Creak, Creak, here comes the trek 69'er, Creak Creak- Mtbr.com
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  1. #1
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    Creak, Creak, here comes the trek 69'er, Creak Creak

    Since the second day riding the bike has been creaking. initially it FELT like it was the bb, but after changing it out it had the same noise, and i've traced it to the rear end.
    I've tried removing it all, cleaning and reassembling. soon after it creaks again when i'm applying power to the pedals.
    tried cleaning, greasing. that works for a while but that attracts dirt and the creak returns.
    tried cleaning and putting anti-seize. same but it starts to creak sooner.
    really wet riding makes it quiet though.

    last night i disassembled it and cleaned it and gave a light roughing to the mating surface of the slidey recessed parts and reassembled tightly. no luck.

    bolts can't get tighter when i do them with an multitool allen key set. maybe i need a longer lever to get extra torque or something.
    i was also thinking of making a gasket out of thin foam...dunno. that creak is making me nuts though!

    anyone have similar issues/solutions?

    thanks.

  2. #2
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    Bolt On Drop Out's

    You would think the dropout assembly would be a place of concern.

    Do the bolts get locktite? Blue?
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  3. #3
    J_T
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    Bontrager hub?

    Try a light coating of grease on the splines of the freehub body and cog. Make sure all of the spacers, chainguards etc are clean and the lockring is torqued to the correct tightness.

  4. #4
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    response

    J.T - if i greased the slidey dropouts and the noise stops for a bit, i'm doubting that its anything but the dropouts. good thought. i may do so anyways.

    Crash_burn - no i haven't locktited the bolts yet, however when i check em during/post ride they seem fine (aka, friggin tight). and if i locktite them it'll be a larger pain when i want to switch between cogs for different terrrain (currently a 16t and a 19t cog depending).

    i may try sanding the entire interface of the dropout/frame to see if that solves anything.
    i'd also contact trek themselves if there was a way to do that, since i doubt they read much here.

    thanks for the suggestions.
    don

  5. #5
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    Interesting

    [QUOTE=Crash_Burn]You would think the dropout assembly would be a place of concern.



    in the photo above the bike has polished alu dropouts...production bikes are black painted. Wonder if thats an issue. i tried lightly sanding them, but they were really resistant to a file...which is both good and bad i guess.

  6. #6
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    I've got a buddy at Trek I'll fire off a text message and see what he has to say.

    If the bolts did'nt come with loctite on them it would be odd that they are supposed to have it on them.

    I imagine these bikes had fairly good quality control as they are such a small batch.

    Can you post a pic of your DO's?

  7. #7
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    Crash_Burn; thanks for that. this is all i've got just now. i'll grab another specific shot tonight if i think of it.


    other pics here: https://www.donricker.smugmug.com/gallery/2731787/1

    would i have to re-loctite the bolts each time i moved the dropouts?
    i'm also wondering how hard i need to crank the holding bolts down, perhaps its harder than i can actually do without using some form of levered extension (aka a pipe).

    maybe i'll just tool dip the dropouts and see what happens next :-)

  8. #8
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    Creaky 69er

    I rode one of these bikes a couple of weeks ago and had a blast on it, took awhile to get the fork up to pressure for my weight (200lbs), once I got the right sag set, it ripped.

    Dax (the NW Trek Demo rep) says BB and Crank arm connection is most likely, then drop out nuts then seatpost collar. I guess this would be his plan of attack if the bike was in front of him.

    From your postings so far you mention tightening things, I would be very careful in not going to hard with over tightening. I know having a creaky bike (especially an SS) is not pleasant, but be very care when snugging things up.

    Nice website BTW - hope you don't mind me pirating your photo, I can't really tell that the dropout is painted black? o.k. I see what your saying - doh

    Wonder why they painted them in the production run - may look cool but it seems like the paint would eventually wear off.

    Looks like you may need a longer stem - Maverick sells different lengths.
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    Last edited by Crash_Burn; 06-06-2007 at 10:21 AM.

  9. #9
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    hmmm

    well its not the bb. i thought it was, was sure it was, so i replaced it with a new square taper bb and new cranks. same creak.

    seatpost. nope. cleaned/lubed that too. it creaks standing or sitting.

    back to the rear. hadn't considered the nuts specifically

    the dropouts are a very hard anodized/rough textured metal. not sure what they used but its friggin durable.
    thanks again.

  10. #10
    J_T
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    paddlerx,

    I had this same issue with a Bonty hub on another bike with out sliders and it drove me nuts. The splines on the hub were anodized and that was the problem. If you're swapping cogs give it a try. I personally think that grease between the sliders and frame will only attract dust and add to the problem.

    I do have a Trek 69er too but it's been quiet so far. I have had mine apart to replace the cog and to look things over. From what I can tell the texture of the sliders grip the frame so again grease might not be good. jmho.

    What cranks did you put on yours? I'm going to replace mine but only to go to 180mm I can't understand why Trek didn't spec longer arms on this bike... Especially on an XL

  11. #11
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    bonty hub; ok i'll give it a shot tonight. the bikes getting the 19 put on for a hilly ride tomorrow night (was just raced last night on the 16t). a light coating of grease it is. and here's hoping.

    i found an old set of 'shimano hollowtech' cranks at the shop in a dusty bin. their 175s and as light or lighter than the bonty originals. the BCD was the same as the bonty so i just moved the rockring and the 32t chainring right over.

    are you finding the bb a bit low? i'm tagging lots of rocks and roots, more than i used to. i was thinking about 180s as well but i'm already thinking clearance is an issue.

  12. #12
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    I'm not a fan of aluminum but that bike is so sweet.

    Truly a wealth of useless information.


    http://blackdogadventureteam.blogspot.com/

  13. #13
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    Out Out Dam Creak!!!

    OK, been riding the TT bike for a bit, but in prep for an upcoming dirt ride I went nuts last night trying to find the creak in the 69er.
    Had already lubed the cog/spline interface prior to putting on a 19t.
    Got some new bolts (Titanium!!!) and retightened everything: creak
    Definitly isolated it to the rear of the bike.
    Put antiseize around the dropouts: creak
    Loosened the right side bolts: creak
    Loosened the left side bolts: creak
    So now for sure its NOT the interface between the slidey dropouts and the frame...interesting.
    Loosened the QR for the wheel: creak (and the wheel moved when I torqued on the chain...not funny)
    Took the bonty QR out and slid in a POS steel deore QR after giving it a bit of grease: NO CREAK
    Dam it couldn't be that simple.
    Tightened the whole thing back to spec. silence.
    Switched QR's, back to the bontrager after greasing the snot out of it. SILENCE!!!!

    Man.
    i just hope my pain and suffering saves someone else.
    probably not though...at least i'm not nuts anymore.

    cheers and thanks for the input everyone.

  14. #14
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    Bonty QR

    Quote Originally Posted by paddlerx
    Took the bonty QR out and slid in a POS steel deore QR after giving it a bit of grease: NO CREAK
    I've always liked Shimano QR, the Bonty QR seems to take much more leverge to get them to work properly.

    Glad to hear the Creak is gone - for now

  15. #15
    J_T
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    QR creaking!

    Paddlerx, Glad that you finally found the source of the creaking.

    Mine started that creaking noise this weekend. Stopped halfway up a climb, released the rear QR, slightly tightened the nut maybe a quarter turn and closed it. Noise gone!
    Chasing those things can drive you nuts but I got lucky this time!
    I figured that you had done at least some of the troubleshooting during your attempts at isolating the noise. Thanks for posting your experiences.

    JT

  16. #16
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    hey!

    Glad to hear the Creak is gone - for now

    That's just friggin mean!!!!
    no more noise ever. (stealth biking only)

  17. #17
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    at the SSUK champs last sunday my mate who works for trek cm past me on his 69er, REALLY loud creaking, did make me laugh!

  18. #18
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    Same issue?

    i wonder if its the same issue. if it was a creak on every power phase of the pedal stroke (about 1-3o'clock on each crank arm) then i'd bet that's his issue. I'd be curious to know if this fix...fixes his problem.

    don

  19. #19
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    ghosts in my machine!!!!

    Well i lied. the creak was gone, for about 10 minutes, then slowly and persistently...it came back.
    not quite full on terrifying but bad enough.

    more R&D required by me it seems. sigh.

  20. #20
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    Maybe a light greasing of the threads on the skewer?

    When do you engage the tension on the QR lever?

    Seems like on the Bonty QR you want to feel contact at or about 135 - 120 degree (starting at 180 full open to 0 full closed), where as with shimano I make first contact at or about 90 degree.

  21. #21
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    tight...loose.

    i tried making it painful tight. starting at about 90degrees ish. also tried making it a very loose connection. neither made much difference.

    tonight i'll actually try a few diff qr's.
    and maybe some antisieze.
    dunno.

    feeling blah about the whole thing. theres and 8hr endurance event coming up, and for the first time a SS division. i was hoping to enter in and try for the win, but i won't suffer through 8hrs of creaking each time i apply power.

  22. #22
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    Good luck on the testing, let us know how it turns out.

    Saw your post on a modified stem - I imagine Maverick will eventually step up to the plate a make a shallower angled (current is 125 degree I think) stem, with so many people using the DUC as a 29er fork the supply should follow demand eventually.

    Can you flip a Mary Bar?

    https://www.on-one.co.uk/graphics/pr...f/mary_big.jpg

  23. #23
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    As part of the testing try to see if you can get the creak to come back WITHOUT using the rear brake.

    I wonder if the force of the rear disc brake applied to the DO is creating the creak?

    credit goes to Brant for thinking about this

  24. #24
    J_T
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    Grease or light oil on the QR

    Where the exposed cam makes contact with the mating curved plate/washer.

    Look Here

  25. #25
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    Thanks for posting this - It all comes back to Sheldon, He Da Man!

    I haven't read through his Blog/Journal in awhile, good to see he recently got out on his bike for a ride!

  26. #26
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    This may be a stupid question but how old/worn are your pedals? I had a hard time diagnosing a creak on one of my bikes until I figured out the pedals were the cause (I could have sworn it was a pivot or something more complex).
    "You can't discern by calculating in your mind how it will work. You have to feel how it rides differently to understand."

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crash_Burn
    As part of the testing try to see if you can get the creak to come back WITHOUT using the rear brake.

    I wonder if the force of the rear disc brake applied to the DO is creating the creak?

    credit goes to Brant for thinking about this
    And a good thought it was, and one i had thought about. i tried it both on a gentle uphill holding onto a tree and rocking the bike forward backward (creak)
    also stuffing the front wheel against a bench in my basement (creak).

    trek has said they'll deal with the creak as a warranty issue, they were aware of all the steps i'd gone through to try to rectify this. I believe its somewhere internal to the hub.
    So thanks trek for doing good! :-)
    Last edited by paddlerx; 06-15-2007 at 10:02 AM.

  28. #28
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    Trek via LBS has always been good to me - I went through 3 warranted frames, I weigh to much and ride to hard for most lightweight frames.

    I wonder if Trek has any suggestions for lowering your bar height?

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crash_Burn
    Trek via LBS has always been good to me - I went through 3 warranted frames, I weigh to much and ride to hard for most lightweight frames.

    I wonder if Trek has any suggestions for lowering your bar height?

    Yes indeed, unlike many many other big and even boutique companys, trek has kept their customer service/warranty service top drawer. that was a big reason i took the chance with a new design like the 69er. if it failed/sucked/whatever i felt that i'd be treated well. and i am so far right.

    for the lower bar issue; well i was thinking about getting an arc'ed stem cnc'd from aluminum. something like a variant on the curve cinelli road stems. it'd look wicked cool for sure.
    or i can go drop bar like tomac of old...cause people aren't making fun of me enough riding a bike like this :-)

  30. #30
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    Haaaa

    Quote Originally Posted by paddlerx
    or i can go drop bar like tomac of old...cause people aren't making fun of me enough riding a bike like this :-)
    Great quote!

    Just let em try and keep up, that's when the fun begins.

  31. #31

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    Make sure your SPD's are well oiled, it was the source of a mystery creak on my Trek 8900 a few months back, almost drove me mad hunting it down!!

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    shhh...well almost. but its not treks fault

    Short ride last night with a 5$ QR on the back...silence. nice. well until i wanted to slow down. i, in a moment of weakness droppped coin on some titanium bits and pieces. Without doing quite enough research ordered ti rotors. sweet weight savings...horrific ear piercing braking noise. I had swapped pads and installed brand new ones with the avid juicy 7 brakes. but man oh man.
    anyways the ti bolts i bought will work at least.
    my bad with the rotors.

    now hunting for a proper length/rise stem...gotta get to the machine shop i guess.

  33. #33
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    ... and if we just ...

    Quote Originally Posted by paddlerx
    And a good thought it was, and one i had thought about. i tried it both on a gentle uphill holding onto a tree and rocking the bike forward backward (creak)
    also stuffing the front wheel against a bench in my basement (creak).

    trek has said they'll deal with the creak as a warranty issue, they were aware of all the steps i'd gone through to try to rectify this. I believe its somewhere internal to the hub.
    So thanks trek for doing good! :-)
    after 2 months of creaking, i retightened the pedals, all rear end bolts, and did the qr hulk style, damn, 2 straight silent rides!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!yeah

  34. #34

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    Well? is the QR skewer the fix for the creak? Mine is driving me nuts.

    BTW where is the source and cost of the Ti bolts? If you don't mind.

    Gramps

  35. #35
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    so did this fix the issue??? or what did trek do?
    I have had this bike for about 4 months now and the creaking is driving me nuts.
    I got a longer stem for the bike after the first ride. One of the designers told me the med. should have come with the longer stem.... well let me know on the creaking.
    jesus rides a fixed gear.

  36. #36

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    69er creak fix

    I had trouble with the 69er creak in the rear end. It turned out to be the contact area between the hub and dropout. The tiny little teeth on the hub would not dig into the very tough dropout material like it normally does on most AL. and steel frames. the fix was to file down the teeth so that there was more contact area between the two surfaces. I figured this out when I tried an old crossmax wheel spaced out for one gear and the creak went away completly.

    I also had alot of trouble with the crown slipping on the maverick fork. When I climbed anything real steep that required tugging on the bars the crown would slip up. I would try to tighten it up but it still slipped. this happened over and over until I tightened too much and broke the bolts. I called maverick and pestered them til they told me that trek ordered the crown hole size a half mm larger to accomadate the painted fork, they sent me the stock size crown and I had to sand off the clear coat to get it on. this sucked but at least it stopped slipping. this week the right dropout on the fork broke, this may have been from overtightening but when I didn't get the 24 mm axle holder real tight it would also creak and the front wheel had alot of flex. the replacement axle holder is gonna be 50 bucks. when I get it fixed the fork is getting sold! anyone need a brown maverick 29er fork?

    yesterday I put a reba 29er on and today's ride was quit, flawless and much quicker in the corners. I can't believe I spent this much money on a single speed to have this many problems. my old chameleon is way more dependable!

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by justridnalong
    I had trouble with the 69er creak in the rear end. It turned out to be the contact area between the hub and dropout. The tiny little teeth on the hub would not dig into the very tough dropout material like it normally does on most AL. and steel frames. the fix was to file down the teeth so that there was more contact area between the two surfaces. I figured this out when I tried an old crossmax wheel spaced out for one gear and the creak went away completly.

    I also had alot of trouble with the crown slipping on the maverick fork. When I climbed anything real steep that required tugging on the bars the crown would slip up. I would try to tighten it up but it still slipped. this happened over and over until I tightened too much and broke the bolts. I called maverick and pestered them til they told me that trek ordered the crown hole size a half mm larger to accomadate the painted fork, they sent me the stock size crown and I had to sand off the clear coat to get it on. this sucked but at least it stopped slipping. this week the right dropout on the fork broke, this may have been from overtightening but when I didn't get the 24 mm axle holder real tight it would also creak and the front wheel had alot of flex. the replacement axle holder is gonna be 50 bucks. when I get it fixed the fork is getting sold! anyone need a brown maverick 29er fork?

    yesterday I put a reba 29er on and today's ride was quit, flawless and much quicker in the corners. I can't believe I spent this much money on a single speed to have this many problems. my old chameleon is way more dependable!
    Sorry to bring this back from the dead but...is this last post the final word? I have the creak. Tried multiple qr's...salsa....Mavic...Bonty. Nothing works. After cleaning the mating surface between the hub and frame, the noise goes away for a ride or two then comes back in full force. I am a little reluctant on filing down the hub teeth mating surface .

    Thanx
    Pap

  38. #38
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    Glad you resurrected this post. I'm new to the board and have the creaky 69'er issue also. Some days it's good, and others it's loud. Dunno.

  39. #39
    pap
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    The hub that comes with the X lite wheels on our 69er is DT Swiss. You can get a 10mm thru bolt to work with these hubs. It allows you to crank the wheel on a lot tighter to reduce the movement between the hub and the drop out mating surface. That mating surface movement is whats causing the problem on my 69er. I am picking up the 10mm thru bolt kit today. I will report back after the weekend and let you know if the creak is still there.

    Here’s the kit I will be using
    http://www.dtswiss.com/Products/Comp...thru-bolt.aspx

    Pap

  40. #40
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    don't those bontrager SS cranks (made by truvativ i think) spec'ed on those also have that removable spider? didn't see that anyone had mentioned removing/cleaning/greasing that which has been a known source of mystery creaks.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by onespeedpaul
    don't those bontrager SS cranks (made by truvativ i think) spec'ed on those also have that removable spider? didn't see that anyone had mentioned removing/cleaning/greasing that which has been a known source of mystery creaks.
    Thanks for the suggestion. I have XTR m960 crankset on there now and it creaks as much as it did with the Bontrager crank. I am 100% certain its the mating surface between the hub and drop out. I put a thin washer between the two surfaces and the creak goes away. Obviously thats not the solution so I am trying the DT swiss skewer.

    Pap

  42. #42
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    yep, 960's=no removable spider. good luck eliminating that creak tho!

  43. #43
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    Just to let anyone who is interested know. So far, the DT Swiss RWS 10mm rear axle seems to be doing the trick. No creaks so far. You can really crank this baby down. This is the longest time without creaks so far. I will let you know if anything changes.

    Pap

  44. #44
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    Interesting and useful thread. I have the creak and am going to try filing down the mating surface as suggested. Just to let you all know, I have a HTII XT crank on mine now, as I suspected the ISIS BB was initially to blame...not so. I've also tried slathering the thing in grease. XTR pedals, serviced. Its a real shame cos the bike riiips. Together we can beat this....

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by pressendye
    Interesting and useful thread. I have the creak and am going to try filing down the mating surface as suggested. Just to let you all know, I have a HTII XT crank on mine now, as I suspected the ISIS BB was initially to blame...not so. I've also tried slathering the thing in grease. XTR pedals, serviced. Its a real shame cos the bike riiips. Together we can beat this....

    I haven't tried filing the surface but I can tell you the DT swiss 10mm RWS thru bolt works perfectly. No more creaks. You can really crank these baby's down!


  46. #46
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    Resurrecting a really old thread, but I have had my 69er since Oct 07 and immediately replaced the Bonti ISIS cranks, then found it was the QR skewer as well. I am using an old Control Tech bolt-on skewer.

    Have any of you fellow 69ers had issues with creaking still?
    just ride

  47. #47
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    running a bolt on skewer myself still...no creaks at all. crank once in a while lets me know how much torque i'm putting into it by creaking..but that's standard service issues. rear (and by extension the whole bike) is mostly excellent now.

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