD

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    I got word today that a rider may have had issues with the new rollin to the right of the dumbed down spot on Little Horse. I hope he or she was not badly injured. When I look at a spot like that and anticipate what could go wrong it makes me think another trail improvement is warranted, but what do I know.

    TD

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    Quote Originally Posted by traildoc View Post
    I got word today that a rider may have had issues with the new rollin to the right of the dumbed down spot on Little Horse. I hope he or she was not badly injured. When I look at a spot like that and anticipate what could go wrong it makes me think another trail improvement is warranted, but what do I know.

    TD
    Damn, word spreads fast in this town. He wasn't anticipating that the line that was pictured earlier in this thread (the one with the lady riding down) be blocked by rocks. He had to take a little different line than he's used to and bit it. It's one of the many ways that changing a trail can be dangerous to those who know the trail but not the improvement.

    You don't need to worry or fix anything. People crash and sometimes in the easiest of places. There's a guy I know who broke his neck on the easiest trail in Flagstaff. Does the trail need repair? No. Does it need to be rerouted? No. Does the rider pay more attention, even on easy stuff? Yes.

    The rider wasn't badly injured. A dab of superglue and he's fine. Hell, he's probably out there again right now.
    The secret to mountain biking is pretty simple. The slower you go the more likely it is youll crash.
    - Julie Furtado

  48. #48
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    [QUOTE=woahey;8636259 He wasn't anticipating that the line that was pictured earlier in this thread (the one with the lady riding down) be blocked by rocks. He had to take a little different line than he's used to and bit it. It's one of the many ways that changing a trail can be dangerous to those who know the trail but not the improvement. [QUOTE]

    Good to here he is all right, I will stop worrying.

  49. #49
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    It's been 4 years since this improvement caused so much controversy. There hasn't been much Sedrama lately. More background reading here:
    http://forums.mtbr.com/arizona/anoth...re-748959.html
    http://forums.mtbr.com/arizona/trail...on-693816.html

    TD is on a court-imposed 1 year sabbatical from the Coc. Nat. Forest. The FS is steam-rolling ahead with trial adoptions and re-routes. For the most part seemingly under the radar.

    A repeated refrain during threads like this and in other forums is that by continuing to dumb down trails to avoid trail widening, all that is being accomplished is making mtn biking less challenging. Improvement or maintenance? It's a gray area. The Little Horse improvement is still a world-class climb.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Riding the NEW Little Horse Trail Improvement-lhorse1.jpg  

    Riding the NEW Little Horse Trail Improvement-lhorse2.jpg  


  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by rockman View Post

    TD is on a court-imposed 1 year sabbatical from the Coc. Nat. Forest.

    Again?

  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillbo View Post
    Again?
    Yes, he got caught by a ranger pruning a bush to improve line-of-sight on a trail called Anaconda. One year ban from three different national forests. The court doesn't like repeat offenders.

  52. #52
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    Oh well......
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  53. #53
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    Riding the NEW Little Horse Trail Improvement

    Quote Originally Posted by 50cents View Post
    I understand he is on a world cruise during his one year suspension. Right now he is in Thailand with his wife living like fat cat.

    My understanding is that the FS law enforce ment is in the process of a major investigation of the recent trimming done on the trail. All volunteer maintenance has been suspended until the investigation is completed.
    I cannot believe that money and other resources are being used to conduct an investigation into vegetation along the trail!

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