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  1. #1
    the WALKING DEAD
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    Sun Ringle Black Flag Pro 10mm thru-bolt kit

    I have been interested in stiffening up my swingarm and have read the posts on converting quick release hubs to 10mm thru-bolts. After considering a bunch of different wheel builds that offered a 10mm convertible hub (Hope, Stan's, Hadley, etc), I settled on Sun Ringle Black Flag Pro's. Sun Ringle describes the rear hub as being 12mm compatible, so at first I didn't think it would work with standard 10mm dropouts. But, after emails were sent to Sun Ringle they told me part 281-25122-Bolt is a step down bolt on axle that works with the 12mm center of the hub, but "steps down" to 10mm at the dropout. This also works with the Charger Pro wheels too. I asked my LBS to call Sun Ringle and order the kit.

    With the kit, you get the step down axle, new hub end caps, and bolts. Of course, there are no instructions.
    The disc brake side is a press fit, you wiggle the qr cap loose and replace it with the 12mm end cap.
    The drive side is threaded on. I used a 5mm allen wrench.
    With the 12mm end caps installed, the step-down axle just slides in. Then you align it with the drop outs and bolt it on. Pretty simple. I hope it stiffens things up this upcoming riding season.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Sun Ringle Black Flag Pro 10mm thru-bolt kit-p2180321.jpg  

    Sun Ringle Black Flag Pro 10mm thru-bolt kit-p2180322.jpg  

    Sun Ringle Black Flag Pro 10mm thru-bolt kit-p2180323.jpg  

    Sun Ringle Black Flag Pro 10mm thru-bolt kit-p2180326.jpg  

    Sun Ringle Black Flag Pro 10mm thru-bolt kit-p2190337.jpg  

    Your momma's so nasty, she keeps ice between her legs just to keep the crabs fresh.

  2. #2
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    How much did the conversion kit cost? Have you had a chance to give it a test?
    On-One ScandAl 29er
    "...Obviously you're not a golfer"

  3. #3
    the WALKING DEAD
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    I haven't ridden the wheelset yet. As you can see from the pics, my bike is missing a few parts! The kit was around $25. Even though it wasn't that hard to figure out how to put together, it would be nice if Sun Ringle would include some instructions. They include everything else though, 9mm, 15mm, and 20mm axles for the front wheel, Stan's yellow tape, valve stems, and 2 little bottles of sealant. And with the kit, a 10mm bolt on rear hub.
    Your momma's so nasty, she keeps ice between her legs just to keep the crabs fresh.

  4. #4
    Cut Casing Whisperer
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    Nice find! Thanks for sharing.

    P

  5. #5
    SPECIALizED
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    I sent an email to Sun Ringle as well regarding the axle for a set of Charger Pros I just ordered and was told you can just slide a 5mm QR thru the axle instead of using the bolts.

  6. #6
    the WALKING DEAD
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    That is true. The axle is hollow and a QR will slide through. I am digging the bolts though, and plan on using them.
    Your momma's so nasty, she keeps ice between her legs just to keep the crabs fresh.

  7. #7
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    By the way, OPr...those gold hubs and black rims are going to look pretty dang nice with that color of frame you are throwing them on!
    On-One ScandAl 29er
    "...Obviously you're not a golfer"

  8. #8
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    My local shops don't seem to be able to get this kit. I have even provided them with the part number. Any idea on an online retailer who can get it? Since Sun won't deal direct. Many thanks

  9. #9
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    This wheelset just keeps getting better and better. If you could let me know where you ordered it I want to get mine!
    X-prezo Super-D, 26in style.

  10. #10
    the WALKING DEAD
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    My lbs contacted Hayes directly. The phone # for hayes, answer, and sun ringle all appear to be the same: 888-686-3472. The shop guy at the bike shop said it was a bit of a pain to get a hold of Hayes because the number is often busy, or they have to leave a message. Also, my shop couldn't use their business credit card (they used Am Express, or Discovery, or something), so I trusted him with my Master Card #. I've been to the same shop and talked to the same guy for about 10 years so I figured I could trust the guy. He said he's ordered items with customer cards lots of times before too.
    Anyway, after getting in touch with Hayes and getting a credit card that they accept, the part was ordered direct from Hayes to the lbs and they called me when it came in. As some of the other posts mentioned, I couldn't find this part on line either. At first I thought my lbs would get it through QBP or one of the other distributors, but they had to get it direct from Hayes. You may have to pester your shop guy as I'm sure he doesn't want to sit on the phone trying to order some doo-dad. At least my guy was cooperative, but he was pretty clear that it was a pain in the a$$. Good Luck!
    Your momma's so nasty, she keeps ice between her legs just to keep the crabs fresh.

  11. #11
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    Cool, thanks for the info. I see the 12mm end caps everywhere. You've been a big help.

  12. #12
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    I just got a call back from John at Hayes/Sun Ringle, and he gave me a different part number than the one listed in the original post. He said the part is EM71R812CAP. (I explained that I had a Charger Pro rear wheel without any adapters, only set up for thru-axle, and needed the adapter kit to use a quick release.) He confirmed that I need to order through a bike shop -- any shop will do, they don't need to be a Sun Ringle dealer or anything. Said the MSRP was $15.

    Am going to place the order now, will report back.

  13. #13
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    Anybody use these for the Charger Pro yet? I guess they'll work, I think the hubs are the same. This seems like an upgrade a lot of people would want. Why do they have to make it such a pain to get them???

    My LBS is going to give me a hard time for buying a wheelset online, (yeah they're like that). Would have bought from them if they sold em!

  14. #14
    the WALKING DEAD
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    I was just poking around the Price Point site and noticed they have the Charger Pro 12x135 end caps available (and 12x142 also). This is not the complete kit that I got from Sun Ringle, but Price Point also has an Azonic Momentum Axle 12x135 that steps down to 10mm at the drop outs for regular old frames. Put the Charger end caps together with the Azonic axle and you can have a beefy 12mm connection at the rear drop outs. As far as I know the Charger Pro end caps should work with the Black Flag Pro wheels as well (but the color won't match). For anyone having trouble getting the complete kit from Sun Ringle, this should make things a lot easier for you.
    Your momma's so nasty, she keeps ice between her legs just to keep the crabs fresh.

  15. #15
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    Nice! I've been coveting these rims and wondering whether or not to get them as their whole system is very flexible and a great deal. Let us know when you're out and riding them. I'd be especially interested as I would like to get them for my AS-R.

  16. #16
    the WALKING DEAD
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    So I got my bike assembled at the end of August, rode the bike twice and then threw my back out and didn't ride for about 3 weeks. I put some slicks on my bike and have been riding on pavement so as to not aggravate my back. The wheels roll really smooth and accellerate quickly. The freewheel is kind of loud and seems to engage quicker than some Mavic Crossmax's I had in the past. I was worried that 24 spokes wouldn't be stiff enough, but they feel fine. I flipped the bike upsided down, spun the rear wheel and put my thumbnail against the rim to check for trueness. They have a "hump" in the rim that worried me at first, but I figure that is where the rim was pinned and welded. Going around the rear wheel just now, I found one spoke that has gone totally slack. I can turn the nipple by hand. I'll have to take it to the lbs for a truing. I bought these (for about $436 from Price Point, had them price match a less reputable retailer) because they were less expensive than Stan's stock wheelsets, or Hope Hoops and included most of the adapters I needed.
    Your momma's so nasty, she keeps ice between her legs just to keep the crabs fresh.

  17. #17
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    Hmm. I'm not really needing wheels but these things are calling out to me for their flexibility. I bet I could sell my old wheels for around $150-200. That would make these a pretty good deal based on your find on the website.

  18. #18
    Basura Blanca
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    I've had the same issue w/ my Charger Pro rear wheel. Ride hard for a day, and one or two spokes will be loose. I just tighten them back up to about the same tension as the nearby spokes (making sure they're not twisting) and call it good. Don't know if it's a poor quality machine build, or somehow a function of the direct pull spokes, but I'm keeping an eye on it after every ride. Sometime this winter I'll probably rebuild it, using spoke prep and a tensiometer, and see if that cures it. Other than that complaint, I love the wheelset. I may see about getting the bolt-on adapters, too.
    - Joe

    Quote Originally Posted by aph72 View Post
    Going around the rear wheel just now, I found one spoke that has gone totally slack. I can turn the nipple by hand. I'll have to take it to the lbs for a truing.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by NuMexJoe View Post
    I've had the same issue w/ my Charger Pro rear wheel. Ride hard for a day, and one or two spokes will be loose. I just tighten them back up to about the same tension as the nearby spokes (making sure they're not twisting) and call it good. Don't know if it's a poor quality machine build, or somehow a function of the direct pull spokes, but I'm keeping an eye on it after every ride. Sometime this winter I'll probably rebuild it, using spoke prep and a tensiometer, and see if that cures it. Other than that complaint, I love the wheelset. I may see about getting the bolt-on adapters, too.
    - Joe
    I was told when I talked to Hayes that there was an issue with the first production run. He said they didn't clean some oil off the spokes which didn't allow the wheelsmith spoke prep to adhere to the spoke threads. He said this was the cause of them backing out. He told me to put loctite on the spoke threads and that would penetrate the oil and solve this problem. Well, I'm not sure how feasible it is for you, but I'm not taking all my spokes out one at a time and putting loctite on them, mainly because I don't have any wheel-building skills.

    That's all well and good, but my smallest 11 tooth gear on a 10 speed cassette has completely chewed through the aluminum freehub body on my Charger Pros after only a half a season of riding. I'm talking all the way through. I pretty much have to buy a new pricey freehub body (pawls and all) to replace it. It doesn't even matter if you run a nice cassette or not because the 11T isn't on the spider anyway. The told me they don't offer a steel replacement either, only aluminum. I'd take the weight penalty for the extra durability.
    Gotta get up to get down.
    LMB

  20. #20
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    would doing the 12mm axle with 10mm stepdown using the QR over the bolt on be just as stiff? or would using the QR make defeat the purpose? And does a regular QR axle work?

  21. #21
    the WALKING DEAD
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    The wheels come with QR's and you can certainly use them with the 12/10mm axle. I don't know for sure if that would more or less stiff than using the bolts. If you need to make quick wheel changes, the QR would be the way to go. I like the bolts though. It's probably just all in my head, but I like the idea that the wheel has as tight a connection to the dropouts as possible.
    Your momma's so nasty, she keeps ice between her legs just to keep the crabs fresh.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by aph72 View Post
    My lbs contacted Hayes directly. The phone # for hayes, answer, and sun ringle all appear to be the same: 888-686-3472. The shop guy at the bike shop said it was a bit of a pain to get a hold of Hayes because the number is often busy, or they have to leave a message. Also, my shop couldn't use their business credit card (they used Am Express, or Discovery, or something), so I trusted him with my Master Card #. I've been to the same shop and talked to the same guy for about 10 years so I figured I could trust the guy. He said he's ordered items with customer cards lots of times before too.
    Anyway, after getting in touch with Hayes and getting a credit card that they accept, the part was ordered direct from Hayes to the lbs and they called me when it came in. As some of the other posts mentioned, I couldn't find this part on line either. At first I thought my lbs would get it through QBP or one of the other distributors, but they had to get it direct from Hayes. You may have to pester your shop guy as I'm sure he doesn't want to sit on the phone trying to order some doo-dad. At least my guy was cooperative, but he was pretty clear that it was a pain in the a$$. Good Luck!
    Funny. Shop guy is complaining about calling for bike parts from a bike company. Wish I had those problems.
    ... And I Am You,
    And What I See Is Me!

  23. #23
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    That's awesome! Thanks for the info. I'm gonna pick one of these kits up now that I just bought some BFP's. Did it stiffen up the back end of your AS-R? I'm not disgusted by any means with mine but any little bit helps. Now to get a 15mm fork....

  24. #24
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    How did you get the cassette side cap off? When I tried getting it off with a rubber mallet the whole assembly popped off. Not good.

  25. #25
    the WALKING DEAD
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    I'm sorry, I can't really remember. I seem to sort of remeber there being a notch in the hub and I used a 5mm allen wrench turned sideways in the notch and using that to undo the cap. It bent my wrench, but it worked. This was awhile ago though, so I might be way off.
    Your momma's so nasty, she keeps ice between her legs just to keep the crabs fresh.

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