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  1. #1
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    I thought Ebay was.....

    Well, occasionally you can find a good deal here and there.
    But can someone please explain something to me.
    Ebay is an auction site right, so why is it that certain people feel that
    they have to bid 4 days before the auction is over? You're only
    raising the price you or someone else will have to pay 4 days later.
    Why don't we all just hold our bids until the last possible sec?
    That way it keeps the bid low and betters your chances or someone elses
    chances of getting a get deal.
    True, the seller might lose out but thats the risk he takes.

    It's just so frustrating watching people bid without thinking first.
    Anyone else feel the same way?

  2. #2
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    I don't quite follow your reasoning.
    If you bid your maximum bid early, and it's higher than the starting price, you will only pay the starting price if no one else bids.
    I frequently bid early on items I wish to buy and don't bid again if the price goes above my maximum.
    Sometimes doing this will scare other bidders away or I will be outbid.
    The bidding price will only stay low if bidders place little nibble bids.
    If several bidders bid late with their maximum bid, the price will still go up to just over the second highest bidders max bid.
    Just because it's ebay doesn't mean your entitled to cheap prices.
    I fall down and I get up again

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Screamer
    Well, occasionally you can find a good deal here and there.
    But can someone please explain something to me.
    Ebay is an auction site right, so why is it that certain people feel that
    they have to bid 4 days before the auction is over? You're only
    raising the price you or someone else will have to pay 4 days later.
    Why don't we all just hold our bids until the last possible sec?
    That way it keeps the bid low and betters your chances or someone elses
    chances of getting a get deal.
    True, the seller might lose out but thats the risk he takes.

    It's just so frustrating watching people bid without thinking first.
    Anyone else feel the same way?
    Auctions are not about keeping the price low for you. They are about people bidding a price that they think is reasonable. If that is more than you think is reasonable, move along. True, you might lose out, but that's the risk you take.

  4. #4
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    Have you bid in the last seconds only to find yourself outbid even while yours is still being posted? That's frustrating.

    Sometimes I bid at the end, sometimes when I can. That's what a watch list is for. If I don't think I will be back online, or I know what I am willing to pay I'll just bid and move on. Besides, the auction means the seller wants as much as he can get and the buyer will pay depending on how bad he really wants it versus the other person who wants it more. If you aren't willing to pay more for it, then it wasn't meant to be. Most times, patience is the key to finding a good deal, or you will pay up and forget about it because you won.

    Some auction sites have a 15 minute rule, where if you bid anywhere within 15 minutes of ending the clock resets for 15 minutes. It helps if you are in a bidding war or say you just came home and found out someone had outbid you at the last minute. Of course, it really tests how far you are willing to go too.

  5. #5
    Five is right out
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    There are lots of full-on academic studies that cover Ebay bidding strategies. Some are more effective than others, some a suitable to different situations. If you want a really definitive answer to your question, Google turns them up pretty easily.

    It boils down to: Sniping is usually more effective.
    Since when did the phrase "invest in" come to mean the same as "buy"?

  6. #6
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    Right!

    As a buyer, I almost exclusively use www.AuctionSniper.com to place my bid in the closing seconds. More often than not, if I'm not outbid by somebody else's bidding war, I get win for a healthy margin below my max.

    As a seller, I love early bidders! Bid early, bid often, just as long as you pay me!
    speedub.nate
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  7. #7
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    Sometimes I watch at the bitter end of an auction, waiting to up my bid if necessary. But to do that is to risk getting caught up in the emotion of the moment and pay more than one intends.

    One strategy is to: a) Decide the max you are willing to pay; b) Add two increments to that price; c) Bid the resulting amount. If you lose, then you've lost to someone who was willing to pay at least three bid increments more than your maximum, and you can feel good that you didn't get caught up in the heat of the moment.

    As for when to bid, people are going to bid whenever it's convenient for them to do so. We aren't going to be able to change the behavior of people at large. And eBay certainly isn't going to do anything to discourage bidding, since eBay's whole purpose is to drive up the price to increase seller profit.

    Nate -- That AuctionSniper site looks interesting. I'm going to look into that. I'm not really a frequent eBayer, but I might give the sniper site a shot.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonathanGennick
    Nate -- That AuctionSniper site looks interesting. I'm going to look into that. I'm not really a frequent eBayer, but I might give the sniper site a shot.
    I use my AuctionSniper account in spurts, but it's always there for me.

    If you sign up, please list me as the referring member. My eBay buying account name is serious.bidders.only -- thanks!
    speedub.nate
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  9. #9
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    I could never understand why people treat Ebay like this. Bid sniping makes no sense to me at all! Why not just bid that same amount the first time you see the item you want? Whether it's 15 bids over 4 days or 15 bids in the last 10 minutes, it's the same people making the same bids... I suppose if you were bidding on rare things that you absolutely needed to have and could not get anywhere else, regardless of price, sniping makes sense. Otherwise, if the price goes up too high, wait for it to get listed again. What am I missing here?

    The few times I waited until the last minutes, I got caught up in a bidding war with somebody and would've spent way more then I intended- good thing I lost

  10. #10
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    Who cares whether you bid 150 bucks now or right as the auction ends? The only people who get pissed at that are auction snipers and that WAS against Ebay policy at one point in time. I don't always have time to sit around on Ebay waiting for an auction to close.. sometimes I have to step away from the computer, I suggest you try it sometime.

  11. #11
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    The reason I snipe is because I only bid once, and its the maximum amount I am willing to pay. Others get too attached to the thrill of victory and will bid much more than they should. As a buyer, I'd prefer those people not to win (because then I'd lose, following me so far?) Or at the very best, they would bid up the price to where I'd pay more for the item (that's less money in my pocket, still with me?)

    I never bid with more than a minute left in an auction. Its counterproductive to someone looking to win at the lowest price.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by norton05
    I could never understand why people treat Ebay like this. Bid sniping makes no sense to me at all! Why not just bid that same amount the first time you see the item you want? Whether it's 15 bids over 4 days or 15 bids in the last 10 minutes, it's the same people making the same bids... I suppose if you were bidding on rare things that you absolutely needed to have and could not get anywhere else, regardless of price, sniping makes sense. Otherwise, if the price goes up too high, wait for it to get listed again. What am I missing here?

    The few times I waited until the last minutes, I got caught up in a bidding war with somebody and would've spent way more then I intended- good thing I lost
    It's a psychological weakness in humans, and it's the reason I've sold a used derailleur for more than it could have been purchased, new, at a reputible online retailer.

    All it takes is two bidders afflicted with this weakness to drive the price sky-high, given enough time to react to the other person's bid.

    By bidding days in advance, you're allowing all the time in the world for your competition to see you and raise you. And often, they will.

    On the other hand, if you rationally figure your highest bid, set your sniper, and let the bid land in the closing <b>seconds</b> -- too little time for anyone to react to it -- you'll maybe land the item for a much more reasonable price. Unless somebody else started a bidding war.
    speedub.nate
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  13. #13
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    You lost me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Screamer
    Well, occasionally you can find a good deal here and there.
    But can someone please explain something to me.
    Ebay is an auction site right, so why is it that certain people feel that
    they have to bid 4 days before the auction is over? You're only
    raising the price you or someone else will have to pay 4 days later.
    Why don't we all just hold our bids until the last possible sec?
    That way it keeps the bid low and betters your chances or someone elses
    chances of getting a get deal.
    True, the seller might lose out but thats the risk he takes.

    It's just so frustrating watching people bid without thinking first.
    Anyone else feel the same way?
    I guess maybe you are assuming everyone has time to do what you are suggesting. If I find something I want, know exactly how much I am willing to pay, what difference does it make if I post it 4 days or 4 minutes before the auction ends? Like more than a few people on MTBR, I have all the good on-line shops saved to my "favorates", thus have a pretty good idea what a good deal is and is not. I will place a bid with that in mind and if some knucklehead (and there are lots of them) feels that winning the bid is more important than common sense dictates, who am I to deprive someone like Speeddub.Nate from benefiting from the old adage "a fool and his money are easily parted".

    Brian

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by BrianU
    I guess maybe you are assuming everyone has time to do what you are suggesting. If I find something I want, know exactly how much I am willing to pay, what difference does it make if I post it 4 days or 4 minutes before the auction ends?
    I can definitely see your point there and maybe I should have elaborated a little more on the subject.
    It's the person or persons that start the bid 4 days before and continues to bid everyday.
    In turn raising the price everyday. Sure I understand we can't all sit by our computers but if we want
    something bad enough we might have to...or throw down a heavier bid.
    Overall I guess I was hoping we could all live in a dream world....
    Last edited by Screamer; 05-08-2008 at 11:25 AM.

  15. #15
    mmm
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    Quote Originally Posted by Screamer
    I can definitely see your point there and maybe I should have elaborated a little more on the subject.
    It's the person or persons that start the bid 4 days before and continues to bid everyday.
    In turn raising the price everyday. Sure I understand we can't all sit by our computers but if we want
    something bad enough we might have to...or throw down a heavier bid.
    Overall I guess I was hoping we could all live in a dream world....
    They could be using Ebay Bid Assistant.

    ....or....

    The seller is in cahoots w/ the bidder to raise the price.

    Either way it doesn't matter to Ebay. They're in the business of making money...not offering good deals to buyers.
    ↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → B A Select Start

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Screamer
    Overall I guess I was hoping we could all live in a dream world....
    No, that is reserved for: http://news.ebay.com/team.cfm
    What do I know, ask the "experts"!

  17. #17
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    rarely, I bid early because I want to know what the reserve price is, if a seller refused to give the reserve price.
    if a seller gives me the reserve price, I bid $1 below reserve price and waiting and watch.
    if someone bid for the item, I don't bid again. after the auction, I ask to the seller about same item availability. if the seller has same items, I calculate ebay and paypal fees then I make an offer (reserve price minus fees) to the seller. since ebay and paypal fees are really high, If I make an offer outside ebay, sellers accept an offer. I can take advantage by fees.

    anyway, I am one of the sniper bidder.
    bookmark the auction then bid once.
    95% of time, I bid 3 seconds before the end

  18. #18
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    I understand your frustration.

    Quote Originally Posted by Screamer
    I can definitely see your point there and maybe I should have elaborated a little more on the subject.
    It's the person or persons that start the bid 4 days before and continues to bid everyday.
    In turn raising the price everyday. Sure I understand we can't all sit by our computers but if we want
    something bad enough we might have to...or throw down a heavier bid.
    Overall I guess I was hoping we could all live in a dream world....
    There was a time when it bothered me and I would get fired up over people bidding used items higher than what they cost new. Now I rarely go on ebay seriously looking for anything that I just got to have. I imagine if I ever found a really clean 1991 Bridgestone MB-2, I might get stupid, but other than that, I would just as soon buy it outright and not deal with the hassle. Every once in awhile I do find something that I actually bid on and most of the time someone outbids me. I usually expect it and find it interesting to see just how high it ends up going. Like watching someone bid on a WI freewheel that Bikeman.com was auctioning and watching it go for more than what Bikeman.com sells them on their website. Or watching Thomson stems and seatposts go for more than what mtnhighcyclery sells them new. Every once in a blue moon, I actually do win and get a great deal. Like the Vicious Cycles fork that I won for less than a 100 bones and have been rock'in for the last two years.

    Brian

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonathanGennick
    And eBay certainly isn't going to do anything to discourage bidding, since eBay's whole purpose is to drive up the price to increase seller profit.
    Hmmm, my experience as a seller on eBay has been that eBay's "whole purpose" is to increase eBay profit. The listing process guides you through a veritable minefield of upcharge options until, alas you are able to actually get to the submit button to list. Not to mention the fees they charge to list and again when it sells. Not enough fees for ya? - wait until you accept Paypal.

  20. #20
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    i've basically given up on bidding on items, i never could win anything and from above i know why...i just look for good or reasonable deals with buy it now options...of course the shipping people charge on ebay is ridiculous...i bought my last bike there, because the guy didn't post up a photo, scared everybody else away
    "He can make even a global summit meeting seem like a kegger." M. Dowd, NY Times, 19 July 2006

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by adamantane
    ...of course the shipping people charge on ebay is ridiculous...
    Are these equal to you, if not why? Two the same items, one with $20 price and $2 S&H and one with $2 price and $20 S&H?
    What do I know, ask the "experts"!

  22. #22
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    I have been using ebay since 01'. I have learned a few things about bidding, selling and ebay as a whole. When it comes to buying the highest bid gets the item doesn't matter when the bid is placed - now , later , proxy or snipe. As to the OP stating early bidding runs up the price ? I'll have to agree on some level. If an item stays low in price as a buyer you may make the assumption it is going to sell low so you don't consider bidding higher. If that same item goes up in up in price you adjust the value and may bid higher. We all set max $ amounts we want to spend but if we still think we are getting a deal we spend more $.

  23. #23
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    I purchase quite a lot of items on Ebay.

    I have become pretty good at "1 second to go" bids. I usually win...



    R.
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by keen
    I have been using ebay since 01'. I have learned a few things about bidding, selling and ebay as a whole. When it comes to buying the highest bid gets the item doesn't matter when the bid is placed - now , later , proxy or snipe. As to the OP stating early bidding runs up the price ? I'll have to agree on some level. If an item stays low in price as a buyer you may make the assumption it is going to sell low so you don't consider bidding higher. If that same item goes up in up in price you adjust the value and may bid higher. We all set max $ amounts we want to spend but if we still think we are getting a deal we spend more $.
    Ummmm...not really. I know how much an item is worth to me and how much I am willing to pay (including shipping, I always adjust bids for shipping). If some one else is willing to pay more, fine. I will not get in a bidding war and do not think I get a "deal" if I do get caught in one and exceed my limit.

    Snipes are my way to hold to my limit and avoid competing with the guy who thinks "I will bid $1 more than the current price" is the way to pay the game.
    I do not get every item I bid on by snipe but I rarely get one that I do not snipe.
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  25. #25
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    I rarely bid. After research i look for buy it now options. PoW. Done.

    I ain't got time for 7 days of silly $1 bidding for it to sell at the same price as 90% of the buy it now offers.


  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozvena
    Are these equal to you, if not why? Two the same items, one with $20 price and $2 S&H and one with $2 price and $20 S&H?
    That is a way for the seller to save on Ebay fees, see they don't charge a percentage for the shipping just the selling price. That being said I would buy the one for $20 with the $2 S&H just for being honest.

  27. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee
    That is a way for the seller to save on Ebay fees, see they don't charge a percentage for the shipping just the selling price. That being said I would buy the one for $20 with the $2 S&H just for being honest.
    Also, I think if the seller is forced to return you money, he only has to return the item's worth and not the shipping cost.. so you get $2 back for the $22 item. I am not sure on this though.

  28. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee
    That is a way for the seller to save on Ebay fees, see they don't charge a percentage for the shipping just the selling price. That being said I would buy the one for $20 with the $2 S&H just for being honest.
    You are a comedian! Being honest with whom? With Ebay but not with yourself? After all, it is called "Shipping and handling". Do you sell on ebay? Do you know how much effort is it, take pictures, put it on ebay, pack it carefully, provide estimates for international, answer questions, deal with scamers and fraud, communicating with buyers,driving to post office, filling our forms, standing in the line and driving back?

    It is really sad that we can't put a price for that because of people like you who complaint about high S&H and that we should pay more ebay and paypal coz they deserve it.

    Do you know how much it cost to me to sell $10 item (ebay and paypal fees) for example? Do you know that ebay and paypal is the same company and they get it all?

    They both this a smart move, kudos to them but frankly as long as they keep charging me more I will charge more for S&H. Overall I am loosing because some items I sell are many hundreds of dollars and I can charge $500 for S&H.
    What do I know, ask the "experts"!

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by marktomin
    Also, I think if the seller is forced to return you money, he only has to return the item's worth and not the shipping cost.. so you get $2 back for the $22 item. I am not sure on this though.
    Are you talking from your experience? I always got the total I paid back. But I never returned an item because I changed my mind. There was always something wrong with it and it makes sense to get it back all.
    What do I know, ask the "experts"!

  30. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozvena
    You are a comedian! Being honest with whom? With Ebay but not with yourself? After all, it is called "Shipping and handling". Do you sell on ebay? Do you know how much effort is it, take pictures, put it on ebay, pack it carefully, provide estimates for international, answer questions, deal with scamers and fraud, communicating with buyers,driving to post office, filling our forms, standing in the line and driving back?
    This post is 100% spot on! eBay is a huge time suck, and only worth my while when I have bigger items to sell. It's disruptive to my sechdule, to the house (boxes, piles of stuff, photo table & lighting set up), etc. I only have time for smaller items when I'm "in the mode" for selling a frame, wheels, forks, etc.

    That said, eBay is a competitive venture. I could try to charge for my time, but I'm going head to head with other sellers. With bike stuff, I've found FREE shipping & handling to produce better results than charging. Buyers seem to recognize this, adjust their prices accordingly, and all-in-all I think I attract more eyeballs -- resulting in higher bids.

    And for whatever stupid reason, despite all of eBay's fees, I still prefer it over Craig's List. Mainly, I like the wider market, and I hate setting my own prices. eBay bidders almost always surprise me with what they're willing to pay, making up for any eBay & PayPal premiums.
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  31. #31
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    Given the value of the internet, craigslist, local boards, ebay completed listings, etc., a buyer can get a good idea of how much they are willing to spend. In the ebay arena, my methods vary:
    - Place an item on my watch list and revisit it later. Mostly items I'd like to have but could live without if I forget to look again before auction ends.
    - Bid my final amount early and forget about it. Last minute bid wars benefit the seller but rarely benefit the buyer. Placing multiple bids in small increments early also gives the appearance that the early bidder may have reconsidered and "bid high to buy" so others shy away from bidding on the item.
    - Sniping? Yeah, I've done it and scored big time but rarely. The drawback is having to be at a PC when auction ends. Never tried any sniping services.
    - I run a search for a few things I really want at different times thoughout the day and sort results by 'newly listed' and look for 'buy it now' items that fit my acceptable price range and snag 'em right then and there. A lot of great deals can be had from sellers who just want to unload product and not wait 7-10 days for an auction to end. The 'newly listed' sort is my preferred method.

    Also take into consideration how much your time is worth vs. cost savings realized from investing that time in hunting down a deal. Sometimes it's better to just pull the trigger on what you want and get on with your life. Getting out and riding the bike you have is better than time spent thinking about that bike you're waiting for the great deal on but can't ride (yet!).

  32. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozvena
    You are a comedian! Being honest with whom? With Ebay but not with yourself? After all, it is called "Shipping and handling". Do you sell on ebay? Do you know how much effort is it, take pictures, put it on ebay, pack it carefully, provide estimates for international, answer questions, deal with scamers and fraud, communicating with buyers,driving to post office, filling our forms, standing in the line and driving back?

    It is really sad that we can't put a price for that because of people like you who complaint about high S&H and that we should pay more ebay and paypal coz they deserve it.

    Do you know how much it cost to me to sell $10 item (ebay and paypal fees) for example? Do you know that ebay and paypal is the same company and they get it all?

    They both this a smart move, kudos to them but frankly as long as they keep charging me more I will charge more for S&H. Overall I am loosing because some items I sell are many hundreds of dollars and I can charge $500 for S&H.
    I am not saying that it is wrong to charge extra for S&H because it doese take a lot of work, but $20 on a item that only takes a stamp just to beat the Ebay charges is wrong!!! Yes I have sold and I choose to use Ebay, Ebay doesn't choose me so I follow their rules! If you are complaining about their charges well don't use them!! One more thing I was not complaining or nocking them, I was just explaining why sellers do it and sticking with my morels I don't have to buy from them! I didn't see anything funny about my original statement just the facts.

  33. #33
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    In general I do not care how much people make. You seem to do care and that is a tough position. If somebody values his 15-30-60 minutes at $20 minus the actuals shipping let's be it.

    There are industries charging thousands for the same time. Ebay gets "billions" bucks per hour of their effort. I do not have a problem with that you do.

    I do what is right for me and that is value my time and effort.

    You are wrongly trying to decide for us how we should value our time.

    So if supermarket or gas station raise the prices that can also be called "beating" the system?

    Why do you care how much people make? You must be sick looking at most of the ebay auctions.
    What do I know, ask the "experts"!

  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdundee
    Ebay doesn't choose me so I follow their rules!
    Which rule you have specifically in mind?

    Ebay is doing everything they can to get $$$$$$$$$$$ from S&H charges. They introduced the seller rating system where buyers rate S&H part of the contract. This is designed for people like you who accept terms because that is the item they choose to buy and then complain about S&H clearly specified before the bids are placed. I do not get it. I think this one thing is meant to IQ test buyers IMO. You do not like it then do not bit but don't tell me what is right or wrong.
    What do I know, ask the "experts"!

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozvena
    In general I do not care how much people make. You seem to do care and that is a tough position. If somebody values his 15-30-60 minutes at $20 minus the actuals shipping let's be it.

    There are industries charging thousands for the same time. Ebay gets "billions" bucks per hour of their effort. I do not have a problem with that you do.

    I do what is right for me and that is value my time and effort.

    You are wrongly trying to decide for us how we should value our time.

    So if supermarket or gas station raise the prices that can also be called "beating" the system?

    Why do you care how much people make? You must be sick looking at most of the ebay auctions.
    You totally missed my point again some of these ebay companies are not using the S&H to cover their time and expenses, but to avoid paying the ebay fees and that is fine for them. I am not judging them or you and your time is worth a lot and you should add it in the S&H. I also add time in to ship but I don't try to cover the ebay fees, to me it's not right
    but if you feel it is that's cool too. We all have a choice to buy or not so it's really a silly argument. Cheers and Ride on friend!!

  36. #36
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    The thing is you just do not know what their intention is. Even if you do there is no rule being broken. There is no specific rule about S&H. The statement that cough my attention was a generic one: "..of course the shipping people charge on ebay is ridiculous.." which started it all. You seemed to agree with it, I do not.

    Also each action invokes reaction. The action is ebay and paypal fees going up. I have heard complaints about shops going out of business because of that. The first they would charge more for S&H. That is just natural. If ebay do not like it they too can leave (them). They will certainly leave ebay if they no longer can take it.

    If you present me 2 auctions with the same BIN price + S&H, the same feedback and condition. I would probably choose the one with lower S&H and higher price. I buy often but I have never seen such a case.

    I always look at the lowest price + S&H and do not think weather S&H is reasonable or not.
    What do I know, ask the "experts"!

  37. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by ozvena
    The thing is you just do not know what their intention is. Even if you do there is no rule being broken. There is no specific rule about S&H. The statement that cough my attention was a generic one: "..of course the shipping people charge on ebay is ridiculous.." which started it all. You seemed to agree with it, I do not.

    Also each action invokes reaction. The action is ebay and paypal fees going up. I have heard complaints about shops going out of business because of that. The first they would charge more for S&H. That is just natural. If ebay do not like it they too can leave (them). They will certainly leave ebay if they no longer can take it.

    If you present me 2 auctions with the same BIN price + S&H, the same feedback and condition. I would probably choose the one with lower S&H and higher price. I buy often but I have never seen such a case.

    I always look at the lowest price + S&H and do not think weather S&H is reasonable or not.
    See thats where everthing got crazy! I never once agreed that the shipping costs where ridiculous and I never would because like yourself if the price plus shipping was to high I wouldn't buy. Even when I did buy with to high of shipping (in my own opinion) I still gave 100% positive feedback cause I paid it and I knew what it was before I bid. I love Ebay, it can be a lot of fun and a great way to get a little extra cash for the extra parts on my shelf.

    and yes ebay +paypal is getting crazy on their fees and I can't blame people for trying to recover some of it.

  38. #38
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    Great to hear
    What do I know, ask the "experts"!

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