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  1. #1
    Gumnut Peddler
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    ZTR Alpine/Crest – Tyre recommendation for tubeless.

    Looking at purchasing a ZTR Alpine or Crest wheelset for the upcoming XC season, and am now looking at a good tyre combo to complete the package.

    For the last 2 years I have run a Racing Ralph/Rocket Ron combo on my Anthem with tubes, but have been told by a couple of local XC riders that the newer versions of the UST Schwalbe tyres are known for blowoffs?

    This now has me slightly worried, as I do not like the idea of a tyre blowing off a rim during a training session let alone during a race.

    I have done a bit of research around my local LBS’s and have come up with the following:

    Maxxis Ikon XC Folding – 26x2.2. $37 each
    Maxxis High Roller XC Folding – 26x2.1. $31 each
    Maxxis Crossmark XC – 26x2.1. $38 each
    Maxxis Larsen XC LUST – 26x2.2. $41 each
    Continental Rubber Queen Black Chilli – 26x2.2. $60 each
    Continental Race King Folding – 26x2.2. $32 each

    I am not too sure if any/all/none of the tyres above are UST specific, but according to the notubes site, this shouldnt be an issue?

    Overall I would love a set of tyres that offer the same corner grip as my current setup, but without the issues with tubeless on the ZTR's. The majority of the riding I do consists of hard packed dirt/rock with loose gravel over the top.

    Has anyone run any of the above on ZTR rims as a tubeless setup? How did they perform, and did you have any issues with blowoffs?

    This will be my first tubeless setup. I did attempt a ghetto conversion on my existing rims, but failed two times and have now decided to retire these to the daily and shell out for something new/lighter.


    UPDATED: Updated thread topic to include ZTR Crest rims.
    Last edited by Grinderz; 01-05-2013 at 06:17 PM.
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  2. #2
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    Stans is *not* UST, its still ghetto tubeless. You dont need, and many times dont even want UST spec tires.

    If you like your current tires, give them a try tubeless. If they blow off, start trying new stuff until you find something acceptable on the stans rim. Or buy a UST wheelset and dont have the hassle of ghetto tubeless setups!

  3. #3
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    Cheers One Pivot. The weight/price of the ZTR Alpines is what has me wanting them over a set of UST spec rims.

    If I can get away with running non-UST folding tyres as well, than this is even better.

    The issue I dont want to deal with is random blowoffs leaving me up the proverbial or with me heading face first towards hard stationary objects.

    The video on the ZTR tubeless system does look more promising than some UST rim systems as well



    Could just be a marketing ploy, but the 'ghetto ZTR' rims seem to burp less air - which appeals to me.
    Last edited by Grinderz; 01-03-2013 at 10:54 PM.
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  4. #4
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    Currently running ZTR Alpines tubeless with Stan's yellow tape. Rocket Ron EVO 2.25 front. RaceKing Supersonic 2.0 rear. Been working great, no blow-offs or other issues.

  5. #5
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    Cheers xc71 - this is exactly what I wanted to hear.
    How long have you been running this combo for? The EVO's are not UST just foldable from memory?
    Maybe running a non UST might be the way to go...
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  6. #6
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    Correct - folding but non UST, so two scoops for stan's sealant. I have a 1 1/2 years on this set-up but admittedly I have a 2nd bike I also ride often.

  7. #7
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    Cheers for the reply xc71.
    How are you finding the Alpines?
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  8. #8
    Formerly of Kent
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    Do yourself a favor and get the Crests instead. Wider rim, much better support for tires.
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  9. #9
    Gumnut Peddler
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    Cheers Le Duke.
    I have priced up the Crests and they come out at $80 more expensive.
    $40 per rim. Are they that much better?

    Crests: eBay Australia: Buy new & used fashion, electronics & home d
    Alpine: eBay Australia: Buy new & used fashion, electronics & home d

    Cant seem to find them cheaper online for the same build - including sites such as Wiggle.
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  10. #10
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    Wiggle have Conti Mountain King II on sale at the moment. For the price I think it might be worth giving these a run on the ZTR's.

    Have done a bit of research and apparently you have to paint the inside of the tyre with Stans before mounting to seal up all the leaks around the sidewalls.

    Here are the tyres that are on special: Wiggle | Continental Mountain King II Folding MTB Tyre | MTB Off-Road Tyres

    Race Kings are also on sale: Wiggle | Continental Race King Folding MTB Tyre | MTB Off-Road Tyres
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  11. #11
    Killer b.
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    I run Crests with Maxxis CrossMark rear and Aspen front. The Aspen is extremely fast and grips a lot better than you'd think to look at it. Both 2.1 folding. I've blown Maxxis tires off the back rim in the past, but only the EXCeption series with the higher 120tpi thread count. The trick with Maxxis apparently is to use the 60tpi folding. It seems to have a slightly thicker side wall and stronger, tighter fitting bead. I've not had a problem running the 120 tpi versions on the front.

    I highly recommend these as an extremely light and fast rolling cross country race combo.
    Last edited by The Understater; 01-06-2013 at 01:49 AM. Reason: spelling
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  12. #12
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    Cheers for the tip bshallard.

    Not too sure on where to find the TPI, but I am assuming the lower TPI count would be these?
    Wiggle Australia | Maxxis CrossMark 70A Folding Mountain Bike Tyre | MTB Off-Road Tyres

    I spoke to a couple of local riders and a couple have now mentioned the Crossmark for the rear, so I think this may be a high contender.

    For the front I am now leaning towards something like this to help grip with the loose over hard we have around my parts of the woods:
    Wiggle Australia | Maxxis Ignitor Folding Tyre | MTB Off-Road Tyres

    Still not 100% decided though as I still have a bit of hum/har time though as its currently Sunday and shops are not open. If I wasn't new to the whole tubeless experience I could justify shelling out for another set of RaRa/RoRo's but at the risk of buggering it all up its a big outlay for a failed project.

    Examined my current set of tyres and there is no way the will seal up in their current shape. Have put a whole XC season on to them, and they are pretty stuffed as a result.
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  13. #13
    Killer b.
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    Have a look at this chart on the Maxxis site.

    CrossMark

    I couldn't tell which variant they are advertising on the link you sent. You might need to check with Wiggle.
    The eXC series are the lightest, with the tightest thread count, but they're the least robust. The LUST are designed to run tubeless with thicker sidewalls, but they're pretty heavy. The folding ones that aren't eXC or LUST are the ones to go for. Chances are you will get the eXC to air up on the Crest, but eventually the bead stretches and blows off the rim... on the back wheel anyway. I've landed some pretty decent jumps with the eXC on the front and never had a problem. 30 psi seems to be the right tire pressure to keep things compliant without getting squirrelly.
    I'm about to change my front Aspen for a 2.25 as the 2.1 seems smaller than the 2.1 Crossmark. The Ignitor looks like a good tire for the front.
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  14. #14
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    Thanks.

    I think it must be the EXO with the 60 tpi

    These are also at a good price and are located within Aus: Maxxis Crossmark 26 x 2.10 EXO Folding MTB Tyre
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  15. #15
    Killer b.
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    Looks good. I think you will enjoy your new wheel tire combo.
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grinderz View Post
    Cheers for the reply xc71.
    How are you finding the Alpines?
    Alpines have been great - no issues and thats been laced to the lightweight Sapim Superspokes.

  17. #17
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    I've run that Schwalbe combo on my Crests for years never had any issues with blow offs or burping and plan to replace the current set with same tyres. The stan rims work best with non UST tyres.

  18. #18
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    Cheers tahic.
    You able to post up some pics of your setup? You running wired non-ust Schwalbe or folding Schwalbe?
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  19. #19
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    These are the only pics I have to hand right now but if you want more just shout. These were taken as I put them on a new frame, hubs are Hadleys. I'm running folding evo versions of the tyres (non pacestar TLR) although I run a newer set of TLR pacestar on another bike both without issue.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails ZTR Alpine/Crest – Tyre recommendation for tubeless.-p1000069.jpg  

    ZTR Alpine/Crest – Tyre recommendation for tubeless.-p1000157.jpeg  

    ZTR Alpine/Crest – Tyre recommendation for tubeless.-p1000158.jpeg  

    ZTR Alpine/Crest – Tyre recommendation for tubeless.-p1000164.jpeg  


  20. #20
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    Cheers tahic.
    How did you go with mounting them tubeless?

    Nice bike BTW, bet it rides like a dream.
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  21. #21
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    Thanks Grinderz yes it's a great bike I'm a big pivot fan. They mount with a floor pump on the Stans rims and I'm a girl so simple. Any other rim has required a compressor.
    Hope you are not being affected by those fires too badly?

  22. #22
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    Wheels and tyres arrived last night. Got home late from work so didnt get a chance to take too many pics.

    Wheels:


    No issues with getting the tyres on the rims. Only time I needed to use a lever was when I realised I had stupidly put the tyre on the wrong way (they are directional).

    Decided to air them up without stans first to see if I would have any dramas with seating the bead.

    Could get air into the crossmark with my mini hand pump which was surprising. Not fast enough to seat the bead, but the tyre did inflate some without purging all the air at the same rate. I think if I had no other option I could have persisted and got it done with the dinky hand pump.

    The ignitor wouldn't take any air with the hand pump - which confirmed what I read on the forum. Having said that, once I got my small electric pump on to it, it inflated first go.

    Both the crossmark and ignitor went up first go on the electric compressor. Didnt need to remove the valve core and both beads seating with small twangs. I believe a bigger hand pump would have worked for both to be honest.

    Pumped both up to 35psi and let them sit whilst I got the Stans ready. The crossmark still had a good amount of pressure after sitting for 20mins or so. The ignitor still had air, but considerably less.

    Tyres on rims. Inflated first go, no stans:


    Before adding the Stans I decided to burp both tyres. Could squeeze the sidewalls together on the ignitor with no burp. Didnt have the strength the squeeze the crossmark together due to its higher air pressure. Hopefully this is an indication as to how well they will keep air on the trails.

    Fed 2 scoops of Stans into the tyres via the valves. Learnt the hard way that the last bit likes to push air back out before going into the tyre. (Stans stick to clothing really well)

    Gave both a shake, aired back up again without any dramas and did the shake/spin/rest/shake/spin/shake/shake/shake dance with both rims and let them be for the night.

    Checked first thing this am, and only a 2psi loss of pressure on the crossmark and 4psi loss of pressure on the ignitor. I think both probably due to air loss when fitting the pressure gauge.

    Tonight I will be moving my cassette and rotors over to the new rims, and first ride on Sat. Cant wait to feel the difference!
    Last edited by Grinderz; 01-17-2013 at 07:49 PM.
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  23. #23
    Colorado
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    Please report back Grinderz, as I'm thinking about setting up some regular 26' Ignitors on Crests.

  24. #24
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    Ride went well. No issues at all from the new wheels and tyres. Both held up pressure and when cleaning the bike after the ride (got stuck in a downpour which resulted in a heap of mud) I noticed a pinhole sized bit of yellow on the rear tyre. Obviously Stans did its job repairing a puncture!

    Like I mentioned before, the Ignitors didnt hold air as well as the Crossmark without the Stans Sealant, but once added and left to do its thing, I still have fully inflated tyres on my bike as of 5 minutes ago.

    I will try and reupload some pics of the process. The site I usually use wasnt too keen on uploading them the other day.
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  25. #25
    Formerly of Kent
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    Make sure you check out the tension of the spokes. They can do weird things when you mount a tire on the rims.

    Just make sure everything checks out. It will save you time and money in the long run.
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  26. #26
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    Another couple of rides under my belt without any issues. Spoke tension also appears fine.

    In regards to tyre pressures. The front lost a little pressure during the week. Diagnosed the leak down to a loose valve. Tightened it back up again, added air and no more dramas.

    Poser shot with the new tyres as of today:
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  27. #27
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    Just an update on these wheels.

    Today the rear tyre blew off the rim. Possibly as a result of over inflating with the hand pump, I dont know. Was in the middle of a team event and burped out some air. Pulled up at the end of my lap to let my team mate go, and went to town with the hand pump knowing I only have a limited amount of time to fix bike, hydrate, run to the loo and eat something before jumping back on the bike.

    ANYWAYS, pumping away with the pump and BANG, tyre shot off and ears began ringing. No biggy I thought. Put the tyre back on the bead, reinflated and spun it around.

    WOW. To my disappointment, the tyre blowing off the rim put a massive buckle in the rear. It was that bad that the tyre was nearly fouling on the side of the bike!

    Quick run to the bathroom, and got out the spoke tool to try and true it up a little. Running out of time, I kind of porked the corners on some of my nipples, but did get it to a point where it would be good enough to finish.

    Didnt have time to put any more stans in or even consider a tube. Took off, and pressure remained fine for the rest of the race.

    Up until this point in time, I have loved these rims. Now after blowing off the rear tyre and ending up with a massive buckle, I am a bit pissed off about it all.

    Again this 'may' have been a result of my error in how many PSI I was pumping into the bike (with a hand pump mind you) but seriously, ending up with a buckle that bad is kind of disheartening to say the least.

    Will see how these go during the week on my training rides. Will probably have to replace 2 or 3 spokes (hopefully just the nipples) that I rounded. Going to leave that job up to the professionals though, as the wheel could still use a bit of tweaking to get perfectly true again.

    Urgh...
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  28. #28
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    Grinderz, I've been wondering to get the Stan Crest, but after this I need to rethink...Just as an information, how heavy are you ?. Which tire size are you using ?.

  29. #29
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    I weigh around 80kg's - tyre size is on the previous page.

    The wheel didnt get the buckle until the blow off. Its actually back at the shop today for them to suss out. Also going to check spoke tension on the front too, just in case.

    Need to get it sorted ASAP as I have another race in 2 weekends
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