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  1. #1
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    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior

    I've spent the past week or so trying to decide which section to put this but the brief to Walt was basically as follows:

    Iíve been looking at the new Santa Cruz Hightower, thinking how great would that bike be to ride, something that is designed to run both 29Ē and Plus tyres optimally, but then I realise that this kind of thing may not be achievable with a hard tail? Unless we could replicate their flip chip adjustability somehow? Maybe via the drop outs or BB?
    Executive summary would be something like: a hardtail for hardtail stuff that isn't unwilling to take on the really rough stuff where a FS bike might be a "better" choice.

    So basically over the past 5 months myself and Walt have been discussing options, what I was looking for from a bike, my body measurements etc and this is what we (well Walt!) came up with...

    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior-img_3760.jpg

    I wanted to be able to run a 170mm Reverb dropper for the most standover. I have pretty long arms so the top tube might appear to be really long too, but basically this frame is tailored to me 100%.

    I didn't want the BB to be too low as I tend to get frustrated with that current trend in the rocky terrain we tend to have round these parts.

    I wanted a stable bike with a nice short rear end, this one actually comes out between 410mm and 425mm, which is pretty darn cool if you ask me?!

    We decided that if we were going to go with 27.7+ and 29" wheels then why not make this thing ultra adjustable, we'd use Boost 148mm Paragon Polydrops with a 6mm offset (so I can run dishless wheels) AND a Niner EBB along with a Boost 110mm Fox 34 120mm fork in order to allow the use of the following wheel and tyre combos:

    This info direct from Walt,
    (all numbers plus/minus 5mm or so, tires vary in actual size a lot):

    -29x3 is about 385mm radius
    -29x2.4 is going to be about 370mm radius
    -27.5x3.8 (Hodags) is about 370mm radius
    -27.5x3 is about 360mm radius
    -26x3.8 (Hodags, Nates) is going to be about 360mm radius
    -27.5x2.4 is about 350mm radius

    The EBB is optimized to be run in the "up" position with 27.5x3 (~360mm) for the ~320mm BB height in the design. If you use a bigger tire, the BB height will go up (ie, it'll be about 335-340mm with a 29x3) in which case you'd *probably* want to spin around to the "down" position to drop the BB by 15mm to roughly match.

    All of the smaller tire options will generally be best run in the up position on the EBB.


    The rockers can be adjusted however you wish to maximize tire clearance, achieve shortest possible chainstay length, etc. No set position will be "best", it will depend on your preferences and the tires you're running.

    I give you The Ultimate Warrior...





    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior-img_0034.jpgWaltworks Ultimate Warrior-img_0035.jpgWaltworks Ultimate Warrior-img_0036.jpgWaltworks Ultimate Warrior-img_0037.jpgWaltworks Ultimate Warrior-img_0038.jpgWaltworks Ultimate Warrior-img_0039.jpgWaltworks Ultimate Warrior-img_0040.jpg

    It'll be in powder coating early next week so I'll post some more images as we have them and of course some build pictures and riding reports later on too.

  2. #2
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    This is the colour I've gone with:



    This will be the first wheel setup I'll run, Hope Pro 4 Evo Boost hubs, Ibis 741 rims and 2.8" tyres, either these Nobby Nics or the Maxxis Ikon/Rekon setup coming on the way over to me...





    I've got a nice build planned for this, running XX1/X01 initially with a Race Face Next SL crankset so I can flip the ring for more clearance to be able to run 3.8" tyres during the winter.

    I won't bore you with specs unless you want me to.

  3. #3
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    Bore away!

    That's a beautiful rig and I love the thoughtfulness that goes into a build like this

    Congrats and keep sharing

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by blidner View Post
    Bore away!

    That's a beautiful rig and I love the thoughtfulness that goes into a build like this

    Congrats and keep sharing
    Thanks very much, I'm really excited about this project!

    This is my 27 plus setup:

    Waltworks Custom BIKE BUILD

    FRAME: Waltworks Custom Ultimate Warrior

    FORKS: Fox 34 120 Float Factory

    RIMS: Ibis 741

    HUBS: Hope Pro 4 Evo Orange

    SPOKES: DT Swiss

    HANDLEBARS: Thomson Ti 760mm

    STEM: Thomson 50mm silver

    SPACERS: Hope Orange

    GRIPS: ESI Fit CR Orange

    SEATPOST: Rockshox Reverb Stealth 170mm

    SADDLE: Fabric Scoop Race Shallow Ti

    CRANKSET: Raceface Next SL

    CHAINRING: One Up Oval 30T

    BOTTOM BRACKET: Hope Ceramic Orange

    CHAIN: SRAM XX1

    REAR DERAILIEUR: SRAM XXO

    CASSETTE: SRAM XX1

    SHIFTER: SRAM XXO

    BRAKES: SRAM Guide RSC

    DISCS: SRAM Centreline 180mm

    TYRES: Maxxis Ikon & Recon 2.8"

  5. #5
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    That's is an impressive build spec

    The orange accents will be very cool on the bike

    Keep the photos coming -

  6. #6
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    Thanks, I certainly will.

  7. #7
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    Will be VERY interested to see this thing together. As said above, love the thought and planning that was put into this one.
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

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    cool project. Walt is the man for this kind of thing!

    getting a custom bike that can be run in different configurations is an interesting concept. on the one hand you want a custom bike that is not a compromise, usually, but if the flip side is a few extra grams of dropout and bb, and then it can be configured to different wheel sizes, why not!

    in time i wonder if you will settle on one wheel size in particular or keep swapping. it's a question i have always asked myself as well!
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  9. #9
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    Thanks guys!

    The way we saw it was for the sake of a 200g BB it was worth it for the versatility. I wouldn't be surprised if I settle into a wheel size and stick to it 90% of the time, I'm betting it'll be 29" x 2.5 or similar BUT it's going to be nice to have various options to suit conditions etc.

    Walt has been fantastic to deal with, he's steered me and guided towards where we are both happy that we'll achieve what I was looking to and a bit more too hopefully!

  10. #10
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    wow, amazing build. what I would want if I could afford a custom frame...

    holy tire clearance.

  11. #11
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    Can't wait to see this all come together, and some post-ride impressions. Great looking build, JustJ!
    "The only way we can truly control the outcome of a ride is not going on it, which is a choice I'm unwilling to make." -K.B.

  12. #12
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    Thanks guys! Should have some more pics soon.

  13. #13
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    If you don't follow his color scheme, have tassels hanging off your handlebars, or wear the same boots...you CANNOT call your bike the ultimate warrior. You will get hulk smashed

    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior-ultimate.jpg

  14. #14
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    Ha ha I do have orange hubs and other hope goodies!

  15. #15
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    Quick update, Walt took these pics of the finished frame showing the cable routing etc just before sending to the powder coaters.

    Should be around 2 weeks...




  16. #16
    cmg
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    Nice, l like the curve in the top tube
    always mad and usually drunk......

  17. #17
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    Based on those specs it should be an awesome ride!
    Collection of fun carbon & titanium bikes

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  18. #18
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    It's amazing what happens around here lately! Walt's briefs get mentioned and bikes appear. @.o
    Get fAt, Stay fAt, Ride fAt
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeRune View Post
    It's amazing what happens around here lately! Walt's briefs get mentioned and bikes appear. @.o
    What do you mean?

  20. #20
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    Looks great! Can't wait to see it when it gets back from powder.

  21. #21
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    Thanks ianick, here's a couple of pics Walt sent me a few days ago...





    She's in her way over the sea to me at the moment so I'll post some pics of the build ASAP.

    In the mean time here are my 29/29 plus wheels I have set up and waiting.

    Easton Arc 35
    Hope Pro 4 Evo boost
    DT Comp spokes.



    But first I intend on trying the bike in its 27 plus guise.


  22. #22
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    Looks great! Can't wait to hear a ride report, especially once you get some miles on both wheelsets. I dig the color, should look great once built up.

    I'm in the queue for a very similar build.

  23. #23
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    Thanks Ianick, I should have it tomorrow with a bit of luck. I'll update with some pics soon.

  24. #24
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    Let'sssss getttttttt rrrrrrrready to rummmmmbbbbblllllllle!






  25. #25
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    That's going to make a sharp build!
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

  26. #26
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    Agree, going to be very sweet Frame colour is nice enough, but doesn't do it for me, would have gone for something a bit brighter or just plain RAW, but the actual bike, geo and parts, killer Can't wait to see it completed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Frame colour is nice enough, but doesn't do it for me, would have gone for something a bit brighter or just plain RAW
    Didn't your mother ever teach you to just stfu sometimes? Maybe a couple smacks in the mouth would have gotten that point across!

  28. #28
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    Ha ha it's ok, my wife doesn't like it either but I do and seriously it looks much better in real life! I'll post some pics up once the build is complete. I'm hoping to ride it on its maiden voyage this weekend.

  29. #29
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    That's the great thing about having so many color options, we can choose what colors and scheme's we each personally like. I like some bright/flashy frame colors and also like some subtle (even matte finish) frame colors.

    I like this frame and accent color combination.
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

  30. #30
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    Didn't yours teach you to not eat so much? Take your BS elsewhere, OP likes it and that's all that matter, but seems, you don't think anyone else should have their own opinion if it differs

    Quote Originally Posted by jonshonda View Post
    Didn't your mother ever teach you to just stfu sometimes? Maybe a couple smacks in the mouth would have gotten that point across!
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
    You're doing mtbr wrong, you're supposed to get increasingly offended by the implications that you're doing ANYTHING wrong.

  31. #31
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    Come on, there's no place for this kind of talk in this thread, jonshonda was just trying to get that across I think.

  32. #32
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    Anyway here's a little teaser...



    Yeah I know my cables are too long, I have no chain etc etc!

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Didn't yours teach you to not eat so much? Take your BS elsewhere, OP likes it and that's all that matter, but seems, you don't think anyone else should have their own opinion if it differs
    Ohh a fat joke...good for you. Take my BS elsewhere, pot calling the kettle black..don't you think? Judging by the several PMs I got, many others "opinions" of you are similar to mine. Keep on shit posting, anything different would be quite unusual.

    Sorry for the derailment OP, bike looking great!

  34. #34
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    I love the color with the orange accents. That thing should ride kick ass!
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  35. #35
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    I thought you were starting with 27+?
    Looks good, but l want to see it full fat, and the clearances.
    Is the seat post clamp around the wrong way? or are my eyes playing tricks on me..........again
    always mad and usually drunk......

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmg71 View Post
    I thought you were starting with 27+?
    Looks good, but l want to see it full fat, and the clearances.
    Is the seat post clamp around the wrong way? or are my eyes playing tricks on me..........again
    That is 27+, 2.8 Nobby Nics to be exact, not the widest of tyres but they're definitely plus and there's plenty of room to spare.

    I'll be having some Easton Arc 45 rims built onto Hope hubs built a little later in the year and I'll be running Hodag 3.8's on there. Obviously I'll post clearance pics etc as we go on.

    I got Walt to cut a forward facing seat tube slot in the frame in order to cope better with UK crud so your eyes are not deceiving you.

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by EBG 18T View Post
    I love the color with the orange accents. That thing should ride kick ass!
    Thanks, I hope so! Glad you like the orange, I wasn't 100% sure if it would work as time went on through the process, that's why I had the 29er wheels made with silver hubs. But now it's pieced together I reckon it looks pretty cool.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    That is 27+, 2.8 Nobby Nics to be exact, not the widest of tyres but they're definitely plus and there's plenty of room to spare.
    .
    Oh sorry, thought l read 29 on the tyres.
    With clearances, l meant when you have it full fat (because everything else is just an imitation )
    always mad and usually drunk......

  39. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmg71 View Post
    Oh sorry, thought l read 29 on the tyres.
    With clearances, l meant when you have it full fat (because everything else is just an imitation )
    I'll post some full fat pics as soon as I get the wheels together.

  40. #40
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    That build is the Ultimate! Well thought out and would not change a thing J! Love the concept of changing wheels/tires when you want a different ride for the seasons....sweet!
    17 Fuel EX 9.9 (in progress)
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  41. #41
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    I'll throw my hat in the ring.

    Bad. Ass.

  42. #42
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    Nice bike indeed. Walt is great to work with on a project like this. I like the idea of using both an EBB and a rocker setup, as it lets you dial in chainstay length and BB height independently for each wheel size. I will say I'm not a big fan of the yoke used, but if it works, it works.

    I think your color choice looks great together, well except for that green chainring, that has to go!

    BTW, the slot in the seat tube should always be forward to keep it away from crap flung up from the rear wheel. Not sure why it was traditionally on the back.

    Good luck with the bike and build, and keep the pictures coming!

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by NH Mtbiker View Post
    That build is the Ultimate! Well thought out and would not change a thing J! Love the concept of changing wheels/tires when you want a different ride for the seasons....sweet!
    Thanks very much, glad you like it. My thinking is, in theory i should only ever need this bike along side a full suspension and a cyclocross bike, but who knows, this WW might become all the bike I'll ever need?!... That's how I got it past the wife anyway!

  44. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by sternomac View Post
    I'll throw my hat in the ring.

    Bad. Ass.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    Nice bike indeed. Walt is great to work with on a project like this. I like the idea of using both an EBB and a rocker setup, as it lets you dial in chainstay length and BB height independently for each wheel size. I will say I'm not a big fan of the yoke used, but if it works, it works.

    I think your color choice looks great together, well except for that green chainring, that has to go!

    BTW, the slot in the seat tube should always be forward to keep it away from crap flung up from the rear wheel. Not sure why it was traditionally on the back.

    Good luck with the bike and build, and keep the pictures coming!
    Thanks, yeah Walt has been fantastic on this build, I've always liked the look of his bikes, there's just something about them. I actually like the yoke, it's a cool solution, I know the paragon plus yoke is total bike porn but his one gets the job done as you say.

    That green chainring is a temporary measure until I find an orange Raceface one.

    I've also always wondered why some manufacturers place the slot facing crudside first, it was one of my requirements for this build to have it on the right way round.

    Thanks for your kind words, the bike is currently in a shop having a few tweaks before being able to take some glamour shots before taking it out for its first ride. I think I've decided on a name for her though...

  46. #46
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    Wow it really turned out great! Excellent parts selection. The colors go together very well. Was the Paragon yoke an upcharge? I just checked it out and it is total bike porn!

    Looking forward to more pictures and first ride report.

  47. #47
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    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior

    Quote Originally Posted by ianick View Post
    Wow it really turned out great! Excellent parts selection. The colors go together very well. Was the Paragon yoke an upcharge? I just checked it out and it is total bike porn!

    Looking forward to more pictures and first ride report.
    Thanks ianick! No Walt covers most things apart from decouplers I think but it was decided that as this build is unique in its versatility in terms of the many wheel sizes it can run that Walt's yoke would be the better option.

    Just for some more info, here are the 29" wheels setup with the Chupacabras. Looking forward to trying these bad boys out!




  48. #48
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    Love it, man that thing looks like it would be a riot!
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by ianick View Post
    Wow it really turned out great! Excellent parts selection. The colors go together very well. Was the Paragon yoke an upcharge? I just checked it out and it is total bike porn!

    Looking forward to more pictures and first ride report.
    The Paragon yoke does indeed look nice, but it will only fit up to a 3" tire. No way to squeeze those 27.5 x 3.8 Hodags in it.

  50. #50
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    29+ now your talking, 27+ look small for that frame.

  51. #51
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    Very Nice!

  52. #52
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    Thanks guys!

    Meet Payton...











    Loads of clearance with 27.5x2.8's on the shortest (410mm) chainstay setting with the BB set in the up position.





















    Had an issue with the Hope BB, due to the fact it's massive and wasn't sitting well with the Niner EBB, in the end I had to revert to a Rave Face Cinch BB and all is well.

    Only had a couple of shake down rides but so far I can tell you that this bike feels very fast and very comfortable. It fits me like a glove and so it should. We spent a long time fitting this thing up so I feel totally comfortable on it. It's perfect for me and I'm very happy so far.

    I think her name is self-explanatory, especially if you know the story behind Walt (shhh Walt isn't his real name!) but all my bikes have girls names and I felt that Payton suits her down to the ground!

  53. #53
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    Was waiting to see it all built up, have to say, despite not initially liking the colour, paired with the orange bits it really works,looks excellent or as the guys on GMBN would say Super Nice Curious what pedals those are, they are THE biggest I think I've ever seen? Pity you couldn't find any matching orange ano bottle cages, that would have just absolutely finished it off, IMHO.
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  54. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Was waiting to see it all built up, have to say, despite not initially liking the colour, paired with the orange bits it really works,looks excellent or as the guys on GMBN would say Super Nice Curious what pedals those are, they are THE biggest I think I've ever seen? Pity you couldn't find any matching orange ano bottle cages, that would have just absolutely finished it off, IMHO.
    Ha ha thanks LyNx, glad you like it now!

    They are Pedalling Innovations Catslyst pedals and I swear by them. These are the limited edition gooooolllld ones. Have a read up on them, they're great.

    Those cages don't need to be orange, they're titanium King Cages to match the titanium Thomson bar! . I also snuck a King Cage Manything cage under he down tube, should come in handy for bikepacking trips for carrying a dry bag or a bottle of something alcoholic!

  55. #55
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    Just J,

    Lookiing at a piece of rideable art!! Top job, mistuh...

    Walt makes some kewl stuff.
    Get fAt, Stay fAt, Ride fAt
    Doctor recommended...

  56. #56
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    Very nice........
    still waiting for full fat pics 😉
    always mad and usually drunk......

  57. #57
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    Thanks guys and patience cmg71!

    I'll be riding it 27plus for the next few days (although I wish I bought myself some 3" tyres now!) and running 29plus (with 3" tyres!) next weekend for comparison. I'll then order up my wheel parts for the full fat tyres.

  58. #58
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    Looks really nice! Much better with the orange chainring vs. the green one. That thing deserves some bigger meat, I think you should go right to 27.5x3.25 tires, get rid of those little 2.8s!

    One warning: I would remove that Manything cage from under the downtube for normal riding, as cages down there are prone to breaking, usually on a big log!

  59. #59
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    BADASS looking steed.

  60. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    Looks really nice! Much better with the orange chainring vs. the green one. That thing deserves some bigger meat, I think you should go right to 27.5x3.25 tires, get rid of those little 2.8s!

    One warning: I would remove that Manything cage from under the downtube for normal riding, as cages down there are prone to breaking, usually on a big log!
    Thanks, yeah it's just on as I'll be using it over the weekend, testing it out.

    Having ridden a few plus bikes recently I'm definitely more in favour of the wider tyres but I'll see how these go and I've also got some Ikon and Rekon+ on order to try too which I actually prefer over the NN's.

  61. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by litespeedaddict View Post
    BADASS looking steed.
    Glad you like it.

  62. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    Looks really nice! Much better with the orange chainring vs. the green one. That thing deserves some bigger meat, I think you should go right to 27.5x3.25 tires, get rid of those little 2.8s!

  63. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    Thanks guys!

    Meet Payton...

    payton's way cool with orange accent bits, 650b+ 3.0 would be the perfect fit.

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    I'm jealous of your bike man.

    More jealous of your bike budget though.

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    Sweeeeeet! Walt is starting on mine in the next week or so and we have pretty much the same exact build. I'm going with a standard BB though, as I'm not worried about the BB change with the different tire combos (I actually kind of welcome it). Mine will be optimized for 370mm (standard 29er) and if I run 29+ I will want it to be higher as it will be a bikepacking trip where I won't care about handling and will want the extra clearance. On the fat winter tires (26x3.8 Nate front, 26x3.8 Hodag rear) it'll be a touch lower and that's totally ok too, actually preferred. All with that Fox 34 120mm fork.

    I can't wait to have the ultimate hardtail. Wanna rip? standard 29er. Wanna float? 26x3.8. Wanna be comfy and cushy? Put 3.0 tires on those 29er wheels. All with "standard" mountain bike components (Boost spacing, 73mm BB, etc). STOKED

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    Waiting to hear your thoughts on B+ vs 29+. For me if I can fit 29+ on a rigid/HT, then that's what goes on, if not a 2.8" 650B+ will work better to take the edge off than a normal 2.4" 29er tyre.

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    I'll be riding it 27plus for the next few days (although I wish I bought myself some 3" tyres now!) and running 29plus (with 3" tyres!) next weekend for comparison. I'll then order up my wheel parts for the full fat tyres.
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  67. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by trhoppe View Post
    Sweeeeeet! Walt is starting on mine in the next week or so and we have pretty much the same exact build. I'm going with a standard BB though, as I'm not worried about the BB change with the different tire combos (I actually kind of welcome it). Mine will be optimized for 370mm (standard 29er) and if I run 29+ I will want it to be higher as it will be a bikepacking trip where I won't care about handling and will want the extra clearance. On the fat winter tires (26x3.8 Nate front, 26x3.8 Hodag rear) it'll be a touch lower and that's totally ok too, actually preferred. All with that Fox 34 120mm fork.

    I can't wait to have the ultimate hardtail. Wanna rip? standard 29er. Wanna float? 26x3.8. Wanna be comfy and cushy? Put 3.0 tires on those 29er wheels. All with "standard" mountain bike components (Boost spacing, 73mm BB, etc). STOKED
    Looking forward to see yours too then! It's amazing what Walt can do! Enjoy yours!

  68. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Waiting to hear your thoughts on B+ vs 29+. For me if I can fit 29+ on a rigid/HT, then that's what goes on, if not a 2.8" 650B+ will work better to take the edge off than a normal 2.4" 29er tyre.
    I'm looking forward to having some thoughts! My only experience of 29+ was on a quick ride on a Trek Stache so it'll be interesting to see what I gel wii the most. To be honest I have a feeling I'll mostly run 29x2.4/5 or there abouts but time will tell once I've put some miles on this baby. It's good to have options!

  69. #69
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    Yeah, nice to have such a versatile bike with options, but I can tell you, if you're even slightly old or have some aches and pains, PLUS is the answer for a HT/Rigid, no going back once you give it a go, IMHO. None of my personal rigid/HT bikes will ever not be B+/29+ in the future, too many aches from injuries I didn't take care of properly, need all the edge off I can get, even considering a suspension post.

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    I'm looking forward to having some thoughts! My only experience of 29+ was on a quick ride on a Trek Stache so it'll be interesting to see what I gel wii the most. To be honest I have a feeling I'll mostly run 29x2.4/5 or there abouts but time will tell once I've put some miles on this baby. It's good to have options!
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  70. #70
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    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior

    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Yeah, nice to have such a versatile bike with options, but I can tell you, if you're even slightly old or have some aches and pains, PLUS is the answer for a HT/Rigid, no going back once you give it a go, IMHO. None of my personal rigid/HT bikes will ever not be B+/29+ in the future, too many aches from injuries I didn't take care of properly, need all the edge off I can get, even considering a suspension post.
    That's interesting and you're definitely not the first person I have seen saying similar.

    I'm "only" 39! LOL. Thankfully no real aches or pains at the moment but what I will say having managed to get a quick spin around my local woods is - this is the plus bike I was looking for!

    I've tested quite a few lately, I own a Charge Cooker 0 SS and although it has plus tyres, I think they're filled with concrete compared to this thing! I've also recently tried the Hightower, Genius and HD3 and wasn't that impressed with any of them to be honest. This thing seems to wipe the floor with them in terms of feel, handling and fit. What I said about probably running 29x2.4 could have been said far too soon!...

    Very happy with this bike so far!

    Last edited by Just J; 08-04-2016 at 11:45 PM.

  71. #71
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    Sweet looking' bike!

    As far as mostly riding 29x2.4s, and now not so sure: I hear you. I've only got a few rides on my 29x3.00 Gnarvester, but I can't see putting skinny tires on it. I'f I want to roll 2.4s it will be on my suspension bike (Tallboy LTc).
    --Reamer

  72. #72
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    Thanks reamer41!

    Had a good ride this morning, took the bike out to shake it down across the North York Moors, managed some climbs I don't usually manage to get up and got to know the bike.

    Got to say, it does exactly what I wanted of it, pedals well, corners nicely, floats over stuff and is generally a really well sorted bike that fits me perfectly. Can't wait to try those big wheels out next time though!








  73. #73
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    Just J, That Walt guy does some nice frame builds, indeed! Looks great and nice to see your new friend out in the wild!

    Congratz on that gorgeous new bike!!
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  74. #74
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeRune View Post
    Just J, That Walt guy does some nice frame builds, indeed! Looks great and nice to see your new friend out in the wild!

    Congratz on that gorgeous new bike!!
    Thank you, I appreciate it!

    I've had no doubt that Walt was definitely the man to take on this project, looking forward to putting miles on this thing over the years.

  75. #75
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    Top shelf. Do you have to deflate the back tire to get it in the frame?

    Also, seeing the bare ti parts on your bike makes me kinda wish we'd get away from all the d*mn black parts. Shiny metal is good.
    bikes, guns, dogs....perfect

  76. #76
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    Quote Originally Posted by azjeff View Post
    Top shelf. Do you have to deflate the back tire to get it in the frame?

    Also, seeing the bare ti parts on your bike makes me kinda wish we'd get away from all the d*mn black parts. Shiny metal is good.
    Thanks!

    I'll have to deflate the 29x3.0 and 3.8 tyres to get them into the yoke but that's not a problem.

    I've always had a soft spot for bare Ti and also raw stuff in general, I love the dropouts on this thing where Walt shaved the bits that rub on each other and I must admit that I'm so glad I went with that Ti handlebar!

  77. #77
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    Funny you have the same attitude about blacking stuff out on a bike that I do. I went to great extents to get rid of the boring contrastless black on my bike parts. That included polishing out a pair of Scrapers before lacing em up with orange hubs and blue nipples with stainless spokes. Now the bike looks bytchen instead of average. I think that is one aspect of Just J's build that makes it look groovier, but then it is a WaltWorx creation... I would love to see that bike in person as pix prolly don't do it the justice it deserves.
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  78. #78
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeRune View Post
    Funny you have the same attitude about blacking stuff out on a bike that I do. I went to great extents to get rid of the boring contrastless black on my bike parts. That included polishing out a pair of Scrapers before lacing em up with orange hubs and blue nipples with stainless spokes. Now the bike looks bytchen instead of average. I think that is one aspect of Just J's build that makes it look groovier, but then it is a WaltWorx creation... I would love to see that bike in person as pix prolly don't do it the justice it deserves.
    Those rims of yours do look pretty awesome!! I'll take some detail shots as time goes by and add them to this thread.

  79. #79
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    So, what HT/rigid bikes have you had before this to compare it to? Curious how active/plush you feel the rear is from frame compliance as compared to the PLUS tyres, will be looking for your views if you do actually try normal 29"x2.4" tyres on it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  80. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    So, what HT/rigid bikes have you had before this to compare it to? Curious how active/plush you feel the rear is from frame compliance as compared to the PLUS tyres, will be looking for your views if you do actually try normal 29"x2.4" tyres on it.
    Well I'll try and put my list of previous hardtails in order:

    1992 Orange Clockwork DX
    1999 ish Marin something something
    2000 Giant ATX Team XC
    2006 ish Salsa Ala Carte
    Dekerf Implant
    Soul Cycles Hooligan
    Soul Cycles Dillinger
    Orange P7
    Stanton Slackline
    Cove Hummer 650bj
    Trek Farley 8
    Charge Cooker 0

    I think that's all the hardtails covered?!!

    I'd say this bike is one of, if not the most comfortable HT's I've owned and I'm pretty sure it's not down to the tyres either. The frame seems pretty compliant to me, springy in the right places and stiff where it counts and that to me is what makes a good steel frame in my opinion.

    The Dekerf was the closest in feel to this bike, I rode that bike for quite a while and never missed FS whilst I owned it. Followed by the Oranges. The Salsa was springy all over the place, very much an old school XC bike feel to it. Not a bike I enjoyed very much to be honest.

    Comparing steel to Ti, well in my limited experience I'd choose steel all day long. The Cove I owned had a very flexy front end and the rear was not as compliant as I'd have liked it to have been.

    I will definitely try normal 29x2.4 tyres soon. I've got some Maxxis Minion SS and DHR WT coming soon...

  81. #81
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    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior

    Also I forgot to say that my bike got bike of the day on Vital MTB today!

    http://m.vitalmtb.com/community/j5bws,13924/setup,32462

    https://www.facebook.com/VitalMTB/po...404281636060:0

  82. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    Also I forgot to say that my bike got bike of the day on Vital MTB today!

    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior - j5bws's Bike Check - Vital MTB

    https://www.facebook.com/VitalMTB/po...404281636060:0
    Congratz to you, J! And you too, Walt... Teamwork happened here.
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  83. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeRune View Post
    Congratz to you, J! And you too, Walt... Teamwork happened here.
    Thank you, it sure did!

  84. #84
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    So inquisitiveness purveyed and this happened this morning!





    So easy to do, I just slid the dropouts back on their longest (425mm) setting (although I could slide them at least half the way back again if I wished), put the wheels in (without having to deflate the rear actually!) and I set the BB to the lower setting to compensate.



    There's an absolute tonne of clearance there again and it feels awesome!









    Managed to get a quick 4 mile local shake down ride in and it's amazing how the handling is still just as direct as in the smaller wheel setting but the grip levels are even higher.

    I always take my bikes on some long steps that go into my local woods, I managed to fly down them without braking on this bike, far more comfortably than I have on my past couple of FS bikes too!

    I think I love this thing!

  85. #85
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    That thing is soooo cool looking! Love that color as well!

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

  86. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flat Ark View Post
    That thing is soooo cool looking! Love that color as well!

    Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk
    Glad you like it, thanks!

  87. #87
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    Looks even better with the big wheels on. Looks .... Just right.

    I'm betting that 29+ will be the norm for you on that bike.


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    Looks great in 29+ mode. I really like how the ebb can move around with the wheel size. I suppose a saddle adjustment needs to happen with the ebb move? Wonder how the climbing will feel w/ the slightly longer stays?

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    Thanks guys.

    Yes I made sure the saddle was at my preferred height but that's pretty much it, the reach etc won't be any different I don't think.

    Climbing seems fine, maybe a little less urgent but I'd put that down mainly to the slightly heavier wheels.

  90. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by reamer41 View Post
    Looks even better with the big wheels on. Looks .... Just right.
    I have to agree, looks tops
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    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior

    Got a few miles under my belt this morning on the bike and the 29 Plus wheels and wow! This thing rails and does it in a way that I've not experienced before.

    I've always said that I wasn't blown away by 27.5 plus wheels, also feeling a bit muted and slow to me on other bikes I've tried, however, I really like the way my Walt rides with the 27 plus wheels but having now tried the 29" plus, I see no real reason to go back other then for sh**s n giggles for the sake of it!

    I was able to ride the bike as hard as I would a 140mm full suspension bike and the tyres just seem more in contact with the trail for some reason, getting none of that vagueness or squirm experienced on 27 plus.

    I've not been this blown away with a bike since my first ride out on a truly sorted 29er. The difference is huge and I can't see any pitfalls of running this setup. It climbs well (set some decent up and down hill PR's today), it's comfortable, it charges through rough terrain and downhill like nobody's business yet it also rails both high and low speed corners like nothing else. The bike is eager to pop, jump, hop and skip as if it's cerebrally connected to me too, this was a pleasant surprise for me as it made me actually feel like a decent rider today!! Really impressed!

    Walt really has done an amazing job here, he's managed to extract my brief and put into a bike that does everything exactly how I want from a bike.

    If there are any down sides to this bike, I can only think of one and that's that I can put it through the kind of terrain that a full suspension bike would be more at home on, resulting in my being a bit surprised when the bike bites back at me for being so cheeky! That's a good thing though, right?!

    Here's some pics from today's ride:


    The moment when everything just gels...




    Front end detail...




    I'm not sure how I got through this bit, the ferns were a foot above my head and were so thick that only momentum gathered up top pushed me through them along with the huge wheels helping along the way! I kept falling into gullies that were impossible to see but the bike got me through to the end.


    I always thought that this wall could do with a gate! This thing is big but rides small if that makes sense?...








  92. #92
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    Pure goodness, J!! Looks damn good, indeed...
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  93. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeRune View Post
    Pure goodness, J!! Looks damn good, indeed...
    Thanks man!

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    Makes me want one. Glad you like it! A new bike that is as awesome as you expected it to be, is pure bliss.

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    You know, it really does get tiring sometimes to have to keep telling people "I told you so" Was just waiting for you to ride it on the 29+ and confirm what I already knew - they're dangerous, can handle way more than you'd think
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  96. #96
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    Ha ha right again eh LyNx?!

    I just thought the huge wheels might make the bike a bit slow witted but nope, they make it even better in every situation as far as I can tell so far.

  97. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by reamer41 View Post
    Looks even better with the big wheels on. Looks .... Just right.

    I'm betting that 29+ will be the norm for you on that bike.
    Ha ha. As I said...
    I recently took my first rides on my 29+ Gnarvester. I get what you're saying and feeling regarding g those big wheels.



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  98. #98
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    Walt did a great job on your bike. It looks a lot better with 29+ wheels with that big a frame. For a hardtail I'd go straight to 29+. With the right geo it will handle well and the roll though of those tall tires is amazing.

    I occasionally get tempted to get a new 29+...something custom or semi-custom. So far I have resisted. Your bike isn't helping though!

    Have fun on the new ride.
    Safe riding,

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    man yours came out great!

  100. #100
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    Thanks guys, I'm really enjoying this thing and I'm glad that I'm going to be able to test out various wheel sizes as time goes by.

  101. #101
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    Full fat?
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  102. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmg71 View Post
    Full fat?
    The plan is to have a 27.5" wheelset built up next with 50-60mm rims that should fit in the frame nicely with a pair of 3.8 Hodags, then a carbon pair of 29er rims for XC. Just deciding on the fat rims at the moment...

  103. #103
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    Will you play "mix & match" with all these wheel sets?
    ie; a fat front (which l guess would be 26") with a 27.5+ rear, or 27.5+ front with 29" rear.etc etc etc
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  104. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmg71 View Post
    Will you play "mix & match" with all these wheel sets?
    ie; a fat front (which l guess would be 26") with a 27.5+ rear, etc etc etc
    The front will take a 27.5 x 3.8 so I see no reason to get a 26" wheelset built although I had considered it just so I could say it covers ALL wheel sizes! I have thought about mixing and matching wheels, just for the sake of inquisitiveness. Probably something I'll post about on here at some point and once I have all wheelsets covered...

    I haven't seen a bike 27.5 plus rear with a 29 plus front, could be interesting, could be pointless but we shall see!

  105. #105
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    That's how I run my Monkey when I use it for trail duties, works SO well - adds as much cush to the rear as my '08 will allow, drops the back a tad & raises the front a tad, which slackens it out just nice When things get busy and all my HT are in use, this is what I ride and it's super fun, rigid of course

    If it would fit 29+ in the rear, would most likely run that, but the B+/29+ combo does the few things I want done to the Monkey in slackening it out a tad (think 71* is just too steep for "proper trails) and adds cush (not sure how much different a B+ 2.8" is vs a 29+ 2.8" in terms of smoother/plusher ride). Would love to find a 500-520mm A2C rigid fork for it, then it would be absolutely awesome.

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    ...I haven't seen a bike 27.5 plus rear with a 29 plus front, could be interesting, could be pointless but we shall see!
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  106. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    That's how I run my Monkey when I use it for trail duties, works SO well - adds as much cush to the rear as my '08 will allow, drops the back a tad & raises the front a tad, which slackens it out just nice When things get busy and all my HT are in use, this is what I ride and it's super fun, rigid of course
    Sounds fun! Do you have any pics (or a link to a thread) of this Monkey that I could see please?

  107. #107
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    Nope, forgot to grab pics when I did it last season, but can pop the wheels back in there maybe tomorrow and take some pics - may actually need to use it anyhow as have a bigger tour.

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    Sounds fun! Do you have any pics (or a link to a thread) of this Monkey that I could see please?
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  108. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Nope, forgot to grab pics when I did it last season, but can pop the wheels back in there maybe tomorrow and take some pics - may actually need to use it anyhow as have a bigger tour.
    That would be cool, thank you

  109. #109
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    B+/29+ Monkey

    So here's the pic of my B+/29+ Monkey as promised. Had not ridden it in quite e a while and enjoy turning the pedals on it again, perfect for the ride and trails I did after a fairly hard one this AM. FYI, this is my oldest bike I own, have had it since '08 in so many guises and trim, such a versatile frame, think of your WW as an updated Monkey, think you should order a rigid fork for it

    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior-p1080292.jpg
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  110. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    So here's the pic of my B+/29+ Monkey as promised. Had not ridden it in quite e a while and enjoy turning the pedals on it again, perfect for the ride and trails I did after a fairly hard one this AM. FYI, this is my oldest bike I own, have had it since '08 in so many guises and trim, such a versatile frame, think of your WW as an updated Monkey, think you should order a rigid fork for it

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Thanks LyNx, looks fun! I might stick the 27.5 plus wheel on the back of the WW for this coming weekend, although right now it looks like the rain is back so might have to consider a wet weather tyre setup sooner than I expected at this rate!

    I have toyed with the idea of having Walt make me a suspension corrected rigid fork with a couple of Any/Many Thing Cage mounts on there...

  111. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    I haven't seen a bike 27.5 plus rear with a 29 plus front, could be interesting, could be pointless but we shall see!
    http://forums.mtbr.com/26-27-5-29-pl...l-1010722.html
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

  112. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by nitrousjunky View Post
    Thanks nitrousjunky, interesting.

    So this is what I've cooked up this morning:



    27.5 x 2.8 rear with 29 x 3.0" front

    Low BB setting

    410mm short chainstay setting

    Haven't had chance to ride it properly in this configuration but it's a wheelie popping son of a gun on first impressions!!

  113. #113
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    Highly approved, looks totally badass

    So how's clearance in that fork with the 29x3"? No clearance in my F34s or Trace, unless you're just riding smooth dirt roads or seriously packed gravel and won't pick up anything in the tyre. Curious how come you chose to also put the BB in the Low setting with the drop the B+ would have already given it? Any idea on the HTA in this setting? Looks pretty slack, DHs should be very fun

    All my Banshee's are easy to pop the wheel, no real effort required at all, makes putting it up on small rocks and ledges super easy and yet, not too much body english to keep the front end down.

    Not sure how "sensitive" you are to subtle changes with your bike, but curious if you'd keep a "feel" out for how the B+ rear compares to the 29+ rear and if you notice much difference in how "comfortable" the B+ is compared to the 29+? Just wondering if my Jonesing for a proper 29+ rear setup is really founded or just wishful thinking that I'll get more cush.

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    So this is what I've cooked up this morning:



    27.5 x 2.8 rear with 29 x 3.0" front, Low BB setting, 410mm short chainstay setting.
    Haven't had chance to ride it properly in this configuration but it's a wheelie popping son of a gun on first impressions!!
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  114. #114
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    Im interested in this setup, I mean enduro motorbikes come 17" back with a 19" front (mostly), must be something in that .............. maybe?
    always mad and usually drunk......

  115. #115
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    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior

    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Highly approved, looks totally badass

    So how's clearance in that fork with the 29x3"? No clearance in my F34s or Trace, unless you're just riding smooth dirt roads or seriously packed gravel and won't pick up anything in the tyre. Curious how come you chose to also put the BB in the Low setting with the drop the B+ would have already given it? Any idea on the HTA in this setting? Looks pretty slack, DHs should be very fun

    All my Banshee's are easy to pop the wheel, no real effort required at all, makes putting it up on small rocks and ledges super easy and yet, not too much body english to keep the front end down.

    Not sure how "sensitive" you are to subtle changes with your bike, but curious if you'd keep a "feel" out for how the B+ rear compares to the 29+ rear and if you notice much difference in how "comfortable" the B+ is compared to the 29+? Just wondering if my Jonesing for a proper 29+ rear setup is really founded or just wishful thinking that I'll get more cush.
    It does look pretty cool, I like it!

    I'm not sure if I posted the tyre clearance pic with the 34's? I've definitely got a lot more clearance than I've had with Pikes and 29x2.35 setups in the past so no worries with mud and rocks etc, here's the pic:



    I kept the BB 29+ position because the bigger front wheel is pulling things up slightly and figured that it might be fun to try it in a position that I wouldn't normally run the 27.5+ wheels in. We'll see how it goes.

    Using my iPhone the HA is about 66į setup like this. Should be fun like you say!

    Having a front end that's easy to pop was one of my prerequisites for this bike, I love being able to control things with a small wheelie or manual, makes a bike more fun to me. This thing pops effortlessly, especially when in the short CS position. I've found that after I took a headset spacer out and dropped the front end slightly I don't have to work to keep the front end down on climbs. Perfect!

    I am pretty "sensitive" to setup changes, that's what this bike is all about for me, working through all options and finding my own ultimate setup. So yeah, no problem, I'll report back and let you know how I feel in differences in cush etc.

  116. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmg71 View Post
    Im interested in this setup, I mean enduro motorbikes come 17" back with a 19" front (mostly), must be something in that .............. maybe?
    Yes. A powerful motor that needs tons of traction from a wide tire and a long travel shock that eats up bumps on the rear.
    Safe riding,

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  117. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by cmg71 View Post
    Im interested in this setup, I mean enduro motorbikes come 17" back with a 19" front (mostly), must be something in that .............. maybe?
    No harm in trying it out to see is there?!

    If I like it, then great, if not then nothing ventured nothing gained.

    So far I REALLY love the 29+ setup, it gathers momentum everywhere really well and feels more natural to me than the smaller wheels (I've always much preferred MOST 29er traits over 26 and even 27.5) but this 79pluser setup might be a lot of fun, we'll see.

  118. #118
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    I've also ordered up my Fatbike wheels, decided on 27.5 Easton Arc 45 rims to mount my Hodags on.

    I'm now thinking about what to run in the wet, sloppy mud that we get around these parts? I can either use my Ibis 741 wheels with 2.3 Maxxis Shorties or get my 29" wheels deck red and built up sooner rather than later and run some Bonty Muds that I already have or some Shorties.

  119. #119
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    The 2.8" HR2 have just been released, you have loads of clearance in the frame and fork to run them and they are fantastic in just those conditions
    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    I'm now thinking about what to run in the wet, sloppy mud that we get around these parts? I can either use my Ibis 741 wheels with 2.3 Maxxis Shorties or get my 29" wheels deck red and built up sooner rather than later and run some Bonty Muds that I already have or some Shorties.
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  120. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    The 2.8" HR2 have just been released, you have loads of clearance in the frame and fork to run them and they are fantastic in just those conditions
    Definitely going to order me a plus Minion and HR2 when they become available, hope they will be available in 29 plus though...

  121. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    No harm in trying it out to see is there?!
    If you already have all the parts....no harm in trying at all.



    Ventana has made a number of purpose built 650B/26er rear & 29er front FS bikes.
    Safe riding,

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  122. #122
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    If you already have all the parts....no harm in trying at all.



    Ventana has made a number of purpose built 650B/26er rear & 29er front FS bikes.
    That looks really nice, always been a fan of Sherwood's work too.

  123. #123
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    So having had a ride around some of my local trails I've been able to appraise this setup satisfactorily to me and it's safe t say that it's not my favoured setup.

    Firstly, the high front end choppers it out a little too much for my liking, making steep climbs more difficult and I don't feel as balanced as before.
    This also affects the steering, losing that razor sharp edge that I tend to like.

    The back end feels very harsh in comparison to the front, it's definitely not as cushy as the big wheel, I can feel it getting caught up on terrain and it feels like it's dragging the bike down if that makes sense?

    On slower speed chunk I almost felt like the back end was trying to buck over the front, there's just not the control there.

    On their own 27.5+ wheels are fine, to me, I still much prefer the bigger wheels but I don't see much point in mixing and matching again, for me, the the type of riding that I enjoy.

    It was worth the time to experiment though as riding bikes is kind of like pizza (or having sex) because even if you have a bad one, it's still pretty good!




  124. #124
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    Thanks for the report, kind of what I figured. For me the B+ in the rear is the only option in the frames I have and it does help with some such, but ultimately did not think it would compare to a nice 29+. Also with my HT and rigid especially, the B+/29+ combo helps to slacken out the angles to someplace decent of about 69.5*. So guess time to start saving for a 29+ capable HT frame in 2017.
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  125. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Thanks for the report, kind of what I figured. For me the B+ in the rear is the only option in the frames I have and it does help with some such, but ultimately did not think it would compare to a nice 29+. So guess time to start saving for a 29+ capable HT frame in 2017.
    I can whole heartedly recommend speaking to Walt.

  126. #126
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    Definitely will not have Custom $$ to spend, will have to be something production and under $800.
    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    I can whole heartedly recommend speaking to Walt.
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  127. #127
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    I have a friend that loves his Trek Stache, I used to have the 29" non plus version and it was great. Niner ROS9?

  128. #128
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    Definitely nothing niner, the Stache+ I have looked at, but most likely it would be a Gnarvester in Ti since the pricing is so good for Ti and reports on them are all glowing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    I have a friend that loves his Trek Stache, I used to have the 29" non plus version and it was great. Niner ROS9?
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  129. #129
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    So having had a ride around some of my local trails I've been able to appraise this setup satisfactorily to me and it's safe t say that it's not my favoured setup.

    Firstly, the high front end choppers it out a little too much for my liking, making steep climbs more difficult and I don't feel as balanced as before.
    This also affects the steering, losing that razor sharp edge that I tend to like.

    The back end feels very harsh in comparison to the front, it's definitely not as cushy as the big wheel, I can feel it getting caught up on terrain and it feels like it's dragging the bike down if that makes sense?

    On slower speed chunk I almost felt like the back end was trying to buck over the front, there's just not the control there.

    On their own 27.5+ wheels are fine, to me, I still much prefer the bigger wheels but I don't see much point in mixing and matching again, for me, the the type of riding that I enjoy.

    It was worth the time to experiment though as riding bikes is kind of like pizza (or having sex) because even if you have a bad one, it's still pretty good!



    Hey, great looking bike! And thanks for trying and posting about the various combinations - not everyone can or would, and/or provide useful info. It sounds like you ride somewhat like I do and appreciate the same feel and features. I might have to get over my infatuation with "new" B+ stuff and go with 29+ like I always thought I would.
    Ride on!

    -F
    It's never easier - you just go faster.

  130. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fleas View Post
    Hey, great looking bike! And thanks for trying and posting about the various combinations - not everyone can or would, and/or provide useful info. It sounds like you ride somewhat like I do and appreciate the same feel and features. I might have to get over my infatuation with "new" B+ stuff and go with 29+ like I always thought I would.
    Ride on!

    -F
    Hey Fleas, thanks I'm glad you like it and find my info helpful. I honestly do think that people are infatuated with B+, probably those who wouldn't ever admit to wanting to ride a 29er though and secretly looking for some of the big wheel traits.

    To me, this bike has proven to me that I'm about done with 27.5, I needed to try it on a few of my bikes over the past couple of years since my 2nd/3rd SB95c decided upset me one too many times, I needed to try B+ properly to see if it really could offer what 29" gave to me but I'm definitely a big wheel kinda guy and apart from playing with fat(ish) tyres over the winter, I can't see me going down a size.

  131. #131
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fleas View Post
    I might have to get over my infatuation with "new" B+ stuff and go with 29+ like I always thought I would-F
    So I'm not the only one catching myself doing this! 29+ fits me, my riding style, and my needs better. Yet I still catch myself looking hard at all the new B+ stuff.

    Just J - your comments about the rear B+ not being as plush as the 29+ and getting caught up in holes is the main reasons I see me never owning a B+ bike. I will demo one if the chance pops up. That said, I've got enough time on 29+ to know it's awesome for my SS duties.
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

  132. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    ...I honestly do think that people are infatuated with B+, ...

    To me, this bike has proven to me that I'm about done with 27.5, ....
    I needed to try B+ properly to see if it really could offer what 29" gave to me but I'm definitely a big wheel kinda guy and apart from playing with fat(ish) tyres over the winter, I can't see me going down a size.
    Quote Originally Posted by nitrousjunky View Post
    So I'm not the only one catching myself doing this! 29+ fits me, my riding style, and my needs better. Yet I still catch myself looking hard at all the new B+ stuff.
    ....
    I'm not yet ready to spring for a new bike, but I'm running 2.4/2.5 tires and liking the advantages far above any weight penalties. B+ would seem to be a backward step.

    -F
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  133. #133
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fleas View Post
    I'm not yet ready to spring for a new bike, but I'm running 2.4/2.5 tires and liking the advantages far above any weight penalties. B+ would seem to be a backward step.

    -F
    My intention is still to try my Waltworks out with a wide (but not plus) rim and 2.4/5" tyres to see which I'll prefer between that or 29 Plus, just deciding on those rims at the moment, will probably go with Easton Arc 30's...


  134. #134
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    But have you actually tried B+ vs 29x2.4/2.5"? I actually have and there is definitely a increase in comfort with the B+, no question about it, for a HT there is no question in my mind unless you're racing serious XC and that's that PLUS is the way to go.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fleas View Post
    I'm not yet ready to spring for a new bike, but I'm running 2.4/2.5 tires and liking the advantages far above any weight penalties. B+ would seem to be a backward step.
    -F
    Don't, get the WTB Asym i29s or i35, the Asym rim builds an almost dishless rear/front and the tubeless setup is super easy. As to whether normal 29 or 29+, can't see you riding any real rough/tech trails and not preferring the 29+.

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    My intention is still to try my Waltworks out with a wide (but not plus) rim and 2.4/5" tyres to see which I'll prefer between that or 29 Plus, just deciding on those rims at the moment, will probably go with Easton Arc 30's...
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  135. #135
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    Damn, I'm out riding Sarge past peeps on the climb as well as descents and fairly level ground with b+. Weight penalty? Sarge weighs nearly 1/2 pound less than my 26x2.4 equipped HT. So gotta say, Really? Not trying to be offensive, just curious on that one.
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  136. #136
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    Have you ridden 29+ yet or is B+ the only PLUS iteration you've tried? For me after riding both, no comparison for a HT, 29+ all the way.

    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeRune View Post
    Damn, I'm out riding Sarge past peeps on the climb as well as descents and fairly level ground with b+. Weight penalty? Sarge weighs nearly 1/2 pound less than my 26x2.4 equipped HT. So gotta say, Really? Not trying to be offensive, just curious on that one.
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  137. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    But have you actually tried B+ vs 29x2.4/2.5"? I actually have and there is definitely a increase in comfort with the B+, no question about it, for a HT there is no question in my mind unless you're racing serious XC and that's that PLUS is the way to go.



    Don't, get the WTB Asym i29s or i35, the Asym rim builds an almost dishless rear/front and the tubeless setup is super easy. As to whether normal 29 or 29+, can't see you riding any real rough/tech trails and not preferring the 29+.
    I've been looking at the new CI31 rims too but don't want to waste money for the sake of it if what you say about preferring 29+ happens and I don't ride 29 much at all. I'll looks into the i29 and 35...

  138. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    But have you actually tried B+ vs 29x2.4/2.5"? I actually have and there is definitely a increase in comfort with the B+, no question about it, for a HT there is no question in my mind unless you're racing serious XC and that's that PLUS is the way to go.
    I don't doubt that. I ride rigid and have been pounding my 29" wheels. I keep thinking that bigger tires would protect the rims better for how my riding is [still] evolving. B+ is only a little smaller than 29x2.4, but JustJ's description bears out some assumptions I've made, but haven't tested. And like I said, it sounds like his interests match mine closely, so I have assigned some legitimacy to his findings. If I could demo a rigid steel B+ bike, I'd do it in a heartbeat. It would probably serve me very well when I made a mistake and pounded into something, but overall I'd be missing that bump up in wheel diameter that 29 provides.

    -F
    It's never easier - you just go faster.

  139. #139
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fleas View Post
    I don't doubt that. I ride rigid and have been pounding my 29" wheels. I keep thinking that bigger tires would protect the rims better for how my riding is [still] evolving. B+ is only a little smaller than 29x2.4, but JustJ's description bears out some assumptions I've made, but haven't tested. And like I said, it sounds like his interests match mine closely, so I have assigned some legitimacy to his findings. If I could demo a rigid steel B+ bike, I'd do it in a heartbeat. It would probably serve me very well when I made a mistake and pounded into something, but overall I'd be missing that bump up in wheel diameter that 29 provides.

    -F
    There are others aspects of B+ that I don't like, I find the tyres that I've tried squirm to varying degrees so I don't feel that I have the control I'd like, I haven't found this to be true, thus far on 29+.

    So far, I just don't like B+ as much as a good 29 tyre, yes they might be more comfortable typically but that's only one aspect to me.

    I wouldn't count on the bigger rubber protecting your rims, the lower pressures tend to negate again gains in girth and I often wince at the sound of rock on rubber on metal/carbon!

    Anyway I'm flattered that you find my "research" helpful and I really hope you and others continue to.

  140. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Have you ridden 29+ yet or is B+ the only PLUS iteration you've tried? For me after riding both, no comparison for a HT, 29+ all the way.
    After test rides on many 29+ as well as b+ bikes I chose b+, since it simply felt more natural to me. 29+ would have forced the custom frame since I was not finding a "this is the bike" epiphany. Since that would have been 3k + choice that still required a fork and grouppo, wasn't in the cards. I'm still paying on my 100k heart surgery.

    So, yes I have had many weekenders with test bikes in both b+ and 29+. Didn't have in mind to be impulsive at all.
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  141. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeRune View Post
    After test rides on many 29+ as well as b+ bikes I chose b+, since it simply felt more natural to me. 29+ would have forced the custom frame since I was not finding a "this is the bike" epiphany. Since that would have been 3k + choice that still required a fork and grouppo, wasn't in the cards. I'm still paying on my 100k heart surgery.
    You hit the nail on the head there when you said ""this is the bike" epiphany", I got this from the 29plus setup on this bike but I was also pretty blown away with the B+ too, certainly far exceeding my experience of other plus bikes. I've vowed to only buy bikes that blow me away from now on, (I can't actually see me buying another bikes for a long time, unless I decide to go with a FS WW) the Walt was a gamble in the same way as any custom frame can be, but knowing it would fit me helped somewhat.

  142. #142
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    @ Fleas - Don't know if the PLUS tyre would better protect the rim, but I know it sure as hell helps protect my back with the extra cush it provides. The best compliment I can pay any part on my bikes is that I don't think about them, just ride and with the B+ I have done just that and the 29+ I have tried. I have never been one who felt that 29ers were awkward or slow to accelerate, never noticed that, only the much greater traction benefits. You should definitely try to get a demo on some of these bikes, you really can't judge them, no matter how much you crunch the numbers.

    As to JustJ, I totally appreciate and respect the feedback he's given and I also felt some of that squirm he mentions about the B+ tyres I have run, running them at pressures low enough to give the cush I want, but I'm also not running them on really wide rims, just 35mm internal, where as the 29+ have been run on 39mm internal rims. If I could afford a new 29+ frame, in a heart beat, but since I can't, for a HT, definitely B+ over regular 29ers. Now on my FS where I don't need that cush I feel the opposite way, love the 29ers, B+ are OK.

    BansheeRune, seems you are/were kind of in the same boat as me, which is why B+ was started to help those who wanted some more cush on their 29ers HTs but couldn't afford it, had an option without a new frame.
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  143. #143
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    LyNx - if memory serves me right, were you not pretty close to the guys at Banshee, I seem to remember talking to you about the Phantom a while back. Aren't those guys interested in trying 29+? If would be great if you could influence them.

    If you have anymore questions you think I might be able to help with please just shout, there's nothing I like more than testing out different setups and appraising them.

  144. #144
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    Yeah, and I already tried it, somewhat, did not like what I initially felt and so did not worry to do anymore testing. There are other who have the Prime and have used the 650B drop outs to run 29+ with no issues at all. Maybe when I get back from my vacation I will feel so inclined to give it a better go in the Phantom (can't do the Prime as I have the pre-production one), but honestly can't see me liking 29+ on it anymore than I like B+. FYI, all Banshee frames can take at min 2.8" B+ without any fiddling and I had no issues with 3.0" fitting.

    Oh and if you really want to not spend a tonne on a 29er wheelset, why not take a look at the new KORE rims, you can pick up 2 for under $100 and they're wide, if you can find them in stock that is.
    https://www.universalcycles.com/shop...&category=5987
    https://www.universalcycles.com/shop...&category=5987

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    LyNx - if memory serves me right, were you not pretty close to the guys at Banshee, I seem to remember talking to you about the Phantom a while back. Aren't those guys interested in trying 29+? If would be great if you could influence them.

    If you have anymore questions you think I might be able to help with please just shout, there's nothing I like more than testing out different setups and appraising them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
    You're doing mtbr wrong, you're supposed to get increasingly offended by the implications that you're doing ANYTHING wrong.

  145. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Yeah, and I already tried it, somewhat, did not like what I initially felt and so did not worry to do anymore testing. There are other who have the Prime and have used the 650B drop outs to run 29+ with no issues at all. Maybe when I get back from my vacation I will feel so inclined to give it a better go in the Phantom (can't do the Prime as I have the pre-production one), but honestly can't see me liking 29+ on it anymore than I like B+. FYI, all Banshee frames can take at min 2.8" B+ without any fiddling and I had no issues with 3.0" fitting.

    Oh and if you really want to not spend a tonne on a 29er wheelset, why not take a look at the new KORE rims, you can pick up 2 for under $100 and they're wide, if you can find them in stock that is.
    https://www.universalcycles.com/shop...&category=5987
    https://www.universalcycles.com/shop...&category=5987
    Cheers LyNx I'll take a look. I've always liked the look of the Prime and Phantom, I'd have probably had one of my local shop was keen when I enquired a couple of years back.

  146. #146
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    And then this came along and made things REALLY interesting!...

    https://instagram.com/p/BJx5URSj3yC/

  147. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    And then this came along and made things REALLY interesting!...

    https://instagram.com/p/BJx5URSj3yC/
    Nice I was waiting on Plus-Minus!
    Safe riding,

    Vik
    www.vikapproved.com

  148. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by vikb View Post
    Nice I was waiting on Plus-Minus!
    Ha ha all we need now are 28" wheels!

  149. #149
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    Glad to see that tire actually made it to reality.

    This is kinda interesting as well - https://www.instagram.com/p/BJxOXYrBF7X/
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

  150. #150
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    So, basically we're going from low fat to nonfat?!?! Doh!


    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    BansheeRune, seems you are/were kind of in the same boat as me, which is why B+ was started to help those who wanted some more cush on their 29ers HTs but couldn't afford it, had an option without a new frame.

    I was looking at the overall budget and going for down and dirty. Complete bike that's rather close to representing my .dwg file without ending up spending 5-6k in the process. The Sergeant just had that "Oh boy, this feels just right" feeling which is nearly unheard of in a production bike. At the time I was open to either b+ or 29+ provided the performance was present. Had I gone with the Ti Sergeant I could cram either size in it and been good to go.



    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    You hit the nail on the head there when you said ""this is the bike" epiphany", I got this from the 29plus setup on this bike but I was also pretty blown away with the B+ too, certainly far exceeding my experience of other plus bikes. I've vowed to only buy bikes that blow me away from now on, (I can't actually see me buying another bikes for a long time, unless I decide to go with a FS WW) the Walt was a gamble in the same way as any custom frame can be, but knowing it would fit me helped somewhat.
    This is why I kept an open mind toward wheel size. The one number that was static was 3.0. I concur with your vow! It's gotta be feeling really groovy to find a place in the collective.
    Get fAt, Stay fAt, Ride fAt
    Doctor recommended...

  151. #151
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    For my FS bike I have no desire/need for plus tires, but a true 2.5" tire would be great.
    Safe riding,

    Vik
    www.vikapproved.com

  152. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeRune View Post
    So, basically we're going from low fat to nonfat?!?! Doh!
    That 29x2.6" Nobby Nic has a good chance at being as wide or wider than several of the B "+" tires. I for one has no desire to ever run another tire with less than 29" OD.

    I'd 10:1 rather run a 29x2.6" tire on something like an i35 rim than a 27.5x2.8 that measures only 28" OD. Horse for courses and all

    Not to mention the fact that this tire will fit in the rear of some frames that a true 29+ won't fit in.
    "I ride to clear my head, my head is clearer when I'm riding SS. Therefore, I choose to ride SS."~ Fullrange Drew

  153. #153
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    Sounds like the bike is working out well for you. I'm jealous of all the tinkering, trying out different configurations is part of the fun. I visit this thread regularly then check the waitlist.

    Any commentary on how the 29+ wheels feel versus a regular 29er tire? Looks like the 29+ wheels and tires are pretty light. Any noticeable differences?

  154. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by ianick View Post
    Sounds like the bike is working out well for you. I'm jealous of all the tinkering, trying out different configurations is part of the fun. I visit this thread regularly then check the waitlist.

    Any commentary on how the 29+ wheels feel versus a regular 29er tire? Looks like the 29+ wheels and tires are pretty light. Any noticeable differences?
    It really is working out well thank you! That waitlist comes around sooner or later and from design to completion REALLY quickly!

    I have no experience of normal 29" wheels on the UW as yet because I still need some wheels building for a fair test BUT I do have a good amount of experience of 29ers and I can say that these wheels and tyres are light enough for me not to notice them. The good old 29" momentum is there and they tend to flatten trails, can't wait to compare them though and of course I will report back once I have.

  155. #155
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    Back on the big wheels and out for an 18 miler around Sutton Bank North Yorkshire this morning.

    I find it amazing how fast the bike covers unfamiliar ground and also how easy it is to pedal even when tired.

    Got some new tyres on their way to me next week so I'll be starting some more tests soon...

  156. #156
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    Been playing with a bikepacking setup...











    These are Alpkit bags but I will probably invest in an Alpine Ludites seat bag and custom frame bag at some point.

    I'm hoping to do some overnight trips with the bike very soon...

  157. #157
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    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior

    I hope you guys still want to read my musings and don't mind my posts but this thread is all about documenting what this bike is all about so please forgive me if you're getting bored? I hope not anyway!

    So I've not yet tested out the bikepacking aspects of the bike, the kids school commitments means riding time of any merit is pretty much limited to the weekend at the moment, but I have been playing with the setup a bit more.

    Firstly there's the Absolute Black oval cinch ring that I've fitted recently. It can be flipped like the Raceface rings but the offset is slightly different so it actually affords me a little more clearance than the standard 30T ring. I reckon I could get away with a 32T now and that opens up the prospect of running SRAM Eagle at some point, so that's great news!







    I've been experiencing a bit of a "simple is better" kind of ethos since building this rig, so I've paired things down a little. I've removed the cadence and speed sensors because I ain't a roadie and I've finally realised that these things matter not on a mtb. I've removed the TOGS thumb over grip system because I'm going to see if I actually miss them during my riding. I am pretty sure I will to be fair, I've kind of got used to being able to have an extra hand position. I've also taken the King Cage Manything cage off as I'm reserving it for back pack duties. It's just another thing to clog with mud when I'm not utilising it properly but it's a great bit of kit and works well with my bikepacking setup.

    I've also reverted back to 27.5+ for a while, a load of Maxxis and Bonty tyres turned up from Walt and this bike was always supposed to have a Rekon/Ikon plus setup to try out initially so I thought I'd put them back on before our winter's slop ensues. Going to try them out this weekend.









    Next up...

    I pick my "Fat" wheels up next week, Easton Arc 45 with Hope Pro 4 hubs. I'll probably try the tyres out for fit and photos but I'll be saving their true test for the snow.

    I've got some Maxxis WT (Wide Trail) tyres to try out too, these will go on the Arc 35 wheels that I use for my Chupacabras as the WT's are apparently optimised for use on 35mm wide rims so this should be good! I'll be using 29" Maxxis Shorty 2.5 WT's during the majority of our winter, they're my favoured mud tyre I'm normal widths so I'm hoping for big things!

    More pics to follow next week and I'll report back on how he bike rides with the new tyres above and others ASAP...

  158. #158
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    Please keep the updates coming! I like reading about all the different setups and how they compare.

    What are the tires going to be for the "Fat" setup?

  159. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    Please keep the updates coming! I like reading about all the different setups and how they compare.

    What are the tires going to be for the "Fat" setup?
    Thank you, glad you're enjoying the thread!

    I'll be running 27.5x3.8 Hodags, I really liked the 26" versions I had on my old Farley, they seemed to work pretty well in the snow and as all-rounders.

  160. #160
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    Yeah, you're getting annoying rubbing this beauty and all it's versatility in our faces, be gone j/k Very much like and appreciate reading about your different setups and tyres etc you're trying with this bike. Curious why only Arc 45s for your fat setup and not some 60mm> internal rims to properly optimize those Hodags?
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  161. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Yeah, you're getting annoying rubbing this beauty and all it's versatility in our faces, be gone j/k Very much like and appreciate reading about your different setups and tyres etc you're trying with this bike. Curious why only Arc 45s for your fat setup and not some 60mm> internal rims to properly optimize those Hodags?
    Ha ha, thanks LyNx!

    Well it all comes down to clearance really, Walt recommended 50mm rims to fit in there without an issue and most of them weigh a tonne (Scraper etc) so I decided to go for the Arc 45 as it should be wide enough for what I need plus I have the option to use them as a real Plus wheelset during the other 50 weeks of the year that we don't have snow! Having ridden the 29x3" for a while now I can't see the current 27+ setup being the one I ride most but the Rekons and Ikons are only 2.8" and only come up to just over 2.6" (actual) on my Ibis 741 rims, so I can see me trying some 27.5x3 or bigger once more tyres are released and the 45's are the perfect rim to run them on.

    One thing I do notice about running the 27.5 wheels and the 410mm chainstay setting is this thing really is a wheelie monster! It's definitely the bike I should be doing Ryan Leech's 30 Day Challenge on, maybe a project for the winter!




    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

  162. #162
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    I hope you guys still want to read my musings and don't mind my posts but this thread is all about documenting what this bike is all about so please forgive me if you're getting bored? I hope not anyway!

    Hey, bike looks killer! Quick question for you about the fork with the 29+ wheels. I'm looking for a new fork for my new (to me) stache 9. Is your fork just the boost 29/27.5+ to get that clearance, or is it a 29+ specific one?

    Thanks!

  163. #163
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    My super Waltworks also got finished and built up. I still need to order and build my 29er Boost wheelset, so for now, I've just got the fat bike setup going and it's AWESOME. Using Hugo rims with the 27.5 x 3.8 Hodags. Fits like a glove with ~425mm chainstays. I'll be able to bring those in for ~415mm length stays with the 29er wheelset, but probably won't. I didn't want the uber short wheelbase on this rig as I like the stability of ~430mm chainstays for the techy descents we have here in Colorado.








  164. #164
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    Quote Originally Posted by dejock View Post
    Hey, bike looks killer! Quick question for you about the fork with the 29+ wheels. I'm looking for a new fork for my new (to me) stache 9. Is your fork just the boost 29/27.5+ to get that clearance, or is it a 29+ specific one?

    Thanks!
    Thanks dejock! They're the 27.5+ Boost version and there's plenty of room for 29+.

  165. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by trhoppe View Post
    My super Waltworks also got finished and built up. I still need to order and build my 29er Boost wheelset, so for now, I've just got the fat bike setup going and it's AWESOME. Using Hugo rims with the 27.5 x 3.8 Hodags. Fits like a glove with ~425mm chainstays. I'll be able to bring those in for ~415mm length stays with the 29er wheelset, but probably won't. I didn't want the uber short wheelbase on this rig as I like the stability of ~430mm chainstays for the techy descents we have here in Colorado.







    Looking good trhoppe!! How are you enjoying it? Will you mainly be running the bike with the Hodags?...

  166. #166
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    Only one ride so far and it was great! Loving the short chainstays, loving the regular Q-factor and the bike feels pretty dialed right out of the box.

    I'll be mostly on a 29x2.5 DHF/2.3 DHR2 setup and for bike packing I'll experiment with some 29+, but probably stick with my tried and true 2.35 Forekaster/IKON combo. The Hodags are going to be my winter tires. We have ~2-3 months of that here in Denver.

  167. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by trhoppe View Post
    Only one ride so far and it was great! Loving the short chainstays, loving the regular Q-factor and the bike feels pretty dialed right out of the box.

    I'll be mostly on a 29x2.5 DHF/2.3 DHR2 setup and for bike packing I'll experiment with some 29+, but probably stick with my tried and true 2.35 Forekaster/IKON combo. The Hodags are going to be my winter tires. We have ~2-3 months of that here in Denver.
    Sounds pretty close to how I'll be using mine! Just fitted a 2.4WT DHR (people run them back to front so I hear?!) on my Arc 35 front wheel to see how it looks, will mate it up to a DHF 2.3 and give them a whirl before putting the Shorties on.

  168. #168
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    I'd highly suggest you take a look at the new Forekaster 2.6" offerings, this tyre rolls really fast, is relatively light compared to a DHR2 and has super open tread which gives great clearing ability and fantastic grip. Just did 4 days in Crested Butte with a Forekaster rear/DHF front and never wanted for traction, really grunted a small climb or two and no slippage from the Forekaster - my new fav tyre. BTW, your WW looks sweet as well

    Quote Originally Posted by trhoppe View Post
    Only one ride so far and it was great! Loving the short chainstays, loving the regular Q-factor and the bike feels pretty dialed right out of the box.

    I'll be mostly on a 29x2.5 DHF/2.3 DHR2 setup and for bike packing I'll experiment with some 29+, but probably stick with my tried and true 2.35 Forekaster/IKON combo. The Hodags are going to be my winter tires. We have ~2-3 months of that here in Denver.
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
    You're doing mtbr wrong, you're supposed to get increasingly offended by the implications that you're doing ANYTHING wrong.

  169. #169
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    The Forecaster is definitely in my sights for next year but I'll be really interested in seeing how this Wide Trail thing pans out. I should add though that I see no reason not to run the 29plus setup for most of the summer season as it really is a game changer to me on this bike.

  170. #170
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    Why do you thjink you need a 32t to run Eagle?

    I'm pretty sure you could do okay with a smaller chain ring, though maybe you don't need the low end.

    I'm running a 1x10, 26 x 40 now, so an Eagle woudl only work for me if I get a little more low end, so I'd be looking at a 28-30t.

    There are less expensive alternatives to Eagle that will allow you to convert your 1 x 11...

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    I hope you guys still want to read my musings and don't mind my posts but this thread is all about documenting what this bike is all about so please forgive me if you're getting bored? I hope not anyway!

    So I've not yet tested out the bikepacking aspects of the bike, the kids school commitments means riding time of any merit is pretty much limited to the weekend at the moment, but I have been playing with the setup a bit more.

    Firstly there's the Absolute Black oval cinch ring that I've fitted recently. It can be flipped like the Raceface rings but the offset is slightly different so it actually affords me a little more clearance than the standard 30T ring. I reckon I could get away with a 32T now and that opens up the prospect of running SRAM Eagle at some point, so that's great news!







    I've been experiencing a bit of a "simple is better" kind of ethos since building this rig, so I've paired things down a little. I've removed the cadence and speed sensors because I ain't a roadie and I've finally realised that these things matter not on a mtb. I've removed the TOGS thumb over grip system because I'm going to see if I actually miss them during my riding. I am pretty sure I will to be fair, I've kind of got used to being able to have an extra hand position. I've also taken the King Cage Manything cage off as I'm reserving it for back pack duties. It's just another thing to clog with mud when I'm not utilising it properly but it's a great bit of kit and works well with my bikepacking setup.

    I've also reverted back to 27.5+ for a while, a load of Maxxis and Bonty tyres turned up from Walt and this bike was always supposed to have a Rekon/Ikon plus setup to try out initially so I thought I'd put them back on before our winter's slop ensues. Going to try them out this weekend.









    Next up...

    I pick my "Fat" wheels up next week, Easton Arc 45 with Hope Pro 4 hubs. I'll probably try the tyres out for fit and photos but I'll be saving their true test for the snow.

    I've got some Maxxis WT (Wide Trail) tyres to try out too, these will go on the Arc 35 wheels that I use for my Chupacabras as the WT's are apparently optimised for use on 35mm wide rims so this should be good! I'll be using 29" Maxxis Shorty 2.5 WT's during the majority of our winter, they're my favoured mud tyre I'm normal widths so I'm hoping for big things!

    More pics to follow next week and I'll report back on how he bike rides with the new tyres above and others ASAP...

  171. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nurse Ben View Post
    Why do you thjink you need a 32t to run Eagle?

    I'm pretty sure you could do okay with a smaller chain ring, though maybe you don't need the low end.

    I'm running a 1x10, 26 x 40 now, so an Eagle woudl only work for me if I get a little more low end, so I'd be looking at a 28-30t.

    There are less expensive alternatives to Eagle that will allow you to convert your 1 x 11...
    30T with a 12 speed 10-50T cassette would be too low for me, that's all. I really like bling and I really like Eagle too!

  172. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nurse Ben View Post
    Why do you thjink you need a 32t to run Eagle?

    I'm pretty sure you could do okay with a smaller chain ring, though maybe you don't need the low end.

    I'm running a 1x10, 26 x 40 now, so an Eagle woudl only work for me if I get a little more low end, so I'd be looking at a 28-30t.

    There are less expensive alternatives to Eagle that will allow you to convert your 1 x 11...
    Eagle cassettes are 10-50, he can get your lowest ratio with a 32t.

  173. #173
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    I'd highly suggest you take a look at the new Forekaster 2.6" offerings, this tyre rolls really fast, is relatively light compared to a DHR2 and has super open tread which gives great clearing ability and fantastic grip. Just did 4 days in Crested Butte with a Forekaster rear/DHF front and never wanted for traction, really grunted a small climb or two and no slippage from the Forekaster - my new fav tyre. BTW, your WW looks sweet as well
    There's a 2.6" forekaster now? WAT? If that's the case, that would be my all around perfect 29" tire.

    I LOVED the 2.35 forekaster on the front with an IKON on the back on the Colorado Trail and a ~2.5" forekaster would be the ticket for me.

  174. #174
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    So far, as far as I can gather it's only 650Bx2.6", but also AFAIK it will also be released as a 29er Curious where in CO you were riding (CO trail is long) and what time of year and surface? I don't think I would like an Ikon out back for it's lack of braking prowess on loose, might maybe go with a Bonti XR3 instead (beefed up Ikon) with the Forekaster upfront. Wasn't there long enough to be trying different tyre combos, but was most definitely impressed by the performance I got with it as a rear.

    Maxxis Interbike 2016 - Mtbr.com

    Quote Originally Posted by trhoppe View Post
    There's a 2.6" forekaster now? WAT? If that's the case, that would be my all around perfect 29" tire.

    I LOVED the 2.35 forekaster on the front with an IKON on the back on the Colorado Trail and a ~2.5" forekaster would be the ticket for me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  175. #175
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    Waltworks Ultimate Warrior

    First ride out on the Maxxis Rekon/Ikon+ setup and I've got to say they are definitely a much better prospect than the Nobby Nics. I still prefer the big wheels with the 3.0's though, they just work for me and I'm plain faster on them although today's ride still felt pretty good!







    The highlight of the ride for me was the Absolute Black oval ring, this thing really shone today, I've used oval chain rings quite a lot over the past year or so but this one has been by far the best I've tried. Seems to really help pedalling through rough sections of trail, helps smooth my pedalling and also looks pretty awesome too!



    The bike now feels paired down at the essentials at the moment, removing things like the farming bits, TOGS etc feels more simplified and I'm really loving the clean cockpit and the way the thing looks.



    Next stop... Minion 29er!


  176. #176
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    Unless those are the new PLUS Minions, you're not going to like them as much as the 29"x3" setup Just saying

    Can you elaborate on the differences between the Nobby Nics and the Rekon/Ikon combo for me? Very curious as I currently have 2.8" NN and our local Maxxis dealer has a set of 2.8" Rekons sitting there for me and want to know if I should be trying to make my way down there to collect them ASAP Nics have proved pretty nice for me, decent volume, decent grip, not ridden them enough to gain confidence I think, definitely am a Maxxis fan and know them well, so feeling I'll jive better with the Rekons as well, especially in the wet.

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    Next stop... Minion 29er!

    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  177. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Unless those are the new PLUS Minions, you're not going to like them as much as the 29"x3" setup Just saying

    Can you elaborate on the differences between the Nobby Nics and the Rekon/Ikon combo for me? Very curious as I currently have 2.8" NN and our local Maxxis dealer has a set of 2.8" Rekons sitting there for me and want to know if I should be trying to make my way down there to collect them ASAP Nics have proved pretty nice for me, decent volume, decent grip, not ridden them enough to gain confidence I think, definitely am a Maxxis fan and know them well, so feeling I'll jive better with the Rekons as well, especially in the wet.
    Ha ha you might just be right! The front is a WT but it's only 2.4" and doesn't come up that Wide to be honest. We shall see though.

    Basically the Nics are slower to roll and have less grip than the Rekons, they're also lighter and have Maxxis written on them!

    I've ran NN's in standard trim quite a lot over the years until I realised there were better tyres available out there, I still use one on the front of my Cannondale Habit along with a Rocket Ron on the back but that's a dry weather bike these days for shorter loops.

  178. #178
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    Ha ha LyNx wins again! Just adjusted the BB and CS, put the right air in the tyres and gone for a quick ride. 29" sucks!

    First gravel corner that I usually take flat out on my plus tyres and I nearly ended up on my arse facing the other direction!

    Too early to say but I can't see these wheels catching on!

  179. #179
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    A week down the line, no big rides but plenty of small ones under my belt on the Minions and I just can't do it, I prefer Plus tyres on this bike, namely 29" Plus tyres!

    Even with the Minions at 23/20psi on 30mm internally wide rims and they're uncomfortable and more to the point HEAVY!

    I've put the 27.5+ wheels back on and the thing feels like an XC bike! I'll try the 2.5" Shorty WT's when things get really wet but until then I'll be sticking with the big rubber.

  180. #180
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    J, I wondered when you'd come to your senses!!
    Get fAt, Stay fAt, Ride fAt
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  181. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by BansheeRune View Post
    J, I wondered when you'd come to your senses!!
    Ha ha yes well it's pretty hard giving up on convention sometimes!


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  182. #182
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    Listen, why don't you just /End Thread right now with...and LyNx was right, 29+ rocks LMAO

    Didn't figure you'd like the loss of grip and weight gain from them compared to the 29+, good to keep reading on your trials with this frame, am sure it will help quite a few on decisions regarding the PLUS wheel sizes. When you realise what you really don't like, maybe you should send me that set of wheels for being able to give forward predictions on your efforts

    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    A week down the line, no big rides but plenty of small ones under my belt on the Minions and I just can't do it, I prefer Plus tyres on this bike, namely 29" Plus tyres!

    Even with the Minions at 23/20psi on 30mm internally wide rims and they're uncomfortable and more to the point HEAVY!

    I've put the 27.5+ wheels back on and the thing feels like an XC bike! I'll try the 2.5" Shorty WT's when things get really wet but until then I'll be sticking with the big rubber.
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  183. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Listen, why don't you just /End Thread right now with...and LyNx was right, 29+ rocks LMAO

    Didn't figure you'd like the loss of grip and weight gain from them compared to the 29+, good to keep reading on your trials with this frame, am sure it will help quite a few on decisions regarding the PLUS wheel sizes. When you realise what you really don't like, maybe you should send me that set of wheels for being able to give forward predictions on your efforts
    LOL yeah maybe I should!...


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  184. #184
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    Quote Originally Posted by LyNx View Post
    Unless those are the new PLUS Minions, you're not going to like them as much as the 29"x3" setup Just saying

    Can you elaborate on the differences between the Nobby Nics and the Rekon/Ikon combo for me? Very curious as I currently have 2.8" NN and our local Maxxis dealer has a set of 2.8" Rekons sitting there for me and want to know if I should be trying to make my way down there to collect them ASAP Nics have proved pretty nice for me, decent volume, decent grip, not ridden them enough to gain confidence I think, definitely am a Maxxis fan and know them well, so feeling I'll jive better with the Rekons as well, especially in the wet.
    I've just seen these two reviews and thought of you, they seem to pretty much sum things up although I'd argue that the Maxxis seem as durable as the Schwalbes if not a little bit moreso:

    Schwalbe Nobby Nic TrailStar/PaceStar 2.8in tyres review - BikeRadar

    Maxxis Rekon+/Ikon+ 2.8in EXO TR review - BikeRadar

  185. #185
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    Thanks for the links, What I was worried about seems to hold true according to their testing,the Pacestar does not do well in the wet and that's what I have Should be picking up my Rekons sometime this or next week from dealer when I get a chance to get into town, will give them a go on my Phantom and Prime and Paradox, not sure about rigid Monkey, think back is still a bit out of whack for it right now
    Quote Originally Posted by Harold
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  186. #186
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    No problem, I really like the Ikon/Rekons, I've not had them in the real wet stuff yet though but that might change soon.

  187. #187
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    Have you built up 26" fat wheels yet?

  188. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by ianick View Post
    Have you built up 26" fat wheels yet?
    Not something on my radar to be honest, I went straight to 27.5" although part of me wonders if I should have gone 26 just to have a wheelset in all diameters?!

  189. #189
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    That's right, the 27.5x45 will be your fat set up. Are the Arc 35's still your favorite wheel set?

  190. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by ianick View Post
    That's right, the 27.5x45 will be your fat set up. Are the Arc 35's still your favorite wheel set?
    Well the 29x3.0 setup on the 35's is definitely my favourite setup that's for sure. It's started raining heavily here lately so I'm going to try some 2.5WT Shorties on the 35's to see how I get on.

  191. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    Not something on my radar to be honest, I went straight to 27.5" although part of me wonders if I should have gone 26 just to have a wheelset in all diameters?!
    Don't bother with the 26 fat, B fat is far superior! IMHO

  192. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeny View Post
    Don't bother with the 26 fat, B fat is far superior! IMHO
    This was my thinking when planning the build.

    I picked the Arc 45 wheelset up a few days back, just waiting on some rim strips to arrive now....

  193. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    This was my thinking when planning the build.

    I picked the Arc 45 wheelset up a few days back, just waiting on some rim strips to arrive now....
    Why so skinny??? I'm in the process of getting together my winter setup, and just received a set of Nextie 27.5x65mm rims today! Can't wait to get them built and setup! I have the hubs already (DT) and will be dropping them off to get built any day now.

  194. #194
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    See post #161

    Basically I know they'll fit in the frame, not sure if 65mm rims would but now you've got me questioning this!

  195. #195
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just J View Post
    See post #161

    Basically I know they'll fit in the frame, not sure if 65mm rims would but now you've got me questioning this!
    I forgot this bike is Boost rear end and normal BB. The bike these are going in is 157mm rear and 83mm BB.

  196. #196
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    Yeah this was never meant to be a fatbike, just a trailbike that had a option to get fat over the winter.

  197. #197
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    Nice autumnal ride this morning, it has began to get decidedly wetter lately so I've persevered with the "normal" tyres because they tend to cut through the mud a little more effectively than the plus tyres unfortunately.

    Today's setup:

    Maxxis Shorty 29x2.5" WT up front @ 20psi

    Maxxis Minion DHF 29x2.3 @ 22psi in the rear

    Chainstays set at 417.5mm with the BB in the high position.

    This is a rowdy setup and felt awesome in the mud and wet especially when going down hill but it was harder work on steeper climbs. Traction was great but not as good in the corners as plus tyres but we already knew that!

    Again, I miss the comfort and general feel of the 29 plus setup, I could definitely feel myself being jarred more than I've been used to of late but the beauty of this bike is I can easily change things over if we manage to get some drier weather or when it suits.





    I've decided to put my TOGS back on the bike, I definitely miss them having got used to them over he past few months.

  198. #198
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    Sarge would throw me over the bars if I were to put less than a 2.8 on him!
    I would imagine that your setup is very playful. Gotta appreciate the experimentation you've been doing, J... That makes the +bike even more fun than a "regular" bike.
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  199. #199
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    Well there were definitely a couple of moments when the margin of error just wasn't there, it's all part of the fun though!

    Yes it's definitely a playful bike, very easy to loft the front end and steer from the rear too, it also manages to give my the impression that it'll do things that no hardtail has a right to do, I know I've said this before and it might be getting old, but I like this bike a lot!


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  200. #200
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    As near as damn it a true 2.5" on the rims the tyres were designed for.




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