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  1. #1
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    OK - this is scarey

    And TOTALLY bike-related.

    (much rambling involved)

    I wouldn't even be thinking about moving away from Austin, TX if it wasn't so dang far from
    all other places with great riding. But for the last year, I've been thinking about how nice it
    would be to be located somewhere where Evil Tracey and I could jump in the Element and
    be in another MTB mecca for a weekend with a relatively short drive. For TX residents, short
    drives are anything under 4 hours.

    Phoenix.

    The "armpit of Satan"...or so I've heard.

    It seems like an ideal location for a couple that is so fixated on riding, but still wants to
    work for a few more years.

    So, I've been sending resumes out. What happens when I get a bite? Can I really make
    the leap?

    I'd be giving up so much. You would not believe what I'd be giving up. My home is arguably
    among the best that any passionate MTB'er could ever hope to own. 23.5 acres. On a
    hilltop. Overlooking Lake Travis. Facing west for spectacular sunsets. The house is in the
    middle. It's huge. The closest neighbor is 1000+ feet away and not visible, due to the
    heavy tree cover. I've cut a 4.5 mile loop of black diamond, expert trails on the property.
    No one can ever shut it down, kick me out or complain.

    But here I am. Thinking about leaving. Thinking about AZ and how nice it would be to be
    able to hit Tucson and visit my parents virtually any weekend - any weekend that I was not
    up in Sedona, or Flag or riding the local, PHX trails. And how easy it would be to go to
    Utah or CO or CA or NM.

    It's all about riding and being able to easily visit the parents.

    Phoenix.

    Goodbye, trees.

    Goodbye, remote and sweet privacy? (that's still only 20 miles out of the city)

    Goodbye, personal trail system.

    Would you do it?

    How far out would I have to go to find a few acres where I'd have some sense of privacy?
    No, I wasn't planning on building another trail system, just getting some privacy.

    Anyone here a Realtor?

    Lot's of questions from someone that is noticeably nervous!

    -- Evil Patrick

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    The trail...shall set you free.

  2. #2
    No Clue Crew
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    Not a realtor. Unless you're unusually wealthy, you'd be buying WAY out in order to get some land. Think Laveen, Queen Creek, maybe Gold Canyon or some parts of Apache Junction. Might even be too late in those areas; I haven't followed real estate in the past few years.

    I moved here 10 years ago from the East Coast and can't imagine living anywhere else. I love it here. And it's a great time to buy. Good luck.

  3. #3
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    Again not a realtor, but I do watch the business. If your looking for 20+ acers and under 1Million you will be looking 30 to 40 miles from down town. But depending on where you work, your commute may be 20 to 80 miles. Phoenix is a much larger foot print than Austin. If you buy 20 miles from down town, you will be smack in the middle of suburbia.

    Idea 1 - look for a job in a smaller college town - Boise Id, Tucson Az, Bolder Co, these will all match the feeling of Austin,

    Idea 2 - Live on the wild side, give up the privacy, and move downtown Phoenix. Give up the daily commute, peddle when ever you can, and take public transport when you cannot. When you want to ride, peddle 5 miles to South Mountain, 7 to North Mountain. You will not have your privacy, but you will have a lot more time with the family... and the bikes. If you need a larger lot, 5 to 10 acres, in town there are some near the base of the mountains and off Central as you travel north from down town. These will all be Million-ish in price.

    idea 3: With names like Evil, talk with ASU and see if you can get a home at Sun Devil Stadium.....

  4. #4
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    I moved to Phoenix earlier this year from central Texas, so I can relate to what you are thinking about doing. Let me first tell you that the riding here is awesome. I'm just amazed at how many trail systems there are in the Phoenix metro area. I agree with Blalant that you will be buying WAY out to get some land, and that land will be desert.........not the rolling hills and trees you are accustomed to. It is pretty here, but it's just sand, cactus, and rock. You can find smaller plots close to town which have an acre or two, but to get 20+ acres, you'll be out on the fringes of town. We do lots of road rides through the east Phoenix area through Fountain Hills. Some neighborhoods in that area have larger lots in a "out in the country" type atmosphere. It's not 22 acres, but there is some level of privacy.

    If it's all about riding..............go for it. The riding here is amazing. I don't think you'll be able to find a piece of land similar to what you have close to Phoenix, but if you don't mind being out a ways you can find a small piece of land and get that privacy you want.

  5. #5
    In the rear with the beer
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    I moved from the east coast 3 years ago and have no plans of going back...and frankly can't think of anywhere else i might want to live given our year round riding season and relatively easy access to so many other great riding locations. One can even leave early enough in the day to get to Durango in time for an afternoon ride.

    I guess you will need to weigh the good of being close to family and the great riding against giving up your pretty sweet sounding property. There are larger "horse" property type places in NE phx and scottsdale which are sizeable, but not quite 20 acres..and have more pump track potential than 4 mile single track (actualy I've got a kinda regular size back yard with desert landscape I'm thinking about turning into a pump track). Given the land you are giving up sounds like you may have some $$ from that sale to get a size-able plot here...but it would need to be kinda far out in the desert..

    If it is truly all about riding, then I don't think you can go wrong coming here....I know I didn't.
    Salvation Outdoor
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  6. #6
    Kathleen in AZ
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    IMO, having South Mountain as your backyard is worth the sacrifice of saddling up next to neighbors. Sure, there's a constant suburb "hum" that you will have to get used to, but every house has 6+' concrete walls surrounding the yard that creates privacy of sorts. You've seen my house - I'm guessing you could get closer to SoMo on a larger plot and a bigger home - who knows, maybe even right next to the preserve. Go for the older neighborhoods (20+ years) and you will end up with more of a yard.

    Amazing local trail systems
    < 3 hrs to Flag, Sedona, Prescott, Payson, Tucson
    < 8 hours to Moab, Durango, Santa Fe, CA
    instant pack of really cool cycling friends
    commuting by bike to work
    big city opportunities and conveniences
    close to family....

    You have to decide if these pluses outweigh a beautiful plot of land with loads of privacy and all the other good things you have going on in Austin.

    Try something new! I have a feeling that you will not regret it. Maybe in the grand Evil scheme you should also plan on buying a cabin on a plot of land up near Flag to satisfy the privacy thing.... of course, we'll all be following you up there and hitting you up for accommodations, so I suggest building a bunkhouse for your MTBR pals

  7. #7
    pedaller
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    My home is arguably among the best that any passionate MTB'er could ever hope to own. 23.5 acres. On a hilltop. Overlooking Lake Travis. Facing west for spectacular sunsets. The house is in the middle. It's huge. The closest neighbor is 1000+ feet away and not visible, due to the heavy tree cover. I've cut a 4.5 mile loop of black diamond, expert trails on the property. No one can ever shut it down, kick me out or complain.
    Wanna trade?
    "Nobody ever told me not to try" - Curious George Soundtrack by Jack Johnson

  8. #8
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    You could also buy a home in the metro area and then buy some acreage up north. We have 20 acres at 7300' elev. and it's only 2.5 hours from here. Nearest neighbor is much farther than 1000', more like ten miles.

    I definitely need to cut a track around the property up north, as I've seen pics of yours. It is very nice!
    If you're lucky enough to be in the mountains,
    you're lucky enough.

  9. #9
    parenting for gnarness
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    you could consider renting for awhile to see if you like it, and hang onto your home in TX. Prices in the Valley continue to drop such that you really wouldn't be trading much off in equity vs. your rent for the purposes of seeing if you like it.

    You realistically wont find what you have near a place of work, unless you get insanely lucky, and then you are stuck with that job. Trying to map what you have to here is square peg\round hole. You can get property in Williams, outside of Payson, etc but then you have a 2nd property which is very different from having a backyard and the flexibility to get away.
    YES to Scottsdale Prop 420
    Our Preserve, Our Taxes, Our Vote

  10. #10
    Sup?
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    I'd do it....

    Have friends that have 'gone both ways' (so to speak) from Austin to Phx and Phx to Austin.

    One friend is a big time lake/water person. His own dock, on a cove on lake travis, big time water skiier, wakeboarder, barefooter.. came to Phx from Minn, now in Austin for good. Other friends had to move when Motorola spun off their Semiconductor Products Sector into Freescale. They like the trees, more land etc: (not outdoors folks, other than huntin/fishin) They still have their cabin in Pinetop/Lakeside.

    Austin.. you are a long ways from anything big (related to skiing, cycling, climbing etc)
    Phx. you are right in the 'thick' of it so to speak.. Seriously, after having been here since 1990, the only other places I'd consider would be Salt Lake City, Albuturkey, Boise, maybe Vegas area? Colo Springs or SW Colo.

    Depends upon your line of work.. stuff I mentioned above
    (with the exception of SW colo) would work for me (high tech)
    but maybe not for others.

    Would love california, but's it is just too damn expensive
    everywhere in that state.. plus being in a border state
    you can visit/vacation there, then head back to Arizona
    for 'refuge'!

    Summers take getting used to, but then again, Austin is hot and humid at times...

    You will not be able to get that sort of acerage unless you go way out of town. Maybe Globe? Superior? I've often though about Superior.. you could commute back and forth to the East Valley if you *had* to.

    Personally, I hate yard work, and having to maintain a 'big spread' would rather be out playing. I'm not one of those 'homesteader' types I guess. Probably comes from growing up in rural KS and having to do all that stuff as a kid from an early age (chores) no thanks!

    Prices are in a freefall here in the valley. You can score nice places *IN town* with some room.. but not 23 acres for sure.

    I like the access to California by car/plane as well as SW colo, the Wasatch and New Mexico. (also Southern Utah and even Moab.. long drive!) Snow skiing? you can visit it but not have to shovel it! Probably the most lacking thing here though. Two resorts here are pretty lame and subject to the whims of the seasons. But, the best skiing is only a couple hours away (via Southwest Airlines) in SLC!

    It's a good place to be based, an adventure hub if you will as long as you can stand the 3 months of the year that it's brutally hot. (you adapt I think!?)

    I dont miss the bugs, the trees, the poision Ivy/Oak/Sumac, they humidity, the pollen/grass, and being from Kansas.. the wind/tornadoes!

    If you are an avid outdoors person, I cant think of many nicer places
    in the lower 48 to be.

    The desert has a way of growing on you as well... some folks never
    get into it though, but many do.

    CB's suggestion of renting is a good one IMHO. esp with the real
    estate market in such a turmoil.

    In the east valley, call Kim Nelson, Reality Executives, Chandler AZ
    She's done well for my wife and I over the past 18 years that I've been in
    the valley.
    Last edited by honemastert; 09-23-2008 at 10:32 AM.

  11. #11
    Pivotal figure
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    Hey Patrick, there are a few places for sale in my 'hood which is smack up against the Phx Mtn Preserve. No big lots but you can get the desert as a back yard if you're lucky enough to get a place on the outer edge (like mine )
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  12. #12
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    Did you think about moving to Tucson? I think it would be a lot easier to find something with land closer to town then in Phoenix. Heading south towards Nogales you have Green Valley, Tumacacori, Tubac and places like that that are actually pretty green with good tree cover. Oh yeah and Milagrosa won't be to far away either.

  13. #13
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    If you want to live in Phoenix and still have land, trees and privacy, consider buying two homes. Buy a place in Phoenix near the local riding (SoMo, Dreamy Draw, etc.) and buy a little cabin in the high country someplace like Flagstaff or Prescott. For the price of one McMansion you can have two houses in two riding locations with two different types of weather. A cabin will help you escape the single biggest negative of living in Phoenix, the long very hot summers.

    I would strongly suggest against buying a suburban home way out in the sticks to try to get some land around Phoenix (unless you are also into something like horses). It will make the drive to anyplace else in the Phoenix metro area a real epic and the city will just grow out and surround your land anyway. We started out living out in the sticks 20 years ago and each house since has been closer to downtown Phoenix.

    The real blessing of Arizona is being able to hop in the car, drive an hour, have a significant change of weather and be in the middle of a large chunk of public land.

  14. #14
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    fountain hills is the best place to live if you move to the greater phx metro area.

    good luck

    mx

  15. #15
    Elitest thrill junkie
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    It's like 70 degrees here in the daytime now! Do it!
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  16. #16
    Black and Sticky
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    Patrick,

    I moved to Phoenix from Austin 10 years ago and haven't looked back. And among my reasons for moving was one very similar to yours, a desire to live in a place that had access to more outdoor recreation activities. In case you are wondering, the summers in Phoenix are not any worse than summers in central Texas. And those occasional crisp fall and winter days in Austin happen continuously in southern Arizona.

    BWEIDE gave you the best advice, buy something hard against the Phx Mtn Preserve or SOMO and then find another place in Arizona mountains. Not sure your situation, but if you own 20+ acres overlooking Lake Travis, you may be sufficiently wealthy to not have to work. (You're not Michael Dell are you?) So your options may even be more and better than what BWEIDE suggested. Something like summer home in Durango, winter home in Phoenix or Tucson.

    What I was going to say you would miss would be dinner and drinks at sunset at the Oasis, but I guess you have that at home already! Your compound must be right by the Oasis if you are looking west over the main body of Travis. But for sure you won't get the same variety of music in Phoenix. And the quality of BBQ here isn't what you are used to. To get by, you'll have to learn how to make your own. But other than that, you can't beat Arizona for a place to live.

    Good luck!

    Bob
    "Some people follow their dreams, others hunt them down and beat them mercilessly into submission." - Neil Kendall

  17. #17
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    Stay where you are, Evil. Phx sucks.

  18. #18
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    yeah, move here. Evil Tracey will have company on her new mach 5! ( Congrats, BTW)
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  19. #19
    wrecking crew
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    I say you should definitely move! But what do I know? I don't have a huge spread like yours to sway me...

    But then again, you already know a good bunch of riders out here and the riding is year round with CO, UT, NM and CA all next door.
    ~~~

  20. #20
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    This is Mtn biking Mecca! I sold everything, house, practice-left the miserable East and came here with no job, started new practice and LOVE it here. Land is spendy, so unless you have several mil for a pad forget about the 23.5 acre thing. Riding.......the BEST, shh......don't tell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I was set on Colorado but came here for better year round weather and riding. Really depends on priorities. Good luck to you, follow your dreams - I did.

  21. #21
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    This area truly is the armpit of Satan.

    Last week in the morning hours I was waiting for my dawn patrol mountain bike ride, my gear all ready, peanut butter sandwich breakfast waiting when pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, zzzinnng.

    Called the cops who drove around for a while and then asked to get into my back yard so that they could look around and check for bullet holes.

    Another drive by shooting -- no one hurt but not for lack of effort. Didn't even make the news because there was no bloody body to show. But the house if full of nice evenly spaced holes. Obviously the shooters were trying to whack someone sleeping in the upstairs bedroom of the targeted house.

    No chance to leave the house for my dawn patrol ride.

    I live in one of the low-crime areas of the Valley.

    The police say not to worry because the shooting doesn't appear to be random.
    "Thank you, God, for letting me have another day"
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  22. #22
    Pivotal figure
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    Soo, they expect you to feel all warm and fuzzy because it was a planned shooting??
    Desert Sunset Calls/Upward, Pain, Perseverance/Welcome Solitude

  23. #23
    I'm Lazy, So I Shuttle
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    hey

    I would stay where u are man, besides living closer to your parents, nothing else is worth really living here....dont get me wrong the mntbker scene here is cool, and the people are friendly well most people, but the city its self sucks. Very polluted, my fiance and I had to move to Gilbert so she wasnt sick all the time due to air quality. Also its stupid hot in the summer which makes riding imposible in the valley unless its at 4 am. And not to mention u have 20 plus acers which unless ur donald trump will not happed here and if u can there will be no view of a lake thats for sure just bare desert brownness. But if u wanna leave you sweet spot I will trade u my house and I will come shred ur trails and hey I might even let you come visit them.
    The secret to mountain biking is pretty simple. The slower you go the more likely it is you'll crash.- Julie Furtado

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by supermoto
    yeah, move here. Evil Tracey will have company on her new mach 5! ( Congrats, BTW)
    Thanks! Tomorrow's the big day! I can't wait!!!


  25. #25
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    Flagstaff Maybe?

    Dunno what you do, and the job market is (really) small, but might be worth looking into. Not as close to Tuscon, but you can do it in 5 hours easy - my roommate did it all the time last year. I think you could get get some acreage outside of town without too much trouble, and best of all there are trees! And if your looking for a mecca Flag is it - not just mtb but just about any other outdoor sport you can think of. This is coming from a 18 year resident of PHX who came to Flag for college - love it, and I never want to go back.

  26. #26
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    I grew up in Phoenix and my heart is broken....

    Phoenix was my home and it was a small town at one time not so long ago. Believe it or not! I watched it turn into East Los Angeles over two short decades. The best places in the desert have been turned under to make way for millions of clone stucco houses, strip malls and convenience stores. There is no unique character left to the city. It has become Generica!

    There is great MTB'ing all over Arizona and if that is your only consideration then you will be exceptionally happy there. I still go back for vacations to visit friends and ride when the season is done in Colorado.

    However, if you want an overall good quality of life, the greater Phoenix area is lacking. Pollution, traffic, overcrowding, crime and increasing summer heat in my opinion take away from what used to make Phoenix a great place. All the good reasons so many people moved to the Grand Canyon State are gone. All that is left is mild winter weather and with that comes the worst pollution of the year.

    Sorry to be a neg-head, but the hordes have ruined Phoenix – that’s progress baby! You can do better in the other 3 of the 4 corners states and also the Pacific Northwest – Idaho, Oregon or Washington.

  27. #27
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    So Evil, have you made your decision yet? You comming, going, staying?

  28. #28
    Fragile - must be Italian
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    Quote Originally Posted by CMu_dogtag
    However, if you want an overall good quality of life, the greater Phoenix area is lacking. Pollution, traffic, overcrowding, crime and increasing summer heat in my opinion take away from what used to make Phoenix a great place. All the good reasons so many people moved to the Grand Canyon State are gone. All that is left is mild winter weather and with that comes the worst pollution of the year.

    Sorry to be a neg-head, but the hordes have ruined Phoenix – that’s progress baby! You can do better in the other 3 of the 4 corners states and also the Pacific Northwest – Idaho, Oregon or Washington.
    If that's the case (Phoenix sucks now)...then why do so many people *continue* to move here...even in this sh!tty economy? I wish more people thought like you do so the population slows down.

    I'm a Phoenix native (born in Good Samaritan Hospital in 1969), so I've seen this city grow from literally a dinky little desert town to a gigantic metropolis. And you're right that some of the things that made this city great are gone...but others have moved in to make up for the loss. The cities here have done a tremendous amount to help keep riding (both road and MTB) some of the best in the country -- Scottsdale bought up the McDowell Mtn Preserve (guaranteeing permanent open space and trails), Phoenix has purchased additional preserve land to be used for the public, and many cities have done a great job adding bike lanes to both major and intermediate roads.

    And believe it or not, pollution and traffic on city streets (where I ride) have actually gotten better since 1980.

    There is no place in the West (or the USA for that matter) that is perfect for living and biking. The weather in the Pacific Northwest totally sucks. Salt Lake City and Denver are both nice 50% of the year...but the other 50% (Nov-May) is cold and snowy so you have a short bike season. Las Vegas is...well...Las Vegas. Southern California is totally ideal for weather...but MTB access is the pits and road biking is scary as hell. And Phoenix & Tucson have great year-round riding but the summers are hot.

    I have a lot of family who live in Denver. It's a decent city but I can't see myself living there. If I did...I would have to drastically alter my riding patterns. I guess riding would become a summer sport and skiing would be what I do in the winter.

    Thx...Doug

  29. #29
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    If that's the case (Phoenix sucks now)...then why do so many people *continue* to move here...even in this sh!tty economy? I wish more people thought like you do so the population slows down.
    I was a native also - BFD. Most people I used to meet that had moved to Phoenix from somewhere else, which was virtually everyone, came from someplace in which the economy, weather or quality of life was so desperate, Phoenix seemed very desirable. I think that is probably still the case.

    Saying that Phoenix is unequivocally "perfect for living and biking" might be pushing it. Phoenix and AZ do have good aspects but it is certainly not perfect for an overall quality of life. There are better places in the USA. I manage to bike most of the year round and have done so in the many cities I have lived in that are supposedly "cold and snowy" half the year. If the weather is too cold and snowy to ride, I go skiing or head out of state. What does a person do in Phoenix when it is too hot to ride? Oh yeah, people head north, out of state or float in their pools. There are trade offs with the weather no matter where you live.

    All I am saying is that in my opinion a person could do better than Phoenix. But if you dig a big city with crime, pollution and out of control population growth, then live in peace. I don't really care.

  30. #30
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    Looks to me like you’re more likely to get raped, assaulted, and burglarized in Denver according to these statistics. So it looks like Denver is a small city with a lot of crime.

    Latest 2006 Crimes per 100,000 People:


    Denver, CO / Phoenix / AZ National

    Murder: 9 / 15.4 / 7
    Forcible Rape: 60.16 / 36.25 / 32.2
    Robbery: 225.2 / 287.5 / 205.8
    Aggravated Assault: 466.5 / 398.5 / 336.5
    Burglary: 1151 / 1064.3 / 813.2
    Larceny Theft: 2353 / 3282.6 / 2601.7
    Vehicle Theft: 1116.5 / 1587.5 / 501.5



    I love Phoenix! It just sounds like it's not for you, which is why you moved to Denver.

  31. #31
    Fragile - must be Italian
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    Quote Originally Posted by CMu_dogtag
    I was a native also - BFD. Most people I used to meet that had moved to Phoenix from somewhere else, which was virtually everyone, came from someplace in which the economy, weather or quality of life was so desperate, Phoenix seemed very desirable. I think that is probably still the case.

    Saying that Phoenix is unequivocally "perfect for living and biking" might be pushing it. Phoenix and AZ do have good aspects but it is certainly not perfect for an overall quality of life. There are better places in the USA. I manage to bike most of the year round and have done so in the many cities I have lived in that are supposedly "cold and snowy" half the year. If the weather is too cold and snowy to ride, I go skiing or head out of state. What does a person do in Phoenix when it is too hot to ride? Oh yeah, people head north, out of state or float in their pools. There are trade offs with the weather no matter where you live.

    All I am saying is that in my opinion a person could do better than Phoenix. But if you dig a big city with crime, pollution and out of control population growth, then live in peace. I don't really care.
    You say that you don't care...but you can't leave well enough alone. Throwing around false generalities like "big city with crime, pollution, and out-of-control population growth" shows that you now have a bias against Phoenix.

    The true facts on crime, pollution, etc. don't back up your bias. But I'm sure you don't care.

    Phoenix is not nirvana -- I never claimed it was. But from a bike-friendly standpoint, it doesn't get much better (MTB or road). I truly ride here 12 months of the year (I don't just sit around in my swimming pool as you like to believe).

    I have lots of family that live in Denver. I go there all the time -- probably 5 times/yr. It's a nice city with lots of MTB trails nearby that are rideable 6 months of the year. I've ridden them many times (favorite "close in" trail system is Apex Park)...and I've been on them in May when they were still snowed under. So it's not a "year round" MTB city. It can't be. As for road riding? It sucks - very unfriendly place to ride. Denver has a lot to learn from other larger cities when it comes to being a bike friendly city, including Phoenix and Tucson...and sister city Boulder.

    As you said, you were a Phoenix native. You left. So what? Lots of people leave. This place isn't for everybody. But just because you left, there is no need to come on this board and throw your sh!t all over the place. You call your statements your opinions...but you rattle them off as matter-of-fact.

    Thx...Doug

  32. #32
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    Enough Said!

    Sorry for ragging on your hometown. I know what I experienced and why I left. I loved Phoenix and I still find myself homesick. I never said Denver was the best place either. Just better for me right now.

    I am visiting AZ in October because Denver will apparently be covered in snow. You can punch me in the mouth or something for being a dick.

    Apologies to the original poster for taking this so far off topic.

  33. #33
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    Fountain Hills is the best place to live.

    thanks

    mx

  34. #34
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    Can't do anything without an offer from an employer.

    I'm looking in Tucson and Phoenix. Looking on Dice and Craigslist. Every day. I've submitted
    quite a few resumes to what I consider good matches, but have yet to receive a response.
    (OK - I received one great response, but then, evidently, the company decided that they didn't
    want to fill the rec and pulled the job listing - probably related to the economic down-turn)
    PHX has a ton of high-tech postings. Tucson, only a small fraction.

    I'm in high tech. I'm the director of quality assurance where I now work. I'm looking for
    managerial jobs in software development. This narrows the playing field considerably. I
    mean, there's a 100 to 1 ratio of job postings for programmers to managers.

    I hate snow. I must be able to ride year-round. Four to five times a week. I have that
    ability now...and I do it. Austin is perfect for that. But as stated, it's too far from other
    great riding. Snow and the inability to ride as frequently as I need rules out suggestions
    such as Flag and Prescott.

    I'm leaning towards Tucson. No, it's not the central location that PHX is, but it has real
    mountains (8000+ ft tall, with huge pine trees) which would provide relatively easy relief for
    dog-days of summer riding.

    Who, among you in PHX, is getting up and hitting the trails 4 or 5 times a week during
    the hottest days of summer? I'm guessing 5 AM is the best start time. The trails have had
    the most time to cool off. And I'm really a VERY early morning person.

    Anyway, first things first...someone on the AZ side has to make an offer. I'm not pulling up
    stakes until the future is somewhat known.
    -- Evil Patrick

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    The trail...shall set you free.

  35. #35
    My other ride is your mom
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Patrick
    Who, among you in PHX, is getting up and hitting the trails 4 or 5 times a week during
    the hottest days of summer? I'm guessing 5 AM is the best start time. The trails have had
    the most time to cool off. And I'm really a VERY early morning person.
    I have....between 5 and 6 days a week out at Hawes. Granted, they're only 1-2 hr rides; but it's still riding. You just go a little slower, take more breaks, wring the sweat out more, drink like it's goin out of style. I usually left at 7 in the morning before work, or would go just before dinner at 430 or 5 in the afternoon. A few times, I went out in the middle of the day just to do it....it sucked, but once you get used to it, it's not so bad as long as you stay within your limits.

    Like everything, you can get used to it.




  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Patrick

    Who, among you in PHX, is getting up and hitting the trails 4 or 5 times a week during
    the hottest days of summer? I'm guessing 5 AM is the best start time. The trails have had
    the most time to cool off. And I'm really a VERY early morning person.
    i don't understand this. why are so many people babies in the heat. you don't have to avoid it. i go out all the time when it is 115+

    mx

  37. #37
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    it's about heat management and duration.

    1-2 hr with ice-filled camelbak makes 115+ possible, but 4-6 hrs is not, and that amount of heat management IS something to be careful about. Once you start overheating in those conditions is *can* be lethal.

    That said, like EP put it, nobody serious stops riding at any time in Austin area and while we don't get the 115+ much you don't get 100+ F with 95% + humidity which is just as much a PITA.

    I'm going to be sorry to see the Evil's leave Austin, but then again the Bear Clan may not be far behind in their departure either (and target location is much less known, although I may angle to see if I can get Mrs interested in Denver area for her work ... I like snow sports, and can drive to ride in the winter ... )

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by mx_599
    i don't understand this. why are so many people babies in the heat. you don't have to avoid it. i go out all the time when it is 115+

    mx
    Do you want a cookie or something?
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  39. #39
    Elitest thrill junkie
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Patrick
    Snow and the inability to ride as frequently as I need rules out suggestions
    such as Flag and Prescott.
    Heh...uh, no. In prescott snow does not keep you from riding. In flag you can zip down to Sedona (pretty darn close), but I can understand the more constant snow of Flag would be somewhat of a detriment.

    We ride year-round in prescott, snow does not accumulate here.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  40. #40
    Fragile - must be Italian
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    Quote Originally Posted by bear
    it's about heat management and duration.

    1-2 hr with ice-filled camelbak makes 115+ possible, but 4-6 hrs is not, and that amount of heat management IS something to be careful about. Once you start overheating in those conditions is *can* be lethal.

    That said, like EP put it, nobody serious stops riding at any time in Austin area and while we don't get the 115+ much you don't get 100+ F with 95% + humidity which is just as much a PITA.
    I ride in Phoenix all the time in 110+ heat.

    I also ride a lot in St Louis MO in that muggy 90+ 90% crap.

    I'll take the Phoenix 110+ heat any day.

    I'm going to be sorry to see the Evil's leave Austin, but then again the Bear Clan may not be far behind in their departure either (and target location is much less known, although I may angle to see if I can get Mrs interested in Denver area for her work ... I like snow sports, and can drive to ride in the winter ... )
    Check out Salt Lake City if you want *convenient* snow sports. I never considered SLC for anything...until my wife's company bought another small company up there. Now we go up there all the time in the winter. Alta/Snowbird and Solitude/Brighton are a whopping 10 miles out of town, versus the Denver ski areas all at 60+ miles away with sh!t traffic (unless you like Loveland Pass, which is 40 miles away in sh!t traffic and cold as hell). And here's a bonus - the Mormon's can't ski on Sundays, so the lift lines are SHORT on any Sunday (yeah baby).

    I personally don't understand how anybody in Denver deals with those hellish weekend drive times to the ski areas. My friends who live up there usually take days off work to avoid traffic...but not everybody has the ability to do that.


    Thx...Doug

  41. #41
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    Riding times

    5 is good for a shorter ride (1-2 hrs). After about 7 it starts getting hot real fast though. I always went during the evening because I'm no morning person, and that's not too bad either. Start once the sun gets low on the horizon, you can get a good 2 or 3 hours of riding in before its too dark to see. You can go during the heat of the day if you want and get a good ride in - its just not gonna be all too fun.

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem
    Heh...uh, no. In prescott snow does not keep you from riding.



    We ride year-round in prescott, snow does not accumulate here.


    Interesting.

    http://www.city-data.com/city/Prescott-Arizona.html

    Scroll down about halfway on that page.

    They're showing somewhere between half a foot and almost 2 feet of snow fall from Nov through
    April.




    And unfortunately, Dice and craigslist turn up very little in the way of high-tech jobs in the
    Prescott area.
    -- Evil Patrick

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    The trail...shall set you free.

  43. #43
    Elitest thrill junkie
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Patrick
    Interesting.

    http://www.city-data.com/city/Prescott-Arizona.html

    Scroll down about halfway on that page.

    They're showing somewhere between half a foot and almost 2 feet of snow fall from Nov through
    April.



    .
    That's the great thing about prescott, people underestimate it. We may get almsot 2 feet of snow a year, but it doesn't accumulate, if it snows a few inches, it is literally gone in a matter of hours. It sublimates because it is so dry here. Otherwise it gets a little cold when a pacific storm comes across the state, but then the temp goes back to not-nearly-as-cold as other places in the winter.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  44. #44
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    Hey Folks,
    I am in a similar situation as EvilP, Except I live in Dallas. The riding here is unfulfilling at best. I went to ASU and lived in the are for quite a while as well. I know the riding rocks out there and the heat doesn't bother me at all-I was there when it hit 122 degrees! Another winter here has no appeal for me. I am beginning my job search, but does anybody know any recruiters in the PHX area? Any help would be much appreciated.
    thanx,
    Moe

  45. #45
    Ouch, I am hot!
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    [quote=CMu_dogtag]I watched it turn into East Los Angeles over two short decades./quote]

    Comparing Phoenix to Los Angeles is like comparing go-kart to Nascar. The direction Phoenix has been taking in terms of crime, heat, traffic, etc., may be a negative one, but Phoenix is and shall always be the largest little cowpoke town in the world.
    I AM JUST A JERK

  46. #46
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    Cool-blue Rhythm

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirdir
    Comparing Phoenix to Los Angeles is like comparing go-kart to Nascar. The direction Phoenix has been taking in terms of crime, heat, traffic, etc., may be a negative one, but Phoenix is and shall always be the largest little cowpoke town in the world.
    When have you watched Nascar?
    Currently at Mayo Clinic being tested for a kidney transplant. Donors welcome.

  47. #47
    Don't believe the Hype...
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    It's all about getting a job job first...
    95% of the places you would end up working would be within 10 miles of SoMo, PMP, MMP. Take your time on the house and find the perfect PHX house. Their won't be acrage, but if you look around you can find something that will work just fine.
    Made with real bits of Panther, so you know it's good...

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  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Patrick

    And unfortunately, Dice and craigslist turn up very little in the way of high-tech jobs in the
    Prescott area.
    Try looking up "cattle rancher" and see what turns up. I lived in Prescott for a year, and while it's a nice place to visit, no way would I recommend it to anybody looking to move to Arizona.
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  49. #49
    Sup?
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    Phx / Tucson High Tech

    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Patrick
    I'm in high tech. I'm the director of quality assurance where I now work. I'm looking for managerial jobs in software development.
    Here are a list of high tech firms I can think of locally... I work for an
    EDA (IC design software) firm called Synopsys, who has many of
    these folks as customers. Our software folks are in the bay area
    and the Boston Mass area unfortunately... only a sales/support office
    here.

    Google (Tempe)
    General Dynamics (Scottsdale, Gilbert)
    Boeing (Mesa)
    Honeywell (Phoenix)
    Intel (Chandler)
    Qualcomm (Chandler?)
    ITT (not the tech school.. ) Tempe/Phoenix
    Freescale (Tempe/Chandler)
    Raytheon (Tucson)
    Intuit (Tucson)
    GoDaddy (Gilbert)
    Orbital Sciences (Chandler)
    Microchip (Chandler)
    Medtronic (Phoenix/Tempe)
    Lockheed Martin (Goodyear)

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by skinny-tire
    Try looking up "cattle rancher" and see what turns up. I lived in Prescott for a year, and while it's a nice place to visit, no way would I recommend it to anybody looking to move to Arizona.

    Hey what's wrong with Prescott? For pretty much the same reasons as Evil dude was mentioning, I too am packing up and heading to AZ....only I am more of a mountain small town person who loves having a huge city nearby...makes Prescott along with other reasons perfect!

    And for the record I am moving from the PNW....and if you love to ride your bike never ever move there unless you like rain.....lots of rain, even in the desert regions....still short seasons, rain and of coruse good ol Cascade cement snow...wet wet wet wet powder, like riding in a big slurpee.

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