Prescott Ride - Sept 7- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Prescott Ride - Sept 7

    There will be a group of riders gathering for a few hours of riding on September 7th (Sunday) at 8:00am. The meeting place is Thumb Butte Parking area.

    ROUTE: We'll ride up White Rock, head over to Fire Place Springs and hop on the RR bed to Iron Springs. From there, we'll ride the singletrack into Granite Basin for a quick loop of 349/351. From there, we'll backtrack to the RR bed where we'll drop into the Emmanuel Pines singletrack (local's secret). A quick jaunt over to Long's Canyon will bring us back to the Butte. Our last run on this loop only took 2:50 at a casual but steady pace. Beautiful ride.

    Anyone and everyone is welcome to join in. For those not familiar with the area, this might be a good chance to learn some of the lesser known trails. There are op-outs if people want a shorter ride but the whole loop is pretty awesome.

    September in Prescott is pretty awesome riding weather. Hope to see you then.


    EDIT: If you think you might join us, let us know. If the group gets too big we might split it up a bit, or offer two departure times. [email protected]

    Thanks
    Last edited by Roverbiker; 08-27-2008 at 11:36 AM.

  2. #2
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    Me and a few guys from work ride 1 morning every weekend in Prescott. I will see how many I can round up for this ride and let you know.
    Jeff

  3. #3
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    This sounds like a good time. I really liked the prescott style of trails. I did 305 and 297. Is the elevation similar to what trails you got planned for this ride?
    Smooth

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    Quote Originally Posted by Going_Loud
    This sounds like a good time. I really liked the prescott style of trails. I did 305 and 297. Is the elevation similar to what trails you got planned for this ride?
    This ride will be a little Prescott sampler. A nice slice of a little of everything Prescott has to offer. There's a modest amount of climbing, but ample twisty downhills. This ride will have everything from buff hard pack to some sections of loose rock. Much of it in the pines, some of it in the juniper scrub.

    If you're thinking of coming up to Prescott to ride, now is the time. Conditions won't be better than this. It's as good as it gets right now. Everything is green, moist, fast and decorated with pretty little flowers. Pretty awesome.

    grancurve (2).jpg

    stugreen (3).jpg

    Both of these sections will be part of the ride.

  5. #5
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    Rover - Sounds like fun! I scheduled a job for that day, gunna try and re-schedule!

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roverbiker
    There will be a group of riders gathering for a few hours of riding on September 7th (Sunday) at 8:00am. The meeting place is Thumb Butte Parking area.

    Thanks
    Directions to the parking lot. Coming from Phx. I have only been there once and I didn't drive. Drive time, about two hours???
    I need to ride more and work less.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by liteandfast
    Directions to the parking lot. Coming from Phx. I have only been there once and I didn't drive. Drive time, about two hours???
    You're going to love these directions. Arrive Prescott. Stop at Thumb Butte.

    Seriously, when you arrive in Prescott, you'll enter town on Gurley Street. Follow Gurley street passed the courthouse and drive up the hill to Thumb Butte. No turns to make. The parking area is on your right. That's the beauty of the Butte - you can't miss it.

    You'll arrive via HWY 69 which turns into Gurley which turns into Thumb Butte Road. It's like it was meant to be, huh?

    Drive time? From north Phoenix (Anthem) to the Butte should probably take about 1:25ish or less.

  8. #8
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    I should be able to make it. It would be nice to ride with some others since I've been riding solo almost all summer. Hopefully the conditions then will be as good as they are right now...

  9. #9
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    Is anyone interested in Car pooling from Phoenix? Send me a pm. I live by the I17 and Pinnacle Peak which in on the way to prescott. Thanks.
    Smooth

  10. #10
    Dave
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roverbiker
    You're going to love these directions. Arrive Prescott. Stop at Thumb Butte.

    Seriously, when you arrive in Prescott, you'll enter town on Gurley Street. Follow Gurley street passed the courthouse and drive up the hill to Thumb Butte. No turns to make. The parking area is on your right. That's the beauty of the Butte - you can't miss it.

    You'll arrive via HWY 69 which turns into Gurley which turns into Thumb Butte Road. It's like it was meant to be, huh?

    Drive time? From north Phoenix (Anthem) to the Butte should probably take about 1:25ish or less.

    Thanks man. I see what you mean about the road, leads right to Thumb Butte.
    http://www.whereweride.com/RideTool/AddRideDetails.aspx
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  11. #11
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    I'll get back into Preskit just in time to hit this ride.

    I bet we can pretty accurately predict a rendevouz time at Granite Mtn for those who might want to skip the ride over to GM from Thumb Butte and don't mind waiting around for 30 minutes to meet us over there. If we leave from TB at 8/8:15, we can probably count on being at the Cayuse parking lot in GB between 9:15 and 9:45.

    All the riding in Granite Basin is like a BMX track... No Work, All Play.

    Greg

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    The group is growing! If any of you Phoenix people would care to ride in a second group, we could have another group start at 8:30. That'll buy you an extra 30 minutes of Zs.

    Conditions are really awesome right now. This morning we watched three deer bound down the trail. Less than a minute later, a couple coyotes loped across the trail in front of us by only 50ft. Did I mention the purdy flowers?

    Mo info: http://ravensingletrack.com/Soul_Rides.html
    Last edited by Roverbiker; 08-29-2008 at 08:45 AM.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roverbiker
    The group is growing! If any of you Phoenix people would care to ride in a second group, we could have another group start at 8:30. That'll buy you an extra 30 minutes of Zs.

    Conditions are really awesome right now. This morning we watched three deer bound down the trail. Less than a minute later, a couple coyotes loped across the trail in front of us by only 50ft. Did I mention the purdy flowers?

    Mo info: http://ravensingletrack.com/Soul_Rides.html
    I think that 8 should be fine. I was thinking of doing the whiskey next year. Is this route a sampler of some of the trails used for the whiskey?
    Smooth

  14. #14
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    Going_Loud,

    These trails aren't near the Whiskey 25/50 routes... and you should thank your lucky stars they aren't.

    To prepare for the Whiskey, go to altitude somewhere and see if you can manage 3 hours descending trails covered with babyheads and then climbing up a really steep dirt road.

    See ya next Sunday!

    Greg

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    Quote Originally Posted by Going_Loud
    I think that 8 should be fine. I was thinking of doing the whiskey next year. Is this route a sampler of some of the trails used for the whiskey?
    Just as Velokid mentioned, this is really nothing like the Whisky course - that is a good thing. The Whisky course is one of the more un-fun rides in Prescott (I hope they never change the race course, the beauty of it lies in its brutality). I'll ride it once a year and that's plenty.

    This ride will be a sampler of all good things Prescott.

  16. #16
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    Sounds good.
    Smooth

  17. #17
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    Is there camping around the Butte? I was plan on taking the wife and dogs camping around Lynx Lake and ride 305. But this sounds pretty sweet.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by luckybastard
    Is there camping around the Butte? I was plan on taking the wife and dogs camping around Lynx Lake and ride 305. But this sounds pretty sweet.
    There's camping at a variety of locations around town. You can camp at large, anywhere in the forest, but not all areas are real nice, if you know what I mean.

    I think one of the nicer campgrounds is White Spar Campground located about 1 mile south of town on White Spar Highway. That campground has received a lot of work in the last couple years and really is nice, clean, and right now, really pretty. It also has the advantage of being the starting point to several awesome trails, many of which are new within the last few weeks. For referance, it's about a 15 minute ride from White Spar Campground to the Butte. Pretty close.

    From the courthouse square, turn south on Montezuma (Whisky Row) and continue to the stoplight by the Safeway. Pass through the light and drive for about 1.5 miles. The campground is in the tall pines to your left. I ride through there almost every day and think it's one of the nicer parts of the forest, for sure.

    We'd love to have you join us on the ride. Should be a good one.

    shoot us an email if you need directions: [email protected]

  19. #19
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    Here's the mid week ride update: Seems we'll have a really nice mix of Prescott locals and riders from the valley. Very cool.

    We were thinking we might split the group with a ride time at 8 and one at 8:30 so the Phoenix riders could hit the snooze a couple times, but it appears 8 is the magic hour. Not many takers for 8:30.

    Glad to hear so many riders will be able to make it! We can still take more!

  20. #20
    Dave
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    I'm back in again

    Quote Originally Posted by Roverbiker
    Here's the mid week ride update: Seems we'll have a really nice mix of Prescott locals and riders from the valley. Very cool.

    We were thinking we might split the group with a ride time at 8 and one at 8:30 so the Phoenix riders could hit the snooze a couple times, but it appears 8 is the magic hour. Not many takers for 8:30.

    Glad to hear so many riders will be able to make it! We can still take more!

    I will be able to make it this weekend. Actually I might head up Saturday and camp. At the grounds you mentioned. Do you know how much they charge, I'll look it up. But if I can't find it let me know. See you guys there on Sunday. If anyone wants to ride Saturday swing by the campground and look for a white 93 Jeep YJ7 with a orange bike on the back (locked up) and a small green tent.
    Do they have showers and stuff
    I need to ride more and work less.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by liteandfast
    If anyone wants to ride Saturday swing by the campground and look for a white 93 Jeep YJ7 with a orange bike on the back (locked up) and a small green tent.
    Do they have showers and stuff
    I'll ride with you on Saturday, if you come up then. We could knock out a really nice loop right behind the campground. Let me know when.

    That campground doesn't have showers. None of them do as far as I know. Maybe hit the local YMCA?

  22. #22
    Dave
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    Saturday ride

    Cool thats great. I'll PM you my cell number and we can hook up. Yeah no showers and they charge $10 a day. Great Hope their not full. I'll either be up Friday night or early Sat. 8-9 am sometime.
    Dave
    I need to ride more and work less.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by liteandfast
    Cool thats great. I'll PM you my cell number and we can hook up. Yeah no showers and they charge $10 a day. Great Hope their not full. I'll either be up Friday night or early Sat. 8-9 am sometime.
    Dave
    We usally do the dispersed camping, but we'll probably check out White Spar also. If you see a Tan Trooper with a couple rigid 29er and 2 Boxers thats us.

    Later

    Ryan
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  24. #24
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    This is the last bump.

    Weather looks perfect. Conditions are perfect. Sounds like we have a great group of riders assembled.

    See you fellers tomorrow!

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roverbiker
    Conditions are perfect.
    Awwww, yeah. Conditions are perfect.


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    group.jpg
    Thanks guys for a great ride. We started with a couple dozen guys and wrapped it up with only a few less than that starting number. That was a pretty quick 20+ miles.

    It was nice to meet you fellers. Velokid and I thank you for heading up our way to sample our trails. Thanks to Bfoot for keeping everyone on track.

    And for Dave, hope you heal quickly and get back on the dirt.

    Good riding, Going29az! Nicely done.

    If you guys ever want to ride up here and don't mind having us tag along, let us know.

    Christophe

    www.ravensingletrack.com

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roverbiker
    group.jpg
    Thanks guys for a great ride. We started with a couple dozen guys and wrapped it up with only a few less than that starting number. That was a pretty quick 20+ miles.

    It was nice to meet you fellers. Velokid and I thank you for heading up our way to sample our trails. Thanks to Bfoot for keeping everyone on track.

    And for Dave, hope you heal quickly and get back on the dirt.

    Good riding, Going29az! Nicely done.

    If you guys ever want to ride up here and don't mind having us tag along, let us know.

    Christophe

    www.ravensingletrack.com

    Thanks to Christophe and Greg for hosting this little get-together! It was nice to meet all the peeps from down south and big shout out to all the locals that came out

    Thanks to Ed for showing us his "training loop" trail that was a sweet section!

    And a HUGE thanks to Christophe for helping with the mechanical...check is in the mail (or a six pack next time I see ya)!

    I look forward to the next Soul Ride!

  28. #28
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    Rode Willow Dells Slickrock yesterday after the rain - SWEET conditions, bike stuck like velcro everywhere! Sorry I missed this ride - looks as though it was nice. Gotta love the cooling off going on up here..............

  29. #29
    Dave
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    Well I'm just going to let it out ride leaders

    I was pissed yesterday. I have been on big rides before in excess of 20 even and one thing that always happens is people fall off the back for one reason or another. Yesterday pedaling up the railroad bed I was feeling a little drained. It wasn't really hot yet but the shade felt great. Now I wasn't back more than a few minutes but when I got to the tar road there wasn't a fricking bike anywhere to be seen. You guys need to wait I mean what is the purpose of a head count if 5 miles later you don't care. What was the big rush. If this was a "Keep up if you can ride" then it should have been know ahead of time.
    I have only been there twice before and lucky I ended up on some fimilar trails over by Granite Basin. I ended up doing twentyfive miles. I found my way back and crashed pretty hard in the last mile. If I had been hurt worst who would have know. You guys were long gone. Chris I never told you that I was turning around and going back but yet I heard from some of the guys that were still in the parking lot that's what you said. Man I have never been so pissed on a ride before.

    ER visit- Nothing broken just two seperated ribs and a minor abrasions. To those who care. (Befoot) thanks for taking the time with me at the end an helping break down my campsite. And Jason, Ray an Bill thanks for helping me get back to Phoenix. You guys rock, I'll ride with you anytime.
    But not for a month most likely.

    Dave
    Last edited by liteandfast; 09-08-2008 at 08:56 AM.
    I need to ride more and work less.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by liteandfast
    I was pissed yesterday. I have been on big rides before in excess of 20 even and one thing that always happens is people fall off the back for one reason or another. Yesterday pedaling up the railroad bed I was feeling a little drained. It wasn't really hot yet but the shade felt great. Now I wasn't back more than a few minutes but when I got to the tar road there wasn't a fricking bike anywhere to be seen. You guys need to wait I mean what is the purpose of a head count if 5 miles later you don't care. What was the big rush. If this was a "Keep up if you can ride" then it should have been know ahead of time.
    I have only been there twice before and lucky I ended up on some fimilar trails over by Granite Basin. I ended up doing twentyfive miles. I found my way back and crashed pretty hard in the last mile. If I had been hurt worst who would have know. You guys were long gone. Chris I never told you that I was turning around and going back but yet I head from some of the guys that were still in the parking lot that's what you said. Man I have never been so pissed on a ride before.

    ER visit- Nothing broken just two seperated ribs and a minor abrasions. To those who care. (Befoot) thanks for taking the time with me at the end an helping break down my campsite. And Jason, Ray an Bill thanks for helping me get back to Phoenix. You guys rock, I'll ride with you anytime.
    But not for a month most likely.

    Dave
    Hey Dave,
    Sorry to hear about your crash man. I had a mechanical before we hit the RR bed. I did tell Christophe & Greg to go on and I would try to catch-up...hopefully there was no confusion there. I think I saw you at the 332 trail and Granite Basin Rd intersection, where you on a Dos Niner? You had just gone thru the gate above the road and was heading up 332.

    I continued into Granite on the road and finally caught the group at the Metate/351 intersection. We stopped at Cayuse for a pretty long rest, but not long enough for you to get back down 332/347 to Cayuse. Sorry I didn't catch you sooner that might have avoided some additional angst and riding!

    Come back up when you heal and lets try it again!

  31. #31
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    Dave - that's why so many up here ride solo, me included. The group rides are usually led by XC racers and if they wait up it is just till you get there, then they are off while you are still waiting for your HR to get back to normal. Some are considerate and some are not. They had their rest so who cares?!? I only ride with buds who wait up at every intersection if new riders are along and would never leave anyone behind. I ride a 34 lb FR rig and don't ride as fast as the XC guys on their 27 lb wonders but usually reel people in on DH sections. People should post what type of ride it is going to be: a training ride for XC racing or a trail ride. Our local Club wants to attract more members and it is safer to not ride alone but we need to realize a group ride should be just that - a group of folks riding together.

  32. #32
    Dave
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    Quote Originally Posted by going29AZ
    Hey Dave,
    Sorry to hear about your crash man. I had a mechanical before we hit the RR bed. I did tell Christophe & Greg to go on and I would try to catch-up...hopefully there was no confusion there. I think I saw you at the 332 trail and Granite Basin Rd intersection, where you on a Dos Niner? You had just gone thru the gate above the road and was heading up 332. Come back up when you heal and lets try it again!
    Trail 332 is that the one that goes to the right side of that hill when you get to the tar road? If so yeah that was me I thought I was the last guy out there cause I saw most everyone in front or passing me approaching the top of the RR bed trail. I saw that is was trail 332 so I stayed on 332. Those guys didn't, they went down the road? That was a major change of direction. Don't you think someone should have waited for us? Or did you know they were going down the road. I rode up that road after my trip down 332 (nice trail that down hill part with all the water-bars was a blast) and over to the three way intersection and another gate on the backside of the hill near the GB parking area. Then I headed up the tail from GB that runs along the right side of a creek that I must have crossed 3 or 4 times. This trail I have been on once before during this years AZSF. When I got to the little lake back up near the top I couldn't tell any more which way all the tire tracks went. SO I hit the road and hoped it would bring me back to the RR bed trail. Which it did then I found my way back from there. Over the same trails we used heading out at the beginning of the ride.


    Yes I do have orange Dos Niner. Did you hear me whisle or yell, because I was whisling and yelling to see if anyone was nearby. But no response so then I headed across the road and up 332.

    Dave
    I need to ride more and work less.

  33. #33
    Dave
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    TLS36 - Amen to that brother !!!
    I need to ride more and work less.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by tls36
    Dave - that's why so many up here ride solo, me included. The group rides are usually led by XC racers and if they wait up it is just till you get there, then they are off while you are still waiting for your HR to get back to normal. Some are considerate and some are not. They had their rest so who cares?!? I only ride with buds who wait up at every intersection if new riders are along and would never leave anyone behind. I ride a 34 lb FR rig and don't ride as fast as the XC guys on their 27 lb wonders but usually reel people in on DH sections. People should post what type of ride it is going to be: a training ride for XC racing or a trail ride. Our local Club wants to attract more members and it is safer to not ride alone but we need to realize a group ride should be just that - a group of folks riding together.
    hallelujah!!!!! and advanced does not mean racepace.

  35. #35
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    I was wondering what happened to you Dave... terribly sorry to hear about your misfortunes on this ride. I hope it was merely a miscommunication or something... I seriously don't think these guys would purposely leave anyone. In fact, I had quite the opposite experience yesterday... I bonked pretty bad around mile 13, climbing out of the canyon on 332 and was waaay off the back of the pack... I had to walk quite a bit and was totally surprised to see the entire crew waiting at the beginning of the railroad bed. I rebounded and rode ok for a while down through Emanuel Pines, but then totally ran out of gas at mile 17... Christoph was kind enough to wait for the remainder of us to get pointed in the right direction before he motored on to the finish. I ended up hiking the bike for nearly the entire last mile... with several rest stops in between. Thanks to Jeff and Dave for waiting for me a couple of times during that last effort. Turns out I felt so bad because I had a serious sinus infection and spent the rest of the day watching football and battling a 101 fever... ugh.

    Anyways, I hope this was just an isolated incident, and I hope that you'll continue coming up here to ride as we enjoy riding with you.

    Heal fast,

    Jason

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roverbiker
    Thanks guys for a great ride. We started with a couple dozen guys and wrapped it up with only a few less than that starting number. That was a pretty quick 20+ miles.

    It was nice to meet you fellers. Velokid and I thank you for heading up our way to sample our trails.
    Shame on you guys... "wrapped it up with a few less than the starting number" ?? You lost one of your visitors!

    Did you provide maps to all your visitors prior to the ride? Did you make sure that the group agreed that if no one was visibly behind you on the trail that you wait at all intersections? Did you periodically have regroups, do headcounts, and give those who were last adequate time to refresh and recharge? If you decided that there was to be a slow and a fast group, did you make sure the slow group leader knew how many were behind? tsk tsk. The hammer group mentality is fine if everyone in the group knows the trails and knows the deal. But this was advertised as a group ride and was an open invite to those unfamiliar with the area.

    I think the main problem was the abundance of male testosterone, lycra, and rigid hardtails. Call us mother hens, but us chicks always want to know that the flock is ok. Your wives and girlfriends would be ashamed of your behavior - you lost a rider and he ended up having to take a trip to the ER! Thank goodness some friendly riders found him back at camp and helped him get back home.

    Shame on you!!!

  37. #37
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    Yes advanced does not mean racepace. I like to ride the steep and rough, that would mean advanced for most, but I DO NOT move along at racepace. Or a ride with lots of climbs and techy DH would definately classify as advanced even if done at a slower pace. Always good riding together, lets look out for all on a ride and describing a ride beforehand can really be helpfull. This way we will get newbies out to more rides and give them what they need: encouragement and help if needed, we were all there once!

  38. #38
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    2x Amen. Why i dont go on bid group rides with XC guys also. I ride a trail bike and am slower up. I am always aware where guys are in my group. Even on the DH We wait and regroup so if a guy fell, you dont have to ride a mile back up to help him.

  39. #39
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    UUUMMM no comment, it might be the AIR up here.
    SHITBIRD

  40. #40
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    Just another reason I prefer SoMo in Phoenix, my kind of trails there.

  41. #41
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    Dave...Chris did see that you did not made it back seeing your Jeep and no you I told him I would wait for you to get back...I thought I was the last one up 332 after the R/R grade and I thought I counted seven riders I passed on the climb up to the tar road and I thought I waited for everyone so it's looks like it was my fault you got lost Man I suck ! thing is I thought I was a having good day that was...before I saw that look in you eyes (hurt,pain, frustration and anger at being left out there) and now I see I may be responsible for your predicament makes me feel like S**T!

    So Christophe when you thanked me for "keeping everyone on track" sorry I can only take this as an insult. thing is I never sign on as on for a group leader job. Hell I was not sure were the hell the ride was going half the time?

    next time you do this kind of ride do everyone a favor make up a ride map with short cuts back to the cars...after all you are the "Map Guys"

    tls36... could not have said it any better
    Steve..is one bad a** fast fast as hell rider and I love him for it...but as a big group ride leader well ... you suck Steve

    Dave you are always welcome to come up and ride with me, I promise never to drop you again....so sorry


    Billy
    Darwin was an Optimist

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by liteandfast
    Trail 332 is that the one that goes to the right side of that hill when you get to the tar road? If so yeah that was me I thought I was the last guy out there cause I saw most everyone in front or passing me approaching the top of the RR bed trail. I saw that is was trail 332 so I stayed on 332. Those guys didn't, they went down the road? That was a major change of direction. Don't you think someone should have waited for us? Or did you know they were going down the road. I rode up that road after my trip down 332 (nice trail that down hill part with all the water-bars was a blast) and over to the three way intersection and another gate on the backside of the hill near the GB parking area. Then I headed up the tail from GB that runs along the right side of a creek that I must have crossed 3 or 4 times. This trail I have been on once before during this years AZSF. When I got to the little lake back up near the top I couldn't tell any more which way all the tire tracks went. SO I hit the road and hoped it would bring me back to the RR bed trail. Which it did then I found my way back from there. Over the same trails we used heading out at the beginning of the ride.


    Yes I do have orange Dos Niner. Did you hear me whisle or yell, because I was whisling and yelling to see if anyone was nearby. But no response so then I headed across the road and up 332.

    Dave

    No I didn't hear you yell or whistle (wish I did!) From reading the original invite post, I knew the group was going to head down the road to 349. It was a lucky guess on my part that I could down to the Metate trail and intersect them.

    I've only lived up here a year and half so I'm still learning the trails. Like I said, I am truly sorry for you getting left behind and getting hurt. It sucks, but I try to look at the positive, even though Dave got hurt, this is going to bring on some much needed conversation on this very topic. I have been on a bunch of group rides, here in Prescott, Phx and Sedona (Bama and his boy's like a fast pace as well!) and can remember a couple that ended up with these issues, albeit, it happens more IMHO on road rides with all the Lance wannabes out there!

    The last Soul Ride I did with the group, when BritMtnBiker came up, I gotta say, I had no business being out there, I was way out of condition ( 4 month layoff from Rotator Cuff surgery), but Greg and Christophe was awesome in making sure that I was coming along with my turtle pace on a trail I had not been on before.

    We got a much deserved scolding from DirtGurl and some good insight from TLS36, so let this be a lesson for future group rides. I think maps are a great idea, we all paid the $2.00 parking fee, so maps are free!

    Thanks again to Billy for showing some Preskitt class. Dave, heal quickly and come back up for a do over??!!

  43. #43
    Kathleen in AZ
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    Damage Control

    Quote Originally Posted by DurtGurl
    Shame on you guys... "wrapped it up with a few less than the starting number" ?? You lost one of your visitors!

    Did you provide maps to all your visitors prior to the ride? Did you make sure that the group agreed that if no one was visibly behind you on the trail that you wait at all intersections? Did you periodically have regroups, do headcounts, and give those who were last adequate time to refresh and recharge? If you decided that there was to be a slow and a fast group, did you make sure the slow group leader knew how many were behind? tsk tsk. The hammer group mentality is fine if everyone in the group knows the trails and knows the deal. But this was advertised as a group ride and was an open invite to those unfamiliar with the area.

    I think the main problem was the abundance of male testosterone, lycra, and rigid hardtails. Call us mother hens, but us chicks always want to know that the flock is ok. Your wives and girlfriends would be ashamed of your behavior - you lost a rider and he ended up having to take a trip to the ER! Thank goodness some friendly riders found him back at camp and helped him get back home.

    Shame on you!!!
    Shame on me for such a passionate heat-of-the-moment blast. I'm sure there are multiple sides to this story, and below I see that BeFoot now feels the blame for losing contact with Dave. Miscommunication happens... Thankfully everyone came out ok (well mostly ok, Dave I hope you feel better) and this will just be a reminder to us all for future group rides. No hard feelings I hope

  44. #44
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    No need for an apology Kathleen you were right on the mark!!!
    Last edited by befoot; 09-08-2008 at 09:04 PM.
    Darwin was an Optimist

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by liteandfast

    ER visit- Nothing broken just two seperated ribs and a minor abrasions.

    Dave
    Awe man, I hope you can get on the bike soon and it's not too painfull or bad.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by DurtGurl

    I think the main problem was the abundance of male testosterone, lycra, and rigid hardtails.

    I think you just about summed up the entire world right there. We had only a few girls at the candy mtn sausage fest-2008, but at least there were a few.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  47. #47
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    Sorry to hear about your mishap, Dave. Heal up soon! I'll have to give you crap when you come back to work
    Last edited by Rix-ster; 09-08-2008 at 06:21 PM.

  48. #48
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    Hmmmm....... This is a bummer all the way 'round, huh? So much for light and fun.

    We probably need to clear the air on a few things. Befoot is not to blame for anything. End of discussion on that. In fact, Befoot was just along for the ride, but stepped up to help keep a watchful eye over things. He's a typical Prescott rider....a good guy out to help everyone have fun. HUGE thanks to Befoot. He added a lot of quality to our little outing.

    Dave really should be pissed. That's no way to spend a weekend. He's welcome to be pissed at me if he needs a target. I tried to be a good host. I met him for a ride on Saturday to show him around one on one. I thought that went well...maybe not. I know exactly where we lost Dave. It was on 332 about 300 yards from the gate on Granite Basin Road. He was right in front of me. Behind me was Velokid. Behind Velokid was Ed. As it got steep, Dave pulled off to the side. Befoot wasn't really on sweep, because like he said, he didn't sign up to lead this thing, but he was on his fixie so he was coming up last. I thought we had that turn covered (aside from Befoot) so he's not to blame at all. Just a crappy turn of events.

    The riders who opted to back track or ride behind the sweep did speak to me directly. I did offer to stay with each of those guys and asked them if they wanted me to ride back with them. The only miscommunication I recieved was about Dave....and this is where this mess unfolds.

    As for ride instructions prior, I did give a rough rundown as to where we were going. No sense getting super detailed since most of the riders where out of town guests. I also mentioned this is not your typical loop around Granite. The route was VERY complicated. I let everyone know keeping together was going to need to be a group effort. All in all....the group did pretty well, including those leading and sweeping.

    As for maps, this route was pretty complicated and maps wouldn't have made getting from A to B much easier. We managed to lead 20+ guys through the whole complex loop without any fuss. We successfully communicated with the few guys who opted to ride back safely. We lost Dave. Is that a good score? Of course not. Are we villains? That's up to you. Were we a bunch of "testosterone pumped lycra clad XC racers" out to make people suffer. Absolutely not. That's just being judgmental for the sake of being judgemental.

    Did the front go faster than the back? You betcha. We gave them the green light to go quickly knowing full well, they'd be stopped frequently to wait for the tail end, which they did. No one was forced into a quick pace and we tried to give everyone a rest at the stops. No matter how you slice it, this was a tough ride, but I think every single rider did awesome.

    Personally, I don't think we deserve to be critiqued by riders who weren't on the ride, and I'll leave that at that.

    I hope those who had a good time continue to chime in on this discussion. This thread seems to make the day sound like a total loss and I think only Dave has the right to lobby that point.

    Christophe

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by Notch Johnson
    I was wondering what happened to you Dave... terribly sorry to hear about your misfortunes on this ride. I hope it was merely a miscommunication or something... I seriously don't think these guys would purposely leave anyone.

    Anyways, I hope this was just an isolated incident, and I hope that you'll continue coming up here to ride as we enjoy riding with you.

    Heal fast,

    Jason
    Wondering... at what point did you just say aw the heck with it, it's only Dave. You actually thought of me and then disreguarded that thought! You were feeling sick I remember you saying when I said hi to you at your truck. You didn't hold up the pack for just another minute or so.

    I don't think there was much communication to boot. Map guys...what mapguys. Did anyone get a map for that route?

    UUMMM yes the air was a bit thin but the time table must have been even shorter.

    Chris - just finished reading yours- I had a great ride Saturday with you. SO much so I did the loop twice. I was just so surprised to see no one at the tar road, I mean really. It was only 5 miles into it. Nuff said. This stuff happens and I want EVERYONE to know that it won't stop me. I'll be out there again riding with all of you. Just you wait.

    Besides riding alone for most of it I did have a good time up until the air rushed out of my body from impact. Those trails are nice.
    I need to ride more and work less.

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by liteandfast
    Wondering... at what point did you just say aw the heck with it, it's only Dave. You actually thought of me and then disreguarded that thought! You were feeling sick I remember you saying when I said hi to you at your truck. You didn't hold up the pack for just another minute or so.

    I don't think there was much communication to boot. Map guys...what mapguys. Did anyone get a map for that route?

    UUMMM yes the air was a bit thin but the time table must have been even shorter.
    .
    Please don't direct this at Jason. It wasn't his fault. Point that finger at me, Dave. Jason was along for the ride and we were glad to have him, but I don't want my mistake and your anger from detering him from joining us in the future.

    Once again.....there is no map creation that would have been much help here.

  51. #51
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    Damn. I thought it may have been nice to do this ride if I wasn't going to Candy Mtn this weekend, but I have to say, this is exactly why me and a few others don't go on these "prescott rides". Maybe this is just my perception, but it just doesn't seem like these rides are set up to be "fun". The challenge factor seems to be in just going as fast as possible (and again my perceptions here from some rides I've done and others I've heard about) on relatively tame terrain, without really racking up a lot of vertical or spanning much distance (not milege, but actual distance between points).
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  52. #52
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    Buzzkill

    The reason Dave lost the group was due to our error and had absolutely nothing to do with "XC guys" going "race pace" or any of that nonsense. We left the stop at the top of the climb on 332 too early and it led to Dave getting lost and having a really bad day. Simple as that. And yeah, it sucks to hear that we lost him and I feel like a schmuck for it.

    I was following Dave up the climb until just below the road and he was pulling a fine pace. It never would have occurred to me that he was in any kind of trouble. From now on, headcounts at each stop.

    To be honest, I had no idea that nearly 30 people would show up for this ride. It was indeed a little overwhelming, for me anyway. We just weren't expecting it since we had maybe 6 people RSVP. I've learned a lesson from it and am just sorry it was at Dave's expense.

    But to make it sound like it was some huge hammer fest is completely off the mark. Nobody was trying to lose Dave because they love speed more than they love Dave. Notice how everyone who has said that wasn't on the ride? I think a few of you are using this as an excuse to take potshots at people you like to pigeonhole as "cross-country riders."

    Jayem- I look forward to you taking me on one of your rides. And I'm not being sarcastic. You won't join us, but I really look forward to joining you one of these days. We can do whatever kind of ride you want to; I like them all.

    Thanks to everyone who came out.

    Greg
    Last edited by Velokid1; 09-08-2008 at 04:01 PM.

  53. #53
    Kathleen in AZ
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    I vote that we call it a Big Oops and move on. $hit happens and it really stinks that Dave was left behind and then had the crash... It was indeed a very bad day for Dave but you know what? All of us have had suckfest days in our mtn bike careers. They are good for building character Also, there have been times that I've wanted to toss a few mtn bike friends off the cliff, but I think it is key to forgive and forget, and then learn and move on.

    This weekend I was actually quite gleeful when reading about all the great group MTBR events going on in AZ with the Prescott ride and what seems like a huge success at Candy Mountain. For once I was living vicariously thru everyone else's post as I've been off the bike for a spell. Reading the posts gave me the warm fuzzies and then Dave's post was my big buzzkill. I overreacted and didnt' mean to start the avalanche of nastiness.

    So, I want to offer thanks to you guys for hosting the ride and also for following up with the details of the huge effort to keep 30 people rolling. And I want to apologize for the lycra stereotyping - I really do hate it when others do that and then I went and did it myself (it's just so easy to blame everything on lycra). And finally, I still hold true to my belief that a couple of gals on the ride might have made it that much more enjoyable for everyone .

    Perhaps we need a Fall MTBR lovefest at the new Willow Dells trail??

  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by DurtGurl
    (it's just so easy to blame everything on lycra).
    LOL That and Al Gore.


    Quote Originally Posted by DurtGurl
    Perhaps we need a Fall MTBR lovefest at the new Willow Dells trail??
    Count me in.

  55. #55
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    Now that is precisely...

    Quote Originally Posted by DurtGurl
    I vote that we call it a Big Oops and move on. $hit happens and it really stinks that Dave was left behind and then had the crash... It was indeed a very bad day for Dave but you know what? All of us have had suckfest days in our mtn bike careers. They are good for building character Also, there have been times that I've wanted to toss a few mtn bike friends off the cliff, but I think it is key to forgive and forget, and then learn and move on.

    This weekend I was actually quite gleeful when reading about all the great group MTBR events going on in AZ with the Prescott ride and what seems like a huge success at Candy Mountain. For once I was living vicariously thru everyone else's post as I've been off the bike for a spell. Reading the posts gave me the warm fuzzies and then Dave's post was my big buzzkill. I overreacted and didnt' mean to start the avalanche of nastiness.

    So, I want to offer thanks to you guys for hosting the ride and also for following up with the details of the huge effort to keep 30 people rolling. And I want to apologize for the lycra stereotyping - I really do hate it when others do that and then I went and did it myself (it's just so easy to blame everything on lycra). And finally, I still hold true to my belief that a couple of gals on the ride might have made it that much more enjoyable for everyone .

    Perhaps we need a Fall MTBR lovefest at the new Willow Dells trail??

    Why Dirtgurl is appointed Ambassador MTBR-AZ! Like I said, you Rock!

  56. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by liteandfast
    Wondering... at what point did you just say aw the heck with it, it's only Dave. You actually thought of me and then disreguarded that thought! You were feeling sick I remember you saying when I said hi to you at your truck. You didn't hold up the pack for just another minute or so.
    Uh, Dave... I don't know if you knew this or not, but I wasn't one of the ride organizers, leaders or sweep riders (although I did spend a lot of time riding DFL), I was merely along for the ride (this was only my 3rd ever group ride). I had never been on most of the trails we took, therefore I was concentrating on trying to keep up and not get lost, all the while, battling my own set of ills. I only recall seeing you in the very beginning of this ride, when leaving the Thumb Butte TH and up White Rock. On all the group rides I've been on, there have always been riders that bail out and don't continue for a variety of reasons (bonk, mechanical, time, whatever). This is what I thought happened to you. I assumed that if there was a genuine issue, it would have been communicated by the sweep rider, my mistake I guess. Perhaps if I had more experience with these group rides, or if I would have been tasked with getting head counts, riding sweep, etc. then things might have been different. Please know this... I would NEVER purposely disregard you or anyone else out on the trail. Sorry if you see it differently...

    To all those on that weren't there, but are feeling free to pass judgement... this was not a breakneck pace led by a bunch of lycra clad testosterone fueled XC racers, as rumor seems to be have it. I consider my speed to be slow-very slow, and I thought the pace was a good, steady trail cruise and the group stopped to rest and regroup often. I see how the routing could be confusing to an out-of-towner, but the terrain wasn't extreme or anything like that.

    It's very unfortunate what happened to Dave, and for those of us who were actually there, we all feel very bad about the events that unfolded and would never want anything like that to happen again.

    That being said, aside from what happened to Dave of course, this was actually the best group ride I've been on and I would gladly ride with the Raven Singletrack crew anytime.

    Ride on,
    Jason

  57. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by DurtGurl
    I vote that we call it a Big Oops and move on. $hit happens and it really stinks that Dave was left behind and then had the crash... It was indeed a very bad day for Dave but you know what? All of us have had suckfest days in our mtn bike careers. They are good for building character Also, there have been times that I've wanted to toss a few mtn bike friends off the cliff, but I think it is key to forgive and forget, and then learn and move on.

    This weekend I was actually quite gleeful when reading about all the great group MTBR events going on in AZ with the Prescott ride and what seems like a huge success at Candy Mountain. For once I was living vicariously thru everyone else's post as I've been off the bike for a spell. Reading the posts gave me the warm fuzzies and then Dave's post was my big buzzkill. I overreacted and didnt' mean to start the avalanche of nastiness.

    So, I want to offer thanks to you guys for hosting the ride and also for following up with the details of the huge effort to keep 30 people rolling. And I want to apologize for the lycra stereotyping - I really do hate it when others do that and then I went and did it myself (it's just so easy to blame everything on lycra). And finally, I still hold true to my belief that a couple of gals on the ride might have made it that much more enjoyable for everyone .

    Perhaps we need a Fall MTBR lovefest at the new Willow Dells trail??
    Good comeback, Durtgurl. I wasnt there, but got a little peeved by your original post. I have ridden with Christophe and Greg and they are totally not your typical testorone type XC riders. These guys went out of there way for me and another rider that was on the ride after only meeting them for the first time. I was totally bummed to see what sounded like a fun ride turn into something negative. Sucks that Liteandfast got lost and crashed and hope this does not deter anyone from riding in the future on any Soul Rides. Prescott has some amazing trails and as soon as my cast is off (1.5) weeks I will be up for a couple of days recuperating on the trails with the lycra clad boys!! Durtgurl hope your ok and back on the trails soon.

    Brit.

  58. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by BritMtnBiker
    Sucks that Liteandfast got lost and crashed and hope this does not deter anyone from riding in the future on any Soul Rides.
    Brit.
    To bring some of the fun back to this roller coaster thread, Dave and I did have a nice ride on Saturday morning. We did the 396 trail over to Feldmire. Dave's luck isn't all bad. He drove all the way up from Phoenix and unknowingly pitched his tent about 20 feet from the trail I was going to show him. How's that for luck? Then, as we rode 100 feet up the trail, we ran into Befoot. Perhaps we used all of Dave's luck on Saturday. Sorry, Dave.

    Britmtbiker and Going29az,
    We'll have to do a repeat of that ride we did. That was fun.

  59. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roverbiker
    To bring some of the fun back to this roller coaster thread, Dave and I did have a nice ride on Saturday morning. We did the 396 trail over to Feldmire. Dave's luck isn't all bad. He drove all the way up from Phoenix and unknowingly pitched his tent about 20 feet from the trail I was going to show him. How's that for luck? Then, as we rode 100 feet up the trail, we ran into Befoot. Perhaps we used all of Dave's luck on Saturday. Sorry, Dave.

    Britmtbiker and Going29az,
    We'll have to do a repeat of that ride we did. That was fun.

    I'm in! https://forums.mtbr.com/images/smilies/23.gif

  60. #60
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    What a great ride, for me at least until that damn Emanuel Pines trail. After taking a dive and then trying uphill with loose rocks...no freakin way. Walked most of the hill along with a few others and then coasted into the parking area.

    Maybe next month a further tour of Granite Basin especially 347 or the 396 / Feldmire loop.

    Thanks to the Raven Singletrack guys for getting this ride together. Can't wait till next month.

    Jeff

    PS: there was way to much lycra though ;-)
    Last edited by azbeersnob; 09-08-2008 at 07:33 PM.

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Roverbiker
    He drove all the way up from Phoenix and unknowingly pitched his tent about 20 feet from the trail I was going to show him. How's that for luck?
    Thats a cool camping spot. Is that close to the entrance of the campground where the trail comes down by a litttle turn around area? I parked the afternoon when we rode and took the family up the trail to show them where we were riding!

  62. #62
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    I find this discussion silly.

    Someone else is responsible for your safety and guidance just because it is a group ride?

    I don't do much in the way of group rides. Perhaps that is why I am self sufficient. Before I ride, I like to know where I am going and make sure I have the resources and ability to get there and back. In other words, I don't trust anyone else with my well being. If I were bonking or had a mechanical or something, I would tell the group to go on and go enjoy my own ride perhaps on some other route. No big deal.

    Either way, it was a mega group and bound to get spread out. Even 4-5 riders can be tough to get together.

    Disclaimer: I was not on this ride, but wanted to be. It was advertised as a get together ride right here on the AZ board, so I guess I can see where folks might expect support.

    I think we could all stand to learn a bit from the self supported endurance racing crowd, however. It's wild out there, be prepared.

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Notch Johnson

    It's very unfortunate what happened to Dave, and for those of us who were actually there, we all feel very bad about the events that unfolded and would never want anything like that to happen again.

    That being said, aside from what happened to Dave of course, this was actually the best group ride I've been on and I would gladly ride with the Raven Singletrack crew anytime.

    Ride on,
    Jason
    For a guy coming off a sinus bug, you did great! You also pushed a bigger gear than I could have pushed. As for your slog up Longs Canyon, boy oh boy, I've been there. Thanks for coming, Jason.

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