Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 26 to 50 of 62
  1. #26
    NONDURO
    Reputation: Leopold Porkstacker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    6,622
    Singlespeed up hills does really well for strength training.
    QUOTE from MTBR.COM: You have given out too much Reputation in the last 24 hours, try again later.

  2. #27
    Always Learning
    Reputation: BruceBrown's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,916
    Quote Originally Posted by kingkongsfinger View Post
    Hi,

    Has anyone got any weight lifting programmes for legs, if possible one that can be done at home and not in a gym.

    Im 42 been racing around 10 years and want to have some more power, and something to do when its really bad weather outside or I only have 30-45 mins to spare. (For fitness level references I get into the top 10 in local MTB races and scrape top 20 in national events. Sub hour 25 mile TT and 21.30 min 10 mile TT)

    I would like more power and maybe a bit more definition (for vainty)

    Cheers.
    Absolutely do it at home. 30-45 minutes is a good amount of time to do this. If you start going beyond that time frame there are diminishing returns, so your time budget is perfect.

    You can start with hand held weights, free weights - whatever you have room for in your home (garage, shed, basement, etc...). Good idea for testosterone production and bone density for us old guys (over 40 that is).

    My basement "home gym" has built up over the years. Started with hand held weights and a treadmill, and it has grown (used by the entire family these days).


    HomeGymWeights by BBcamerata, on Flickr

    Lunges, squats, dead lifts, core workout, upper body toning - Morris and Friel both outline it pretty well for cycling specific weight work.

    Using the periodization approach, the first weeks may only be lifting the Olympic bar, and very "entry level" amounts of mass so that the body adapts and sets the stage for adding weight.

    Again - you don't need a lot of equipment and can easily begin with hand held weights and or a cheap set of free weights. Add a rack/bench later if you find you are benefitting from it all and like it.

    BB

  3. #28
    mtbr member
    Reputation: limba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    2,915
    Nice. You can also use medicine balls or kettle bells for your weights/resistance.

  4. #29
    mtbr member
    Reputation: thesnail's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    20
    I don't know if lifting helps or not but luckily I have access to a gym at lunch so it doesn't really afffect the rest of my training. I'm almost 45 so I like to do a lot of reps for upper body(usually around 20), I'm not trying to build muscle, just look good for the ladies and have some strength for Mt bike handling and cross. During cross season and into the spring I do legs hard on Monday(leg press, curl and reverse curl, bout 8 reps), then a 30 min easy easy spin on the trainer. Wednesday I just do leg press, except after cross season then I do legs hard twice a week.

  5. #30
    RTM
    RTM is offline
    #1 Latex Salesman
    Reputation: RTM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    1,556
    I like the guy who said, rule 2. Don't get hurt. Man that is so true. I've been lifting for a sport since I was in high school. I've done some really stupid things, including herniated discs in my lower back that now PREVENT me from playing some of the sports I love.
    Oh the irony...

    Anyway, I'm now 41 and much wiser. And I'm actually in my best shape and feel better than I have in years. One resource I find helpful is the men's health book of exercises. It's largely geared toward total body fitness. A pretty dramatic difference from the way we learned to lift in the mid to late 80's. The Weider principals are fine, but for real world fitness, sports power, injury prevention and longevity, there is definitely a whole new school of thought. It's mostly about getting off the benches and seats. And it is VERY effective.

    ps - just wanted to mention a probably little known one of my favorites. reverse lunge with your back foot in a TRX-type suspension training strap. All around fantastic for riding, running, etc.

    - Rob
    Last edited by RTM; 12-04-2012 at 08:10 AM.
    "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of a low price is forgotten." - Benjamin Franklin

  6. #31
    Giant Anthem
    Reputation: 2fst4u's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    701
    Lift 2x per week when base training-full body. Adjust your leg workouts to where your not destroyed the next day-minor soreness is ok but if your really fatigued your going to hard. I do 4 sets of legs twice a week 2 sets of squats and 2 sets of stiff leg deads. I've lifted a lot before I was a cyclist so soon as I start doing legs they puff up so a lot isn't necessary for me but yeah the little bit I do helps a lot with general fitness, health/ knee health/ short climbs/ standing on the bike etc..

    "Cyclist Robert Forstemann and his freakish quads are trending today"
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Racing and Training Blog
    http://dirtandgears.blogspot.com/

  7. #32
    mtbr member
    Reputation: kingkongsfinger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Posts
    48
    Superb information here, thanks alot.

    Going to digest it all and choose some of the exersizes.

    Great idea to do weights the same day after a hard session while still warm and then recover the day after.

    Thanks for all the info, links etc. Will start a small program.

    Cheers.
    Trek Top Fuel - Santa Cruz Blur -Chinese FLYXII 29er

  8. #33
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    266
    generally its better to lift BEFORE a hard workout. I usually lift, then go straight onto the trainer and hit my hard training. The possition might affect your lifting, but the lifting wont affect your bike power

  9. #34
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    480
    As you get older and ride more, doing some winter work on the core and opposing muscles is really smart. It helps prevent injury when you crash, improves posture and reduces loss of bone density.

    You don't need to do a lot, just enough to balance yourself back out. If you want to hit your legs a little more, it won't hurt and may (or not) help your cycling performance.

    For a rider with just 45 mins to invest, 2x20 at tempo or higher with a quick cool down on the trainer is the best bang this time of year.

  10. #35
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    799
    I think Friel and anyone else that say mimic bike riding knee angle with squats is wrong. What about bench press....don't bend elbows past mountain biking angle? Give me a break.

    Squats are done with hip joint below knee joint to fully engage adductors, abductors, and hamstrings to ensure a safe, powerful motion. This creates a balanced force on the knees and hips. Look up Mark Rippetoe if you actually want to know how to squat or deadlift. Ass to grass is also wrong, you lose the bracing effect of the spine that low down.

    But, ah, the lifting. I've done it and felt it was pointless and wore me out (Morris). Right now I do KB swings a few times a week and would do deadlifts if I had a bar around.

    MTB needs exercises that complement cycling, which is not the same as mimic it. If you are trying to mimic it, you guessed it, riding a bike works well.

  11. #36
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    552

    If I had a bar around...

    Quote Originally Posted by Johnny K View Post
    I think Friel and anyone else that say mimic bike riding knee angle with squats is wrong. What about bench press....don't bend elbows past mountain biking angle? Give me a break.

    Squats are done with hip joint below knee joint to fully engage adductors, abductors, and hamstrings to ensure a safe, powerful motion. This creates a balanced force on the knees and hips. Look up Mark Rippetoe if you actually want to know how to squat or deadlift. Ass to grass is also wrong, you lose the bracing effect of the spine that low down.

    But, ah, the lifting. I've done it and felt it was pointless and wore me out (Morris). Right now I do KB swings a few times a week and would do deadlifts if I had a bar around.

    MTB needs exercises that complement cycling, which is not the same as mimic it. If you are trying to mimic it, you guessed it, riding a bike works well.
    Sounds like you do a lot of reading.

    DeFranco's Training - Ask Joe 03.24.06
    you can "control F" keywords "sport specific"

    Per DeFranco
    The Cliff Notes version of my little rant is this…”Sport-specific training in the weight room is ********! Get strong in the weight room using the most economical exercises and then make that strength “sport-specific” by practicing the technical aspects of your sport separately!” Simple enough?

  12. #37
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    799
    Yeah. Agree with defranco

  13. #38
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    552

    Squat deep?

    Quote Originally Posted by SkiNBike View Post
    Haha.
    T NATION | Does Everyone Need To Squat (Deep)?

  14. #39
    Always Learning
    Reputation: BruceBrown's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,916
    Quote Originally Posted by kingkongsfinger View Post
    Superb information here, thanks alot.

    Going to digest it all and choose some of the exersizes.

    Great idea to do weights the same day after a hard session while still warm and then recover the day after.

    Thanks for all the info, links etc. Will start a small program.

    Cheers.
    Curious if you had chosen some exercises and started yet. There are always a lot of opinions when it comes to lifting and cycling, but consider the professional cycling coaches that pretty much always include lifting in the off season plans for Masters (40+) mountain bikers. What do they know that the opinions don't know?

    A good sample program for a 12 week base building plan for Masters 40+ mountain bike riders that includes the traditional periodized weight lifting plan, mixed with riding would be the one available from LW Coaching. Lynda Wallenfells posts from time to time here on MTBR.com and if you purchase the plan and sign up for her website forums - personal attention is included via question and answer format. You can download the sample .pdf file which lists the first 2 weeks of the 12 week plan to see how they integrate weights and on the bike time (and recovery).

    I don't recall reading any plan (Morris, Friel, LW, etc....) that suggests lifting and then riding hard on the same day for any Masters athlete. I guess it depends on the definition of "hard". But assuming "hard" means intensity, wouldn't too much muscle tearing be done from lifting and riding hard on the same day? This would take too long to recover from for the older athlete and trash the rest of the week's training. Maybe when one was younger, but not for the older athlete. Recovery rides/spins after lifting on the same day - yes, but doing hard riding following lifting? Hmmmm....probably not a problem if lifts were only upper body, but if the muscles were already torn down with lower body lifts - I'd like to see the professional cycling coaches who advocate that for the older guys.

  15. #40
    Helmetless Crasher
    Reputation: Stumpjumpy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    1,070
    Yeah, can't imagine lower-body lifting and high intensity riding on the same day. Whichever is done subsequent would be a vastly suboptimal effort on spent legs with vastly diminished returns.
    '95 M2 StumpJumper FS
    '11 Cannondale RZ 120-two

  16. #41
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    266
    Quote Originally Posted by Stumpjumpy View Post
    Yeah, can't imagine lower-body lifting and high intensity riding on the same day. Whichever is done subsequent would be a vastly suboptimal effort on spent legs with vastly diminished returns.
    it depends on the type of effort you'll be doing on the bike.

    Lifting will recruit all type of muscle fiber and certainly fatigue you, but you will still have enough energy for certain type of effort on the bike.

    I lift heavy, think 5-6 reps and I often train after my lifting on the bike, doing short L6 power micro intervals with short recovery, I only do a total of 4-7min of total time spent at L6 power. If I dont lift prior, I hit the same power at same RPE.

  17. #42
    Give it a crank
    Reputation: Mtn-Rider's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    2,913
    Quote Originally Posted by Stumpjumpy View Post
    Yeah, can't imagine lower-body lifting and high intensity riding on the same day. Whichever is done subsequent would be a vastly suboptimal effort on spent legs with vastly diminished returns.
    Me neither, every time I try both on the same day the lifting gets painful, heavy arm curls become impossible. There's something about a bumpy ride messing with muscles, tendons, and ligaments that demand a day of rest.

  18. #43
    DLd
    DLd is offline
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    980
    Quote Originally Posted by kingkongsfinger View Post
    Superb information here, thanks alot.

    Going to digest it all and choose some of the exersizes.

    Great idea to do weights the same day after a hard session while still warm and then recover the day after.

    Thanks for all the info, links etc. Will start a small program.

    Cheers.
    If lifting right after riding just be sure you're not so fatigued that you sacrifice form and safety. Otherwise later in the day (2 a day approach) might be better. It depends what you're doing. In general, I think strength-building workouts on the bike are better. Hard hill repeats where you can just maintain 50rpm is one type. Focus on what's appropriate for the types of races you'll be doing. If you've got races coming up with 5000ft+ of climbing for example, you probably don't want to be piling on extra mass, you'd get more benefit from long climbing workouts, while a course with short, powerful, technical sections (some uphill steps type of scenarios) might benefit from the workout above.
    "Great things are not accomplished by those who yield to trends and fads and popular opinion."-Jack Kerouac

  19. #44
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    266
    weight lifting has little to nothing to do with bike power. Lift, sure, but dont expect it to inprove your cycling. Do it for the right reasons.

    Lift heavy and stay tiny

  20. #45
    Always Learning
    Reputation: BruceBrown's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    8,916
    Quote Originally Posted by Devincicx View Post
    weight lifting has little to nothing to do with bike power. Lift, sure, but dont expect it to inprove your cycling. Do it for the right reasons.
    Correct, for the Masters Athlete during the off season - lifting has little to do with cycling (outside of sprints and short steep climbs), but everything to do with testosterone production and bone density. Both of those are worth it for the over 40 crowd male cyclist of which the OP mentioned he was.

    And the OP did mention one of his goals included vanity.

  21. #46
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    266
    weight lifting has little to do with endurance cycling sprints and steep hills, same goes for bone density. Weight lifting is not an impact activity, unless you do plyos etc. You're better off running or playing impact sports such as badminton, for bone density.

    As for sprints and steep hills involved in endurance cycling discipline, nothing to do with legs size/strength. Power production relies on metabolical processes, not muscle contraction absolute force.

    Sorry to play the smartass there

  22. #47
    mtbr member
    Reputation: pattongb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    590
    Quote Originally Posted by Devincicx View Post
    weight lifting has little to nothing to do with bike power. Lift, sure, but dont expect it to inprove your cycling. Do it for the right reasons.

    Lift heavy and stay tiny
    Im sorry but: Wrong Wrong and Wrong!

    Overall fitness will CERTAINLY help improve your cycling; including lifting weights. Anything that improves your ability to delay lactic acid build up in your muscles and improves your cardiovascular fitness will help you ride better.

    The ability to push your body that little bit extra say on a hill or on sprint to the finish can be mimicked by exertion in the gym. So when your pushing yourself to do that one last rep you are better preparing yourself for pushing yourself on the bike.

    Now you can argue that there is no direct correlation to increased power output due to specific weight lifting exercises, but to say that improving overall general fitness will not improve someones biking is just being foolish.

    One final note: Lean muscle burns more calories pound for pound than fat. So lifting to add lean muscle will give a rider an additional advantage of being able to keep weight off easier. For a lot of us that is a much needed bonus.

    OP, lift away and as many here have said, try not to gain too much weight.
    People ask me all the time "who beat you up"? I tell them "a tree". They just look at me funny....

  23. #48
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    266
    Quote Originally Posted by pattongb View Post
    Im sorry but: Wrong Wrong and Wrong!

    Overall fitness will CERTAINLY help improve your cycling; including lifting weights. Anything that improves your ability to delay lactic acid build up in your muscles and improves your cardiovascular fitness will help you ride better.

    The ability to push your body that little bit extra say on a hill or on sprint to the finish can be mimicked by exertion in the gym. So when your pushing yourself to do that one last rep you are better preparing yourself for pushing yourself on the bike.

    Now you can argue that there is no direct correlation to increased power output due to specific weight lifting exercises, but to say that improving overall general fitness will not improve someones biking is just being foolish.

    One final note: Lean muscle burns more calories pound for pound than fat. So lifting to add lean muscle will give a rider an additional advantage of being able to keep weight off easier. For a lot of us that is a much needed bonus.

    OP, lift away and as many here have said, try not to gain too much weight.
    In all due respect, you should be more careful before saying someone is plain wrong, especially with such statements. That being said, it all comes down to who you are and what you need, but generally:

    Overall fitness and general conditioning will certainly improve your bike fitness IF you're untrained or quite new to the sport. Doing general conditioning, cross-training, weight lifting, etc, will be better then doing nothing at all and sitting on the couch. But the fact is you need to ride your bike if you want to be a faster bike rider. Time spent on the bike is way better then doing general sport activities, think specificity (more on that in a few sec).

    Lactic acid does'nt actually do you any harm or make you feel anything.

    Why waste time and "push your body" through that last rep when you could push your body through that last grueling interval on the bike? Aerobic fitness is very sport specific, therefore you need to train specificaly to improve your sport performance. Cycling has its whole neuromuscular specificity that cant be replicated in the gym. Forces involved are very specific, velocity and muscle contraction angle are too. A lot of good bike rider would be average runner and shitty swimmer.

    Improving overall general fitness, like previously said, will help IF your untrained. If you've been training for a few years, then becoming a more powerful and faster bike rider should be done mainly via cycling training, not any other kind of "detraining" activity.

    More lean muscle generally also means a lower w/kg ratio which is overly important in MTB riding/racing/performance. Sure it might burn energy better/faster, but if you're already at a healthy weight, why bother? Riding your bike would also burn decent energy. An hour of weight lifting will burn roughly 350-450 cal for the average weight male while an hour riding your bike at a modest 150W will burn 550 cal. Throw in a few intervals and you easily hit 700-900 cal for an hour.

    Finaly, once again, weight lifting wont improve your bike performance as would riding your bike in a significant maner would. But it really depends on who you are and what your specific need/goals are too. Just dont fool yourself thinking if you have stronger legs you will go faster on a bicycle, its plain nuts.

    *disclaimer: I lift weights, I do plyos, I do cross-fit stuff, I like it, but I dont expect it to improve my cycling.

    ** disregard my whole post if generating more power on a bicycle does not matter to you

  24. #49
    mtbr member
    Reputation: pattongb's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    590
    Quote Originally Posted by Devincicx View Post
    In all due respect, you should be more careful before saying someone is plain wrong, especially with such statements. That being said, it all comes down to who you are and what you need, but generally:

    Overall fitness and general conditioning will certainly improve your bike fitness IF you're untrained or quite new to the sport. Doing general conditioning, cross-training, weight lifting, etc, will be better then doing nothing at all and sitting on the couch. But the fact is you need to ride your bike if you want to be a faster bike rider. Time spent on the bike is way better then doing general sport activities, think specificity (more on that in a few sec).

    Lactic acid does'nt actually do you any harm or make you feel anything.

    Why waste time and "push your body" through that last rep when you could push your body through that last grueling interval on the bike? Aerobic fitness is very sport specific, therefore you need to train specificaly to improve your sport performance. Cycling has its whole neuromuscular specificity that cant be replicated in the gym. Forces involved are very specific, velocity and muscle contraction angle are too. A lot of good bike rider would be average runner and shitty swimmer.

    Improving overall general fitness, like previously said, will help IF your untrained. If you've been training for a few years, then becoming a more powerful and faster bike rider should be done mainly via cycling training, not any other kind of "detraining" activity.

    More lean muscle generally also means a lower w/kg ratio which is overly important in MTB riding/racing/performance. Sure it might burn energy better/faster, but if you're already at a healthy weight, why bother? Riding your bike would also burn decent energy. An hour of weight lifting will burn roughly 350-450 cal for the average weight male while an hour riding your bike at a modest 150W will burn 550 cal. Throw in a few intervals and you easily hit 700-900 cal for an hour.

    Finaly, once again, weight lifting wont improve your bike performance as would riding your bike in a significant maner would. But it really depends on who you are and what your specific need/goals are too. Just dont fool yourself thinking if you have stronger legs you will go faster on a bicycle, its plain nuts.

    *disclaimer: I lift weights, I do plyos, I do cross-fit stuff, I like it, but I dont expect it to improve my cycling.

    ** disregard my whole post if generating more power on a bicycle does not matter to you
    Sorry it was not my intention to be "gruff" or to put anyone down.

    The better your overall fitness the quicker your body recovers from lactic acid build up, which is the #1 enemy of a mountain bike racer.

    Unless you have 4-7% body fat and are ripped like a MMA banterweight, I dont know how anyone could possibly say that improving overall fitness will NOT improve cycling.

    Im not fitness expert, but it just doesnt make sense to me.

    Finally, and not to be argumentive, but having years and years of experience training in the gym for semi-pro football, rugby, and US Army Infantry field deployments, I can assure you that you absolutely CAN replicate "pushing your limits" in the gym. Is it the exact same as the circumstance where you will use the extra "push", like that last 10 meters of a long uphill climb? No of course not. But again, your overall ability to overcome fatigue in your body can be strengthened in the gym. I have done it many many many times. Not only the physical ability to push just a bit harder, but the mental ability as well.

    Thanks. Just my 2 cents. Im no pro biker and im lucky if i have 17% body fat so i cant claim to know for sure if my beliefs translate to mountain biking. I just dont see how they couldnt....
    People ask me all the time "who beat you up"? I tell them "a tree". They just look at me funny....

  25. #50
    mtbr member
    Reputation: limba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    2,915
    You guys don't have to quote each other. Especially if the other expert wrote a book.

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 1 2 3 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •