Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er? - Page 3- Mtbr.com
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  1. #401
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    Quote Originally Posted by clewttu View Post
    it has lock nuts, i just dont think people are using them correctly
    I'm wondering too, I've had zero slippage. Granted I only weigh about 165, but have done quite a bit of climbing on it already. I did tighten the sliders with a 3/8" socket wrench and driver that afforded a lot of leverage.

  2. #402
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    Quote Originally Posted by meltingfeather View Post
    How does lock washers come after tack welding?
    Lock washers is step one. Many bikes come with them.
    It was a joke.....

  3. #403
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danner182 View Post
    It was a joke.....
    I get jokes... no really
    Quote Originally Posted by pvd
    Time to stop believing the hype and start doing some science.
    29er Tire Weight Database

  4. #404
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    Quote Originally Posted by alefak View Post
    Mine definately slipped a lot intially out of the box. Heres what works best w/o filing paint off. Loosen the hex nuts a little bit so the sliders will slide but not too much or the frame will spread. loosen the lock nuts on the chain tensioner bolts. Tighten the chain tensioner bolts on each side to set the chain tension to be fairly tight and to center the wheel in the frame. Note: If you dont get the slack out of the chain, every time you bumb the cranks you are jerking the drive side forward with more force. Once you get the chain tight and the wheel centered, tighten the lock nuts really tight against the drop out to hold the tensioner bolts in place and to keep them from backing out. You have to use two 8mm wrenches, one to hold the tensioner and the other to tighten the lock nut against the drop out. Then tighten the hex bolts with a metric wrench, not a hex key.
    Absolutley correct, and the tensioner bolts have course thread so it doesn't take many turns to move the wheel. I think that my wheel moved in the initial setup for two reasons....the tensioner bolts had not been correctly adjusted plus there wasn't near enough torque applied to the mounting bolts because I was using a small hex key not a wrench with some leverage.

    The fact that the Paint came off under the bolt heads didn't help either.....I wonder if this is a problem unique to the orange paint only??

  5. #405
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    Had my first ride on her this weekend. LOVED it! Curious about something though...This is my first bike with disc brakes. After adjusting the pads, then taking off the front wheel to go to the trails, the pads needed to be re-aligned when I put the wheel back on. Will this happen every time I take off and reinstall the front wheel? Or will it eventually work it self out?

  6. #406
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    Quote Originally Posted by ply5013 View Post
    Had my first ride on her this weekend. LOVED it! Curious about something though...This is my first bike with disc brakes. After adjusting the pads, then taking off the front wheel to go to the trails, the pads needed to be re-aligned when I put the wheel back on. Will this happen every time I take off and reinstall the front wheel? Or will it eventually work it self out?
    No you should not have to mess with it after you get it set up.

  7. #407
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    Quote Originally Posted by ply5013 View Post
    Had my first ride on her this weekend. LOVED it! Curious about something though...This is my first bike with disc brakes. After adjusting the pads, then taking off the front wheel to go to the trails, the pads needed to be re-aligned when I put the wheel back on. Will this happen every time I take off and reinstall the front wheel? Or will it eventually work it self out?
    My old bike with track ends and bolt on wheels needed readjustment every time a wheel was removed. So far the Luddite has been great in this regard.

  8. #408
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    That's what I was hoping. Thanks.

  9. #409
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    I think the slipping sliders has finally stopped. Ive tighten them soo many times and theyve moved so many times, that they are pretty much fixed now. The wheel is still slightly crooked, but its not rubbing anywhere and honestly im sick of messing with it. So if you're worried about the sliders moving, eventually they will stop once you chew up paint on drop out enough.

    Save yourself some time, and just remove the paint with a file as soon as you get the bike.

    I did a personal best distance record last night of almost 12 miles, and the back wheel never moved.

  10. #410
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danner182 View Post
    Save yourself some time, and just remove the paint with a file as soon as you get the bike.
    disagree, save yourself some time and dont remove everything to file off your dropouts, set your dropouts up properly or get someone that knows how to to help you...use the tensioner screws to get the wheel aligned properly (yours being crooked tells me you didnt do this correctly), lock em down with the lock nut the way alefak mentioned (securing the tensioner screw while tightening the lock bolt), and properly torque the slider bolts, its a really simple process that should need to be done once and last a good while

  11. #411
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    Some upgrades...

    This was from today's 10.5 mile ride, my first since swapping out the bars/stem/seat post/saddle/brake levers/grips. Between these changes and going tubeless, the bike is a dream to ride. Once I can pony up some cash for a decent wheel-set, it'll be complete.

    All parts swapped are carbon Easton Haven, except for the saddle and levers of course. Ol' school Selle Italia Flite and Avid SpeedDial 7 levers. Oury lock-ons... Much better!
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-img_20120807_102050.jpg  

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-img_20120807_102101.jpg  


  12. #412
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    Also picked up some Alligator Superfortress brake cables/housing, but I haven't had time to install them yet...

  13. #413
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    Quote Originally Posted by clewttu View Post
    disagree, save yourself some time and dont remove everything to file off your dropouts, set your dropouts up properly or get someone that knows how to to help you...use the tensioner screws to get the wheel aligned properly (yours being crooked tells me you didnt do this correctly), lock em down with the lock nut the way alefak mentioned (securing the tensioner screw while tightening the lock bolt), and properly torque the slider bolts, its a really simple process that should need to be done once and last a good while
    Ive done all of this pal, to the point of almost breaking it from tightening so hard. If you've noticed, im not the only one with this problem.

  14. #414
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danner182 View Post
    Ive done all of this pal, to the point of almost breaking it from tightening so hard. If you've noticed, im not the only one with this problem.
    Quote Originally Posted by Danner182 View Post
    The wheel is still slightly crooked, but its not rubbing anywhere and honestly im sick of messing with it.
    im sorry pal, but if you cant get the wheel straight in the dropouts when you are adjusting it, you are doing it wrong...what are you tightening so hard that it almost breaks? find that a bit of hyperbole...i think your problem lies in the adjuster/tensioning screws and locknuts

    have had mine for a month and a half now, and the wheel moved after my first couple of rides with no adjustments out of the box...i then adjusted it properly myself, and 250 miles later wheel is in perfect alignment and chain is still tensioned

  15. #415
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danner182 View Post
    Ive done all of this pal, to the point of almost breaking it from tightening so hard. If you've noticed, im not the only one with this problem.
    Did you change cogs? I'm wondering because I installed a 21t and with the stock chain it was too tight, pulling to one side and off center. I never rode it like that and installed a new chain. In my limited experience, a chain that is too tight with too much drive train friction can also cause slippage and other problems like pulling to the drive side.

  16. #416
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    If I'm doing something wrong please advise..

    I loosen up the allen key slider bolts and the tensioner bolt. Everything is lose and free to move around. I then line up the wheel by hand and begin tightening the adjusters until the wheel is straight and the chain is tight, but not super tight. I then Lock the tensioners as tight as I can humanly tighten them. I then tighten the slider allen key bolts in the rear and torque as tight as i can. I'm a big fella and I work out regularly, so I'm quite confident that I am tightening them enough. My only guess is my weight. I weigh 240lbs.

    But like I said before, they haven't moved in a week. The chain is tight, but the tire is a bit closer to the left side of my bottom triangle than the right. Not a big deal, but I find myself constantly looking down there to see if it has slid.

    I still enjoy this bike very much, I just have a tendency to vent sometimes when I cant find a remedy to a problem.

  17. #417
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danner182 View Post
    If I'm doing something wrong please advise..

    I loosen up the allen key slider bolts and the tensioner bolt. Everything is lose and free to move around. I then line up the wheel by hand and begin tightening the adjusters until the wheel is straight and the chain is tight, but not super tight. I then Lock the tensioners as tight as I can humanly tighten them. I then tighten the slider allen key bolts in the rear and torque as tight as i can. I'm a big fella and I work out regularly, so I'm quite confident that I am tightening them enough. My only guess is my weight. I weigh 240lbs.

    But like I said before, they haven't moved in a week. The chain is tight, but the tire is a bit closer to the left side of my bottom triangle than the right. Not a big deal, but I find myself constantly looking down there to see if it has slid.

    I still enjoy this bike very much, I just have a tendency to vent sometimes when I cant find a remedy to a problem.
    Sounds to me like you are using the proper procedure to set the sliders up with the alignment bolts.... but....if you are using a hex key or regular L shaped Allen wrench you cannot possibly be applying enough torque to get the bolts tight enough.

    Do yourself a favor and take one of the bolts to a hardware store and get a hex socket that will work on a large socket wrench. I think his will solve your movement problem. I have found that I can't possibly tighten it enough otherwise to prevent movement at my size and weight. I am at around 215 lbs. and mine has not moved at all since I got rid of the bubbling paint under the bolt heads, greased the threads and torqued it all down with a socket wrench. Make sure that your chain has a slight amount of slack also. I wouldn't worry (much) about stripping the threads out either, they can handle the torque.

    This is an awesome bike and it just needs to be set up correctly to be problem free. I am at about 300 miles and will soon need to take some slack out of the chain as it has stretched slightly....... Good luck

  18. #418
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    I put new wheels on my bike and weighed the stock ones last night. For those that are still curious, without skewers, with valve stems and two layers of gorilla tape they weigh 2355 grams.

    I have a new chain ring on order. I noticed on my bike that at a particular point in the crank revolution the chain gets super tight. It's pretty loose the rest of the time so I assume the ring is ovalized. Perhaps others who are having issues with the sliders coming loose might have the same problem.

  19. #419
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zakman View Post
    I put new wheels on my bike and weighed the stock ones last night. For those that are still curious, without skewers, with valve stems and two layers of gorilla tape they weigh 2355 grams.

    I have a new chain ring on order. I noticed on my bike that at a particular point in the crank revolution the chain gets super tight. It's pretty loose the rest of the time so I assume the ring is ovalized. Perhaps others who are having issues with the sliders coming loose might have the same problem.
    You might be able to loosen the bolts on the ring and move it slightly to minimize the tight spot. Most of these are slightly out of round and a little minor adjustment can fix the issue. Lots of threads on this topic. Mine seemed pretty good with a minor tight spot just like my other single speed.

  20. #420
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    My new screen saver, my orange Luddute is coming this Tuesday
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-screen-shot-2012-07-12-9_21_23-pm-365x550.png  


  21. #421
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    I got mine in the mail today. It took about an hour to carefully unbox and assemble and tune everything perfect. The stock wheel/tire combo is sooooo heavy. Much heavier than I expected. I put on Crank brothers wheels w/ Kenda Small Block 8 tires, Crank Brothers carbon handlebar, Specialized seatpost, WTB Speed V Pro Gel saddle, Oury Grips, Wellgo Magnesium Flat pedals, Surly Single Speed Cassette spacers, Chris King 17T cog. In a 17" size medium it weighs 23.5 lbs according to my digital bathroom scale. I weigh exactly 200lbs so holding the bike and doing the math is easy. I took it on a little cruise around the neighborhood to get a feel for it. It rides very nice. I was going over speedbumps and jumping curbs to see how it felt. The steering felt a bit twitchy so I'll put on a shorter stem soon. Overall it rode nice and was the opposite of harsh. It's downright plush for a rigid bike.
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  22. #422
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    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-luddy-002.jpg  

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  23. #423
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    Shorter stem will make the steering feely even more twitchy

  24. #424
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    I decided the orange grips and pedals were a bit too much orange for me so I went black and added a thud buster.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-ludditey-002.jpg  

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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-ludditey-007.jpg  

    Last edited by LittleBuddy; 08-14-2012 at 06:29 PM.

  25. #425
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    Very Nice!

  26. #426
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    Quote Originally Posted by LittleBuddy View Post
    My new screen saver, my orange Luddute is coming this Tuesday
    nice shot but next time heat your studio,, she looks cold! LOL
    “An adventure is misery and discomfort, relived in the safety of reminiscence.” Marco Polo

  27. #427
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    Quote Originally Posted by t0pcat View Post
    nice shot but next time heat your studio,, she looks cold! LOL
    And she needs a hair light to help separate her from the background ...

  28. #428
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    I put a stubby DJ stem on and now the bike feels perfectly balanced. It took the weighted twitchy feeling away from the steering.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-what-004.jpg  

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  29. #429
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    How do you like the Thudbuster ST. I tried the LT but WAY too much movement.

  30. #430
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    I had the LT too, hated it , ST is awesome and just barely heavier than a regular seat post, it just looks ugly.

  31. #431
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    I was out for a ride on rocky singletrack this AM.....and noticed play and noise developing in the lower headset bearing. Came home, took the top cap off...curious to see if it is a carbon or aluminum steer tube.....I couldnt tell from what was exposed ( I didn't pull the fork out ) ..adjusted the bearing pre load and re-assembled.

    Is the steer tube carbon or aluminum?? Anyone know?? I am leaning towards carbon because there isn't a normal star nut to attach the top cap to....looks like a pressed in or molded in anchor nut.

    Why is there a spring between the top cap and anchor nut?? I have never seen this before.
    Last edited by borbntm; 08-19-2012 at 03:19 PM.

  32. #432
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    It's a carbon steerer w/ a compression plug hence the funny hardware inside.

    Civilian Luddite Review from Drunkcyclist

    here's a must see review of the Luddite w/ chick pics NSFW

  33. #433
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    Quote Originally Posted by LittleBuddy View Post
    It's a carbon steerer w/ a compression plug hence the funny hardware inside.

    Civilian Luddite Review from Drunkcyclist

    here's a must see review of the Luddite w/ chick pics NSFW
    Thanks for the info on the fork, I hope the carbon steerer holds up..... and great pics by the way!

  34. #434
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    Quote Originally Posted by LittleBuddy View Post
    It's a carbon steerer w/ a compression plug hence the funny hardware inside.

    Civilian Luddite Review from Drunkcyclist

    here's a must see review of the Luddite w/ chick pics NSFW
    Hard to take the review too seriously when juxtaposed with soft porn.

  35. #435
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    I've ridden this bike a handful of times now and I love it. I swapped out the tires to Conti XKings and put a 110mm stem on.

    Has anybody bought the derailleur hanger dropout for this bike yet? A Google search didn't come up with anything.

  36. #436
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalAl View Post
    I've ridden this bike a handful of times now and I love it. I swapped out the tires to Conti XKings and put a 110mm stem on.

    Has anybody bought the derailleur hanger dropout for this bike yet? A Google search didn't come up with anything.
    I think the bike comes with one.

  37. #437
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalAl View Post
    I've ridden this bike a handful of times now and I love it. I swapped out the tires to Conti XKings and put a 110mm stem on.

    Has anybody bought the derailleur hanger dropout for this bike yet? A Google search didn't come up with anything.
    Mine came with one....

  38. #438
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    Mine did not come with one. The original description said it did but it has since been updated saying it is available for an additional fee.

  39. #439
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    I think the bike comes with one.
    It sounds like some people get one and some don't, mine definitely did not come with one. I bought mine about a month and half ago from Huck and Roll. I've messaged Civilian and I'll post the response here if/when I get one.
    Alan

  40. #440
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalAl View Post
    It sounds like some people get one and some don't, mine definitely did not come with one. I bought mine about a month and half ago from Huck and Roll. I've messaged Civilian and I'll post the response here if/when I get one.
    Alan
    I got one too. Contact Backcountry and I'm sure they'll send you one.

  41. #441
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalAl View Post
    It sounds like some people get one and some don't, mine definitely did not come with one. I bought mine about a month and half ago from Huck and Roll. I've messaged Civilian and I'll post the response here if/when I get one.
    Alan
    I have a follow up; Civilian gave me a very quick response, unfortunately the response was that all distribution of any kind is handled by Competitive Cyclist. So I emailed them regarding the hanger and a couple of days later I got this response-
    "Unfortunately, we are currently out of stock of those dropouts according to our shop. I would suggest contacting us back in a few weeks to see if we received more in stock."
    This is a pretty disappointing response to say the least. I'm not in a rush to get the hanger dropout but I would like to know that it is available when I decide I'd like to buy it. The dropouts used are Tange but a Google search doesn't come up with anything I could buy. Anyone who wants to buy this bike and immediately convert it to a geared bike should make sure they can get the other dropout before buying the bike.
    Alan

  42. #442
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    pretty sure paragons slider will work
    i also got a hanger version with mine a few months back

  43. #443
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    Mine came with a hanger dropout.

  44. #444
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    I found this thread about Tanghe dropouts. http://forums.mtbr.com/frame-buildin...rs-479110.html Opps. never mind the rest of this post. I read it wrong.

  45. #445
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    How is everyone doing out there with there Civilian Ludittes? I can imagine that we all have more than a few rides logged..... Any issues to report?? Mine is doing great at around 300 miles now. Feels more like an ATV at times than a bicycle with the wide bars and the big heavy Nevagel tires. I have found that it rolls over just about any trail obstacle without beating me up to bad. Keeping it singlespeed for now, great workout machine!

    I noticed that the Whiskey brand carbon fork looks very similar to what came with the Luditte. At least we can get a replacement if needed.

  46. #446
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    I have about 250 miles logged, and cant be any happier. I was having an issue with my sliders "Sliding", but its all better now. No more movement.

  47. #447
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    Mine

    Here is Mine, not really a review but figured I would post some pics. It took over a month to get the bike from Dept of Goods, during that timeframe I had messed up my knee, bike came literally the day of my surgery than set in the box for another month before I even took it out. No geared dropout which was a bummer becasue don't want to hit knee too hard at first. I think I am better off keeping SS though, other option is used parts 1x9.

    Anyway these are the changes so far

    flat bat - easton EA50, probably upgrade to carbon at somepoint
    Avid Speed Dial levers off an old bike and some old pedros lock on grips
    2.4 racing ralph upfront (really like it)
    2.2 Saguaro in rear
    Surly 22 rear cog sram 8 speed chain (figured start easy since knee)
    old cheapo Crank Bros smarty pedals

    Future mods to come
    - new candies (doubt those smarties last long at all lets see if I can kill a third pair of CBs this year!)
    - Carbon bar - specialized or niner
    - Wheels - Probably the hope / flows off my FS when/If I upgrade those to Carbon, if not just std Arch EXs
    - maybe niner carbon seatpost
    - Rear tire
    - I have surly 20T cog will use eventually as well

    First Impressions are really good, geo is good, considered small went medium, small would have been too small. Geo seems very well balanced on my short test run. Plesantly suprised by the seatpost, saddle, and stem. I might eventually replace some of that but so far so good, I even have 2 used Fizik saddles in parts boxes and they will remain for now.

    Not a Wieght Weenie but came in at 25.6 pounds on my cheapo luggage scale and that is with the pedals, the Saguaro that is filled with dryed up stans. Doesnt feel heavy at all riding it.

    Once I get a couple singletrack rides and one longer endurace ride I will post up again in the meanwhile will be rehabing knee and changing parts on my cross bike.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-img_20120906_180244.jpg  

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-img_20120906_180308.jpg  

    XC, Road, XXC, Endurance, Mtn, All-Mtn, Cross, Gravel, just go have fun on 2 wheels!

  48. #448
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    I have had issues with the truvativ crank developing play. After about 10 miles of riding it starts knocking. I played around with the torque of the BB and the crank bolt as well as adding blue loctite to the bolt with no success. Its not in the bolt that attaches the two cranks sides together, its in the external BB. LBS added a washer to the non-drive side to take up about .5 mm space to see if that works. Anyone else having this issue or have any recommendations? I havent ridden it since the washer was added...

  49. #449
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    No BB problems here although I've seen lots of comments about those BBs having problems on different bikes.

  50. #450
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    No problems with the bottom bracket.....just the paint, when the orange paint chips, it goes big....real thick with yellow primer under it! Oh well, it's a mountain bike....

  51. #451
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    Quote Originally Posted by borbntm View Post
    No problems with the bottom bracket.....just the paint, when the orange paint chips, it goes big....real thick with yellow primer under it! Oh well, it's a mountain bike....
    Battle scars ...

  52. #452
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    What's the easiest way to install a straight tubed suspension fork? Is there a part in can use to adapt it to the existing headset, so I don't have to remove the headset cups? I have another headset, but I wanted to find an easy way to try a 120mm fork and perhaps switch back and fourth.

  53. #453
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    This bike handles great with a shorter stem.
    It rides stiff to put down the power without being harsh even over washboard rooty areas.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-alafia-053.jpg  

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-alafia-066.jpg  

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-alafia-068.jpg  

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-alafia-075.jpg  

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-alafia-049.jpg  


  54. #454
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    Quote Originally Posted by Danner182 View Post
    My sliders slipped forward last night. Exact same thing you are describing. Wasnt even 20 ft on to the trail and it slipped. So have you fixed this problem, or have any advice?
    Sorry for the slow response, I ended up sanding all the paint off the frame where the sliders and bolts came in contact and haven't had any problems since related to that.

    I came by to say I love the bike, but I did have an issue with the fork, at the base of the steer tube the bearing race was loose in a side to side, forward and back motion, which caused the fork to come loose in the headset, it was there from the beginning but went away after resetting it after the first ride at the beginning of august until about a week ago and since it hasn't held. I called back country and the guys in the bike department were super helpful and but ended up warrantying the bike since the fork isn't really a stand alone unit.

    I saw some one asking about the material of the tube, its carbon all the way.

  55. #455
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    Quote Originally Posted by phrump View Post
    Sorry for the slow response, I ended up sanding all the paint off the frame where the sliders and bolts came in contact and haven't had any problems since related to that.

    I came by to say I love the bike, but I did have an issue with the fork, at the base of the steer tube the bearing race was loose in a side to side, forward and back motion, which caused the fork to come loose in the headset, it was there from the beginning but went away after resetting it after the first ride at the beginning of august until about a week ago and since it hasn't held. I called back country and the guys in the bike department were super helpful and but ended up warrantying the bike since the fork isn't really a stand alone unit.

    I saw some one asking about the material of the tube, its carbon all the way.
    Are you getting a new bike? I'm not sure how I feel about a carbon tube ... glad I only weigh 160.

  56. #456
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Are you getting a new bike? I'm not sure how I feel about a carbon tube ... glad I only weigh 160.
    Yes.

  57. #457
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    Does anyone know if a cog from a shimano 9 or 10 speed cassette will work to swap out w the 18t that comes on the bike?

  58. #458
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    Its got a standard freehub that will fit a 9/10 speed cassette

  59. #459
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    Quote Originally Posted by alefak View Post
    Does anyone know if a cog from a shimano 9 or 10 speed cassette will work to swap out w the 18t that comes on the bike?
    Are you talking about breaking up a cassette? If so, I wouldn't recommend as the cogs are made for shifting. Surly cogs are cheap and plentiful and a good alternative.

  60. #460
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    Yes I was talking about breaking up a cassette. Kind of an emergency because I dont have time to order the proper single speed cogs. Will the shifting cogs be able to do the job temporarily until I am able to order single speed cogs.

  61. #461
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    Breaking a cassette up will work fine as long as your chainline is straight. Just don't use it for too long or the cog can wear a groove into the freehub body.

  62. #462
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    Last edited by LittleBuddy; 10-03-2012 at 03:47 PM.

  63. #463
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    Has anyone had any problems with their front wheel not staying aligned? Maybe there's a better way to describe this... A couple of times I've looked down and my front wheel isn't centered in the fork. I turn the bike upside down, open the quick release, and there's a little bit of room for the wheel to center back where it should be. I tighten the quick release the best I know how, and it will eventually happen again.

    This is my first carbon fork - does the material have anything to do with it? Never had an issue on my old 26" rock shox forks. Tips? Techniques? Suggestions???

    Thanks.

  64. #464
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    Quote Originally Posted by ply5013 View Post
    Has anyone had any problems with their front wheel not staying aligned? Maybe there's a better way to describe this... A couple of times I've looked down and my front wheel isn't centered in the fork. I turn the bike upside down, open the quick release, and there's a little bit of room for the wheel to center back where it should be. I tighten the quick release the best I know how, and it will eventually happen again.

    This is my first carbon fork - does the material have anything to do with it? Never had an issue on my old 26" rock shox forks. Tips? Techniques? Suggestions???

    Thanks.
    I had that exact problem with the bike I tested, but since it was a review bike, I didn't bother with finding a solution. I think it's probably just a little paint on one of the dropout faces or something.

  65. #465
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    Not exact problem you have but the front quick release on mine was junk to put it politely one trail day and i replaced it, pick up some cheap shimano skewers or something.
    XC, Road, XXC, Endurance, Mtn, All-Mtn, Cross, Gravel, just go have fun on 2 wheels!

  66. #466
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    i've had the same problem, but replacing the stock skewer with a decent sun ringle skewer seems to have done the trick.

  67. #467
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    Thanks. Maybe I will try my old skewer and see if that helps.

  68. #468
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    Did you guys find you needed an extra long skewer for the front because if the fat dropouts?

  69. #469
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    Really digging this bike, and will likely pick one up at or around Christmas. Do the large frames really only come with one bottle mount? If so, why the hell would they not put another set of mounts on there? This isn't really a deal breaker, but definitely something that would annoy me.
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  70. #470
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    Yes, there really are only one set of bottle mounts. It doesn't bother me at all since if I need more than one bottle I'll use the Camelback, but I could see it becoming an issue if I use it for touring or bikepacking. It would have been simple enough to put a second set on it and it struck me as odd when I first got it too.

  71. #471
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    Quote Originally Posted by SoCalAl View Post
    Yes, there really are only one set of bottle mounts. .

    Well, that sucks. But, how hard could it be to add another set?
    1) Find the right placement
    2) Drill holes
    3) press in threaded anchors

    Am I missing something? Would this damage frame at all?

    I'm going to repost this in the frame builders forum and see what they say as well.
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  72. #472
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    After a little searching in the frame builders subforum....It should be really easy. There is rivet/nut called a riv-nut (clever) that would be perfect. Drill the holes in the right spot, insert riv-nut, screw in bolt to set the riv-nut, unscrew bolt and voila! No damage to paint or frame.
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  73. #473
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocktownrook View Post
    i've had the same problem, but replacing the stock skewer with a decent sun ringle skewer seems to have done the trick.
    I will have to check this out as I have had my front wheel come out of alignment a few times also. Thanks for the tip!

  74. #474
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    Looks like a nice bike. Wish they'd gone any other route for chain tension than slider.... (ugly). The downtube/steerer tube junction is a bit funky too but that can be overlooked.

  75. #475
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1 Speed View Post
    Looks like a nice bike. Wish they'd gone any other route for chain tension than slider.... (ugly). The downtube/steerer tube junction is a bit funky too but that can be overlooked.
    What's your preferred tensioning method?

  76. #476
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    What's your preferred tensioning method?
    It used to be a "normal" EBB (yes, some squeak, others turn, etc.) but now that I've got the Problem Solvers BEER in my new Retrotec I love it! The EBB in my Ti IF which is Phil Wood and does occasionally make a bit of noise but I have never had troubles with it.

  77. #477
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1 Speed View Post
    It used to be a "normal" EBB (yes, some squeak, others turn, etc.) but now that I've got the Problem Solvers BEER in my new Retrotec I love it! The EBB in my Ti IF which is Phil Wood and does occasionally make a bit of noise but I have never had troubles with it.
    I've always been scared to try an EBB setup. I do think they look better - track ends look pretty clean too.

  78. #478
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    I'm still diggin the Luddite. I'm 3/4 the way through with my local race season and I've been kinda neglecting the Luddite since the start. I've rode it maybe tree times since the first of October. I did have an awesome training ride with it this past weekend though. As soon as the season is over I'm riding the Luddite exclusively. All my offseason dirt work will be aboard the SS.
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  79. #479
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    I've always been scared to try an EBB setup. I do think they look better - track ends look pretty clean too.
    Scared? What of? If not that the new swinger style rear ends are nice. With sliders I see issues with brakes, they look weird because they often have an ugly flat billet as the slider and more.

    Possom... half way through the season? You have to be in the desert. For us... the CX season is almost done. MTB racing stopped in middle September to avoid the snow. We won't really start again without flying to a desert island until June because there will be multiple feet of snow up in the mountains.

    Glad you're enjoying the bike.

  80. #480
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-imageuploadedbytapatalk1352470607.497308.jpg
    Natural habitat shot.....Still really digging this bike even with the heavy wire bead Nevegels. Trying to wear them out as fast as possible to justify an upgrade with my wife and accountant!!
    MTB Rob was taken!

  81. #481
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1 Speed View Post
    Scared? What of? If not that the new swinger style rear ends are nice. With sliders I see issues with brakes, they look weird because they often have an ugly flat billet as the slider and more.

    Possom... half way through the season? You have to be in the desert. For us... the CX season is almost done. MTB racing stopped in middle September to avoid the snow. We won't really start again without flying to a desert island until June because there will be multiple feet of snow up in the mountains.

    Glad you're enjoying the bike.
    These sliders have been great so far. I personally think some of the new swingers (Salsa) are even more clunky looking.

  82. #482
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1 Speed View Post
    Scared? What of? If not that the new swinger style rear ends are nice. With sliders I see issues with brakes, they look weird because they often have an ugly flat billet as the slider and more.

    Possom... half way through the season? You have to be in the desert. For us... the CX season is almost done. MTB racing stopped in middle September to avoid the snow. We won't really start again without flying to a desert island until June because there will be multiple feet of snow up in the mountains.

    Glad you're enjoying the bike.
    I'm in sunny fla. We have two race series in the state. There's good xc racing from September to march. From march to September we have random monthly endurace races.

    I'd love to trade you our hot and humid summers for some mountains and occasional snow
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  83. #483
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    Quote Originally Posted by Possum Jones View Post
    I'm in sunny fla. We have two race series in the state. There's good xc racing from September to march. From march to September we have random monthly endurace races.

    I'd love to trade you our hot and humid summers for some mountains and occasional snow
    I'm originally from K.C. so while not as humid as Florida I do know riding in over 100 degree weather with near equal humidity. That, is one of the main things I love about living here next to the Alps.... not much humidity and much lower temps. More my style.

    However... I do really miss having a nearly year 'round race season and courses that are more than 3-10 km per lap (pretty normal for endurance races here).

  84. #484
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    Here's mine with a Marzocchi 44 Micro Ti fork and DT Swiss wheels.

  85. #485
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    Tapatalk wouldn't post my photo ...

    Here's mine with a Marzocchi 44 Micro Ti fork and DT Swiss wheels. Mt Tam in the background - the birthplace of mountain biking (mostly).
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-ludditetam.jpg  


  86. #486
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    Just put my Luddite up for sale on Ebay if anyone is interested.

    Item number- 281022758726

  87. #487
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua_B View Post
    After doing some calculating I got my Luddite for $582.00. I used bill me later and got another 6% cash back which was $47. So with that and the promo code I felt I did good! GO BACKCOUNTRY!
    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua_B View Post
    Just put my Luddite up for sale on Ebay if anyone is interested.

    Item number- 281022758726
    Selling for $625-$690? You are going to make more money on the bike than backcountry did!!
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  88. #488
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasnavy05 View Post
    Selling for $625-$690? You are going to make more money on the bike than backcountry did!!
    Not after the horrendous eBay and Paypal fees!

  89. #489
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    Did you try to return it? Backcountry and competitive cyclist have an unlimited return policy. Huck n Roll was merged into CC so if you bought it from them I bet CC would still take it back.

  90. #490
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Tapatalk wouldn't post my photo ...

    Here's mine with a Marzocchi 44 Micro Ti fork and DT Swiss wheels. Mt Tam in the background - the birthplace of mountain biking (mostly).

    Nice photo....What is the tooth count on your cog? I am considering a 19 or 20 to replace the stock 18 for the winter due to the extra clothes / weight I'm lugging around in the cold weather.

  91. #491
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zakman View Post
    Did you try to return it? Backcountry and competitive cyclist have an unlimited return policy. Huck n Roll was merged into CC so if you bought it from them I bet CC would still take it back.

    Is that really how their return policy works?

    What would keep someone from buying a new bike, riding it for a couple years, and then returning it for full price? (other than personal ethics/morals)
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  92. #492
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    I have never tried it but this is copied directly from their web site:

    We call it our Unconditional Lifetime Returns policy, as in no questions asked, in perpetuity. Buy something and if it falls short of your expectations in any way, for any reason, just send it back, for as long as you own it. Bikes, clothes, components, and stuff on sale. We won't ask any questions, and there's no fine print. We want you to be eternally happy, simple as that. Just send your item(s) back and include the information below. As soon as we receive the item(s) we will post a credit to your original form of payment. Be aware that it typically takes your credit card company 5-7 to refund the amount to your card.

  93. #493
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    Yea, Im trying to make a little money, but after the ebay and paypal fees I wont make much. I not just going to give the bike away for like 300 hundred bucks either. I haven't ridden this bike but a few times. I don't think I could just send it back, thats not right IMO.

  94. #494
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua_B View Post
    Yea, Im trying to make a little money, but after the ebay and paypal fees I wont make much. I not just going to give the bike away for like 300 hundred bucks either. I haven't ridden this bike but a few times. I don't think I could just send it back, thats not right IMO.
    Any special reason you're selling?

  95. #495
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    Quote Originally Posted by borbntm View Post
    Nice photo....What is the tooth count on your cog? I am considering a 19 or 20 to replace the stock 18 for the winter due to the extra clothes / weight I'm lugging around in the cold weather.
    I'm running a 21t, we have some long fire road climbs around here. When I pick up another cog, I'll try a 20t.

  96. #496
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    I am selling it to upgrade my fatbike. I have many bikes in my stable as well.

  97. #497
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua_B View Post
    I am selling it to upgrade my fatbike. I have many bikes in my stable as well.
    Admit it, you're a bikeoholilic.

  98. #498
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    Oh, I know!

  99. #499
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua_B View Post
    Yea, Im trying to make a little money, but after the ebay and paypal fees I wont make much. I not just going to give the bike away for like 300 hundred bucks either. I haven't ridden this bike but a few times. I don't think I could just send it back, thats not right IMO.
    I don't think I could send a bike back like that either.
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  100. #500
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    I'm running a 21t, we have some long fire road climbs around here. When I pick up another cog, I'll try a 20t.

  101. #501
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshua_B View Post
    Just put my Luddite up for sale on Ebay if anyone is interested.

    Item number- 281022758726
    Are you going to drop the price again? Or just keep it? I figured it would have gone for $520.
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  102. #502
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    Just ordered one of these, looks like a very nice bike for the money.

    I was just curious about the wheelset. I read in the thread that they weigh approx 2400 grams ... Can anyone else confirm this? This seems extremely heavy...

    Anyways, thx for sharing your insight. I'm super excited to get my new ride.

  103. #503
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    The wheels and tires that come stock are extremely heavy. An upgrade here is money well spent IMO.
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  104. #504
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    Quote Originally Posted by Short Bus View Post
    Just ordered one of these, looks like a very nice bike for the money.

    I was just curious about the wheelset. I read in the thread that they weigh approx 2400 grams ... Can anyone else confirm this? This seems extremely heavy...

    Anyways, thx for sharing your insight. I'm super excited to get my new ride.
    I think mine were around 2300. The tires are boat anchors at 980 each.

  105. #505
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    Thanks for the info guys. Fortunately I have a spare set of wheels waiting to go on. The hard part now is just waiting patiently for them to ship it... I'll weigh the wheels when I get them in and will post up some pics.

  106. #506
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    Mine just arrived. I also grabbed the WTB Trail TCS 29r wheelset they also had on backcountry. Reasonably weight 1950g (comparable to an EA70 or other mid-line wheelset) but not light compared to Stans.

    Will build up tonight.

    May stick with the mech discs, only used hydro in the past and interested to see what the current mech's feel like. I figure I can hawk them for $70 on craigs for the F&R set to offset the hydro costs if I decide to go that way.

    Planning on a Thomson post, WCS Stem, maybe EA70 bars, Fizik saddle and a CK cog for now. Crankset and tires will have to wait a bit...

    Had a 05 Specialized Epic with all XT that I just sold for this bike. It will be quite a transition from FS to full-rigid. But the 1 ride I seem to have time for per year for the last 6 years did not seem to justify servicing the F&R shocks at $250 each rotation. Now my MTB became just as easy to maintain as my road bikes and longtail

  107. #507
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    The stock seat post is actually pretty good. Thomson style clamp and not outrageously heavy. I would replace the tires before the seat post. You can save almost a pound of rotational weight for the cost of the post.

  108. #508
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zakman View Post
    The stock seat post is actually pretty good. Thomson style clamp and not outrageously heavy. I would replace the tires before the seat post. You can save almost a pound of rotational weight for the cost of the post.
    Most of the parts aren't bad at all. The wheels and tires are the extreme offenders.

  109. #509
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    So those of you with upgrades done to the bike, especially wheels & tires, what does your bike weigh after upgrades? Ordered a Hope/Flow combo tonight and have Geax Saguaro 2.2 TNT's on the way. Hoping to shave 2 lbs off the bike with the new setup running tubeless. I can't wait. Loving the bike btw.
    Civilian Young Turk 29er

  110. #510
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    Quote Originally Posted by DBackRider08 View Post
    So those of you with upgrades done to the bike, especially wheels & tires, what does your bike weigh after upgrades? Ordered a Hope/Flow combo tonight and have Geax Saguaro 2.2 TNT's on the way. Hoping to shave 2 lbs off the bike with the new setup running tubeless. I can't wait. Loving the bike btw.
    I haven't weighed mine yet, but two pounds is easy - the tires are so heavy you can lose more than a pound there. I gained 3 pounds by adding a fork, but I'm icing to take it back off because of the weight.

  111. #511
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    Oops I meant to post in the Young Turk thread.
    Civilian Young Turk 29er

  112. #512
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    Quote Originally Posted by DBackRider08 View Post
    Oops I meant to post in the Young Turk thread.
    Almost the same bike ...

  113. #513
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    True. :P
    Civilian Young Turk 29er

  114. #514
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    Quote Originally Posted by DBackRider08 View Post
    So those of you with upgrades done to the bike, especially wheels & tires, what does your bike weigh after upgrades? Ordered a Hope/Flow combo tonight and have Geax Saguaro 2.2 TNT's on the way. Hoping to shave 2 lbs off the bike with the new setup running tubeless. I can't wait. Loving the bike btw.
    You will come close to that at least (maybe exceed) I have Hopes Flows on another bike and rode them with Regular Saguagros for a long time night and day difference between that and Nevegals. I had switched from TN719s Mavics at the time and mine have been great. In fact as old as those wheels are plan is to hopefully keep the stock anchors on the Civilian for now and get some I9s / ArchExs for my FS in the spring and move Hope Flows over to the SS Luddite.

    Any reason you went TNTs? I have heard the bead is tough to get on stans rims and the regualr folding bead works great.
    XC, Road, XXC, Endurance, Mtn, All-Mtn, Cross, Gravel, just go have fun on 2 wheels!

  115. #515
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    Cool, nice. No particular reason I went with the TNTs. I got a deal on the them and bought them prior to finding a deal on the Hope/Flows. LoL. I have heard about the TNTs being somewhat of a pain to install. However, a buddy of mine is running AKA TNT's on a set of Sun Ringle Charger Pros so I'm not too worried. Great to hear that my future setup will certainly lighten things up to my expectation or exceed it. How did you like the Saguaro tires? I'm hoping they are fairly fast rolling with good traction. Had some good reviews on 'em online. Just a waiting game for my parts to arrive now which is the part I hate... lol.
    Civilian Young Turk 29er

  116. #516
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    I like the Saguaros the Luddite has one on rear right now. Best comparioson tire I have to them is probably an ikon, other than weight i like the Saguaro. A lot of info on this board told me Ikon Ex would be better for wet roots, I think Saguaro was better. Side traction about equal, sidewall strength never had a issue and have used them from some AM type riding, have cut some older Maxxis tires (cross marks). Also had issues with an ikon and stans causing bubbles. Price Saguaro wins hand down and is more durable. All my 2 cents, I will still use Maxxis Ikons for the weight but for all round bike not for racing I prefer the Saguaro.

    One caveat this is all setup tubeless, I did notice Saguaros were prone to thorn punctures minimal times I ran them with tubes.
    XC, Road, XXC, Endurance, Mtn, All-Mtn, Cross, Gravel, just go have fun on 2 wheels!

  117. #517
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    Not to turn this into a tire discussion but I second you on the Saguaros. In 10+ years of 29'ers I've ridden a lot of tires and my favorites, without question are the Saguaros. I go non-TNT because they're a lot lighter and once you get them set up, they work really well tubeless too.

  118. #518
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zakman View Post
    The stock seat post is actually pretty good. Thomson style clamp and not outrageously heavy. I would replace the tires before the seat post. You can save almost a pound of rotational weight for the cost of the post.
    Yep. Would normally agree but I'm cheating by upgrading two bikes at once.

    Moving a Thomson setback from my SS road bike and replacing with a 0-setback EC90
    I want a deeper drop on the same road bike so getting a EA90 stem and moving the WCS 4-axis to the Luddite.

    Tires are definitely next. Ideally I could gawk the current ones with the stock wheels on CL to create some cash flow for new rubber.

    The bike will never be a weight weenie bike. But I like good stuff and only want to buy it once so while not Moots, these prices are good enough for a pouser like me. Cheers

  119. #519
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    i'm 5'8" with a 30 inch inseam... i'm thinking medium frame? i know the medium has a 30" stand over height, just wondering if i'm leaving myself enough room. can anyone with a similar build help me out... tia.
    You only live once but if you do it right, once is enough.

  120. #520
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    size

    Quote Originally Posted by carlos9 View Post
    i'm 5'8" with a 30 inch inseam... i'm thinking medium frame? i know the medium has a 30" stand over height, just wondering if i'm leaving myself enough room. can anyone with a similar build help me out... tia.
    ETT is probably a better measurement. I am 5'7 or 8" depending on day it seems with 29" inseam I ride a medium but I already knew I was comfortable on a bike with 23.5 ETT. If you are really worried about standover and think the Top Tube will be fine than I think you will be ok, got to rember that doesnt include shoes and bike is leaned when hoping on. I would go with it, if you like to sit more upright and be able to toss bike around small may be better. I personally like to be stretched out and leaned over slightly. Also keep in mind bike comes with straight post, you can always go setback or change stem lengths to play with position a little (dont go over board and totally ruin geo).

    I like to give folks this link

    Bike Stem Calculator - Brightspoke
    Last edited by HEMIjer; 11-26-2012 at 03:14 PM. Reason: typos
    XC, Road, XXC, Endurance, Mtn, All-Mtn, Cross, Gravel, just go have fun on 2 wheels!

  121. #521
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    Quote Originally Posted by HEMIjer View Post
    ETT is probably a better measurement. I am 5'7 or 8" depending on day it seems with 29" inseam I ride a medium but I already knew I was comfortable on a bike with 23.5 ETT. If you are really worried about standover and think the Top Tube will be fine than I think you will be ok, got to rember that doesnt include shoes and bike is leaned when hoping on. I would go with it, if you like to sit more upright and be able to toss bike around small may be better. I personally like to be stretched out and leaned over slightly. Also keep in mind bike comes with straight post, you can always go setback or change stem lengths to play with position a little (dont go over board and totally ruin geo).

    I like to give folks this link

    Bike Stem Calculator - Brightspoke
    thanks, thats great info
    You only live once but if you do it right, once is enough.

  122. #522
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    Quote Originally Posted by carlos9 View Post
    i'm 5'8" with a 30 inch inseam... i'm thinking medium frame? i know the medium has a 30" stand over height, just wondering if i'm leaving myself enough room. can anyone with a similar build help me out... tia.
    I'd say medium with a shorter stem. The stand over is really close on both sizes because of the slopping top tube (I have the medium and my wife has a small Young Turk). That said, I'm 5'10" and a 31" inseam and I could ride either. The small feels fun and easy to throw around, like you want to want look around for some modest jumps. I'm going to a shorter stem on the medium; I think this bike lends itself to a less stretched out position.

  123. #523
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    So, to those that own this bike, I'm looking for more info on this fork.

    Is it carbon steerer?

    Weight?

    Ride report/compliance?

    comparison to niner carbon fork?

    TIA
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  124. #524
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    Please forgive my ignorance, but I am only just coming to the time when I have to man up and work on my own bike. I am preparing to change my rear cog, and my question is this-
    does the quando hub use a normal shimano-type freewheel tool, or is it something wierd? any other pitfalls I need to watch out for?

  125. #525
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    Just need a chain whip and a lock ring removal tool. You may need different spacers depending on the width of your new cog.

  126. #526
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    so the lock ring removal tool is standard between different manufacturers? I got the impression that they had different spacing pattterns.

  127. #527
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    Quote Originally Posted by nephron View Post
    so the lock ring removal tool is standard between different manufacturers? I got the impression that they had different spacing pattterns.
    I think they're the same, pretty cheap too. You're need a 1" wrench or crescent wrench to turn it too. I'm running Surly cogs on mine with the OEM spacers.

  128. #528
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    There are Campy lockrings and Shimano. I believe the splines are actually the same. I have found the dedicated lockring tool with the 1/2 skewer fixed to the tool works best. Alligns the tool and prevents the tool from angeling out when wrneching which can mess up soft Aluminum lock rings.

    FYI. I run a King Cog, OEM spacers were too long, but what fits perfect is the Wheels Mfd single speed kit with the two larger beveled spacers + the slimmer of the two stock spacers that come with the bike. Gives a really straight chainline and a nice smooth look since you are using only 3 large spacers rather than cobbling a bunch of skinny ones together.

  129. #529
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    Finally got the bike put together but alas no time to ride, just time to take pretty pictures. Rode down some of my driveway steps with the rigid fork and its suprisingly cush given I am coming from a FS Specialized Epic. Bumps there, yes, not as jaring as I expected.

    A few changes:
    - WTB Laserdisc TCS Trail wheelset (about 1900g, tubeless ready, but still runing stock tires and tubes)
    - 27.2x330m Thomson setback post (with room to spare above the min insertion line. So for those who are about 5'10" and have a 31.5 inseam, you don't need the 400mm post)
    - 3T Xida Ltd bar
    - 100mm Ritchey WCS 4-axis stem
    - Chris King 18T
    - KMC X8 chain
    - WTB grips (the stock lock on grips produced an audible pop when lightly clamping the bar (on the ends) so... those go in the parts bin.

    Comments on the parts removed and replaced with:
    - As others have said, the stock parts are indeed pretty nice. The OEM post worked well, but scratches by looking at it. Its 400mm long and fairly light.
    - The stock bar is 720mm long. Holy giganormous bars! Them things could turn a tanker ship. The rise is nice and the backsweep is a bit more then I like.
    - The OEM stem leaves the most to be desired. Never seen split-ring washers on a stem and the dual clamp is OK. Not heavy, but primarily functional is all that can be said for this.
    - The OEM KMC single speed chain is heavy, like almost 2x as much the 8sp chain. I have never had problems running on my SS 26" (which has since been converted to a SS Xtracycle and sees a ton of torque on the X8 chain so trust it)
    - The OEM cog is crap. Duh. But even so, the splines are sloppy and uneven, and on an aluminum cassette body, it would just trash it. Even the cog that came with the Wheels Mfd spacer kit was much nicer that the OEM cog. King is my go-to cog and I see no reason to change.
    - I never rode the OEM wheels, actually I just jumped on the bike for 3 min about an hour ago, but the OEM's really are tanks

    Not that you have not seen it before but here is mine (because the web is for showing off to total strangers )





    Last edited by hiroshima; 11-30-2012 at 04:38 PM.

  130. #530
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    Nice looks great let us know how youy like it on the singletrack.
    XC, Road, XXC, Endurance, Mtn, All-Mtn, Cross, Gravel, just go have fun on 2 wheels!

  131. #531
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    Really diggin' this bike and love the cheap prices they have going now. Only problem is they're out of larges. I'm 5'11" with a 33" inseam. I currently ride a large Yelli Screamy with a 60mm stem and feel good. So question is could I be happy on a medium? I do like kinda sitting up and being able to throw the bike around.

  132. #532
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    Quote Originally Posted by elroyj View Post
    Really diggin' this bike and love the cheap prices they have going now. Only problem is they're out of larges. I'm 5'11" with a 33" inseam. I currently ride a large Yelli Screamy with a 60mm stem and feel good. So question is could I be happy on a medium? I do like kinda sitting up and being able to throw the bike around.
    I'm 5'10"-5'11" & 31.5-32" inseam. I set mine so as shown above with a 100 -6deg stem and Thomsen setback post and a flat bar. The reach from tip of saddle to the grips ended up being with 1/2" of what my old XC stumpjumper epic 18" med was.

    I have a medium and feel like I could sit up more and still be very comfortable.

    Keep in mind the stock setup for a med is a 90mm stem and probably a 10-15deg rise with a 1-1.5" rise handlebar with more backsweep and a zero setback post. So the three upgrades I slapped on probably added 1-1.5" of stretch.

    Lmk if you want saddle to stem/ saddle to gripe measurements and I can get it for you to compare to your current setup

    Jeff

  133. #533
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    Quote Originally Posted by elroyj View Post
    Really diggin' this bike and love the cheap prices they have going now. Only problem is they're out of larges. I'm 5'11" with a 33" inseam. I currently ride a large Yelli Screamy with a 60mm stem and feel good. So question is could I be happy on a medium? I do like kinda sitting up and being able to throw the bike around.
    I'm 5'11" 32" inseam, and ride a medium. Its TT measures out almost identical to my ibis mojo in a large, and fits me perfectly (more of an AM/trail geo, vs a longer XC style). Stems are 100mm across the board not 90mm (unless things have changed).

    Sign up for fatwallet cash back for deeper savings, was an extra 14% last I checked for backcountry. When I got mine I think it was 11%, bike came in under 700 shipped. Cashback takes about 3 months or so to be available but no reason not to take advantage.

  134. #534
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    FYI, if you sign up for ebates you get 5% cash back at Backcountry.com but I guess 14% is better.
    Last edited by Zakman; 12-08-2012 at 01:57 PM.

  135. #535
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    So, got my Luddite. I went way overboard I guess but oh well - I'm happy. Thrilled, actually. I figured since most of it was disassembled I'd document weight where I could, in case anyone is interested. Itry to be "weight aware" when I can.

    Luddite -

    Weighed components, with replacements:
    • Nevegal tires: 1000g/980g, replaced with Spec'd Ground Control 2.1 rear at 660g and Captain 2.2 front at 760g
    • Tubes were 220g each, replaced with others at about 180g or so
    • Cutter seat was 280g but uncomfortable as heck for me, so I treated my Stumpjumper to a new Romin Pro and put my Phenom Comp on the Luddite at 280g (check out the Outlet prices at Specialized's site!)
    • Stock seatpost was 260g and I'm leaving it alone
    • QR's were 60g front and 80g rear, putting a Halo bolt on in the rear
    • Stock bars were 280g, putting on a Niner bar at a claimed 175g
    • Grips were 140g and I hated them, putting on the Ritchey foam grips I prefer at about 45g or so.
    • Stock stem is 120g and I'm leaving it alone
    • I'm putting on an X8 KMC chain
    • I put on my old Shimano PD-M540 pedals and bought the Stumpy some Ritchey ProParadigm pedals
    • I'm putting on a Surly 21T cog
    • I'm putting on some Purely Custom stuff to give it some personality
    • I'm leaving the stock cranks and 32T chainring


    Without the bars, grips, bolt-on skewer, bottle cage, chain, 21T, etc it's currently at 26lbs and was a blast to ride during my short test ride Saturday. I'm looking forward to finishing and getting it out there for real. It definitely has a different feel - much more upright than my Stumpy. Pushing the 18T cog wasn't as bad as I'd anticipated but I did a short, flat ride, so...

    What a great bike for the price and I was lucky enough to have some fun with modifications, too. Even stock it was groovy and I feel like most of what I did to modify it was extra (tires really needed to be different). Front end feels kinda light already but I don't think it'll have a handling problem.

    I've got a few crappy cellphone pics attached.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-luddite2.jpg  

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-ludditeride3.jpg  

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-ludditeride1.jpg  

    2004 Specialized FSR Pro
    2011 Specialized Stumpjumper Comp 29er
    Civilian Luddite 29er SS

  136. #536
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    I went to a 80mm stem over the weekend and the bike just came alive - I'd like to try even shorter for kicks. You guys contemplating a stretched out cockpit should at least try a short stem. I try to ride with "heavy feet, light hands" and the stem really enabled this technique. I also found the climbing better as I was able to get in more of a standing or "hiking" position which allows me to stand for long periods of time without getting tired.

  137. #537
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    been running a 70mm, its definitely a requirement imo for a bike like this (ie not a steep XC geo)

  138. #538
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    springsrubicon, did you by chance weigh the wheels? I have seen some ball park weights but not anything too official.
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  139. #539
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasnavy05 View Post
    springsrubicon, did you by chance weigh the wheels? I have seen some ball park weights but not anything too official.
    Mine were officially 2,325 grams.

  140. #540
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasnavy05 View Post
    springsrubicon, did you by chance weigh the wheels? I have seen some ball park weights but not anything too official.
    Well... I did it in a pretty cheesy way. I was too lazy to remove the rotors and the cog/spacers...

    Front with 180mm Avid rotor: 1260g
    Rear with 160mm Avid rotor, stock 18T cog, stock spacers, stock lockring: 1500g

    So there's documentation online saying the rotors are 104g (160mm) and 160g (185mm).
    My new Surly 21T cog is about 100g. No idea on spacers/locking.

    Anyway, in loose numbers, subtract about 400g or so from the total wheel weight...
    2004 Specialized FSR Pro
    2011 Specialized Stumpjumper Comp 29er
    Civilian Luddite 29er SS

  141. #541
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    Thanks SS Hack and SpringsRubicon.

    So, with the wheels and tires I already have (American classic all mountain, and maxxis ikons) I am looking at a net loss of 1651 grams which is over 3.6 pounds!!

    Another 100 grams for the bars that I I will buy, and 60 for my esi chunky grips and I am at a 4 pound loss.

    I could have this bike in the low 23# range only having to buy bars and grips!!
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  142. #542
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasnavy05 View Post
    Thanks SS Hack and SpringsRubicon.

    So, with the wheels and tires I already have (American classic all mountain, and maxxis ikons) I am looking at a net loss of 1651 grams which is over 3.6 pounds!!

    Another 100 grams for the bars that I I will buy, and 60 for my esi chunky grips and I am at a 4 pound loss.

    I could have this bike in the low 23# range only having to buy bars and grips!!
    Shouldn't be that hard. Mine is 25.2 right now with semi heavy DT Swiss wheels (1,950 grams) and a big Rampage up front. Everything is mostly stock.

    Any know what the cranks weigh? I have a set of AKAs I might slap on too with a spiederless ring at some point.

  143. #543
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    Sorry for the tedious question but i am thinking of biting the bullet and purchasing this bike but i am unsure on the sizing. I am 5'6" and my inseam is just about 31", i currently ride a medium 2011 stumpjumper fsr so i am wondering if the small or medium frame would be better for me? Ive always been in between on sizes and i just cant decide on this one, so from your experiences with the bike, small or medium?

  144. #544
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    Compare the top tubes between the 2 bikes, though I'd guess a small

  145. #545
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    Quote Originally Posted by hajjar02 View Post
    Sorry for the tedious question but i am thinking of biting the bullet and purchasing this bike but i am unsure on the sizing. I am 5'6" and my inseam is just about 31", i currently ride a medium 2011 stumpjumper fsr so i am wondering if the small or medium frame would be better for me? Ive always been in between on sizes and i just cant decide on this one, so from your experiences with the bike, small or medium?
    I am always in that same boat. I am slightly taller but shorter inseam than you and went Medium because it was same ETT as another bike and I like to be stretched out, alos figured on geo and straight seatpost bike would still be flickable. I would probably suggest small as well, if yo uwantto be stretched out and think you have longer torso maybe medium.
    XC, Road, XXC, Endurance, Mtn, All-Mtn, Cross, Gravel, just go have fun on 2 wheels!

  146. #546
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    I'm 5'10" with a 31" inseam and the medium is perfect. My wife (she's 5'7" with a 30' inseam) has the geared version of this bike in small and the top tube is quite a bit shorter - I'd say there's a biggest difference than between most other company's frame sizes.

    That said this bike in small seems really fun and frankly I could even ride it. The head tube is even slightly slacker and it feels easy to throw around, like you want to go look for some jumps to hit.

  147. #547
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    Okay thanks for the input. im probably going to go with the small.

  148. #548
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    So I've looked through some of this thread, and am going to order a Luddite this week. I'm super excited to get the XLT size, I'm 6'6" with a 37" inseam and I've never been on a 29er or a frame properly sized for climbing (the only other bike I currently ride is a Banshee Scythe).

    Some of the previous posters said they where able to get the bike for $630. The current sale price on Competitive Cyclist is $786. Did I miss the best prices or is there still some deal/discount I can take advantage of?

  149. #549
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    fatwallet has a cashback program, 14%, but you wont get that cashback for 3-4 months so its not like an immediate discount

  150. #550
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strelok View Post
    So I've looked through some of this thread, and am going to order a Luddite this week. I'm super excited to get the XLT size, I'm 6'6" with a 37" inseam and I've never been on a 29er or a frame properly sized for climbing (the only other bike I currently ride is a Banshee Scythe).

    Some of the previous posters said they where able to get the bike for $630. The current sale price on Competitive Cyclist is $786. Did I miss the best prices or is there still some deal/discount I can take advantage of?
    For a time, it was up on Dept of Goods at a blow out price - some people got that deal and others (myself) got CC/Backcountry to match that price on older orders.

  151. #551
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    For a time, it was up on Dept of Goods at a blow out price - some people got that deal and others (myself) got CC/Backcountry to match that price on older orders.
    How did you get them to match the Department of Goods sale price? I have talked to 3 Backcountry employees, and they all said they could not match a DoG price. One claimed it was a previous model year Luddite, another insisted the Luddite had never been on sale through DoG.

    I tried to use this link: Civilian Bicycle Co. Luddite | 29Er Bikes to convince them that it had been on sale. But no luck.

  152. #552
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strelok View Post
    How did you get them to match the Department of Goods sale price? I have talked to 3 Backcountry employees, and they all said they could not match a DoG price. One claimed it was a previous model year Luddite, another insisted the Luddite had never been on sale through DoG.

    I tried to use this link: Civilian Bicycle Co. Luddite | 29Er Bikes to convince them that it had been on sale. But no luck.
    It went on sale a week after I bought it at Backcountry and I just asked if'd they'd match and the nice girl checked with a sup and they matched. They gained a very loyal customer in the process.

    There was no prior year.

  153. #553
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    You wont get a price match. That was months ago, and they stopped doing it back then.

  154. #554
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    Well I'm a bit disappointed I missed that 40% sale, but if I'm fortunate enough to be considering another bike I guess life is still good, haha. I'll order it through Backcountry with the fatwallet cashback deal clewttu suggested.

    Thanks for the help guys! I'll be sure to post ride pics and some thoughts on the bike in a week or two.

  155. #555
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    don't give up hope

    after a bit of research and before i saw this thread, i ordered my luddite yesterday. the price was listed as $786. they graciously lowered to $740 and then, with a bit more haggle, $720. this was all done using live chat at realcyclist.com.

    then i saw this board and the ridiculously low price some had paid. this was going to bug me for the foreseeable future.

    so it's 3:30am and i've finished devouring all 24 pages of this thread. i start a new chat session with, this time, backcountry.com. surprise: someone is actually working at this ungodly hour and they know about my order.

    before long (and with the help of quoting some posts from this thread) i had the price reduced to $650. done. happy. good night.

  156. #556
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    Rode a quick 10 mile ride off the levee today. I have forgotten how wonderful a ss mtb bike is. I have a surly 1x1 but it has king hubs and with all the racket thoseake between pedal strokes, it was truly a revelation running my luddite with the wtb/American classic hubs. Those things are basically silent. It was dead quiet out there and I snuck up on a few walkers.

    Bike rode great. Full ridged coming from fs is jarring.

    32x18 is too tall as others have mentioned. I think a 19 or 20 out back may be better.

    Bike steers great. I have a setback post and 10cm stem and didn't feel slow at all. Take up on the low tooth count hubs was unnoticeable.

    Traction up inclines was great. Steep descends were cake.

    Paint already chipped from a flying rock. Can't wait to put this thing on a real trail.

    Merry Christmas

  157. #557
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    Anyone have this bike in a large size? Competitive and backcountry appear to be out.
    -It's time to shred some mild to moderate gnar!! :cornut:

  158. #558
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    backcountry and competitive are out of stock of medium and large in both orange and mojito. i talked to customer service last night as i was planning on spending my christmas loot on a medium orange... apparently they haven't heard from civilian regarding when or if they will be receiving a new shipment as civilian haven't decided on which lines they are going to continue for the new year. according to the service rep i spoke to, civilian are cutting down on the number of models made for 2013 [possibly introducing new models?] and that they wouldn't know until "spring" exactly what civilians plans are....

    sooooo, if anyone has purchased a medium luddite in orange that they are not happy with, pm me!
    You only live once but if you do it right, once is enough.

  159. #559
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    hi all,
    I emailed tyson hart of cvln asking if any large luddites would be available and what, if any, changes were to be made for the 2013 models.
    His response:
    "Working through next year's production, so they should be available by mid spring. Sorry for the inconvenience...not much is changing on the Luddite for next year."

    so, the question for me is to wait?
    ...or keep lurking/looking on pinkbike and mtbr and ebay until the purchasing urge takes me over and I end up "wasting" my future children's college funds on some specialized/niner/moots lovely monstrosity?

    fun!

  160. #560
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    Quote Originally Posted by pilonidal View Post
    hi all,
    I emailed tyson hart of cvln asking if any large luddites would be available and what, if any, changes were to be made for the 2013 models.
    His response:
    "Working through next year's production, so they should be available by mid spring. Sorry for the inconvenience...not much is changing on the Luddite for next year."

    so, the question for me is to wait?
    ...or keep lurking/looking on pinkbike and mtbr and ebay until the purchasing urge takes me over and I end up "wasting" my future children's college funds on some specialized/niner/moots lovely monstrosity?

    fun!
    Makes no sense. You are comparing a $4k moots with a $700 steel basic ride? It sounds to me like you should buy what you really want rather then purchase an interim bike you know you will dump. Double purchasing is the sure fire way to kill your kids education fund. Wasting money is the fun that only the truly wealthy get to experience in any great excess. Sounds to me like you and I fall into the same boat ( not rich, multiple kids).

    The luddite is a hoot for sure, but it ain't no moots

  161. #561
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    i did the same thing, [quite surprised to get an email from tyson himself!] and got the same answer. by the way, mid-spring means april...

    Quote Originally Posted by pilonidal View Post
    hi all,
    I emailed tyson hart of cvln asking if any large luddites would be available and what, if any, changes were to be made for the 2013 models.
    His response:
    "Working through next year's production, so they should be available by mid spring. Sorry for the inconvenience...not much is changing on the Luddite for next year."

    so, the question for me is to wait?
    ...or keep lurking/looking on pinkbike and mtbr and ebay until the purchasing urge takes me over and I end up "wasting" my future children's college funds on some specialized/niner/moots lovely monstrosity?

    fun!
    You only live once but if you do it right, once is enough.

  162. #562
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    First Luddite lands in Afghanistan. Taliban scurry for hills

    Got my XXL 23" orange Luddite sent USPS to an APO in Afghanistan free of charge by Competitive Cyclist in Utah. I am 6'3" and this seems to be a size perfect for me. Arrived in three boxes and surprisingly light for a bike of that size. I have to say that it looks much much better than I had expected. There are about 30 bike owners just in the one building where I work and this Luddite has blown all others out of the water. It is definitely the best looking bike in Afghanistan. Quality is very good and if I could find any drawback at all it would be that the gearing, 32/18 is slightly low for flat ground. If u r pedalling slightly downhill or on flat ground for a long distance you would want a higher gear, but for hill country it is likely just right. Apart from that one helluva bike. Almost a shame to take it out and get it dirty. Maybe I'll order a second one. One to ride and one to admire.

  163. #563
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    Quick question, do you'll think a small would fit me? I'm 5'10", 30" inseam. Crotch to sternum is 21" and arms are 31". Or will it be to cramped? Thanks guys.

  164. #564
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    Quote Originally Posted by motoolfan View Post
    Quick question, do you'll think a small would fit me? I'm 5'10", 30" inseam. Crotch to sternum is 21" and arms are 31". Or will it be to cramped? Thanks guys.
    Cannot say for certain but I'm 5'11". 31"inseam. Arms are about 21.5 (wrist to shoulder socket). I got the med. I also like a stretched out position and so have a 100mm stem, flat bars, and a setback post. I personally think a small is pushing it unless you are looking for a really upright position

  165. #565
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    Quote Originally Posted by hiroshima View Post
    Cannot say for certain but I'm 5'11". 31"inseam. Arms are about 21.5 (wrist to shoulder socket). I got the med. I also like a stretched out position and so have a 100mm stem, flat bars, and a setback post. I personally think a small is pushing it unless you are looking for a really upright position
    Thanks for the info, I also like a stretched out position, I'll have ta wait till the spring.

  166. #566
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    Quote Originally Posted by motoolfan View Post
    Thanks for the info, I also like a stretched out position, I'll have ta wait till the spring.
    Wise, the small has a way short TT compared to the medium - a much bigger difference than many other brands. Perhaps, spring will bring a better wheelset. I'd loved to have paid just a little more for something not so very heavy.

  167. #567
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    I put a set of 2.25 Schwalbe Nobby Nics on mine.......lost around 2.25 lbs! ( more than I expected ) planning on doing a getto tubless conversion on the stock wheelset next. Developed play in the headset twice and re tightened, the bearing race must not have been set correctly during the initial assembly.....other than that, really enjoying this bike!

  168. #568
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    Glad to see this bike has a lot of positive attention! Of all the sub $1K single speeds out there this has to be the best offering IMHO. It's very encouraging to hear the Ludite may be offered again. I have looked at the Kona Unit, Redline Monogog as well as the Surly Karate Monkey (more than $1K) but the Ludite just seems way better!! Are there any other locations (in So Calif area) that may offer this bike?

  169. #569
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    Loving mine. Have not had a ton of time to ride it but I can tinker with it in the garage.... and have moved to some new bits to get the weight down. It should be in the mid23 lbs / low 24 lbs in its current state. (Size Med) The frame is a tank so it will never be a fly weight.

    3t Xida Ltd Carbon Bar
    WCS 4-Axis Stem
    Oury grips
    Deore 596 Brakes
    XT pedals
    WTB TCS Trail wheelset
    S-Works Fasttrack tires
    Thomson setback post
    Chris King Cog

  170. #570
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    Quote Originally Posted by panicstop View Post
    Glad to see this bike has a lot of positive attention! Of all the sub $1K single speeds out there this has to be the best offering IMHO. It's very encouraging to hear the Ludite may be offered again. I have looked at the Kona Unit, Redline Monogog as well as the Surly Karate Monkey (more than $1K) but the Ludite just seems way better!! Are there any other locations (in So Calif area) that may offer this bike?
    I think it was a Backcountry (CC, HnR) internet only bike; but the original owner has the company back, so maybe more places will stock now. For the $636, it was the best deal going. Ironically, I just bought a discounted Surly KM frame set which I'm slapping together with my leftover Luddite parts! I ran a 120mm suspension fork for a time on the Luddite and it was pretty cool as a hardtail too - very versatile bike.

    Anyone have a frame weight yet? I'm betting it's over 6 pounds, maybe 7.

  171. #571
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    My only real complaint is the paint. Mine has a ridiculous number of chips in it.

    I had the same problem with the headset loosening up. A Thomson stem solved the problem for me.

    My size large is about 22.6 lbs but I have Stan's Raven tires on it at the moment which are pretty much useless in anything but dry hard pack conditions. I got a good deal on the tires and wanted to check them out for myself after reading all the good reviews on line. I am pretty much a tire junkie and like to try new things out.

  172. #572
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    I love mine, with just a few qualifications. I'm already seeing paint problems, which sucks. I am also having a helluva time keeping the rear wheel aligned so the rotor doesn't rub. It seems that every ride I go on it slides. I emailed Civilian and got a reply directly from Tyson Hart (!), who gave me step by step instructions on how he does it on his Luddite. Problem still exists. Any suggestions?

    Otherwise this has been a great experience! I love singlespeeding and now split my time between my Stumpy HT and my Luddite. I can tell that the Luddite will increase my fitness (both because it's physically challenging and because it's so fun I want to ride more).

    My large now weighs in at about 25.6. The assembly was a breeze (other than the wheel slipping thing) and I've got about single track 40-50 miles on it now. My changes:

    Tires: Spec'd Capt 2.2 Control front / Spec'd GC 2.1 Control rear (will probably go fatter someday)
    Tubes: stock were stupid heavy, replaced with some from performance and lost 60grams per wheel
    Spec'd Phenom Chromo saddle
    Niner Carbon bar because it was on sale and I could afford it
    Shimano 540 pedals
    21T Surly cog
    KMC X8 chain
    Cheap foam grips
    Purely custom stem cap and spacers for some personality
    Incredibell because I hike with my kids a lot and appreciate being warned when someone is riding up behind us

    Even though I immediately upgraded a bunch of components, I have zero doubt that stock the bike was awesome. I couldn't handle the saddle (everyone's different), but other than that it rocked out of the box. I just gotta solve the wheel slipping thing...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-luddite2.jpg  

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-ludditeride3.jpg  

    2004 Specialized FSR Pro
    2011 Specialized Stumpjumper Comp 29er
    Civilian Luddite 29er SS

  173. #573
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    I would suggest regular washers between the bolts and the frame. That's what I am doing with mine and it works like a charm. If you look at Paragon Machine Works website, all of their bolt kits for their same style sliders come with washers.

  174. #574
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    I know folks like the whole battle scar thing and tell me i should ignore paint chips. But I'm OCD and so cannot. I wonder if Tyson would do some kind of deal to produce some quality stickers or decals for those of us who end up powder coating the frame. I am not for tons of advertising on my bikes (2 of my 4 bikes have be PC'ed and have no branding whatsoever) but like that the bike is a smaller company and think the OEM logos were actually tasteful and understated.

    I'll follow up with the company to see what they think.

  175. #575
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    Yeah Tyson bought the company back and as far as I know Mellow Johnny's in Austin carried them in addition to Backcounty.

    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    I think it was a Backcountry (CC, HnR) internet only bike; but the original owner has the company back, so maybe more places will stock now. For the $636, it was the best deal going. Ironically, I just bought a discounted Surly KM frame set which I'm slapping together with my leftover Luddite parts! I ran a 120mm suspension fork for a time on the Luddite and it was pretty cool as a hardtail too - very versatile bike.

    Anyone have a frame weight yet? I'm betting it's over 6 pounds, maybe 7.

  176. #576
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpringsRubicon View Post
    I love mine, with just a few qualifications. I'm already seeing paint problems, which sucks. I am also having a helluva time keeping the rear wheel aligned so the rotor doesn't rub. It seems that every ride I go on it slides. I emailed Civilian and got a reply directly from Tyson Hart (!), who gave me step by step instructions on how he does it on his Luddite. Problem still exists. Any suggestions?
    The setup advice in this thread works, as I'm sure Tyson's does. I scraped the paint on my sliders as was recommended here, and you've gotta tighten the everloving dog sh!t out of a few things here and there, but I've gotten mine to run pretty straight. Still have trouble with the front wheel pulling to one side in the fork if I don't get the QR tightened down good (no bike rack, so it comes apart regularly to fit in the Civic), but that's user error on my part. It took a few tries at a few different methods, but so do most things in life.

    Paint chips... Yeah, I've got plenty of those, but they usually don't reach bare metal, so I'm not worried about it.

    Other than that, mine's been great! I added a Surly 20 tooth cog and pulled it as far forward as it would go in the sliders and the bike really woke up handling-wise. It's a little heavy, but it feels bulletproof and fits my ham fisted approach to riding pretty well. I joke with my riding buddies about having to go home and do fork maintenance after every ride. This involves drinking beer and staring at my fork. Maybe one of these days they'll see the light and go rigid too...

  177. #577
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    I'm using a Halo Hex on the front and have no problems with movement. The sliders work perfectly for me too. I plan to move to a 70mm stem soon (from 80mm) and I've got a little setback on my seatpost now too. The frame seems really stout.

  178. #578
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRed390 View Post
    The setup advice in this thread works, as I'm sure Tyson's does. I scraped the paint on my sliders as was recommended here, and you've gotta tighten the everloving dog sh!t out of a few things here and there, but I've gotten mine to run pretty straight. Still have trouble with the front wheel pulling to one side in the fork if I don't get the QR tightened down good (no bike rack, so it comes apart regularly to fit in the Civic), but that's user error on my part. It took a few tries at a few different methods, but so do most things in life.

    Paint chips... Yeah, I've got plenty of those, but they usually don't reach bare metal, so I'm not worried about it.

    Other than that, mine's been great! I added a Surly 20 tooth cog and pulled it as far forward as it would go in the sliders and the bike really woke up handling-wise. It's a little heavy, but it feels bulletproof and fits my ham fisted approach to riding pretty well. I joke with my riding buddies about having to go home and do fork maintenance after every ride. This involves drinking beer and staring at my fork. Maybe one of these days they'll see the light and go rigid too...
    I had the same issue with the front wheel shifting just enough to cause the rotor to rub.....I was surprised to find out that when I install a higher quality set of Easton skewers, the problem was solved.

    As for paint chips.... After a few deep chips almost down to bare metal, I installed a down tube protector, (2"wide black vinyl tape) and wrapped the frame area above the rear tire, no paint chips since! This bike is good enough to invest in a media blast and powder coating in the future when the factory paint is thrashed.

    And yes, taking the paint off and tightening the s**t out of the sliders is the only way to keep them from moving! As for fork maintenance, sounds like a great plan to me....
    Last edited by borbntm; 01-24-2013 at 07:52 PM.

  179. #579
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    Quote Originally Posted by borbntm View Post
    I had the same issue with the front wheel shifting just enough to cause the rotor to rub.....I was surprised to find out that when I install a higher quality set of Easton skewers, the problem was solved.
    So there's 2 votes for new skewers. Guess I'm going shopping!! Thanks!

  180. #580
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigRed390 View Post
    So there's 2 votes for new skewers. Guess I'm going shopping!! Thanks!
    Readjust and align those BB7s after the install for best results.

  181. #581
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    I replaced my BB7's with Shimano Deore M596 stoppers. Seriously, no comparison in terms of power, modulation, feel, ergonomics, and weight.

    Power - I felt was ~ 2x as strong as BB7's (same avid rotors for both)

    Modulation - I suppose is subjective, but the BB7's lever pull requires way more lever effort then the Deore. The amount of effort required on the Deore to go from say 10% to 75% brake power is tiny, but the modulation is all there. I almost felt that my XTR v-brakes with KoolStop salmon pads stopped better them BB7's (in the dry).

    Feel - running stock cables is so much nicer with hydro. Duh. I suppose if I spent $65 on Gore Cables feel would be closer. But full open to full clamp, the hyrdos had a firm "thunk" as opposed to the BB7's which kinda-stop and then just keep getting more squishy as the cables flex

    Ergo - is more a function of the lever only, but the Shimano's nailed the ergo on the new levers.

    Weight ~ 200g less for the F&R system.

    I am super happy with the upgrade, and at the cost delta between the two (Deore can be had for $120 and I sold my BB7's with levers and adaptersfor $50) is $75 and for that amount of money, its a no-brainer in my mind. I know this is not the place for a brake review, but felt that it was worth posting on this thread.

    Bike now at 23.5 pounds (sans seat pack and pump), No more easy/cheap upgrades to drop significat weight at this point

    I can't see dropping more then 1/2 pound without spending a LOT of $.

  182. #582
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    I used some of the leftover parts to build up a Surly KM and the KM only weighs about a pound more with a steel fork, which leads me to believe the Luddite frame is at least 6.5 pounds or more.

  183. #583
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-imageuploadedbytapatalk1359731483.128427.jpgLatest upgrade, 2.25 Nobby Nics, tubeless on the stock wheelset.....lost just over 2lbs!!
    MTB Rob was taken!

  184. #584
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?

    Quote Originally Posted by borbntm View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	ImageUploadedByTapatalk1359731483.128427.jpg 
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ID:	767213Latest upgrade, 2.25 Nobby Nics, tubeless on the stock wheelset.....lost just over 2lbs!!
    What conversion technique did you use?

  185. #585
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?

    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    What conversion technique did you use?
    Stan's valve stems, tape and sealant, aired up with a hand pump(barely) ......had a few slow leaks at first in the bead areas but ok now after some tossing around. Currently working well at around 30 / 32 psi
    MTB Rob was taken!

  186. #586
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?

    Quote Originally Posted by borbntm View Post
    Stan's valve stems, tape and sealant, aired up with a hand pump(barely) ......had a few slow leaks at first in the bead areas but ok now after some tossing around. Currently working well at around 30 / 32 psi
    I think I'll try with Gorilla tape and a small POS compressor.

  187. #587
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    Anyone put an aftermarket derailleur hanger on their bike? I have the Young Turk an the DH is a weak link, super flexy, bends out of place easily. I was hoping to replace it with something sturdier.

  188. #588
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?

    I bought the derailleur hanger from paragon machine works. It fits in the slider fine. I haven't attached a derailleur to it so I can't say how durable it is.

  189. #589
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    Just installed the latest round of upgrades....Stans Arch wheelset, tubeless with 2.25 Nobby Nics, Niner carbon bar, EA50 stem, Easton Haven carbon seat post, Surly 18 tooth cog....Now tips the bathroom scale at 24lbs. + change....pics to follow (or it didn't really happen, I know!)

    Here's some pics....planning to ride about 40 miles between Sunday & Monday, to fully evaluate the build.....so far MUCH improved based on a short ride. It's cool to see others improving their rides also. It's a great platform.
    Last edited by borbntm; 02-15-2013 at 07:17 PM.
    MTB Rob was taken!

  190. #590
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?

    Quote Originally Posted by borbntm View Post
    Just installed the latest round of upgrades....Stans Arch wheelset, tubeless with 2.25 Nobby Nics, Niner carbon bar, EA50 stem, Easton Haven carbon seat post, Surly 18 tooth cog....Now tips the bathroom scale at 24lbs. + change....pics to follow (or it didn't really happen, I know!)
    Which Nobby Nics did you use?

  191. #591
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    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Which Nobby Nics did you use?
    SS H.....Jenson USA, on sale for $39.99, folding bead, non UST... very happy with this tire. I am going to buy another set and stash them away before the sale is over. Extremely easy to mount tubless on Stan's Arch rims with just a floor pump.

    I ran them in the correct direction on the stock WTB wheels...have them mounted opposite on the new wheel set. I haven't had a chance to ride enough yet to determine any difference in rolling resistance or grip.

  192. #592
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    Last show and tell, now I gotta ride the damn thing and get off my road bike.

    Updated with Deore brakes which are way more then I should ever need. S-Works Fast Track rubber. Also tossed out the stock crankset for an X9 + Bling Ring. Didn't drop as much weight as I thought I would but stands at 23.25 lbs which ain't light.

    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-img7005q.jpg
    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-img7006u.jpg

  193. #593
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    Forgot the mention. Owners - recheck the BB torque. When I went to install my new crank and remove the stock GXP BB cups... they were finger tight. I barely needed the cup tool.

    My usual Ext-BB cup tool is the kind that fits like a cup over the whole assembly and not the open-ended wrench type that looks like a claw.... I have that one too... but did not think to use it. It may benefit you guys to double check its not loose so you don't prematurely toast you BB bearings.

  194. #594
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    Anybody out there know when something new / updated is coming out from Civilian?? Seems like I read somewhere that there are new models coming soon??

  195. #595
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    Quote Originally Posted by borbntm View Post
    Anybody out there know when something new / updated is coming out from Civilian?? Seems like I read somewhere that there are new models coming soon??
    hi all,
    I emailed tyson hart of cvln asking if any large luddites would be available and what, if any, changes were to be made for the 2013 models.
    His response:
    "Working through next year's production, so they should be available by mid spring. Sorry for the inconvenience...not much is changing on the Luddite for next year."

    so, the question for me is to wait?
    ...or keep lurking/looking on pinkbike and mtbr and ebay until the purchasing urge takes me over and I end up "wasting" my future children's college funds on some specialized/niner/moots lovely monstrosity?

    fun!



    Here's the post from early January... Apparently mid spring means April.
    You only live once but if you do it right, once is enough.

  196. #596
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    Quote Originally Posted by carlos9 View Post
    hi all,
    I emailed tyson hart of cvln asking if any large luddites would be available and what, if any, changes were to be made for the 2013 models.
    His response:
    "Working through next year's production, so they should be available by mid spring. Sorry for the inconvenience...not much is changing on the Luddite for next year."

    so, the question for me is to wait?
    ...or keep lurking/looking on pinkbike and mtbr and ebay until the purchasing urge takes me over and I end up "wasting" my future children's college funds on some specialized/niner/moots lovely monstrosity?

    fun!



    Here's the post from early January... Apparently mid spring means April.

    I emailed Tyson Hart @ civilian a couple days ago and he said he was dealing with production delays and would update Facebook page , I can't seem to find the Facebook page.

  197. #597
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?

    Anybody ever measure the fork? I did and this thing is pretty long, it's at least like a 100mm and pretty similar to a sagged 120mm sus fork.

  198. #598
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?

    Quote Originally Posted by SS Hack View Post
    Anybody ever measure the fork? I did and this thing is pretty long, it's at least like a 100mm and pretty similar to a sagged 120mm sus fork.
    It's about 1/2 inch shorter than my Reba RLT 100mm on my Stumpy EVO not accounting for sag.
    MTB Rob was taken!

  199. #599
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?

    Killer deal on the seat....same as what came on the Luditte / grips (which I swapped) only $11.99....The carbon version that I purchased for the road bike was a better deal at $26.99 with bar tape....seat weight is only 160 grams and it is as well made as my WTBs.....This carbon rail seat truly a killer deal! Hope it holds up under road bike use, truly a weight weenie special.Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-imageuploadedbytapatalk1366255747.023754.jpgAnyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-imageuploadedbytapatalk1366255791.077309.jpgAnyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?-imageuploadedbytapatalk1366255823.614068.jpg
    MTB Rob was taken!

  200. #600
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    Anyone seen a Civilian Luddite 29er?

    Quote Originally Posted by borbntm View Post
    Killer deal on the seat....same as what came on the Luditte / grips (which I swapped) only $11.99....The carbon version that I purchased for the road bike was a better deal at $26.99 with bar tape....seat weight is only 160 grams and it is as well made as my WTBs.....This carbon rail seat truly a killer deal! Hope it holds up under road bike use, truly a weight weenie special.Click image for larger version. 

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    Nice, where did you get them?

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