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  1. #1
    LMN
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    Tuesday Workouts

    What was on tap for the night?

    Myself, Trainer ride:
    10 minute w.p.
    3x2 minutes @175, 200, 225 watts with 2 minutes between each rep.
    4x8 minutes @200/205, 205/210, 210/215, 215/220 (increased wattage to second level at four minutes) 2 minutes rest between reps.
    10 minute w.d.


    Not a particularly hard workout, but effective at this time of year. I find in December I have to be quite kind to myself when on the trainer. If I over due it early on I find it hard to get back on the trainer.

  2. #2
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    Tuesday night for me.

    1.5 hours on the rollers, 150-190W, with some low cadence stuff.

    1 hour weight room.

    Lotsa fun.
    Head Coach, Ben Lomond HS MTB Team
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    http://www.roostersbikersedge.com/

  3. #3
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    Our club rents an indoor facility every Tuesday night during the winter months to get together with trainers or rollers and run through a program of some kind for about an hour, plus warmup and cooldown on either side. We usually get anywhere from 5-15 members showing up.

    We're 8 weeks in, and have been building on a progression to introduce some intensity back into people's riding 1x per week, after doing mostly casual riding from the latter part of the summer onwards.

    Routines vary by week, but with this being our last night before we break for the holidays we put everyone to the test with a simple 5 reps x 5 min best effort w/ 5 min rest in between each. I found it challenging to maintain a level of output even slightly better than my in season FTP, even with all the rest in between. Good thing I don't have any events of consequence until next June.

    Our program is going to suffer from an enforced break for a few weeks around February again though, as our facility is being taken over solely for use by the winter Olympics during that time.

  4. #4
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    Off!

  5. #5
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    morning run and night xc ski with a buddy- I have no interest in a bike right now.......last year I was on my road bike all winter and it got old quick.
    weights 2x a week also

  6. #6
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    LMN -
    How do those numbers translate to effort levels for you? I'd imagine that even if you are very light, that 200-220 would be at most a light tempo effort, yes?
    I did your 1 hour at LT deal on Sunday to test and find out how much I lost through the fall. Was very pleased to get through it at 4w/kg without any drama. Will try about 5% higher watts next time.
    Thanks
    Dave

  7. #7
    mutaullyassuredsuffering
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    Lt

    Quote Originally Posted by dkri
    LMN -
    How do those numbers translate to effort levels for you? I'd imagine that even if you are very light, that 200-220 would be at most a light tempo effort, yes?
    I did your 1 hour at LT deal on Sunday to test and find out how much I lost through the fall. Was very pleased to get through it at 4w/kg without any drama. Will try about 5% higher watts next time.
    Thanks
    Dave
    LT test in December....Yuk. I'd rather poke my eyes out with shift cable.

    I like that workout LMN. I do something similar and find it's just the right amount of work without forcing me into hating my trainer.
    Free will is an illusion, people will always choose the perceived path of greatest pleasure.

  8. #8
    LA CHÈVRE
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    Tuesday is an easy day for me. About an hour of easy riding outside for commuting and another hour on the trainer doing leg speed work: spin-ups, 10sec max cadence, 60sec one-legged stuff.

    Today, again an hour of commute going a bit harder (in the cold and snow today) and then at least 2 hours of Z2 then some core and a bit of resistance training.

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  9. #9
    CB2
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    My Tuesday workout


  10. #10
    No longer 26
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    Spinervals 1.0
    1 hr of Spinervals Lake Placid ride today.

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  11. #11
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    2hrs endurance, keep the watts over 200. Tonight is the same with 16x12sec seated bursts.. 46x11 from 3mph with 5min rest between. Tomorrow the same with 2x30min Tempo.

    Last night was especially fun, the freezing rain warranted the first night with Studded MTB tires. The weekend snow covered with freezing rain made for a crunchy ride. Schools closed today, but the temps are suppose to get above freezing which will make the road conditions much better for the next 2 nights.. gotta love Winter!

    There is a park near by with a long, fairly straight 6 mile road, and no traffic. Perfect training grounds for when the place is covered in snow and ice.

  12. #12
    TEAM TOPEAK - ERGON
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    Tuesday
    - AM Mito roller ride. 50 min tempo at 240-250 watts
    - Core/gym workout
    - PM 1.5 hr road ride with 60 min sustained 240-286 watt tempo

    Wednesday
    - AM Mito roller ride. 50 min tempo at 240-250 watts
    - Core/gym workout
    - PM road ride with 3 x 20 min high Z3 / low Z4 wattage tempos

  13. #13
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    Jeff, what's a Mito ride?

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  14. #14
    TEAM TOPEAK - ERGON
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan Gerous
    Jeff, what's a Mito ride?
    Instead of me getting long winded on this subject, check out these links which give a good idea of these early AM efforts:

    http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/fitne...cogen_training

    http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/con...ent=a791674884

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by KERKOVEJ
    Instead of me getting long winded on this subject, check out these links which give a good idea of these early AM efforts:

    http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/fitne...cogen_training

    http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/con...ent=a791674884
    Oh I see... I just didn't know the Mito term... Thanks.

    DAN.GEROUS.NET : MOUNTAIN BIKING : CYCLOCROSS : ROAD :

  16. #16
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    Tuesday was a recovery day 1hr easy spin with some one legged work thrown in.

  17. #17
    LMN
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    Quote Originally Posted by dkri
    LMN -
    How do those numbers translate to effort levels for you? I'd imagine that even if you are very light, that 200-220 would be at most a light tempo effort, yes?
    I did your 1 hour at LT deal on Sunday to test and find out how much I lost through the fall. Was very pleased to get through it at 4w/kg without any drama. Will try about 5% higher watts next time.
    Thanks
    Dave
    Effort wise that would be around 80-85%. I could still carry on a broken conversation, but definitely felt a bit of a load. Right now I estimate my FTP to be around 230 watts, compared to a peak in season of 270 watts.

    As I said I tend to be fairly easy on myself when on the trainer. If I do too much I end up not riding the trainer.

  18. #18
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    Yesterday (Tuesday) I did a bit of core exercises (planks, pushups, etc) and today went for a 55 minute run. The middle third of the run was on rocky singletrack. On the last climb before the end of the run I did some Lydiard-style hill-bounding.

  19. #19
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    Static lower body day for me...

    1. Elliptical 800 meters @ Level 15 resistance 2min 45sec
    2. Power Cleans 225x2-245x2 -255x2-265x2-275x2
    3. Box Squat 4x365x2-4x375x2-4x385x2
    4. Front Lunges 100x8-110x6-120x6-130x4
    5. Single Leg Bench Squats (Bodyweight)x8-50x6-60x6-70x4
    6. Straight Leg Deadlift 185x 8-205x6-225x6-245x4
    7. Hamstring Curls 90x 8-100x6-110x6-120x4

    Working between 90% and 95% of my Box Squat 1 rep max(405#). I have 3 weeks of heavy eating left on my mass cycle before I start to whittle it down again and see what's left. Since October I have gained about 30lbs (225-255) and managed to keep some visable abs so I think that its going well. I'm hoping for a 10-15lb gain in muscle.
    Retribution Fitness: Strength, Power, and Purpose
    General fitness workouts posted daily.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yeti2424
    Since October I have gained about 30lbs (225-255) and managed to keep some visable abs so I think that its going well. I'm hoping for a 10-15lb gain in muscle.
    That's a different trend, with most on this board trying to maximize their power to weight ratio.

    After over 35 years of weight training, I quit a little over a year and a half ago. Found I have some potenial on the bike, 70 VO2 max @ age 50, but had a body comp more like football player than an elite cyclist. Since I started racing four years ago I've dropped 25 lbs, probalbly 10 fat/15 muscle. At mid season last year I was 152 lbs and 8% body fat; hoping to get to 145 and 6-7% this year.

    I still do core work and push-ups to balance my cycling-centric workouts.

  21. #21
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    Tuesday as far as this week is a Sub-threshold workout including 2x20 min at 88-94 % of my FTP........

  22. #22
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    Ah, tuesday..
    20 min from 80W with 40W inlcine every three minutes
    5x5 at 370W low 50-60 rpm 2 min rest
    10 min @ 330W 85 rpm
    10 min @ 310W 100 rpm
    15 min recovery
    Bedtime.

  23. #23
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    I prefer the sustained threshhold 8min intervals at 700w with 2 min RBI..........at 90rpm

  24. #24
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    LMN,
    When on the trainer, which bike are you riding?

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by suvowner
    I prefer the sustained threshhold 8min intervals at 700w with 2 min RBI..........at 90rpm
    That's it?

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by stillhardtailing
    That's a different trend, with most on this board trying to maximize their power to weight ratio.

    After over 35 years of weight training, I quit a little over a year and a half ago. Found I have some potenial on the bike, 70 VO2 max @ age 50, but had a body comp more like football player than an elite cyclist. Since I started racing four years ago I've dropped 25 lbs, probalbly 10 fat/15 muscle. At mid season last year I was 152 lbs and 8% body fat; hoping to get to 145 and 6-7% this year.

    I still do core work and push-ups to balance my cycling-centric workouts.
    Totally agree that it's different then most on this forum. However I do more than just cycling and will benefit from the extra mass as long as it ends up being lean muscle. Last year I dropped a bunch of weight (I went from 270 to 255 and then 255 to 225) and really felt the benefit of being lighter and lean. However I came into different situations in various other sports where some additional mass would have been beneficial, (Once again as long as it’s lean) so I adjusted my food intake accordingly. (my workouts have stayed the same) My goal is really to weigh between 230 and 240, be as lean as possible(10% bodyfat or less), and then be able to maintain it.
    Retribution Fitness: Strength, Power, and Purpose
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  27. #27
    LMN
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    Quote Originally Posted by suvowner
    I prefer the sustained threshhold 8min intervals at 700w with 2 min RBI..........at 90rpm
    I like my intervals to follow an Geometric Series for each month.
    December 200 watts, January 400 watts, Feb 800 watts, March 1600 watts, .......

    Same with length of each interval.

  28. #28
    LMN
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    Quote Originally Posted by System
    LMN,
    When on the trainer, which bike are you riding?
    I use my road bike.

    But for Catharine this year I changed the spacing on the rear hub of one of our old road wheels and put it on her MTB for trainer rides. Two reasons for this: first her road SRM is on the fritz and we are waiting for a replacement, only her MTB has a power meter, second it is good to train in the position you race in.

  29. #29
    No. Just No.
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    Quote Originally Posted by LMN
    But for Catharine this year I changed the spacing on the rear hub of one of our old road wheels and put it on her MTB for trainer rides. Two reasons for this: first her road SRM is on the fritz and we are waiting for a replacement, only her MTB has a power meter, second it is good to train in the position you race in.
    I used to do the same with a 130mm spaced 700c road Powertap on my XC hardtail. It was only going to be used for the trainer anyhow, given that it was before Saris made a disc brake model, and I figured that it would have better resale value later than a 135mm model built on to a 26" rim. I just used a couple of big azz washers to take up the slack in the spacing on each side. It wasn't quite dished properly, but given that it was locked on to a trainer all the time anyhow it wasn't even worth the effort to redish. The plan worked out eventually, as I sold it and now have a disc Powertap for MTB.

    BTW, 1600w by March is going to give you a wicked first lap at Salty Dog.

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by LMN
    I like my intervals to follow an Geometric Series for each month.
    December 200 watts, January 400 watts, Feb 800 watts, March 1600 watts, .......

    Same with length of each interval.
    LMAO brilliant........

  31. #31
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    Yeah, I use my road bike, too. Only because I need to get a separate rear wheel set up for my mtn bike. And I need to get a longer steel skewer because the Kinetic trainer doesn't mesh well with my Scott's dropouts.

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by the mayor
    That's it?

    well heck yea, I do it until I can no longer produce 700 watts !!!

  33. #33
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    LMN, is that session you described first with 3x2 followed by more sustained workout your take on the Mito-idea?

    About that Mito-idea... Isn't just a prolonged workout just the same as one session prior to empty the muscles? After my tuesday session I feel pretty empty anyway...

  34. #34
    LMN
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    Quote Originally Posted by kentkreitler
    LMN, is that session you described first with 3x2 followed by more sustained workout your take on the Mito-idea?

    About that Mito-idea... Isn't just a prolonged workout just the same as one session prior to empty the muscles? After my tuesday session I feel pretty empty anyway...
    Personally I don't really buy into the whole Mito-idea.

    For me the 3x2 before hand are there as a warm-up set. I always like to do a little bit of intensity before I start my main set. It makes things easier.

  35. #35
    Mythical Creature
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    Quote Originally Posted by LMN
    What was on tap for the night?
    10 minute w.p.
    3x2 minutes @175, 200, 225 watts with 2 minutes between each rep.
    4x8 minutes @200/205, 205/210, 210/215, 215/220 (increased wattage to second level at four minutes) 2 minutes rest between reps.
    10 minute w.d.
    Like that simple structure and progression; without knowing (well, remembering) how much you weigh - what're those numbers like when looking at your FTP or W/Kg number(s)? Being a big-ish guy (hit 181 on the scale 3 days ago!!!) my w/Kg has never been great - and is seriously in the sh1tter at the weight I'm at now - but I'd guess I'd do the same workout with anywhere from 75-100 more watts, but still not be ANYWHERE near as fast as you!

    FWIW - after a long hiatus, and carrying 10-12 extra pounds *cough ahem* (or more) my P/W number BLOWS!

    Which leads me to todays workout; which unfortunately was my 4-week FTP check (that I haven't done in a year) after a hard day yesterday and little sleep. All factors conspired to work against me, so when I went out too hard (indoors, rollers, resistance, road bike) averaging 365 watts for the first 9-10 minutes I imploded. This was a rather low/conservative number for a typical 20 minute check in the past, but today just about killed me. After backing off substantially trying to get my HR back down from the stratosphere, it was no good. 20 minutes average was 300 watts dead-even. This leads to an all-time low P/W ratio of 3.64 at a weight of 82 or so Kg.

    Summary:
    Weight - 181 = 82.27 Kg
    Power @ 20 minutes - 300 watts (300 X .95 = 285)
    P/W - 3.64


    As an aside, I knew I was out of shape, and over-caffeinated when I hit my all time MHR of 196 (I'm 40 years old) during this aborted test!

    FWIW I used to sit comfortably with a P/W ratio of 4.5 ~ and peaked just a tick over 5 for a few months in 2006. Seems like a LONG way away! That was with an FTP around 340, do the math for the weight. I was skinny ;-)

    Goal? Get that weight down to the low 170's - or 170, and FTP power back up as best I can in coming months, with a training schedule that barely has 8 hours a week set aside... have a new friend / motivator to help slog through the winter here in not-so-sunny Boston, which helps immensely.

    Is this a new / regular thang? Tuesday night check-in? I'll keep an eye out, and keep posts here for the hell of it.

    glen
    Last edited by glenzx; 12-17-2009 at 03:24 PM.
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  36. #36
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    Same Story

    Quote Originally Posted by stillhardtailing
    That's a different trend, with most on this board trying to maximize their power to weight ratio.

    After over 35 years of weight training, I quit a little over a year and a half ago. Found I have some potenial on the bike, 70 VO2 max @ age 50, but had a body comp more like football player than an elite cyclist. Since I started racing four years ago I've dropped 25 lbs, probalbly 10 fat/15 muscle. At mid season last year I was 152 lbs and 8% body fat; hoping to get to 145 and 6-7% this year.

    I still do core work and push-ups to balance my cycling-centric workouts.
    When I started cycling, I was still built like a linebacker. Years of football, lifting weights, and Rock Climbing made me a different body type than I needed to be for this sport. I've dropped 20 lbs over the past few years, without my body fat percentage changing much at all. I quit lifting other than the core work you list above.
    Free will is an illusion, people will always choose the perceived path of greatest pleasure.

  37. #37
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    Glen

    Quote Originally Posted by glenzx
    Like that simple structure and progression; without knowing (well, remembering) how much you weigh - what're those numbers like when looking at your FTP or W/Kg number(s)? Being a big-ish guy (hit 181 on the scale 3 days ago!!!) my w/Kg has never been great - and is seriously in the sh1tter at the weight I'm at now - but I'd guess I'd do the same workout with anywhere from 75-100 more watts, but still not be ANYWHERE near as fast as you!

    FWIW - after a long hiatus, and carrying 10-12 extra pounds *cough ahem* (or more) my P/W number BLOWS!

    Which leads me to todays workout; which unfortunately was my 4-week FTP check (that I haven't done in a year) after a hard day yesterday and little sleep. All factors conspired to work against me, so when I went out too hard (indoors, rollers, resistance, road bike) averaging 365 watts for the first 9-10 minutes I imploded. This was a rather low/conservative number for a typical 20 minute check in the past, but today just about killed me. After backing off substantially trying to get my HR back down from the stratosphere, it was no good. 20 minutes average was 300 watts dead-even. This leads to an all-time low P/W ratio of 3.64 at a weight of 82 or so Kg.

    Summary:
    Weight - 181 = 82.27 Kg
    Power @ 20 minutes - 300 watts (300 X .95 = 285)
    P/W - 3.64


    As an aside, I knew I was out of shape, and over-caffeinated when I hit my all time MHR of 196 (I'm 40 years old) during this aborted test!

    FWIW I used to sit comfortably with a P/W ratio of 4.5 ~ and peaked just a tick over 5 for a few months in 2006. Seems like a LONG way away! That was with an FTP around 340, do the math for the weight. I was skinny ;-)

    Goal? Get that weight down to the low 170's - or 170, and FTP power back up as best I can in coming months, with a training schedule that barely has 8 hours a week set aside... have a new friend / motivator to help slog through the winter here in not-so-sunny Boston, which helps immensely.

    Is this a new / regular thang? Tuesday night check-in? I'll keep an eye out, and keep posts here for the hell of it.

    glen
    Good to hear from you Glen! Sounds like you did pretty good with your fat-self this season anyhow As stated above with my shift cable comment, I simply cannot imagine suffering through a test right now. I have about 6 hours of total exercise in since Moab! BTW Swine flu is a great weight reducer. I recommend it highly

    Edit..I cannot believe you were around 150lbs when I saw you in Telluride. You didn't look like a bloody toothpick!

    Time to start training on Saturday.
    Free will is an illusion, people will always choose the perceived path of greatest pleasure.

  38. #38
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    This thread is inspiring me to do something supergnarly next Tuesday. Just you wait.

  39. #39
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    my coach has me on 13 hours of Z2 this week. Z2=206-279Watts for me, I don't go under 240 tho.

  40. #40
    LMN
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    Quote Originally Posted by glenzx
    Like that simple structure and progression; without knowing (well, remembering) how much you weigh - what're those numbers like when looking at your FTP or W/Kg number(s)? Being a big-ish guy (hit 181 on the scale 3 days ago!!!) my w/Kg has never been great - and is seriously in the sh1tter at the weight I'm at now - but I'd guess I'd do the same workout with anywhere from 75-100 more watts, but still not be ANYWHERE near as fast as you!
    For me those numbers are around 3.5 watts/kg. Definitely nothing special, significantly off summer form.

    My watts/kg have never been that great (the reason I never made it as an elite rider). I am pretty efficient on a MTB (get the most out of my limited power) which has allowed me to fight above my weight class so to speak.

  41. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by KERKOVEJ
    Instead of me getting long winded on this subject, check out these links which give a good idea of these early AM efforts:

    http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/fitne...cogen_training

    http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/con...ent=a791674884
    Thanks for the links! As I understand it, the concept is that training at intensity in a glycogen depleted state is a more effective way to specifically improve your mass of mitochondria (as compared to training at intensity in a glycogen rich state). Interesting concept (it's not really new--think 2-a-days), but I'm not sure I understand how/why it works. Anyway, thanks for the links.
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  42. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by suvowner
    well heck yea, I do it until I can no longer produce 700 watts !!!
    Oh, I get it now. This is just a rest day, right? Active recovery from your hard early season days.

  43. #43
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    I'm also 6'6" so the weight spreads out very evenly.
    Retribution Fitness: Strength, Power, and Purpose
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  44. #44
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    ... and if we just ... Workouts

    I have been hitting up my core workouts M,W,F and have been snowshoeing 2k verticle feet up M,T,W,TH gettin crazy strong here.
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  45. #45
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    Only 20 pounds more to Clydesdale...

    Yo Glen!

    Your power to weight is creeping down to mine...you best lose some weight or you're going to have to start checking your six when you ride with me!

    Hope all's well!

    Tom

    PS - My power to wind drag ratio is not so dismal...
    Friends don't let friends give their money to NORBA.
    Get a bicycle. You will not regret it. If you live. - Mark Twain

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