Stans Flow EX

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  • 06-04-2012
    mtnbiker72
    Stans Flow EX
    Look what is on the Stan's No Tubes page...wider and heavier (duty).

    Flow EX Rims
  • 06-04-2012
    WrecklessREX
    I wonder what they really weigh? The page you link linked to says 545g and the "more details" page says 490g in the 29" variety.
  • 06-04-2012
    'size
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by WrecklessREX View Post
    I wonder what they really weigh? The page you link linked to says 545g and the "more details" page says 490g in the 29" variety.

    looks like the 490g is a typo/copied from the black 26" version - the white 26" version shows the same thing and the ERD is the same for both 26" and 29".
  • 06-04-2012
    thrasher_s
    Cool. My Flows have been holding strong so far. Glad they come in all three wheel sizes AND 36h for 26".
  • 06-04-2012
    trek551
    My Flows are already overkill for my Trance X1 2011. But why not? 20gr more is nothing at these weights. 13% wider and lower beads can convert to what? 10% lower air pressure? I like the fact that they increased they durability factor as well as performance.

    As do-it-all rims on regular bikes they will be tough to beat because they are very good snow rims also.
  • 06-05-2012
    PissedOffCil
    All of Stan's new rims are moving towards the new BST, which makes me look elsewhere!
  • 06-05-2012
    Ronnie
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by PissedOffCil View Post
    All of Stan's new rims are moving towards the new BST, which makes me look elsewhere!

    Why do you say that? At this point I have not paid too much attention to the new design as my Flow rims are still doing well. Why would Stan's elect to change to an inferior system? I see that the new bead hook is smaller and I wondered about it. Have there been problems with the likes of Arch EX rims?
  • 06-05-2012
    PissedOffCil
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ronnie View Post
    Why do you say that? At this point I have not paid too much attention to the new design as my Flow rims are still doing well. Why would Stan's elect to change to an inferior system? I see that the new bead hook is smaller and I wondered about it. Have there been problems with the likes of Arch EX rims?

    The bead seat on the new BST rims is larger than on other rims which means that it doesn't work very well with most UST and tubeless ready tires. The design is meant to be used with regular tires and I'm moving more and more towards TL ready with sidewall protection tires. Therefore it doesn't fit my needs.
  • 06-05-2012
    mtnbiker72
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by PissedOffCil View Post
    All of Stan's new rims are moving towards the new BST, which makes me look elsewhere!

    Certainly does make the WTB Frequency i23 rims more appealing if you plan on using Tubeless Ready or UST tires.
  • 06-05-2012
    Ronnie
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by PissedOffCil View Post
    The bead seat on the new BST rims is larger than on other rims on the new BST which means that it doesn't work very well with most UST and tubeless ready tires. The design is meant to be used with regualr tires and I'm moving more and more towards TL ready with sidewall protection tires. Therefore it doesn't fit my needs.

    Okay, as I said I haven't paid too much attention but if No-Tubes is concentrating on their rims fitting non-tubeless tires I would also look elsewhere. I will only use a TLR or UST tire tubeless. The problem unfortunately is that there are not too many other options.
  • 06-05-2012
    PissedOffCil
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ronnie View Post
    Okay, as I said I haven't paid too much attention but if No-Tubes is concentrating on their rims fitting non-tubeless tires I would also look elsewhere. I will only use a TLR or UST tire tubeless. The problem unfortunately is that there are not too many other options.

    Exactly, I'm looking for a wide, strong, tubeless compatible and light rim for my XC hardtail and it's hard to find! The Velocity Blunt SL I currently run doesn't hold up to my abuse...
  • 06-05-2012
    notubes_pete
    Sorry for the Typo. I have corrected the 29er rim. Below are the weights.

    Flow EX Rim weights:
    26 Black = 490g
    26 White = 510g
    650b Black = 525g due Aug 1st
    29 Black = 545g
    29 White = 565g
  • 06-05-2012
    PissedOffCil
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mtnbiker72 View Post
    Certainly does make the WTB Frequency i23 rims more appealing if you plan on using Tubeless Ready or UST tires.

    Yes but the i23 is slightly out of my weight range. I'd like around 400g. A i21 would be perfect...
  • 06-05-2012
    mtnbiker72
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by PissedOffCil View Post
    Yes but the i23 is slightly out of my weight range. I'd like around 400g. A i21 would be perfect...

    Well if they ever become available again...might look at the Pacenti TL28 rims then.
  • 06-05-2012
    Ronnie
    "notubes_pete", Thank you for chiming in. From your user name and signature it's clear that you are employed by Satan's Notubes. I would appreciate some input from you on the reason for the change in the BST for these newer rims. Before changing to a 29" bike I would only use UST rims with either UST or TLR tires. Because of many user reviews, two years ago I had a wheelset built with a pair of Flow rims. I have found them to work as well as UST rims when used with TLR tires. I have no interest in using non-tubeless tires.

    I would appreciate if you could confirm what the difference is with these new rims and that they are indeed designed to use non-tubeless tires. If in fact I am going to have problems mounting some of my favorite tires or TLR tires don't work as well, I would not be able to consider them for my next rim purchase.
  • 06-05-2012
    PissedOffCil
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ronnie View Post
    I would appreciate if you could confirm what the difference is with these new rims and that they are indeed designed to use non-tubeless tires. If in fact I am going to have problems mounting some of my favorite tires or TLR tires don't work as well, I would not be able to consider them for my next rim purchase.

    +1, my comment above was based on "gossips" read on these forums. Clarifications are welcome!
  • 06-05-2012
    trenchDiggr
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by PissedOffCil View Post
    The bead seat on the new BST rims is larger than on other rims which means that it doesn't work very well with most UST and tubeless ready tires. The design is meant to be used with regular tires and I'm moving more and more towards TL ready with sidewall protection tires

    Please provide evidence for this. A test, an technical article, a logical argument, anything. I find it very hard to believe that the pioneers (and widely considered the best) of non-UST tubeless systems would introduce a new bead socket that performs worse with tubeless ready tires, at the very same time that all of the tire manufacturers are focusing more attention on producing non-UST, tubeless-ready tires. It just makes no sense at all. Sounds like BS to me.
  • 06-05-2012
    trenchDiggr
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ronnie View Post
    I would appreciate if you could confirm what the difference is with these new rims and that they are indeed designed to use non-tubeless tires. If in fact I am going to have problems mounting some of my favorite tires or TLR tires don't work as well, I would not be able to consider them for my next rim purchase.

    The Stan's website can help:

    From the Flow EX page:
    The new Flow EX is lower, wider, and meaner, offering a lower profile sidewall and redesigned Bead Socket Technology for maximum durability and tire seal on even the most punishing of technical trails. We kept the weight low, but the new EX offers 14% thicker sidewalls for maximum dent resistance and a 33% thicker spoke bed for added pull-through strength. Increasing the outside width of the rim to 29.1mm and the interior width to 25.5mm let us reshape the bead socket for an even tighter seal and allowed our internal arch to add even more stiffness to the rim's structure. The new Flow EX: the strongest, fastest rolling, and best sealing tubeless rim available for 26-inch, 29-inch and 650b tires sizes just got even better.

    So the intent of the new bead socket is better tire sealing. Not to be "better for regular tires".

    From the Recommended Tires page:
    Compatible Tubeless Tires:
    All Tubeless tires are compatible:
    UST, LUST, UST-lite, 2Bliss, Tubeless Ready, TNT (tube no tube)

    There are also a few tires listed as "not recommended" because they are either too tight or beads are too weak.

    I think it is safe to say that the new rims are intended to be used with tubeless ready tires. As would be expected.
  • 06-05-2012
    Mr.P
    To add to trenchDiggr's post (from the NoTubes website: http://www.notubes.com/RecommendedTires.aspx):
    Quote:

    Not Recommend Tires
    WTB TCS and UST 29 inch tires are too tight for Stan's Notubes rims and NoTubes licensed rims such as Sun Ringle Black Flag.
    I can see this causing some confusion (no fault to NoTubes as it is clearly stated on the website).

    I too would like to hear about the updated bead hook.


    Found this on their website too, and it would eliminate alot of threads on this forum.
    Quote:

    Tech Tip - Tire pressure
    To determine a starting tire pressure when running NoTubes tires with our ZTR rim use this simple formula.
    Rider Weight in pounds divided by 7 = x
    x - 1 = Front tire pressure in PSI
    x + 2 = Rear tire pressure in PSI
    P
  • 06-05-2012
    TaupoRider
    Honestly if you run 2bliss or any other flavor of tire DO NOT buy these or the arch EX. It is borderline impossible to mount tires to them. Trust me after first hand experience.
  • 06-05-2012
    Ronnie
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Mr.P View Post
    Found this on their website too, and it would eliminate alot of threads on this forum.

    Quote:

    Tech Tip - Tire pressure
    To determine a starting tire pressure when running NoTubes tires with our ZTR rim use this simple formula.
    Rider Weight in pounds divided by 7 = x
    x - 1 = Front tire pressure in PSI
    x + 2 = Rear tire pressure in PSI
    Be careful with that tech tip. It only applies to NoTubes tires.

    I weigh 220lbs. so my front tire based on the above should be 30psi. and my rear should be 33psi.:eekster: I ride my front 2.35 Nobby Nic at 24psi. and the rear 2.25 at 27psi. Above 30psi. I would be bouncing off everything.
  • 06-05-2012
    trenchDiggr
    Quote:

    Honestly if you run 2bliss or any other flavor of tire DO NOT buy these or the arch EX. It is borderline impossible to mount tires to them. Trust me after first hand experience.
    I run 2bliss tires on both the original Flows and the original Arches, and it could not been easier. Add a cup of sealant, pop the tire on, and pump it up with a floor pump. The bead sets immediately, first try. Same for all 4 2bliss tires I've mounted. Piece of cake.

    You have used Arch EXs with 2bliss tires and had mounting issues? What issues? Tire was too tight to mount on the rim? Bead would not set? Bead would not seal?
  • 06-05-2012
    Shalom
    The Arch EX rim is 'wider' (ie bigger diameter) than usual to create a better seal. However, this makes fitting tyres somewhat...problematic...unless you have thumbs of steel.

    Once they are on and the bead is stretched, though, refitting is simple.
  • 06-05-2012
    rufus
    Now granted, I'm no expert on rims and tires..............

    But, having seen the original BST design on the Stan';s site, it looked to have a more curved design to the bead hook, in order to capture and hold a tire bead that is round in shape, as they all used to be.

    From what i've seen, the new UST and TLR tires, the bead is bigger and more square, and that may be why I was having the blowoff problems with older RaRa's on an Arch rim, the rounded BST just didn't match well with the squared off tire bead.

    Also granted, the new BST on my Arch EX rims is very small, and I've only looked at it with my naked eyes, but the bead hook looks to be more squared off, more of a right angle. This would seem to work better at holding a more square-shaped bead onto the rim.

    Just my two bits.
  • 06-05-2012
    Mr.P
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ronnie View Post
    Be careful with that tech tip. It only applies to NoTubes tires.

    It is a good starting point for all tires.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Ronnie View Post
    I weigh 220lbs. so my front tire based on the above should be 30psi. and my rear should be 33psi.:eekster: I ride my front 2.35 Nobby Nic at 24psi. and the rear 2.25 at 27psi. Above 30psi. I would be bouncing off everything.

    As always it's a good starting point. Personal preference, riding type & terrain inform the rest (I have to go higher for landing jumps or :eekster: casing fold over & crash)

    P