Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 29
  1. #1
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    111

    Starting training now for 2014 season?

    It has crossed my mind to do this.

    Currently mid pack in the class I'm in. Rather than chase more average results over the rest of the season what If I put in an extended period of base training from now until the end of the winter.

    The weather is lovely right now so long rides and adventure rides are lots of fun especially without the pressure of thinking I should be doing interval sessions etc. It's helping me enjoy riding with my mates too.

    My question is; would this approach potentially lead to greater gains in the 2014 season than sticking to the more conventional approach of training racing until Sept, taking a transition month then back to base for the winter?

  2. #2
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Posts
    516
    What class are you racing in and training for?, the answers will likely be very different if you're a Cat3 or a Cat1. What are your racing goals for 2014?
    It sound like maybe you want/need a break from the more serious side mtb?, to take some more just for fun rides? If you need a break, take one, you will probably train a lot better later on if you're more refreshed and motivated.

  3. #3
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    681
    Quote Originally Posted by grawp View Post
    My question is; would this approach potentially lead to greater gains in the 2014 season than sticking to the more conventional approach of training racing until Sept, taking a transition month then back to base for the winter?
    Like JimPacNM said, what class are you racing? How many hours & rides a week do you train?

    What is your idea of base training? What are your idea of intervals?

    Age? Years training?

    No matter what you do, to get your performance "to the next level" you need to get your FTP (20 min power) up
    "Reaching the next level means improving every aspect of fitness, but itís our threshold power that holds us back." Hunter Allen

    Peaks Coaching: Take Your Performance to the Next Level

    I became a faster rider this last off season by just doing 'some' of #2 in article above and focusing on #4.

  4. #4
    Formerly of Kent
    Reputation: Le Duke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    2,779
    You'd probably gain more from continued racing (pacing, technique when exhausted, bottle handups, race strategy, bike setup, etc) than you would from just riding aimlessly for the next 9 months.

  5. #5
    Endurance Junkie
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    216
    Quote Originally Posted by scottz123 View Post
    No matter what you do, to get your performance "to the next level" you need to get your FTP (20 min power) up
    Just a point of clarification, FTP is 60 minute power by definition. 20 minute intervals are a common way of estimating FTP and trying to improve it. Raising FTP is definitely a key aspect like you said though.

  6. #6
    mtbr member
    Reputation: WR304's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    3,790

    Starting training now for 2014 season?

    Considering that you're in the UK July/ August/ September should be ok weather wise. There are still plenty of events to ride too so it isn't as if the season is over either. A mid season break could do you good, before coming back strongly in a few weeks time.

    2fast4u started a very similar thread entitled "I quit racing XC" a few years ago. The points in that thread apply here too:

    I quit racing XC

    If you really want to begin preparing for next year the key point isn't riding through the summer so much, it's more about keeping your fitness and motivation during the winter months when the weather is bad.

  7. #7
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    111
    Good, solid replies there guys. I knew I could count on you!

    Prob best to describe me as mid cat 2 (here in the uk I race masters but to be honest half of them could be in expert/elite)
    I'm 38 and based on my birthday will be making my debut in Vets next season. I want to arrive with a bang as a force to be reckoned with and need to shave 8 mins/hour in an xc race to achieve this.

    Work is tough (I run a small landscaping business), family is great but it leaves me at an average of 8 hrs/week training time.

    Just bought a road bike and joined a road club which I'm really excited about as I'm tired of training alone. Me and my best mate have also started dirt jumping which is brilliant.

    I do need some time off, our team has disintegrated due to the leader getting neurotic and feeling threatened, so I need a fresh start.

    Want to do some big things and then come back stronger. I'm planning a 120mile road ride on Sunday.

    There are a few races in Sept/Oct that interest me, I'll probably have a rest now then peak for them.

    Thanks again for being the sounding board. Wanting to be a race cyclist can be a lonely occupation.

  8. #8
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    681
    Quote Originally Posted by skibum1321 View Post
    Just a point of clarification, FTP is 60 minute power by definition. 20 minute intervals are a common way of estimating FTP and trying to improve it. Raising FTP is definitely a key aspect like you said though.
    You are correct
    Joe Friel - Estimating Your FTP

  9. #9
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    404
    Grawp, your situation is similar to mine. I just started racing this year, and right now I'm burned out. Not from riding/racing, but other life stress such as running my landscaping business. Obviously riding/racing contributes to the overall stress. I need a break from SOMETHING right now, and cycling will unfortunately be the thing to go(at least for a few weeks). Rather than come back and start racing, only to have lost some fitness and place worse, I'm considering no more racing until next year, and training smart up until then(also big hours in the winter due to lack of work).

  10. #10
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    1,918
    As with any "how do I get faster thread" The key is to do an honest assessment of strengths vs Weaknesses. Working with a coach is a good way to do this but its not the only way. Spend some time thinking about how your races unfold, what types of courses you do well on vs struggle on, do you gain or lose positions late in the race, could you lead the race for the first 20 min if you wanted to? Train your weaknesses Race your Strengths. What do you need to train? Once you have identified some things to improve then you can determine the best plan for next season.

    Racing often is great training but is often not the most effective with regards to time. For example The last race that I did was a Midweek evening training race. I enjoy doing them because its a great workout, and I get to see a bunch of friends that I don't see often. The race was 2 laps of a 25-35 min Course so about an hour long. Go time was 5 pm so I left my house at 3 pm to get there before 4 so I would be able to warmup. Race start was delayed until 5:30 because of Traffic so I ended up pedaling around the parking lot 45 min once I had done my usual warm up. I had a good race, changed got packed up, had a beer with some friends, helped clean up the race site a little, and then headed home about 7:30. I unpacked and sat down for dinner with my GF about 9 pm. So the Race took about 6 hours for a Good 1 hour effort on the bike. I could have went out on the road bike(or MTB) in the morning before work and climbed one of the local canyons I can ride from my house. I have several options for 2 hour rides from mt front door with lots of climbing that can easily be as hard as a race. Leave at 5am and I am done by 7 and at work by 8. Same amount of workout in 1/3 the time. Racing can be good training but it is not always the most effective from a time management standpoint.
    Visiting St george/Hurricane? Stay at my vacation rental. Discounts for MTB's

    http://www.vrbo.com/392904

    PM me

  11. #11
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    111
    Kawigreen99, Nice to hear from someone in the same trade. Folk don't realise that we do 40hrs week of base level workout with bursts of intensity mixed in too. Throw in all the admin, meetings, phone calls etc and it's a wonder we ever get out on the bike at all.

    Like you I find I have a lot more time in winter which is good because right now I'm a wreck by the end of each week.

    I'm going to pick a handfull of races to do in Sept and Oct to give me some direction, but treat July and Aug as playtime with nice rides as and when I can fit them in.

  12. #12
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    111
    WR304. Thanks for that link, made good reading and I can certainly relate to some of the points raised. Luckily I think I've caught it early and will be back into race mode soon, in fact am getting that tingle of excitement already. One of the problems is that there are so many events and a lot of them are series, so if you do well in one you feel guilty if you miss another. I need to be more choosy and not worry too much about series results. By far my favorite race this year was a 100km one which I decided to just use as a nice day out. Took it real easy for the first hour then felt so good I gunned it and took 13th in an uncatagorised field.

  13. #13
    mtbr member
    Reputation: WR304's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    3,790

    Starting training now for 2014 season?

    How far North do you live? There's a two day mountain bike orienteering event in the Tweed valley 31/08/2013 - 01/09/2013 which sounds like fun.

    http://www.bmbo.org.uk/calendar/deta...p?event_id=438

    http://www.bmbo.org.uk/calendar/

    I always used to enjoy the 2 day orienteering events because it's about riding and exploring areas that you might not have ridden before. They're best done as part of a two man team. It's a different ambience to an XC race and would be a good target to build up to during the summer.

  14. #14
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    111
    I live about as far away as is possible from that event!
    Also hate stopping to read maps (love my gps!).
    I wish there were more point to point or big loop races but this country is too built up for that here in the south.
    Planning some epic road riding this weekend and rather excited about it.

  15. #15
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    404
    Quote Originally Posted by grawp View Post
    Kawigreen99, Nice to hear from someone in the same trade. Folk don't realise that we do 40hrs week of base level workout with bursts of intensity mixed in too. Throw in all the admin, meetings, phone calls etc and it's a wonder we ever get out on the bike at all.

    Like you I find I have a lot more time in winter which is good because right now I'm a wreck by the end of each week.

    I'm going to pick a handfull of races to do in Sept and Oct to give me some direction, but treat July and Aug as playtime with nice rides as and when I can fit them in.
    It sure does all add up at the end of the week. Unfortunately, I don't feel like it does much for cycling fitness, but it really tires you out. Saturday is my day to do nothing. Guys I ride with have been planning group rides at different locations on saturday mornings, but I really need that day to rest. Sunday is really the only good day to ride. Last week I forced myself to get out and ride 4 days, as I've only been riding once or twice a week... well now I'm sick, which made for a miserable work week and certainly no riding.

  16. #16
    mtbr member
    Reputation: WR304's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    3,790

    Starting training now for 2014 season?

    Quote Originally Posted by grawp View Post
    I live about as far away as is possible from that event!
    Also hate stopping to read maps (love my gps!).
    I wish there were more point to point or big loop races but this country is too built up for that here in the south.
    Planning some epic road riding this weekend and rather excited about it.
    Sorry, I thought you lived near Dalby forest for some reason.

    Good luck with the road rides.

  17. #17
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    111
    108 miles today at 16.9mph av. Made a real change and I bet a couple of months of this plus some mtb specific training is going to make me into an animal!

  18. #18
    Formerly of Kent
    Reputation: Le Duke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    2,779
    Long, slow riding isn't going to make you fast. It's going to make you good at riding long and slow.

  19. #19
    Rod
    Rod is offline
    Endorphin Junkie
    Reputation: Rod's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    4,273
    Le Duke has a very good point. In the middle of the season, a century ride isn't going to help you very much when it comes to specificity.

    Here is my suggestion:

    Now that you own a road bike, go out and find some fast group or groups that will push you to your limit. Try to find rides around your race time.

    If you find a group that is slower, here are some things I do. Attack on the hills. I treat them like intervals. Work on your cadence. Use the group rides as a recovery ride if you need to so you can do your more specific work when you ride alone.

    The real question is:

    What were you doing earlier this year when you were training? What did your week look like and why were you doing that workout or were you just riding? How many miles do you have in your legs this season? From there, hopefully someone can chime in and help you get better results. You made it sound like you're close to being burned out though. Hopefully that isn't the case.
    There is not much choice between rotten apples.

  20. #20
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    111
    I rode 100 miles because I wanted to ride 100 miles. I always attack on hills because that's the kind of guy I am (I always get to the top first as well!).

    I'm enjoying just riding my bike at the moment and plan to do another long ride but on my mtb this weekend, I think the long rides do help but more importantly it's nice to head out the door with sandwiches in my pockets and money for a cuppa and cake later on.
    I'll switch back some time in Aug to some dedicated training for a few autumn races which I've pencilled in the diary.
    Feels great to have stopped thinking about which event to do next and just ride.

    3 days of uplift in wales at the end of the month too. Yippee!

    EDIT: LeDuke, 16.9mph average over 108 miles with 5000feet of climbing isn't exactly pootling!

  21. #21
    mtbr member
    Reputation: WR304's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Posts
    3,790

    Starting training now for 2014 season?

    Quote Originally Posted by grawp View Post
    EDIT: LeDuke, 16.9mph average over 108 miles with 5000feet of climbing isn't exactly pootling!
    It's a starting point to improve from.

    It's hard to generalise but on a road bike you'd be aiming for a 20mph+ average speed over that sort of distance if you were just out for a ride.

  22. #22
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    681
    Quote Originally Posted by grawp View Post
    EDIT: LeDuke, 16.9mph average over 108 miles with 5000feet of climbing isn't exactly pootling!
    I take it you must be a local pro.

    I entered reply above before reading your earlier response of "Prob best to describe me as mid cat 2"

    After going thru my garmin downloads, a recent 2hr road ride for me titled "Tempo w/ Time Trial interval" has me at a 17.2 avg spd with 928' of elevation. While not a race pace the entire effort, the overall ride was pretty challenging.

    I entered 3 races so far this season:
    1st race = 6th out of 54 (sport and expert, all ages combined, 2 lap TT 1hr 2m)
    2nd race = 7th out of 76 (sport, all ages combined, CX 1hr 26m)
    3rd race = 11th out of 29 (expert, all ages combined, 2 lap TT, 1hr 37m)

    My point being, I was really surprised to see you describe yourself as a "mid cat 2".

    I race here in the midwest of U.S., Indiana/Illinois, and I realize things may be different 'over there', I cannot see them being 'that different'. From what you said of that 108 mile ride, I would guess you have a better power/weight ratio than I do. I am wondering if bike handling or anaerobic capacity/power is holding you back.

    I am not criticizing, just trying to help
    Last edited by scottz123; 07-03-2013 at 05:45 AM.

  23. #23
    Formerly of Kent
    Reputation: Le Duke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Posts
    2,779
    Quote Originally Posted by WR304 View Post
    It's a starting point to improve from.

    It's hard to generalise but on a road bike you'd be aiming for a 20mph+ average speed over that sort of distance if you were just out for a ride.
    This.

  24. #24
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    111
    I'm not sure about the mid cat 2 thing as have no benchmark of what cat 2 is, was just guessing.
    Best long distance result this year was 53mins behind winner (who finishes approx mid elite in xc but prefers mid/long distance races)of a 100km race.
    Recent xc race I did 5 laps in 1hr 30mins and the National Champ did 6 in the same time on the same course.

    As to the 20mph thing you've goaded me into trying a flat out 100mile effort. I'll report back....

    Did a flatish 10mile TT on Scott Scale 26 with knobblies a couple of months ago and did it in 28mins.



    Anyway this is all beside the point. Part of me still thinks I could focus on achieving some epic long distance goals this year which would be a lot of fun, then build on this next spring to decent effect.

  25. #25
    mtbr member
    Reputation:
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    111
    Are you guys trying to kill me?

    Just back from a hilly (4000 feet climbing) 50mile road ride.
    Averaged 17.9mph (on my own so no drafting).

    You're suggesting 20mph + for base training rides?
    I'll try another on the flat sometime soon and see how that compares.

    The road bike is a killer because you never let up on the peddles, even when doing 40mph downhill.

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Off season training
    By jakester29959 in forum Downhill - Freeride
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 02-28-2013, 07:39 PM
  2. Starting the racing season without trail riding time...
    By PissedOffCil in forum XC Racing and Training
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 05-06-2011, 07:44 AM
  3. Right tool for the job - Commuting season starting!
    By RecceDG in forum Eastern Canada
    Replies: 22
    Last Post: 04-11-2011, 09:22 AM
  4. INSANITY Training! Off season or pre season!
    By cryde in forum XC Racing and Training
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 03-21-2011, 09:08 AM
  5. There's some off-season training...
    By rockyuphill in forum XC Racing and Training
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 03-12-2011, 07:36 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •