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  1. #1
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    CCDB on SB-66 wins again!

    I should have known from my past 4 experiences with the Cane Creek Double Barrel on Turner, Specialized, and Intense bikes that it would transform the bike. First off, if you are having trouble with the firm feeling of the SB and want the best of both worlds, you need to get a properly tuned coil shock. IMO!! The Avy, felt great on the bike. No complaints...BUT, I couldn't help but wonder if the CCDB would give that extra little bit of tunability that goes from great to AMAZING. So, I got a CCDB to test out from a great friend, and threw it on the SB. I had a LOOOONNNGGG talk with Malcolm at Cane Creek about the bike and leverage ratios and how that affects the setup. Specifically how the SAG point can either put the Axle above or below where the eccentric pivot is most efficient or where it is working against you. 25-28% is the best for AM riding, and 30%+/-1% is best for DH/bike park.


    Immediately, with Malcolms' recommended settings, I noticed the bike pedaling as good or better than when the RP23 was on it. What really put the CCDB in the "I knew I should have gotten the CCDB to begin with" Category was I didn't get the HS chop that was there with the RP23 and was able to even better fine tune it a click at a time till I got the best of both worlds. Great pedaling, with controlled HS hits, and perfect rebound response to keep the rear glued to the ground. I still had 16 clicks of LS Compression left to dial in even more improved pedal performance if you are looking for firmer beginning stroke.

    Suspension Experts also did a mod on my 2012 Lyrik RC2 DH Coil(170mm) that worked great. It required me to keep the LS compression on the Mission control between all the way closed to about 4 clicks from fully closed, with HS compression turned 1 click from fully open. This gave it great cornering stability with little to no brake dive, and great small bump compliance.

    So, I've had the chance to experiment with a few different setups of suspension and tunes, and I think I've landed on what allows the SB66 to truly do what it was designed to do. As with most high end products, it's really hard to have a bad experience. At this point it just comes down to rider preference and if you are a set it and leave kind of rider, or like to tinker and wrench. I'm the latter. It's part of the fun to me! More CCDB ride and tune impressions to come.

    If you want to get the CCDB, I would buy it from MTB Suspension Experts. They have been tremendous to work with and were more than helpful in assisting getting the shock set up right for the SB and it's new design.

    Suspension Experts Home Page
    Kevin Booth
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails CCDB on SB-66 wins again!-ccdb.jpg  

    CCDB on SB-66 wins again!-ccdb2.jpg  


  2. #2
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    sweet, wonder how the ccdbair will compare to the rp23

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    Quote Originally Posted by While At Rome View Post
    sweet, wonder how the ccdbair will compare to the rp23
    I'd imagine it will blow it away. CC isn't going to make an air shock if it is going to cost them their CCDB reputation, and it uses the same twin-tube tech as the coil, so dampening characteristics will be similar.
    What is left to be seen is whether they can un-couple bottom out and sag, which has been the traditional downfall of air canisters, especially with larger riders.

    The RP23 is the most common shock on the market, not the most popular amongst those that actually spec their own bikes.

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    Have you thought about getting the avalanche revalved at all? You were full of praise last time around so would a fine tune yield the same results? What I'm wondering is whether you are feeling the shock or feeling the tune.

    If you went back to the avy would it have any redeeming features or is it just a worse solution than the ccdb?

    Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by petercarm View Post
    Have you thought about getting the avalanche revalved at all? You were full of praise last time around so would a fine tune yield the same results? What I'm wondering is whether you are feeling the shock or feeling the tune.

    If you went back to the avy would it have any redeeming features or is it just a worse solution than the ccdb?

    Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk
    Yeah getting the Avy re-tuned is always an option. Thing is, time down for shipping it out, cost to do so, turn around to get it back, and I can do all of that with a few clicks on the CCDB.

    Remember we are talking minor adjustments. Both shocks are great. I like to wrench and tinker, so havin the ability to tune without complete disassembly is a big plus for me. And I will say, there is a feel to the CCDB that I missed. Can't put my finger on it exactly but just felt like home when things got moving.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CharacterZero View Post
    I'd imagine it will blow it away. CC isn't going to make an air shock if it is going to cost them their CCDB reputation, and it uses the same twin-tube tech as the coil, so dampening characteristics will be similar.
    What is left to be seen is whether they can un-couple bottom out and sag, which has been the traditional downfall of air canisters, especially with larger riders.

    The RP23 is the most common shock on the market, not the most popular amongst those that actually spec their own bikes.
    Nailed it

  7. #7
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    Very nice Aapling! So, you running the fork in the 170mm setting? and if so, what's your static BB, <14"? I have a 170 DH solo air Lyrik, spaced down to 160 to run on the SB-66 when I get it built, but curious how it the bike feels and handles in the 170 setting?
    Ride On!

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgusta View Post
    Very nice Aapling! So, you running the fork in the 170mm setting? and if so, what's your static BB, <14"? I have a 170 DH solo air Lyrik, spaced down to 160 to run on the SB-66 when I get it built, but curious how it the bike feels and handles in the 170 setting?
    Yes, the Lyrik is in the 170mm setting. My HA is 65.1 degrees. Might appear to slack on paper, but translates great on the trail, at least IMO. I only notice a little wandering on something really steep. However, those are usually short steep bursts here on the East Coast. There are long fireroad climbs but the SB climbs really good even with the 170mm fork. Point it down and the CCDB and Lyrik mated to the SB66 design is great.

    I don't have a measurement on the BB height. I'll get that and post it.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by aappling72 View Post
    Yes, the Lyrik is in the 170mm setting. My HA is 65.1 degrees. Might appear to slack on paper, but translates great on the trail, at least IMO. I only notice a little wandering on something really steep. However, those are usually short steep bursts here on the East Coast. There are long fireroad climbs but the SB climbs really good even with the 170mm fork. Point it down and the CCDB and Lyrik mated to the SB66 design is great.

    I don't have a measurement on the BB height. I'll get that and post it.
    Thanks man! Yeah I had my fork in 170 setting on my Rune with a custom -1.0 head angleset for my 1.5" fork (Saar set), making for a 65.4* HTA which felt great on the rowdy trail descents with some chunk and big booters, but raised my bike up enough to notice some hinderance on the climbs and steepened the STA enough to noticed it on longer climbs as well forcing me to raise my post even higher for the climbs to compensate.

    Your bike looks great, wondering how it would do at Whistler or other bike parks? Looks like it could handle it fine. BTW, are you running a frameskin kit on your frame? I am going to be building a frame here in the next week (just waiting a tapered steerer assembly from RS) and trying to decide if it is worth to wait and pay for the sticker kit.
    Ride On!

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by aappling72 View Post
    Suspension Experts also did a mod on my 2012 Lyrik RC2 DH Coil(170mm) that worked great. It required me to keep the LS compression on the Mission control between all the way closed to about 4 clicks from fully closed, with HS compression turned 1 click from fully open. This gave it great cornering stability with little to no brake dive, and great small bump compliance.
    So does this mean that you took the Avy cartridge out of the Lyrik and that you prefer the Mission Control damper with a modded shim stack?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by nybike1971 View Post
    So does this mean that you took the Avy cartridge out of the Lyrik and that you prefer the Mission Control damper with a modded shim stack?
    Yes I took the Avy cartridge out. I need a little more ride time on the fork, but as of right now it is a very close match between the two. The nod might go to the Avy a little on the HS stuff, but honestly they both feel really good and controlled. Suspension Experts did a great job!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgusta View Post
    Thanks man! Yeah I had my fork in 170 setting on my Rune with a custom -1.0 head angleset for my 1.5" fork (Saar set), making for a 65.4* HTA which felt great on the rowdy trail descents with some chunk and big booters, but raised my bike up enough to notice some hinderance on the climbs and steepened the STA enough to noticed it on longer climbs as well forcing me to raise my post even higher for the climbs to compensate.

    Your bike looks great, wondering how it would do at Whistler or other bike parks? Looks like it could handle it fine. BTW, are you running a frameskin kit on your frame? I am going to be building a frame here in the next week (just waiting a tapered steerer assembly from RS) and trying to decide if it is worth to wait and pay for the sticker kit.

    Totally worth getting the frameskin kit. Very well done and goes on great! I used some old 3M protection film I had on a couple of other areas and it attracted dirt on the edges and the frame skin really didn't, and if it did it wiped off! So I say get it. I'm ordering a cople of plain sheets!

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    Discussing this with another this morning and wanted to get a bit of insight...

    Since I have no idea what the leverage curve is like for that frame, how are you finding the CCDB to handle bottom out control? Of course, the CCDB doesn't have a dedicated adjustment for that, more a combination of LSC/HSC changes, but the AVY did have a dedicated bottom out control built in.

    What are your thoughts on how the two shocks compare in that regard? Do you know what the end-stroke of the sb66 looks like? Is there bottom out control built into the linkage?

    Thanks in advance!

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by CharacterZero View Post
    Discussing this with another this morning and wanted to get a bit of insight...

    Since I have no idea what the leverage curve is like for that frame, how are you finding the CCDB to handle bottom out control? Of course, the CCDB doesn't have a dedicated adjustment for that, more a combination of LSC/HSC changes, but the AVY did have a dedicated bottom out control built in.

    What are your thoughts on how the two shocks compare in that regard? Do you know what the end-stroke of the sb66 looks like? Is there bottom out control built into the linkage?

    Thanks in advance!
    I've had no problem with bottoming on the CCDB. In talking with Malcolm, the curve is relatively flat with small hump at about 25-28% sag mark which is the sweet spot for the eccentric pivot. So getting the shock properly sprung (I'm on a 350# at 170lb ride weight), is really crucial. The biggest drop I've hit with it is about 5' with a very slight transition and it felt very controlled and smooth. Malcolm said to start at 1 full turn from fully open on HSC, and 1.5 full turns from fully open in HSR. I'm at 15 clicks from full closed on LSC, and 13 clicks from full closed on LSR, with 4.5 turns of preload. I'm gonna try a 400# spring to see how that feels as well, but I'm digging where I'm at (28% sag) as a balance between pedaling and high speed control.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aappling72 View Post
    I've had no problem with bottoming on the CCDB. In talking with Malcolm, the curve is relatively flat with small hump at about 25-28% sag mark which is the sweet spot for the eccentric pivot. So getting the shock properly sprung (I'm on a 350# at 170lb ride weight), is really crucial. The biggest drop I've hit with it is about 5' with a very slight transition and it felt very controlled and smooth. Malcolm said to start at 1 full turn from fully open on HSC, and 1.5 full turns from fully open in HSR. I'm at 15 clicks from full closed on LSC, and 13 clicks from full closed on LSR, with 4.5 turns of preload. I'm gonna try a 400# spring to see how that feels as well, but I'm digging where I'm at (28% sag) as a balance between pedaling and high speed control.
    Cool. Thanks for the quick response. Yeah, Malcolm and crew over there are absolutely great when it comes to getting things dialed. I dug the CCDB so much on my Terremoto there was just no way to not run it on the Delirium I am on now.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by CharacterZero View Post
    Cool. Thanks for the quick response. Yeah, Malcolm and crew over there are absolutely great when it comes to getting things dialed. I dug the CCDB so much on my Terremoto there was just no way to not run it on the Delirium I am on now.
    I feel the same way. I liked the AVY too, buy there is just something special about the way the CCDB tracks when set up right. Do you have an SB66 too?

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by aappling72 View Post
    I feel the same way. I liked the AVY too, buy there is just something special about the way the CCDB tracks when set up right. Do you have an SB66 too?
    Nope, no Yetis in my stable yet. Really happy with the current whip, got a buddy that is a tribe member and another buddy that is really sold on the 575 and is shopping (with my help), hence my increased interest in the lineup and suspension characteristics.
    I wanted a do-it-all that was a bit tougher than the last rig, and the D is very good at everything I've put it thru from WinterPark/Keystone to AM riding in Austin.

  18. #18
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    What's the shock size? I think I really want to go coil but money is holding me back.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Transfer View Post
    What's the shock size? I think I really want to go coil but money is holding me back.
    8.5 x 2.5. For the money you've already spent its worth it to get the CCDB!

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    Whats the mean difference between the avy and ccdb? I'm going to put a coil on and it's between the 2. I was thinking with the ccdb you would be able to adjust it from a all day pedal to a dh shuttle day.As with the avy it's not as adjustable to do that.I like to set and forget it but I could find 2 different setting that work with the ccdb and change as to what I'm riding that day.

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    I loved the CCDB on my Uzzi VP, wish I had one for the SB-66 that will get here next week. I think I will have the RP-23 Push'd first and go from there.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by tdubb View Post
    Whats the mean difference between the avy and ccdb? I'm going to put a coil on and it's between the 2. I was thinking with the ccdb you would be able to adjust it from a all day pedal to a dh shuttle day.As with the avy it's not as adjustable to do that.I like to set and forget it but I could find 2 different setting that work with the ccdb and change as to what I'm riding that day.
    That's exactly the biggest advantage. The ability to even adjust during a ride for a long DH descent or a long climb. The CCDB really takes advantage of why the bike has to offer.

    Sell the RP23, and get the CCDB. Call Kevin @ Suspension Experts Home Page and tell him Ashley sent you and order your CCDB from them. They are Cane Creeks official service center too. Great guy great price. You won't regret it!!

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by TejasMTB View Post
    I loved the CCDB on my Uzzi VP, wish I had one for the SB-66 that will get here next week. I think I will have the RP-23 Push'd first and go from there.
    I listed my RP23 when I knew the. Ike had shipped and had it sold in a couple of days. Don't waist your money pushing the RP23. Besides, they don't have Kashima parts to service it with anyway. Tell Kevin @ Suspension Experts Home Page Ashley sent you and order your CCDB from them. He'll hook you up and they are great with help tuning it!!

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by aappling72 View Post
    I've had no problem with bottoming on the CCDB. In talking with Malcolm, the curve is relatively flat with small hump at about 25-28% sag mark which is the sweet spot for the eccentric pivot. So getting the shock properly sprung (I'm on a 350# at 170lb ride weight), is really crucial. The biggest drop I've hit with it is about 5' with a very slight transition and it felt very controlled and smooth. Malcolm said to start at 1 full turn from fully open on HSC, and 1.5 full turns from fully open in HSR. I'm at 15 clicks from full closed on LSC, and 13 clicks from full closed on LSR, with 4.5 turns of preload. I'm gonna try a 400# spring to see how that feels as well, but I'm digging where I'm at (28% sag) as a balance between pedaling and high speed control.
    Wonder how the lack of bottom out control comes into play with heavier riders. I'm 240 pounds and seriously considering this shock with a Ti coil.

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailbrain View Post
    Wonder how the lack of bottom out control comes into play with heavier riders. I'm 240 pounds and seriously considering this shock with a Ti coil.
    Choosing the right spring rate and then adjusting HSC will resolve any bottom out issues. I know ive listed this a couple of times already in this thread, but talk to Kevin Booth at Suspension Experts Home Page. Great guy full of knowledge. He'll point you in the right direction!

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by trailbrain View Post
    Wonder how the lack of bottom out control comes into play with heavier riders. I'm 240 pounds and seriously considering this shock with a Ti coil.
    There is probably a whole load of theory vs practice going on here. The SB-66 is distinguished by having a linear leverage ratio. Don't know of many 6in bikes that have that; it tends to be a feature of bigger rigs. The linearity is a disadvantage for handling big hits.

    What other designs are doing with a rising rate is they keep an active suspension for small bumps and for a supple midstroke and then the system becomes more overdamped in deep travel. This works on both compression and rebound strokes. It is an effective way of controlling bottom out but if taken to extremes it makes the bike wallow on big hits because it is slow to rebound. When bike marketing departments describe they have a bottomless feel, it means they have a rising rate actuating the shock.

    If you were to use a shock with an explicit bottom out control feature it is usually specific to the compression circuit (I'm thinking boost valve on the Fox DHX RC4). This is only operative on the compression side, so the rebound from deep hits will stay normal and fast. This would, ignoring all other considerations, be a good option for the SB-66.

    For something like a CCDB, where there is no position-sensitive damping, the bottom out control is delivered by a bumpstop. This is not actually a bad thing. Bumpstops don't compromise performance in the non-deep travel events and they don't compromise the rebound from deep events.

    The CCDB certainly provides the fine tunability of the HSC and LSC to blend in nicely with an appropriately specified bumpstop.

    The CCDB has a high speed shim stack on its piston for both comp and rebound. This should be set for your weight and bike's leverage. You can just write that off to black art.

    The CCDB needs an appropriate bumpstop for your weight and for the bikes' leverage curve. More black art required.

    After that, the CCDB at default settings will be pretty damn good and will be tunable. By this stage you will be benefitting from the CCDB's use of the full displaced flow of oil for accurate adjustment of the compression circuit.

    The same reliance on a bumpstop would be true for any other non-positional damper, such as an Elka Stage 5. Taking the Elka as an example, it allows fine adjustment of the high and low speed compressions to match terrain, riding style and blending in with the bumpstop. The difference is that the Elka is custom valved to be in the ball park and then is fine adjusted on the adjusters. The CCDB doesn't need custom valving because it has the best wide-range adjustment system on the market (because of that big compression oil flow thing).

    Horses for courses. I wouldn't be worried in running any of Elka, CCDB, Avy or a S'Toy, appropriately set up. There are now air options that seem to have reputations far removed from their cross-country brethren; I'm thinking of the Vivid Air, Vip'r and to some extent the Monarch Plus. These won't make any specific provision for big riders and bottom out because there is nowhere to package a bumpstop that doesn't alter the spring curve. While they may be good for general riding, for aggressive stuff a coil with a good bumpstop looks like the best option.

    Just IMO and according to "theory". I certainly don't think there is any reason to avoid the CCDB. Personally I am looking at a S'Toy to match my Deville up front but it is a close call vs. the CCDB apart from the pimp S'Toy colours.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by petercarm View Post
    The CCDB has a high speed shim stack on its piston for both comp and rebound. This should be set for your weight and bike's leverage. You can just write that off to black art.

    The CCDB needs an appropriate bumpstop for your weight and for the bikes' leverage curve. More black art required.

    After that, the CCDB at default settings will be pretty damn good and will be tunable. By this stage you will be benefitting from the CCDB's use of the full displaced flow of oil for accurate adjustment of the compression circuit.
    That would be great but as far as I know it's not possible: Cane Creek does not modify the piston shimstack for leverage ratio and/or rider weight. They use the same stack for every CCDB they sell.

    In my experience, the CCDB is not going to be the best shock for a bike with a flat rate such as the SB-66. I have a 303 RDH, which also has a pretty flat linkage and I have experimented with a CCDB as well as Fox DHX5 and RC4, and Elka Stage 5.

    The CCDB was by far the most sensitive shock of the bunch and I tried everything to make it work but even after extensive conversations with Malcolm, the performance was just disappointing with this specific linkage. It used too much travel all the time; it's not even a question of hard bottom outs, it just makes the chassis less responsive and requires more rider input. I could not achieve an acceptable compromise between snappy handling, control in g-outs and harsh landings, and smoothness of the suspension over deep square edge hits.

    I asked Malcolm if it was possible to change IFP depth or pressure, whic would have helped quite a bit to tune the spring curve, but he said that it could not be done. I tried several spring rates and damping combinations but ultimately I gave up. Malcolm himself said on the phone that they can't make a shock that will work perfectly with every frame on the market. That shock is now doing an incredible job on my wife's Ventana El Cuervo, which has a very progressive linkage.

    The RC4 has great HS control and the wide shock shaft displaces a ton of oil which results in a good ramp-up at the end of the stroke. It's also possible to make this shock quite linear, if one so chooses by dropping the pressure in the IFP to the minimum and making the bottom-out chamber as big as possible. The main gripe I had with the RC4 was that it's not a very smooth and sensitive shock, it really transmits a lot of choppy trail input to the frame, even with the lighter damping of the 2011 model (this one was off of a Turner DW DHR).

    The Elka stage 5 is the shock I ended up settling on. For me, it offered the best compromise. It's not as sensitive as the CCDB but on the 303 RDH with its linear linkage it offers substantially better chassis control than the CCDB. The Elka doesn't quite ramp up as much as the RC4 but it's smoother and has a great HS circuit. The progressive rebound damping also allows for an extremely lively ride without compromising handling after deep travel hits. Elka recommends a MC10/MR20 damping profile for the 303 but I opted for slightly heavier compression stack for control (MC20/MR20) at the expense of comfort.

    I agree with petercarm that ultimately these are all high-performance shocks and that any of them will be an excellent option, but if going for an aftermarket upgrade I think one should take into account the linkage characteristics and match the shock that best complements them.

    Personally, I think the upcoming CCDB Air will be a killer option for the SB-66 (as well as the 303 RDH and I am planning on testing it if I can get my hands on one unit of the right size). Being able to tune the spring curve together with the wide range of damping profiles will make for an amazingly versatile shock.


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    Quote Originally Posted by nybike1971 View Post
    That would be great but as far as I know it's not possible: Cane Creek does not modify the piston shimstack for leverage ratio and/or rider weight. They use the same stack for every CCDB they sell.

    In my experience, the CCDB is not going to be the best shock for a bike with a flat rate such as the SB-66. I have a 303 RDH, which also has a pretty flat linkage and I have experimented with a CCDB as well as Fox DHX5 and RC4, and Elka Stage 5.

    The CCDB was by far the most sensitive shock of the bunch and I tried everything to make it work but even after extensive conversations with Malcolm, the performance was just disappointing with this specific linkage. It used too much travel all the time; it's not even a question of hard bottom outs, it just makes the chassis less responsive and requires more rider input. I could not achieve an acceptable compromise between snappy handling, control in g-outs and harsh landings, and smoothness of the suspension over deep square edge hits.

    I asked Malcolm if it was possible to change IFP depth or pressure, whic would have helped quite a bit to tune the spring curve, but he said that it could not be done. I tried several spring rates and damping combinations but ultimately I gave up. Malcolm himself said on the phone that they can't make a shock that will work perfectly with every frame on the market. That shock is now doing an incredible job on my wife's Ventana El Cuervo, which has a very progressive linkage.

    The RC4 has great HS control and the wide shock shaft displaces a ton of oil which results in a good ramp-up at the end of the stroke. It's also possible to make this shock quite linear, if one so chooses by dropping the pressure in the IFP to the minimum and making the bottom-out chamber as big as possible. The main gripe I had with the RC4 was that it's not a very smooth and sensitive shock, it really transmits a lot of choppy trail input to the frame, even with the lighter damping of the 2011 model (this one was off of a Turner DW DHR).

    The Elka stage 5 is the shock I ended up settling on. For me, it offered the best compromise. It's not as sensitive as the CCDB but on the 303 RDH with its linear linkage it offers substantially better chassis control than the CCDB. The Elka doesn't quite ramp up as much as the RC4 but it's smoother and has a great HS circuit. The progressive rebound damping also allows for an extremely lively ride without compromising handling after deep travel hits. Elka recommends a MC10/MR20 damping profile for the 303 but I opted for slightly heavier compression stack for control (MC20/MR20) at the expense of comfort.

    I agree with petercarm that ultimately these are all high-performance shocks and that any of them will be an excellent option, but if going for an aftermarket upgrade I think one should take into account the linkage characteristics and match the shock that best complements them.

    Personally, I think the upcoming CCDB Air will be a killer option for the SB-66 (as well as the 303 RDH and I am planning on testing it if I can get my hands on one unit of the right size). Being able to tune the spring curve together with the wide range of damping profiles will make for an amazingly versatile shock.

    I know what you are talking about with the SB66 using its travel. However, dialing in a little more LSC seems to assist with this somewhat. It keeps it a little higher in the travel until it hits a square edge or high speed impact.

    I am seriously considering trying the CCDB on a friends IBIS MOJO HD. I'm curious how that bike would feel with the CCDB. Hopefully not to good. I don't want to sell the SB yet. Maybe I shouldn't test it. :-)

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by nybike1971 View Post
    Personally, I think the upcoming CCDB Air will be a killer option for the SB-66 (as well as the 303 RDH and I am planning on testing it if I can get my hands on one unit of the right size). Being able to tune the spring curve together with the wide range of damping profiles will make for an amazingly versatile shock.
    I think you could be right, but there is always the danger of the bottom out control being linked to the sag, which air cans cannot get away from, and this is a problem for heavier riders.

    Thanks for the great points above, too...

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by nybike1971 View Post
    The Elka stage 5 is the shock I ended up settling on. For me, it offered the best compromise. It's not as sensitive as the CCDB but on the 303 RDH with its linear linkage it offers substantially better chassis control than the CCDB. The Elka doesn't quite ramp up as much as the RC4 but it's smoother and has a great HS circuit. The progressive rebound damping also allows for an extremely lively ride without compromising handling after deep travel hits. Elka recommends a MC10/MR20 damping profile for the 303 but I opted for slightly heavier compression stack for control (MC20/MR20) at the expense of comfort.

    exactly my line of throughout so...executed perfectly
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails CCDB on SB-66 wins again!-077.jpg  


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    Quote Originally Posted by aappling72 View Post
    I am seriously considering trying the CCDB on a friends IBIS MOJO HD. I'm curious how that bike would feel with the CCDB. Hopefully not to good. I don't want to sell the SB yet. Maybe I shouldn't test it. :-)
    Go ahead without fear. People has tested it and...HD is just designed for air.

  32. #32
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    aappling72....making me so proud to call Asheville home (CC and S.EX.). Too bad I haven't been able to find a SB-66 to demo around here. Hopefully Yeti will bring the demo fleet here soon.

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    Fork?

    What did Suspension Experts do to your fork? Did you take the Avy cart out and put the MCDH cart back in?

    Any more comparisons between the two fork options? Running a Lyrik SA DH right now and considering one of these options.

    Thanks for your time and input.

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by G-AIR View Post
    What did Suspension Experts do to your fork? Did you take the Avy cart out and put the MCDH cart back in?

    Any more comparisons between the two fork options? Running a Lyrik SA DH right now and considering one of these options.

    Thanks for your time and input.
    Yes, I took the Avy cartridge out and had Suspension experts do some modding on the Lyrik. I am liking the Lyrik much better now, but I also rode a friends 2012 55 RC3 Ti that a bud of his who works for Marzocchi did a pro tune on and it had the Open bath somoothness that Marz used to be famous for plus some. Might snatch up a marz and do a fork test. Another fork I was thinking of testing out is the Bos Deville. Concerned about warranty mainly if something happened. But the reviews are amazing.

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    How did you end up with the Ti coil? Cane Creek's site says they are only available in 3 and 3.5 ".

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    Quick question, what did you feel was lacking with the Yeti when you were running the fox? I seemed to be blowing through the travel on mute MI trails running 50 pounds over my weight on the rp23. Thought it was blown, Yeti told me to talk to fox, fox took it apart said it was fine, just valved too light for a guy weighting 180.... seriously??? It also bobbed more than my 1997 trek y bike on concrete, so not sure if I should have it revolved or spring for the CCDB air.....Any advice would be awesome!

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtber1510 View Post
    Quick question, what did you feel was lacking with the Yeti when you were running the fox? I seemed to be blowing through the travel on mute MI trails running 50 pounds over my weight on the rp23. Thought it was blown, Yeti told me to talk to fox, fox took it apart said it was fine, just valved too light for a guy weighting 180.... seriously??? It also bobbed more than my 1997 trek y bike on concrete, so not sure if I should have it revolved or spring for the CCDB air.....Any advice would be awesome!
    I spent two weeks riding an SB-66 and had your same experience. Even the most trivial drops to flat would blow through all the travel. The linear rate of the linkage doesn't help with bottom out control. Regardless of which air shock you go with, if it was my bike I would focus on changing the spring curve of the shock to make the shock rate at the wheel more progressive.

    I weigh 170lbs and ran anywhere between 165psi and 180psi. For the bike to pedal well and not feel harsh I settled on 175psi but at this pressure, even a 2 foot drop would blow through all the travel. Mind you, I never felt a harsh bottom out but I don't like not having any travel reserve for when I do need it on a harsher hit or my screw up. If it was my bike, I would start by shimming the RP23 to reduce the air chamber volume and make it more progressive. Fox sells the kits or you can just use some flexible plastic in the space between the outer sleeve and the inner air canister.

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtber1510 View Post
    Quick question, what did you feel was lacking with the Yeti when you were running the fox? I seemed to be blowing through the travel on mute MI trails running 50 pounds over my weight on the rp23. Thought it was blown, Yeti told me to talk to fox, fox took it apart said it was fine, just valved too light for a guy weighting 180.... seriously??? It also bobbed more than my 1997 trek y bike on concrete, so not sure if I should have it revolved or spring for the CCDB air.....Any advice would be awesome!
    As NY said, the SB is very linear and needs bottom out support. I noticed when you got it to the 25% sag mark it pedaled amazing but felt really harsh over chatter and didn't track as well as I would have hoped. So I switched to coil. I got an Avy Chubie first, then put a CCDB on and stayed with that. I ultimately sold the SB and went with the MOJO HD which suited my riding style better. I now have the CCDB Air on it and can tell you for a bike designed around air, this is the shock to have. I weigh 180 geared up and I am running 138psi to get 30% sag and it tracks like the back tire has taffy on it. More sag its super plush, less and it still tracks well but pedals great. I would STRONGLY consider the CCDB Air. Call Kevin at Suspension Experts Home Page. He will take care of you. And, they are right down the street from cane creek!!!

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    I ended up going with a Pushed Monarch Plus. Just got the shock but have been on the injured list. I'm just now starting to ride again so I'll have see how it performs long term.

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    Quote Originally Posted by trailbrain View Post
    I ended up going with a Pushed Monarch Plus. Just got the shock but have been on the injured list. I'm just now starting to ride again so I'll have see how it performs long term.
    Heal up, man! Looking forward to having you back out soon!

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    Wanted to thank everyone for the heads up. Still find it crazy some have suggested the can shims, while fox told me that was the cheap fix and only revalving would fix the issue. I think I will fix the issue and get the ccdb air since I can adjust it better and that can only improve the overall platform. Hell I am still in love with my 5th element on a heckler! I am sure the ccdb air will blow the rp23 out of the water!

  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtber1510 View Post
    Wanted to thank everyone for the heads up. Still find it crazy some have suggested the can shims, while fox told me that was the cheap fix and only revalving would fix the issue. I think I will fix the issue and get the ccdb air since I can adjust it better and that can only improve the overall platform. Hell I am still in love with my 5th element on a heckler! I am sure the ccdb air will blow the rp23 out of the water!
    You'll love the CCDB Air. You getting it from Suspension Experts Home Page. Call Kevin. He's great!

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    How much does the DBAir go for?

  44. #44
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    Just to put another option into the mix:
    Bos mountain bike suspensions

    WOW!

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    Quote Originally Posted by hssp View Post
    Just to put another option into the mix:
    Bos mountain bike suspensions

    WOW!
    They don't do a 215x63.5 in the new shock, which is a shame. I'm looking for an improvement over the rp23 to better match the Deville that I have up front.

    Vip'r is tempting but all this talk of coils keeps sounding like the correct end point to aim for. S'toy is available in the right size for the SB66.

    Sent from my GT-N7000 using Tapatalk

  46. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by petercarm View Post
    They don't do a 215x63.5 in the new shock, which is a shame. I'm looking for an improvement over the rp23 to better match the Deville that I have up front.

    Vip'r is tempting but all this talk of coils keeps sounding like the correct end point to aim for. S'toy is available in the right size for the SB66.
    DANG! Oh well, I'll save som grams and go for the Vip'R instead. I have high thoughts for the Vip'R, as BOS seems to know their business for tuning spring curves. The Deville has a very linear spring curve for an air fork, and that gives me hope for the Vip'R. Light, coil like suspension sounds just great in my opinion.

  47. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by mahrous View Post
    How much does the DBAir go for?
    $650 retail

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    aappling72, I will be going through my road bike racing team shop, they are giving me full discout, pretty hard to beat. I guess there are some benefits of riding a road bike!

    Anyone want an Fox rp23 ridden twice or a pair of DT Swiss M1900 15mm thru axle never pedaled. Smoking deals available!

  49. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by mtber1510 View Post
    aappling72, I will be going through my road bike racing team shop, they are giving me full discout, pretty hard to beat. I guess there are some benefits of riding a road bike!

    Anyone want an Fox rp23 ridden twice or a pair of DT Swiss M1900 15mm thru axle never pedaled. Smoking deals available!
    Por favor, start a new thread with the CCDB air when you get a chance. Grassy a$$
    Get a bicycle. You will not regret it, if you live. ~Mark Twain, "Taming the Bicycle"


    www.yeticycles.com

  50. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by snigs View Post
    Por favor, start a new thread with the CCDB air when you get a chance. Grassy a$$
    I did here

    Mojo HD and CCDB Air!!!

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