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  1. #1
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    bummed with my stans

    riding the whiskey today with my brand new Maxxis Advantage tire setup tubeless on Stans Arch EX rims. No problem with the tubeless setup. about 12.5 miles into the ride I cut the sidewall resulting in a small slit that didn't seal at all. Ended up having to tube to keep going. Any suggestions for other sealants that may work better? Also, any suggestions on sidewall repair? It pains me to throw away a $60 tire after 2 rides.

  2. #2
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    The sad truth is that the claimed "seals punctures up to 1/4" in size" is pretty much a joke. It might work if you can ride with 4psi in the tire but that's about it. I don't know of any sealant that works any better though, it's just the nature of the beast. Sidewall cuts are a common issue, esp. with lighter tires. You might be able to repair it by sewing the area up with dental floss and some sort of internal patch. I've used a small piece of cotton cloth with decent results (gives the sealant something to bind to). There are plenty of DIY tubeless guys on here that have all kinds of creative solutions so I'd wait and see who else chimes in. There's probably a simple method that I haven't heard of yet.
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  3. #3
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    I went thru 2-3 tires with the sidewall cuts. There is no way to fix them except for surgical stiching. I tried everything - tampons, tire plugs, stans with and without car tire slime.
    It must have something to do with lower pressure and as tire flattens out it is more susceptible to cuts. I went with spec ust grids on the back, but I had to readjust my riding style. It actually taught to me ride better.

    On the bright side, I run over a barbed wire and had multiple punctures and the tire held up just fine.

  4. #4
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    Usually lots of sharp tires on the two main descents that give ample opportunity for pinch flats and sidewall cuts. This is basically when I did NOT want a flat! This means ample sidewalls. Many high volume tires skimp on the sidewalls to keep the weight down. I also kept pressure relatively high due to the possibility of pinching being significant (and the significant road/fireroad sections).
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

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  5. #5
    No Clue Crew
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    Sounds like a tire problem, not a Stan's problem.

  6. #6
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    Try cleaning the area around the slice real well and use a regular tube patch. Might not work on on a sidewall due to flex, but it has worked for me on the tread portion of a tire.
    I like ken's idea of a stitch job too. Use a baseball switch pattern.

  7. #7
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    Re: bummed with my stans

    Clean well, I use brake cleaner, get car tire patches, follow directions for the glue. I have had a run where I seem to cut either a sidewall or tread 1st or 2nd ride. Of the three I patched they all held until tires were bald.
    I live in Vegas so similar tire pokers.

  8. #8
    Ahhh the pain....
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    No need to throw the tire out. If the cut is radial(same direction as the spokes), its very fixable as long as the cut isnt super long. Get a curved needle and some dental floss and stitch it back together. A bball stitch as mentioned works great. Then get some auto patches at walmart and patch both the inside and outside over the stitching. Just be sure the surfaces are clean and dry. I use isopropyl alcohol to clean the area.
    Ive ridden a bunch of tires till theyre worn out with this kind of patch.
    On the trail, theres several tricks i use to avoid tubing(last resort!)
    1. Small cuts, stuff a piece of rag in with a small hex wrench(tampon method)
    2. Bigger cuts but not completely through the sidewall but stans wont seal. Drop the pressure immediately. Stanns needs to coagulate to work and even 25psi will cause it to squit through the hole. Take some superglue and drip it on the area. Put a piece of gorilla tape on it. I literally finished 85 miles of the Gila100 with this fix.
    3. If the cut is through the sidewall, dont break the bead! Sew it up with a curved needle and dental floss and put a little superglue/gorilla tape. If you have a long way to get back, put a patch on it. Inflate slowly letting the stans set up. This fix has worked for me several times.
    Biggest thing is be patient...stans is great stuff but you have to let it do its magic on the bigger cuts.

  9. #9
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    Tire plugs, sew with floss at home.
    Nice KOM, sorry about your penis.

  10. #10
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    Where to pick up a curved sewing needle? I work in a lot of OR's now, might have to sweet talk a suture kit out of one of the nurses!
    Vassago Cycles, Shadetree Bikes, Flat Tire Bikes, Galfer Brakes USA

  11. #11
    Ahhh the pain....
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    Walmart has a small pack of needles containing 2 curved and a few straight ones. I would imagine if you're close to a place like Tempe Sales or similar, you could find some good ones too.

  12. #12
    Vincit qui patitur
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    Orange seal is supposed to work well. I'm running it but have yet to rip a sidewall.
    Vincit qui patitur
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  13. #13
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    Use a tire boot. I have had good luck with Park Tools tire boots. They are made of strong vinyl and have a super sticky side that will easily seal a side cut, although obviously not a huge one. If you want highest probability of success, then apply a boot and use a tube. I carry package of these in all my seat bags. Not sure why these don't get more love, very simple, very effective.

    Park Tool Emergency Tire Boot | All Seasons Cyclist
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    Bob
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by jjkuhn818 View Post
    riding the whiskey today with my brand new Maxxis Advantage tire setup tubeless on Stans Arch EX rims. No problem with the tubeless setup. about 12.5 miles into the ride I cut the sidewall resulting in a small slit that didn't seal at all. Ended up having to tube to keep going. Any suggestions for other sealants that may work better? Also, any suggestions on sidewall repair? It pains me to throw away a $60 tire after 2 rides.
    maybe a dumb question, but did you try tilting your wheel such that all the stans would be settling in the sidewall cut ? I think one of the main reasons why sidewall punctures don't seal well is because the stans needs to saturate the puncture area

  15. #15
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    how long was the sidewall wound?
    RAM speed: UP, UP, and away....!

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bituman View Post
    Use a tire boot. I have had good luck with Park Tools tire boots. They are made of strong vinyl and have a super sticky side that will easily seal a side cut, although obviously not a huge one. If you want highest probability of success, then apply a boot and use a tube. I carry package of these in all my seat bags. Not sure why these don't get more love, very simple, very effective.

    Park Tool Emergency Tire Boot | All Seasons Cyclist
    Park Tool Co. » TB-2 : Emergency Tire Boot : Tube & Tire

    Bob

    Bob- I have looked at those and although I haven't had a use for one (yet), wondered how well they work and how clean does the tire have to be. I can imagine trailside not being able to get the inside of my tire clean enough. If it needs to be pretty clean, do you think alcohol swabs would work?-Cory
    Vassago Cycles, Shadetree Bikes, Flat Tire Bikes, Galfer Brakes USA

  17. #17
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    You don't need to use brake cleaner or anything aggressive like that. Normal trail cleaning (e.g. spit on it and wipe well with jersey) or even that little piece of sandpaper that comes with tube patch kits works fine. Or as you say, a little dab of isopropyl alcohol would be fine. These things are really, really sticky.

    Bob
    "Some people follow their dreams, others hunt them down and beat them mercilessly into submission." - Neil Kendall

  18. #18
    EDR
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    Couple of things:

    Re: turning the tire sideways to seal the cut. Yes, this will get the goo into the cut, but the problem (usually) is when riding the casing deforms and cut opens back up. Sealant can't really combat that issue.

    Re: tire boot. My question is also regarding the tire being clean/dry. They very few times I've had to insert a tube in my UST tires while riding it's a freak'n mess inside. I can't imagine anything could stick inside the tire without a fairly thorough cleaning. Maybe just a handful of dirt then wipe dry, IDK??

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by eatdrinkride View Post

    Re: tire boot. My question is also regarding the tire being clean/dry. They very few times I've had to insert a tube in my UST tires while riding it's a freak'n mess inside. I can't imagine anything could stick inside the tire without a fairly thorough cleaning. Maybe just a handful of dirt then wipe dry, IDK??
    I agree with you that the inside of the tire is a sticky mess. But you don't have to clean the whole inside of the tire, just a small area around the cut only slightly bigger than the piece of boot. To me the bigger consequence of all that sticky latex in the tire is that it's hard to get a tube in and properly seated. That's what you pointed out and for sure it's a PITA. Most of the road bike old timers have patched a cut or punctured tire with a powerbar wrapper, dollar, etc. Basically, the tire boot is a super version of that. Again, while just the boot itself might work for a tear, IMHO it's better to use it in conjunction with a tube.

    Bob
    "Some people follow their dreams, others hunt them down and beat them mercilessly into submission." - Neil Kendall

  20. #20
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    Re: bummed with my stans

    Quote Originally Posted by Bituman View Post
    I agree with you that the inside of the tire is a sticky mess. But you don't have to clean the whole inside of the tire, just a small area around the cut only slightly bigger than the piece of boot. To me the bigger consequence of all that sticky latex in the tire is that it's hard to get a tube in and properly seated. That's what you pointed out and for sure it's a PITA. Most of the road bike old timers have patched a cut or punctured tire with a powerbar wrapper, dollar, etc. Basically, the tire boot is a super version of that. Again, while just the boot itself might work for a tear, IMHO it's better to use it in conjunction with a tube.

    Bob
    Okay I got you. I totally misunderstood point of the tire boot. I thought it was to be used without a tube. I keep a section from a two liter coke bottle in my pack that I can cut and use as needed with a tube. Same thing I suppose.

  21. #21
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    I bought the tire boot and will be giving that a try. I had tried getting the Stans into the tear, but the weight of me on the bike kept splitting it back open. I'm going to do the boot trick tonight and try running tubeless again. Keeping my fingers crossed. . . there's a little bit of time left before the race.

  22. #22
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    Are you planning to run that sliced tire the day of the race?

  23. #23
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    If at all posiible, replace that tire before the race. You may be setting yourself up for failure if you use the damaged tire.
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    you're lucky enough.

  24. #24
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    What do you recommend for a strong sidewall tire? I ran the TNT tire from Geax and its a pain to mount on a Stans wheel

  25. #25
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    +1 on the tube patches. I use Slime brand self adhesive patches. Patching the sidewall works. I've even parched a spot right at the bead with no issues. Park Tool also makes some nice patches but haven't tried them.

    Quote Originally Posted by GR1822 View Post
    Try cleaning the area around the slice real well and use a regular tube patch. Might not work on on a sidewall due to flex, but it has worked for me on the tread portion of a tire.
    I like ken's idea of a stitch job too. Use a baseball switch pattern.

  26. #26
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    Tube patch, sand good but try not to get into cords, after patch installed use superglue on edges of patch. Not going anywhere!

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bituman View Post
    Use a tire boot. I have had good luck with Park Tools tire boots. They are made of strong vinyl and have a super sticky side that will easily seal a side cut, although obviously not a huge one. If you want highest probability of success, then apply a boot and use a tube. I carry package of these in all my seat bags. Not sure why these don't get more love, very simple, very effective.

    Park Tool Emergency Tire Boot | All Seasons Cyclist
    Park Tool Co. » TB-2 : Emergency Tire Boot : Tube & Tire

    Bob

    I can't get these things to work for crap! I cleaned the inside of the tire SPOTLESS and the boot still came unstuck as I want mounting the tire very carefully. I can't imagine one ever working on the trail.

  28. #28
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    Re: bummed with my stans

    Quote Originally Posted by Skelldify View Post
    I can't get these things to work for crap! I cleaned the inside of the tire SPOTLESS and the boot still came unstuck as I want mounting the tire very carefully. I can't imagine one ever working on the trail.
    I've never tried one of those but you do know they are meant to be used in conjunction with a tube to hold them in place right?

  29. #29
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    carry alchy wipes with you for cleaning. save them from restaurants or just by some. they come in cheap first aid kits as well.

    you can slow a small hole leak down with a park tool glueless patch if you put it on right. air the tire down, clean, let it sit on the there for a while, air up. helped my friend get home one day without putting a tube in or patching from the inside. Desert classic .

    those volcanized patches can bond really well to tubes. I'd imagine they could do well on the outside of a tire for a temporary patch as long as you take the time.
    Novara Patch Kit at REI.com
    back at it
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  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skelldify View Post
    I can't get these things to work for crap! I cleaned the inside of the tire SPOTLESS and the boot still came unstuck as I want mounting the tire very carefully. I can't imagine one ever working on the trail.
    Read post #21.
    "Some people follow their dreams, others hunt them down and beat them mercilessly into submission." - Neil Kendall

  31. #31
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    At the moment my tire's holding 50 psi with a park tool boot and rubber cement plus stan's. It wasn't holding with just the boot and rubber cement, so I figured I'd put some stan's in and see if that seals up the little gaps. An interesting phenomenon occurred: the stan's seems to have mixed with the rubber cement and a little bit of real thick, rubbery goop squeezed out, and seems to have sealed it.

    Haven't test ridden it yet though... You never know what will hold up on the trail...

    I'll try the tire patch kit next. I've torn 3 sidewalls in the last couple months, and just can't keep throwing out tires! Thanks for the help!

  32. #32
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    I've torn my share of sidewalls (Continental X-King ProTection I'm looking at you) then I switched to Specialized GRID sidewalls and no problems since (Purgatory GRID 2Bliss Ready). Tread pattern gives me plenty of grip for the loose gravel trails around here and they seal up very easily (unlike the Conti) - even without sealant. No, I don't work for Specialized nor do I ride their bikes - I hate their tire naming but the tires themselves have been rock solid.

  33. #33
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    bummed with my stans

    Skelldify. Have the same issue with side walls from time to time. It typically comes in 3's and the it stops for 6 to 9 months before I really start railing corners on my home trails and it starts again.


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