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  1. #1

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    Winter footwear

    Hey! Can i get some advice about winter footwear please?

    I have decided (but not ordered as yet) these boots, to be combined with NEOS trekker overboots.

    http://lonelyplanet.altrec.com/shop/detail/40270/

    What socks would be best to wear? Would a liner sock and thick woollen socks be ok? Or do I need neoprene socks?

    Cheers

  2. #2
    Wood chips are stupid
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    wiggle room

    Quote Originally Posted by NickyB
    Hey! Can i get some advice about winter footwear please?

    I have decided (but not ordered as yet) these boots, to be combined with NEOS trekker overboots.

    http://lonelyplanet.altrec.com/shop/detail/40270/

    What socks would be best to wear? Would a liner sock and thick woollen socks be ok? Or do I need neoprene socks?

    Cheers
    circulation before insulation.


    akdeluxe
    "Trust me,you don't want a big baby."

    JT

  3. #3
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    hmmm, i love my lake boots. i can still clip in. and i like thicker fluffier winter hiking socks (not neoprene) from REI. make sure you buy a size larger than your regular shoes. bring along an instant heat packet too. you'll only get caught once in the cold before you realize how good those are.

  4. #4
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    i really like the lake shoes as well, but i haven't had them in sub zero(farenheit) temps yet. neos overboots work great with regular running shoes. if you want to wear boots with them you need to order a size larger than you would normally get. i have a pair of extra large, and my 13 running shoes fit in fine, but boots don't. plus side though is that with midweight wool socks, running shoes and neos, my feet sweat at 10 degrees just standing around.

  5. #5
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    Most front- to mid-pack- riders in both the 50K and the 100 ride clipless pedals- the same set they use for summer riding. This necessitates an appropriate winter boot (one exception-- Jay Petervary had a MacGyver-style modified boot for his Nome ride last year). Lake is the current favorite, though I'm excited by Pearl Izumi's new GTX Winter boot and await some feedback from other riders.

    I took a pair of the old Sidi winter boots to McGrath in 1998 and was happy even at 20 below zero Farenheit. But that's just me.

    I still counsel to use clipless and some oversized winter cycling boots with a liner sock+wool sock+ neoprene sock. This should keep you toasty. If you feel a bit of numbness in the toes, get off and run with your bike for a couple of hundred meters. This jogging has tremendous restorative power in that gets warm blood to the feet.

    If you stay properly hydrated and don't over-dress to the point of turning into a human sauna, you'll fly over the 50K course without a care.

    As we like to say: no sweat in the Arctic.

  6. #6

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    Word.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jacquesboutet
    Most front- to mid-pack- riders in both the 50K and the 100 ride clipless pedals- the same set they use for summer riding. This necessitates an appropriate winter boot (one exception-- Jay Petervary had a MacGyver-style modified boot for his Nome ride last year). Lake is the current favorite, though I'm excited by Pearl Izumi's new GTX Winter boot and await some feedback from other riders.

    I took a pair of the old Sidi winter boots to McGrath in 1998 and was happy even at 20 below zero Farenheit. But that's just me.

    I still counsel to use clipless and some oversized winter cycling boots with a liner sock+wool sock+ neoprene sock. This should keep you toasty. If you feel a bit of numbness in the toes, get off and run with your bike for a couple of hundred meters. This jogging has tremendous restorative power in that gets warm blood to the feet.

    If you stay properly hydrated and don't over-dress to the point of turning into a human sauna, you'll fly over the 50K course without a care.

    As we like to say: no sweat in the Arctic.
    Listen to the gospel from a zen master.....

  7. #7

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    Thanks

    I was going with hiking style boots as I am more likely to use them again. As I'm pretty new to winter cycling, I didnt really want to spend my money on winter cycling shoes then hate the sport.

    I get cold feet all the time no matter how warm my core is, so wanted to get as much insulation as possible on my feet (obviously without cutting off the circulation that is needed). With having cold feet all the time I dont really notice anymore how cold they are but I'm hoping that if they are numb I will notice this. Either that or I shall just stop and run along at regular intervals to make sure I am not having any problems.

    Hydration is a key factor to prevent hyprothermia so I will keep on top of that at all times! I'm currently sorting myself out for the amount of layers I need when we go off at the weekends so I'm hoping I will have that worked out! I'd rather work harder to keep warm than dress too heavily!! That should make me faster and actually finish in a respectable time!

    Thanks for all the help guys
    Nicky

  8. #8
    No, that's not phonetic
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    I'm surprised more folks don't use these as a starting point when building a footwear system:



    We have been riding these in Kodiak for a few years now and they are superb. Way nicer than the Lakes or Gaernes I also own. The fit is just brilliant, and they sell for considerably less than the other winter boots go for. Brandscycle.com has them for $160 a pair, and they are gore-tex.
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  9. #9
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    Short answer as to "why not?"- On average, Kodiak is 10-20 degrees warmer than Flathorn Lake ....and sometimes quite a bit nicer than that. If it weren't for the 70 inches of rain you get every year, we'd all live there!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by NickyB
    I was going with hiking style boots as I am more likely to use them again. As I'm pretty new to winter cycling, I didnt really want to spend my money on winter cycling shoes then hate the sport.

    I get cold feet all the time no matter how warm my core is, so wanted to get as much insulation as possible on my feet (obviously without cutting off the circulation that is needed). With having cold feet all the time I dont really notice anymore how cold they are but I'm hoping that if they are numb I will notice this. Either that or I shall just stop and run along at regular intervals to make sure I am not having any problems.

    Hydration is a key factor to prevent hyprothermia so I will keep on top of that at all times! I'm currently sorting myself out for the amount of layers I need when we go off at the weekends so I'm hoping I will have that worked out! I'd rather work harder to keep warm than dress too heavily!! That should make me faster and actually finish in a respectable time!

    Thanks for all the help guys
    Nicky
    That's fair. I use the above Lake system, but I climb with people who get cold feet no matter what (even with double boots and heaters). If your feet tend to get very cold easily , and you have addressed circulation issues, then the Lake is probably not going to work that well for you.

    That being said, I think those boots with or without over boots will work well. Try to keep the bulk down and keep some wiggle room in them in addition to space for thicker socks (I am using thick padded climbing socks). My Lakes are 1 size bigger than normal.

  11. #11

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    Thanks

    Thanks everyone! I'm going to go with original idea of the NF boots and NEOS. I use platform pedals so I cant use the clipless shoes and there doesnt seem to be enough insulation for my feet.

    Im going to get a size bigger and get either really warm hiking socks or fleece socks with a thin liner! Hopefully that will do the trick, damn cold feet!!

  12. #12
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    Lakes

    I've never done any winter racing, but I've been winter riding in Alaska for over 20 years, for what that's worth. Lake's and clipless don't work for me-I freeze my feet. If I'm riding when it's icy, I use an old pair of Salomon climbing boots (with screws in the soles) and platform pedals. If it's below zero, I use an old pair of boots (no screws!) with Neos. Something else to chew on...

  13. #13
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    I wish

    I really wish I could wear Lakes on the long cold rides. My feet get cold too easy. On short local rides,I can get away with a cycling shoe type set up. But,not if it's really cold. I finally switched to great big light duty hiking boots. Four sizes too big,one pair of heavy weight wool socks. So far so good. Next up are gators for slogging. No more cold feet


    akdeluxe
    "Trust me,you don't want a big baby."

    JT

  14. #14
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    Pat agrees with Deluxe

    I agree with everything Deluxe says whether it's true or not.

    Circulation is more important than insulation, so if you don't have enough of the former in clipless shoes, then go with a platform and big footwear. You'll enjoy your rides alot more if your feets are happy.

    I've always used platforms in winter and never regretted it, even when racing...no offense Jaques. To each his own......

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by patirwin
    I agree with everything Deluxe says whether it's true or not.

    Circulation is more important than insulation, so if you don't have enough of the former in clipless shoes, then go with a platform and big footwear. You'll enjoy your rides alot more if your feets are happy.

    I've always used platforms in winter and never regretted it, even when racing...no offense Jaques. To each his own......

    I love you Pat

    akdeluxe
    "Trust me,you don't want a big baby."

    JT

  16. #16

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    Really.

    Quote Originally Posted by akdeluxe
    I love you Pat

    akdeluxe

    We all do.

  17. #17
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    Boot I really like here

    Only $60 and they hold up very well.
    I buy 3-4 sizes too big. Sealskin sock covered by a Patagonia expedition weight sock

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by pbasinger
    I buy 3-4 sizes too big.
    too bad no size 17's
    Pete, why sealskins? technically the membrane is breathable so it woun't act as a VB... interesting.

    my plan this winter is to cut up and add 1" of height to the lower part of a pair of Neos so I can fit more insulation in them. If I ever get around to it I'll post the resulting hack.

    ps - pat and akdeluke, you're getting me all choked up and emotional.. save it for the right moment.

  19. #19
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    Pete, what do you know about it-you're in Wisconsin. By the way, the new Shimano's are every bit the boot the Lakes are, plus cheaper and better quality, but they're not $160-that is the old style boot. For me, as long as it's got a plastic sole, I'm getting cold feet, cleat or not. NickyB, if you have cold feet, go with running shoes and Neos, or any non-cycling winter boot you like.
    Speedway Cycles owner http://fatbackbikes.com

  20. #20
    is buachail foighneach me
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    my soon to be maybe winter shoe setup:

    i'm unfortunately in the same situation as eric regarding size, so finding something with loads of extra room isn't an easy option. so, i decided to try something.

    ordered a pair of size 15(biggest i could find) spd sandals. they're made by keen. they arrived, i cut them with a scissor. i'm gonna try modifying a pacboot liner to fit inside of them. going to sew/glue in a waterproof outer cover with a fairly thick wool felt sole. going for extra long gaitors too.

    unfortunately the sandals run narrow, but cutting the straps down the middle should allow me enough room for the liner and some circulation. regardless they should at least be warmer than the lakes.

  21. #21
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    sean, my current setup is a sorel linner glued to a running shoe sole, all inside the neos. I think it is similar to your current idea. I had the same overlap problem, foam or other dense rubber works to fill in the overhang.

  22. #22
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    are you running them clipless? some kind of plate inside the neos with a shaved sole? i wish i could find some e width size 16 or 17 spd sandals... would make it a hell of alot easier to make a pac-style cycling shoe.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bearbait
    too bad no size 17's
    Pete, why sealskins? technically the membrane is breathable so it woun't act as a VB... interesting.

    my plan this winter is to cut up and add 1" of height to the lower part of a pair of Neos so I can fit more insulation in them. If I ever get around to it I'll post the resulting hack.

    ps - pat and akdeluke, you're getting me all choked up and emotional.. save it for the right moment.

    Yeah, you big feet guys are kind of screwed.
    So I never read the product info on the Sealskins, Iíve just had them in my kit forever and didnít realize they are supposed to breath. Maybe they do, but not very much and they work as a vapor barrier pretty well. I cannot do a true vb, but the Sealskins seem to be a good in between. My outer layers stay dry, my foot doesnít get too clammy, and they have a liner built in so theyíre great for blister prevention.

  24. #24
    No, that's not phonetic
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    Quote Originally Posted by thirstywork
    $160-that is the old style boot.
    Doh, time to stock up on the old ones!
    My video techniques can be found in this thread.

  25. #25
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    no, no clipless. I like platforms for winter for just being able to jump on and have a big target.

    mesotony has a freak neos clipless setup he posted here once, maybe he'll post the photo again of the shoe goo monstrosity.

  26. #26
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    You guys are seriously overthinking this. You're far better off just getting used to both the idea and the reality of having frozen feet.

  27. #27
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    Steger mukluks

    ... get some Steger mukluks. I have been using these for years. They're warm, light, and highly water resistant. When used with platform pedals they work great. Your feet stay warm, but they're light enough to run in if needed. Check them out at www.mukluks.com .

    Stop fooling around cutting and gluing and all that crap, the product you want is already available.


    Eric- you should be making these!

    Ak29
    Singletrack Advocates Anchorage, Alaska
    Susitna 100 "Race Across Frozen Alaska"

  28. #28
    is buachail foighneach me
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    i didn't see the spd mukluks on that site....

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bearbait
    no, no clipless. I like platforms for winter for just being able to jump on and have a big target.

    mesotony has a freak neos clipless setup he posted here once, maybe he'll post the photo again of the shoe goo monstrosity.

    i've seen tony's setup, but it would be good to see it up here as an example of some sweet alaskan frankenfootwear. any glueing i do will be for waterproofness/keeping snow out of where it doesn't belong. heavy duty nylon thread will be what actually holds everything together.

  30. #30
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    shoe goo frankenfootwear

    Quote Originally Posted by Bearbait
    mesotony has a freak neos clipless setup he posted here once, maybe he'll post the photo again of the shoe goo monstrosity.
    Quote Originally Posted by sean salach
    i've seen tony's setup, but it would be good to see it up here as an example of some sweet alaskan frankenfootwear.
    OK already, here is the offending footwear again:

    After three winters, the shoe goo seperated at the toe on a certain 18 mile walk-a-bike/12 mile ride-a-bike I did last February...

    These were warm to about -15 F - but a pain to put on.

    I am going with platforms and Neos over some warmer boots - want something warm , stiff enough to pedal and supportive enough for long slogs.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    "I get a buzz from being cold and wet ~ the pleasure seems to balance out the pain" - Blue, Red and Grey The Who By Numbers

  31. #31
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    AK 29 - how do the softer Steiger soles hold up to the points on platform pedals?

  32. #32
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    ... better than you would think

    The rubber outsoles on the Steger mukluks is soft enough for the pins in platform pedals to grab into, but firm enough and durable enough to not be damaged.

    Alas, Sean, no spd compatable models available that I'm aware of.

    Ak29
    Singletrack Advocates Anchorage, Alaska
    Susitna 100 "Race Across Frozen Alaska"

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