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  1. #1
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    insane deal, Kinley FS for $1200 FULL XTR

    http://cgi.ebay.com/2006-Kinley-Moun...QQcmdZViewItem
    I see this on ebay, and it makes me cry inside because I don't have enough money to buy it.

  2. #2
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    It's just a cheap frame with a few XTR parts bolted on with cheap hubs, rims, and fork, and some cheap FSA parts. Still they can buy those kits cheap in bulk and make a few hundred while passing on the savings. The best part is the XTR crankset but that is a $100 frame with a low-end shock, fork, and wheels. So if you're buying it to do an eventual part swap to a good frame, you still still have some major expenses because you will need to replace the fork and wheels.

    On the other hand, if you're looking at a $1,000 Pricepoint bike or something like that, this is a much better deal with the XTR drivetrain.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer
    It's just a cheap frame with a few XTR parts bolted on with cheap hubs, rims, and fork, and some cheap FSA parts. .
    I disagree with the above comment, R7 with lock-out is a very nice fork, XT hubs are not top-end but they are good and popular, easily a trade-up in marketplace if you ever need to. for $1,200 you can ride this FS with full XTR and see for yourself if it's a crap or not, even swap all the XTR to next bike still a killer deal. Hey what is the last time you see a $1200 bike with complete 'cheap?' FSA parts instead of generic house brand?
    Unless you have experience on the frame, you would never tell from the picture it's a $100 worth frame, or a hidden gem made by the same manufacture of brand name bikes- notice this seller so far got 100% positive feedback on his bike sale. If I have free time to part and build on another frame next summer, it's a very tempting deal.
    Last edited by BigBull; 12-07-2007 at 01:31 PM.

  4. #4
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    For you, it may be. I just see a cheap frame with cheap wheels and a cheap fork. When I look at a frame, I want to see the welds, know the leverage ratio is well-designed, examine the geometry and specs, and know that tire clearance is adequate.

    Their website lists the 2006 as the latest models, I can't find any specs, and nothing about the bike sounds the least bit interesting. The only thing is the XTR stuff, which is probably 2005 or 2006 spec. The R7 is a flexy fork that tucks in under hard braking. In really rocky stuff, that thing feels like it is dying to jump off the bike.

    One man's junk is another man's treasure though. If this had decent wheels and a decent fork, I'd agree with you in that it would be a good deal, even with a crappy frame. As it stands, it's not that great.

    I don't get wowed by 2005/2006 XT/XTR parts hung on a cheap frame that has no specs available. So yeah, it's a crappy deal to me but if the older XTR parts are so impressive, by all means, whip those credit cards out and don't mind my opionion

  5. #5
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    Lol, I listed this deal for those who need an xc fs, and this bike probably weighs in at the 24-26 pound category.
    You need lightweight, this is probably it.

    Knowing all numbers can do some good, but in the end its going to handle like an XC Race bike so hey.

  6. #6
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    Agreed. It should be relatively light. I wish they showed the specs though- not just the weight but the geo specs. That would go a long way in attracting buyers.

  7. #7
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    oop, deal is gone.. I guess the seller deemed it too cheap to sell at that price.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer
    For you, it may be. I just see a cheap frame with cheap wheels and a cheap fork. When I look at a frame, )
    Remember, this is the 'Where is the best deal ' forum, not 'Dream bike' forum. we need to look at its price and make the call on value/cost ratio (for the sake of other buyer here). What you called 'Cheap' fork and wheels are decend in this price range.
    I do own a few 'boutique' bikes with Talas fork, CrossMAx wheels, but never in this price.

  9. #9
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    No, still there. Someone placed a bid so the BIN offer disappeared. I do think the BIN price was a mistake. If you look at their website the lower end FS bikes are on sale for $1,200, but that version is listed for more.

  10. #10
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    Its still there?
    If an online company is selling it for 2100, 1200 is like 400% discount off of boutique prices.

  11. #11
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    It's still there. For those generic online setups, 40% off is not uncommon. Their MSRP is set to make you think the value is much higher- typical marketing game. They can sell that $2,200 MSRP bike for $1,200 and still make 20%-30% profit over their cost.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer
    It's still there. For those generic online setups, 40% off is not uncommon. Their MSRP is set to make you think the value is much higher- typical marketing game. They can sell that $2,200 MSRP bike for $1,200 and still make 20%-30% profit over their cost.
    Flyer, you are misunderstanding me.

    This is what Bikesdirect does, SALE: 1899, MSRP 4000
    This is completely different, it is MSRP 4000, SALE 1899, EBAY 1199

    why? Because 2100 is what the website sells it all the time for.

  13. #13
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    No way in hell that bike has a MSRP of $4K. That's the MSRP of a fully built Turner or even a handbult Ventana.

    At $2,100, they are making an easy 100% profit over cost. If you think the MSRP of that bike is close to $4K, you haven't been around the biz very long.

    At $2,100, it is a steal- they are stealing an extra grand from you

  14. #14
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    Flyer, I thought you knew that online companies can say the MSRP is whatever they wanted.........................
    and I was making an analogy, not saying the bike is worth $4000.

    1) Look, Kinley bikes when under, they are gone, kaput.
    When they were in the online business, their price would be $2100 for their "direct manufacturer price crap"
    Closing out on ONLINE PRICES is cheaper than online prices and way cheaper than LBS prices.

    2) Hypothetical situation:
    If a LBS brand bike on ebay normally sells for $1600 MSRP, thats the value of a $800-900 online bike brand with the same component build.
    If that online bike brand closed out on their bike, then it would be 500-600 on ebay.

  15. #15
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    Yes, but four times what a bike is truly worth is way over any MSRP in the bike industry. You have to be way more careful with the generic ones. They (a few) inflate MSRP even more to make it appear that they are on par with the boutique bikes.

  16. #16
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    Hey, if it sounds like a good deal to you without knowing the specs or taking a chance on 2005/2006 XTRs being passed off as 2008 (no mention on the Ebay site, is there?) then go for it.

    I just don't see it as an insane deal so I shared my thoughts on that. Sorry to temper your enthusiasm on this but I have been around long enough to recognize a smoking deal when I see one and once in a while I see ads like this one that lack so much info and I have to say something or newbies will get sucked in.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer
    Hey, if it sounds like a good deal to you without knowing the specs or taking a chance on 2005/2006 XTRs being passed off as 2008 (no mention on the Ebay site, is there?) then go for it..
    I believe there're better frame/kit combination deal, but when is exactly the last time you've seen fully XTR spec. bike go for $1200? personally I am not too crazy about XTR but for some race minded students it's a valid option to get these light weight parts and build from there, keep the frame as commute bike or something.
    If the current year made gear is important to you, you are sucked into their marketing scheme, as long as they are brand new and top of the line of 'recent' year model, they are great super light kit to have.
    As you mention, for the sake of newbies. do a fair judgement base on the price of all parts adding up. Here is an idea: get a SC Superlight frame from Phattire $589 and build up with $1200 kit here, you got a boutique name 25 lb FS XC race bike for $1789. try to beat that.
    Last edited by BigBull; 12-08-2007 at 10:31 AM.

  18. #18
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    XTR stuff, till now, hasn't interested me at all. This may be a good deal for someone looking for an entry-level frame with decent componenets. My point is that it isn't an "insane" deal that one should not pass up. I'd rather have a X.7/X.9 kitted bike with a slighty better fork and wheels.

    FWIW- I don't use Shimano drivetrains except for the front der. The older XTR crankset rings were soft and rounded off too easily. The bearings were like cheese so the marketing doesn't work on me. The XTR brake pistons are sticky and when they are, fixing them is impossible, even according to Shimano- or at least that is what they say and many shops say. My point is that newbies will see a FS bike with "XTR" and get all wowed. That bike woud have to be $800 for me to say it's an insane deal. As it stands, those components are suspect and I cannot stand flexy wheels and forks.

    Seriously, if that was a X.9 kitted bike with a better fork and maybe Race Face stuff instead of FSA, I'd find it to be a much more appealing package. OR if the stuff on it was 2008 XTR, then we are talking because at least the resale value of the components is much higher than the old XTR stuff and I hear better things about durability..

    Ever tried dealing with FSA? That is a nightmare worse than dealing with Shimano and implying they made a defective product (been there; done that).

    I use my reliable old Race Face Turbine LP (4 yrs with original bearings annd stiff as can be) and X.9 stuff that has never failed me. Shimano, Specialized and all that type of awesome marketing doesn't work on me.

    I focus on three things- frame, wheels, forks. That's where I spend my money and want my reliability 9and geometry) and none of those appeal to me in this case. I hope you see where I'm coming from. Liek I said- if you thin this is an insane deal- buy it by all means. I think it's a mediocre deal and i'm sure some find that irritating since this bike say "XTR" but I have been ridig and using/upgrading parts for a long time now. I have had over 10 bikes (GT/KHS/Yetis/Ventanas/Turners) in the last decade with a myriad of diff components and I know what works. I have ridden or demo-ed countless others and countless other forks/wheelsets and know how crap works and know how well-built stuff works.

    Just my opinion- you wanna do a circle jerk on this mediocre setup- be my guest. It seem like you are more impressed by the XTR setup; not me. You demonstarte that by saying "when was the last time you saw a fully XTR spec bike go for $1200?"

    It doesn't matter- the older XTR stuff was not that great- maybe the front derailleur was. if it's 2005/2006 XTR, I'll take Race Face or SRAM mid-level components and X.7/X.9 over that.

    Don't make this as bad as that circle jerk "Which Bike to buy" forum used to be when someone saw a $400 bike complete and got a hardon over it and everyone else and their dog joined in when 99% of the guys didn't even know what the silly headangle and ETT or BB height on the bike was. It's pretty well known why all the more experienced guys never (or rarely) went or go there anymore. You like it- buy it. Don't expect me to join in but I will state my opinion and if some agree- great. If you don't, buy the silly thing and review it in 6 months after using it hard. If the wheels are true enough and the fork doesn't leak and flex like meals at Noodles and Company, you did good.

  19. #19
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    Ideas for newbies

    Here is a X.9/XT build kit listed at $850:

    http://www.fullcycles.com/product_in...oducts_id/1023

    You can probably get it for around $700ish. Then you can choose your fork and find a decent frame (with published specs) on Ebay or online and build up your own bike. I have seen Revelations for 4350 new and rebas for less. You can pick up frames quite cheap if you stick with "generic" frames or used frames on CL or Ebay. At least you can pick a frame with geometry YOU want. There are several retailers who sell them online. I got my KHS Softail frame for around $300 new. A generic FS frame with a low-end shock should be easy to find. I see even Konas going for $250ish even on mtbr banner ads.

    That's what I would do if starting out. I may spend $300 more but have a bike with durable parts and a frame I picked for it's geometry. It's something I built up and I think something like that woud be a good deal.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer
    . I have had over 10 bikes (GT/KHS/Yetis/Ventanas/Turners) in the last decade with a myriad of diff components and I know what works. I have ridden or demo-ed countless others and countless other forks/wheelsets and know how crap works and know how well-built stuff works.

    Just my opinion- you wanna do a circle jerk on this mediocre setup- be my guest. .
    What do we have here? How did we get into stuffs like that? yak.

  21. #21
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    Maybe I was a bit harsh with that tasteless circle jerk coment- my apologies. This was bringing back some memories of some horrible posts where newbies were getting sucked in and it was like a mob frenzy.

    Sorry- did not mean to bring any horrible visualizations into play

  22. #22
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    No sweat, you probably right about this is not quite an 'insant' deal yet. cheer.

  23. #23
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    taikuodo- please don't let my opinion dissuade you from posting deals here. There are some who may find that it is exactly what they are looking for.

    I'll be less vocal, I promise

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