Dutch Cycling Union has revised the race rules- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Dutch Cycling Union has revised the race rules

    Hooraay!

    The KNWU has listened to it members and acted wisely.
    The minimum width for MTB races is now 40mm of the carcus of the tyre excluding 'sticky out knobs'. There will be a dialogue with race organisers to try to create course that remove the advantage of cyclo-crossers on flat ground (should be interesting in flat Holland).

    Later this year a review will be held and the procedure possibly changed but I'm confident that this is will be in the positive sense.

    I'd like to take the opportunity to thank the KNWU to have listened to it's members. It's easy to criticise big organisations and say that members are too far removed. A process of dialogue has really helped here. I'm very happy about this and look forward to coming last in all my races due to lack of condition rather riding too small wheels. There is nothing for me to blame but my own fat ass!

  2. #2
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    They do state that the reason that it's an interim solution, put in place because of the last-minute publishing of the original ruling ("no bigger than 26" inches").

    40mm is a good width IMO. Any tubulars for CX stars to use would have to be fabricated, at really high cost. Current 40mm+ tires that also fit well in CX bikes are really rare. There's many 42mm offerings, but most don't meet 40.0mm on the carcass on typical CX rims at typical pressures.
    Decent tires such as he 44?mm ZED will be hard fit in most CX bikes.

    Anyway, a big riot has been prevented. I would have made a lot of noise had our arguments been dismissed.

    Now I have to go back to my training. I had stopped altogether after the ruling, re-thinking what I want to do with my racing. Take it to X-Terra altogether, focus on CX, or focus on non-KNWU races (big UCI events or independant).

    There's a pair of Karma's is ordered for me, my 18-19 race bike is going to happen!

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloxxki
    Anyway, a big riot has been prevented. I would have made a lot of noise had our arguments been dismissed.
    I think a lot of guys with kiddy wheels (like me) also protested by mail the past weeks. Many see any rule (be it anti-29 or whatever) as just another piece of bureaucracy that infringes on the 'ride what you bring' idea.

    I wonder how a lot of north americans look at this...Here in Europe even cycling is legislated to death.

    Anyway, now it's even harder to resist the urge to build up a Voodoo Dambala....

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloxxki
    Anyway, a big riot has been prevented. I would have made a lot of noise had our arguments been dismissed.
    Maybe a big riot, but maybe not. The volume of 29ers actually racing in the Netherlands is still too small to make a fist, I think. The biggest challenge lies ahead: Riders with 29ers actually participating in national racing events.

    It is easy to shout "I cannot compete because of them!" from the couch. No one knows if you were really committed to racing! If there is no match between the level of protest in the last months and 29er rider participation this season, the Dutch Cycling Association will start to wonder what all the fuss was all about. This way, you will never be able to reach a 29er friendly ruling next season.

    So: The temporary ruling is a good start. Now race and count the numbers of 29ers racing (not just #riders that raced this season, but #races)!
    Last edited by JeroenK; 02-10-2006 at 04:07 AM.

  5. #5
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    I totally agree with Bob. The dutch cycling union has really listened to the riders, 26 or 29 inch, who didn't understand the reason for this new rule. The fast and professional way they repaired their earlier decisions is great. I wrote my "thank-you"-letter half an hour after I got their message.
    I feel confident about the midterm-evaluation. This new rule will show its effectiveness and there should be no other reason to ban 29inchers.

  6. #6
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    Clokki to run for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by JeroenK
    It is easy to shout "I cannot compete because of them!" from the couch. N
    I agree, Clokki, you've got to go and race otherwise you'll be just like D66 saying they won't discuss sending troops to Afghanistan. Apprantly there is a vacancy for leader of D66 if you want to get more political Jan Gerrit!

    Did you really get rid of your license?

  7. #7
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    The main issue was the ruling being unfair. These bikes simply exist. Increasing numbers of people, be them Dutch or American, are starting prefer them over the more commonly known 26" standard. No thrust rockets are attached. It's really nothing more than bringing MTB level in rim size with the other main endurance/speed disciplines regulated by the UCI. Next to that, it helps taller riders ride bike that are somewhat proportional to their body.

    When in 2004 a big race (Dutch -23 Nationals) was won on a 29" bike, that started quite a bit of controversy. IMO he was the strongest man that day, or season really.

    I'm not sure I now need to go and win races or prove myself as a top-10 finisher again like I once was. Sure I'd love to, and it would put some 26" holouts to thinking perhaps, but there's more to sport than winning. I'm not just competing to others, most of all I'm battling myself. On a 29" bike I'm much more at ease, I feel more in control. Like I'm drawing my lines on the dirt as an artist does his paint on the carvas. I'm no longer battling a rodeo bike.
    Small people ride small wheel bikes, at least give adults an option as well. There's not a whole lot more to it.

    Sure, the local Dutch 29" scene isn't very substantial at all, and not too race-oriented either. Anyone even seen the movie Paul Q? Something doesn't have to affect a whole nation to be wrong.
    On my own I cannot make a whole lot of noise, but I can send out an open letter to the world press. I'm glad they saved me that effort and negativity by this so much more just ruling.

    Nice to see you posting on here BTW, Jeroen! Welcome to the forums, keep posting, lurking and learning!
    That deal still stands, where you teach me how a 26" bike makes so much more sense on your local trails ;-)
    Klok - XC - Skate - Ski

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cloxxki
    Nice to see you posting on here BTW, Jeroen! Welcome to the forums, keep posting, lurking and learning!
    That deal still stands, where you teach me how a 26" bike makes so much more sense on your local trails ;-)
    I have had an MTBR forum login for a long time, searching it once in a while for stuff I am interested in. I am just trying to keep the number of forums I visit manageble, so I do not post a lot

    Sure we have to ride that trail in the near future! Because it's fun I am not pro-26" by the way; I do not have to prove anything. Especially on that sandy, twisty trail, speed depends on a lot of things besides wheelsize: Handling technique, local knowledge, power... form of the day

    Are you allready saving up for an SRM crankset? Now THAT would be nice to put some numbers on the 26" - 29" performance difference.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeroenK
    I have had an MTBR forum login for a long time, searching it once in a while for stuff I am interested in. I am just trying to keep the number of forums I visit manageble, so I do not post a lot

    Sure we have to ride that trail in the near future! Because it's fun I am not pro-26" by the way; I do not have to prove anything. Especially on that sandy, twisty trail, speed depends on a lot of things besides wheelsize: Handling technique, local knowledge, power... form of the day

    Are you allready saving up for an SRM crankset? Now THAT would be nice to put some numbers on the 26" - 29" performance difference.

    Doens't Cloxxki already have an SRM? He needs to sell it to me.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeroenK
    Maybe a big riot, but maybe not. The volume of 29ers actually racing in the Netherlands is still too small to make a fist, I think. The biggest challenge lies ahead: Riders with 29ers actually participating in national racing events.

    It is easy to shout "I cannot compete because of them!" from the couch. No one knows if you were really committed to racing! If there is no match between the level of protest in the last months and 29er rider participation this season, the Dutch Cycling Association will start to wonder what all the fuss was all about. This way, you will never be able to reach a 29er friendly ruling next season.

    So: The temporary ruling is a good start. Now race and count the numbers of 29ers racing (not just #riders that raced this season, but #races)!
    I'm not sure I completely understand that hypothesis or argument: "If we alter the rules so that 29"er's can indeed compete in our races due to all the complaints filed and not enough of them show up to race, then we've got to change the rules next year to not allow them to race."

    Is there a number or a percentage of 29"er's in national races that would quantify as the magic number for matching the level of protest sustained during the recent "crisis" - at least in the Dutch Cycling Association's view? If so, would it not be fair for the Association to state those target numbers so that everyone knows and removes any mystery surrounding the issue?

    BB

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by BruceBrown
    Is there a number or a percentage of 29"er's in national races that would quantify as the magic number for matching the level of protest sustained during the recent "crisis" - at least in the Dutch Cycling Association's view? If so, would it not be fair for the Association to state those target numbers so that everyone knows and removes any mystery surrounding the issue?

    BB
    My point was that if there is no follow up on the racecourse to the verbal and paper "Pro 29er" offensive that took place after the "26" only" ruling, 29er riders will have a hard time convincing the Dutch cycling union to ditch this temporary ruling for a permanent one, allowing 29ers at races after next year.

    Remember: The cycling union's current objective is to give the current 29" riders stuck with "illegal" material a year to convert to 26"! Cloxxki would agree that 29er riders still have a massive job to do, to make 29" LEGAL next year.

    To achieve that, I think it is very important to put your money where your mouth is this season.

  12. #12
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    [QUOTE=JeroenK]My point was that if there is no follow up on the racecourse to the verbal and paper "Pro 29er" offensive that took place after the "26" only" ruling, 29er riders will have a hard time convincing the Dutch cycling union to ditch this temporary ruling for a permanent one, allowing 29ers at races after next year.

    Quote Originally Posted by JeroenK
    Remember: The cycling union's current objective is to give the current 29" riders stuck with "illegal" material a year to convert to 26"! Cloxxki would agree that 29er riders still have a massive job to do, to make 29" LEGAL next year.

    To achieve that, I think it is very important to put your money where your mouth is this season.
    If that truly is the objective of the union - to simply allow one year of current equipment use through the temporary ruling until riders can "update" their equipment to meet the 26" rule next year - then will having riders who participated in the verbal and paper protest put their money where their mouths and keyboards are be a worthwhile endeavor? Rather a catch 22, but as you mention - there is work to be done if there is any chance of it not ending up as only a temporary one year ruling.

    Probably best to use supportive arguments of other cycling unions and bodies in other countries throughout the globe that are finding no difficulty in allowing both size wheels to coexist within their racing series and events.

    BB

  13. #13
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    The new ruling is somewhat 2-sided. On one hand it's introduced as a transition. On the other hand, it says that starting mid-October the MTB Commission will see whether the (unfair) "advantage" of large and narrow wheels is properly addressed, and no longer a factor.
    Presumption drips from it. Lite it's a scientific fact that CX wheels rolls better, due to their magic combination of diameter and width. I bet that if you do a fair comparison of a sub-35mm tire to that of a 1.9"+, the 1.9"+ will roll better on most of a course's surfaces. 34mm Dugast tubular vs. $20 random 1.9"+ tire, a different story.
    The KNWU is bringing an army to a fight with a newborn. The CX bike by concept doesn't hold much over an MTB due to it's skinny tires, I just can't believe that. On a 26" bike on a CX course I once matched the laptimes set by the local CX king, who did his race before my MTB one. Let alone an MTB course.
    I hope that by the time the season is over, no CX-ish bikes have "spoiled" the result in national KNWU-governed races, nor the intl UCI-ones on Dutch territory. The latter will depend on CX rider's interest and the ability of course builders to make it sufficiently MTB-ish to have CX'ers suffer in ways they don't enjoy.
    Of course it's never the smalltime CX riders that scare the MTB'ers. It's the folks that have superior bike handling skills, and managed to stay with full-time MTB riders on their turf despite the skinny tires. Dugasts are a nice weapon for that job.
    40+mm tires either don't fit CX bikes, or are really quite shitty for MTB riding. Much faster 26" tires out there. And a 40+mm Dugast that barely fits a CX bike? Not likely to be worth it for the CX rider that just wants a workouts and some prize money.
    Certainly the "narrow large tire" issue will be addressed. The ruling just did that. Period. Rule is good for 2007+ as well. Let the whole world follow.

    I contest that to keep a rule alive, it has to be used. as long as the bikes exist, they have a place in the rules. Small CX wheels are allowed, but no-one uses them. Did the rules after that became clear ever outlaw those? No. Some kids DO use them, and have every right.

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