Do I need more bike?- Mtbr.com
Results 1 to 45 of 45
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039

    Do I need more bike?

    Iím currently riding a Ď16 BMC Speedfox with Arch wheels and I love the bike, especially for XC riding. But as Iím progressing with jumps and tech riding itís starting to feel like it has a lot of flex especially in the rear. Iím 180lbs and not always the smoothest on the tech stuff we have here - 2-3í drops, some doubles, some rocky somewhat tech descents. Iím going to try more air pressure and Iíve thought about a new wheelset but donít really want to invest in a non-boost wheelset.

    I know I donít need a new bike and the speedfox fits like a glove but something a bit slacker would be nice too. Is there a way I can stiffen the rear or is it time for more of a trail bike?

  2. #2
    Retro-grouchiest
    Reputation: MattiThundrrr's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    186

    Do I need more bike?

    Quote Originally Posted by bank5 View Post
    Iím currently riding a Ď16 BMC Speedfox with Arch wheels and I love the bike.
    I know I donít need a new bike and the speedfox fits like a glove
    That bank5 character already answered your question.
    I want something good to die for
    To make it beautiful to live
    I want a new mistake, lose is more than hesitate

  3. #3
    Rides all the bikes!
    Reputation: Sidewalk's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    3,283
    Sounds to me like you have the bike you want. Often times with any bike you have you will run into some sort of limits. It's really about getting the bike that fits MOST of your needs, and just dealing with the stuff outside the envelope.

  4. #4
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    That makes sense and would save me some $.

    As far as stiffening the rear, do you think a new wheel would help? The Arches are pretty flexy. But then I figure if I'm spending ~$800 on a wheelset, that's a lot of money I could put into a whip.

  5. #5
    Rides all the bikes!
    Reputation: Sidewalk's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    3,283
    You dont need a new wheelset. You can find a used set, or just rehoop the set you have now. Swapping on Flow hoops (or similar) wouldn't be hard. You could do it yourself and have a local shop true them for you.

  6. #6
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    ^ Good point. Then I'd only be out ~$150 for the hoop, probably new spokes and labor. I posted in the wheel forum to see if that will make a big difference in terms of flex / feel

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Lone Rager's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    7,158
    When you say it has a lot of flex in the rear, what do you mean?
    Do the math.

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    2,171
    My wife loves her kona Process 134. Its held her back a bit on some trails. She hated drops and jumps. She bought a Evil Wreckoning and hit stuff harder than I've ever seen her do, with a big cheesy grin. Made me jelly for a bigger bike my self lol. But she said the smaller wheels and smaller bike will still be fun for the trails without so much chunk and jumps.

    So you need 2 bikes is what I'm trying to get at 🤣

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    Quote Originally Posted by Lone Rager View Post
    When you say it has a lot of flex in the rear, what do you mean?
    Feels like there's some lateral movement in the rear wheel when I come down on a jump or tech downhill.

    I was just looking at the bike and there's some creek coming from the linkage. I'm going to swap that out to see if that makes a difference.

    Based on the replies so far in the wheel forum, a new alu hoop won't be that huge of a difference.

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    Quote Originally Posted by Cerberus75 View Post
    My wife loves her kona Process 134. Its held her back a bit on some trails. She hated drops and jumps. She bought a Evil Wreckoning and hit stuff harder than I've ever seen her do, with a big cheesy grin. Made me jelly for a bigger bike my self lol. But she said the smaller wheels and smaller bike will still be fun for the trails without so much chunk and jumps.

    So you need 2 bikes is what I'm trying to get at 🤣
    I think you mean 6 bikes as I already have 5 bikes I may post a bike recommendation thread just to see what sort of replies I get.

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    6,661
    Quote Originally Posted by bank5 View Post
    Iím currently riding a Ď16 BMC Speedfox with Arch wheels and I love the bike, especially for XC riding. But as Iím progressing with jumps and tech riding itís starting to feel like it has a lot of flex especially in the rear. Iím 180lbs and not always the smoothest on the tech stuff we have here - 2-3í drops, some doubles, some rocky somewhat tech descents. Iím going to try more air pressure and Iíve thought about a new wheelset but donít really want to invest in a non-boost wheelset.

    I know I donít need a new bike and the speedfox fits like a glove but something a bit slacker would be nice too. Is there a way I can stiffen the rear or is it time for more of a trail bike?
    That's a real sweet cross country bike ya got there.

    and no, there is no way you're gonna make this bike anything other than what it is.

    You need more bike for the riding you want to do or you need to go back to mellow trails.

    2-3" drops, doubles, and rocky tech descents.

    ^ I'm pretty sure you answered your question
    Guerilla Gravity Shred Dogg
    Fezzari Signal Peak (For Sale)
    Pivot Shuttle (wife's)

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation: David R's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    2,361
    Do you need more bike? No, probably not. Would a more confidence-inspiring bike better suited to the kind of riding you're progressing onto make your rides more enjoyable and comfortable, and allow your development to continue? Absolutely.

    Plenty of bikes in the trail/downcountry type genre that would give you way more on the descents without compromising climbing ability too much.

  13. #13
    Formerly of Kent
    Reputation: Le Duke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    10,672
    Iíll be a voice of dissent.

    An XC bike is perfect for the riding you describe. Get a dropper post if you donít already have one.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Death from Below.

  14. #14
    WillWorkForTrail
    Reputation: Cotharyus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    4,580
    I'm going to assume this is a FS bike. To stiffen the back end up all you can really do is a pivot service - new bearings and make sure everything is torqued right. Other than that, it's a wheel thing. A new hoop will be ~$100 bucks, if you just don't want to buy a new wheelset, think about that route. Ultimately, at your weight, that bike shouldn't seem flexy, which makes me wonder if it's not a pivot problem or maybe just the notoriously noodly arch hoop. If you were a bigger guy I'd tell you not to jump an XC frame - most companies with really good warranties don't warranty their XC frames for anything if you've been "jumping" them, and won't warranty them for anything much over an 18" drop. Beyond that they want you on something they didn't try to build as light as possible for a racing scenario. When I finally bought a trail bike, it only weighed a couple ounces more than my XC bike anyway, and frankly, it's a lot more fun. So, another point to consider is that you don't NEED any bikes. But, another bike might be fun right? I mean....

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Iíll be a voice of dissent.

    An XC bike is perfect for the riding you describe. Get a dropper post if you donít already have one.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Yep, I bought a dropper as soon as I bought the bike. Most of the riding we have here is mellow XC stuff, but the drop I want to hit is about 3-4' but kind of sketchy - off a rock, with about a 4' gap, between a couple trees. I also like going to Western NC although I don't make it there very often. I've broken a couple rear triangles on a RIP 9 so I'm not the easiest on bikes. But with some routine service so far the Speedfox has held up well.

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,489
    You've got what rear shock on the back? 120mm of travel shouldn't hold you back from a decent drop assuming you set your suspension up for it like you states. More pressure is a great idea, make sure you add more rebound too.

    Any chance you can add a volume spacer to your rear shock? That can help with end stroke support. I'm assuming you're just mashing through the travel right now or larger hits?

    Wouldn't worry about the wheelset though. Just try and keep em true.

    If you want a cheap(ish) hucker the Kona Process 153's have been my favorites, been pretty darn impressive. You can go cheap & find a used older model 2015+ or find a good deal on the G2's 2018+
    83 Ritchey Everest
    95 Bianchi Mega Tube ti
    2015 Kona Operator Supreme
    2015 Kona Process 153
    2019 Kona Process 153 CR 29

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    6,661
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Iíll be a voice of dissent.

    An XC bike is perfect for the riding you describe. Get a dropper post if you donít already have one.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    How dare you!

    Well, I'll be the voice of dissent of the voice of dissent

    The thing is, the OP is asking a question he already knows the answer too ... or he would never have thought to ask the question.

    Like many folks, he started with a simple XC bike made for moderate terrain, then he started pushing limits and he found them: the bike is an XC bike

    So yeah, he could "get by" with an XC bike, in fact that's a pretty good bike for an XC bike, but it's still an XC bike, no amount of tire pressure, angle set, wheel upgrades, or suspension changes will make the bike differen than what it is designed to be.

    My recommendation to the OP is to suck it up and get a real trail bike, either sell the XC bike, or get a second bike. Go used and save some coin, there are so many good used bikes out there.

    Ya don't take a knife to a gun fight, just saying ....
    Guerilla Gravity Shred Dogg
    Fezzari Signal Peak (For Sale)
    Pivot Shuttle (wife's)

  18. #18
    mtbr member
    Reputation: Shredmonkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    391
    If you can afford it get a new bike, life is short. When I rediscovered mtb years ago I tried to upgrade a 2011 trance into something it wasnít. Wasted much time time and money. When I upgraded to an 2015 enduro I noticed a big difference in confidence ,stability, and just all around fun.
    Iíve since moved on to the new Stumpjumper Evo which has less travel than the Enduro but itís the modern lower, longer, and slacker geo that for me has made a way bigger difference than the amount of suspension.
    As always, try to demo as many bikes as possible before you spend your hard earned cash.



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  19. #19
    Formerly of Kent
    Reputation: Le Duke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    10,672
    Quote Originally Posted by Nurse Ben View Post
    How dare you!

    Well, I'll be the voice of dissent of the voice of dissent

    The thing is, the OP is asking a question he already knows the answer too ... or he would never have thought to ask the question.

    Like many folks, he started with a simple XC bike made for moderate terrain, then he started pushing limits and he found them: the bike is an XC bike

    So yeah, he could "get by" with an XC bike, in fact that's a pretty good bike for an XC bike, but it's still an XC bike, no amount of tire pressure, angle set, wheel upgrades, or suspension changes will make the bike differen than what it is designed to be.

    My recommendation to the OP is to suck it up and get a real trail bike, either sell the XC bike, or get a second bike. Go used and save some coin, there are so many good used bikes out there.

    Ya don't take a knife to a gun fight, just saying ....
    Sounds like he's taking a knife to a knife fight.

    Fully within the limits of what the bike is designed for, and compatible with the described terrain.
    Death from Below.

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2015
    Posts
    2,171
    Quote Originally Posted by bank5 View Post
    Yep, I bought a dropper as soon as I bought the bike. Most of the riding we have here is mellow XC stuff, but the drop I want to hit is about 3-4' but kind of sketchy - off a rock, with about a 4' gap, between a couple trees. I also like going to Western NC although I don't make it there very often. I've broken a couple rear triangles on a RIP 9 so I'm not the easiest on bikes. But with some routine service so far the Speedfox has held up well.
    If you like the geo and brand. You can probably find a trailfox and be good for rough stuff. I do WNC twice a year on a 140mm bike, sometimes I want a little more.

  21. #21
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    Quote Originally Posted by eshew View Post
    You've got what rear shock on the back? 120mm of travel shouldn't hold you back from a decent drop assuming you set your suspension up for it like you states. More pressure is a great idea, make sure you add more rebound too.

    Any chance you can add a volume spacer to your rear shock? That can help with end stroke support. I'm assuming you're just mashing through the travel right now or larger hits?

    Wouldn't worry about the wheelset though. Just try and keep em true.

    If you want a cheap(ish) hucker the Kona Process 153's have been my favorites, been pretty darn impressive. You can go cheap & find a used older model 2015+ or find a good deal on the G2's 2018+
    Fox Float 130 is on the back. I do blow through the travel pretty quickly so adding a spacer is a good idea. I've heard good things about Konas and my favorite LBS sells them. I'm leaning towards keeping the Speedfox but if I find more of a trail bike that's too good to pass up, I may jump on it.

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    Quote Originally Posted by Cerberus75 View Post
    If you like the geo and brand. You can probably find a trailfox and be good for rough stuff. I do WNC twice a year on a 140mm bike, sometimes I want a little more.
    Looks like they don't make the Trailfox anymore unless you want it with a motor.
    I find myself often wanting a bit more in WNC too. That place will do it to ya

  23. #23
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    3,029
    Quote Originally Posted by Cotharyus View Post
    If you were a bigger guy I'd tell you not to jump an XC frame - most companies with really good warranties don't warranty their XC frames for anything if you've been "jumping" them, and won't warranty them for anything much over an 18" drop.
    I agree that the likely flex is from the pivots or maybe the axle torque. I'm also not a fan of abusing warranties and do not condone lying. However, I don't see how a company could realistically know if or expect a customer to keep a bike less than 18" off the ground. Is that both wheels at the same time? Bunny hops ok? Honestly, a fast downhill with bumps and g-outs will put more stress on a bike than a 2' drop. I remember when 80mm of travel was considered downhill, trials riders dropped 10' on rigid forks, and a mountain bike was a mountain bike. If a mountain bike can't handle 3' drops and small jumps, it's a gravel bike.

    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Iíll be a voice of dissent.

    An XC bike is perfect for the riding you describe.
    Agreed. That is trail riding, which any mountain bike should be able to handle.

    Quote Originally Posted by bank5 View Post
    I find myself often wanting a bit more in WNC too. That place will do it to ya
    I live and ride in western NC, and there are only a few trails where 120mm travel isn't sufficient. If your goal is to beat your riding buddies down the mountain, more travel would help cover some deficiencies in ability. Also, there are some gaps and drops that are a bit safer on a bigger bike, but in no way is more travel mandatory. Honestly, I wish we had more features here that benefited longer travel.

  24. #24
    banned
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2019
    Posts
    213

    Do I need more bike?

    Well, do you need more bike? - no. Would it be nice to have more bike(s)? - yes.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  25. #25
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    750
    Service your bike and work on being smooth. Buy a new bike when you want one and it makes sense.

    I have a hardtail that I hated because it cornered very vaguely. Discovered that was my crappy noodle wheels. Put some LB carbon hoops on there and it completely changed the ride for the better. My hardtail wasn't boost either, so i just bought the rims and had them laced up to my existing hubs to save some money.

  26. #26
    WillWorkForTrail
    Reputation: Cotharyus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    4,580
    Quote Originally Posted by mountainbiker24 View Post
    I agree that the likely flex is from the pivots or maybe the axle torque. I'm also not a fan of abusing warranties and do not condone lying. However, I don't see how a company could realistically know if or expect a customer to keep a bike less than 18" off the ground. Is that both wheels at the same time? Bunny hops ok? Honestly, a fast downhill with bumps and g-outs will put more stress on a bike than a 2' drop. I remember when 80mm of travel was considered downhill, trials riders dropped 10' on rigid forks, and a mountain bike was a mountain bike. If a mountain bike can't handle 3' drops and small jumps, it's a gravel bike.


    Yeah, I mean, my first mountain bike had 2x5 gears, rim brakes, no suspension and I beat hell out of that bike. But it also weighed 47 pounds. I understand what you're saying, I'm just telling you companies design XC bikes for skinny XC weight weenies to ride on fast XC courses and not to ride the local dirt jumps. I actually had a company rep tell me once that it was possible that at my weight bunny hopping a log across a trail was "pushing the intended design envelope" for their cross country bike in terms of "abuse" (I'd already broken two frames) and that I might be better off with a trail bike. I agreed and told him they should make a 29" trail bike. So while I agree with you about what a "mountain bike" should do, as soon as they start calling something a DH bike or an XC bike or a free ride bike certain assumptions are going to be made. No one cares how much a DH bike weighs because it's going up on a lift, right? Likewise, XC riders would rather die than ride a bike that weighs 2oz more than necessary. So you get these design compromises.

  27. #27
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    Thanks all. I think I'm going to wait on a new bike for now and put new pivot bearings in, tighten the spokes of the rear wheel, increase the rebound, add some spacers.

    If I can get a great deal on a closeout trail bike, I may jump on it, but will likely keep the Speedfox for at least a few more years.

  28. #28
    Wanna ride bikes?
    Reputation: *OneSpeed*'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    6,904
    What rear tire are you using?
    Rigid SS 29er
    SS 29+
    Fat Lefty
    SS cyclocross
    Full Sus 29er (Yuck)

    Stop asking how much it weighs and just go ride it.

  29. #29
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    6,964
    You don't need more bike, you need.....

    MORE COWBELL!!!
    Whining is not a strategy.

  30. #30
    mtbr member
    Reputation: jeremy3220's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    1,998
    You don't need a new bike for what you described but the issue isn't usually about whether the bike can handle it, it's more about what you want to ride. I have no desire to hit jumps and drops on an XC bike. I don't think they're fun and I don't like the geo for that stuff. I come from a BMX background so I don't need suspension or slack head tube angles to hit jumps and drops but I don't like riding XC bikes.

  31. #31
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Sounds like he's taking a knife to a knife fight.
    Maybe I didn't describe things well enough. I'm finding the XC stuff boring. The jump line I'm enjoying is rated Expert. Granted I think it's over rated but a guy on it yesterday had pads and a full face. If someone lacks the necessary skill and tries it they're probably going to separate a shoulder or bust a clavicle on the first drop (I've seen it happen a couple times). I've found my XC bike to be suitable but I'm progressing quite a bit where I'm hitting stuff now where I thought no way would I ever hit before. So I'm not sure if it's the best tool for the job long term for me.

    Quote Originally Posted by *OneSpeed* View Post
    What rear tire are you using?
    Maxxis Minion DHR II

    Quote Originally Posted by kosmo View Post
    You don't need more bike, you need.....

    MORE COWBELL!!!
    Haha, I've got a mini handlebar cowbell from my days of riding in California.

    Quote Originally Posted by jeremy3220 View Post
    You don't need a new bike for what you described but the issue isn't usually about whether the bike can handle it, it's more about what you want to ride. I have no desire to hit jumps and drops on an XC bike. I don't think they're fun and I don't like the geo for that stuff. I come from a BMX background so I don't need suspension or slack head tube angles to hit jumps and drops but I don't like riding XC bikes.
    Curious what you like to ride

  32. #32
    mtbr member
    Reputation: jeremy3220's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    1,998
    I'm riding a Guerrilla Gravity Pedalhead (hardtail) and a Santa Cruz Megatower (enduro bike). Both of those are slack bikes but like I said that's not necessary for jumps and drops. What I don't like about XC bikes is the low bar position and longer stems. I want a bike long enough that I can run a 50mm or less stem and a stack high enough that I don't feel like I'm leaning on the bars while standing.

  33. #33
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    6,661
    Quote Originally Posted by Le Duke View Post
    Sounds like he's taking a knife to a knife fight.

    Fully within the limits of what the bike is designed for, and compatible with the described terrain.
    No it's not, even the reviews say it's not the bike for jump lines and tech, do your research!

    So yeah, wrong bike or wrong trail, pick one.
    Guerilla Gravity Shred Dogg
    Fezzari Signal Peak (For Sale)
    Pivot Shuttle (wife's)

  34. #34
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    6,661
    Quote Originally Posted by jeremy3220 View Post
    I'm riding a Guerrilla Gravity Pedalhead (hardtail) and a Santa Cruz Megatower (enduro bike). Both of those are slack bikes but like I said that's not necessary for jumps and drops. What I don't like about XC bikes is the low bar position and longer stems. I want a bike long enough that I can run a 50mm or less stem and a stack high enough that I don't feel like I'm leaning on the bars while standing.
    Exactly!

    If he was riding a Trail Pistol, he would not be posting this question cuz there'd be no issue; ie the Trail Pistol IS meant for the OP's described riding.

    I got a TP Revved in process, gonna use it for all the things the OP describes plus XC riding and epics. The Shred will become a Mega, and I'll reserve it for big hits and gnar
    Guerilla Gravity Shred Dogg
    Fezzari Signal Peak (For Sale)
    Pivot Shuttle (wife's)

  35. #35
    Rides all the bikes!
    Reputation: Sidewalk's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Posts
    3,283
    I can, and have, taken my full race XC hardtail (F-Si) down more difficult trails than most people will try. Fully clearing large jumps at the bike park. Some of you guys act like a modern XC bike is a roadie with wide tires, they aren't.

    I've also seen my friend on a Scalpel with a dropper post clear a double that I have seen people with DH rigs not try.

    Seriously, there is nothing wrong with a modern XC bike on a chunky trail. Would I rather ride my Enduro? Yes, that's why I strictly ride my Enduro everywhere. But I also have pretty good legs, so climbing mountains on a big, heavy, squishy bike is just fine for me. But for most, an XC bike with a dropper is MORE than enough for anything but the sketchiest of trails.

    If the OP is happy with his bike, why are you trying to convince him otherwise? Let him be happy. Stop telling him his bike sucks, when he thinks it is great.

  36. #36
    mtbr member
    Reputation: jeremy3220's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Posts
    1,998
    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post


    Seriously, there is nothing wrong with a modern XC bike on a chunky trail. Would I rather ride my Enduro? Yes, that's why I strictly ride my Enduro everywhere.

    If the OP is happy with his bike, why are you trying to convince him otherwise? Let him be happy. Stop telling him his bike sucks, when he thinks it is great.
    I don't think other people sharing their preferences (like you) are saying that OP's bike sucks.

  37. #37
    Formerly of Kent
    Reputation: Le Duke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    10,672

    Do I need more bike?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nurse Ben View Post
    No it's not, even the reviews say it's not the bike for jump lines and tech, do your research!

    So yeah, wrong bike or wrong trail, pick one.
    According to many reviews and reviewers, anything other than a modern LLS bike is flat out unrideable on any dirt surface.

    I have to ask, what the hell so you think people ride on XC bikes? Do you genuinely believe that people canít ride technical terrain on an XC bike?




    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Death from Below.

  38. #38
    Elitest thrill junkie
    Reputation: Jayem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    32,178
    Quote Originally Posted by Sidewalk View Post
    I can, and have, taken my full race XC hardtail (F-Si) down more difficult trails than most people will try. Fully clearing large jumps at the bike park. Some of you guys act like a modern XC bike is a roadie with wide tires, they aren't.
    I have a pro level friend that keeps doing that and he keeps breaking his XC bike. He's since wised up, but an XC bike is not for giant launches and that kind of riding. The leverage curve of the suspension is meant for very different things. Not that you can't blast downhill on it, like you do when you are racing XC competitively, but you aren't launching drops, doubles, etc. for the most part and not to any large extent.

    I agree there's nothing wrong with one on a chunky trail, it kind of depends on how fast you want to go and what the trail allows. I rode my XC bike last week in Texas on the chunky Northshore-west trail, lots of little chunky sections and a bigger bike would be a huge drag due to all the ups and downs on the trail system. But ultimately you are a little more limited on the XC bike.

    Back to the bikes: One thing to consider is that certain manufacturers, Pivot, Foes and a few others, are known for very very stiff frames. This is something I consider greatly and going to the other side of the scale, many of the large-manufacturer ones aren't nearly as stiff and tend to lose a lot of that initial stiffness as the parts break in. The good ones stay stiff season after season. IME, it makes a difference. You can trust the bike a lot more, the handling is a lot better, it gives you good feedback, etc.

    A good stiff wheelset makes a big difference AND 29er wheels are inherently flexier. My old Specialized Enduro 29er was not the stiffest frame ever, not horrible, but the wheelset was a noodle, tire would rub the chainstay when riding hard at the bike park. Cranking the hell out of all the spokes helped, but definitely didn't' eliminate the problem. The problem was eliminated when I went to a 32 spoke carbon wheelset that I built. Making things bigger, like 29er wheels and forks, makes them inherently flexier, so more exotic engineering or reinforcement is necessary to bring them back to the accepted level.

    Within a range, most people wouldn't notice a big difference in stiffness, but when you have a few of these factors working against you at the same time, it can definitely lead to an unacceptable ride IME. For that reason, I try to go for something pretty stiff to try and get as much going for me in that sense.
    "It's only when you stand over it, you know, when you physically stand over the bike, that then you say 'hey, I don't have much stand over height', you know"-T. Ellsworth

    You're turning black metallic.

  39. #39
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    3,029
    Quote Originally Posted by Cotharyus View Post
    Yeah, I mean, my first mountain bike had 2x5 gears, rim brakes, no suspension and I beat hell out of that bike. But it also weighed 47 pounds. I understand what you're saying, I'm just telling you companies design XC bikes for skinny XC weight weenies to ride on fast XC courses and not to ride the local dirt jumps. I actually had a company rep tell me once that it was possible that at my weight bunny hopping a log across a trail was "pushing the intended design envelope" for their cross country bike in terms of "abuse" (I'd already broken two frames) and that I might be better off with a trail bike. I agreed and told him they should make a 29" trail bike. So while I agree with you about what a "mountain bike" should do, as soon as they start calling something a DH bike or an XC bike or a free ride bike certain assumptions are going to be made. No one cares how much a DH bike weighs because it's going up on a lift, right? Likewise, XC riders would rather die than ride a bike that weighs 2oz more than necessary. So you get these design compromises.
    Yikes! Which company was that? I wouldn't consistently hit jump lines or downhill courses on a cross-country bike, but I wouldn't have thought twice about riding technical trails and bunny-hopping things on one. I mean, recent cross-country race courses have incorporated some sizable drops..

  40. #40
    WillWorkForTrail
    Reputation: Cotharyus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    4,580
    Quote Originally Posted by mountainbiker24 View Post
    Yikes! Which company was that? I wouldn't consistently hit jump lines or downhill courses on a cross-country bike, but I wouldn't have thought twice about riding technical trails and bunny-hopping things on one. I mean, recent cross-country race courses have incorporated some sizable drops..
    A big one. A HUGE one. You might even say they're gigantic. Still, Giant stood behind their warranty, and it didn't stop me from buying a Trance 29 when they finally DID give up that stupid 27.5 obsession of theirs. See, the thing is, I was riding some super chunky stuff (Reddish Knob) in addition to all the regular riding I did on my Anthem, and it was fine, really. The problem seemed to be a couple of G-outs on some of my local trails, and one relatively small drop (maybe 12") that you either have to huck full send to get the back wheel over another rock at the bottom or slow way down and just hop off it stradling the rock. Apparently the full send hucking (bunny hopping off it at 12mph or so) was a problem. Of course, Giant knew they were in for problems on that frame when they designed it - the goal was the lightest AL full suspension XC frame on the market, and I think they managed that, but it cost them, ultimately. Anyway, my frames kept breaking on a particular weld, so they knew it was always going to be a production problem that caused the break, otherwise it wouldn't be breaking on a weld. On the whole, 3 frames in 7 years wasn't the worst thing that could have happened. But I'm for sure happier on my Trance.

  41. #41
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Posts
    8,275
    I guess I shouldn't have ridden my TBCv1 at a small bike park.
    Ripley LS v3
    OG Ripley v2 handed down to son

  42. #42
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    Looks like my bike has a 3 year warranty which is over - https://us-en.bmc-switzerland.com/wa..._store=intl_en But I'm tossing a lot at it and it's holding up well so far. Much better than my original RIP 9 (but Niner was great replacing those frames).

    It is interesting how things have changed so quickly. 3 years ago it was considered an all around trail bike. Now it's considered an XC bike.

  43. #43
    mtbr member
    Reputation: slimphatty's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    778
    I don't look forward to pedaling my Slash up the hill but when that thing points downhill, I'm so glad I brought it. It provides so much confidence and it's way more fun than ripping a sketchy line on a cross country bike. Even though that's STILL fun but a different type of fun.

    If you can afford it, Have an enduro and a cross country bike.

  44. #44
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Posts
    2,039
    Just saw there's a Yeti demo day by me. If they have them in size L, I think I'll try the SB130 and maybe the 150. It usually takes me a couple days to really get used to a bike and send it. Will be interesting to see how I like the modern geo and slack HA.
    Hopefully it doesn't make me want a $10k bike I

  45. #45
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    9
    Quote Originally Posted by bank5 View Post
    Just saw there's a Yeti demo day by me. If they have them in size L, I think I'll try the SB130 and maybe the 150. It usually takes me a couple days to really get used to a bike and send it. Will be interesting to see how I like the modern geo and slack HA.
    Hopefully it doesn't make me want a $10k bike I
    I will say that the SB130 is an amazing bike. I demod one and loved it. The fork is a 150 so plenty of travel. It was just too much $$ for me

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 08-21-2015, 09:51 AM
  2. Do I need more fitting components, or do I just hate my 29er?
    By DualRollers in forum Bike and Frame discussion
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 05-17-2014, 09:25 PM
  3. More videos more more more
    By yogreg in forum Vermont, New Hampshire, Maine
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 09-20-2008, 05:44 PM
  4. More More More Fort Rock pics
    By yogreg in forum Vermont, New Hampshire, Maine
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 07-18-2004, 03:54 AM

Members who have read this thread: 237

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

THE SITE

ABOUT MTBR

VISIT US AT

© Copyright 2019 VerticalScope Inc. All rights reserved.