• 03-31-2011
    Buggyr333
    New Bikesdirect Gravity 29Point1?
    http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...y/29point1.htm

    Looks pretty interesting. Frame looks similar to the performance Access 9r frames (not the same though, don't be confused, look at rear dropout and downtube/headtube weld) But I do dig the look of the frame, and I want to know how it rides (curse you BD for no testridability). I would like to see this frame with higher end componentry (Hint-Hint Mike, if you're listening) And I think with a paintjob over ther "Gravity" logos, it would look really sweet.

    Thoughts? comments?
  • 03-31-2011
    pulsepro
    Ewwwww. Just when you thought BD couldn't get any more "budget".......
  • 03-31-2011
    nachomc
    Looks janky.

    Like most of their stuff.
  • 03-31-2011
    AZ
    Look's like a Walgoose.
  • 03-31-2011
    MrHappyMedium
    The cheese
    It hurts my eyes...

    Quote:

    The 29Point1 adds to those race winning specs; a smooth shifting SR crank
  • 03-31-2011
    subspd
    Hey looks better than anything else in the price range. It is a "budget" bike after all.
  • 03-31-2011
    boomn
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by pulsepro
    Ewwwww. Just when you thought BD couldn't get any more "budget".......

    They've had bike far cheaper and lower quality than that for a long time. Someone has to provide the low-budget options with inherently worse parts, and it just so happens to be a niche that BD pursues a lot. Have you seen how crappy the $300-400 "mountain" bikes look from Trek, Specialized, Giant, etc?
  • 03-31-2011
    mtnbiker72
    Almost guarantee that is a Ideal Bike made frame (same company that makes Fuji, Windsor, and the Access 29er frames).
  • 03-31-2011
    will-lee wonka
    What makes a bike look good or bad?

    It's just an aluminum hardtail like a so many others. Compared to like kind bikes (aluminum 29er hardtails), what makes this one look icky? (yes, "icky" is a technical term)
  • 03-31-2011
    TwoHeadsBrewing
    It seems a bit overpriced. For just $100 more, the Windsor 29er Comp comes with a Dart 3 with lockout and BB5 discs. I'm not crazy about the Alivio/Deore deraillers, but they are good enough to get you down the trail with a little adjustment.

    However, for my money I'd rather forgo the suspension AND the gears and get a SE Stout: http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/se/stout.htm
  • 03-31-2011
    Buggyr333
    I just like how the frame looks, looks way less janky than the windsor 29ers, and less plain than the moto's. Just needs paint over the logo.
  • 03-31-2011
    wyatt79m
    blaaah
  • 03-31-2011
    frdfandc
    I'm with mtbbiker72. Frame looks like its from Ideal. Ideal makes good frames. I'm currently riding one with my Fuji Tahoe Pro 29er and absolutely love it.

    I do agree the graphics could have a been better thought out, but if I was on a really tight budget, which a lot of people are, I wouldn't snub it at all. Nothing a pinstripe removal tool can't take care of and some imagination.

    The Suntour XCT fork is pretty much equal when compared to a Dart 3 as far as price and features go.
  • 03-31-2011
    rate
    Looks great. What do you want for under $500? Me personally I want Ti.
    I can dream...
  • 03-31-2011
    jeffgothro
    I hate it, looks like a trek/specialized/niner clone...now you mention it, I don't care much for the aforementioned bikes either.
  • 03-31-2011
    AZ
    2 Attachment(s)
    Wally clone...
  • 03-31-2011
    rydbyk
    Terrible. Horrible. Bad. Not good. Walmartlike.
  • 03-31-2011
    umarth
    I mean, some of what I had came from the garage, but I recently sold two bikes and trades some others to builder a 29er 1x9. I have Velocity Blunt to XT hubs, a White Brothers carbon fork and a Fuji Tahoe SL frame. It is a sub 400 dollar set up.

    Sometimes it is better to just sit and see what comes up on ebay and craigslist.

    Just sayin'.
  • 03-31-2011
    Buggyr333
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    Wally clone...

    Whats the name of that Wally bike, I wanna do some research to see.

    Edit: Not a clone, look at the headtube, the Wally doesn't have an intergrated headset, and it looks like the dropouts are different too, hard to tell in the pictures though.
  • 04-01-2011
    dr.mediocre
    I don't think that rear derailleur could handle the last 2 gears.
  • 04-01-2011
    floydlippencott
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by umarth
    I mean, some of what I had came from the garage, but I recently sold two bikes and trades some others to builder a 29er 1x9. I have Velocity Blunt to XT hubs, a White Brothers carbon fork and a Fuji Tahoe SL frame. It is a sub 400 dollar set up.

    Sometimes it is better to just sit and see what comes up on ebay and craigslist.

    Just sayin'.





    /\ This, sometimes you should just save a little more money so you dont have to ride crappy bikes.
  • 04-01-2011
    grizzlyplumber
    Says it compares to $1100 bikes from other mfg, more like the $500 bikes.
    http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0041V2FR0/...SIN=B0041V2FR0
    $1100 will get you a Giant XTC, nothing like fudging the facts in your advertising.
  • 04-01-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Buggyr333
    http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...y/29point1.htm

    Looks pretty interesting. Frame looks similar to the performance Access 9r frames (not the same though, don't be confused, look at rear dropout and downtube/headtube weld) But I do dig the look of the frame, and I want to know how it rides (curse you BD for no testridability). I would like to see this frame with higher end componentry (Hint-Hint Mike, if you're listening) And I think with a paintjob over ther "Gravity" logos, it would look really sweet.

    Thoughts? comments?

    Thank you
    I think you will find the gravity 29er line is most like the aluminum fisher 29er hardtails
    And that the point 2, point 3, point 4, and point 5 models will be up on BD site in a few days

    Once these bikes get in the hands of enough riders there will be little question that their quality, weight, and performance will equal bikes selling in bike shops all over the USA

    A point 6 model will be added for 2012 which will be even higher spec than the 2011 point 5 (which is X9 / Reba )

    It takes time for some to understand what new bikes like these are about
    But it will come around
  • 04-01-2011
    TwoHeadsBrewing
    Mike, I can't help but wonder: With all these new models coming in, where is that Full Suspension 29er that's been talked about for the past 6 months?
  • 04-01-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
    Mike, I can't help but wonder: With all these new models coming in, where is that Full Suspension 29er that's been talked about for the past 6 months?

    Five medium to high end Moto 29er FS models coming in JUNE

    Several lower to medium level gravity and Dawes 29er FS coming this fall

    Thanks for asking

    Also bringing all those in framesets
    For those that want to change over a hardtail
  • 04-01-2011
    rydbyk
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    Five medium to high end Moto 29er FS models coming in JUNE

    Several lower to medium level gravity and Dawes 29er FS coming this fall

    Thanks for asking

    Also bringing all those in framesets
    For those that want to change over a hardtail

    Seems like everyone and their mother now offers a carbon 29er. When will you offer one?
  • 04-01-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by frdfandc
    I'm with mtbbiker72. Frame looks like its from Ideal. Ideal makes good frames. I'm currently riding one with my Fuji Tahoe Pro 29er and absolutely love it.

    I do agree the graphics could have a been better thought out, but if I was on a really tight budget, which a lot of people are, I wouldn't snub it at all. Nothing a pinstripe removal tool can't take care of and some imagination.

    The Suntour XCT fork is pretty much equal when compared to a Dart 3 as far as price and features go.

    This is very interesting to me
    The GRAVITY look of minimalist decals on mountain, road, and lifestyle bikes has been very well received. We get lots of positive comments on the low key look.
    However the new Dawes 29er line will be more "colorful" and the entry HT will even be lower in price

    I do think there is a place for all price ranges, assorted looks, different designs and lots of choices!!
  • 04-01-2011
    2002maniac
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
    Mike, I can't help but wonder: With all these new models coming in, where is that Full Suspension 29er that's been talked about for the past 6 months?

    we want more 29er ti frames too!
  • 04-01-2011
    Jim311
    Def need to offer a cheap carbon 29er Mike!
  • 04-01-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by rydbyk
    Seems like everyone and their mother now offers a carbon 29er. When will you offer one?

    Good question
    And I could do a moto or Windsor or gravity CF 29er tomorrow

    But the truth is I do not like CF for off road bikes
    MTB or CX. You will note we have done

    Someday we may sell a GT or Kestrel or Fuji that is off road CF
    But not on a brand I design

    I feel if you fall off and hit a rock with your frame you should be able to get up and ride without worrying
  • 04-01-2011
    TunicaTrails
    For an entry-level bike, it's awesome. A big problem with getting people involved in the sport is the cost of entry. They just balk at the price. Get them hooked though and they'll think nothing of dropping 5 grand on a bike (cough cough).

    A bike like this is actually ridable on trails vs. a Wal-Mart bike which is pretty much useless on a real mountain bike trail.
  • 04-01-2011
    Fuze911
    oops double post...sorry
  • 04-01-2011
    Fuze911
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    Five medium to high end Moto 29er FS models coming in JUNE

    Several lower to medium level gravity and Dawes 29er FS coming this fall

    Thanks for asking

    Also bringing all those in framesets
    For those that want to change over a hardtail


    This is awesome news!. Guess i know what frame im getting in June!! Whos excited?



    ...unless this is somekind of sick april fools joke.... :|
  • 04-01-2011
    subspd
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    Five medium to high end Moto 29er FS models coming in JUNE

    Several lower to medium level gravity and Dawes 29er FS coming this fall

    Thanks for asking

    Also bringing all those in framesets
    For those that want to change over a hardtail

    Mike,

    This FS will be my next bike. Would like to start gathering some parts when will we be able to get the exact breakdown on the component specs/prices and also things like seat post diameter, handlebar width, etc.

    The reason I ask is I would like to swap some peices between my HT and this bike. And maybe move over the front fork from your FS to my HT as well and then get a 120mm thru axle for your FS. Just thinking about it and would like to start collecting parts this next month or so.

    Also what colors are the high end models? I heard silver (again!)?
  • 04-01-2011
    rydbyk
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    Good question
    And I could do a moto or Windsor or gravity CF 29er tomorrow

    But the truth is I do not like CF for off road bikes
    MTB or CX. You will note we have done

    Someday we may sell a GT or Kestrel or Fuji that is off road CF
    But not on a brand I design

    I feel if you fall off and hit a rock with your frame you should be able to get up and ride without worrying


    Business must be booming! To easily have the ability to produce a CF 29er and opt not to means that you are missing a HUGE % of potential consumers.

    The % of damaged CF frames that are based on rock impact is tiny. Seems like you might be overlooking something IMO...
  • 04-01-2011
    Buggyr333
    Carbon HAS come a long way and is very impact resistant at this point, that is, at least expensive carbon. Cheap carbon on the other hand, I'm not so sure about.
  • 04-01-2011
    nachomc
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Buggyr333
    Carbon HAS come a long way and is very impact resistant at this point, that is, at least expensive carbon. Cheap carbon on the other hand, I'm not so sure about.

    Just like with everything else BD they'd use the same frame manufacturers and materials as the big name companies. The website would likely say "Compare to $10,000 super bikes from Specialized, Giant, Trek." I'm sure it would be fine.
  • 04-01-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by 2002maniac
    we want more 29er ti frames too!

    On the water
    and should be on BD and BI in the next few weeks

    later we will get the new 2012 Ti Monster Cross frameset also [this I think will be popular]
  • 04-01-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Fuze911
    This is awesome news!. Guess i know what frame im getting in June!! Whos excited?



    ...unless this is somekind of sick april fools joke.... :|


    No April fool's joke
    Today [april fools day] is my wedding annverisary and that is no joke!

    FS 29er framesets will go on presale 30 days before they land
    and at a really nice price
  • 04-01-2011
    floydlippencott
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    On the water
    and should be on BD and BI in the next few weeks

    later we will get the new 2012 Ti Monster Cross frameset also [this I think will be popular]




    Spy pics of Monster Crosser and F/S 29er? Happy Anniversary by the way.
  • 04-01-2011
    Clones123
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by frdfandc
    The Suntour XCT fork is pretty much equal when compared to a Dart 3 as far as price and features go.

    Eh? How is a friction-damped fork with a mechanical lockout (XCT) "pretty much equal" to a hydraulic fork with rebound adjust and hydraulic lockout (Dart 3)? Perhaps you were thinking of the much better Suntour XCM-LO hydraulic fork (not to be confused with the non-hydraulic XCM-MLO version).
  • 04-01-2011
    boomn
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Clones123
    Eh? How is a friction-damped fork with a mechanical lockout (XCT) "pretty much equal" to a hydraulic fork with rebound adjust and hydraulic lockout (Dart 3)? Perhaps you were thinking of the much better Suntour XCM-LO hydraulic fork (not to be confused with the non-hydraulic XCM-MLO version).

    They're certainly quite similar though. Plus there is no XCM line for 29ers

    *The Dart and all those Suntours are coil spring forks with preload adjustment. No difference there

    *The TurnKey hydraulic lockout on the Dart functions pretty much the same as any mechanical lockout. Both companies claim to have a blow off system for big hits if the lockout is left on. No useful difference there

    *The Suntour does lack rebound adjustment, which is not good

    *The fact that the Dart damper is hydraulic doesn't necessarily make it much better, though there likely is at least some difference. The damper on my wife's Dart certainly doesn't perform very well, squishing and/or bouncing around when you don't want it too, then packing up and getting harsh at other times
  • 04-02-2011
    Buggyr333
    Having ridden both, IMO the suntour is better than the Dart. The dart is the only fork I have ever ridden and decided that the bike would be better off rigid. But my dart may have been defective, since it would make a knocking noise at every big bump, and still got about 20mm of travel while locked out.
  • 04-02-2011
    Clones123
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Buggyr333
    Having ridden both, IMO the suntour is better than the Dart.

    We're talking about the Dart 3, right? That's still a cut above the Dart 2 or the utterly craptastic Dart 1. And "the Suntour" - that's the XCM-LO and XCR-LO you're talking about I assume? The low-end XCT is an awfully basic fork with skinny stanchion tubes.
  • 04-02-2011
    Buggyr333
    Yeah, My Outcast came with a Craptastic Dart 3, but as I said, mine may have been defective, because mine was REALLY bad. and that's the only time I had ridden a Dart.
  • 04-03-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by floydlippencott
    Spy pics of Monster Crosser and F/S 29er? Happy Anniversary by the way.


    No early shots of pre production FS 29ers yet
    But we are doing Monster Cross in Steel, Ti, and Aluminum [as I think there should be lots of price points available]

    First AL one is below
    There will also be an APEX version in AL
    Gravity Zilla below will take any tire from 700x28c to 29x2.2 and comes with 700x45c





  • 04-03-2011
    appleSSeed
    c'mon dude...buy an ad...I'm not trying to see that POS over and over again
  • 04-03-2011
    subspd
    Thanks for the pic. Not my thing but interesting...
  • 04-03-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by appleSSeed
    c'mon dude...buy an ad...I'm not trying to see that POS over and over again

    We have purchased ads on MTBR and RBR for years
    I think you will see them on the home page

    I am not at this time trying to promote our Monster Cross bikes; as they are not in yet and will not be in for months

    However, there were posts & PMs asking for 'spy' pictures; the ones I posted are all I can supply right now

    I know Monster Cross will not be for everyone; but it is an interesting catagory that I hope more manufacturers get involved in
  • 04-03-2011
    Vecsus
    Mike, buying an ad on mtbr doesn't give you the green light to turn so many threads into product roll-out announcements. The word subtle must not be in your vocabulary. If your product is good the customers will speak for you. You don't see other company reps bumping threads any time their product is mentioned do you?
  • 04-03-2011
    waterdude
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vecsus
    Mike, buying an ad on mtbr doesn't give you the green light to turn so many threads into product roll-out announcements. The word subtle must not be in your vocabulary. If your product is good the customers will speak for you. You don't see other company reps bumping threads any time their product is mentioned do you?

    Looks like the classy move for a MOD would've been a PM regarding this stuff. :rolleyes:
  • 04-03-2011
    wyatt79m
    I'm just glad to see a MOD finally taking a stand, it's like a nonstop commercial around here.
  • 04-03-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vecsus
    Mike, buying an ad on mtbr doesn't give you the green light to turn so many threads into product roll-out announcements. The word subtle must not be in your vocabulary. If your product is good the customers will speak for you. You don't see other company reps bumping threads any time their product is mentioned do you?


    DID YOU NOT SEE THE REQUEST POSTED BY A MEMBER FOR "SPY PICTURES"

    funny thing is: he also wanted FS 29er pictures which I could not supply

    And I agree; you do not see other reps on forums much
    ever wonder why?
  • 04-03-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by wyatt79m
    I'm just glad to see a MOD finally taking a stand, it's like a nonstop commercial around here.


    Post was put up by a member about a bike we offer

    I responded to requests made by other members

    please read the entire thread

    Next Time a post is put up about Brand X in the 29er forum; we can see how fast it gets moved. The way I read this action is: any post concerning just one brand needs to be moved out of the general 29er forum. Fair is fair; all should be treated equally
  • 04-03-2011
    Clones123
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vecsus
    Mike, buying an ad on mtbr doesn't give you the green light to turn so many threads into product roll-out announcements. The word subtle must not be in your vocabulary. If your product is good the customers will speak for you. You don't see other company reps bumping threads any time their product is mentioned do you?

    Who moderates the moderators? Time for a Super Mod to step in.

    Busting out a vendor in public for answering questions about his product is 'subtle'? I guess mods can swing a big stick and only little people need to be subtle. Mike seems like an alright guy and his products are a unique and popular niche in the market. The information he provides is of great interest - especially upcoming products. MTBR should be encouraging vendor participation not rudely shutting it down.
  • 04-03-2011
    ljsmith
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vecsus
    Mike, buying an ad on mtbr doesn't give you the green light to turn so many threads into product roll-out announcements. The word subtle must not be in your vocabulary. If your product is good the customers will speak for you. You don't see other company reps bumping threads any time their product is mentioned do you?

    I wish more company reps would come on here and actually answer questions about new products. It would be one thing if he posted these pics unsolicited. But I also suspect had similar posts been made by someone from a big company that you would not have thought it was a big deal.
  • 04-03-2011
    TwoHeadsBrewing
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vecsus
    Mike, buying an ad on mtbr doesn't give you the green light to turn so many threads into product roll-out announcements. The word subtle must not be in your vocabulary. If your product is good the customers will speak for you. You don't see other company reps bumping threads any time their product is mentioned do you?

    Someone asked about monstercross, and about BD putting one out specifically. If this isn't the place to post such pictures, I'm wondering what is. You are the mod, so do what you will, but a little reason goes a long way. I like your quote BTW...
  • 04-03-2011
    TwoHeadsBrewing
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by wyatt79m
    I'm just glad to see a MOD finally taking a stand, it's like a nonstop commercial around here.

    OK, first of all, the thread is titled: "New Bikesdirect Gravity 29Point1?"

    What content did you think was going to show up? And if you're so upset by the "commercial" going on, why did you click the link? Nobody is force feeding you this thread, so if you don't like it, don't read it.
  • 04-03-2011
    Buggyr333
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
    if you don't like it, don't read it.

    Yes! exactly! and in Mike's defense, the photos he posted were 100% relevant to the Discussion! someone asked for pictures of what is essentially in the same line as the the bike the thread was made for (It is still a Gravity 29er, after all).
  • 04-04-2011
    Clones123
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing
    You are the mod, so do what you will, but a little reason goes a long way. I like your quote BTW...

    I'd like the mod's quote better without the misspelling - there is only one "e" in argument. I'm fond of using a spell-checker plugin in my browser to catch things like that before I post (IeSpell for Internet Explorer works great).

    Too bad this thread got yanked from the 29er Bikes forum. Numerous past discussions about the Access XCL 9r from Performance never got moved to the obscure "Custom Builders & Other Manufacturers" forum.
  • 04-04-2011
    subspd
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vecsus
    Mike, buying an ad on mtbr doesn't give you the green light to turn so many threads into product roll-out announcements. The word subtle must not be in your vocabulary. If your product is good the customers will speak for you. You don't see other company reps bumping threads any time their product is mentioned do you?

    Wow. :madman:

    Thanks Mike for answering the questions asked. He wasn't bumping the thread he was answering the questions. I think this mod needs a new job... :nono:

    I also believe it is crazy that this thread was moved it was in the right place the first time.
  • 04-04-2011
    gregg
    this thread is relevant to the 29er forum, so I have moved it back.
  • 04-04-2011
    Cowboypilot
    Mike, keep up the good work!
  • 04-04-2011
    ScaryJerry
    what are the brakes on that drop bar bike?
  • 04-04-2011
    dr.mediocre
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by ScaryJerry
    what are the brakes on that drop bar bike?

    The ones on Mike's bike look like Tiagra Brifters. The Tiagras are the "Alivio" of the Road Bike components.
  • 04-04-2011
    RDTigger
    So how quality are the frames from BD and Motobecane?

    Say a Fantom 29er elite versus a GF Mamba? I like the G2 geometry feel of the Mamba's ride and am undecided.

    Is the Motobecane a worthy comparison?
  • 04-04-2011
    Buggyr333
    i don't know about vs a GF mamba, but my Motobecane outcast 29 handles beautifully, and it seems to be strong as hell, I beat the hell out of it, heavy trail riding, lots and lots of jumps, urban assault, had a couple of bad crashes, and the frame has shown no signs of giving up.

    I've had it for about 8 months, with very heavy usage, I have no idea how many miles, but I have a trail that is basically in my backyard that I hit up almost daily, usually more than once per day. But I almost always make time to run through there before work and such.
  • 04-04-2011
    AZ
    G2 geometry is specific to Fishers.
  • 04-04-2011
    Adim_X
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by RDTigger
    So how quality are the frames from BD and Motobecane?

    Say a Fantom 29er elite versus a GF Mamba? I like the G2 geometry feel of the Mamba's ride and am undecided.

    Is the Motobecane a worthy comparison?


    I would take this question to the Motobecane forum, you will probably get better and more information.
  • 04-04-2011
    AZ
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Adim_X
    I would take this question to the Motobecane forum, you will probably get better and more information.



    Really?
  • 04-04-2011
    RDTigger
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Adim_X
    I would take this question to the Motobecane forum, you will probably get better and more information.


    Thanks, I will :thumbsup:
  • 04-04-2011
    Jnthomps08
    I dont mean to stir the pot, so to speak, but I feel like the BD pictures always look so... cheap.

    *Note: I have seen some Motos in person and have been surprised.
  • 04-04-2011
    RDTigger
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jnthomps08
    I dont mean to stir the pot, so to speak, but I feel like the BD pictures always look so... cheap.

    *Note: I have seen some Motos in person and have been surprised.


    Saw one on someones rack today, looked pretty good. I almost wanted to stop them and ask for a test ride!
  • 04-05-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by ScaryJerry
    what are the brakes on that drop bar bike?


    Brakes on the ZILLA are Tektro LYRA with 160mm frt and 140mm rr; designed to work with drop bar brake/shift levers

    On a another note on Zilla - which has been bought up buy other members.
    The hydro formed TT is designed to lower standover while allowing tall HT
    Many buyers want a 'compact' type design in a CX bike; so I decided to add that extra comfort in this monster cross bike; and as the bike maybe used for about anything and with tire changes can effect standover [big diff from 28c to 29x2.2] -- I wanted to add the extra 40mm [about 1.5 inches of standover from the formed TT.
  • 04-05-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by RDTigger
    So how quality are the frames from BD and Motobecane?

    Say a Fantom 29er elite versus a GF Mamba? I like the G2 geometry feel of the Mamba's ride and am undecided.

    Is the Motobecane a worthy comparison?

    Frames on Motobecane, Gravity, Windsor etc are exactly the same quality as on Fuji, Trek, Fisher, Specialized etc

    Moto Fantom 29ers ride a bit more aggressively than Fisher 29er; bit less comfy; bit quicker. Gravity 29er Point series rides exactly like a Mamba as far as feel and handling. I guess 29er Point 2 or 3 would compare to a Mamba; but 'ride' on all would be just like the Fisher AL 29er series
  • 04-05-2011
    subspd
    When are we going to see hydroformed tubes on Moto?
  • 04-05-2011
    Jnthomps08
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect

    Moto Fantom 29ers ride a bit more aggressively than Fisher 29er; bit less comfy; bit quicker. Gravity 29er Point series rides exactly like a Mamba as far as feel and handling. I guess 29er Point 2 or 3 would compare to a Mamba; but 'ride' on all would be just like the Fisher AL 29er series

    G2 geometry?
  • 04-05-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by subspd
    When are we going to see hydroformed tubes on Moto?


    It is true; Motobecanes are more traditional in look. And there does seem to be a market and following for that. However, new FS 29er, 2012 AL road line, and all Ti Motos tubing that is a bit more 'modern'

    On the flip side; adding lots of steel in Moto which will look very 'old school'

    I understand cyclists like choices; so I will try to have something for everyone
  • 04-05-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jnthomps08
    G2 geometry?


    Gravity 29er HT angle adjusted to allow use of standard offset forks
    ride is no different
  • 04-05-2011
    roadie scum
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jnthomps08
    G2 geometry?



    G2 geo is patented and belongs to Fisher.
  • 04-05-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by roadie scum
    G2 geo is patented and belongs to Fisher.

    I have never heard that; nor do I think it is correct


    However, my main concern is that forks delivered on our bikes are standard and that forks in line with industry standard can always be used on our frames
  • 04-05-2011
    Jnthomps08
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    Gravity 29er HT angle adjusted to allow use of standard offset forks
    ride is no different

    Sorry to rain on this parade, but the geo between my Xcal and the Gravity HT are different.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    have never heard that; nor do I think it is correct

    Really? Seriously? The Fox and Rock Shox forks have a proprietary offset. They cannot be purchased aftermarket.
  • 04-05-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jnthomps08
    Sorry to rain on this parade, but the geo between my Xcal and the Gravity HT are different.



    Really? Seriously? The Fox and Rock Shox forks have a proprietary offset. They cannot be purchased aftermarket.


    I think the geo charts should be clear; but I do not know what your Xcal is in geo
    from what I can tell Gravity 29er geo is same as Fisher 29er AL except for HT angle [which is adjusted for standard forks]

    Proprietry and Patented are very different terms; and I do not beleive there are any patented geos; at least I do not know of any

    Patenting a geo I think is much different than a feature like a horst link, DW Link, etc
    Of course, please note I am not an attorney nor a specialist in patents

    Maybe a patent specialist will read this and chime in
  • 04-05-2011
    92gli
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jnthomps08
    Really? Seriously? The Fox and Rock Shox forks have a proprietary offset. They cannot be purchased aftermarket.

    Do you understand that changing fork offset is not patentable ? By your logic if easton agreed to make 40" carbon bars ONLY for specialized bikes and not sell them themselves then that means no one else can make 40" bars.
  • 04-05-2011
    AZ
    The correct term is proprietary, and G2 is proprietary to Fishers. Copying Fishers geo accomplishes zip without the G2 offset, hence the different HT angle on the motos.
  • 04-05-2011
    RDTigger
    And the madness ensues.

    ....The Moto has different geometry than a G2m but the Gravity line is identical. Check out the geo of the Point 1 or 5
  • 04-05-2011
    Adim_X
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    Really?


    My point was kind of facetious, I didn't want the thread to get derailed. Because than all the haters can come start calling us all shills.
  • 04-05-2011
    Jnthomps08
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by 92gli
    Do you understand that changing fork offset is not patentable ? By your logic if easton agreed to make 40" carbon bars ONLY for specialized bikes and not sell them themselves then that means no one else can make 40" bars.

    Wait. Thats not how it works? :rolleyes:

    I said "proprietary." It is there in my post.

    Im not a BD hater; if you look you will see that i own a Dawes Deadeye. I understand BD's place in the market and I have read every long thread on BD versus other brands. BUT, you cannot say that the Gravity handles just like a Fisher G2 if it doesnt have the same ht angle and fork offset... that is basis for G2.

    I didnt mean to start anything on this thread. The ridiculousness just got the best of me.
  • 04-05-2011
    92gli
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jnthomps08
    Wait. Thats not how it works? :rolleyes:

    I said "proprietary." It is there in my post.

    Im not a BD hater; if you look you will see that i own a Dawes Deadeye. I understand BD's place in the market and I have read every long thread on BD versus other brands. BUT, you cannot say that the Gravity handles just like a Fisher G2 if it doesnt have the same ht angle and fork offset... that is basis for G2.

    I didnt mean to start anything on this thread. The ridiculousness just got the best of me.

    Oops. You're right, should have been replying to roadie scum. :cool:
  • 04-06-2011
    OmaHaq
    It is a well known fact that Kinesis is the source of all of Motobecane frames as well as most of the other brands Bikes Direct carries. Kinesis also does every aluminium hardtail Trek offers now. If you are riding a Trek 4300-6700, you have a frame from the same factory Motobecanes come from.

    ? It's all about value. If you value warranty and generally solid customer service, buy the Trek version. If you can work on your bike yourself and aren't worried about a frame failure, go BD.com. Nothing wrong as long as you look at these things from a value perspective.
  • 04-06-2011
    AZ
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by OmaHaq
    It is a well known fact that Kinesis is the source of all of Motobecane frames as well as most of the other brands Bikes Direct carries. Kinesis also does every aluminium hardtail Trek offers now. If you are riding a Trek 4300-6700, you have a frame from the same factory Motobecanes come from.

    ? It's all about value. If you value warranty and generally solid customer service, buy the Trek version. If you can work on your bike yourself and aren't worried about a frame failure, go BD.com. Nothing wrong as long as you look at these things from a value perspective.




    Fit, its about fit. If it does not fit well it is not a good value at any price.
  • 04-06-2011
    longhaultrucker
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by gregg
    this thread is relevant to the 29er forum, so I have moved it back.

    Thank you :thumbsup: I was enjoying it until the Mike/BD bashing started :p

    FWIW,I have yet to buy anything from BD,but I do now own a BD bike second hand though-very decent bike for the price point,and I see nothing wrong with him answering questions-including spy shots (more please!)-when asked,it's not tasteless spamming,more like doing what he was asked to do. I mean no offense to the dude what was complaining,but nobody held a gun to your head and forced you to open and read it,right? So if it bothers you,don't do it no'mo :nono: :)

    Personally,I wish more bike companies would come on here like Mike does,as it is though,he seems the only one to care enough to spend that kinda time chattig with us "little people"...or maybe they don't wanna get flamed from the dude what was complaining and others like that maybe? :skep:
  • 04-07-2011
    gmtx77
    I would love to get a look at some of these Gravity's. BD's retail arm Cycle Spectrum recently closed their store in Plano - a suburb of Dallas. With BD located in Dallas and their warehouse in Garland you would think they would maintain a retail presence in the area. I came real close to buying a Moto last year after riding one at CS. I really liked it and was close to buying it. But after they wanted to charge me $100 over the BD price and wouldn't budge (to cover their cost of assembly and lifetime tune-ups) - yeah right, I went elsewhere. None of the other CS stores charge more than BD. Why this one?

    Pity. I know that BD has some good values but the lack of a retail arm in their back yard doesn't instill confidence.

    Oh, and I do enjoy Mike coming on here and providing useful information on new products and soliciting information. I wish more mfg's would do the same.
  • 04-07-2011
    dr.mediocre
    Quote:

    Pity. I know that BD has some good values but the lack of a retail arm in their back yard doesn't instill confidence.
    Oh I know. Why just yesterday I took my car over to Tire Rack to have my tires rotated. While I waited I ran in to the local Amazon store to buy some books and browse. I walked next door to Newegg for a new router then hopped on over to ING Direct to cash a check. I may run by Overstock.com later to see if they have any good deals on cycling shorts. All-in-all it was a productive afternoon.
  • 04-07-2011
    subspd
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by gmtx77
    I would love to get a look at some of these Gravity's. BD's retail arm Cycle Spectrum recently closed their store in Plano - a suburb of Dallas. With BD located in Dallas and their warehouse in Garland you would think they would maintain a retail presence in the area. I came real close to buying a Moto last year after riding one at CS. I really liked it and was close to buying it. But after they wanted to charge me $100 over the BD price and wouldn't budge (to cover their cost of assembly and lifetime tune-ups) - yeah right, I went elsewhere. None of the other CS stores charge more than BD. Why this one?

    Pity. I know that BD has some good values but the lack of a retail arm in their back yard doesn't instill confidence.

    Oh, and I do enjoy Mike coming on here and providing useful information on new products and soliciting information. I wish more mfg's would do the same.

    I know!!! I went to Jacksonville on business and drove by a store called "Bikes Direct" I had to stop asked if they were affiliated with BD.com and they said yes. They charged the exact same price as online but charged tax which they said really works out to an assembly charge. I got on a couple bikes that's when I decided to buy one online. I have even thought about talking with Mike about opening a store in ATL. I think it would take off.
  • 04-07-2011
    Clones123
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by subspd
    I have even thought about talking with Mike about opening a store in ATL. I think it would take off.

    I don't know - with the cost of inventory, retail lease, employees, insurance, advertising, telecom & utilities...it all adds up. You think the increase in units moved would pay for a store in Atlanta year-round? I'm not saying it wouldn't - just that I'm not sure.

    Remember that the surest way to make a million dollars in the bike business is to start with two million! LOL.
  • 04-07-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    Fit, its about fit. If it does not fit well it is not a good value at any price.

    This is way many customers are happy to learn Gravity road bikes fit exactly like a Giant Defy and that Gravity 29ers fit exactly like a Fisher 29er.
  • 04-07-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by dr.mediocre
    Oh I know. Why just yesterday I took my car over to Tire Rack to have my tires rotated. While I waited I ran in to the local Amazon store to buy some books and browse. I walked next door to Newegg for a new router then hopped on over to ING Direct to cash a check. I may run by Overstock.com later to see if they have any good deals on cycling shorts. All-in-all it was a productive afternoon.


    I like your style
  • 04-07-2011
    AZ
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    This is way many customers are happy to learn Gravity road bikes fit exactly like a Giant Defy and that Gravity 29ers fit exactly like a Fisher 29er.



    I would humbly suggest that if the gravity 29ers have a different HT angle than a Fisher then they do not fit exactly like a Fisher. It may be close, but it is not exact.
  • 04-07-2011
    coot271
    MIKE FOR PRESIDENT!:thumbsup:
  • 04-07-2011
    subspd
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Clones123

    Remember that the surest way to make a million dollars in the bike business is to start with two million! LOL.

    True. Unfortunatly this is the case with many businesses in this economy! My thought was just that like the Apple stores helped Apple by letting people touch, feel and try products it would help BD if they had stores in more cities. Of course the buisiness side is NOTHING like Apple so I'm sure $ wise it would be hard to make a buisiness case for it. Nevertheless a man can dream...

    Now where is that FS Moto Mike! ;)
  • 04-07-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    I would humbly suggest that if the gravity 29ers have a different HT angle than a Fisher then they do not fit exactly like a Fisher. It may be close, but it is not exact.

    I will respectfully submit that a .2 degree change in HT angle does not effect fit IMHO
    I mean who can feel a 'fit' difference in a 69.3 degree HT vs 69.5 degree?
  • 04-07-2011
    AZ
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    I will respectfully submit that a .2 degree change in HT angle does not effect fit IMHO
    I mean who can feel a 'fit' difference in a 69.3 degree HT vs 69.5 degree?




    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    This is way many customers are happy to learn Gravity road bikes fit exactly like a Giant Defy and that Gravity 29ers fit exactly like a Fisher 29er
  • 04-07-2011
    RDTigger
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    This is way many customers are happy to learn Gravity road bikes fit exactly like a Giant Defy and that Gravity 29ers fit exactly like a Fisher 29er


    I am sure if we measured Fisher bikes, they would be off by ~.01 in some dimension. You are splitting ant pubes with that argument AZ.
  • 04-07-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    This is way many customers are happy to learn Gravity road bikes fit exactly like a Giant Defy and that Gravity 29ers fit exactly like a Fisher 29er

    You are correct
    I should have typed 'why' not 'way'
    it seems I do mistype a lot; and I should proof read closer

    point is; no human on earth could tell the difference bewteen the fit on Gravity AL road & Defy OR Gravity 29er and Fisher 29er like mamba

    sorry for the typo
  • 04-07-2011
    AZ
    The point is that you continue to draw inaccurate comparisons to other manufacturers products with phrases like "exactly like" and "compares to" when they are not true. Then when corrected your typical response includes diversion from the facts. Keep preying on the newbs, no one else that has any knowledge of things bike related is buying into it.
  • 04-07-2011
    boomn
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    The point is that you continue to draw inaccurate comparisons to other manufacturers products with phrases like "exactly like" and "compares to" when they are not true. Then when corrected your typical response includes diversion from the facts. Keep preying on the newbs, no one else that has any knowledge of things bike related is buying into it.

    Let it go AZ. Whatever you want to say about many of his sales pitches, he is right about this one that a 0.2 degree difference is "the same" within any reasonable standard or capability of human detection. If you want to pick fights, pick more significant topics
  • 04-07-2011
    Dictatorsaurus
    I have the Giant Defy 1. As a matter fact I just came back from 1.5 hr ride.

    Bike rides superbly. I love how comfortable the cockpit is without being overstretched.

    I got the Defy used for a good price. If the Gravity is close enough to the Defy, then the geo is very well dialed.
  • 04-08-2011
    bikesdirect
    I know this post is not exactly about FS 29ers
    But there have been several requests for FS 29er info and for 'Spy' photos of FS 29er
    {post #24 & #40 and maybe others I missed}

    Although I have no pictures to spare on Motobecane FS 29er [bikes about $1500 & up]
    But I have photos on the soon under $1500 and under $1000 and matbe under $700 FS 29ers





    Of course; in addition to the Dawes Roundhouse 2900; there will be a 2901, 2902, and maybe 2903 ~~ in addition to the Gravity FXS29 ONE, there will be a TWO, THREE and maybe FOUR

    Thanks for the interest and requests on our FS 29ers
  • 04-08-2011
    subspd
    Thanks for he pics Mike! But these look a little too low rent for me. (heavy!) Still waiting on the FS moto... :thumbsup:
  • 04-08-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by subspd
    Thanks for he pics Mike! But these look a little too low rent for me. (heavy!) Still waiting on the FS moto... :thumbsup:

    Yes, I understand
    and certainly the Dawes & Graviry FS 29ers will be lower price range and heavier than the Motobecane. After over a year in development, I expect a lot out of the Moto Fantom 29 FS 4by4 line - that is why I have ordered 5 models plus a frameset option [I am excited to see those go up on our site in June]
  • 04-08-2011
    Fuze911
    Cant wait for the Moto 29FS!
  • 04-08-2011
    gmtx77
    Any ride reports on these Gravity's yet? Would like to see something comprehensive.
  • 04-09-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by gmtx77
    Any ride reports on these Gravity's yet? Would like to see something comprehensive.

    Probably a bit early for the ride reports; as these have only been shipping for a week.

    Turns out I way underestimated the strength of the 29POINT1 - which will sell out way before we get more. This is good news for supporters of 29er platform; as it shows lots of interest building from the middle price point buyers. I expect 29ers to move to entry level within the next two years and challedge the dominate position of 26ers.

    Of course, I & 3 MTB riders in my company have riden the Gravity 29er a lot during the development phase and compared to Mamba and Cobia samples [no one could tell the difference]

    I look forward to lots of ride reports posted on assorted levels for Gravity 29er by mid to late summer.
  • 04-09-2011
    Lickety Split
    That monstercross fits a niche that I could use.
    I never thought I'd say it,depending on price,I may be looking at buying one.
    Kinda like the old Kona Dew Drop.
    We'll see.
    LS
  • 04-09-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Lickety Split
    That monstercross fits a niche that I could use.
    I never thought I'd say it,depending on price,I may be looking at buying one.
    Kinda like the old Kona Dew Drop.
    We'll see.
    LS

    On Zilla 27-speed Shimano monstercross I am shotting for $599 - but if I can I will do a lower intro price for our newsletter readers

    I really like the idea of a 'swiss army' bike; that can do about everything
    And I hope the monstercross can fill that bill for some riders

    Working hard to get the Zilla XX [20-speed sram] dailed in as component makers are not really thinking 'monstercross' right now; so as some have said they are in a way 'mutant'
    I know example below will take a bit of 're-do' once I get my hands on it; but it is what I am thinking as second step up in MC

  • 04-09-2011
    PoisonDartFrog
    A few thoughts.

    The TERM "G2" is a trademark owned by GF, but the combination of tube lengths and angles are not. Anyone can reproduce it so long as they don't actually call it G2.

    I find it ironic that this forum can embrace a cheap imported frame as a good value (Performance Access XCL 29er) but simultaneously throw so much FUD about moto frames failing. So far I haven't seen a thread about chronic moto frame failures, unlike GF.

    Fit is important, more so in road bikes than MTBs. But if you know how to use Google and a tape measure, you can figure out what you need.

    Moto is no different from any other manufacturer in the industry that has frames mass-produced overseas, then adds components and sells them at a given price. They just distribute them differently, and they have a product for every price point. Not everyone who buys a bike is a 100-mile-a-week single track rider. Some people just want an inexpensive bike to ride around the neighborhood with the kids. If you are THAT critical of component spec, you are probably past the stage where ANY off-the-rack bike 100% matches what you want, anyway. You probably need to be looking at frame-up custom builds.

    I think it is an emotional thing. A "name brand" bike from an LBS that cost hundreds more with the same or lower spec MUST be better in SOME way, right?
  • 04-09-2011
    gmtx77
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    Probably a bit early for the ride reports; as these have only been shipping for a week.

    Turns out I way underestimated the strength of the 29POINT1 - which will sell out way before we get more. This is good news for supporters of 29er platform; as it shows lots of interest building from the middle price point buyers. I expect 29ers to move to entry level within the next two years and challedge the dominate position of 26ers.

    Of course, I & 3 MTB riders in my company have riden the Gravity 29er a lot during the development phase and compared to Mamba and Cobia samples [no one could tell the difference]

    I look forward to lots of ride reports posted on assorted levels for Gravity 29er by mid to late summer.


    Hey, send me a comp and I'll be happy to write up a comprehensive ride report from the point of view of a 56 year old trail/suburban rider. Heck, I'll even be happy to come by the warehouse and pick one up saving you the shipping! ;)
  • 04-09-2011
    grizzlyplumber
    Mike here is a request, most of the descriptions I see on the BD website say that the bike is lighter than most others at their price point, I would like to see actual weights (even approximate weights). I do plan to buy a ht niner in the next few months and it would help me to decide if the extra few hundred bucks is worth it to step up to the next level. Thanks.
  • 04-09-2011
    Buggyr333
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by grizzlyplumber
    Mike here is a request, most of the descriptions I see on the BD website say that the bike is lighter than most others at their price point, I would like to see actual weights (even approximate weights). I do plan to buy a ht niner in the next few months and it would help me to decide if the extra few hundred bucks is worth it to step up to the next level. Thanks.

    And maybe saying the exact thing about every bike on the website should be re-thought out. I'd rather have one sentence that is relevant to the bike than 3 paragraphs of the same thing I have seen over and over and over again. Something as simple as the frame weight, or how much tire clearance the frame has, or what makes the bike different or better than other bikes you have to offer on your website, to help people sort through the endless options on bikesdirect.
  • 04-09-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by grizzlyplumber
    Mike here is a request, most of the descriptions I see on the BD website say that the bike is lighter than most others at their price point, I would like to see actual weights (even approximate weights). I do plan to buy a ht niner in the next few months and it would help me to decide if the extra few hundred bucks is worth it to step up to the next level. Thanks.


    I WOULD LOVE AN INDUSTRY STANDARD ON ADVERTISED BIKE WEIGHTS
    in fact, I have advocated one for 28 years

    An association of bike manufacturers which agreed to standards and had say a seal to display next to advertised weight would help everyone

    Instead, the we get a situation where some manufactures do not publish weights; some retailers routinely understate weights; some manufacturers 'fudge' on weights and where industry leaders have the following:

    Specialized - nothing stated I can find

    Trek says "Why don’t you list the weights of your bikes? Can you tell me the weight of a particular model?
    Due to manufacturing tolerances in all the parts that make up a bicycle there will always be some variation in the final weight of the complete bike even when the model and size remain the same. As a result, any weight we list would be a rough approximation of the weight of the bike you are looking at. Most of our models come in multiple sizes which add to the variation in the measured weights within a given model. It is simply not feasible to weigh a wide sample of bikes in all the different sizes offered only to provide numbers that will still lack the accuracy which we know our customers expect. We understand how important weight can be in making your purchasing decision and for that reason we suggest going to your local dealer and weighing the actual bike you are looking at in its fully assembled state. This way you can be assured that the weight you are getting is accurate for the exact bike you have selected."


    Giant says "How much does this bike weigh? It’s a common question, and rightly so. But the truth is, there are no industry standards for claiming bike weights—and this leads to a lot of misinformation. Variances exist based on size, frame material, finish and hardware. And as bikes get lighter, these differences become more critical. At Giant, we believe the only way to truly know the weight of any particular bike is to find out for yourself at your local retailer."

    Cannondale says "WEIGHT: Don't see a weight listed for this bike? Wondering why that is? Well, we used to list our weights based upon medium or 56 cm frame and err on the side of caution when we know there will be variances due to welds, paint thicknesses, etc. But some of our competitors are weighing their small or extra small frames and rounding down. Then you're left wondering what's going on and making important buying decisions based upon faulty information. That's not right.
    So because weight is too important to you as a consumer, we encourage a healthy bit of skepticism over published weights. Go to your local dealer, see it, feel it, weigh it and test ride it for yourself. We're that confident. You should be, too"


    I love to compete and we have shown we can supply some of the lightest bikes in the industry and at any given price point a BD bike is normally the lightest available. But with no standards and so many incorrect weight claims out there; there is no advantage to us or to customers for us to publish weights.

    Maybe we can all hope for an industry wide standard to be adopted
  • 04-09-2011
    Buggyr333
    Well I feel that other manufacturers don't necessarily need to publish weights, because, as they said multiple times, you can go to a local dealer. Bikesdirect bikes however, you just have to order and cross your fingers, so I think that they should have a rough estimation on the weight (the MotobecaneUSA website has weights listed though, doesnt it?)
  • 04-09-2011
    roadie scum
    Weak sauce, publish the weights, don't use what others do or don't do as an excuse.
  • 04-09-2011
    subspd
    I believe on the Moto Ti frames and some others as well they do have weights listed. Something in the 24lb area I believe? But on the cheaper bikes they don't. I think my fantom 29er came in at 32lb for a medium.

    Since I have been shopping for a FS 29er all of them are within a pound of eachother. (anthem x, stumpy fsr and rumblefish) they were all right within a pound of 28lb in medium.

    I have decided that buying bikes is worse than buying a used car. They will tell you anything with no facts to back it up. I have found it is best to do an independent investigation by asking people who own the bikes for their experience and if possible weights as well. That goes for BD bikes or anyone else's for that matter.
  • 04-09-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by roadie scum
    Weak sauce, publish the weights, don't use what others do or don't do as an excuse.


    Not an excuse
    been dealing with this for 30 years; by trying to explain the weight question to each customer - I would much prefer to just post all the weights

    BUT when customers are routinely told an unrealist weight; you do not get a chance to respond unless they ask.

    Now every LBS in your area maybe totally straight up; however, if you saw the number of e-mails we get that say something like 'the bike shop told me their $700 road bike is just like the one ridden by Lance and weighes 12 lbs; what have you got that beats that?' OR something on that order; you would understand why I have been pushing the idea of an industry wide standard for close to 30 years.

    It is funny how about everyone MTB people ask about is quoted at around 25 or 26 lbs; when in fact the vast majority of mountain bikes sold in bike shops weigh 30 lbs

    If there was an industry standard; I would be the first to signup for the program
    And if we could get Trek, Giant, and Specialized to comment to it; everyone would follow.
    Think about it; who who have the most to gain from an industry standard? who would have the most to lose?
  • 04-09-2011
    mvi
    Not to steal the thread but does bikesdirect have any 29'r bike with an overseize fork axle (15-20mm) or even a tapered headtube?
  • 04-09-2011
    PoisonDartFrog
    This weight issue is a no-win for BD. If they publish weights, and the listed weight is above the actual delivered weight, everyone will scream shenanigans. If their advertised weight is high, everyone will say it's because they are "lower quality".

    At the end of the day, why should they offer up a measure that even other major manufacturers don't? Sure, you can go to an LBS and weight the actual bike you intend to buy. If they have it in stock, that is. If not, you will have to order it, sight (and weight) unseen. Just like ordering online from BD or Nashbar or Pricepoint or Performance or Sun and Ski or REI, etc.

    In my opinion, the uncomfortable truth is that the bike industry's distribution and sales model is being rendered obsolete by the Internet. There is absolutely no valid reason to got to an LBS to buy a mass-produced, off-the-rack bike. Saying otherwise is just the industry's attempt to artificially prop up an outdated biz model.

    And before we get the inevitable "support your LBS" argument, first realize that a bike shop makes their money on service and accessories. The margin on bikes is very slim.

    Anyway, I don't own a BD bike but I do own an SE Stout that I got off of Nashbar. I would consder BD if I were in the market, and I have recommended it to friends who want to get into MTBing without investing a lot of money.
  • 04-09-2011
    AZ
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by PoisonDartFrog
    This weight issue is a no-win for BD. If they publish weights, and the listed weight is above the actual delivered weight, everyone will scream shenanigans. If their advertised weight is high, everyone will say it's because they are "lower quality".

    At the end of the day, why should they offer up a measure that even other major manufacturers don't? Sure, you can go to an LBS and weight the actual bike you intend to buy. If they have it in stock, that is. If not, you will have to order it, sight (and weight) unseen. Just like ordering online from BD or Nashbar or Pricepoint or Performance or Sun and Ski or REI, etc.

    In my opinion, the uncomfortable truth is that the bike industry's distribution and sales model is being rendered obsolete by the Internet. There is absolutely no valid reason to got to an LBS to buy a mass-produced, off-the-rack bike. Saying otherwise is just the industry's attempt to artificially prop up an outdated biz model.

    And before we get the inevitable "support your LBS" argument, first realize that a bike shop makes their money on service and accessories. The margin on bikes is very slim.

    Anyway, I don't own a BD bike but I do own an SE Stout that I got off of Nashbar. I would consder BD if I were in the market, and I have recommended it to friends who want to get into MTBing without investing a lot of money.




    Try to buy a new Cannondale over the internet and then tell me there is no valid reason to go buy at the LBS.
  • 04-09-2011
    TwoHeadsBrewing
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by PoisonDartFrog
    This weight issue is a no-win for BD. If they publish weights, and the listed weight is above the actual delivered weight, everyone will scream shenanigans. If their advertised weight is high, everyone will say it's because they are "lower quality".

    At the end of the day, why should they offer up a measure that even other major manufacturers don't? Sure, you can go to an LBS and weight the actual bike you intend to buy. If they have it in stock, that is. If not, you will have to order it, sight (and weight) unseen. Just like ordering online from BD or Nashbar or Pricepoint or Performance or Sun and Ski or REI, etc.

    In my opinion, the uncomfortable truth is that the bike industry's distribution and sales model is being rendered obsolete by the Internet. There is absolutely no valid reason to got to an LBS to buy a mass-produced, off-the-rack bike. Saying otherwise is just the industry's attempt to artificially prop up an outdated biz model.

    And before we get the inevitable "support your LBS" argument, first realize that a bike shop makes their money on service and accessories. The margin on bikes is very slim.

    Anyway, I don't own a BD bike but I do own an SE Stout that I got off of Nashbar. I would consder BD if I were in the market, and I have recommended it to friends who want to get into MTBing without investing a lot of money.

    I think there will always be a reason for local bike stores. Some people are just not ready to drop $$$$ on a product sight unseen, with no fitting support, and especially if they have no technical ability or tools. As a DIY sort of guy, I found the two bikes I bought from BD to be a fantastic deal, but it's definitely not for everyone. There will always be a demand for personal contact and some sort of human connection in the bike industry, as with almost every other industry. Some people do not want to go to an online forum to figure out which bikes are good deals, how to assemble a bike, how warranty support is handled. Many people would prefer to pay an extra few hundred bucks and have someone at the bike store do that for them.

    I have a feeling that these people also pay others to mow their lawn, change the oil in their car, and vacuum their floors. Nothing wrong with that of course, just saying some people would rather spend $$$ than do these things themselves.

    The other part of the argument is super high end bikes and boutique manufacturers. BD certainly has no shot at that market segment, at least at this time.
  • 04-09-2011
    cg61doc
    Been riding a Fantom 29er for about four years now. I'm 6' 6", 230 lbs. Riding the 21 inch frame. It's not entirely stock as I have broken components over the years. The only thing I changed without breaking was a 440mm seat post and Kona Cowan handlebars. Bike weighs 31 lbs 4 oz with tubed kenda small block eights on it. Bike has over 6000 miles on it. Probably 5000 of those single track. I'm not a gentle rider. I have had 8-10 different seats on the bike due to the fact my fat a$$ keeps bending the seat rails. Folks can say whatever they want about BD. If you can beat the crap out of a bike for that long and there has been no catastrophic failure of the frame/fork set up, I'm thinking they pretty much got it right. I also have a 2010 Kona Hei Hei 29 for my FS rig. (Sorry Mike, couldn't wait). It comes in at 28 lbs 12 oz with a GD seat post. When the FS BD rig comes online, I will get one as I get real jittery when one of my bikes is down and I can't get my ride on. The first BD/MB I got proved to me the durability of their product and it is the best bike for the bucks that I can find. Everyone gets worked up about weight issues. A pound here, a few ounces there. I carry around 10lbs in my camelback because when I smash something on the trail, I don't want to walk out. Maybe an issue for the 130lb guy riding, but not at 230lbs... They're making a great product at a price that gets folks on the trails. Keep it up.
  • 04-10-2011
    PoisonDartFrog
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    Try to buy a new Cannondale over the internet and then tell me there is no valid reason to go buy at the LBS.

    Why would I want to buy a CannonFail?

    Seriously tho, I never wrote there is no reason for LBSes, I wrote that artificial moratorium some manufacturers place on Internet sales is outdated.
  • 04-10-2011
    floydlippencott
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by PoisonDartFrog
    Why would I want to buy a CannonFail?




    Wouldn't want to ruin the perfect track record of buying BD junk would we?
  • 04-10-2011
    Buggyr333
    Cannonfail? Cannondales are great and all, offer great features that other manufacturers don't offer, but their availability and pricing put major strikes against them in my book.
  • 04-10-2011
    AZ
    My CAAD 9 is one of the best buy's I have ever made.
  • 04-10-2011
    PoisonDartFrog
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by floydlippencott
    Wouldn't want to ruin the perfect track record of buying BD junk would we?

    I definitely wouldn't by from BD if I was an image squirrel who was more concerned with the brand recognition of my frame by other riders at the trailhead.
  • 04-10-2011
    mtnbikej
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    I WOULD LOVE AN INDUSTRY STANDARD ON ADVERTISED BIKE WEIGHTS
    in fact, I have advocated one for 28 years

    An association of bike manufacturers which agreed to standards and had say a seal to display next to advertised weight would help everyone

    Instead, the we get a situation where some manufactures do not publish weights; some retailers routinely understate weights; some manufacturers 'fudge' on weights and where industry leaders have the following:

    Specialized - nothing stated I can find

    Trek says "Why don’t you list the weights of your bikes? Can you tell me the weight of a particular model?
    Due to manufacturing tolerances in all the parts that make up a bicycle there will always be some variation in the final weight of the complete bike even when the model and size remain the same. As a result, any weight we list would be a rough approximation of the weight of the bike you are looking at. Most of our models come in multiple sizes which add to the variation in the measured weights within a given model. It is simply not feasible to weigh a wide sample of bikes in all the different sizes offered only to provide numbers that will still lack the accuracy which we know our customers expect. We understand how important weight can be in making your purchasing decision and for that reason we suggest going to your local dealer and weighing the actual bike you are looking at in its fully assembled state. This way you can be assured that the weight you are getting is accurate for the exact bike you have selected."


    Giant says "How much does this bike weigh? It’s a common question, and rightly so. But the truth is, there are no industry standards for claiming bike weights—and this leads to a lot of misinformation. Variances exist based on size, frame material, finish and hardware. And as bikes get lighter, these differences become more critical. At Giant, we believe the only way to truly know the weight of any particular bike is to find out for yourself at your local retailer."

    Cannondale says "WEIGHT: Don't see a weight listed for this bike? Wondering why that is? Well, we used to list our weights based upon medium or 56 cm frame and err on the side of caution when we know there will be variances due to welds, paint thicknesses, etc. But some of our competitors are weighing their small or extra small frames and rounding down. Then you're left wondering what's going on and making important buying decisions based upon faulty information. That's not right.
    So because weight is too important to you as a consumer, we encourage a healthy bit of skepticism over published weights. Go to your local dealer, see it, feel it, weigh it and test ride it for yourself. We're that confident. You should be, too"


    I love to compete and we have shown we can supply some of the lightest bikes in the industry and at any given price point a BD bike is normally the lightest available. But with no standards and so many incorrect weight claims out there; there is no advantage to us or to customers for us to publish weights.

    Maybe we can all hope for an industry wide standard to be adopted


    Here is how I see it.......

    I can easily go into my local dealer and they will gladly throw any bike up on the shop scale and tell me the weight.

    Now I went to the local dealer and asked them to throw one of your bikes on the shop scale and tell me the weight.....oh, yeah! They can't, because you are the only one to sell them.

    So it is impossible to find out the weight on any of your bikes.

    You post tire sizes, even though there is no accepted industry standard as to how to measure a tire.
  • 04-10-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    My CAAD 9 is one of the best buy's I have ever made.


    Nice bike; I like the CAAD 9

    and if an AL framed road bike like a CAAD 10 [with same geo; tubing; and ride] comes out with fantastic spec at a super price and a different DT decal; it could be a good buy for someone also
  • 04-11-2011
    unagidon
    Mike - so when are the Ti 29er hardtails going to be in stock again?

    BTW - as a business person, I admire your business model. Your job would be my dream job. I would seriously consider reducing # of SKUs though. Maybe market 3 brands only - not point having Dawes, Motobecane, Windsor, etc. when they're currently not very segmented.
  • 04-12-2011
    bikesdirect
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by unagidon
    Mike - so when are the Ti 29er hardtails going to be in stock again?

    BTW - as a business person, I admire your business model. Your job would be my dream job. I would seriously consider reducing # of SKUs though. Maybe market 3 brands only - not point having Dawes, Motobecane, Windsor, etc. when they're currently not very segmented.


    Thanks for the input

    Ti 29er hardtails should be in within a week
    Should send out newsletter on that as soon as they come in
  • 04-12-2011
    2tallrid3r
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by bikesdirect
    Thanks for the input

    Ti 29er hardtails should be in within a week
    Should send out newsletter on that as soon as they come in

    Mike,

    A cannibalized FLY owner here and a fan of BD. Haters will hate, but those of us on here with more common sense than snobbery recognize the value of your bikes. Unfortunately, you still aren't giving any love to the CLYDES! With all your new bikes, I don't see a 23" or above frames? Guess I will have to continue to buy your bikes for the great parts and continue using other frames.
  • 04-18-2011
    Trawets
    I think Im going to order a Gravity 29point1.Trying to decide between the Talon 29er 2 and this bike, to save $300 Im leaning towards the Gravity. Not a huge fan of ordering site unseen, but it looks like a great starter into the world of the 29er.
  • 04-20-2011
    crash_harder
    just got the gravity point3 and love it. i can't compare it to anything but i'm 6'2", 240lbs and the bike hasn't given me any trouble. don't have a scale so i can't give an exact weight but all the components are great!! i will be going to VA in 2 weeks for some real trail riding and i'll let ya'll know how it does... :thumbsup:
  • 04-20-2011
    Buggyr333
    Pics or it didn't happen! lol.
  • 04-20-2011
    TwoNin9r
    i know one for sure (and possibly 2) people looking very forward to the moto FS 29er. with a decent component group and a good rear sus. i think this is going to be GREAT for all those who can't afford a 3k+ bike but want essentially the same product
  • 04-20-2011
    AZ
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by 4x4runner
    i know one for sure (and possibly 2) people looking very forward to the moto FS 29er. with a decent component group and a good rear sus. i think this is going to be GREAT for all those who can't afford a 3k+ bike but want essentially the same product




    Good rear suspension is a relative term, good compared to what? Many rear suspension designs are known for being pogo sticks while others are very good performers. Time will tell if these are going to be winners or not.
  • 04-20-2011
    RDTigger
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Buggyr333
    Pics or it didn't happen! lol.

    +1... Pics please... I had a hard time deciding on which model to get. I was hooked on the fork possibilities.

    I'm waiting on my Point 5 to arrive, probably tomorrow evening according to tracking.
  • 04-20-2011
    Trawets
    I just order the point 1 today. I know it's entry level,but it will be a great way to get me out again. I will post pics when I get it.
  • 04-20-2011
    TwoNin9r
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    Good rear suspension is a relative term, good compared to what? Many rear suspension designs are known for being pogo sticks while others are very good performers. Time will tell if these are going to be winners or not.

    yeah i just mean something comparable to the mid range FS stuff out right now.
  • 04-21-2011
    Jay5280
    Hi, I just recently decided to get a 29er and would like to spend some where between 4 to 6 hundred dollars on my first bike also take into account that I am 6'1" and about 280. So if any one knows a good entry lvl bike that would be great, I have been leaning towards a GT 29er since it looks like it can take a beating but then I stumbled upon this thread about BT's Gravity and would like to know what you all thin k?
  • 04-21-2011
    crash_harder
    I'm doing this from my phone so forgive the crapiness... rode a couple trails today at the state park and am very impressed so far, next weekend will be the test in va. And of course I can't figure out how to post the pic from my phone... sorry.
  • 04-21-2011
    Jay5280
    Grav3
    Awesome keep me updated on the Gravity and how it's riding.
  • 04-22-2011
    crash_harder
    Will do, as soon as we get back tomorrow ill post some pics.
  • 04-22-2011
    RDTigger
    Life is keeping me from completing my Point5 assembly...that along with some missing tools and uncertainty!

    Noob wrencher at work here people.. LOL
  • 04-22-2011
    Mace244
    Well I took the bait and bought one. I actually wanted the gravity2 but it was sold out. Didn't have enough cash for the 3.

    My last bike was a specialized about five years ago. It served me just fi e with the riding I did. Weekeend warrior...... Maybe rode it four hours a week.

    So I figure this should be capable enough compared to a 800 dollar specialized I bought five years ago.


    Bought it last night, says will arrive on Thursday.

    I'll post a review when I get it.

    I have been reading a bunch of reviews on bikesdirect and motobecane.... And tons of mixed reviews.

    Maybe I am a sucker for falling love with the value for components.... Pricing.


    I am going to try to assemble it myself, I called four local bike shops and they want between 75-100 bucks to assemble it.


    For that price I could have bought a specialized hard rock disc sport...... Which was the other bike I was thinking about.


    I hope I don't regret it




    Wish me luck!
  • 04-22-2011
    Vecsus
    Interesting how so many bikesdirect customers have single-digit post counts and no pics of the bikes they just picked up. New riders without a camera or just too excited to snap a pic? :rolleyes:
  • 04-22-2011
    Mace244
    I really hope your talking about me and the fact I said in my post I just ordered it and it wad coming on Thursday.

    Another bikes direct hater I assume?
  • 04-22-2011
    RDTigger
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vecsus
    Interesting how so many bikesdirect customers have single-digit post counts and no pics of the bikes they just picked up. New riders without a camera or just too excited to snap a pic? :rolleyes:


    Count on it...as soon as I get the assembly finished. The hydro and front fork alignment is off and haven't figured it out as of yet. Taking it to have the last few steps done in the morning and look forward to snapping shots. :thumbsup:

    It's minefield of Point 5 bike parts on my front porch....but it will be good to roll it out tomorrow morning!
  • 04-22-2011
    AZ
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Mace244
    I really hope your talking about me and the fact I said in my post I just ordered it and it wad coming on Thursday.

    Another bikes direct hater I assume?




    You know what they say about assumptions, right? Great second post.
  • 04-22-2011
    OnaMTBtrailisME
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vecsus
    Interesting how so many bikesdirect customers have single-digit post counts and no pics of the bikes they just picked up. New riders without a camera or just too excited to snap a pic? :rolleyes:


    Just let these people enjoy their freaking bikes! Who cares if they buy from BD or LBS. You do realize that some people don't have the cash to drop on a Trek, Giant, or whatever brand that suits your needs. Stop being a f****** bike snob!

    To the OP, sorry about the rant. I am very interested in seeing pics. I also was also looking at BD. I am interested in getting a bike just to loan out or make a quick trip to the grocery store. So please let us know how it goes.

    Just make sure you clear the pics with Vecsus first. Cause we have a single-digist post and we clearly are not in the same league as him :rolleyes: You really went there....you insulted someone about their thread count...you are a tool!
  • 04-22-2011
    floydlippencott
    I'm going to play devils advocate and side with vecsus. These BD threads are filled with posters who otherwise add nothing to the MTBR community. They come into one inflammatory thread and are gone never to be heard from again. Has to make one wonder if they really are shills, especially when they post no pics, generally insinuate that anyone who buys an expensive bike is a fool, how we got took for buying from the LBS etc. So I say to all of you BD minions, step up and become part of the community or EFF off.
  • 04-22-2011
    Mace244
    As soon as I actually take shipment of the bike ill throw up pics. It seems as though if a member actually bought a bike ffom bikes direct, and says they like it.... they must work for them. That is the feeling I got from reading all the threads about them the last couple days.

    U buy a bike, join the forum, post about it, and people say u work for the company. Lol. Believe me, if I worked for them, I could probably afford a santa Cruz or something better.

    Anyways.... ill make a new post Thursday about the gravity once it arrives. Thanks for the warm welcoming to the forums. Ha.
  • 04-22-2011
    OnaMTBtrailisME
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by floydlippencott
    I'm going to play devils advocate and side with versus. These BD threads are filled with posters who otherwise add nothing to the MTBR community. They come into one inflammatory thread and are gone never to be heard from again. Has to make one wonder if they really are shills, especially when they post no pics, generally insinuate that anyone who buys an expensive bike is a fool, how we got took for buying from the LBS etc. So I say to all of you BD minions, step up and become part of the community or EFF off.


    I don't give crap to anybody about what they buy. Cause it really does not matter what he/she rides, just as long as he/she has fun and is getting some good exercise. I am all about supporting my LBS. In fact, I do 95% of buisness with them. However, why do I want to spend $700 or $800 on a loaner/commuter when I can get one from BD for half that. And yes, I have looked at CL and there is nothing but crap. Also, how do you become part of the community? By not buying from BD?
  • 04-22-2011
    AZ
    Not all the BD guy's are shills, but you have to wonder about some of them.
  • 04-22-2011
    Mace244
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by AZ.MTNS
    Not all the BD guy's are shills, but you have to wonder about some of them.



    no, i hear ya.

    and i dont know if any of the negative post were aimed towards my first post... just seems like in EVERY post i read about one of their bikes.. someone says something good about it, and then people jump on them for being a shill.

    makes it tough for people like myself to

    1) do research, and actually get real world reviews

    2) post and not get accused of being a shill for a company i know nothing about.





    i HOPE i can rave about the bike --- but to be honest, i havent gotten it yet, and maybe it will be a piece of ****? i dont know.

    but if it is... I will write a review telling people to stay away from it.

    Look for an honest review on thursday when it arrives and how easy/hard it is to put together.


    then in a couple weeks another review about how it rides.
  • 04-22-2011
    AZ
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Mace244
    no, i hear ya.

    and i dont know if any of the negative post were aimed towards my first post... just seems like in EVERY post i read about one of their bikes.. someone says something good about it, and then people jump on them for being a shill.

    makes it tough for people like myself to

    1) do research, and actually get real world reviews

    2) post and not get accused of being a shill for a company i know nothing about.





    i HOPE i can rave about the bike --- but to be honest, i havent gotten it yet, and maybe it will be a piece of ****? i dont know.

    but if it is... I will write a review telling people to stay away from it.

    Look for an honest review on thursday when it arrives and how easy/hard it is to put together.


    then in a couple weeks another review about how it rides.




    Right on, post pics.
  • 04-22-2011
    Bbc84
    Im interested in the review, after the research I have done, I wanted the Windsor Comp Pro, but they are out of stock till June, so I am now considering the Gravity, but havent seen lots of reviews since its a new bike.
  • 04-22-2011
    Mace244
    i wanted the gravity point2 or whatever its called. the one UP from the one i bought... but they are sold out.

    I emailed them 2 days ago, to see when anymore would be coming.. if ever. i actually got an email back from them tonight saying about 2 weeks and they would have the gravity2 back in stock.


    too late --- i had already bought the gravity1. it is about 150 bucks cheaper ... so i guess i wont beat myself up over it.

    if it was a $50 difference or something i would be pissed i didnt wait.



    I will throw it on a scale also --- since i know a lot of people are interested in weights for these bikes.
  • 04-22-2011
    RDTigger
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Bbc84
    Im interested in the review, after the research I have done, I wanted the Windsor Comp Pro, but they are out of stock till June, so I am now considering the Gravity, but havent seen lots of reviews since its a new bike.



    It's not "G2" geometry but it does have the same geo #'s as equal frame size Fisher's. That's what got my attention. I wanted the 3 or 4 model but the Reba fork was sounding like a killer option with Elixir 5 brakes.

    I'm having issues setting up my hydraulics and finding teflon grease I can get my hands on so I will have pics up on the site tomorrow.
  • 04-23-2011
    crash_harder
    pics
    heres the pics... i wonder if all the haters will accept me now that i have "given" to the community?!?! :confused: and just so you know, i don't plan on giving anything, i come here to admire other folks rides, look at pics and learn what i can cuz i'm a noob.... i laugh when i read some posts and raise my eyebrows at other posts... BD was the answer to my problem, my wife would NOT let me spend 1K on a bike, she wanted me to be on a $200 bike so when i convinced her that $750 for a great bike was a good deal she gave me the ok and if your not married you can't say a word about the wife being boss!! hehe...

    to the non-haters, i look forward to learning from you and sharing my experiances. :D

    haters... :nono:
  • 04-23-2011
    crash_harder
    trying again to post pics...

    it keeps telling me "upload error"??? any tips on what i'm doing wrong, they are jpeg
  • 04-23-2011
    boomn
    pics might be too large, or something on the server could be broken. Your best bet is to upload them to photobucket, imgur, or some other image site that lets you link
  • 04-23-2011
    roadie scum
    [QUOTE=crash_harder] and just so you know, i don't plan on giving anything,[QUOTE]



    And they wonder why no respect.
  • 04-23-2011
    crash_harder
    5 Attachment(s)
    ok, downloaded picaso from googel adn did some resizeing... here we go again:thumbsup:
  • 04-23-2011
    crash_harder
    so roadie scum, just what would you like me to give?? i don't need your respect in order to enjoy my mtb experiances... but i am curious of what it is your looking for?? as i said before i look forward to reading posts and looking at pics and sharing my experiances...

    what do you give??

    this is my last post on this B.S. subject of giveing and respect...:madman: i have better things to do. i do look forward to the rest of the stuff this great website has to offer...

    now i know how to do the pics so there will be more, next weekend is VA trip so that'll be fun!!
    :D
  • 04-23-2011
    AZ
    Dude, make up your mind. Your going to give, not going too, your worse than bi polar woman. Make up your mind (one of them) and stick with the plan.
  • 04-23-2011
    Harry Zimmermann
    Only a fool shops at a bike shop. Unless of course you need something right now, or you need some advice, or you have jacked up your drivetrain to the point the chain won't stay on. Then it's nice that the "fools" in your community have been good enough to help keep the bike shop there for your convenience.

    Only a fool pays for advertising when email accounts and MTBR accounts are free. Duh!
  • 04-23-2011
    crash_harder
    AZ, i made up my mind... i'm going to do what i said... :rolleyes:
  • 04-23-2011
    Vecsus
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Harry Zimmermann
    Only a fool shops at a bike shop.

    :nono:
    Then call me a fool. A fool that gets his bike worked on ahead of the ham-fisted idiots that buy parts online then drag their bikes into the shop when they screw up the install. Developing a good relationship with your LBS is worth a bit of mark-up. I buy most of my parts online and install them myself but still spend about half my bike money at the LBS.
  • 04-23-2011
    Harry Zimmermann
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Vecsus
    :nono:
    Then call me a fool. A fool that gets his bike worked on ahead of the ham-fisted idiots that buy parts online then drag their bikes into the shop when they screw up the install. Developing a good relationship with your LBS is worth a bit of mark-up. I buy most of my parts online and install them myself but still spend about half my bike money at the LBS.

    You might want to check the calibration on your Sarcast-O-Meter.
  • 04-23-2011
    Jay5280
    Ok, I came on here to ask if the GT Peace 9r or GT Karakoram 3.0 29er Bike - 2011 or maybe one of the Gravity 1 would be a good starter 29er component and durability wise for a 6'1" 280lb new rider, so what do you guys think?
  • 04-23-2011
    Buggyr333
    I'm relatively certain that the reason that most people buying BD bikes don't have many posts, is because 90% of them are buying their first MTB in years, so why the hell would they have 300+ posts? They come on here looking for answers, and we should give them answers. I mean come on, someone new is trying to get into the wonderful world of MTBing and you people accuse them of being paid advertisers. I have 5 bikes, and my motobecane is still my absolute favorite.
  • 04-23-2011
    Jay5280
    Thanks! Buggyr333 that's exactly why I am here
  • 04-23-2011
    Jay5280
    it looks like I maybe able to get upto 300 posts just on this thread
  • 04-23-2011
    Jay5280
    Thanks for the pics
  • 04-23-2011
    katalinagirl
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Clones123
    Who moderates the moderators? Time for a Super Mod to step in.

    Busting out a vendor in public for answering questions about his product is 'subtle'? I guess mods can swing a big stick and only little people need to be subtle. Mike seems like an alright guy and his products are a unique and popular niche in the market. The information he provides is of great interest - especially upcoming products. MTBR should be encouraging vendor participation not rudely shutting it down.


    I couldn't agree more...I have been looking for more information myself about Motobecane USA and their line of bikes, etc at bikesdirect. It was a most pleasant surprise to actually find a rep in this here forum and read the updates on what is up an coming in regards to the ti frames and fs frames for the 29ers. Seems like the possibility of the moderator having an issue with the brands being discussed might be the problem here. It is not very often if not at all that you can actually talk one on one with a rep in a forum about their line of bikes...
  • 04-23-2011
    Harry Zimmermann
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by katalinagirl
    I couldn't agree more...I have been looking for more information myself about Motobecane USA and their line of bikes, etc at bikesdirect. It was a most pleasant surprise to actually find a rep in this here forum and read the updates on what is up an coming in regards to the ti frames and fs frames for the 29ers. Seems like the possibility of the moderator having an issue with the brands being discussed might be the problem here. It is not very often if not at all that you can actually talk one on one with a rep in a forum about their line of bikes...

    Do you agree that it would be sleazy for someone selling bikes to come on here attempting to impersonate "satisfied customers," *if* that were to happen? Yes or no, please.
  • 04-23-2011
    katalinagirl
    Motobecane Fantom 29PRO SL
    I just bought a Motobecane Fantom 29PRO SL from bikesdirect and will receive it on Monday...Honestly I can't wait and have as well ordered several components to switch out. I will be posting pics of how it looks stock and then after my upgrades. I have previously owned and did some racing years back on a 99 GT XCR, '06 Santa Cruz Blur XC as well as a '00 Santa Cruz Superlight. I was wanting to build my own bike really this time around and with the price of this I couldn't go wrong and as well moving on to a 29er setup that is hardtail.

    I will be upgrading the stock cranks to the Race Face Atlas AM (purple of course) and the matching Atlas AM bar, Race Face headset, new stem undetermined just yet as I ended up getting the 13" frame and so I need to size myself up 1st. As well picking up a new seatpost and seat, will be switching out the front derailler to an XTR. Will be selling off all of the new parts I remove on Ebay to help offset my new upgrades..so far my out of pocket for the complete bike and parts so far that I've ordered (crankset ($209 alone),bar,headset,grips, purple spoke nipples, is at $1294..not bad considering I've owned a $4.5k blur xc previously. Another $150 worth of upgrades and I'll be set.

    Just thought I'd share
  • 04-23-2011
    katalinagirl
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Harry Zimmermann
    Do you agree that it would be sleazy for someone selling bikes to come on here attempting to impersonate "satisfied customers," *if* that were to happen? Yes or no, please.


    Sure it is sleazy to do but most can make that determination for themselves and that is certainly nothing new on Forums or in product feedbacks for employees of a company to post as a HAPPY customer with only outstanding comments. Mike is legit on here and I found his posts very informative to say the least and as well he was very accommodating in his responses to everyone.

    There are trolls everywhere and not just in bike forums.
  • 04-23-2011
    Harry Zimmermann
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by katalinagirl
    Sure it is sleazy to do but most can make that determination for themselves and that is certainly nothing new on Forums or in product feedbacks for employees of a company to post as a HAPPY customer with only outstanding comments. Mike is legit on here and I found his posts very informative to say the least and as well he was very accommodating in his responses to everyone.

    There are trolls everywhere and not just in bike forums.


    Thank you. ;)

    Just out of curiosity, how do you know Mike is "legit on here"? Is there some source of information I have missed?
  • 04-23-2011
    katalinagirl
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Harry Zimmermann
    Thank you. ;)

    Just out of curiosity, how do you know Mike is "legit on here"? Is there some source of information I have missed?


    Only because some of what he had to say on here supports exactly what I was informed of personally from one of the reps that I have been going back and forth with the past few weeks via email. I don't think a troll would have known the answers and as well some of what he had mentioned on the up and coming in regards to dates and such.
  • 04-23-2011
    Harry Zimmermann
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by katalinagirl
    Only because some of what he had to say on here supports exactly what I was informed of personally from one of the reps that I have been going back and forth with the past few weeks via email. I don't think a troll would have known the answers and as well some of what he had mentioned on the up and coming in regards to dates and such.

    I don't think anyone doubts that Mike is the owner of BD. :rolleyes: That's what you meant? Really?
  • 04-23-2011
    RDTigger
    Whatta day... Took the Gravity Point5 in pieces to the last LBS option.

    ...turns out i found the LBS for me. They do rentals and were crazy busy with those but managed to get mine setup in just a few hours and added that personal touch.

    They finished setting up my bike and have it tuned out righteously. Talked to them when I picked it up and the wrencher went ahead and degreased my chain in 2 gentle solvents and applied the first coat of rocknroll for me with no charge.

    They didn't realize it had hydraulics at first this morning but were really helpful and even reminded me to bring it back for retuning the "break in" wear when the time came...Free of charge.

    To anyone who is not a pro, take it to your bike to the best shop you can find and have it checked out. Mine had a bent derailleur hanger.

    Pics are really big... See more in my Bike Photobucket album










    Only thing that really needs attention is the pedals... plain and not my liking. Everything else is just friggin' saweet! Everything else is pretty good stuff, The cassete wasn't listed by brand/model but I wasn't disappointed.
    • Cassette: SRAM 1050 10 speed



    Been 25 years since I had a Quality bike, this one is making up for that one being stolen. :thumbsup:
  • 04-23-2011
    katalinagirl
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by RDTigger
    Whatta day... Took the Gravity Point5 in pieces to the last LBS option.

    ...turns out i found the LBS for me. They do rentals and were crazy busy with those but managed to get mine setup in just a few hours and added that personal touch.

    They finished setting up my bike and have it tuned out righteously. Talked to them when I picked it up and the wrencher went ahead and degreased my chain in 2 gentle solvents and applied the first coat of rocknroll for me with no charge.

    They didn't realize it had hydraulics at first this morning but were really helpful and even reminded me to bring it back for retuning the "break in" wear when the time came...Free of charge.

    To anyone who is not a pro, take it to your bike to the best shop you can find and have it checked out. Mine had a bent derailleur hanger.

    Only thing that really needs attention is the pedals... plain and not my liking. Everything else is just friggin' saweet! Everything else is pretty good stuff, The cassete wasn't listed by brand/model but I wasn't disappointed.
    • Cassette: SRAM 1050 10 speed



    Been 25 years since I had a Quality bike, this one is making up for that one being stolen. :thumbsup:

    It is a nice bike :) Thanks for sharing with us..I was leaning towards this one as my basic to build on, I really preferred the mattblack and the tube design...my Fantom 29PRO SL Moto will arrive on Monday in brushed silver..still yet may have it painted a flat white or black
  • 04-23-2011
    RDTigger
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by katalinagirl
    It is a nice bike :) Thanks for sharing with us..I was leaning towards this one as my basic to build on, I really preferred the mattblack and the tube design...my Fantom 29PRO SL Moto will arrive on Monday in brushed silver..still yet may have it painted a flat white or black

    Thanks Kat, I was sold on the geometry. Originally i was wanting one of the Motobecane's but then Mike told me about the Gravity models and they have the exact specs as a G2 bike, just minus 5mm on the offset fork. I can't tell the difference! The weight is right at 28lbs according to the bathroom scales and I couldn't be happier. (The kmart 26er gift felt heavier than this 29er, lol)

    I wanted the Point4 at first but they sold out to fast. I didn't like the gloss black of the 3 or the components. Hopefully i can test the Reba fork out this week on some trails.

    ----------------
    Now playing: Keller Williams - Love Handles
    via FoxyTunes
  • 04-23-2011
    markaitch
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by RDTigger
    Whatta day... Took the Gravity Point5 in pieces to the last LBS option.

    ...turns out i found the LBS for me. They do rentals and were crazy busy with those but managed to get mine setup in just a few hours and added that personal touch.

    They finished setting up my bike and have it tuned out righteously. Talked to them when I picked it up and the wrencher went ahead and degreased my chain in 2 gentle solvents and applied the first coat of rocknroll for me with no charge.

    They didn't realize it had hydraulics at first this morning but were really helpful and even reminded me to bring it back for retuning the "break in" wear when the time came...Free of charge.

    To anyone who is not a pro, take it to your bike to the best shop you can find and have it checked out. Mine had a bent derailleur hanger.

    amazing ain't it? you did not buy s**t from them yet there is a lbs that bent over backwards to "righteously" get your new bike (that you bought online & could not put together by yourself) on the road & they give you freebies on top of it? while bikedirect sold you an admittedly flawed product & left you on your own.

    so RDTigger...think you might actually buy from that shop one of these days? or you gonna keep buying everything online but count on them always being there when you need them?
  • 04-23-2011
    RDTigger
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by markaitch
    amazing ain't it? you did not buy s**t from them yet there is a lbs that bent over backwards to "righteously" get your new bike (that you bought online & could not put together by yourself) on the road & they give you freebies on top of it? while bikedirect sold you an admittedly flawed product & left you on your own.

    so RDTigger...think you might actually buy from that shop one of these days? or you gonna keep buying everything online but count on them always being there when you need them?


    So you would have turned me away because I bought the bicycle from someone else?





    I think we both win here.... They won my respect and loyalty as a future customer and also a referral. They did NOT do it for free, I paid for the work($65) and also bought some other things from the store. They also heard my pains in dealing with the other LBS trying to find my bike, and laughed. They were "working" me for a return.

    I have the bike I wanted built correctly and working properly. Doesn't hurt feeling not all LBS are flawed.

    They did something they couldn't do BEFORE i bought my bike. I shopped for over a year...a year. Went in there store and countless others looking for the right fit.

    So why so bitter?

    ----------------
    Now playing: Pink Floyd - Keep Talking
    via FoxyTunes
  • 04-23-2011
    Jay5280
    Awesome thanks for the pics buddy tell me how it rides.
    Also any word about the GT 29er to Gravity comperson any one?
  • 04-23-2011
    Jay5280
    GT Karakoram 3.0 29er Bike - 2011 $579.00 ( Note: dose not have disc brakes )

    2011 Gravity 29 Point 2 $599.95

    2011 Motobecane Fantom 29 Trail $599.95

    Marin Bolinas Ridge 29er Bike - 2011 $659.00

    2011 Outcast 29 $499.95

    2011 Windsor Cliff 29R Comp $549.99

    Raleigh Talus Sport 29er Bike - 2011 $699.00

    So which one you guys????
  • 04-23-2011
    katalinagirl
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Jay5280
    GT Karakoram 3.0 29er Bike - 2011 $579.00 ( Note: dose not have disc brakes )

    2011 Gravity 29 Point 2 $599.95

    2011 Motobecane Fantom 29 Trail $599.95

    Marin Bolinas Ridge 29er Bike - 2011 $659.00

    2011 Outcast 29 $499.95

    2011 Windsor Cliff 29R Comp $549.99

    Raleigh Talus Sport 29er Bike - 2011 $699.00

    So which one you guys????

    I would suggest putting them side by side to compare components 1st. The Outcast is a single speed setup; however I would believe that with the geometry and that it is a MB frame it may very well be a little lighter than the others you have listed due to absence of the cassette and both front and rear derailleurs; however it does sport the Kenda Nevs and those are a heavy tire.

    There are many differences between some of these to consider so I would again suggest putting them side by side in a spreadsheet or something to compare the components 1st and then start figuring out which one will best suit you for your type of riding and then narrow it down by the one that is aesthetically pleasing to you.
  • 04-24-2011
    Buggyr333
    The outcast 29 isn't really any lighter. It's pretty much a tank. That's what I have, although it is my favorite bike, I had to replace pretty much everything to make it that way. Wish I had just bought the frame and built it up.