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  1. #1

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    building my own downhill-trail

    I really miss going into the woods and just workin on trails, and wouldn't mind just settin somethin up myself here.
    However when i was livin in germany, we would just go to the closest mountain and start buildin whatever we wanted. after readin through this forum, i got the impression that alot of the land is regulated around here. So i don't really know where there is a possibility of doing this, without having the man upon my back.
    so just looking for some tips on where building would be possible, if anywhere?
    And people who might be willing to build a fun little trail!

  2. #2
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    It's actually really simple around here. If you don't own the land yourself, you better make sure you have the right permits/permission before you do much of anything related to building a trail or building "features" into an existing trail. Depending on who/what owns the land will determine what you need to be allowed to build a trail (Muni, State, Feds, Private).

    People, most prominantly the STA group, have done a lot to improve the image of bikers around here. The single biggest thing that can ruin the reputation and undo the great work that they have done is to go out and start building trails or features without the proper approval and permits.

    It's unfortunate, but that's the way it is. If you do want to pursue building of new trails, Janice who heads up STA would be a good resource to start with and could help to point you in the right direction.

  3. #3
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    rogue building isn't allowed anywhere as far as i know. especially not in the anchorage area. the only real way to do it in the states without making access more difficult in the future is to do it through the proper channels. as anchskier said, start with STA.

  4. #4
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    It's really...

    not all that easy either. Let's say you go rogue and try to build trails. the clearing, drainage, and maintenance someone would have to do on a trail they decide to build would be unmanageable and probably just jack up the land they are working on. I have adopted a trail in town to work on and have spent a ton of time up there keeping it clear the last several years. That is an already established trail. More trails are on the way man. Be patient grasshopper. Until then, help maintain the ones we have. There are plenty to keep busy with.
    "Having lack of self-preservation makes biking more fun."

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    "Making" social trails is a welcome endeavor, at least for those of us who don't need constructo-trails. As long as you don't actually build anything like ramps or jumps, go out and find a new route, put in a trail, tell people about it so they can use it and pack it down. I think it would be great.

    "Social" trails are the best trails anyway; let's have more of them! I'm so sick of constructed/groomed/installed trails, I can't even say it. What is mountain biking coming to when people have to ask what direction they're allowed to travel on a TRAIL?

    ETA: STA is a special interest group(made up of folks that really seem to like that cross-country skier 'only ride where we say and when we say' mentality) and doesn't represent all bikers. I know that it's hard for the STA mouthpieces to realize that, but them's the breaks.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Chick
    "Making" social trails is a welcome endeavor, at least for those of us who don't need constructo-trails. As long as you don't actually build anything like ramps or jumps, go out and find a new route, put in a trail, tell people about it so they can use it and pack it down. I think it would be great.

    "Social" trails are the best trails anyway; let's have more of them! I'm so sick of constructed/groomed/installed trails, I can't even say it. What is mountain biking coming to when people have to ask what direction they're allowed to travel on a TRAIL?

    ETA: STA is a special interest group(made up of folks that really seem to like that cross-country skier 'only ride where we say and when we say' mentality) and doesn't represent all bikers. I know that it's hard for the STA mouthpieces to realize that, but them's the breaks.
    Fat Chick,you are wrong about social trails and STA.Sure,some social trails can be fun to ride.But,as with all lazyness, it pisses everyone else off,and a great deal of everyone else can make life hard for us mountian bikers. STA isn't telling you where or how to ride. STA is trying to build legal and sustainable trails for mt bikers to use. Just ask anyone on any forum in any town which approach works best for biking in their area. As with any user group,working close with other users and the local officials in the area in a constructive manner will always produce the best results. It is not the easiest approach,but it is the best.Yes,you could say I am a STA mouthpiece. Who do you rep

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  7. #7
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    Thanks Dee Lux

    Well said. In addition, the types of trails these "rogue builders" are cutting through the forest suck anyway. Not because they are too difficult (I definitely don't need a "constructo trail") but because they plain suck. So, Fat Chick, since the new trails suck I guess you'll be keeping to the "social trails" that are so much fun? Maybe the coastal trail and the crap that has been built off of that? Kind of an odd stance you have bashing what STA has done while supporting crap trail building. Mysterious.

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  8. #8
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    STA Borgmember

    You're right: STA is a special interest group. The organization seems 'Specially Interested in making killer trails for mountain biking and still friendly enough to share with other user groups.

    All I know is that the planning that must have gone into trail placement must have been excruciatingly deliberate. These trails are GENIUS in their layout. It's obvious that every effort was made to get maximum geograpical utilization while still avoiding low spots that would have created mudholes. I can't imagine what kind of anxiety the designers and builders went through to choose the routes of these trails. It probably would have driven most regular people bonkers; thankfully cooler heads were involved and the result is this fabulous trail system. The more they are ridden and the more familiar I get with them, the more enjoyable they become. Seems to me that moose-generated game (or 'social') trails are not terribly impressive. But you can't expect much from an animal with zombie-like intelligence (except a large backstrap and some filets mignon. Those are good).

    Enjoy Social Alder-Bashing and Mud-Slogging Club-membership as long as you want, then when you're sick of it come ride the real trails. You will still be welcome there and nobody will hold it against you.

    If you choose to take the Higher Path (like the STA trails are built upon) you could find yourself supporting the advancement of Phase Two which was approved last year yet now sits precariously on the verge of being placed on the chopping block. When the local politico reconvenes on the subject, it would be great if we all attend that meeting en masse to show that Anchorage mountain bikers want more trails. Show up and talk or just show up and say, "Yeah!" when the spirit leads you. And have some Kool-Aid, it's scrumptious.

    You want to be a part of this. It will give your life purpose. You will be a part of something greater than yourself. You will be accepted. You will be liked. It will make you a successful citizen. Everyone will want to be your friend. Fulfillment will be yours.

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  9. #9

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    How does one go from Germany to AK? Where in Germany were you?

  10. #10

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    I whent out riding yesterday, and scouted the trails leading of gasline trail (southern intermidiat,ilama etc) was actually really impressed. trails seemed kinda washed out from snow melt, but they were deffinetly fun. Mad props to who worked on these trail!

    However as a freeride, Downhill biker, i would enjoy having some drops, jumps, logrides, etc. I know that our style of biking is still not as recognized as cross country MTB. But its growing and i dont see a diffrence between setting up a trail such as the ones i road yesterday, and having a nice trails with jump and drops.
    I would love to get involved in whatever is needed, just don't really know where to go and who to talk to.

    i grwe up here my first couple years, moved to frankfurt( because of parents work, not military) got sick of the city life, and i needed to satisfy my hunger for fluffy powder. and college kinda played a roll,

  11. #11

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    Ahh, I'm in Dresden now and head around a lot.

  12. #12

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    doing any biking around germany?? how you end up in dresden?

  13. #13

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    Hah, don't ask. Long story. Former east and the NPD-nazi capital to boot. I added Vatertag Wochenende to the list of days I couldn't go out because the Dresdners look for foreigners on this weekend to attack. So we went to Prag. We were supposed to go to Willingen and Winterberg, but we had some scheduling problems. We're heading up North this weekend and maybe we'll find some riding there.

  14. #14
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    Fun stuff such as log rides are not off the discussion table. STA tuned and you might see such features showing up interlaced among these trails (sparingly and legally, of course) if we play our cards right.

  15. #15
    Wood chips are stupid
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alhansen
    You're right: STA is a special interest group. The organization seems 'Specially Interested in making killer trails for mountain biking and still friendly enough to share with other user groups.

    All I know is that the planning that must have gone into trail placement must have been excruciatingly deliberate. These trails are GENIUS in their layout. It's obvious that every effort was made to get maximum geograpical utilization while still avoiding low spots that would have created mudholes. I can't imagine what kind of anxiety the designers and builders went through to choose the routes of these trails. It probably would have driven most regular people bonkers; thankfully cooler heads were involved and the result is this fabulous trail system. The more they are ridden and the more familiar I get with them, the more enjoyable they become. Seems to me that moose-generated game (or 'social') trails are not terribly impressive. But you can't expect much from an animal with zombie-like intelligence (except a large backstrap and some filets mignon. Those are good).

    Enjoy Social Alder-Bashing and Mud-Slogging Club-membership as long as you want, then when you're sick of it come ride the real trails. You will still be welcome there and nobody will hold it against you.

    If you choose to take the Higher Path (like the STA trails are built upon) you could find yourself supporting the advancement of Phase Two which was approved last year yet now sits precariously on the verge of being placed on the chopping block. When the local politico reconvenes on the subject, it would be great if we all attend that meeting en masse to show that Anchorage mountain bikers want more trails. Show up and talk or just show up and say, "Yeah!" when the spirit leads you. And have some Kool-Aid, it's scrumptious.

    You want to be a part of this. It will give your life purpose. You will be a part of something greater than yourself. You will be accepted. You will be liked. It will make you a successful citizen. Everyone will want to be your friend. Fulfillment will be yours.

    [Still,] Allen Hansen
    Right on.
    Moose strap kicks butt.


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  16. #16

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    Just out of curiousity, what would make these features illigal?

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by thegerman
    Just out of curiousity, what would make these features illigal?
    Janice could probably speak better to that, but...

    I think it would be anything that is not included in the permit that was approved for the construction of the trail. Typically, when someone applies for a trail building permit, they have to include plans for where and what type of trail will be constructed. This would usually include the type of trail (including features) that is planned to be used. When granting the permit, those are taken into account. That means, that if you put something in that wasn't approved as part of the permit, you are in violation, thus "illegal". There may be ways to modify the previous permits or get new ones that would allow additional features to be added if that is desired, so where we are at is not necessarily the end of things by any means.

  18. #18

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    so tecnicaly speaking, it would be possible for me to got to STA (??) and if i have a whell presented plan for a single track with features on it. it could be possible to get permit and actually build a freeride trail.
    Basically all that is preventing anything like that is a permit??

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by thegerman
    so tecnicaly speaking, it would be possible for me to got to STA (??) and if i have a whell presented plan for a single track with features on it. it could be possible to get permit and actually build a freeride trail.
    Basically all that is preventing anything like that is a permit??
    That is the simple way to look at it. Yes, permits are the things that are keeping it from happening, they just aren't all that easy to get. STA is not the one granting the permits, but rather the "owner" of the land such as BLM, State, Feds, Muni, etc... who would need to grant the permits. STA just has the recent experience of going through the process and has proven successful in recent times in getting the necessary permits to do that kind of work. They would be the first ones I would contact to know where to start the process and what kind of approach to take that would have the best chance at success. No reason to re-invent the wheel, so to speak.

  20. #20
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    STA doesn't have any plans to build a freeride park or a new downhill trail. But we are considering adding some built features to the existing trail network, i.e. log rides. Anchskier is correct. We would still need to get permission to build such things.

    Contact Greg at Speedway Cycles because he has some ideas also.

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    People, seriously, not everyone likes the same things. Deal. The NSTAA would like to brainwash the parks folks into thinking that everyone wants thirty-foot-wide overgroomed ski-only trails for the winter and weaving back and forth and back and forth and back and forth down a hill for the summer. Not all people like these things. But the NSTAA does not care; it would have all trails turned into the kind of trails IT wants.

    They don't speak for all bikers and yes I think the new trails are "meh". Forgive me for wanting a trail that actually GOES somewhere instead of turning an acre of woods into a hamster wheel for bikes.

    Long live the social trail; roots, bugs, mudholes, and bushwhacking and all. If you're not tough enough for the roots and technical aspects of the much-maligned social trails, by all means, stay on the NSTAA trails. But don't keep mowing down more and more areas and watering down more and more trails and expect everyone to applaud.

    And yes. Really sick of being accosted in parking lots and treated to long winded speeches about why I should join Dirt Divas since I am female and have a bike evidently there's no way I could possibly enjoy riding alone, and I should make donations to NSTAA and OMG have I seen the new trails they're so neat and ooooh, be careful because there might be MUD so don't ride unless we say it's OK and golly don't piss the skiers off, and if you're not doing what we think you should be doing you are a ROGUE and a bad person and are RUINING the REPUTATION of mountain bikers worldwide.

    Get over yourselves please.

  22. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by thegerman
    so tecnicaly speaking, it would be possible for me to got to STA (??) and if i have a whell presented plan for a single track with features on it. it could be possible to get permit and actually build a freeride trail.
    Basically all that is preventing anything like that is a permit??
    NO you do not have to go to STA. You can apply to the muni or to the park for a permit all by yourself. STA wants you to believe you can't do it yourself. But watch, I bet they'll do all they can to block you if you try to get a permit without their holy blessing.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Chick
    People, seriously, not everyone likes the same things. Deal. The NSTAA would like to brainwash the parks folks into thinking that everyone wants thirty-foot-wide overgroomed ski-only trails for the winter and weaving back and forth and back and forth and back and forth down a hill for the summer. Not all people like these things. But the NSTAA does not care; it would have all trails turned into the kind of trails IT wants.

    They don't speak for all bikers and yes I think the new trails are "meh". Forgive me for wanting a trail that actually GOES somewhere instead of turning an acre of woods into a hamster wheel for bikes.

    Long live the social trail; roots, bugs, mudholes, and bushwhacking and all. If you're not tough enough for the roots and technical aspects of the much-maligned social trails, by all means, stay on the NSTAA trails. But don't keep mowing down more and more areas and watering down more and more trails and expect everyone to applaud.

    And yes. Really sick of being accosted in parking lots and treated to long winded speeches about why I should join Dirt Divas since I am female and have a bike evidently there's no way I could possibly enjoy riding alone, and I should make donations to NSTAA and OMG have I seen the new trails they're so neat and ooooh, be careful because there might be MUD so don't ride unless we say it's OK and golly don't piss the skiers off, and if you're not doing what we think you should be doing you are a ROGUE and a bad person and are RUINING the REPUTATION of mountain bikers worldwide.

    Get over yourselves please.
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Chick
    People, seriously, not everyone likes the same things. Deal. The NSTAA would like to brainwash the parks folks into thinking that everyone wants thirty-foot-wide overgroomed ski-only trails for the winter and weaving back and forth and back and forth and back and forth down a hill for the summer. Not all people like these things. But the NSTAA does not care; it would have all trails turned into the kind of trails IT wants.

    They don't speak for all bikers and yes I think the new trails are "meh". Forgive me for wanting a trail that actually GOES somewhere instead of turning an acre of woods into a hamster wheel for bikes.

    Long live the social trail; roots, bugs, mudholes, and bushwhacking and all. If you're not tough enough for the roots and technical aspects of the much-maligned social trails, by all means, stay on the NSTAA trails. But don't keep mowing down more and more areas and watering down more and more trails and expect everyone to applaud.

    And yes. Really sick of being accosted in parking lots and treated to long winded speeches about why I should join Dirt Divas since I am female and have a bike evidently there's no way I could possibly enjoy riding alone, and I should make donations to NSTAA and OMG have I seen the new trails they're so neat and ooooh, be careful because there might be MUD so don't ride unless we say it's OK and golly don't piss the skiers off, and if you're not doing what we think you should be doing you are a ROGUE and a bad person and are RUINING the REPUTATION of mountain bikers worldwide.

    Get over yourselves please.

    NO you do not have to go to STA. You can apply to the muni or to the park for a permit all by yourself. STA wants you to believe you can't do it yourself. But watch, I bet they'll do all they can to block you if you try to get a permit without their holy blessing.
    Man she's funny! How do we keep her going? I'll bet beers work. Or wait, I know...

    The STA is not a world-wide organization (yet) and it is populated my humans who like to ride mountain bikes on narrow little skinny rooty rocky bloody bruisy steep scary trails, too. The Boss Lady of the STA is super cool and, personality-wise, none of what you suggest. It isn't easy to make rooty rocky technical trails but, crikey, you have to start somewhere. These happen to have started out kinda smooth. Oh well. They sure beat 'hamster-wheeling' back and forth on the Llama Trail 8 or 10 times.

    Also, those of us contributing to the advancement of the gene-pool need some easier stuff for our kids to ride so they get pumped on being outdoors. So lighten up a smidge, chickie-poo: the mtb world here is full of fun people. We drink beers, too, and use our middle fingers when necessary and fight back when The Man tries to keep us down. Nobody's harshin on your buzz, so stop being so mean to all the nice people.

    You said, "The new trails are 'meh'." That is totally cracking me up! Oops, I think I just wizzed a little!

    "Meh." Ha!

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    Finally someone who actually thinks in my direction, Thanx Fat chick for phrasing it the way you did!!!
    If the Idea of the trails is to get kids to be stoked on riding, well **** then don't give us beginner trails to get us exited and then stop at intermidiate. Its frustrating not to be able to advance your skills!! It gets booring after a while if you can't push your boundries.
    So for those who actually wan't a trail which will push them, well speak up. It's not gone build itself.
    Yeah we can wait for alyeska to open or we can start something intown!!

  26. #26
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    yep

    There is Alyeska. It is a start in the right direction. The next step is getting to build your own type of trails.It takes time and a lot of effort. It can be done. You might want to consider Peters Creek Valley,Ptarmigan Valley,the Park,Indian and a few others for locations.You might be able to escape the NIMBY's in those areas. Not everyone is going to warm up to your type of trails. You could pave your trails with gold and some people would still complain. Gravity has been discused here a few times. It just has never gained the speed it needs. Janice just jumped in with both feet and ran with a goal and a idea of how to excute.. She found that the powers that be were very open to someone with poise, vision and a plan. STA proved it can be done and opened the door for others. Trust me, people wish the freeriders and downhillers the best. We all can agree on one thing,bikes are cool! How about a little Iggy!


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  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by thegerman
    Finally someone who actually thinks in my direction, Thanx Fat chick for phrasing it the way you did!!!
    If the Idea of the trails is to get kids to be stoked on riding, well **** then don't give us beginner trails to get us exited and then stop at intermidiate. Its frustrating not to be able to advance your skills!! It gets booring after a while if you can't push your boundries.
    So for those who actually wan't a trail which will push them, well speak up. It's not gone build itself.
    Yeah we can wait for alyeska to open or we can start something intown!!
    Well, I'll be the first apologize that we couldn't make the trails harder. We found 3 boulders out there, 2 of which might provide some fun for someone. Thegerman, have you done the boulder drop with the runout? I've yet to see a tire tread on that stunt yet we spent a lot of time trying to make it challenging for someone like you. In fact, why don't you PM me and we can arrange to go out there so I can take some photos of you being the first! Seriously. There's also a stair step boulder that we excavated that looks doable for someone of your considerable talents. Give me a day and time and I'll bring my camera. That would be so cool! Oh yeah, there's one more boulder but the landing is really flat. You'd need a lot of travel.

    Talk to you soon! I'll be waiting!

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Chick
    NO you do not have to go to STA. You can apply to the muni or to the park for a permit all by yourself. STA wants you to believe you can't do it yourself. But watch, I bet they'll do all they can to block you if you try to get a permit without their holy blessing.
    Wow. That's a butt-load of assumptions. So angry. But you're right about one thing--you do not have to go to STA. In fact, I'm all for people going out and "getting a permit all by yourself." I've suggested this very thing on other threads. There was a chunk of land up for grabs last year--the wheels seemed greased to make it happen. I hooked the freeriders up with the land owner. They latched onto it but for a variety of reasons it didn't happen. Freeride stuff would add to the mtb options that we have. Variety is good!

    If the freeriders and downhillers want their own stuff, then I am the first to encourage it. Your plan sounds simple to me, just go get your permit. Knock yourself out! It'd be cool to have others out there getting stuff done for a variety of mountain bikers. Riding, whatever your tribe, is great for anger management.

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by thegerman
    Finally someone who actually thinks in my direction, Thanx Fat chick for phrasing it the way you did!!!
    If the Idea of the trails is to get kids to be stoked on riding, well **** then don't give us beginner trails to get us exited and then stop at intermidiate. Its frustrating not to be able to advance your skills!! It gets booring after a while if you can't push your boundries.
    So for those who actually wan't a trail which will push them, well speak up. It's not gone build itself.
    Yeah we can wait for alyeska to open or we can start something intown!!

    I whent out riding yesterday, and scouted the trails leading of gasline trail (southern intermidiat,ilama etc) was actually really impressed. trails seemed kinda washed out from snow melt, but they were deffinetly fun. Mad props to who worked on these trail!
    Now I'm confused. You like them. You don't like them. Too easy. Didn't mention the boulder drops. I'm really serious, here. PM me and let's go ride them. Scratch that. you'll ride them and I'll take pictures. I want to post them here. Pictures speak louder than words. I'm pretty flexible, so just let me know when.

    You probably won't like Brown Bear trail either. Not enough ladders and root-wells, for sure, but it's a start.

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    Oooo I've been thinking about this for a couple of hours! I'm really tempted to try that stairstep boulder. Seems to me like all I need is to have my weight back far enough... but I've only got 4" of travel. You probably have 7", but you'll still be able to give me some pointers, right? Seriously. I'm ready! Where's my PM??? Definitely not ready for "Heath Ledger" as I've heard someone call it. Too chicken here. I like my wheels on the ground. But I'd like some info on these long travel bikes. Saw a friend of mine in Grand Junction slide up and down 5' boulders with no apparent effort. Looks pretty sweet to me!

  31. #31
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    coil over

    "I've only got 4" of travel. You probably have 7""

    ...actually, it's more like ten-inches... and it's very stiff...(lots 'o compression and rebound damping...what were you thinking?)

  32. #32
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    Have you done Heath Ledger? I'm really serious about this. I'd like to take some video.

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    no cameras alowed!

    Heath Ledger ? No, but I have ridden Amanda Hugginkiss...

  34. #34
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    Lol!!!

  35. #35
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    i like 'boulders', where are these boulders?

    my only real quam with trails so far in alaska is that every log crossing is removed asap. not log ride. log crossing, where a tree falls across a trail, sitting less than 2-3 feet high, and the branches are trimmed and maybe stacked in front of and behind it. makes for an excellent "TTF", an easy skill builder, easy to "construct", helps control the speed of users and not very dangerous at all. everywhere i've been in the lower 48 that has trees, has log crossings, and they're fun and typically stay. i was under the impression that it was an accepted part of mountain biking??

  36. #36

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    Damn i'm kinda stoked to find these boulders now, and yeah i defently enjoy the south advanced trail all the way down to Hill top trail head, Last part of that trails is the best!!!
    Where exactly are these boulders located?? What trail??

  37. #37
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    The boulder is on the lower advanced loop. Start up the red advanced trail from where the lower intermediate loop crosses the gasline and it isn't too far into the trail. The problem with it is there is no good way to get up speed unless your pedaling like mad. And as Janice pointed out the landing is a tad flat. If you had 7 inches of travel it would be no big deal. I'll show it to some of my buddies with bigger bikes, see if they can go over it.

  38. #38
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    I want to say as publicly as I can how grateful I am that Janice and company built these trails. They are the best mountain biking trails I have been on and just so much fun to ride. Janice has paved the way for much more development of ALL kinds of biking trails in the Anchorage area with her tireless efforts. So glad someone had the determination to actually get something done.

    Not sure how many of you remember what was going on about 5 years ago when the ski community was widening ALL of the narrow trails at Hilltop. I know I nearly blew a gasket when I saw what they did to Spencer's loop, but I didn't have the guts or work ethic to do anything about it. I will be showing up on Saturday to put in my meager 3 hours of work and so should everyone!!!

    Thank you again Janice, Anchorage is a better place because of your efforts, don't let anyone tell you otherwise!!!!

  39. #39
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    Heath Ledger

    QB, is that the short detour on one of the north trails (can't remember which one) that cuts back across the trail with the three foot boulder drop and 5 or 6 feet of vertical drop to the landing? It looks like kind of an off camber landing and immediate right-turn. I never really stop to scope it out because just looking at it makes my stomach feel all funny.

  40. #40
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    Forgive me for wanting a trail that actually GOES somewhere instead of turning an acre of woods into a hamster wheel for bikes.
    @ FatChick, I usually reserve this for dudes but you are an udder douche bag. I'm sorry but all the social trails I've encountered around FNBP aren't a whole hell of a lot different as far as being destinationally driven. They all circle around the swamps north of Airstrip road in some fasion or another. Sure they're fun but they ain't all that.

    And hypocritically speaking, I seem to recall a while back someone posting pics of riding blueberry knoll or something off the gasline and having you immediately call them out for riding on a "non-biking" trail. And now you're off talking about forging your own trails off through the mud and brush and who cares what anyone else thinks. You're a BIKER dammit!!! I give me a freakin' break. Somebody needs to stick a fork in you and let all the hot air out. Then we can change your name to SkinnyChick.

  41. #41
    Wood chips are stupid
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alhansen
    QB, is that the short detour on one of the north trails (can't remember which one) that cuts back across the trail with the three foot boulder drop and 5 or 6 feet of vertical drop to the landing? It looks like kind of an off camber landing and immediate right-turn. I never really stop to scope it out because just looking at it makes my stomach feel all funny.
    Yes. Thats the one.
    "Trust me,you don't want a big baby."

    JT

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alhansen
    QB, is that the short detour on one of the north trails (can't remember which one) that cuts back across the trail with the three foot boulder drop and 5 or 6 feet of vertical drop to the landing? It looks like kind of an off camber landing and immediate right-turn. I never really stop to scope it out because just looking at it makes my stomach feel all funny.
    There are two boulders on The Hornet's Nest. One is as you describe. The trail here makes a "figure 8." The upper segment has the boulder with the run-out. Everyone is using the obvious "chicken route" whether going up or downhill. The Boulder can be attempted when approaching from the uphill side--the runnout is just below. There is plenty of sight distance as it was basically an alder thicket that the trail builder mowed through to achieve good visibility.

    The other boulder is a stair-step boulder that can be taken if riding the Hornet's Nest in a northerly direction. It consists of two stairs--kakung/kakung-- with a hard left at the landing.

    The third boulder is on the Stinger. It is just a big boulder on a too-flat area that wouldn't be much fun to drop. The trail builder took the trail there because it was a rare find in this somewhat boulderless terrain. Wherever possible he wanted to take the rider to some nice feature--a boulder, a cool tree (the hemlock blew down in the wind storm) or a nice view.

  43. #43

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    So as i was biking up hilltop ski area, i though why not just build something here!
    Once again i have no idea who it belongs to, so i don't know who to talk to!
    Defenetly some fun terrain to build some jumps banks etc, anybody able to give me an update on who owns Hilltop ski area, and how i could contact the owner(s)

  44. #44
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    It is privately owned and I know the guy, can't think of his name right now, has often thought about retro fitting the lifts for bikes and opening in the summer. I think the cost would be too great and really you would only get like 5 minutes at best down the ski area. And I bet hardly anyone would pay the lift fee anyway...

    My point is the dude is interested in developing, it would be worth a phone call or two.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by onsite12a
    I want to say as publicly as I can how grateful I am that Janice and company built these trails. They are the best mountain biking trails I have been on and just so much fun to ride. Janice has paved the way for much more development of ALL kinds of biking trails in the Anchorage area with her tireless efforts. So glad someone had the determination to actually get something done.

    Not sure how many of you remember what was going on about 5 years ago when the ski community was widening ALL of the narrow trails at Hilltop. I know I nearly blew a gasket when I saw what they did to Spencer's loop, but I didn't have the guts or work ethic to do anything about it. I will be showing up on Saturday to put in my meager 3 hours of work and so should everyone!!!

    Thank you again Janice, Anchorage is a better place because of your efforts, don't let anyone tell you otherwise!!!!
    Compliments are awkward for me to take so I will simply say "thank you." There is a dedicated group of Steering Committee members who have been involved every step of the way who have helped us make difficult decisions and served as the core of this group. And there is a contingent of a couple of hundred mt. bikers interested in STA activities that have backed us up. Kudos go to ALL of you (x-c, freeride, dh-ers, whatever) for supporting the effort and for turning out on trail work days.

    Many hands make light work!

    See you Saturday.

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by onsite12a
    It is privately owned and I know the guy, can't think of his name right now, has often thought about retro fitting the lifts for bikes and opening in the summer. I think the cost would be too great and really you would only get like 5 minutes at best down the ski area. And I bet hardly anyone would pay the lift fee anyway...

    My point is the dude is interested in developing, it would be worth a phone call or two.
    I could see some fun made out of it, but would be far less than 5 minutes a run. It only takes 5 minutes to run (on foot) up to the top and that's not going full speed.

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    Scoped out the boulders over the past few days. Tried doing the stairstep with some speed but its just too sharp of a turn to hit the stairs even remotely head on, then the immediate turn at the landing would be tricky. Sessioned the 'figure 8' one for a few runs, got some good pictures, it's well done, easy to get speed and a pretty good landing, as long as you don't overshoot it. Then we headed over to the one on the stinger and made a couple approaches on it but couldn't get the cajones to send it. There's a small stairstep at the top of it which would send you off balance (especially at such slow speeds). Might be able to wheelie-drop it though... maybe next time.

    Sweet trails, I like the flow of them, even with clunker-heavy bikes going up them wasn't that bad. Really fun on the downhills. Good job for STA getting those going.

  48. #48

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    Yeah i agree with you Drzaous!! i hit the drop on stinger but its just sketchy, unless you wheely drop it, you just end up going nose first!! i still havent found the big one. on hornets nest, maybe someone could give me a better describtion to where it is.
    (Is it before or after the crossing with llama)??

  49. #49

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    To get to the one on hornet's nest go down gasline and do the shortcut into hornet's nest, and make a left at the trail junction. It's somewhere in there, it's obvious since the trail makes the figure-8 that was described above. It's probably a 3-4 footer, maybe a little more when you factor in the landing. I haven't found the one described above as "the three foot boulder drop and 5 or 6 feet of vertical drop to the landing?". I'm assuming it's just the figure 8 one, but its maybe 1 foot of landing drop, not 5-6 feet, unless you WAY overshoot it and hammer into the alder nubs below.

  50. #50
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    Just finished....

    A sweet, sweet trip in Grand Junction, Fruita Colorado, and Moab. Lunch LOOPS, Kokopelli LOOPS, and Slickrock LOOP are all hamster wheels according to Fat Chick, and they are some of the best single track in the country. I'll be posting when we get back, but the ideas they had when they built these trails are similar to those they had when building the hillside single track. The only difference is, the terrain here is naturally rocky, dry, desert dirt that opens the way for several drops, jumps, and fast technical stuff any downhiller would eat up. With little snow fall and influence of frost heaves, the trails maintain integrity throughout the years. If you are really itching for challenging riding, get to Colorado. These places have been amazing.

    On another note, a thread somewhere on here has a guy that is working the Alyeska trails. Drainage, route selection, digging trails, and making them sustainable and challenging is a tremendous task in Alaska especially. I hate to be a pessimist, but highly doubtful anyone will do it on their own.
    "Having lack of self-preservation makes biking more fun."

  51. #51
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    We Have A Winner!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Drzaous
    Sessioned the 'figure 8' one for a few runs, got some good pictures, it's well done, easy to get speed and a pretty good landing, as long as you don't overshoot it.

    Hooray!!!! You win a prize for being the first to report on your experiences dropping in on the boulders. Send me your address to: [email protected] and I'll send you your very own pair of Singletrack Advocates socks.

    Pictures???

  52. #52
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    I hate to pile on, but...

    I just finished up ripping the STA trails, starting from the Hilltop parking lot heading up, then down North Intermediate, all the way back down. One hell of a fun run. Perfect? Maybe not, but an awesome addition nonetheless. I personally think they should be one way. Somebody will get steam-rolled soon, but I guess I'm outnumbered on that idea.
    Many of us have different ideas of the perfect trail, but I can tell you this-STA got it done, and got it done quickly, with the support of other user groups. What you will find if you go it alone is that all the land is tied up, and it is VERY difficult to get other user group's support. I'm not saying I wouldn't love to see more technical riding here (I would), I'm just saying two years ago, we (mtber's) were one step above paint ballers. Now the equestrians look at STA with envy. You can't even imagine what a headache that project has been. Not from the work itself-that actually went very quickly, but because of the endless red tape. Thanks to Janice and the rest of the STA folks. Looking forward to the next one!

    Greg
    Speedway Cycles owner http://fatbackbikes.com

  53. #53
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    Idea Man

    Here's my idea. For the DH crowd, check out the muni maps of parkland and greenbelts, notice Rabbit Creek from Old Rabbit Creek Rd down to New Seward Hwy(NSH)/Old Seward Hwy(OSH)/Rabbit Creek Road (RCR). Would that ride be long enough for you?
    I have bushwacked up Little Rabbit Creek from OSH upstream a short way and there is an old roadbed on the south side of the creek, halfway up the hill. I can tell you that nobody is currently using that greenspace, it is THICK.
    Rabbit Creek itself I don't know as much about other than it seems ripe for a greenbelt trail down it from Old Rabbit Creek Rd.
    Another idea: How about using utility easements?

    On your mark! Get set!... Go!
    you may have come before us on no bicycle, but that does not say you know everything.

  54. #54
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    A very interesting string of opinions on this thread. I am a newbie to the riding world, so my experience is some what limited in terms of what is out there. However, from what I have been able to learn...our trails are what we make of them. I ride with some very experienced riders who still get stoked about what has been created and available...especially so close to where we live.

    Alaska is an outstanding location with some of the greatest scenery around...our trails may not be vast or equal (YET) to Fruita or Whistler or other riding meccas, but I am willing to bet that more will be coming. In just the short time I have been riding, I have seen more trails surface. We are still growing and perhaps with more persistence (and preservation of what we do have) Anchorage/Alaska can continue to develop some epic rides while considering our unique terrain/weather. It seems that for some the quest for the proverbially holy grail will always be desired regardless of the what is already available.

    So, in my 2 cents of an opinion if you cannot find some value in what we do have then it may be time to turn in your Alaska miles to head south, but remember the grass is not always greener on the other side.

    So thanks to the people who have been working diligently on promoting and expanding the riding experience and for helping out a newbie thorougly enjoy what we do have while I continue to look for the the next challenge in our area and appreciate why I live where I live and ride where I ride.

    Peace.

  55. #55
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    good post

    [QUOTE=dfg70]A very interesting string of opinions on this thread. I am a newbie to the riding world, so my experience is some what limited in terms of what is out there. However, from what I have been able to learn...our trails are what we make of them. I ride with some very experienced riders who still get stoked about what has been created and available...especially so close to where we live.

    Alaska is an outstanding location with some of the greatest scenery around...our trails may not be vast or equal (YET) to Fruita or Whistler or other riding meccas, but I am willing to bet that more will be coming. In just the short time I have been riding, I have seen more trails surface. We are still growing and perhaps with more persistence (and preservation of what we do have) Anchorage/Alaska can continue to develop some epic rides while considering our unique terrain/weather. It seems that for some the quest for the proverbially holy grail will always be desired regardless of the what is already available.

    So, in my 2 cents of an opinion if you cannot find some value in what we do have then it may be time to turn in your Alaska miles to head south, but remember the grass is not always greener on the other side.

    So thanks to the people who have been working diligently on promoting and expanding the riding experience and for helping out a newbie thorougly enjoy what we do have while I continue to look for the the next challenge in our area and appreciate why I live where I live and ride where I ride.

    Peace.[/QUOTE

    amen

    akdeluxe
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    "Trust me,you don't want a big baby."

    JT

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