Help with El Capitan rear shock (x-post Ventana)- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Help with El Capitan rear shock (x-post Ventana)

    I'm getting a Curtlo built using the El Capitan rear suspension. I'd like to use the DT Swiss HVR 200 rear shock, but it's 200mm i2i and 55mm stroke, 5mm longer stroke than spec'd for the El Capitan.

    Can someone look at their El Cap and maybe depressurize the rear shock and see if it looks like an extra 5mm of shock stroke would cause the tire or the seatstay yoke to contact the seat tube? I asked Ventana and Teresa says it can't be done. I know, I know, but I'd still like to see.

    Thanks,
    Monte

  2. #2
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    Dude, you are nuts if you are going against Teresa or Sherwood's recommendations, I don't care what kind of shock you want to run.


    Get the fox float. If you don't like it get it PUSHed, and you will never want anything more. I have two pushed shocks, and they are mind blowingly good.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  3. #3
    jrm
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    Id go back..

    and ask if it may be used with the other rockers available for the el cap. Otherwise i agree with the other poster about the float or RP 3 for that matter..

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monte
    I'm getting a Curtlo built using the El Capitan rear suspension. I'd like to use the DT Swiss HVR 200 rear shock, but it's 200mm i2i and 55mm stroke, 5mm longer stroke than spec'd for the El Capitan.

    Can someone look at their El Cap and maybe depressurize the rear shock and see if it looks like an extra 5mm of shock stroke would cause the tire or the seatstay yoke to contact the seat tube? I asked Ventana and Teresa says it can't be done. I know, I know, but I'd still like to see.

    Thanks,
    Monte
    Monte-

    FWIW, I've ridden the HVR on a Behemoth and had no 'contact' issues.

    When's your frame due?

    I *may* be able to send you an HVR (it's not here right now, so you'll have to wait) to test your theory. Lemme know your 'due date'.

    MC

  5. #5
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    [QUOTE=Monte]I'm getting a Curtlo built using the El Capitan rear suspension. I'd like to use the DT Swiss HVR 200 rear shock, but it's 200mm i2i and 55mm stroke, 5mm longer stroke than spec'd for the El Capitan.


    I suggest doing what Sherwood and Teresa suggest, though I can't help you with your test as I have an X5. You should also get a Fox shock and have it custom tuned by PUSH, the best $150 I have spent on the entire bike, a total transformation of how it handled. Shock companies can't tune it for every one of us. You won't regret a Push tuned Fox. You can also buy an RP3 from PUSH tuned to you. Not sure if these have the correct I to I but it would be what I would be hoping for. I have had tow Push-tuned Fox's on two different bikes including the X5. Peace to you!
    WYATT

  6. #6
    AOK
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    Keep in mind that just because one person's shock doesn't contact their frame, that doesn't necessarily mean that YOUR shock / frame combination will clear.

    Both frame and shock will have a manufacturing tolerance. Sherwood has taken these tolerances into account when he says that the combination won't work. If shock X fits on frame Y, it could just be because the shock is on the short end of it's tolerance and the frame is on the large end of it's tolerance. If you put a long shock /small frame tolerance combo together, it might not fit.

    A lot of similar discussions took place a while back on the Ventana board about whether or not a Fox DHX would fit on the pre-'04 Saltamontes and/or X-5.

  7. #7
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    I've asked. Don't do it. Get a Fox or Manitou and get on with it. I have nothing negative to say about the DT goods but the others are OE spec, more readily available for repair/replacement, and can be custom tuned by folks like PUSH.

    I don't think running 5" vs. 4" rockers will change the issue, in fact, it may exacerbate it due to the higher leverage ratio.
    Professional Amateur

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel
    Dude, you are nuts if you are going against Teresa or Sherwood's recommendations, I don't care what kind of shock you want to run.
    Sorry, that came off harsh. Not meant to. Just think carefully before going against manufacturer recommendations in this case. I'm sure Sherwood put a lot of thought into it.

    I have two pushed fox shocks and love them. Plush and stable.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  9. #9
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    If your dead set on an HVR why not have curtlo design the frame around it with the V. rear end. I would think the person building the frame would be able to work something out. After all it is custom.

  10. #10
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    I've never been impressed with the Floats, so I'm going to get a RS MC 3.3, it's 200mm i2i x 50mm stroke. Been reading good things about them.

    Mike offered a HVR200 to try out, I'll give that a go when it becomes available.

    Thanks,
    Monte

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Monte
    I've never been impressed with the Floats, so I'm going to get a RS MC 3.3, it's 200mm i2i x 50mm stroke.

    Please report back about the MC shock. I've heard good things about it, and considered it ordering it instead of the float. Just a little too set in my ways to try it though.
    Quote Originally Posted by buddhak
    And I thought I had a bike obsession. You are at once tragic and awesome.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enel
    Please report back about the MC shock. I've heard good things about it, and considered it ordering it instead of the float. Just a little too set in my ways to try it though.
    I will. Might be a couple weeks.

    Monte

  13. #13
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    Rule nr. 1 - Don't go against what Sherwood and/or Teresa say.

    That having been said, There is a slight chance that Doug may be able to make it work for you depending upon the situation. Are you running 4" rockers or 5"? I'm not sure if hard parts crashing into one another is going to be the biggest problem or if the tire coming to a sudden stop against the seat tube at full speed/full compression will be the more distracting issue, but I'm sure that you don't want to find out the hard way.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daner
    Rule nr. 1 - Don't go against what Sherwood and/or Teresa say.
    You're not the first to say this, I'm not going "against" anyone. It's a bicycle, a mechanical device built by people that have obviously put some time and effort into the design, and I acknowledge that effort, they've made a very nice bicycle. I don't see why some of you think I'm dissing Ventana by even asking the question. The only part being used from Ventana is the rear suspension, and if I used the DT shock and something happened because of it I wouldn't expect either Ventana or Curtlo to fix/replace anything under warranty.

    Still, sometimes a mechanical device has some room for different components than what was specified by the OEM. How has the whole of bicycle technology progressed? Not by always doing what is OEM specified, that's for sure. Not to worry, I've got a 200mm i2i x 50mm stroke shock ordered.

    Quote Originally Posted by Daner
    That having been said, There is a slight chance that Doug may be able to make it work for you depending upon the situation. Are you running 4" rockers or 5"? I'm not sure if hard parts crashing into one another is going to be the biggest problem or if the tire coming to a sudden stop against the seat tube at full speed/full compression will be the more distracting issue, but I'm sure that you don't want to find out the hard way.
    The suspension "unit" (chainstays, seatstays, seattube and pivot points) is already a "unit", no tweaking can be done. I wouldn't just toss the shock on and go bomb some baby head downhill. I would moved the suspension through the travel with the shock unpressurized. I'm sure it would be obvious pretty quickly if there was interference somewhere.

    Monte

  15. #15
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    I only pointed that out because I have had a discussion with Sherwood about using different shocks on a variety of frames, and we have also talked about some of the design challenges with the El Cap suspension. Installing a shock that compresses more, or a yet-to-be-introduced tire that is taller than what he designed the bike around would cause problems with the stock El Cap.

    We are not worried about Sherwood and Teresa. I think that for the most part we just wouldn't want to see you damage your machine or yourself.

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