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Thread: Stans Flow EX

  1. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by notubes_pete View Post
    Hi, We are updating the document again. The Arch EX and Flow EX can use 100-125kg of tention.
    So Pete, can these 2Bliss tires fully compatible with the Flow EX rim as they work quite well with my standard Flow?

    Tires inquiring about include: Specialized Butcher 2.3 Control, Eskar 2.3 Control and Purgatory Armadillo Elite 2.2. All in 26'ers with thicker 2bliss bead of course.
    Ride On!

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by jgusta View Post
    So Pete, can these 2Bliss tires fully compatible with the Flow EX rim as they work quite well with my standard Flow?

    Tires inquiring about include: Specialized Butcher 2.3 Control, Eskar 2.3 Control and Purgatory Armadillo Elite 2.2. All in 26'ers with thicker 2bliss bead of course.
    So far all 26 inch tires tested fine.
    Pete @ Stan's NOTUBES

  3. #53
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    Are the EX rims stronger than the old ones?

  4. #54
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    I recently mounted 2.2 Purgatory 2Bliss on the 29er EX rim with no problem (the tire was previously mounted). The tire went on by hand, no tools required.


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  5. #55
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    No idea about the ArchEX and FlowEX, but I use the Crest which has the newer BST mentioned earlier, with Mountain King 2 UST tires mounted. First time I used the Crest, I used wired, non-folding, non-UST tires and it was a PITA to mount. With the folding USTs I'm using, mounting and removing them was a breeze. They also locked quickly, and I was using a floor pump at that. I've had zero issues since mounting the tires.

    Am very pleased with the Crest that I'm planning to get FlowEXs for my new mountain bike and will mount UST tires on it, too.

  6. #56
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    I can buy the new Flow EX for $140 or the old Flow for $89. Is the new one worth the extra $50?
    I have Schwalbes RaRa Evo 2.1; RoRo Evo Pacestart TLR 2.25 and NoNi Evo 2.1

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stofken View Post
    I can buy the new Flow EX for $140 or the old Flow for $89. Is the new one worth the extra $50?
    I have Schwalbes RaRa Evo 2.1; RoRo Evo Pacestart TLR 2.25 and NoNi Evo 2.1
    Who ever wants to charge you $140 for the Flow EX is ripping you off. What size do you want. Regardless, both 26" and 29" are listed on the No-Tubes website at $93:

    Flow EX Rims
    The trouble with having an open mind is that people will insist on trying to put things in it.

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    I mean for a pair of rims. i'll buy them from ActionSports.de as I'm from Belgium. In their custom wheel builder, the old flow is 70 EUR ($89) a pair and the new EX are 110 EUR ($140) a pair. The guys over at wheelbuilder.com think it's worth it.

    I am leaning towards the old Flow and use that $50 to upgrade from a DT 350 to a DT 240 hub.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stofken View Post
    I can buy the new Flow EX for $140 or the old Flow for $89. Is the new one worth the extra $50?
    I have Schwalbes RaRa Evo 2.1; RoRo Evo Pacestart TLR 2.25 and NoNi Evo 2.1
    Either rims is overkill for theses tires as they are more suited for width 2.3 and up and aggressive riding. I'd suggest Arch EX if you want to keep your tires. If you are over 220lbs then yes go with the Flows but buy bigger tires.

  10. #60
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    I'm 97kg (214lbs) without gear.

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    Quote Originally Posted by trek551 View Post
    Either rims is overkill for theses tires as they are more suited for width 2.3 and up and aggressive riding. I'd suggest Arch EX if you want to keep your tires. If you are over 220lbs then yes go with the Flows but buy bigger tires.
    Then you still have a choice. At your weight I'd go Arch EX for XC/marathon/trail. I'd go Flows EX for everything else, especially if you live up north and ride in snow.

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stofken View Post
    I can buy the new Flow EX for $140 or the old Flow for $89. Is the new one worth the extra $50?
    I have Schwalbes RaRa Evo 2.1; RoRo Evo Pacestart TLR 2.25 and NoNi Evo 2.1
    Only if you need the extra girth as the internal width on the EX is wide as regular DH rims, but at trail/AM weight. I ran my regular Flows for while with a couple of hops up front, but kept running for at least a few seasons with no probs, but my rear would require truing fairly often (every few months) and still wasn't strong/stiff enough for my tail (215 lbs geared that hammer the descents fairly hard). If you aren't typically hard on things (breaks stuff often as I do) and you plan to use Flows for trail to regular AM use at most, then they are definitely sufficient. If needing some more girth/stiffness out back and hard on rear wheel, go Flow Ex.

    The prices you listed are kind of crazy as you should be able to get a Flow for $50/rim on closeout pricing now and $90 tops for Flow EX at retail. I have a hardly used Flow (only about a month of use on it) as I had it built to replace another Flow that I ran forever, then the Flow EX came out just following and decided that was going work better for me. PM if interested in rim as it is almost new and I would sell <$50 for sure. I paid like $85 for it before the EX came out.
    Ride On!

  13. #63
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    I can get the old Flows at $89 a pair not per rim, that would be crazy indeed.
    I don't really need the extra width as my widest tire is a 2.25.
    I live in Belgium, Europe, fairly flat here, do mostly XC, AM. I'm not hard on things, but my weight normally requires a downhill rim.
    I've destroyed my front wheel on a descent, I wasn't even riding that hard. I noticed a flat tire, replaced the tube. But on tarmac, I noticed the bump in the wheel, a flat spot they call it? It's not out of true because there's no problem when I use my v-brakes.
    I don't ride in snow.

    I can get these rims for roughly the same price a set: dt xr 400 $64, dt ex 500 $89, some mavics. The NoTubes are the most expensive.

  14. #64
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    Hi there - since an employee of Notubes posts here, I might as well copy/paste from the other Flow EX topic:

    Here's my feedback on the Flow EX, with a Specialized Butcher SX, front rim, used for downhill:

    -Mounted tubeless with a non-tubeless tire at 28psi / 1.9 bar (just yellow tape, and stans latex), the tire just blew off the rim in a very loud POP on a hard compression (bike was straight, it is not a tire roll off). I initially thought the rim had broken in half, but the tire just went off the rim on both sides at the same time! It left me pushing the bike to the bottom of the slope. I had the same issue a year ago with a Butcher mounted on a regular Flow, and expected it to be solved with the Flow EX; quite disappointed here.

    -I then switched to tubes, same setup otherwise, Butcher SX and yellow tape, no problem whatsoever. I had a really nasty crash and the rim is still perfectly true (tensioned on the disc side @125kgs) so it seems strong enough for DH. But not tubeless, at least not with a Butcher SX. Don't know how it would handle UST tires or double-ply tires mounted tubeless, though.

    My questions: would using a proper UST tire (like a Maxxis Minion DHF UST) help for a better tubeless setup? Do you guys have a flap for the Flow EX (website is down right now, can't look it up) that would help with a tighter fit? I would really love to run my Flow EX tubeless, instead of using a tube.


    Thanks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stofken View Post
    I mean for a pair of rims. i'll buy them from ActionSports.de as I'm from Belgium. In their custom wheel builder, the old flow is 70 EUR ($89) a pair and the new EX are 110 EUR ($140) a pair. The guys over at wheelbuilder.com think it's worth it.

    I am leaning towards the old Flow and use that $50 to upgrade from a DT 350 to a DT 240 hub.
    I have run both (Flow and Flow EX). Given your weight and location, I'd recommend the Arch EX or the old (non-EX) Flow. The new Flow-EX is heavier and stronger, but perhaps overkill for your application. The older Flows are plenty strong, a little lighter, and much cheaper . The Arch EX are lighter still, probably as strong as the old Flow, but probably also more expensive.

    Both will give your tires a nice profile, and will run most tires tubeless quite well.

    Quote Originally Posted by SwintOrSlude View Post
    Hi there - since an employee of Notubes posts here, I might as well copy/paste from the other Flow EX topic:

    Here's my feedback on the Flow EX, with a Specialized Butcher SX, front rim, used for downhill:

    -Mounted tubeless with a non-tubeless tire at 28psi / 1.9 bar (just yellow tape, and stans latex), the tire just blew off the rim in a very loud POP on a hard compression (bike was straight, it is not a tire roll off). I initially thought the rim had broken in half, but the tire just went off the rim on both sides at the same time! It left me pushing the bike to the bottom of the slope. I had the same issue a year ago with a Butcher mounted on a regular Flow, and expected it to be solved with the Flow EX; quite disappointed here.

    -I then switched to tubes, same setup otherwise, Butcher SX and yellow tape, no problem whatsoever. I had a really nasty crash and the rim is still perfectly true (tensioned on the disc side @125kgs) so it seems strong enough for DH. But not tubeless, at least not with a Butcher SX. Don't know how it would handle UST tires or double-ply tires mounted tubeless, though.

    My questions: would using a proper UST tire (like a Maxxis Minion DHF UST) help for a better tubeless setup? Do you guys have a flap for the Flow EX (website is down right now, can't look it up) that would help with a tighter fit? I would really love to run my Flow EX tubeless, instead of using a tube.


    Thanks.
    UST beads are generally not as strong as a "proper" DH bead (which is non-folding, vs folding for UST). If you want a bomb-proof tubeless setup run regular non-UST DH tires. They work especially sweet on Stans rims. I have a 2.35 DH casing (not UST) Maxxis Highroller mounted to a Flow EX tubeless on the rear wheel of my trail bike. It was very easy to set up. I only have one ride on it as of yet, but I gave it a very thorough testing (casing jumps and drops on purpose, landing jumps sideways and some really hard cutting) to see if the tire is solid enough for my up-coming trip to Sedona. Results are positive, and I'm going to run that setup with full confidence down there. I weigh 217lbs right now w/o riding gear (98.4kgs).

    btw, Specialized's folding bead tires are "proper UST" in that they have a bead that is shaped to mate to a UST spec rim. As you know, the SX-casing is reinforced, so it shouldn't be a problem. They only thing a UST tire would have different is a rubber coating on the inside of the tire to make it air tight. In non-freeride or dh casing, Spec says they're toughest casing is the Armadillo, even tougher than it's GRID casing (which is the "official" UST tire). They also don't seem to offer their DH tires in 2bliss or GRID versions.

    Finally, unless you are very lightweight and ride tentatively, the general concensus is that tubeless doesn't work all that well for true DH because of the loads placed on the beads. The bottom line is, UST doesn't work well (yet) for DH. There's a reason it is very rare to see tubeless setups at DH races.
    Last edited by slyfink; 11-06-2012 at 06:39 AM.
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  16. #66
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    Both EX versions of Arch and Flow are $140 a pair. To add to the dilemma, what about the Pacenti TL28 instead of the Arch EX? Exactly the same price though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stofken View Post
    Both EX versions of Arch and Flow are $140 a pair. To add to the dilemma, what about the Pacenti TL28 instead of the Arch EX? Exactly the same price though.
    I guess it depends on how much 100g are worth to you. Flow +/- = 500g; Arch EX = 400g. I think they are the two best adapted to your purposes, so it really comes down to weight and price. The Flow might work slightly better with UST-beaded tires.

    Aren't Pacenti products 650b? If 650b is what you're after, I don't think the old Flows come in 650b.... so you're looking at Flow EX vs. Pacenti. I know nothing about Pacenti. Who makes their products for them?
    continuous growth is the strategy of a cancer cell.

  18. #68
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    I'm trying to loose another 7 kg, so 100g is really a non-issue
    You mean the old Flows might work slightly better with UST-beaded tires? ZTR's EX 2nd gen BST might move more towards standard beads and further away from UST/TLR? I don't know, but the "blow-off" stories here on the forum really scare the crap out of me!

    Pacenti TL28 also comes in 26".
    Pacenti makes his own rims! Do a search on this forum, you'll be surprised about the good stuff people tell about his rims.

  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stofken View Post
    I'm trying to loose another 7 kg, so 100g is really a non-issue
    You mean the old Flows might work slightly better with UST-beaded tires? ZTR's EX 2nd gen BST might move more towards standard beads and further away from UST/TLR? I don't know, but the "blow-off" stories here on the forum really scare the crap out of me!
    Yes, I meant "old" Flows! But to be honest, I've run UST tires on both old and new rims (BST and pre-BST), and they worked fine. On the old Flow's I've run Schwalbe (TL), Specialized (2bliss), Maxxis (UST) and Michelin (UST) tires, no problem, and on the BST-Flow, I've run Specialized and WTB (TCS) tires, as well as a DH casing, wire-bead non UST tire. All of them trouble free in terms of locking the beads to the rim.

    Of course, on my DH bike, I only run DH tires, with tubes. No UST there. I don't ride with a spare tire or tube, and I hate having to walk down the mountain to fix stuff, so I stick with the tried and true.
    continuous growth is the strategy of a cancer cell.

  20. #70
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    I've ordered the Flow EX, I'll see what gives with my current Schwalbe tires.

  21. #71
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    I got a Flow Ex wheelset with ZTR hubs for $400 on Ebay. I'm running a 2.35 Hans Dampf up front and a 2.35 Nobby Nic in back. I weigh 230. I was able to mount the tires without tire levers, although it took some wrestling to get them on - especially the HD. The beads popped on solidly, and have passed the test over the last few months, including the time that I let the pressure get low and came down hard on the front.
    The rock crawling and especially cornering are improved over my old rims which I think were 20 mm internal width. The cornering is very stable even when sliding. I believe that the extra width even helps keep the beads secure on the wheel. Im really happy with this wheelset so far. Even though they are not super-light, they are much lighter than the stock wheels that came on my bike.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stofken View Post
    I've ordered the Flow EX, I'll see what gives with my current Schwalbe tires.
    I have had no issues running Hans Dampf Trail Star or Pace Setter on Flow Ex.

  23. #73
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    Great info so far on this thread! I'm going to order up a Stans wheelset, and am debating whether to use the old Flows ($42/rim), or get the new Flow EX ($80/rim). With gear I weight about 185#, ride typically rocky XC/AM stuff, both up and down. My favorite tires at this point are Specialized Purgatory 2.3/2.4 2Bliss, and I do intend to run these tubeless.

    So with those needs in mind, would it be best to go with the new Flow EX for the added strength, or the old Flows? Is there a consensus on whether the new Flow EX rims are worse for UST/2Bliss/TLR tires than the old Flows?
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  24. #74
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    Going only from Flow 29 to Flow ex 29 means the same spoke length, right ?

  25. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by TwoHeadsBrewing View Post

    So with those needs in mind, would it be best to go with the new Flow EX for the added strength, or the old Flows? Is there a consensus on whether the new Flow EX rims are worse for UST/2Bliss/TLR tires than the old Flows?
    there seems to be a concensus on mtbr... but whether that concensus would hold up to scrutiny is up for debate.

    My experience has been that I have run UST, TL, and 2Bliss tires on the Flow EX no problems. I have also run non-tubeless tires on the EX no problem (a DH-casing High Roller, and currently, the Black Chili Baron).

    That said, I don't think you would be going wrong with the old Flows. They work well too, and so if you can save some coin, why not?

    But to throw a wrench in your equation... you could also consider the Arch EX for even greater weight savings, while maintaining a decent rim width. At your weight, I would think they are a valid option. I weigh 220 before gear and the Flow EX has been bomb-proof. So at 180, I would think the Arch EX should be plenty tough...

    But wait! there's more! there is also the WTB i23. They are a good, strong, proper UST-shaped alternative to the Stans rims. It's what I have on my front wheel and I like it.
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