Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 101 to 130 of 130

Thread: Pole Machine

  1. #101
    Out spokin'
    Reputation: Sparticus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Posts
    9,130
    Hey Le Duke, we each have a right to express our opinion. Speaking of opinions...
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    It’s relevant in that people at making statements that are inaccurate at best re: STA.
    I wonder if this is fact or opinion. May I ask what qualifications you have that make your statement regarding others' opinions ("inaccurate at best") fact rather than merely your own opinion? And if what you've said is merely your own opinion, please help the rest of us understand why your opinion is more credible than the opinions of others. I'm not being flip when I ask this. If you do understand the intimate nuances of frame design, I'd like to ask you some additional questions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Just like using the word “capable”. It means nothing unless you further clarify what it is more or less capable of. There are trade offs. There is no free lunch; one bike is not more “capable”; it just has a different range of conditions under which it is ideal.
    Read back. That's not what MTBguru71 said about capability. Here it is:
    Quote Originally Posted by MTBguru71 View Post
    I'm sure glad intelligent mountain bikers chase trends with their hard earned dollars. The results of this are more choices in bikes with greater capabilities.
    In this case (s)he clearly used the word "capabilities" as a comparative noun. "Greater capabilities" implies compared to bikes that came before. To say there's no free lunch is irrelevant. Outright gains have been made in bicycle frame design. I recall days when mountain bikes had top tubes that were parallel to the ground.
    =sParty
    disciplesofdirt.org

    We don't quit riding because we get old.
    We get old because we quit riding.

  2. #102
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    2
    Hey guys ive had my machine for about 3 months now and been riding it every chance i get... has anyone notice excessive amount of flexing? I know for it being a long geometry bike its known to have some flex. But when i was feeling around the top tube as I shake the bike left and right the seam underneath the top tube shifts side to side where its suppose to be glued, also under neath the bottom bracket where the seams come together has also play. Its not glued any more and by this causes the bike to have excessive play. Also i had a friend follow me and he sees excessive flexing left and right at every pedal strike load.. another time i notice when i hit a jump the landing is pretty rough from the excessive flexing. Ill try to post a video soon. Thanks

  3. #103
    May contain nuts
    Reputation: Haggis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    2,201
    Quote Originally Posted by gil machine View Post
    Hey guys ive had my machine for about 3 months now and been riding it every chance i get... has anyone notice excessive amount of flexing? I know for it being a long geometry bike its known to have some flex. But when i was feeling around the top tube as I shake the bike left and right the seam underneath the top tube shifts side to side where its suppose to be glued, also under neath the bottom bracket where the seams come together has also play. Its not glued any more and by this causes the bike to have excessive play. Also i had a friend follow me and he sees excessive flexing left and right at every pedal strike load.. another time i notice when i hit a jump the landing is pretty rough from the excessive flexing. Ill try to post a video soon. Thanks
    Ah, yikes??

  4. #104
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    1,077
    Quote Originally Posted by gil machine View Post
    Hey guys ive had my machine for about 3 months now and been riding it every chance i get... has anyone notice excessive amount of flexing? I know for it being a long geometry bike its known to have some flex. But when i was feeling around the top tube as I shake the bike left and right the seam underneath the top tube shifts side to side where its suppose to be glued, also under neath the bottom bracket where the seams come together has also play. Its not glued any more and by this causes the bike to have excessive play. Also i had a friend follow me and he sees excessive flexing left and right at every pedal strike load.. another time i notice when i hit a jump the landing is pretty rough from the excessive flexing. Ill try to post a video soon. Thanks
    Glue together a bike they said, it'll be fun they said...

  5. #105
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    30,013
    Wait, they glued a metal bike together?
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  6. #106
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    610
    Have you contacted Pole, they'd be interested to know.

    They did a lot of testing and DH riding on the prototypes. But that is not to say that you could get an unfortunate delamination. It happens with aircraft parts from time to time. Run your finger over the join area, it should be smooth, if there is an edge then there is some movement. Good luck

  7. #107
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Posts
    2,199
    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Wait, they glued a metal bike together?
    It's an aerospace technique. If it is executed properly there shouldn't be an issue. Yes this guy is having an issue but it remains to be seen if it is isolated or not.

    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

  8. #108
    damned rocks...
    Reputation: Aglo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    2,027
    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Wait, they glued a metal bike together?
    The parts are held in place with bolts, the glue is added for extra rigidity, but yeah, I had the exact same reaction the first time I saw "aluminum frame" and "glued together" on the same sentence.

  9. #109
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    30,013
    Quote Originally Posted by tuckerjt07 View Post
    It's an aerospace technique. If it is executed properly there shouldn't be an issue. Yes this guy is having an issue but it remains to be seen if it is isolated or not.

    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
    Yes, my reaction is not that it's impossible, it's that whenever tried in mtb it's often been an utter failure, like Crank Bro's "glued-together" crank-halves. I'm familiar with aerospace, but they don't often glue the engine-mount to the firewall or the wing-struts to the fuselage.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  10. #110
    Formerly of Kent
    Reputation: Le Duke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    9,910
    Aren’t a lot of aluminum crank arms machined in halves then glued together?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Death from Below.

  11. #111
    mtbr member
    Reputation: vikb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    12,222
    Quote Originally Posted by Aglo View Post
    The parts are held in place with bolts, the glue is added for extra rigidity, but yeah, I had the exact same reaction the first time I saw "aluminum frame" and "glued together" on the same sentence.
    The frame is bonded that's what's holding it together. The small bolts are just there so they don't need a fixture for the bonding process. This allows cheaper/faster production. If the adhesive fails those bolts will not hold the bike together under a rider.
    Safe riding,

    Vik
    www.vikapproved.com

  12. #112
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    30,013
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Aren’t a lot of aluminum crank arms machined in halves then glued together?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Um...no?

    Pole Machine-sl4.jpg
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  13. #113
    Formerly of Kent
    Reputation: Le Duke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    9,910

    Pole Machine

    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Um...no?

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	sl4.jpg 
Views:	147 
Size:	120.5 KB 
ID:	1211101
    http://www.killasgarage.bike/uncateg...owtech-cranks/

    There are plenty of articles that talk about Shimano cranks being machined in halves then glued together.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Death from Below.

  14. #114
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    30,013
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Musings on Shimano HollowTech Cranks – Killa’s Garage

    There are plenty of articles that talk about Shimano cranks being machined in halves then glued together.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I wasn't aware that was how they were made, I'd be interesting to see the cross-section and see how they "fit" together, in other words how critical the glue is. Still, monocoque frames like Foes and San Andreas that were produced in halves were always welded together down the middle.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  15. #115
    damned rocks...
    Reputation: Aglo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    2,027
    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    The frame is bonded that's what's holding it together. The small bolts are just there so they don't need a fixture for the bonding process. This allows cheaper/faster production. If the adhesive fails those bolts will not hold the bike together under a rider.
    You are right.
    I went to re-read the article where I originally read about the frame, and it is as you say.
    Still, past examples with aluminum tubes and lugs make me rise one or two eyebrows .

  16. #116
    damned rocks...
    Reputation: Aglo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    2,027
    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    I wasn't aware that was how they were made, I'd be interesting to see the cross-section and see how they "fit" together, in other words how critical the glue is. Still, monocoque frames like Foes and San Andreas that were produced in halves were always welded together down the middle.
    Found this:

  17. #117
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    2
    Hello Everyone!

    I'm Leo Kokkonen, and I'm the founder of Pole bicycles and engineer behind Pole Machine. It's nice to see how much interest there is towards our product in this forum.

    Our frame is machined from 7075 T6 aluminium billets. Bonding the halves together we use mechanical and adhesive joints to create a tubular monocoque frame. We distribute the loads by external shape and wall thicknesses like in any other frame but we can also produce internal shapes that is impossible with conventional methods. The frame halves have mechanical connections and steel bolts. The bolts also share lateral loads and secure some areas for extreme situations.

    We are continually learning from the process, and we have updated already frames several times after we started the production. The updates are relatively small. For example, we added bolts near the bb and head- and top tube to strengthen the frame for extreme impacts and stress. The good thing about machining is that we can quickly change the design within weeks instead of year model batches.

    All our customers who have bought Machines have full warranty on the frames for liabilities and defects, and because we are doing something that no one has any experience, we have extra resources for warranty cases.

    I'm happy to answer any questions, and I'm at Crankworx Whistler next week if someone wants to meet me and see the product live and maybe swing his leg over the bike

  18. #118
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    1,077
    Quote Originally Posted by polebicycles.com View Post
    Hello Everyone!

    I'm Leo Kokkonen, and I'm the founder of Pole bicycles and engineer behind Pole Machine. It's nice to see how much interest there is towards our product in this forum.

    Our frame is machined from 7075 T6 aluminium billets. Bonding the halves together we use mechanical and adhesive joints to create a tubular monocoque frame. We distribute the loads by external shape and wall thicknesses like in any other frame but we can also produce internal shapes that is impossible with conventional methods. The frame halves have mechanical connections and steel bolts. The bolts also share lateral loads and secure some areas for extreme situations.

    We are continually learning from the process, and we have updated already frames several times after we started the production. The updates are relatively small. For example, we added bolts near the bb and head- and top tube to strengthen the frame for extreme impacts and stress. The good thing about machining is that we can quickly change the design within weeks instead of year model batches.

    All our customers who have bought Machines have full warranty on the frames for liabilities and defects, and because we are doing something that no one has any experience, we have extra resources for warranty cases.

    I'm happy to answer any questions, and I'm at Crankworx Whistler next week if someone wants to meet me and see the product live and maybe swing his leg over the bike
    So you're replacing the OP's frame with the new updated version?

  19. #119
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by GRPABT1 View Post
    So you're replacing the OP's frame with the new updated version?
    All warranty replacements will be handled with the current revisions on Machines at the moment.

    Note that all sizes are individuals on construction and we can make small changes weekly without any notice. We mainly optimize machining time. In some cases we might change joints mainly because we can get better performance / weight etc. It's really cool working on this because as soon as we learn something we can implement it next week. This kind of changes are hardly seen outside the frame so from customer point of view it is not relevant until we make some big changes. So every time one purchases a Machine it is the latest design.

  20. #120
    mtbr member
    Reputation: RS VR6's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Posts
    4,433
    Cannondale's Hollowgram crank arms are also bonded from two halves.

  21. #121
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    118
    Quote Originally Posted by Jayem View Post
    Yes, my reaction is not that it's impossible, it's that whenever tried in mtb it's often been an utter failure, like Crank Bro's "glued-together" crank-halves. I'm familiar with aerospace, but they don't often glue the engine-mount to the firewall or the wing-struts to the fuselage.
    Quite a lot of modern cars are held together by glue.
    Those same cars are immensely stiffer and safer than cars from 20 or more years ago.

  22. #122
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    1,359
    Quote Originally Posted by gil machine View Post
    Hey guys ive had my machine for about 3 months now and been riding it every chance i get... has anyone notice excessive amount of flexing? I know for it being a long geometry bike its known to have some flex. But when i was feeling around the top tube as I shake the bike left and right the seam underneath the top tube shifts side to side where its suppose to be glued, also under neath the bottom bracket where the seams come together has also play. Its not glued any more and by this causes the bike to have excessive play. Also i had a friend follow me and he sees excessive flexing left and right at every pedal strike load.. another time i notice when i hit a jump the landing is pretty rough from the excessive flexing. Ill try to post a video soon. Thanks
    That sucks.

    Updates?


    Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk

  23. #123
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    115
    Quote Originally Posted by Suns_PSD View Post
    That sucks.

    Updates?


    Sent from my SM-G892A using Tapatalk
    Really interested in how it actually rides. Any comparisons to a more traditional geo? What were you riding prior? Anyone...?

  24. #124
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    1,359
    Quote Originally Posted by R3D2 View Post
    Really interested in how it actually rides. Any comparisons to a more traditional geo? What were you riding prior? Anyone...?
    It's not my bike. To be blunt I would not consider a 7-8 # (before rear shock so really 9+) frame that costs so much and is such low production. You just can't get enough development and support for such a low volume product.

    I also don't buy the entire biodegradeable angle either because it doesn't consider the lifetime effects of this process (mining and smelting huge blocks of aluminum, transporting it, electricity for the machinery, manufacturing of bits, etc...). But that's not really a motivating factor for most.

  25. #125
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    115
    Quote Originally Posted by Suns_PSD View Post
    It's not my bike. To be blunt I would not consider a 7-8 # (before rear shock so really 9+) frame that costs so much and is such low production. You just can't get enough development and support for such a low volume product.

    I also don't buy the entire biodegradeable angle either because it doesn't consider the lifetime effects of this process (mining and smelting huge blocks of aluminum, transporting it, electricity for the machinery, manufacturing of bits, etc...). But that's not really a motivating factor for most.

    my bad, Suns_PSD. i should not have responded directly to you. i meant it as a question to everyone on the thread. everyone is entitled to their opinions and i am not looking to get into the carbon/alum debate or weight or whatever. we buy this bike or that bike for our own reasons. there are more incredible bikes out there today than ever so it's great to have so many choices. i would just love to hear about how the machine rides from anyone who has thrown a leg over one. cheers.

  26. #126
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    1,359
    Good deal.

    I too am fascinated by the Machine, it sure is nice to look at as well.

    I ordered a Foxy 29, I figure that's low volume enough for around these parts!

  27. #127
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    115
    I'll be on the look out for your thoughts on that bike as well, I have to assume it will be awesome.

    I'm looking for a dedicated DH bike that isn't a full dual crown set up. Something i can pedal if I had to but wouldn't be my day-to-day trail bike. That is what has me interested in the machine. hopefully some other owners will chime in here at some point.

  28. #128
    shredthögnar
    Reputation: bike_futurist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2018
    Posts
    7
    Quote Originally Posted by gil machine View Post
    Hey guys ive had my machine for about 3 months now and been riding it every chance i get... has anyone notice excessive amount of flexing? I know for it being a long geometry bike its known to have some flex. But when i was feeling around the top tube as I shake the bike left and right the seam underneath the top tube shifts side to side where its suppose to be glued, also under neath the bottom bracket where the seams come together has also play. Its not glued any more and by this causes the bike to have excessive play. Also i had a friend follow me and he sees excessive flexing left and right at every pedal strike load.. another time i notice when i hit a jump the landing is pretty rough from the excessive flexing. Ill try to post a video soon. Thanks
    what happened with this?

  29. #129
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Posts
    2
    Quote Originally Posted by bike_futurist View Post
    what happened with this?
    Pole redesigned the frame (top tube nut checker) and they sent me a new one, ive been riding it and so far so good, also they made futher adjustments by adding a special mount for a chainring bash guard...
    other than that Pole stood by their warranty and im happy with my machine!

  30. #130
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Skrool's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Posts
    130

    Questions on your Machine ownership....

    Quote Originally Posted by gil machine View Post
    Pole redesigned the frame (top tube nut checker) and they sent me a new one, ive been riding it and so far so good, also they made futher adjustments by adding a special mount for a chainring bash guard...
    other than that Pole stood by their warranty and im happy with my machine!
    Very good to hear this. I myself am currently trying to decide which Pole I should get. I was [am] leaning toward the 158 because I really don't care for the asymmetrical rear linkage. Thus the 158 OR the Stamina has my interest. I'm just curious as to how the Stamina would do on all-day type rides....which I do a lot of, and which my current favorite bike [Evil Wreckoning] excels at. Sure, it may not be the 'fastest' on the long climbing sections, but it is indeed a very comfortable climbing bike...as well as excelling at anything steep and technical. So if, say, the Stamina were at least as good as my Evil is for all-day rides...then heck I'd surely make use of the extra cush because this new type geometry seems to utterly favor my riding style...thus the Pole!

    So are you still very happy with your Machine? Do you take it on LONG rides? If so, how would you best describe it? ie: is it just 'Ok'?, ...is the fun-factor still high enough to make you forget about how much travel it has? I'm asking this question because, for me, the Evil Wreckoning has somehow managed to become 'thee' bike for me...even though I've read [plenty of times] about people who say that it is too much travel etc. I don't feel this at all from it.

    Another question I had is : When you ordered you Machine, did it arrive on the date you were originally told it would? ..OR did is take months longer than that? I ask because I'm pretty leery about paying --in full-- for a stamina being told it will be shipped in March, when IN FACT it might end up arriving 6 months later than that. ..like what happened to a few other people I have interacted with online.

    Thanks for any input!

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 6
    Last Post: 10-23-2013, 12:52 PM
  2. Superfatty goes to the South Pole
    By druidh in forum Fat bikes
    Replies: 109
    Last Post: 04-04-2012, 04:53 PM
  3. My DIY GoPro pole mount
    By rabidchicken in forum Videos and POV Cameras
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 01-10-2012, 12:01 AM
  4. Biking to the South Pole
    By sjhiker in forum Riding Passion and Stories
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 01-08-2012, 08:45 PM
  5. Pole Hill
    By dutchman59 in forum Colorado - Front Range
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 10-10-2011, 10:42 PM

Members who have read this thread: 293

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

THE SITE

ABOUT MTBR

VISIT US AT

© Copyright 2018 VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.