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  1. #1
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    Dreamy Draw Time Trials

    ..open for business. Come on out and submit your time for one of the three time trials.

    Yesterday I ran TT1, full T100 east to west, including my first time riding the stairs at the DD parking lot - a bit hairy on the rigid the further I got and as my speed increased. Even though I don't feel I'm at my recent best condition, I did manage to take two minutes off my previous fast time. Of course this faster time was on the rigid ss, not the full suspension... I never would have guessed I'm both faster and enjoying rigid ss more than geared full suspension.

    Give the TT's a try, it's only competitive if you want to make it so, for me it's just fun and a way to mark and try and improve my times. Certainly no ruffled feathers when somebody who is really fast posts a great time.

    I'm going to have to hit Shaw Butte in the new year and give it my all, I know it's going to take it.

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    I will have to try this one again to see how I do. Got myself a new 29r so all the 29r hype should make me faster!! Question: I end the TT as soon as I hit the sidewalk at the park on the west end of the TT, is this correct?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjaghblb
    I will have to try this one again to see how I do. Got myself a new 29r so all the 29r hype should make me faster!! Question: I end the TT as soon as I hit the sidewalk at the park on the west end of the TT, is this correct?
    Thats right, you come down that chunky section and right when you pass the big trail sign you hit the sidewalk - that is the end.
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    You need to put that link back in your sig...

    I'd certainly be impressed with myself if I could do C2C in under TWO hours so I won't waste my time trying that one. Plus, that means unless you wanna go C2C2C you need to have a shuttler or a riding buddy to park at Duck Park. I've got neither...

    I do wanna try Shaw Butte and Mine Trail, though. Not like I can come close to those times either...

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by big0mike
    You need to put that link back in your sig...

    I'd certainly be impressed with myself if I could do C2C in under TWO hours so I won't waste my time trying that one. Plus, that means unless you wanna go C2C2C you need to have a shuttler or a riding buddy to park at Duck Park. I've got neither...

    I do wanna try Shaw Butte and Mine Trail, though. Not like I can come close to those times either...
    It's not bad, I did a leisurely pace 9 miles to get from my house to the start of the TT1, then hit it, then maybe only 2 or so miles home.
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    Quote Originally Posted by randyharris
    It's not bad, I did a leisurely pace 9 miles to get from my house to the start of the TT1, then hit it, then maybe only 2 or so miles home.
    But you're a rock star. I'm not...

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by big0mike
    But you're a rock star. I'm not...
    Not by a long shot.
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    Not so fast Randy, I would say you are doing pretty darn good, you beat my time by 1.5 minutes or so and I try and take this stuff as seriously as my time/body/career will let me. I will have to be on my GAME next try and I would suspect it will be a toss of the coin if I can match your time. You're on a SS no less. So do you power through the long climbs as you head west out of the Dreamy Draw parking lot or do you have to walk at all running 32x20? I don't think I could pull that. Is your rig a hard tail and if so, how much do you think that helps you pull that gearing on climbs versus a suspended setup. I rode a hardtail for the first time a few weeks back and was blown away at how climbing seemed "effortless" compared to my Epic. Of course, getting beat up on the next high speed straight followed by braking bumps into a cormer tempered the entusiasum some.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjaghblb
    Is your rig a hard tail and if so, how much do you think that helps you pull that gearing on climbs versus a suspended setup. I rode a hardtail for the first time a few weeks back and was blown away at how climbing seemed "effortless" compared to my Epic.
    He beat his last time on a fully-RIGID SS

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    Man..Shaw butte is steep

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    Can you do the time trial without a GPS - just a stopwatch? My GPS died again and I am not going to get another one anytime soon.

    Looks like a lot of fun

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    Quote Originally Posted by big0mike
    He beat his last time on a fully-RIGID SS
    ALL my fastest time are on a HT SS. They make you work harder

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grave9
    ALL my fastest time are on a HT SS. They make you work harder
    time has no meaning when I ride my bike.

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    I'm always racing against the sun.

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    I was wondering what ride I should do tomorrow but looks like this thread has made my mind up for me, I will give the TT another shot tomorrow morning. I really didn't push too hard the first attempt but I have learned that there is a fine line between the ride speed being comfortable and easy and the ride speed that causes one to blow up. I figure I will easily knock a half minute off but a minute and a half to approach Randy's new time...........that might be a stretch. And thats only if I am on my game.......that remains to be seen.

    Oh wait!!!! I am on a 29r now....that will knock 5 minutes off my time EASILY!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by tamen00
    Can you do the time trial without a GPS - just a stopwatch? My GPS died again and I am not going to get another one anytime soon.

    Looks like a lot of fun
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    So I bettered my time by 2 Seconds!!! 1:04:59 I did take 2 brief wrong turns that required backtracking and there were a good number of hikers and even horses to deal with but I don't think I lost more than 30-45 seconds so I have my work cut out for me to get into the 1:03s And then there is the leading time of 54 something?!? I have no idea where to find that 10 minutes!

    A great day for a ride however so all is good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjaghblb
    So I bettered my time by 2 Seconds!!! 1:04:59 I did take 2 brief wrong turns that required backtracking and there were a good number of hikers and even horses to deal with but I don't think I lost more than 30-45 seconds so I have my work cut out for me to get into the 1:03s And then there is the leading time of 54 something?!? I have no idea where to find that 10 minutes!

    A great day for a ride however so all is good.
    2 seconds! where's that almost 10% 29er speed improvement that I saw when I switched from a 26" bike? Maybe you haven't yet drunk the koolaide? haha.

    I'll be hitting Shaw Butte and attempting to better my time on the T100 East to West TT again in the near future. Scared about Shaw, anxious to try and improve T100. Not sure who the Mine Trail TT would be on the Single compared to my Hei Hei, guess I'll have to find out about that too.
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjaghblb
    ...do you have to walk at all running 32x20? I don't think I could pull that. Is your rig a hard tail and if so, how much do you think that helps you pull that gearing on climbs versus a suspended setup.
    Yes I did have to walk in 3 places, immediately after passing through the tunnel under the 51, I didn't make that short steep rock climb, had to walk 1/3rd of it, then shortly after that when you make a sharp left turn to parallel the 51 up that steep dirt climb, I got about 1/2 way up and my heart rate was at 185 so I bailed and walked the second half, I could have slowed the pace and kept climbing, but my strategy told me to walk that. Another mile or so later, I'm not sure but I think it's called Widowmaker, I had to walk at the first sharp left turn, it's a steep and loose rock climb, same thing, my heart rate was 184 so I opted to walk 1/2 of that hill instead of slug it out at a slower pace on the bike.

    Regarding the climbing, it's just so different from how I ride my FS it's hard to compare directly. I spin out far less on the SS, because I'm in a much higher gear - even with standing while climbing. But my Hei Hei is like a billygoat, it's able to climb pretty crazy stuff, I'm usually the limiting factor not the Hei Hei.
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    Is there a name for the steep steep downhill a short ways before you get to the tunnel under Cave Creek? My brakes were howling going down the 1st half of that yesterday, I think I will need some of those organics to help keep them quiet.

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    Are there GPS files to back these up somewhere? I looked and didn't see any. I did Shea Butte yesterday in 19:17 but i went to the top tower, it looks like that's wrong. I will do it again next week.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grunion
    Are there GPS files to back these up somewhere? I looked and didn't see any. I did Shea Butte yesterday in 19:17 but i went to the top tower, it looks like that's wrong. I will do it again next week.
    Look in Randyharris's signature, and there's a link to his website. Detailed description on the start/finish lines for all of the TT's. I think GPS too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjaghblb
    Is there a name for the steep steep downhill a short ways before you get to the tunnel under Cave Creek? My brakes were howling going down the 1st half of that yesterday, I think I will need some of those organics to help keep them quiet

    I don't think there is an official name for that little section, but it is on the back side of what many people call Disneyland. It's probably the toughest part of T100 proper.
    Last edited by GR1822; 12-29-2010 at 10:37 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjaghblb
    Is there a name for the steep steep downhill a short ways before you get to the tunnel under Cave Creek? My brakes were howling going down the 1st half of that yesterday, I think I will need some of those organics to help keep them quiet.
    One what side of CC? I can't think of any "steep steep downhill" a short ways before the tunnel, unless you're talking about the Mine Trail (which is just northwest of the tunnel) or Widowmaker (which is a ways away from the tunnel).
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skinny-tire
    One what side of CC? I can't think of any "steep steep downhill" a short ways before the tunnel, unless you're talking about the Mine Trail (which is just northwest of the tunnel) or Widowmaker (which is a ways away from the tunnel).
    I replied in the wrong spot earlier.
    Lookat the last post in the thread. I thinks he's riding east to west.


    I don't think there is an official name for that little section, but it is on the back side of what many people call Disneyland. It's probably the toughest part of T100 proper.

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjaghblb
    Is there a name for the steep steep downhill a short ways before you get to the tunnel under Cave Creek? My brakes were howling going down the 1st half of that yesterday, I think I will need some of those organics to help keep them quiet.

    Disneyland
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    Quote Originally Posted by cjaghblb
    Is there a name for the steep steep downhill a short ways before you get to the tunnel under Cave Creek? My brakes were howling going down the 1st half of that yesterday, I think I will need some of those organics to help keep them quiet.
    Respect that section of Disneyland Last time I went down it I got a little careless and went OtB pretty good. First time over the bars that my face actually contacted the ground

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    Yes, I am headed east to west following the TT path. Its the last big drop down the west side of the mountains (after you clear widowmaker and head the mile of so around the east side of the mountains) to the desert floor and its maybe a 1/2 mile from the base of the steep down to the CC tunnel.

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    The Green elipse marks the widowmaker, the blue one the CC tunnel and the Black one is the steep downhill I am speaking of.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjaghblb
    The Green elipse marks the widowmaker, the blue one the CC tunnel and the Black one is the steep downhill I am speaking of.
    No green elipse, no blue one or even black one for that matter.
    (You forgot to include the picture)
    Randyharris, big0mike and I all know what you speak of and answered your question correctly.

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    Failed for some reason last time so here we go again.
    Attached Images Attached Images  

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjaghblb
    Failed for some reason last time so here we go again.
    Second time's a charm!!!
    The answer is still waht we said, and definately not what skinnytire said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ajmelin
    Second time's a charm!!!
    The answer is still waht we said, and definately not what skinnytire said.
    Actually, that's the section I was referring to, I just don't use all those silly trail names. (FYI, that is the section I refer to as Widowmaker; there are at least 10 Widowmakers in the PMP area.)
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

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    Posted for the benefit of those not in the know such as ST and the many others that don't have the trail memorized.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skinny-tire
    Actually, that's the section I was referring to, I just don't use all those silly trail names. (FYI, that is the section I refer to as Widowmaker; there are at least 10 Widowmakers in the PMP area.)
    Okay.

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    Quote Originally Posted by skinny-tire
    Actually, that's the section I was referring to, I just don't use all those silly trail names. (FYI, that is the section I refer to as Widowmaker; there are at least 10 Widowmakers in the PMP area.)
    Any trail I ride has the potential for being a widowmaker

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    Just found out yesterday on my hike with the ranger that the entire section from Conversation Point on down to the parking lot at Dreamy Draw is NOT Trail 100. I'm not 100% clear on the true path because we didn't hike it but I'm fairly certain it's one of two routes:

    1. As you are heading down towards the parking lot you take the right as though you were gonna go UP Chutes/220 and then go left at the first intersection right at the base of Chutes. You'll be on 220 and 100.
    2. As you are heading down towards the parking lot you take the second right (not counting the actual second right that loops immediately back onto the trail in 300 feet) and then go left at the first intersection. You'll be on 220 and 100.

    We were prehiking the city's New Year's Day Fitness Hike. At conversation point we went to the top of Chutes and hiked down the north side so I got to see that funness. Then as we wrapped around the mountain back towards the parking lot she pointed out the signs indicating we were on 100 and 220. Trail 100 proper does not lead into the parking lot according to the ranger.

    FWIW Not that it matters for the Time Trial. Next time I'm out there I'm gonna try to figure out exactly where T100 goes just for the hell of it.

  38. #38
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    Hey on the Shea butte time trial it says first tower and some sign in box. I don't see it. Can anyone help?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grunion
    Hey on the Shea butte time trial it says first tower and some sign in box. I don't see it. Can anyone help?
    It's just on the trail side of the parking lot.
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    It says brown sign in box at first tower. This is where im confused. The first tower on the way up is on the left and I never see a brown sign in box. I have been stoping my time at the very last tower and best so far is 18:18.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grunion
    It says brown sign in box at first tower. This is where im confused. The first tower on the way up is on the left and I never see a brown sign in box. I have been stoping my time at the very last tower and best so far is 18:18.
    Sorry, I thought you were talking about the start. When you climb up to the top, geez, I'm going off memory now, but I believe as you climb to the very top there is a fenced building to your right, and you'll be heading pretty much east at that small stretch, there is a brown sign post with a box on it straight ahead. This is about the highest point you can go at Shaw.

    If you open the GPX file in Google Earth you can zoom in super close and see it in the Sat photos, the route I'm talking about.

    If you have a time for that route, please submit from the website. Thanks.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grunion
    Hey on the Shea butte time trial it says first tower and some sign in box. I don't see it. Can anyone help?

    Grunion, I did Shaw at lunch time today, the box is gone! Up at the top it is now just a brown sign post.

    I did far better than I was expecting, I'll be gunning for your time next attempt.
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    I ran the DDTT #1 this morning, T100 east to west full length. As last time, I took my time and road easy from my house the 9 miles to the start of the TT at T100 and Tatum. Gave it my all and bested my last time by twenty some seconds.

    There were some changes since the last attempt though.
    1) New Easton Haven wheelset
    2) New Easton Haven carbon bar
    3) New Surly 21t rear cog (last time was with a 20t cog)

    I was racing against my last time in Virtual Partner on my Garmin, I could see that I was gaining time on the hill climbs, losing a little time on the flats, and unfortunately I lost precious momentum several times because there were a lot of hikers out on the trial. Poor time to run the TT on my part.

    At the end of the day I was just a hair faster, and I actually felt pretty good at the end, I had more gas in me. I wanted to leave the 21t on because I want to try for a personal best on Shaw Butte soon, but I'm going to have to go back to the 20t and hit T100 TT again too, I'd like to think I'll do better but the proof is in the pudding. Where the heck did that saying come from anyway!
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    Oh, and for what it's worth, I only walked one very short section this time, I think the hill is called Widowmaker. Cross under the 51 from DD, head up the hill parallel to the 51, descend, cross across maybe 1/2 mile or so on undulating trail, then turn right and head up a fairly steep climb, then a sharp left and keep going. That sharp left is where I bailed and walked a section, then rode the top of that hill which levels out a bit. My heart rate was maxed at that corner, decided to not kill myself.
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    Quote Originally Posted by randyharris
    Oh, and for what it's worth, I only walked one very short section this time, I think the hill is called Widowmaker. Cross under the 51 from DD, head up the hill parallel to the 51, descend, cross across maybe 1/2 mile or so on undulating trail, then turn right and head up a fairly steep climb, then a sharp left and keep going. That sharp left is where I bailed and walked a section, then rode the top of that hill which levels out a bit. My heart rate was maxed at that corner, decided to not kill myself.
    I think I know what spot you are talking about and I've not made it without stopping at that bend either. The climb is tough but soon as you turn left it starts to get a little chunky making the climb even worse.

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    Damn! I'm last in the Shaw Butte TT. I guess I should try it again but I am not in good shape anymore and doubt that I could do better right now, I don't own a 21t cog it would have to stay a 19t or use a 22t. I think the 22t would be too tall and would be worse for me but would be nice to finally use it. Maybe it's a good reason to get out the Niner MCR again.
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    Quote Originally Posted by TacoBeer
    Damn! I'm last in the Shaw Butte TT. I guess I should try it again but I am not in good shape anymore and doubt that I could do better right now, I don't own a 21t cog it would have to stay a 19t or use a 22t. I think the 22t would be too tall and would be worse for me but would be nice to finally use it. Maybe it's a good reason to get out the Niner MCR again.
    Yeah pull out the MCR until your knees are good again.
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  48. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by randyharris
    Oh, and for what it's worth, I only walked one very short section this time, I think the hill is called Widowmaker. Cross under the 51 from DD, head up the hill parallel to the 51, descend, cross across maybe 1/2 mile or so on undulating trail, then turn right and head up a fairly steep climb, then a sharp left and keep going. That sharp left is where I bailed and walked a section, then rode the top of that hill which levels out a bit. My heart rate was maxed at that corner, decided to not kill myself.
    Yep, that's the only climb I can't make as well. Less to do with the climb, more to do with the heart rate. I did it yesterday, and stopped at the turn. But didn't walk any, and just waited for my HR to come down.
    Nobody gives a s#$t you singlespeed.

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by randyharris
    Grunion, I did Shaw at lunch time today, the box is gone! Up at the top it is now just a brown sign post.

    I did far better than I was expecting, I'll be gunning for your time next attempt.
    If I took my ss I would have to walk so you got me beat

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grunion
    If I took my ss I would have to walk so you got me beat
    Truth is I walked a steep section in the middle myself.

    Fair is fair, geared or SS, you're picking geared I'm picking SS - no matter on what, it's all about getting to the top.
    ONE SHOX, ONE GEAR, LOTS of FUN! www.TrailFu.com My Rides

  51. #51
    mtbr member
    Reputation: cstem's Avatar
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    Guy I might have a 21 you can have- its a spare that I probably really don't need to hang onto. Let me find it and it is yours.
    Vassago Cycles, Shadetree Bikes, Flat Tire Bikes, Galfer Brakes USA

  52. #52
    Beer Drnkr w/bike problem
    Reputation: TacoBeer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cstem
    Guy I might have a 21 you can have- its a spare that I probably really don't need to hang onto. Let me find it and it is yours.
    Sounds good but I hate taking stuff for nothing so how about a trade? I'll take the 21T and give you my 22t. this way you can sell it and make a little money. if not I'll still take the 21t, it would help witht he four peaks hill climb. or maybe I found a use for the 22 now? I never road up the mountain on a bike and i don't remember the road from late 90's when I drove up it last.
    "Not drinking is the Single Speed World Championships version of doping" -Jacquie Phelan

    E-bikes are Mountain Mopeds

  53. #53
    Got a suspension fork
    Reputation: randyharris's Avatar
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    Whoa, major improvement for me today on Shaw Butte, I dropped nearly two minutes off of my time, my personal best is 16 minutes 56 seconds. As happy as I am with that time, somebody is down to 13 minutes, lol - that is a pipe dream for this non-twitch muscle guy.
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    ONE SHOX, ONE GEAR, LOTS of FUN! www.TrailFu.com My Rides

  54. #54
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Grunion's Avatar
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    Good job

  55. #55
    mtbr member
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    2hrs, I got lost, ate snacks, and did downhill sections i really like multiple times

  56. #56
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Grunion's Avatar
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    Have not done Shea butte since the first of the yr. I am so slow now I granny ringed the whole thing 22 minutes I am ashamed of that. I guess I need to work on this.

  57. #57
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    I have never seen this thread before, I will definitly have to get involved with this and see how i do. This is a great way to track my progress as a rider ( in terms of speed/time ) -- i dont have a GPS unit yet, only my handy bike PC..

  58. #58
    Just Ride
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    What a great idea. I'll have to make sure to start riding these routes to see how my times compare. Any possibilities these TT's are going to expand to other trails around Phoenix?

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