Mountain Lion at T100!- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Mountain Lion at T100!

    My friend thinks he saw one and that it was perhaps "stalking" him. If one ever got there, I see no reason why it couldn't survive. In any case, is such a thing possible. Can there be a Cougar at T100?

    My friend is an outdoorsman and ex-Marine, so he has, in my eyes, much credibility.
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  2. #2
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    Seems pretty unlikely. Maybe you could make a case for one passing through the
    area, but T 100 is in the middle of Phoenix. I dont know of any corridors or reasons
    why one would want to go through that area. I think your friend has a vivid imagination, or was pulling your leg

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by le_buzz
    Seems pretty unlikely. Maybe you could make a case for one passing through the
    area, but T 100 is in the middle of Phoenix. I dont know of any corridors or reasons
    why one would want to go through that area. I think your friend has a vivid imagination, or was pulling your leg
    It seems unlikley, but that is probably just because the preserve is in the middle of the city and it is hard to imagine a lion there. Hypothetically, if a lion was dropped in the Preserve to see if it could survive there, I think it would be no problem. I have seen Javalina out there, coyotes, rabits, etc. I can't imiagine it not surviving. I know very little about this stuff, but if I am correct, then the issue is how did it get there? Given that we know lions are very nearby in the McDowells, I don't think one getting to the Preserve is an impossibility. Hell, it could have headed west from the McDowells staying north of the Preserve and then made its way in.

    Look at the Sabino Canyon situtation in Tucson.
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  4. #4
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    I like cougars.

  5. #5
    sixsixtysix
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    If there is indeed one there, and it is stalking people in the daylight, it won't be there for long... Just like the situation up in Prescott last summer at Granite Basin, they simply shut the park down for 2 weeks, tracked and killed the cat.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by sixsixtysix
    If there is indeed one there, and it is stalking people in the daylight, it won't be there for long... Just like the situation up in Prescott last summer at Granite Basin, they simply shut the park down for 2 weeks, tracked and killed the cat.
    My pal was there just after sunset. As crazy as this sounds, I believe him. I know most of you think I am a big windbag. Well, maybe I am, But, I am being serious here. Be on the lookout.
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  7. #7
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    The javalina go in and out by way of the Green Belt (certain times a year) or so I've heard.

  8. #8
    sixsixtysix
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    Its not out of the realm of possibility, we are in their territory.

    I had a run in a few weeks ago with what I think was a "CoyDog" on DC early in the morning. My tire slipped off a rock and made a loud pop, this thing darted out of a bush about 8ft in front of me and ran across the trail and about 20 yards up the mountain then stopped and just watched me.

    It was red, like a Fox on its head, back and tail, but cream color on its underside. It looked almost like a combination of a Coyote and a Wolf, bigger than the usual Coyotes you see out there. But once it got a little bit away from me, it stopped and just watched, totally not caring that I was there.

    Coydogs can also dangerous to people because they inherit the lack of fear of people from domesticated K9's and the hunting instinct from the Coyote. Although a Mountain Lion is a lot bigger and a much more formidable opponent. Hell, I know what kind of damage my cat can inflict when he wants too, I can't imagine one 10x the size thinking it was "Prey" time.

  9. #9
    sprocket
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirdir
    My pal was there just after sunset. As crazy as this sounds, I believe him. I know most of you think I am a big windbag. Well, maybe I am, But, I am being serious here. Be on the lookout.
    We have seen it before out there. This is old news. Nice, bring it out in the open! Now they are probably going to get a complaint and try to remove it.
    There are many "corrodors" leading into the preserve that are only slightly interrupted by streets. Think Indian Bend wash over by PV mall all the way down to the Arizona canal- pretty uninterrupted all the way out to the Indian reservation.

  10. #10
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    Never seen a mountain lion out there.
    But I've seen plenty of Cougars...
    Quote Originally Posted by azdog View Post
    I think he was born around the time of the Chernobyl fallout which would explain a lot.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetisurly
    We have seen it before out there. This is old news. Nice, bring it out in the open! Now they are probably going to get a complaint and try to remove it.
    I suppose they should wait for confirmation or something until after the thing eats a kid's head or some such thing.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirdir
    I suppose they should wait for confirmation or something until after the thing eats a kid's head or some such thing.
    Typical NIMBY response.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirdir
    My friend is an outdoorsman and ex-Marine, so he has, in my eyes, much credibility.
    Wow..so you just proved you can be friends with military folk. OK, I'm jibbin' ya a bit there.

    We ocassionally ride T100 area at night during the week so if this is true, it could be scary. Guess I better pack my ka-nif-e just in case. Like I could get it out of my pack that quickly.

    We could just send Walt in there to body slam it.
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  14. #14
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    Cool-blue Rhythm

    Just bring me along. Hunters always attack the slow and old of the pack.
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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by trb2929
    Just bring me along. Hunters always attack the slow and old of the pack.
    Thats not very sportsman like now is it? Even less of a challenge as well.

  16. #16
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    here kitty kitty..


  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetisurly
    Typical NIMBY response.
    Look, I am sure I am more danger right now sitting at my desk than I would be if I was riding out there with a cougar lounging about. Nonetheless, if the thing is going to eat someone's head, it ain't gonna be my kid's.
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  18. #18
    sprocket
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirdir
    Look, I am sure I am more danger right now sitting at my desk than I would be if I was riding out there with a cougar lounging about. Nonetheless, if the thing is going to eat someone's head, it ain't gonna be my kid's.
    Then they should shut the whole preserve down to public access. It is people like you who have to ruin it for the rest of us.

  19. #19
    rockcrusher
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    here kitty kitty..
    Great.. now that cat has NO reason to fear humans. Instead of the camera maybe he should of picked up a pellet gun or some bear mace. A mountain lions exposure to humans should be made as unpleasant as humanely possible. if that doesn't work...then BLAST it!!!

  20. #20
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    Maybe it was Manbearpig
    John

  21. #21
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    Good job! hahaha

    Quote Originally Posted by Zero Signal
    Maybe it was Manbearpig
    Best post!!
    Quote Originally Posted by azdog View Post
    I think he was born around the time of the Chernobyl fallout which would explain a lot.

  22. #22
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    This is great news! Now this mtn lion can eat all the dogs that aren't on leashes!!
    07 GF Rig

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Umbrous
    This is great news! Now this mtn lion can eat all the dogs that aren't on leashes!!

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetisurly
    Then they should shut the whole preserve down to public access. It is people like you who have to ruin it for the rest of us.
    Yes, shut it down then. I am much safer as a roadie.
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  25. #25
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    No you aren't. I had a friend get killed on the road. She was hit by an idiot driver and we have PLENTY of those around here. Especially this time of year with the snowbirds.
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  26. #26
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    Same report/alleged sighting at Somo a few years back. Never did hear if anything was found. I would find it easier to believe at somo due to proximity of Estrellas and the Rez. Heck, San Juan part of the park is pretty deserted too. Never know..........may people see Bobcats and think they are mtn lions.

  27. #27
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    I am still trying to figure out why you think they would have had to place the cat in the preserve. Not like it wasn't there then one day people built it. It's a large parcel of land in a semi natural state. I think there is a cute family, a dady cat a mommy cat and two kid cats living there. Isn't that cute to think about?
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  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by KavuRider
    Never seen a mountain lion out there.
    But I've seen plenty of Cougars...
    Me too, I've seen them in packs just roaming around the trails.

  29. #29
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    manbearpig

    Quote Originally Posted by Zero Signal
    Maybe it was Manbearpig
    I'm being totally cerial.

    It's half bear and half man-pig...killed
    No, it's more half man and half pig-bear...killed
    No, it's more half pig and bear-man...killed

    The video would have been better if the mountain lion would have jumped through the 1/16 inch glass and eaten her with the camera on. Perhaps pulled a small child out of the window and dragged it up the hill. haha, like in Woodland Critter Christmas.

    "It could be that the purpose of your life is only to serve as a warning to others."

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by yetisurly
    Thats not very sportsman like now is it? Even less of a challenge as well.
    True but it is hunt or be hunted in the wild. Old and slow are the easiest target. If you can't throw yourself on a grenade. Be a meal for a mountain lion so a friend gets away clean. What good are you anyway!
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  31. #31
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    I was just watching that thing.. and thinking like..
    hey lady.. duh.. the cat is watching you because of
    the kids! (small tasty morsels!!!)
    crazy.. should have grabbed the pellet rifle and
    scared the thing outta there!

    visits to Yosemite in the early 1990's during the
    NPS's kindler/gentler days of managing the
    black bear population remind me of this as well.

    lots of bear problems, can opening car doors etc:

    Fast forward to the last few years, where they've
    instituted a 'get tough' stance with the animals..
    more wax bullets.. trying to scare them out of
    places, catching/releasing up in the high country
    more often and aggressively ticketing idiot tourons
    who leave coolers in their car and such.

    Number of bear incidents have dropped drastically
    in the past few years because of the more aggressive
    stance's towards them and the people leaving things
    out for them (or in their cars for that matter)

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Umbrous
    This is great news! Now this mtn lion can eat all the dogs that aren't on leashes!!
    Could also be an acceptable reason to lose control of your bike...or at least your bowels.
    On second thought scratch that you could still stand and pedal.

  33. #33
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    Warning!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Last edited by JohnniO; 08-19-2010 at 10:16 AM.

  34. #34
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    By the way Geoff what part of T100 was this sighting anyway? East of DD or West?
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    warning

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnniO
    Warning!!!!!!!!!!!!
    OMG, my side hurts from laughing. Hey JohnniO, so you have time to draw between customers at the papago public restroom? Good for you man, good for you.

  36. #36
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    Your problems can be solved here:

    http://www.urbancougar.com

  37. #37
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    Everybody rides Hawes, Pass Mtn, Eldon, all over where there are cats. If it's gonna happen, there's no stopping it. Won't know if he's gonna eat anybody until it happens

  38. #38
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    Mountian lions are wussies...


  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by trb2929
    By the way Geoff what part of T100 was this sighting anyway? East of DD or West?
    West, near Cave Creek. Max said he was on the Widowmaker, but I am not sure where that is.
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  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by eatdrinkride




    Awesome!
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  41. #41
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    I would have thought any cougars would have been out a long time ago. However, didn’t people get killed in a park by LA a few years ago? This cat was spotted in a park by the LA Zoo and the Tonight Show studios. It looks like it is entirely possible…http://www.jaglimo.com/lion.htm

  42. #42
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    There were a number of mountain lions/cougars tagged with radio collars in Southern California over the last couple of years. The mountain lions were found to routinely cross major freeways, and would come down to within several hundred feet of suburban houses at night. The cougars were found to frequent Starbucks, the gym, and the mall.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by AKA Monkeybutt
    It looks like it is entirely possible…http://www.jaglimo.com/lion.htm
    Wow-
    Most stories Ive read theyve never seen the cat until it was on top of them, being stalked would freak me out. Luckily she was on a horse or she would have been the person they are waiting for it to attack before moving it.
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  44. #44
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    Well that ride I've spoken to you about a couple times starts from Cave Creek and Cortez. I ride that area maybe every couple weeks. The other guys ride it twice a week in the late afternoon. Personally I'm not sure where the "widowmaker" is located. A guess would be the harder section between the two ridges heading toward cave Creek road. I see adults, kids and dogs off a leash in that area all the time. One couple has a pretty cool looking black lab. I'm partial to black labs as they are my favorite breed of dog. If there is something out in that area it's going to be noticed pretty soon that is for sure. I have heard the coyotes in the area by your house a couple of times. While a big cat would be rare to be living within our city. I see no reason why it could not survive in that area.
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  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirdir
    It seems unlikley, but that is probably just because the preserve is in the middle of the city and it is hard to imagine a lion there. Hypothetically, if a lion was dropped in the Preserve to see if it could survive there, I think it would be no problem. I have seen Javalina out there, coyotes, rabits, etc. I can't imiagine it not surviving. I know very little about this stuff, but if I am correct, then the issue is how did it get there? Given that we know lions are very nearby in the McDowells, I don't think one getting to the Preserve is an impossibility. Hell, it could have headed west from the McDowells staying north of the Preserve and then made its way in.

    Look at the Sabino Canyon situtation in Tucson.
    I didnt say it was impossible, but cougars tend to go where their prey goes.
    As far as I know there are no deer in Phx Mtn preserve. It is a relatively small
    area with no water, prey. Cats are territorial and need a larger area than that.
    I bet the guy that told you this is laughing his ass off right now

  46. #46
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    Mountain lions tend to stay within one square mile. We used to see the same mama and pair of cubs out at Queen Valley. They would wrestle and play up on the side of a small hill. Quite a site to see

  47. #47
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    The cougars main diet is meat like deer, javelina (ungulates, hoofed critters) but will eat anything like bugs, snakes, rats, mice, rabbits, ringtail and you name it. T100 area would have plenty of easy pickin’ food for a large cat. There’s a ton of urban water in the area like the golf course lakes, house fountains, sprinklers and such.

    Territory for cougars can be as big as 500 square miles but typically less depending on food supply. So the same cat may be in T100 today and in Flagstaff a week from now.

    I know there’s a healthy population of cats in the Lake Pleasant area. A few of my customers have surprised them while riding in the middle of nowhere. One guy riding his atv out prospecting startled a huge male and had a stare down with him and ended up scaring it off with his atv. This guy said he about wet himself because the cat was at least in the 200lb range, about 8ft long and was the largest thing that could eat him he had ever seen. He was shaking for 20 minutes on the way back to his truck and had enough excitement for a day.

  48. #48
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    Ok this may sound crazy but I ride t100 several times a week at night, since 2003. I have seen javelina, fox, coyotes, rattlesnakes galore, saw a great horned owl take a rabbit at night once, etc. Then several months ago, I saw something in the dark loping FAST across the desert, from the direction of 40th street parking lot. It ran to a tree and stopped. I was so scared that I stopped. I was scared to move. I knew it was just sitting there somewhere in the dark watching me. I called a friend on the cell. I wanted someone on the phone in case something happened to me. Then I realized that I had to be crazy. I mean there is NO way a mtn. lion would be so close to civilization. I turned around and went back to the road. Still, I was scared to ride out there for several days afterward. I have since convinced myself that it was something else. But I still havent figured out what I saw. I asked some rangers a few nights later about mtn. lions. I was embarrassed to even ask. All they could say is they had never heard of a mtn. lion sighting at Trail 100.
    I did see a mtn. lion in So. Cal. (Turnbull Canyon) once. I was riding very fast on a dh section of a fire road at dusk. Its eyes reflected back into my light. It just stared right at me as I flew toward it on my bike. At first I was confused trying to figure out what it was, as a mtn. lion didnt even occur to me. All I knew is the eyes werent right for coyote. It didnt turn away until the last minute and I saw its tail go between a barb wire fence and heard it crashing down the brush. I called the rangers the next AM and they said there had been sightings, which is why they were closing the trails at dusk. They had opened a large dump by the trails, which may have attracted it. My friends saw tracks not long thereafter.
    I saw a javelina on T100 about two weeks ago at night. I thought it was a lost dog and I was trying to catch it on my bike. It was running in front of me twisting with the trails and I was gaining on it. It wasnt very big. The poor thing was running for its life. Then I smelled it. Phew. We ran into some hikers going the other way with headlights and they must have scared it off the trail. I guess it almost ran into them.
    Last edited by racerXX; 11-03-2007 at 12:34 AM.

  49. #49
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    I would have thought any cougars would have been out a long time ago. However, didn’t people get killed in a park by LA a few years ago? This cat was spotted in a park by the LA Zoo and the Tonight Show studios. It looks like it is entirely possible…http://www.jaglimo.com/lion.htm
    Yeah, lion attacked a guy on a bike and killed him, then attacked a woman on a bike and tore her up pretty good, her friend came back to help her, started wailing rocks at the cat and got it to leave. The woman had to have half of her face reconstructed....tragic.

    I've got cousins in Trabuco Canyon in OC and they see lions all the time, every once in a while a small dog goes missing and no one in her neighborhood leaves their kids in the back yard unsupervised.

    Back east a bike was an ICBM (incredible canine bashing machine) out here I guess it's cat bashing machine.

  50. #50
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    I live right off T100, there is a trail head 100 yards out my door. I ride this area 3 - 5 times a week. I also lived in cat country in WA (between Marblemount and Newhalem) for a number of years. I've never herd a cat out on T100, which is much more probable than seeing one. I've never seen one out there either. That doesn't mean that there can't be one out there but we sure do have a lot of animals in our neighborhood that a cat could take at night when it's quiet and no one seems to ever tell stories about any.
    Fear can be your greatest ally or your biggest nemesis.

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  51. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by trb2929
    I'm not sure where the "widowmaker" is located.
    It is located just east of Cave reek Rd. Right after crossing Cortez and start up the hill, T100 goes off to the right and the hill goes up to eventually catch back up to Cortez. The very steep ascent a couple hundred yards after veering off to the right to stay on T100 is it. I do find it much more daunting to come down though, since I'm kind of a sissy and still have never made it up without having to get off and push.
    Fear can be your greatest ally or your biggest nemesis.

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