Just another reason to develop a pimp trail network in Flagstaff- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
    The .05 percent
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    Just another reason to develop a pimp trail network in Flagstaff

    Economic Impacts of Mountain Biking Tourism - 2016 Update - Pinkbike

    For your reading pleasure. I guess that Mountain bikers are not the poor dirt-bags that we once were.
    Make Flagstaff RAD Again.

  2. #2
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    Tl;DR "I spent a lot of money on this shit, so dig out these rocks and straighten these turns that make me suck!"
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  3. #3
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    I'm really at a loss to understand why people think Flagstaff needs any increase in tourism for any reason. We get inundated by desert dwellers every weekend from May-October and the international tourists from the Grand Canyon all summer every day of the week. Yes the trails could be better, but do it for the locals, not in order to bring more people here to keep pushing up housing costs, which are already out of reach for most of us who would like to call Flag home .

  4. #4
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    Not really a push for tourism, more of a show and tell as to the impact that is already occurring. On any given Sat, valley dwellers are at Late for the Train for Coffee, Having breakfast at a restaurant, staying in one of our many hotels. It is going to happen weather you like it or not. The simple fact that it is 30 degrees cooler should be obvious. If the city could get behind the Riding scene, the sky would be the limit.
    Make Flagstaff RAD Again.

  5. #5
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    The reality is mtn bike tourism doesn't have much impact on a big town but it certainly does on a small town. Flag is somewhere in the middle. No doubt, towns like Sedona or towns that were dying like Oakridge, OR it's a huge economic driver. Either way, like sinatorj said they are coming. One reason to support MEDL with a trail network that is built for the future with rideable trails to disperse the use. Geezus, trying to climb Schultz on a Saturday is like being in a pinball machine.

    Getting the city on board is a positive. And the Flagstaff Chamber of Commerce is already marketing summer activities like mtn biking in Phoenix. There are pictures of Absolute Bike's 6'8" Nate on the side of city buses. The city of Sedona contributes to the Red Rock trail fund for certain projects. The citizens of Steamboat Springs voted to contribute 3% of tax revenue to support their trail network.

  6. #6
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    If the pitch works to get the city on board and that helps produce the funds needed to get the monies needed for the EIS and any other expenses to improve the trail system I'm all for it. The city isn't getting any smaller and creating a well thought out trail system sooner than later that deals with the increase in traffic would probably be a good idea.

    Also, if Flagstaff put a little more effort into selling the adventure/outdoor sports image for tourism we might get a little bit of a different crowd kind of like how Sedona used to be your average american jeep tour tourist and it's now shifted to have a lot more of the fit and adventurous types there. I imagine that's good for local bike and outdoor gear shops.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by sinatorj View Post
    Not really a push for tourism, more of a show and tell as to the impact that is already occurring. On any given Sat, valley dwellers are at Late for the Train for Coffee, Having breakfast at a restaurant, staying in one of our many hotels. It is going to happen weather you like it or not. The simple fact that it is 30 degrees cooler should be obvious. If the city could get behind the Riding scene, the sky would be the limit.
    the fact of the matter is that that money is not trickling down to those of us making the food, pulling the coffee, or waking up at 5 AM to make sure baked goods at said coffee shop are fresh and delicious. Until the owners of these places start sharing a bit more of the money our products are bringing in we don't need more picky fad diet following scottsdale folks with chips on their shoulders up here. Ask anyone who works in the service industry up here about the needy pheonicians and their crap attitudes and tipping practices.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmctav23 View Post
    the fact of the matter is that that money is not trickling down to those of us making the food, pulling the coffee, or waking up at 5 AM to make sure baked goods at said coffee shop are fresh and delicious. Until the owners of these places start sharing a bit more of the money our products are bringing in we don't need more picky fad diet following scottsdale folks with chips on their shoulders up here. Ask anyone who works in the service industry up here about the needy pheonicians and their crap attitudes and tipping practices.



    Wow. That kind of attitude makes me wonder if the service industry was a good choice for you.
    "These things are very fancy commuter bikes or really bad dirt bikes, but they are not mountain bikes." - J. Mac

  9. #9
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    I think that this topic has gotten a bit off.....er......topic. The need to go to a Chamber of Commerce and discuss how MTB can bring dollars to a community is not about raising wages, it's about getting that Chamber to then exert pressure on other entities such as the FS to be more proactive with respect to recreational activities. To the Chamber, it's about pro-business and the data points which allows them to make the case.

    As for the trickle down economics discussed here, sadly....the chamber is not going to help you here. And Phoenicians will always be crappy when it comes to their impatience and demanding ways in the eyes of the service industry. Hell....Tucsons even say the same thing about Phoenicians.




  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maadjurguer View Post
    And Phoenicians will always be crappy when it comes to their impatience and demanding ways in the eyes of the service industry. Hell....Tucsons even say the same thing about Phoenicians.

    And Flagstaffians are patient, understanding, people who always leave 25% tips and help old ladies across the street.

    srsly?

  11. #11
    The .05 percent
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmctav23 View Post
    the fact of the matter is that that money is not trickling down to those of us making the food, pulling the coffee, or waking up at 5 AM to make sure baked goods at said coffee shop are fresh and delicious. Until the owners of these places start sharing a bit more of the money our products are bringing in we don't need more picky fad diet following scottsdale folks with chips on their shoulders up here. Ask anyone who works in the service industry up here about the needy pheonicians and their crap attitudes and tipping practices.
    I drove a Taxi in this town for 8 years. After all the wonderful service industry kick out the degenerates I was the recipient. I am all too aware of the pitfalls of the service industry. Maybe it is time that you do what I did 8 years ago and leave said industry for a better employer.
    My main message in starting this thread was too bring to light the monetary gains that can come from a well established and thorough trail network. Take it for what it is worth.
    Make Flagstaff RAD Again.

  12. #12
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    They are gonna sanitize yer shit the same as happened in Sedona - for the masses!
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    They are gonna sanitize yer shit the same as happened in Sedona - for the masses!
    Whatever, you are illiterate remember?
    Make Flagstaff RAD Again.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by sinatorj View Post
    Whatever, you are illiterate remember?
    Y'alls aren't gonna make 'Staff RAD again w/ that attitude, just more spodely...and massive.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by dtownmtb View Post
    And Flagstaffians are patient, understanding, people who always leave 25% tips and help old ladies across the street.

    srsly?
    I helped two old ladies and an older gentleman across the street today, bandaged a baby bald eagles wing and taught him to fly again as well as tipped my bartender 50%....all before 11am.




  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mrwhlr View Post
    Y'alls aren't gonna make 'Staff RAD again w/ that attitude, just more spodely...and massive.
    Well bless your bitter little heart... from one hater to another, you're alright.
    Make Flagstaff RAD Again.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmctav23 View Post
    the fact of the matter is that that money is not trickling down to those of us making the food, pulling the coffee, or waking up at 5 AM to make sure baked goods at said coffee shop are fresh and delicious. Until the owners of these places start sharing a bit more of the money our products are bringing in we don't need more picky fad diet following scottsdale folks with chips on their shoulders up here. Ask anyone who works in the service industry up here about the needy pheonicians and their crap attitudes and tipping practices.

    Who has a chip on their shoulder? If the tourist stop coming through town your job would dry up and go away.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmctav23 View Post
    the fact of the matter is that that money is not trickling down to those of us making the food, pulling the coffee, or waking up at 5 AM to make sure baked goods at said coffee shop are fresh and delicious. Until the owners of these places start sharing a bit more of the money our products are bringing in we don't need more picky fad diet following scottsdale folks with chips on their shoulders up here. Ask anyone who works in the service industry up here about the needy pheonicians and their crap attitudes and tipping practices.
    Hey, at least we have some kind of jobs in town here. In fact, I would say that the spectrum of employment opportunity is vast compared to places like Jackson Hole, Aspen, Telluride etc.

    I worked in the service industry for 23 years, 11 here in Flagstaff and if you are good you can make enough money to get by. I wouldn't recommend that industry much past 30-35 but some people seem ok with it long after that.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maadjurguer View Post
    I helped two old ladies and an older gentleman across the street today, bandaged a baby bald eagles wing and taught him to fly again as well as tipped my bartender 50%....all before 11am.
    and yet you used to be a Phoenician...

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by dtownmtb View Post
    and yet you used to be a Phoenician...
    HA! Now that's funny.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by dtownmtb View Post
    and yet you used to be a Phoenician...
    ....and I clubbed a baby seal to get into the hippy club too!!!

    Seriously....my comments were not meant to paint Phoenix with a broad brush....by the time I left PHX, I had been working in the service industry as well and certainly met the archtype customer with no patience, understanding, empathy and the overall self-entitlement that comes with most large metropolitan areas. I know there are good folks in PHX, and you are one of them.

    The fact remains that when folks go to another place, it would help to be a bit kinder and a little more receptive to things not working just exactly as they do back home. This is not unique to Flag/Tucson vs PHX....it just happens to be the hot topic here in this state.

    So tell me, PA Boy.....how do Philadelphian's treat outsiders from smaller towns in PA?

    As for trails in FLG and NoAZ in general.....we just need more support from a do-nothing FS....and I would like to see someone like the Chamber take up that issue.




  22. #22
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    Back to the point...

    IF the chamber and city financially got behind improving the trail system, how much of that money do you think would actually get to the trails? From what I've seen, I'm guessing that there would immediately be a call to improve trailhead parking and amenities, which in my opinion is much needed if they want to get more people to the trails. Arguably the most used TH, Elden lookout, has not even a trash can let alone a pit toilet or a picnic table.

  23. #23
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    ^^^I'm not thinking of this financially at this point. I want the Chamber to voice an opinion to the congressional delegation who will hopefully convey their concerns that we have a FS in our area which is seemingly dragging their feet on things that should have been done a while back....this creates an environment where folks that could be coming up here to enjoy a world class system, go out of state. This is a point that will not be lost by the Chamber....and as the representative for every business owner in flag that is heavily dependent on the tourist dollar, their concern voiced to the congressional delegation which has the gravitas to put pressure on the FS will go a long way.

    Just my opinion....but that's how I see a strategy unfolding in an effective manner. User's *****ing to the FS won't go as far as a call of concern from a congressional representative calling on behalf of Flagstaff Business owners. Politicians almost always respond to profit/loss issues from the business community because that directly impacts tax revenue. Get the Chamber to care about this....they'll make sure they're the squeaky wheel in front of legislators.




  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by jmctav23 View Post
    Back to the point...

    IF the chamber and city financially got behind improving the trail system, how much of that money do you think would actually get to the trails? From what I've seen, I'm guessing that there would immediately be a call to improve trailhead parking and amenities, which in my opinion is much needed if they want to get more people to the trails. Arguably the most used TH, Elden lookout, has not even a trash can let alone a pit toilet or a picnic table.
    Ah, the irony of it all. The Schultz Y is owned by the city.

    As for mtn bike tourism I wonder if it makes a difference to Late for the Train. I see cars with bikes on top there all the time. I'll ask the owner. Afterall, Organ Donoron Sunset is named after he donated his spleen there.

    Yesterday I rode with Dobbs who is up for the week from Phoenix with his family. Renting a condo, riding bikes, eating out....spending money in town. If you read the article signatorj linked the point is that the mtn bikers of today are middle class with money to burn.

    Another example from Sedona. Sedona Mountain Biking | Ridespots.com|Best Mountain Bike Destinations in the World

  25. #25
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    Yep, I dropped some cash in that town...

    Quote Originally Posted by rockman View Post
    Ah, the irony of it all. The Schultz Y is owned by the city.

    As for mtn bike tourism I wonder if it makes a difference to Late for the Train. I see cars with bikes on top there all the time. I'll ask the owner. Afterall, Organ Donoron Sunset is named after he donated his spleen there.

    Yesterday I rode with Dobbs who is up for the week from Phoenix with his family. Renting a condo, riding bikes, eating out....spending money in town. If you read the article signatorj linked the point is that the mtn bikers of today are middle class with money to burn.

    Another example from Sedona. Sedona Mountain Biking | Ridespots.com|Best Mountain Bike Destinations in the World

  26. #26
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    I invite the furnace blasted mountain biking citizens of desert cities to stay at my vacation rental. Mellow trails right out the back gate. Thank you for supporting my bill paying mountain lifestyle. AirBnB, small house with yurt.
    There is a big difference between ripping and skidding.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chalkpaw View Post
    I invite the furnace blasted mountain biking citizens of desert cities to stay at my vacation rental. Mellow trails right out the back gate. Thank you for supporting my bill paying mountain lifestyle. AirBnB, small house with yurt.
    Just make sure it's not this guy:

    Flagstaff police: Nude Scottsdale man high on 'bath salts' assaults officer




  28. #28
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    pm link please
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