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  1. #1
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    2011 USAC XC Nationals Discussion (Not about the Altitude)

    Figured I'd start a thread for discussion of the 2011 nationals. Venue, Schedule, Course descriptions etc. But NOT about how it's held at altitude...

    Can anyone confirm the grade of the climbs shown on the USAC site? My calculations put the CAT 1,2,3 grade at 18% and the Pro at 16%. Any other details on the course would be great (surface, terrain, etc.)

    Thanks!
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  2. #2
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    Does anyone know how many laps each CAT will do? Information on CAT 2 would especially be appreciated.

    Thanks and good luck with the training guys!

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    How can you discuss the slope of the climbs without talking about altitude? LOL.

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    only thing that matters to me is that there is a race. if you are asking questions on the internet about the course that is just as crazy as talking about the altitiude....

    a friend sent an email to Kelly and her response was that they didn't know yet how many laps we would do. they are aiming for a sub 2hr CAT1 race time. my guess would be the start loop plus 3 laps, but i am guessing that would be really pushing the sub 2 hr goal (factoring in altitude and what looks on paper to be a pretty brutal climb)
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  5. #5
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    the trails in SV are pretty straight forward, just great flowy single track and some good technical climbs. Only thing I am wondering about is why the CAT1 19+ dudes are doing a different course then the pros and younger guys.

    There is plenty of info on the USAcycling website on the courses....

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by willymcd View Post
    the trails in SV are pretty straight forward, just great flowy single track and some good technical climbs. Only thing I am wondering about is why the CAT1 19+ dudes are doing a different course then the pros and younger guys.

    There is plenty of info on the USAcycling website on the courses....
    Because Pro-courses are designed for the enjoyment of the spectator not the enjoyment of the racer.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by LMN View Post
    Because Pro-courses are designed for the enjoyment of the spectator not the enjoyment of the racer.
    isn't that more "Pro courses are designed to comply with UCI/Olympic specifications"?

    i can tell you now, the Pro courses at Bonelli and Fontana are FUN. So were the courses back east (Mt. Snow, Windham, MSA). i for one really like the shorter courses so long as they have good technical features and provide good hard racing.

    i think that long, big loop, boring, fired road courses (think marathon etc) are mind numbing. i will take repeats of hard stuff anytime! if i want to go sight seeing i don't need to pay an entry fee!

    where i think things go wrong is dumbing courses down. i hate to hear "not everyone can handle what you can" because that is just a copout. if people can't handle features they can get off and run!
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  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by willymcd View Post
    Only thing I am wondering about is why the CAT1 19+ dudes are doing a different course then the pros and younger guys.
    U17 Cat 1 is a UCI class, so they have to race the UCI course with the pros. All the other Cat 1's are just Cat 1's...
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  9. #9
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    I was told when this venue was announced, that it was "not" at the ski resort, but nearby. Profiles would lead me to believe it's a typical ski resort course. Can anyone who lives there or is familiar with the area tell us for sure?

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    yep at a ski resort

    It was always going to be at one of the ski resorts. heard talk that there was apparently some permit issues with the BLM on building new trails at Dollar Mountain so everything is now on Sun Valley on private property and on existing trails.

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    Sounds like the short track was built for somebody like you whybotherme, merry go round $hit. All the laps get me dizzy. The short format is for sponsors and spectators, which pay the bills. Beyond that its ADHD, hence the huge growth in 100 miler and large loop/point to point stuff. Only speaking for self here and generalizing for others, but I do believe that most racers like bigger loops and less laps.
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    Quote Originally Posted by butryon View Post
    Only speaking for self here and generalizing for others, but I do believe that most racers like bigger loops and less laps.
    And that's why 'cross has exploded in popularity... oh, wait...
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by runner_bob View Post
    It was always going to be at one of the ski resorts. heard talk that there was apparently some permit issues with the BLM on building new trails at Dollar Mountain so everything is now on Sun Valley on private property and on existing trails.

    Haha. It was the USAC employees who picked the venue who told me it would not be at at ski resort, "just near one."

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    Quote Originally Posted by butryon View Post
    Sounds like the short track was built for somebody like you whybotherme, merry go round $hit. All the laps get me dizzy. The short format is for sponsors and spectators, which pay the bills. Beyond that its ADHD, hence the huge growth in 100 miler and large loop/point to point stuff. Only speaking for self here and generalizing for others, but I do believe that most racers like bigger loops and less laps.
    yep. i do like short track and CX too. i race mtb to race. like i said before, if i want to check out the view it doesn't have an entry fee (believe me i love this aspect of riding as well!). i don't need to put my money in someone else's pocket to go enjoy the scenery!

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    cross has the exact growth rate and timing as our nations over diagnosis and medicalization of add/adhd. I never put the two of them together like that, but you are on to something.

    I am teasing here. It will be a fun race regardless of the ADHD format. And, not to disapoint whybotherme, but you are going to dig the views. The Pioneers are across the valley from the venue, even when hypoxic you will still be able to make out beautiful 10k-12k mtns.....I think.
    I know what your thinking..."I am being ripped off because,I paid for this, I am racing, I have killer scenery." yip, a real cake and eat it scenario. it'll be fun!
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  16. #16
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    Enough with the blah blah! How 'bout some real course/venue info.

    From the Ride Sun Valley website:

    Course Sneak Peek #1: The River Run Rocks

    http://www.ridesunvalley.com/blog/wp.../IMG_73601.jpg

    Check out the gnarly rock feature at the base of River Run...Will be on the Amateur and Pro Cross-country courses. Wicked.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdamW View Post
    Enough with the blah blah! How 'bout some real course/venue info.

    From the Ride Sun Valley website:

    Course Sneak Peek #1: The River Run Rocks

    http://www.ridesunvalley.com/blog/wp.../IMG_73601.jpg

    Check out the gnarly rock feature at the base of River Run...Will be on the Amateur and Pro Cross-country courses. Wicked.
    Are they blocking off the fire road on both sides?

  18. #18
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    They must be taping it off. Just used the roads to build the feature.

  19. #19
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    The course as shown on USAC site is at the bottom of a ski run. I'm pretty sure I've ridden part of the course on a longer ride up to the top of Baldy.
    Oh sh!+ just force upgraded to cat1. Now what?
    Best thing about an ultra marathon? I just get to ride my bike for X hours!

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by AdamW View Post
    Enough with the blah blah! How 'bout some real course/venue info.

    From the Ride Sun Valley website:

    Course Sneak Peek #1: The River Run Rocks

    http://www.ridesunvalley.com/blog/wp.../IMG_73601.jpg

    Check out the gnarly rock feature at the base of River Run...Will be on the Amateur and Pro Cross-country courses. Wicked.
    re: blah blah blah... give us more pics. those of us from far away only have a profile and a course map to look at unless the locals give us photos, vids, beta.

    is it a climb or a descent? looks cool. hope they can keep everyone from making a line on one side or the other in the smooth stuff. i can dig chunk, even man made stuff. if the whole course looked like that i would be stoked. the harder the better for me!
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    Was up there last weekend and this is a flat section of rocks no elevation gain either direction. The single track climb you will like but if someone misses and dabs everyone will be walking as it isn't conducive to getting right back on and rolling. The downhill is flat and fast with tight switchbacks that if you miss and roll wide could see you going down the hill a ways in a couple of spots. Sorry no vid's or photos from my preride.

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    Quote Originally Posted by runner_bob View Post
    Was up there last weekend and this is a flat section of rocks no elevation gain either direction. The single track climb you will like but if someone misses and dabs everyone will be walking as it isn't conducive to getting right back on and rolling. The downhill is flat and fast with tight switchbacks that if you miss and roll wide could see you going down the hill a ways in a couple of spots. Sorry no vid's or photos from my preride.
    Interesting. Wonder what the start times (waves) will be like. Lately our local races have had the 30-34 and 35-39 class up near the front as they are the fastest groups. Sounds fun though! Position into the ST is key in any race.
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  23. #23
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    How long do you ride before it puts you into the single track?
    Thanks.
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by butryon View Post
    How long do you ride before it puts you into the single track?
    Thanks.
    from the maps, it looks like we will have a "Start Loop". i just worry about traffic from the wave in front of mine....
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  25. #25
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    Start Lap goes straight up river run ski trail - loose gravel dirt road probably 1/2 to 3/4 mile steep without any place to really get back on your bike again if you get off or are forced off. At the top you head left on to the single track which will bring you back down to the base by the gondola station. From there it was hit and miss but looked to be about a mile of double track and the "rock" section before you get back on the single track climb. From what i remember of the climb there are a few spots to pass but not many but about half way up the climb you pop back out onto a double track access road which should give an opportunity to get around some people again, then a screaming fast 2 track descent to the single track descent (which is where the pro loop enters the single track) and back to the bottom. I was still tired from the Soldier Race the day before but would guess that at race pace the loops will be 30+ minutes and the start loop about 15 so would guess that Cat 1 will be 3+ a start and Cat 2 will be 2 plus a start. Positioning and if nothing else getting to the start of your wave on the start loop will be key since once on the single track there aren't a ton of good places to pass but will be a good recovery section. I am a 40 - 44 Cat 2 so guessing that I will have the slower riders as well from the earlier starts to contend with as well. If nothing else it will be a fun course.

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