Full lockout AM rear shock for big fire road climbs?- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Full lockout AM rear shock for big fire road climbs?

    Before anyone jumps down my throat - I'm not looking to use a lockout on rough trails, but on big climbs on smooth jeep roads & fire roads (really, really big climbs).

    I'm considering going up to AM from XC. Looked around a bit and the Enduro comp is already straining the limit of my budget - but not only is there no lockout, the lbs guy said they don't even make lockouts for AM rear shocks.

    Is that true? Any affordable 8.5" rear shocks with lockouts? Couldn't find any looking at some online retailers.

    My '07 stumpjumper FSR comp is 30.2 lbs (even my old hardtail is 30lbs) and I'm really not worried about big climbs on a 32 lb bike. Yes, I am crazy...

  2. #2
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    am shock, thats about the silliest thing ive heard. anyways i think scott and canodale are the only companies to offer longer travel bikes with full lockout. most bikes will have pro pedal though which will definitely help.

  3. #3
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    Yep Scott and C'dale.
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  4. #4
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    Get a bike with the Fox RP23 rear shock. Setting the ProPedal to 3 should give you a pretty stiff ride to the top, and you can flip the lever for cush on the way down.

  5. #5
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    Do you mean lockout on a coil shock? Like bkul said, no such thing as an AM shock... unless the marketeers are really getting desperate.

  6. #6
    Haro Sonix LT VL120
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    My Rock Shox MC3.3 has lockout.

  7. #7
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    Fox Float in RL or RPL version would work.

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    k here is what you do, walk into a machine shop and ask them to cut up some bar stuck to wedge between the linkage and the stationary shock mount, boom presto just like a hardtail........actually if you thought i am serious please just walk away now. just get something with propedal or the like but from what I hear a lot of people just forget to turn on their platform anyways...

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    Heh heh heh...funny tyler, yep if anyone thought you were serious they are in real trouble!

    OK, "rear shock on AM bike" or whatever, I guess I should have said 8.5" travel rear shock that you could swap on an Enduro. No marketing involved, the explanation is far simpler - I don't know what I'm talking about!

    I'd like as full of a lockout as possible (even lockouts aren't truly locked out of course), but I should probably check out an RP23.

    Looks like the RP/RPL are not made that long. Couldn't find anything on the MC3.3, those are older ones?

    Rode a Scott Genius rental bike in 2009, have they changed much? Seemed squirrelly but it was end-of-season so it was probably pretty trashed.

    Any other shock options that would work on a 2011 Enduro Comp? Liked the bike, didn't want to eliminate it from the running if there is a reasonable shock alternative (for an unreasonable guy like me who wants a full lockout...)

    Thanks for the replies!

  10. #10
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    2012 RP23, I beleive, has lock out. Not sure about the size.

  11. #11
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    Good job! Pushed 2011 Rockshox Monarch Plus RC3 combined with 2011 Fox 36 Talas 160 RL

    Quote Originally Posted by locoyokel View Post
    Before anyone jumps down my throat - I'm not looking to use a lockout on rough trails, but on big climbs on smooth jeep roads & fire roads (really, really big climbs).

    I'm considering going up to AM from XC. Looked around a bit and the Enduro comp is already straining the limit of my budget - but not only is there no lockout, the lbs guy said they don't even make lockouts for AM rear shocks.

    Is that true? Any affordable 8.5" rear shocks with lockouts? Couldn't find any looking at some online retailers.

    My '07 stumpjumper FSR comp is 30.2 lbs (even my old hardtail is 30lbs) and I'm really not worried about big climbs on a 32 lb bike. Yes, I am crazy...
    Hey Mr. locoyokel,

    The fork in the following review has a lockout and the shock has 3 levels of platform that will give you exactly what you're looking for in regards to aid in climbing smooth fire roads. My bike weighs 30 lbs 12 oz in this configuration. The shock and fork have now broken in and are providing a wonderfully plush ride. This was my original impression using it on my bike. I hope this info helps your process in some small way.

    "Last Saturday I had my first ride on a Pushed 2011 Rockshox Monarch Plus RC3 that I combined with a 2011 Fox 36 Talas 160 RLC FIT fork as replacements for the Specialized suspension on my 2007 Euduro SL. It was a major improvement from ride characteristics to the weight of the bike. The ride was a 3.5 hour, 23 mile funfest with over 3,000 feet of elevation gain/loss. One ride doesnít a review make but Iím completely stoked by the changes and highly recommend them to anyone with this frame.

    Iíve had the Fox fork on the bike for 4 rides already so I was somewhat familiar with the advantages brought about by that change. Adding the shock was a major improvement to both the uphill and DH ride characteristics of the bike. That said I was expecting a little plusher ride with all the controls opened up. However I was assured by Darren at Push that they recommend 4-8 hours of off-road riding on all of their suspension services as a break-in period. Additionally, half a dozen other experienced riders told me that you normally need 15-20 hours of riding before a new shock or fork is completely broken in. Iím excited that things will only get better from here on as they were pretty damn nice Saturday!"

    Iíve done two of these long rides plus a number of ďfart aroundĒ sessions around my house. Bottom line is Iíve really liked both the shock and the fork. There was an immediate improvement in how well the bike pedaled on the flat and climbed steep hills. Long boring fire road climbs are greatly enhanced by the lock out feature on the fork and the low speed compression controls on both the shock and the fork. When Iím bombing downhill the bike feels planted to the trail and seems to handle square edged hits better.

    The final thing Iíll say is IMHO the Enduro SL with the Pushed 2011 Rockshox Monarch Plus RC3 and a 2011 Fox 36 Talas 160 RLC FIT fork both climbs and descends much better than it did with the original Specialized suspension!

    Iím a happy camper and looking forward to even better days,

    Michael
    If you can't keep the rubber side down......at least smile for the camera!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by locoyokel View Post
    Heh heh heh...funny tyler, yep if anyone thought you were serious they are in real trouble!

    OK, "rear shock on AM bike" or whatever, I guess I should have said 8.5" travel rear shock that you could swap on an Enduro. No marketing involved, the explanation is far simpler - I don't know what I'm talking about!

    I'd like as full of a lockout as possible (even lockouts aren't truly locked out of course), but I should probably check out an RP23.

    Looks like the RP/RPL are not made that long. Couldn't find anything on the MC3.3, those are older ones?

    Rode a Scott Genius rental bike in 2009, have they changed much? Seemed squirrelly but it was end-of-season so it was probably pretty trashed.

    Any other shock options that would work on a 2011 Enduro Comp? Liked the bike, didn't want to eliminate it from the running if there is a reasonable shock alternative (for an unreasonable guy like me who wants a full lockout...)

    Thanks for the replies!
    Yep, you're right. They come in 8.5 x 2.5, but not the 8.5 x 2.125 that the Comp would require. My bad.

  13. #13
    wyrd biū ful „rśd
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    The type of linkage on your FS will also make a major difference on how your rear end feels ... no punt intended ... ... try out a bike with a 4 bar linkage ...

  14. #14
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    My DH bike has a 9.5x3 coil shock with propedal that can be dialed to almost full lock out. That shop guy was being a dork by treating you like an idiot for wanting a lock out on a 6" bike. Pedal platforms can be had on any size shock really and that's all you need. Many designs on the market now won't ride right with pedal platform dialed in but they still come with the option because people think a shock is cheap if it doesn't have a pedal platform. Depending on what bike you buy, you'll probably find you won't use propedal. Just because you have 6" travel doesn't mean you'll bob out of the saddle.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by slimat99 View Post
    Depending on what bike you buy, you'll probably find you won't use propedal. Just because you have 6" travel doesn't mean you'll bob out of the saddle.
    That's true, but I still think some sort of lockout/platform is nice for big fireroad climbs like the OP is talking about. On a smoothish road and a steep climb you can deffinitely tell the difference especially if you really put some power down. I also think it helps on the really steep winch-up road climbs as it keeps more weight on the front tire since the rear can't compress due to the weight distribution from the steep climb. As for trail climbs, I always leave my rear shock full open as it climbs much better that way.

    OP: I have an RP23 and on the stiffest pro-pedal setting it feels nearly "locked" on road climbs.

  16. #16
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    2012 Fox Float RP23 shock Ė First look
    By Matt Pacocha, US editor

    Fox Racing Shox's 2012 Float RP23 Boost Valve with Adaptive Logic shock (Matt Pacocha/BikeRadar.com)
    For 2012 Fox Racing Shox will offer the option of the slippery Kashima coating found on this year's aftermarket forks on their rear shocks and OE components.

    Also debuting on the Float RP23 Boost Valve damper is ĎAdaptive Logicí, which adds versatility by combining Fox's terrain-sensitive ProPedal platform damping with an additional, lever-selectable firm lockout.

    Length / Travel
    5.50 x 1.00, 6.00 x 1.25, 6.50 x 1.50, 7.50 x 2.00, 7.875 x 2.00, 7.875 x 2.25, 8.50 x 2.50

  17. #17
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    I have a Giant Trance with a Fox float RPL and I find the pro-pedal works best for steep fire roads. Completely locking out the back end is only for climbing pavement. Even the smoothest fire road has some ruts and chunks and a little give in the back makes getting over those much easier.

    You have to sit and spin though, if you're a complete masher and want to grind up stuff standing up at 40rpm, you need to lock out both front and back.

    - Booker C. Bense

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtskibum16 View Post
    That's true, but I still think some sort of lockout/platform is nice for big fireroad climbs like the OP is talking about. On a smoothish road and a steep climb you can deffinitely tell the difference especially if you really put some power down. I also think it helps on the really steep winch-up road climbs as it keeps more weight on the front tire since the rear can't compress due to the weight distribution from the steep climb. As for trail climbs, I always leave my rear shock full open as it climbs much better that way.

    OP: I have an RP23 and on the stiffest pro-pedal setting it feels nearly "locked" on road climbs.
    True, I use propedal on dedicated buff climbs not to reduce suspension activity but to reduce sag which steepens the head angle. I ride VPP so there really isn't that much difference in climbing suspension activity with propedal other than sag and a crappy harsh feel. I used to work at a shop and we sold Intense, I was told by their rep that they would prefer to offer only shocks without pedal platforms because it messes up the performance of VPP, but customers want it because they feel they are getting a cheap shock if they don't have it. Single piv bikes I've owned in the past I used propedal every long climb even techy single track where you want your suspension active.

  19. #19
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    Thanks canuck_tacoma, looks like the Enduro is back in the running with that shock option!

    Yeah, I'm talking about smooth roads - even some pavement here and there. I wouldn't use a lockout on rutted or washboarded fire roads. I'm a sit and spin guy, not into mashing my way up anything longer than 100 feet or so!

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by locoyokel View Post
    Before anyone jumps down my throat - I'm not looking to use a lockout on rough trails, but on big climbs on smooth jeep roads & fire roads (really, really big climbs).

    I'm considering going up to AM from XC. Looked around a bit and the Enduro comp is already straining the limit of my budget - but not only is there no lockout, the lbs guy said they don't even make lockouts for AM rear shocks.

    Is that true? Any affordable 8.5" rear shocks with lockouts? Couldn't find any looking at some online retailers.

    My '07 stumpjumper FSR comp is 30.2 lbs (even my old hardtail is 30lbs) and I'm really not worried about big climbs on a 32 lb bike. Yes, I am crazy...
    Forget the lockout. A good four bar with a properly tuned shock shouldn't require a lockout. I had an 08 Enduro and never even once felt like I needed one on climbs, smooth or otherwise. And that went for long fire road climbs as well . Just sit and spin. See if you can demo an Enduro for the day and try it out with the stock shock. No reason to drop coin on a shock if you dont need to. That and I am pretty sure the fox on the Enduro has a "custom" eye to eye and stroke. That means you would have a hard time finding an aftermarket shock with the right measurements.

  21. #21
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    Just sit and spin

    Yeah well most dualies today pedal pretty decent when you sit and spin. Standing up to hammer is when lockout works great, especially on smooth climbs. I think active suspension is faster than locked out on knarly climbs but on smooth terrain, you can't beat a firm platform or lockout both front and back. On my bike if I am approaching a steep relatively smooth climb, I will use the floodgate on the front and rear for a nice firm feel so I can stand up and hammer. My shock has lockout, floodgate, and wide open positions accessed by a lever. My fork has pushloc so both ends will open up if I hit something but will stay nice and firm otherwise.

  22. #22
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    I had Roco TST coil on my Intense 6.6 which had three setting. Climbing-AM-DH. The firmest "climbing" setting was a pretty rigid lock out. I only used it for smooth pavement or fireroad climbs. I have no idea if it comes in the right size for the Enduro.

    Doesn't Specialized's Brain Shock come on the Enduro? Don't know much about Special Ed.

    You ought to test ride a Mojo HD, Pivot Firebird, Mach 5.75 or Turner 5 spot. I am blown away at how firm these dw-link bikes feel on smooth climbs and standing sprints. Plus, the anti-squat is for real....at least in this situation.
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  23. #23
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    In my Nomad2 I have a Marzocchi Roco TST Air which has five settings and as KRob said "CL" position is pretty much a lockout. Even in the "DH" position I don't feel much bobbing while pedaling but I'd say the lockout is nice to have if you need to ride several miles on pavement.

    I bought mine from eBay - a brand new shock for $200.

    Btw. this is an air shock which weighs 500g (8.5x2.5"). Could this be categorized as an all mountain shock?

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by pinkrobe View Post
    Get a bike with the Fox RP23 rear shock. Setting the ProPedal to 3 should give you a pretty stiff ride to the top, and you can flip the lever for cush on the way down.

    yep, the RP23 like said above does a great job at keeping the bike just stiff enough to motor up those long fire road climbs, and/or stand mash it out.. Lock out is for *****'s if you want it locked out get a HT!

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tema View Post
    In my Nomad2 I have a Marzocchi Roco TST Air which has five settings ...
    Oh yeah, I guess it did have five settings. There were two in between each of the three "named" settings. It's been awhile since I had that bike.

    How do you like the Roco Air on you Nomad?
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  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by locoyokel View Post
    Thanks canuck_tacoma, looks like the Enduro is back in the running with that shock option!

    Yeah, I'm talking about smooth roads - even some pavement here and there. I wouldn't use a lockout on rutted or washboarded fire roads. I'm a sit and spin guy, not into mashing my way up anything longer than 100 feet or so!
    Hey locoyokel,

    If you're talking about the 2010 or 2011 Enduro then I believe this is the hot ticket for what you said you want:

    http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=691124

    I'm using the same shock on my 2007 Enduro SL Pro and I can't say enough good things about it!

    Enjoy the journey!

    Michael
    If you can't keep the rubber side down......at least smile for the camera!

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by KRob View Post
    How do you like the Roco Air on you Nomad?
    I'm happy with the Roco. IMHO it's way better than DHX Air. Smooth, no mid-stroke wallow, noticably better rear wheel tracking.

  28. #28
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    If you want something cheap, I recommend looking into a Rock Shox MC3R. Its basically the predecessor to the Monarch, and can be had for much cheaper (~$150). Mine had a pretty firm lockout, much better than the Fox RP23 that it replaced.
    I got mine from Hippie Tech Suspension in Boise, Idaho for about $175 including rebuild/custom tuning and shipping.

    Just my two cents

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by pfox90 View Post
    Yep Scott and C'dale.
    As far as I know Cannondale's AM bike Jekyll, have a remot travel adjustment settings from 150 to 90mm. But no Lockout setting!

    Scott Genius also have 2 travel settings AND a lockout setting, that locks the shock fully extended.
    That makes a big difference on steep and long climbs.
    It not only 100% power efficient (Specializeds Brain shock is the only other way to get to 100% besides on a hardtail). The main advantage you get from a tru lockout when climbing steeeeep, is that the geometry of the bike has allot to say on how much energy you have to waist on maintaining front wheel traction when climbing.
    My old Genius outclimbes my new RP23 equiped Abracadabra on steep smooth climbes. But on technicla climbes, or any other terrain it's another story..

    Is the lockout on the Float RPL locking the shock fully extended?
    Is there any other shocks that have the 3 modes -> 100% lockout, Propedal an Open.?
    Is it possible to get the RP23 modified / "push'd" to lockout 100% and extended in the 3'rd PP setting?

  30. #30
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    @lococoyote
    It gets confusing with all the terminology of each manufacturer, Pro pedal, Floodgate, Lock out etc.
    It took me a long time to figure out my suspension for climbs, descents and trail riding.
    I have a Rock Shox Pike fork with U-turn ( adjustable travel) and Monarch rear with Flood gate
    If I turn the flood gate full on, my rear suspension totally locks out, the forks will give to hits but prevent the pedal bob, What I found most helpful on the climbs was the adjustable front fork. dropping down from 140 to 100 mms really helped on extended climbs.

    coindicdently while I was being a lookyloo at my LBS they showed me the Spesh Enduro, Nice but no lock out, and no Talas, I hope it has propedal!

    Keep looking around some bikes in the AM category come with Talas. check out the Trek Remedy.

    Have fun! It never ends!

  31. #31
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    my scott ransom 10 has a rear shock lock out. and the lyrik uturn fork allows me to set the fork to 115 and the rear locked out. you can do your fireroad climb and let everything out and bomb down the trail. it really makes a difference on the 10 mile fs road climbs to get to the good backcountry stuff. if the road is real washboardy you can set the rear shock to 3 inches of travel with the propedal set up and be good togo.

  32. #32
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    I have the DXH 5.0 Air, and i climb fire roads with the pro pedal just fine. Steep jeep trails, everything. I recommend it, because its butter on the way down too.

  33. #33
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    I'm considering going up to AM from XC. Looked around a bit and the Enduro comp is already straining the limit of my budget - but not only is there no lockout, the lbs guy said they don't even make lockouts for AM rear shocks.

    Is that true? Any affordable 8.5" rear shocks with lockouts? Couldn't find any looking at some online retailers.



    I have an 2011 Specialized Comp and it has the float RP2 with lockout. i am in complete opposite of you, i went from DH to AM. All the local stuff here is totally ridable on 6" of travel. the only thing i have to do with my comp is fiddle with bar width and added a Specialized adjustable seat post. my biggest learning curve is the getting use to the weight difference. my DH was pushing the 42 lbs mark, and my comp is just pushing the 31 lbs mark. i strongly recommend the Specialized Comp, but shop around to get the best price. i've heard of guys getting the bike for under 2500.00

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